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Just the opposite.
I was wondering if Duncan or any of the other 2003 and 2005 Champs went to Pop and said "can we give ball movement offense a try?"
Along with "Can we at least try tall ball Nazr/Rash for a spell and see if it works?"
You think Duncan went to Pop and suggested it?
I was thinking about it on the way home today. Maybe the combination of his foot problems, along with his lack of confidence in Nazr/Rasho made him think the best chance for him to be effective in the games was to have smaller players around him?
Maybe it wasn't Pop's idea. Pop's always been a twin towers guy. A "we play our way, so we'll win or lose our way" type of person, no? Just a thought.
Just the opposite.
I was wondering if Duncan or any of the other 2003 and 2005 Champs went to Pop and said "can we give ball movement offense a try?"
Along with "Can we at least try tall ball Nazr/Rash for a spell and see if it works?"
It was all about who can guard Dirk. Are you new here Please_Don't_Clone_Me?
I think if he said that, Pop would listen.
But in the past, we've never gone small-ball against the Dirk-led Mavs. What changed this year? I think it was a combination of Duncan's foot injury and not being able to keep up, as well as lack of confidence in Rasho/Nazr. I don't see Pop making a decision like that, he had to have people in his ear...like PJ and Duncan.
I've been around a while. I'm mostly in "the club" section b/c I can't handle the same old regurgitated in this section. Was on SpursReport before that as "northeastsida63" years ago.
It's been explained before but Dirk has upped his level of play. Tim got into foul trouble defending Dirk, therefore, Tim ended up on Diop/Dampier. Horry got into foul trouble guarding Dirk out on the floor. Rasho and Nazr couldn't guard Dirk out on the floor. Bowen and Fin could keep up with Dirk out on the floor without fouling, at least.
Malik Rose used to do a nice job on him and then Malik was a nice threat on offense, too.
Dirk was the whole reason the Spurs had to go small. The only thing the Spurs could try with 2 Bigs was either a zone (which didn't work) or the other big besides Tim trying to guard Howard or Stack. No-workie.
He has "upped" his play? If anything that upp'ing involved him being more of a post player. That should play into Timmy's hands, no? Also I think his upp'ing had more to do on the defensive end of the court.
I agree about Rose. He used to guard Dirk as well as anyone in the league.
I would rather have tried a zone. We don't play zone, but we dont' play small ball either. At least if we played zone we'd have 2 bigs in the game. I know it's harder to rebound ini a zone, but I don't care what you say Nazr/Ras > Finley/Bowen when going up for a rebound...boxed out, or not.
He wasn't a post player in the series, PDBM. They lifted Dirk and ran high screen/rolls all game long, every game. When the Spurs switched, and Dirk had an iso on a small player, that's when Dirk went to the mid or low block.
The majority of his shots were little turn around 12 footers.
In fact that's what so many people praised. His ability to finally play with his back to the basket. And his ability to make that little 12 footer almost every time.
If that's your take, then you aren't watching closely enough to what was and is going on with Dirk. He's not backing down a Big. He's going to the block when he has a small on him and he's lifted when he has a Big on him (out on the floor/lifted means beyond 15 feet or on the perimeter).
I love that argument. "You don't watch enough basketball".
I think I've watched about as much basketball as 90% of the people on these forums. If he's "lifted" why did he go something like 1-8 for 3's in the Spurs series?
Also, exactly when did you see him being "lifted" when he was being guarded by a big in our series. Other than the first half of the first game we pretty much played a small on him the whole series.
In the Grizzlies series it was Battier on him most the series. He's just a more physical Bowen.
My statement wasn't you don't watch enough basketball, it was that you aren't watching closely enough. The Mavs ran high and side screen/rolls with Dirk lifted time and time again. Whenever the Spurs switched, Dirk would shoot a mid-range over the smaller player or take the player to the mid-post or low-post.
Now the Spurs countered that in games 5, 6, and 7 by doubling Dirk when he got the ball inside 15 feet to get the ball out of his hands. It was somewhat effective when the other role players didn't convert on their chances. It allowed the Spurs to come back to tie the series.
