Are Mavs as solid as Spurs? Don't count on it...

[JGrice02]

If the following sounds familiar it should. I have said it several times. I do think the author is a little hard on Dallas as Johnson is clearly an upgrade. As simple as it sounds, this guy does nothing more than point out the obvious. All I know is I'm glad the Spurs didn't pick up George! It should be a fun season...

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5873026

The Dallas Mavericks added free agent forward Devean George to their minor makeover, giving them four new veterans on the roster, along with the dispatching of three others.

What this really means: The Mavs were within six minutes of taking a commanding 3-0 lead in the NBA Finals this season before falling into choke mode. So close were they, it figured to be an off-season of tweaking. But what exactly have they accomplished by brining in George, Anthony Johnson, Greg Buckner and Austin Croshere in lieu of Adrian Griffin, Darrell Armstrong, Marquis Daniels and Keith Van Horn? Not much. In fact, the crew brought in is amazingly comparable to the one let go.

Soon enough, we'll find out the ramifications of last year's collapse. Word out of Dallas is that Don Nelson is finally severing his ties from the organization rather than bilking owner Mark Cuban out of more money for hanging around. What we really need to know is how this all affected young coach Avery Johnson and his three key players — Dirk Nowitzki, Jason Terry and Josh Howard — with the way Cuban was so embarrassingly over the top in his profile as the Mavericks took the series lead. The moves in and of themselves didn't mean much, and they still should compete for the Western Conference le again — but are they as solid as the San Antonio Spurs? Don't count on it.

[George Gervin's Afro]

I guess he hasn't heard that the mavs are a younger deeper team than the spurs. the mavs are the deepest team in the history of the nba...or that the spurs are old and on the decline...

[SpursWillOwn]

yea and mavs have young and fresh legs for 48 minutes.. and they sure have clutch players..

[50 cent]

I'm sure all the re ed Mavs fans would disagree with this guy. The Mavs got deeper when it wasn't even possible to have a deeper team.

Whatever, they are a bunch of -chokers.

[LEONARD]

I have to disagree some...

Johnson is a huge upgrade over DA, and it allows Jet to pay more 2 guard.

KVH / Croshere = wash. Money move dumping Daniels salary. No problem with it...

Buckner / George slight inprovement over Griffin / Daniels. Buckner isn't as much of an offensive liability (despite the poor 3 pt shooting %) as Griffin was and he's a solid defender like Griffin. Daniels didn't fit Avery's style, regardless of what skillset you think he brought to the court. I hope he does well in IND. George is fine as a 12th man / veteran type player and nothing more...

I would expect Spurs fans to try to tear down the Mavs off-season, given the 10,000 posts around here this summer about the Spurs stellar moves...

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

I do agree with the writer that too much is being made of their offseason moves. While Johnson and Buckner are upgrades over Armstrong and Griffin I don't think it's a game changing improvement. My issue with all this hype is that people are acting like as though depth was somehow a weak spot that they've suddenly addressed. They've always been a deep team ever since Cuban came in and started throwing around the big bucks. Depth was not the issue that lost them four straight in the finals.

[leemajors]

I have to disagree some...

Johnson is a huge upgrade over DA, and it allows Jet to pay more 2 guard.

KVH / Croshere = wash. Money move dumping Daniels salary. No problem with it...

Buckner / George slight inprovement over Griffin / Daniels. Buckner isn't as much of an offensive liability (despite the poor 3 pt shooting %) as Griffin was and he's a solid defender like Griffin. Daniels didn't fit Avery's style, regardless of what skillset you think he brought to the court. I hope he does well in IND. George is fine as a 12th man / veteran type player and nothing more...

I would expect Spurs fans to try to tear down the Mavs off-season, given the 10,000 posts around here this summer about the Spurs stellar moves...

i thought daniels was a much more versatile and quicker player than george, kinda a downgrade but does have more size i guess. like you said, slight improvement. offsets the slight size lost in buckner/griffin.

[JGrice02]

I have to disagree some...

Johnson is a huge upgrade over DA, and it allows Jet to pay more 2 guard.

KVH / Croshere = wash. Money move dumping Daniels salary. No problem with it...

Buckner / George slight inprovement over Griffin / Daniels. Buckner isn't as much of an offensive liability (despite the poor 3 pt shooting %) as Griffin was and he's a solid defender like Griffin. Daniels didn't fit Avery's style, regardless of what skillset you think he brought to the court. I hope he does well in IND. George is fine as a 12th man / veteran type player and nothing more...

I would expect Spurs fans to try to tear down the Mavs off-season, given the 10,000 posts around here this summer about the Spurs stellar moves...

Johnsons is a nice uprade over Armstrong, no doubt. But he is the only real upgrade. Other players might be upgrades but we can't know that for sure until they prove it as they are clones of the players they replaced.

As for Johnson, his role in the playoffs will be minimal. His services will be most helpful during the regular season. The important thing is that the Mavs core players are back. I'm sure they will grow even more under Avery.

