Reply With Quote
Allow me.
Link
Cue Bouton anti-organized religion/anti-GOD/general hatred response...A group of Pagans in Albemarle County, Va., was recently given permission to advertise their multi-cultural holiday program to public school children – and they have the Rev. Jerry Falwell to thank for it.
The dispute started last summer when Gabriel and Joshua Rakoski, twins who attend Hollymead Elementary School, sought permission to distribute fliers about their church’s Vacation Bible School to their peers via “backpack mail.” Many public schools use special folders placed in student backpacks to distribute notices about schools events and sometimes extra-curricular activities to parents.
School officials originally denied the request from the twins’ father, Ray Rakoski, citing a school policy barring “distribution of literature that is for partisan, sectarian, religious or political purposes.”
A Charlottesville weekly newspaper, The Hook, reports that Rakoski “sicced the Liberty Counsel on the county,” and the policy was soon revised to allow religious groups to use the backpack mail system. Liberty Counsel is a Religious Right legal group founded by Mathew Staver and now affiliated with Falwell.
Some local Pagans who attend Thomas Jefferson Memorial Church, a Unitarian-Universalist congregation in Charlottesville, decided to take advantage of the new forum as well. They created a one-page flier advertising a Dec. 9 event celebrating the December holidays with a Pagan twist and used the backpack system to invite the entire school community.
“Have you ever wondered what ‘Holidays’ refers to?” reads the flier. “Everyone knows about Christmas – but what else are people celebrating in December? Why do we celebrate the way we do?”
The flier invites people to “an educational program for children of all ages (and their adults), where we’ll explore the traditions of December and their origins, followed by a Pagan ritual to celebrate Yule.”
It concludes, “Come for one or both parts and bring your curiosity.”
Many members of this congregation are strong supporters of church-state separation who don’t believe public schools should promote any religion. But they were also unwilling to cede the field to Falwell and his fundamentalist allies. Falwell opened the backpack forum, and the Pagans were determined to secure equal time.
Suddenly not everyone was pleased by the open forum. Jeff Riddle, pastor of Jefferson Park Baptist Church in Charlottesville, wrote on his personal blog, “If the school allows the Baptist or Methodist church to send home a note to its students about Vacation Bible School, it also has to allow the Unitarian Church to send home a note about its ‘Pagan ritual to celebrate Yule’….This kind of note adds weight to the argument that it is high time for Christians to leave public schools for reasonable alternatives (homeschooling and private Christian schools).”
Another conservative Christian blogger in the county complained about finding the flier in her child’s folder. Apparently unaware of Falwell’s role in bringing it about, the blogger who goes by the name Cathy, noted disclaimer language at the bottom of the flier noting that the event is not connected to the school and wrote, “They [the school officials] aren’t endorsing or sponsoring this? Then it shouldn’t have been included in the Friday folders. The Friday folders have never been used for any thing other than school work and school board and/or County sanctioned/sponsored programs.”
She then fumed that a “pagan ritual” is “an educational experience my children don’t need.”
Well, Cathy and Jeff, it’s a new day. Your pals Falwell and Staver have opened up this forum, and now everyone gets to use it. Isn’t that what you wanted all along – freedom of religion? That freedom means all religions – even ones you don’t happen to like.
Allow me.
It is funny though, especially that idiot Cathy character.
"what else are people celebrating in December?"
Primarily end of year shopping $revenue. The Business of America is $Business, 24x365
"high time for Christians to leave public schools"
good riddance
“an educational experience my children don’t need.”
... but Fallwell/Robertson is one they do need, got it.
I live in a "College" town.
LARGE UU congregation.
Their pompous self-righteousness is surpassed by none; not even the loudest of bible-thumpers. They are OH so enlightened.
Cathy's blog.
http://callherblessed.blogspot.com/
"Only 17 praying days till Christmas!"
GTFOH
As if this dimwit needed some forum to express her views to the world.
Oh, wait...
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Riddle's blog:
http://jpbcstylos.blogspot.com/2006/...vangelism.html
It's the embodiment of the slippery slope in the church-state arugment. If you want to allow some religion into public school (whether by flier or prayer, or something in between) it seems to me that you cannot say that one religious group should be preferred over others. Christians don't have some inherent right to occupy the field when it comes to matters of religious message.
But it seems to me that the uproar that has occurred in this case is almost inevitable if you start opening the door. Christians who favor the use of their religious iconography and means of proselytizing in schools tend not to be very amped about allowing other groups having the same opportunity.
What I think is the most ironic part of Cathy's upset here is that I'd hazard a guess that her view is that if you're not Christian, you should just suck it up and not participate when the school-mandated prayer time or Bible reading occurs. But, when faced with something from another religious group, her decision isn't one to just throw away the flier that she disagrees with -- instead, she seems willing to protest the fact that a message concerning a pagan ritual could be transmitted through the school.