Right, a guy with a sore foot thought that getting into an up and down running game with average scores of 120-117 was a good ideaI was thinking about it on the way home today. Maybe the combination of his foot problems, along with his lack of confidence in Nazr/Rasho made him think the best chance for him to be effective in the games was to have smaller players around him?
I think I watch it rather closely.
The original point was "I think it's about who can guard Dirk". In the past his game was more run-and-gun and he would spot up for 3's much more. This year his game is mostly inside the arc.
So if we didn't go small in the past, why did we go small now? I think we could've kept our bigs in there and put whoever wasn't on Dirk on Josh Howard or Diop, or another player (besides Terry/Harris) who you're not really afraid will just torch you. We did that against the Suns (as people have pointed out...with Duncan on Q Rich) and that worked well.
Why did we change our iden y now, when we never have before? It just baffles me. It's easy to look at this in hindsight, I'm not questioning Pop or anything...but I'm thinking maybe this was more Duncan's decision than it was Pops. I don't see Pop changing our style of play now when he never has before.
Maybe he thought him being effective, regardless the score, gave the Spurs the best chance to win.Right, a guy with a sore foot thought that getting into an up and down running game with average scores of 120-117 was a good idea
Have to go to a dinner. Will reply when I get back, Solid D.
Okay, no problem.
If you have a DVR or VHS recording of any of the Spurs/Mavs games, review some of the two-man game plays the Mavs ran. The high screen/rolls or pick and pops and how the Spurs handled them. They tried lots of different techniques and players.
Then let's talk again, so that we can at least agree on what the Mavs were doing with Dirk.
Okay, lemme rephrase. Do you think a guy with a bum wheel thought he could be most effective when constantly being asked to get out and run in 120-117 games?Maybe he thought him being effective, regardless the score, gave the Spurs the best chance to win.
"with a bum wheel "
Already at the end of the season, and clearly shown in his monstrous playoff output, Tim's PF had diminished to insignificance.
Tim had 32/11 and 2.5 block per game against dallas, do you really think he was working with a 'bum wheel'?
Hey, I'm just working off the OP's post.
Maybe the combination of his foot problems
I just watched quite a bit of Game 6. Dirk set up on the perimeter most of the time and worked from there via screens/rolls or pops. Finley and Bowen defended him most of the time.
Most people who wanted the Spurs to go with 2 Bigs, and go with the look that got them where they are, base that on offensive basketball strategy. The 2-Bigs proponents say...let Dallas get theirs, but "make Dallas adjust to us" when "we" are on offense.
The problem I have with that is how do you get stops? Getting stops is the key to winning close games, isn't it? With Dirk on the floor and the complement of scorers around Dirk, it's tough to play with 2 Bigs against the Mavs unless the "other" Big besides Tim is mobile. If you don't have quick feet against Dirk, you are most likely going to foul trying to keep him from going by you. Horry said he felt like a dinosaur out on the perimeter.
Oh and another thing, the Spurs have had trouble with 2 Bigs against Dallas in years past. In 2003 when the Spurs beat the Mavs in 6 games, the Spurs played Malik Rose twice as many minutes as David Robinson. In game 6, Malik defended Dirk and played 32 minutes, while D-Rob cheered and played 16 minutes.
If you want to say focus on offense and hope the Spurs can outscore Dallas, I guess you could try it and see, but I don't really think it would work against Dallas like it did against PHX, a team that doesn't even try to get stops.
So bring Malik back.
Have we gone small ball in the past? Malik doesn't count. He's a different defender than Finley/Bowen.
Malike played more minutes because DRob's back wasn't 100%. If DRob was healthy and had his mobility you think Malik would have played as much?
As for it being about offense, it totally is not. It's about rebounding and defense. Those 2 things defined the Spurs before this series. We did that with 2 bigs. We've done that since we got Duncan. we even went to 3 bigs. But we never went to just 1 big. Even when DRob retired. Why in the did we with that this late in the season? I just don't get it.
Sure.
If he promises to donate half of his yearly salary back to our salary cap.
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