The moves they made this offseason will ensure a deep bench, something they already had. But come playoff time they will probably not make a big difference. The bench was not the problem in the Finals. Guys like Daniels kept the Mavs in the game. The problem was with the starters.

[samikeyp]

I would expect Spurs fans to try to tear down the Mavs off-season, given the 10,000 posts around here this summer about the Spurs stellar moves...

I would expect Leonard to lump all Spurs fans as being of one mindset.

[FromWayDowntown]

I would expect Leonard to lump all Spurs fans as being of one mindset.

mikey -- Leonard is here just to stir the pot. Leonard excels at provoking Spurs fans with little needling remarks; those efforts are frequently rewarded because those jabs regularly draw bombastic responses from those who try to prove Leonard wrong.

Other than attempting to draw such ire, Leonard's posts are fairly neutral.

[samikeyp]

That is true...for the most part he is on. I just like needling back

[LEONARD]

i thought daniels was a much more versatile and quicker player than george, kinda a downgrade but does have more size i guess. like you said, slight improvement. offsets the slight size lost in buckner/griffin.

Daniels is definitely more versatile and quicker than George, but he just didn't fit...

I would expect Leonard to lump all Spurs fans as being of one mindset.

Not really...I just threw that in at the end due to this comment

I'm sure all the re ed Mavs fans would disagree with this guy. The Mavs got deeper when it wasn't even possible to have a deeper team. Whatever, they are a bunch of -chokers.

which does exactly what you just said... (lumping fans into one group)

mikey -- Leonard is here just to stir the pot. Leonard excels at provoking Spurs fans with little needling remarks; those efforts are frequently rewarded because those jabs regularly draw bombastic responses from those who try to prove Leonard wrong.

Other than attempting to draw such ire, Leonard's posts are fairly neutral.

Who doesn't stir every now and then?

[Supergirl]

I agree with the writer that all the changes don't actually change much for the Mavs - some positions are slightly upgraded (Buckner vs. KVH) some are slightly downgraded (Daniels and Griffin will be missed) but overall they're about the same - still young, athletic, and pretty deep. Still poised for the WCF.

But I think the problem is at their core - Mr. Nowitzki. He just doesn't have IT, that intangible thing that certain players have that wills them to win when they have the opportunity. Wade has it, Duncan has it, even Manu has it (despite that one bad decision that cost them a return to the Finals), Shaq has it, Alonzo has it, Chauncey Billups has it...

Dirk doesn't have it. And I don't think you can fabricate it this late in a career, if you don't have it. And that's what they lacked in the 2006 Finals.

[LEONARD]

But I think the problem is at their core - Mr. Nowitzki. He just doesn't have IT, that intangible thing that certain players have that wills them to win when they have the opportunity. Wade has it, Duncan has it, even Manu has it (despite that one bad decision that cost them a return to the Finals), Shaq has it, Alonzo has it, Chauncey Billups has it...

Dirk doesn't have it. And I don't think you can fabricate it this late in a career, if you don't have it. And that's what they lacked in the 2006 Finals.

Dirk was good in the Spurs series...
Good in the Suns series...
and not all that bad in the Heat series. People forget the ridiculous shot he hit in Game 5 due to Wade hitting the 2 FT's to win the game. He avg'd 27 / 12 in the playoffs...

He had a few off games here and there, but who doesn't? He takes more $hit than he deserves IMO...

[samikeyp]

Who does stir every now and then?

We didn't say you were the only stirrer.

[FromWayDowntown]

and not all that bad in the Heat series. People forget the ridiculous shot he hit in Game 5 due to Wade hitting the 2 FT's to win the game. He avg'd 27 / 12...

David Robinson had numbers like that in the 1995 WCF against the Rockets. I'm pretty sure most NBA fans outside of San Antonio remember tthat he wasn't "all that bad" in the Houston series.

[Supergirl]

What are Dirk's numbers during the 4th quarters of the games versus the Heat? Because that's what I'm talking about - his lack of clutchness.

[Mavs_man_41]

I really have to disagree. Obviously Anthony Johnson is a big upgrade over Darrel Armstrong. I think Buckner is an upgrade over Griffin because he isnt as big of a liability on offense and Griffin isnt as quick because of his back problems. Austin Croshere=KVH? Maybe so, we will have to see but either way i think his defense is quite a bit better than Van Horn's and i would take a better defensive player as a backup rather that a shooter. George wasnt really replacing anyone so he is just a nice addition as the 12th man. The biggest plus is probably the fact that we upgraded at least defensively and it seems Devean Harris might get his chance to start and Jason Terry might get to play more SG where he is more comfortable.

[Mavs_man_41]

^I almost forgot about Maurice Ager. I think he will at least make some kind of an impact even in limited minutes and he might turn out to be a great player later on.

[FromWayDowntown]

Gosh, Mavs man thinks the Mavs got better. I'm shocked.

