Dean on OAI: "Idea We're Going To Win 'Iraq' War...Just Plain Wrong"

[Nbadan]

Dean: US Won't Win in Iraq
LAST UPDATE: 12/6/2005 9:54:29 PM
Posted By: Jim Forsyth

(SAN ANTONIO) -- Saying the "idea that we're going to win the war in Iraq is an idea which is just plain wrong," Democratic National Chairman Howard Dean predicted today that the Democratic Party will come together on a proposal to withdraw National Guard and Reserve troops immediately, and all US forces within two years.

Dean made his comments in an interview on WOAI Radio in San Antonio.

"I've seen this before in my life. This is the same situation we had in Vietnam. Everybody then kept saying, 'just another year, just stay the course, we'll have a victory.' Well, we didn't have a victory, and this policy cost the lives of an additional 25,000 troops because we were too stubborn to recognize what was happening."

Dean says the Democrat position on the war is 'coalescing,' and is likely to include several proposals.

"I think we need a strategic redeployment over a period of two years," Dean said. "Bring the 80,000 National Guard and Reserve troops home immediately. They don't belong in a conflict like this anyway. We ought to have a redeployment to Afghanistan of 20,000 troops, we don't have enough troops to do the job there and its a place where we are welcome. And we need a force in the Middle East, not in Iraq but in a friendly neighboring country to fight (terrorist leader Musab) Zarqawi, who came to Iraq after this invasion. We've got to get the target off the backs of American troops.

Dean didn't specify which country the US forces would deploy to, but he said he would like to see the entire process completed within two years. He said the Democrat proposal is not a 'withdrawal,' but rather a 'strategic redeployment' of U.S. forces.

"The White House wants us to have a permanent commitment to Iraq. This is an Iraqi problem. President Bush got rid of Saddam Hussein and that was a great thing, but that could have been done in a very different way. But now that we're there we need to figure out how to leave. 80% of Iraqis want us to leave, and it's their country."

Dean also compared the controversy over pre-war intelligence to the Watergate scandal which brought down Richard Nixon's presidency in 1974.

"What we see today is very much like what was going in Watergate," Dean said. "It turns out there is a lot of good evidence that President Bush did not tell the truth when he was asking Congress for the power to go to war. The President said last week that Congress saw the same intelligence that he did in making the decision to go to war, and that is flat out wrong. The President withheld some intelligence from the Senate Intelligence Committee. He withheld the report from the CIA that in fact there was no evidence of weapons of mass destruction (in Iraq), that they did not have a nuclear program. They (the White House) selectively gave intelligence to the United States Senate and the United States Congress and got them to give the go ahead to attack these people."

WOAI

According to some polls, most San Antonioians still disagreed with Dean:

PAGS POLL: Howard Dean claims we can't win the war in Iraq. What do you think?
He's right...42.9%
He's wrong...52.1%
I don't know...5.0%

[MaNuMaNiAc]

It actually all depends on what winning is for the American people. Personally, I don't think there is any scenario with good outcomes, for either side, American or Iraqui. Right now, "winning" (for America) would be to cut your loses and withdraw, which is, needless to say, not fair for the Iraqui people, who are stuck with the mess.

The ideal thing would be for the US to rebuild Iraq, and that a democracy be established, but I think its safe to say that scenario is out of the question, no matter how many people have deluded themselves into thinking it can be done.

As it stands right now, Iraq will probably end up being more of a terrorist hotbed than it has ever been. Then again, I don't suppose this is news to anyone.

[JoeChalupa]

We can and must win this war.

[xrayzebra]

According to his own party he is wrong. See story in this mornings E-N. Those running for office in the dimm-0-craptic party are not too happy with him or
Pelosi. Seems as tho they may have a little problem in their own party.

[boutons]

I think the war won't be won or lost in any clear-cut, definitive manner, neither sooner nor later. That's why dubya speaks in sloganistic nebulosities like "stay the course" without defining exactly what the "course" is.

There's no game clock and final score that will say GAMEOVER, when the US occupiers can get up and go home. There won't be any "VI day", Victory Iraq, when the insurgents formally sign an armistice and hand over their weapons.

With the parliamentary elections next week, the horizon will be empty of definitve road signs that mark progress. The Iraqis will have a cons ution and representative parliament, but also festering insurgency stretching to the horizon that will pre-occupy Iraqis daily much more than the niceties of "democracy and freedom".

So, you right-wing idealogues who think "my country, right or wrong", WTF do you think a W in Iraq will look like?

The ONLY positive view for the Repubs is that it looks like the Dems aren't capable of really exploiting electrorally the horrendous and growing anti-Repub sentiment. However, the US voters may just decide, after seeing the Repubs up the US fiscal position, fix or improve absolutely nothing in 5+ years, start a bogus war they can't finish, build/re-organize DHS/FEMA that can't manage emergencies, etc, etc to vote anti-Repub (rather than pro-Dem) on the hope that the Dems might make some progress in the incredible messes the Repubs have created. The Repubs obviously don't give a about anything but cutting taxes for the rich+corps.

[xrayzebra]

I think the war won't be won or lost in any clear-cut, definitive manner, neither sooner nor later. That's why dubya speaks in sloganistic nebulosities like "stay the course" without defining exactly what the "course" is.

There's no game clock and final score that will say GAMEOVER, when the US occupiers can get up and go home. There won't be any "VI day", Victory Iraq, when the insurgents formally sign an armistice and hand over their weapons.

With the parliamentary elections next week, the horizon will be empty of definitve road signs that mark progress. The Iraqis will have a cons ution and representative parliament, but also festering insurgency stretching to the horizon that will pre-occupy Iraqis daily much more than the niceties of "democracy and freedom".