Just let me say: "Merry Christmas" everyone.
And I might add, our country was founded on Christian principles, whether you like
it or not.
Nothing stops you from practicing your religion, xray. Put a huge "Merry Christmas" sign in front of your house and stand on a public street corner singing Christmas hymns. The Cons ution absolutely protects your right to do those things.
But I don't understand why you feel you need the power of the government behind you to convey that message. Isn't it better for all of us if the government stays out of religion (by not using its power to endorse particular views) and lets each of us decide for ourselves how, when, and where to practice a particular faith?
Hey X, you do know that "Christians" didn't really invent Christmas, and scholarly consensus is that Jesus wasn't born in December, don't you?
How about the power of the people to choose to ignore anything that is put
before them, but let those that want to continue the traditions of this country
as in the past. Does one person, supposedly offended, mean that the majority
is suppose to surrender all their customs and traditions? I Don't think so.
Those that insist that we should or must, offend me and many others like me.
And I might add the majority. Which used to considered.
No those that choose to ignore God or deny him are free to do so. But they
should not be free to tell me I cant enjoy what I have for over 70 years. Nor
spread cheer and good will. You want to be miserable, be so. And I know
misery loves company, but as far as I am concerned, be lonesome in your
thoughts.
Your point being. And pray tell who "invented" Christmas? Does
your statement suppose to prove something or just you normal
ramblings.
Actually, the nation majority doesn't rule much of anything in this country. Our President isn't elected by majority. Congress isn't elected by a national majority. Social policy isn't often set my majority, because majorities end up infringing on the rights of others to fulfill their own agendas. Majoritarian view brought us wonderful things like segregated schools and laws against inter-racial marriage. I don't know about you, xray, but those sorts of decisions don't give me great faith that the majority gives a damn about anyone other than the majority.
You really should read James Madison's Federalist No. 10. In it, Madison eloquently argued that divesting the majority from absolute power was essential to the operation of a democratic government, because to do otherwise would necessarily create opportunity for the majority to trample upon the rights of those who were outside of that group. Madison's wisdom has been borne out throughout the existence of this Republic.
Ultimately, the minority in situations like the Christmas issues that you bring up aren't taking away the rights of the majority -- the concern for protecting the minority is precluding the government from taking the majority's side, which is fair. The "majority," who want to celebrate Christmas as a religious holiday can do so through their own private customs and traditions -- the minority just asks that the government play no role in the manner in which the majority celebrates. Asking that the goverment not put a nativity scene in the courthouse doesn't strike me as an infringement on the rights of the majority when each person who wishes to do so may place a nativity scene on his own property.
Again, I ask, why is that such a bad thing?
Downtown, I quit reading your post after the first paragraph, well actually the
second. You don't understand the cons ution much. The President is
elected by a majority of the "Electoral College". And Congress is elected by
the majority of the people in their individual states.
Go figure on some of the arguments put forth in this forum.
And by the way, we are a Republic and not a Democracy. You might want
to read up on that also.
I'll trust my cons utional knowledge, but I appreciate your effort to misguide me. The electoral college doesn't represent a national majority in any sense. As the 2000 Presidential Election demonstrated, a President can be elected without receiving the majority of all votes cast in this country. Likewise, while the individual members of Congress are elected on a majoritarian basis in their districts and states, there is nothing in the Cons ution to support the notion that Congress represents the will of a national majority.
Funny, I specifically referenced that fact in my post.
What I find particularly funny is that you throw around all of this nonsense about the majority somehow being imposed upon, but don't engage anyone who calls you on that nonsense. Why don't you answer my questions?
The laws, statutes and mandates that protect my religious liberties protect the religious liberties of others as well. That is simply the exchange rate that I will have to deal with. Doesn't mean I have to agree/accept/promote their ideals, but I can't take away their right without denying my own.
Schools shouldn't be used for religious recruitment OR as a forum for political activism. Both sides are equally wrong on this, it's just that one side is wrong on purpose.
Well in the first place, the electoral college was established because of the
simple fact that the founding fathers didn't want the "popular" vote to elect a
President. Since large states could greatly influence the outcome of an
election for President. But the MAJORITY of the STATES do elect a President.
But you obviously don't want that pointed out to you.
And yes, the Congress is elected to represent their people back home. Of course
you wouldn't know that much anymore and even when they do, appointed, not
elected judges tend to put their own views out there as law. And impose their
will on people and our Congress hasn't got enough guts to get rid of them.
nm, misread
Why do you hate democracy?
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