[JamStone]

I think Dallas did have a good off-season and did get better.

Devean George is an upgrade if anything because he'll likely play more. AJ did not play Marquis Daniels. His only real PT was the game Stackhouse was suspended for. Devean is bigger and taller and more of a forward than Daniels, and in fact Devean at 6-8, 230 can play the PF spot in small ball. Daniels could not.

Greg Buckner essentially = Adrian Griffin except Buckner is younger and can his a three-pointer, so I think that is an upgrade.

Anthony Johnson is also an upgrade because Darrell Armstrong did not play. AJ appears to be someone who will get at least some spot minutes as Devin and JT will sometimes play the 2-guard, so getting production from the third string PG when Armstrong gave almost none has to be an upgrade.

I think Austin Croshere is actually a downgrade from Keith Van Horn. I think Dallas still needs some help at the reserve power forward spot.

I don't think Maurice Ager will get any meaningful playing time. I actually think he is a good fit for the Mavs, but I think there are too many people ahead of him, and I think he'll spend most of his time this season on the inactive list and on the D-League affiliate team.


Jason Terry >> Devin Harris >> Anthony Johnson
Greg Buckner >> Jerry Stackhouse >> Maurice Ager
Josh Howard >> Devean George
Dirk Nowitzki >> Austin Croshere >> Pops Mensah Bonsu
DeSagana Diop >> Erick Dampier >> DJ Mbenga


Hard to see where Mo Ager will get any playing time. I think the Mavs are better. How much better? Not sure. But, objectively speaking as a fan of neither team, I do think they are a better team than the Spurs.

[BigD1]

I'm sure all the re ed Mavs fans would disagree with this guy. The Mavs got deeper when it wasn't even possible to have a deeper team.

Whatever, they are a bunch of -chokers.

One guy from FSW thinks SA is a more solid basketball team than Dallas and suddenly everyone on this board has a sense of new hope. Pleease. SA is still a top 3 team in the West and can very well win it this year but to say Dallas did nothing to upgrade the roster this year is absurd. Croshere and Pops are better than KVSucks and Powell. Buckner, George, and Ager is an upgrade over Daniels and Rawle. and certainly A.Johnson is an upgrade over DA. This writer is re ed and so is 50 cent with that re ed ass name.
To say Mavs couldn't have gotten deeper is ridiculous. The Mav's depth last year was overrated. When AJ decided to put Harris in the starting lineup, that certainly depleted the bench drastically. The only 2 players that were producing off the bench in the playoffs were Stack and Damp. Daniels was too turnover prone and couldn't throw a rock in the ocean, therefore didn't play a whole lot. DA...well need I say more, the guy is 37. KVsucked sucked...and besides he was hurt throughout 40% of the playoffs. Josh Powell,Mbenga and Rawlle Marshal didn't even play a second.
So yes, Dallas can get deeper and did get deeper in every position except center. They now have QUALITY backups with veteranship, playoff experience and most importantly, defensive savvy.

[BigD1]

Johnsons is a nice uprade over Armstrong, no doubt. But he is the only real upgrade. Other players might be upgrades but we can't know that for sure until they prove it as they are clones of the players they replaced.

As for Johnson, his role in the playoffs will be minimal. His services will be most helpful during the regular season. The important thing is that the Mavs core players are back. I'm sure they will grow even more under Avery.

The moves they made this offseason will ensure a deep bench, something they already had. But come playoff time they will probably not make a big difference. The bench was not the problem in the Finals. Guys like Daniels kept the Mavs in the game. The problem was with the starters.

A.Johnson's role will be huge when A.J decides to put Harris/Terry together. Last year Dallas had no one off the bench at the pg to produce and be effective.

[BigD1]

Johnsons is a nice uprade over Armstrong, no doubt. But he is the only real upgrade. Other players might be upgrades but we can't know that for sure until they prove it as they are clones of the players they replaced.

As for Johnson, his role in the playoffs will be minimal. His services will be most helpful during the regular season. The important thing is that the Mavs core players are back. I'm sure they will grow even more under Avery.

The moves they made this offseason will ensure a deep bench, something they already had. But come playoff time they will probably not make a big difference. The bench was not the problem in the Finals. Guys like Daniels kept the Mavs in the game. The problem was with the starters.

Guys like Daniels...?? What series were u watching? Daniels had one decent performance in game 6 when Dallas was all but down and out. Other than that, he didn't do .

[BigD1]

Dirk was good in the Spurs series...
Good in the Suns series...
and not all that bad in the Heat series. People forget the ridiculous shot he hit in Game 5 due to Wade hitting the 2 FT's to win the game. He avg'd 27 / 12...

He had a few off games here and there, but who doesn't? He takes more $hit than he deserves IMO...

Not only that, but Dirk was getting doubled and triple that entire Heat series. Wade was not. Not to take anything away from Wade but when u have a Shaq that demands double teams in the low post on every possession...well life's a little easier.