So, you right-wing idealogues who think "my country, right or wrong", WTF do you think a W in Iraq will look like?

The ONLY positive view for the Repubs is that it looks like the Dems aren't capable of really exploiting electrorally the horrendous and growing anti-Repub sentiment. However, the US voters may just decide, after seeing the Repubs up the US fiscal position, fix or improve absolutely nothing in 5+ years, start a bogus war they can't finish, build/re-organize DHS/FEMA that can't manage emergencies, etc, etc to vote anti-Repub (rather than pro-Dem) on the hope that the Dems might make some progress in the incredible messes the Repubs have created. The Repubs obviously don't give a about anything but cutting taxes for the rich+corps.

Well boutons for once you are right. There wont be a big victory parade
when we win in Iraq. Iraq is only one phase of this war. Whether people
like it or not we are in a world wide war. Fighting is going on in many
countries that are not visible to the people. We are fighting on many
fronts and in many ways and will be for many, I repeat, many years to come.
Bush warned all of America of this in the beginning, but since many of
you seemed to have no memory of what transpired in the recent past you
keep repeating your hate filled words. You really are a bunch of losers.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Well boutons for once you are right. There wont be a big victory parade
when we win in Iraq. Iraq is only one phase of this war. Whether people
like it or not we are in a world wide war. Fighting is going on in many
countries that are not visible to the people. We are fighting on many
fronts and in many ways and will be for many, I repeat, many years to come.
Bush warned all of America of this in the beginning, but since many of
you seemed to have no memory of what transpired in the recent past you
keep repeating your hate filled words. You really are a bunch of losers.

You actually still believe that Bush is a bright man, that is just laughable

[Hook Dem]

You actually still believe that Bush is a bright man, that is just laughable

That is funny coming from you!

[MaNuMaNiAc]

That is funny coming from you!

why is that?

[Hook Dem]

why is that?

It's not like you're an expert on American affairs!

[MaNuMaNiAc]

It's not like you're an expert on American affairs!

you think I have to be en expert on American affairs to tell that Bush is not very bright?

[boutons]

Saddam/Iraq were not involved in jihad against the USA/Western culture, nor in 9/11.
That was, and has proven to be, just one of head's numerous lies.

Iraq was falsely made into a battleground only because dubya/ head wanted it to be for still mysterious reaasons, not because the jihadis were there.

Iraq has been/will be a huge, wasteful, counter-productive distraction from the real war on the real terrorists.

"Fighting is going on in many countries that are not visible to the people"

bull , until we hear it from somebody else.

[Oh, Gee!!]

We've already won, I thought. Remember the Mission Accomplished sign and Dubya in a flight suit?

[xrayzebra]

You actually still believe that Bush is a bright man, that is just laughable

He's bright enough to have whuped your ass twice. And continues to do so
day in and day out.

[SA210]

We've already won, I thought. Remember the Mission Accomplished sign and Dubya in a flight suit?

This admistration sure is good with pictures aren't they?

[JoeChalupa]

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!

[MaNuMaNiAc]

He's bright enough to have whuped your ass twice. And continues to do so
day in and day out.

I think Bush's victory has more to do with the gulibility of the American people, rather than Bush's brightness. However, at this point, and with all the evidence against Bush's government, its getting to the point where its no longer gulibility, and rather more like stupidity. Either way, give it time

[xrayzebra]

I think Bush's victory has more to do with the gulibility of the American people, rather than Bush's brightness. However, at this point, and with all the evidence against Bush's government, its getting to the point where its no longer gulibility, and rather more like stupidity. Either way, give it time

Just goes to show you. You think most Americans are stupid and you are the bright one. Goes to show you what a "superior" at ude you libs have
of yourself. Bye the way "smart one" Gullibility is spelled with two "l's" not
one. sheesh.

[Oh, Gee!!]

Bye the way "smart one" Gullibility is spelled with two "l's" not
one. sheesh.

Bye the way? Are you going somewhere?

[xrayzebra]

Bye the way? Are you going somewhere?

No where soon. Just want to stay around to "make you angry". Someone
has to remind you of how wrong you are.

[Oh, Gee!!]

No where soon. Just want to stay around to "make you angry". Someone has to remind you of how wrong you are.

someone didn't get the joke.

[Vashner]

Howard Dean is the best thing the Democrats could of ever done in there history. They are gonna pay BIG TIME in 08 for putting in a "I hate everything Republicans stand for"...

Can't win back the seat without swing vote.. no one wants a like Dean telling them stupid ing like this. We will win this ing war.. Despite ass s like NBADan and howard dean trying to bring down our military's accomplishments.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Just goes to show you. You think most Americans are stupid and you are the bright one. Goes to show you what a "superior" at ude you libs have
of yourself. Bye the way "smart one" Gullibility is spelled with two "l's" not
one. sheesh.

First of all, I didn't say most Americans, I think it is clear that I was talking about people who still believe what Bush says despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

oh and "bye" the way , English is my second language Einstein, what is your excuse?

[xrayzebra]

First of all, I didn't say most Americans, I think it is clear that I was talking about people who still believe what Bush says despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

oh and "bye" the way , English is my second language Einstein, what is your excuse?

Then use a spell check if you are going to make comments about
people who support their President and Country and tell them how
dumb they are for showing such support.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Then use a spell check if you are going to make comments about
people who support their President and Country and tell them how
dumb they are for showing such support.

dude, you just used "bye" on your past post when you should have used "by", what the are you complaining about?

Fine, I'll tell you what. I take what I said back. I don't think Bush's supporters are stupid. I think people who follow a leader blindly without question despite all the evidence of his deceit are mentally deficient. Ofcourse this applies to everyone, including us Argentinians, happy?