This is my list, feel free to share yours:
- Betting on Leonard as the franchise has backfired mightily.
It's not that he isn't talented, he is. Even if everything eventually works out ok, there's always going to be lingering questions of what transpired, and that's without entering into the realm of how LMA fits in that picture. I don't hate Leonard, and obviously, until more details come to light we won't know for sure, but it's clear PATFO bet the future on him, and now there's a big black cloud over that gamble and the direction of the franchise. The good news is...
- LMA has a big heart
Look, the jokes about his heart are old, and I still think he's a regular season guy primarily (he has another chance to shut me up soon), but he battled this season, when everything seemed that it was falling out, he stepped up. Nobody should take that away from him. It's clear that if he's going to be option 1A, then he needs legit options 2 and 3, neither of which is Pau, Patty, and dare I say, Gay. He's a workhorse, and honestly, if he had a solid defensive big next to him, I think it would help him tremendously (like when Tim was still able to cover for him, and not hurt). One problem for LMA is...
- There's no shame in retiring after this season, Manu
Gave everything his 40 year old bones could to get this team into the playoffs, after a season of disarray. As usual, he's been pure hearth. I can see him and LMA have a good connection going, but there's really nothing left to prove... I think what transpires over the summer will have some bearing on his decision though, but ultimately, if he were to retire now, his image would be impeccable... while leads us to...
- Tony Parker is done
I know I use my Parker schtick all the time, but this one is honest. Look, I think he would be a great mentor to Murray, but at what cost? He came back from a horrible injury, that most professional athletes have a tough time coming back from, so it's not that I'm faulting him, he just doesn't seem to have anything left in the tank, and it appears that the Spurs have moved on. It's possible that if Manu retires, he gets a bigger leading role off the bench, and maybe adjusts, but again, what's that gamble going to cost? Talking about cost...
- The Anderson project was a failure
Sorry SAGirl. I have to look at this from the point that the Spurs spent 4 years trying to get the best Kyle Anderson possible, with a shooting coach, etc, and the guy's ceiling appears to be 8/8, and that's being generous. Can't shoot, he won't ever get over his lack of speed and athleticism, on an athletic league. He's a middle of the pack bench player (again, I'm being generous here). He's still hesitant, he doesn't seemingly has any kind of fire, etc. He made sense on a cheap deal as roster filler, but now we gotta pay, and maybe it's time to start a new project with hopefully more upside. Maybe...
- I heard White is good
Don't want to get ahead of myself here, because I haven't seen much at all from him, but maybe this could be an interesting next project. It's a guard's league nowadays, so any promising guard makes sense. You know who also looks good?
- Murray can be option 3 or 2 by next season
Look, the Spurs put big trust in the kid midseason, and I thought that was a turning point for the franchise and the roster as a whole. You might think, well, maybe we were just tanking, but the reality is that it's very un-Spurs-like to make those moves. People forget how young he is, and I thought, overall, he's responded well to the new duties, despite he's aware he has limitations he needs to work on, like his shot. Despite all that, I like the fact that his major issue at the moment is that he's too green...
- Like Green, but he is showing his age
He's always been the definition of 3&D, but when you're not excelling at either, well, it's a problem. I like him because he seemed to work on his game the last few summers, trying to improve his playmaking. It's a shame it didn't work out, sometimes you simply don't have the talent for those things. I don't mind the numbers on his current deal, but you would think his next deal would be for less money if he keeps this up? Is he even starter material at this level? Again, the guard position is possibly one of the most important positions in today's NBA which leads us to...
- Patty got paid, but that didn't steady him
Which is a problem. Especially when we're trotting out a rookie PG, we don't need to add more noise. He's played for many years at this point, next to HoF guards who do have a steady hand when needed, and at this point you would think he would know better. We need a more steady Mills, otherwise, he's not really worth the pricetag, like...
- Pau also got paid, but it's time to move on, and he's too expensive for a bench filler
I actually think Pau career has been phenomenal, but we're not in a place where we need a mentor of his caliber on the team, tbh, and if he's going to shoot 3 pointers and give us no defense, I rather have a penetrating guard doing that, or, get a much more solid defensive big that can actually help LMA carry the load. Pau has been fine to burn minutes in the regular season, but he would need to be the 3rd/4th big in the team, and we're paying too much for that, IMO.
