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Hopefully they can learn from this game. I'm sure it was embarrassing and frustrating. Fortunately, if it had to happen, it happened this early in the season and to a pitiful team. Let's hope they don't let their guard down again.
I re-watched the game and I've gone over the play-by-play log and I'm convinced this loss falls on Pop's shoulders. I'm not one to blame him and I think that this is a rare occasion, but there are three glaring things I can point to that leaves no doubt in my mind where to point the finger.
1) Where was Bruce Bowen in the fourth? With Lamond Murray going off, Bowen should have been out there to shut him down. Murray is a good offensive player, but Bowen matches up well with him and could have made it a lot more difficult for him. Ginobili and Barry were getting destroyed trying to cover him. On top of his defense, Bowen was having a good shooting day. I know he had four fouls, but Pop should have eventually put him back in the game.
2) Manu Ginobili played too many minutes. You don't play Ginobili a season-high 37 minutes for several reason. First of all, he came into the game banged up with a couple bruises from the first two games of the road trip. Secondly, this is a third game in four nights. Not only should he get limited minutes just on that fact, but also the Spurs play tomorrow and now he'll be tired for that game as well. Third of all, he had to guard either Jalen Rose or Vince Carter ... which sapped a lot of energy out of him. The result of the minutes was an ineffective fourth quarter performance. The coaches know they need to keep Ginobili around 30 minutes ... I guess they just lost track of time.
3) The Raptors went small in the fourth and Pop went with Horry instead of Rose. Rose was playing awesome in the third quarter. He had a circus shot And-1 and also was fighting under the basket. He was supplying a lot of energy and toughness. In the fourth during the collapse, the Spurs were asleep. Horry didn't do anything to change the at ude of the team ... whereas Rose probably would have.
Hopefully they can learn from this game. I'm sure it was embarrassing and frustrating. Fortunately, if it had to happen, it happened this early in the season and to a pitiful team. Let's hope they don't let their guard down again.
i hope pop wakes up and gets a solid rotation down. there are always some loses like this at the beginning of every season when pop chokes on his rotations in an effort to find an effective and consistent second unit.
What about taking Rasho out when he was clearly having a good game. He had 5 rebounds in 7 minutes in the third quarter and Pop took him out when he got his 2nd and 3rd foul. He didn't put him in until there were only 4 minutes to go in the fourth, and then benched him immediately after he recieved his fourth foul a minute later. At the time when Rasho was benched in the third quarter, Tim and Rasho combined for more rebounds than the entire Raptors team (13+11 against 23 i think) and each had more offensive rebounds then their whole team did (7, 6 to 5). By the time the game was through they almost had as many rebounds as the Spurs and added another 6 on the offensive end in the last 16 minutes. With Rasho in the game the Spurs got a lot of second possessions which is very important when you're trying to hold onto a lead so I don't know if putting Horry in instead was a very good idea.
too bad the real reason was that Duncan thought the game was over after 3 qtrs and the rest of the team agreed with him. after all he is the leader and the rest of his team was just following his example. pop probably is also to blame here but it's nice that Duncan finally manned up and took responsibility for a loss
I've never understood the reaction of a coach si ing his starter after getting a foul in the fourth quarter with a few minutes to go. So what if he needs to warm up a little after he's been out. Presumably the starter is better than his replacement or he wouldn't be starting and if he fouls, out so what.
There's nothing to 'save' him for--they don't give out medals for sitting on the bench for the remaining few minutes.
Losses happen, get over it. Keep it in perspective that our honorable team is doing well and 8-2 will get us through the season any old time.
MadDoc
Truer words have not been spoken. analyze it all you want, the team thought the game was over and that Toronto would turn over and die.
Last edited by johnny00; 11-22-2004 at 03:25 PM. Reason: Lack of punctuation
have to say i agree with all three things.
Ginobili is not made to play 35 to 40 minutes a game.
This is a game, like the Seattle game, where I think a healthy LJ3 wouldve come in handy.
Bowen Parker Duncan Rose Brown shouldve been the lineup near the end.
Rasho, I could see why he wasnt in there, hes too slow to guard Bosh or the other pf they had in the game, so its legit that he couldnt match up well.
The Spurs can't win em all.
.800
Can't complain about that.
It's early in the season, Sequ. I'll give you some time before you start complaing! :p
I think Sequ, while he wont say it.
is partially sold on this team.
as am i.
I see the POTENTIAL this team has.
Rasho's huge improvement.
Ginobili's huge improvement.
Devin Brown MAYBE finally getting on track.
Brent Barry showing flashes of greatness, though the last couple games the greatness has been sustained to JUST the game against the Celtics.
The one I feel worst for are Sean Marks and LJ3.
I thought they wouldve made the active roster, and they wouldve contributed quite a bit and wouldve made this team even better than right now.
Marks I think was ready to turn a corner, and I think LJ3 wouldve been a great addition.
I am going to have to take it easy. I can no longer complain or be hostile towards the Spurs players. I have to support brother tpark in the quest for Rasho greatness.
I will order my Rasho jersey in honor of his few fans. Tpark needs me at a time like this. He could fall off the ledge any minute, I must support him.
Go Spurs.
dont flatter yourself.
i could care less what you think about him, just back it up with an intelligent basketball take.
Saying someone "sucks is soft and is white" is not good reasons why a guy is not good.
Thats all my beef with you has been, at least have a real basketball take about the guy.
If you watched a game without your homer shades on then you would see that usually, occasionally he is asleep. Now the last few games he has done well. We'll see.
i do watch them without homer shades.
if you would see above i admit Rasho has a tendancy to flutter and not play well, and i also admit that he doesnt play tough at ttimes.
Ive just advocated to not hold the guy up to unattainable heights and want him to be David Robinson
yes manu now is tired due to pop being a idiot
Like I've been telling everybody from the begining. Spurs are gonna go 79 - 3.
e20 notice amare's 4 assist at halftime?
Well, Pop did have to sit Manu because he was dead tired in the fourth quarter. Playing him so many minutes last game not only hurt Manu in that game, but also in this one.
Pop's Three Big Mistakes Versus Toronto
1) Not having Marks in the Rotation
2) Not having Marks in the Rotation
3) Not playing Bowen in the forth.
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