Pop mailing it in is something I noticed a few seasons ago, so not going to rehash that here, tbh...
Nice to read a non trollish post from you. I used to like when you made posts like this.
I can’t say I disagree and not sure what happens with Kyle, but I don’t want to make a contribution to this thread just about him. I might say the least about him bc I have already said a ton on his account.
I am posting on a phone though which is annoying for lengthy stuff so I will probably think about this and give some feedback tomorrow
Spurs need to turn the page. Manu and Parker need to retire. So does Pop. The franchise can’t move forward unless they all go. They all just cast a big shadow over the franchise. They’re legends. No one will be as good as they were, and Pop won’t stop playing them as long as they’re on the roster.
It’s kinda like the old Celtics with bird mchale and parish. It’s just time to move on.
thread after late night win. Stop drinking
Let me buy you a scotch, and we'll talk about this...
Don't really have the time these days, tbh... been mulling about posting one of these before the playoffs start, so it doesn't cloud judgement, for good or bad...
Contributions welcome.
Very insightful and I think you’re correct on all accounts.
Spurs are truly at a crossroads here. Who knows where they go from here.
Sad but true.
About time to get younger and faster..But Parker'll get 3-years deal with the Spurs in the offseason...Manu could play the last year of his contract...Pop won't change.
You're wrong about Anderson. The rest is pretty good.
Very good thread. This team has some decisions to make if they want to compete in this league. Years of riding this into the ground has reared its ugly head.
This here. Anderson is just fine and has improved dramatically this year. Yes, I do wish he had a better shot and didn’t look flatfooted on defense (though his hands make up for it). Just hope if he resigns it’ll be to something reasonable.
Tonight was the first time I came around to Pop being done. Right before the TO the Spurs took in the 4:00+ range, he subbed out Manu and has Mills and Forbes out there against the league’s best offensive backcourt outside of GS. What happens? Mills airball and Forbes burned by a bigger Turner in transition. Know your damn personnel. Green has been horrid offensively but you can’t have two no-D guys out there.
Glad you made it b4 the playoffs and after a win. If you made it when they were eliminated or after a loss it could come across as troliish. As I said in general I do agree with what you said and they need to move on from the guys you mentioned for the reasons you mentioned. They can’t restructure the entire team in one fell swoop though so I think regardless of what we think some guys will be back that perhaps we would have moved on from, but I am ready for some starting over. Maybe Pop isn’t the coach for starting over.
Like me you I think Murray is a bright spot on the season as was LMA.
What happens with Kawhi can shape their entire season next year.
I like the thread and will add to it. I liked Davis though Pop didn’t and you don’t mention him.. I thought he was more of an energy player and fearless shooter than Bryn is. Anyways I want to give you better feedback bc threads like these are fun for me. Like to read what other fans think too.
The problem is that will never happen as long as Pop is coaching. Manu ain’t coming back to be a deep bench guy and Pop has too much respect for him to let him be relegated to deep bench.
And then we’re right back to 40 yo guy taking up a roster spot who can only play every 5 game up to par who the coach won’t stop playing.
I’ll just tag along with what HarlemHeat said about Kyle. I already chatted so much about him that I got burned out. I think he’s valuable in a good team. The Spurs struggle to score and he’s had to replace in the lineup the team’s best player and their most versatile scorer so his deficiencies are amplified but I understand the criticism and will just leave it st that. I endorse Harlem though he’s got my vote.
Who could blame PATFO for this?
The reason for Pop's/Spurs' success in last 20 years (playoffs appearances, 50 wins streak) was Tim Duncan. Having the best PF, top 1-5 player every year, meant everything for this team.
They were lucky to find other top 3-5 player in Kawhi. A guy without private life scandals, a gym-rat...Who wouldn't make him a franchise player?
Just blame PATFO for loyalty contracts, for Patty/Gasol crazy deals, but making Kawhi their franchise player wasn't a mistake in that moment.
Every team would have done the same. It doesn't matter how it ends, it was the right decision in 2014-15.
Last edited by YGWHI; 04-08-2018 at 12:03 AM.
Differing opinions are completely welcome, tbh... something to talk about before a long summer
I'm not playing the blame game, I'm pointing out that's a gamble that's looking like it might not pay off right now, with hindsight from what transpired so far. I didn't say PATFO screwed up or anything of the sort.
How it ends completely matter though. It has tremendous implications for this franchise, not just onto next year, but the years after.
Even if it ends in a trade, and what pieces you get, if we need to rebuild from scratch, etc. Or if Kawhi comes back, how it's going to work with LMA having a bigger role, etc.
This is just mad revisionist.
Are we judging a decision that PATFO made three seasons ago that worked perfectly in TWO of those THREE seasons?
What other option they had in that moment?
LeBron didn't sign with SAS in 2014, KD either. After these two guys Kawhi was the better player on boths ends with tremendous potential ..How PATFO wouldn't make him SAS franchise player?
Dude, what part of "I didn't say PATFO screwed up or anything of the sort" isn't clear? I made no judgement about PATFO's gamble at all in the OP or subsequent posts, not sure why you keep insisting on a point I never made or even suggested?
Again, it has nothing to do with whether the gamble was good or not, everybody can have an opinion on that, that's fine. The gamble, however, was made, and how it eventually plays out (good or bad) obviously has huge implications for the franchise going forward.
Obviously if Kawhi would've been healthy, played all season, then there would be no questions whatsoever about his physical status and commitment to the future of the franchise long term, and this summer would probably be a lot more boring.
Do we blame C's for Hayward missing a season? We didnt blame GSW when Curry couldn't play more tan 40 games a season.
Players get injured all time. How would we blame a team for that?
I think the Spurs need to let Green walk, keep Kyle and put him into Danny's role.. It's not like Danny Green has multi faceted game. Kyle's defense is improving, and you'd just have to roll the dice that he will improve his corner 3.
Regardless of what happens with Kawhi, the Spurs need to take a chainsaw to this roster. It's going to be time to sell high on Aldridge at the draft, though going by how this season has transpired I half expect him to blow out his knee in the first round so the Spurs can't trade him for anything of value. I love Tony Parker, but lots of luck playing until he's 40. He's a pretty below average point guard now. Go play the Derrick Rose role in Cleveland. Murray is worth keeping but I don't see the talent there to be anything more than an average point guard, maybe at the level of George Hill. Keep White because who the knows what he's going to give and it's not like you're getting anything for him. Goodbye Manu, thank you for a great season at age 40, but no reason for you to kill yourself trying to win games for a team that is going to need a complete rebuild. Gasol and Fifty stay since the Spurs can't afford to give up assets to get someone to take those bums' salary. I hope Gay opts out and leaves, he's no good for a rebuild. off Anderson. Hopefully Green opts out and walks. He was a of a shooting guard to fit into the beautiful game offense but he doesn't fit a rebuild nor a team no longer filled with amazing passers. Let someone else pay for the player he used to be here.
Really? "Betting on Leonard as the franchise has backfired mightily"
Have no problem with Manu being back he’s already signed to a smallish contract for next season and it is up to him. My only criticism on the subject wasn’t even about Manu per se, but Pops overrealiance on him. For example PATFO not improving their guard situation bc they still have Manu. It’s not fair, he can’t play B2B, he’s on minutes limitations and there’s some games that age does catch up to him and Pop will still play him in crunch time bc he’s Manu, never mind that he’s not having a good game and is 40. It just felt like PATFO wasn’t going to do anything about their guard situation so long as the could get the last sliver of juice from the bar of soap. But could he play another season? In the right context where you rely on Murray and White to do the heavy lifting? Sure. Is Pop going to do that? Allow them to carry the heavy load or look in FA at someone who can? Not sure.
Tony however looks done. Sad to see. At this rate his minutes are decreasing more and more. If White wasn’t in the gleague he might be playing better than Tony too. Does he want to finish his career as a 13th guy? It’s a legit honest conversation he needs to have with Pop. Then again Pop had Bonner in the team for the locker room presence so he might. If he comes back needs to be after everyone else is signed that Spurs want to sign and in a small deal.
Kyle is improving and can play. But he’s Diaw lite. Not going to improve a sorry team, but can be a game changing role player on a championship contending team.
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