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Maybe we can include Butler in a S&T for Johnson?
link
second order of business, locking up 20-year-old power forward Amir Johnson, wasn't as swift.
Johnson was expected to join the summer league team in Las Vegas on Wednesday afternoon -- an indication a deal was imminent -- but he did not play.
The deal is still not done. The Pistons are believed to have offered a three-year deal worth as much as $10 million. It's possible that Bill Duffy, Johnson's agent, might have had interest from another team, maybe San Antonio. But the Pistons have made it clear they will match any offer.
What if the Spurs are trying to dumpo Butler to use money for Johnson?
Maybe we can include Butler in a S&T for Johnson?
What if the Spurs are trying to use Butler to acquire Johnson in a sign & trade?
Detroit could use a big body like Butler, couldn't they?
I think you're reading too much into it. If you pay attention to all the sound bites on free agents, SA is a popular name to drop by agents so they can get better offers elsewhere.
Given the SPurs track record on spending for FAs of late I think their name would be the last one agents would be dropping. Rasho, Finley, Barry all signed for less than they could get elsewhere. That said I'd pack Butler's bags if he could get the Spurs the ultra-athletic and somewhat skilled Johnson, probably a much better prospect than Mahinmi. Pistons certainly seem to have it all over the Spurs when it comes to talent evaluation (minus the Darko fiasco).
Stealing Amir would probably be a good deal. It's always nice to steal a good prospect (like we did to the knicks with Butler). However, to make space, my reccomendation would be to deal Elson (who would be roughly the correct amount of cap space at 10 mil/3 yrs) to the NJ nets who might be interested in replacing Mikki Moore, as he wants more money to resign than they are willing to offer. Amir would be a better fit in Elson's spot anyway - he's much more of a face-up runner than a back to the basket banger, if reports are to be believed...
Assorted Articles that mention Johnson (particularly the D-League Reports)
http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprof...293&page=links
Don't catch any NBADL. What's his deal? He's 6'10" PF whose game is still rough. He addresses none of our needs, as this board sees them.
Excellent point. I often feel the same way.
Don't forget to read the fine print on that last line of the excerpt....
....But the Pistons have made it clear they will match any offer.
I don't see it happening with all free agents. I do see it happening with those who play point guard and SF, two places most people agree the Spurs have a need.
he is 6'11" now.
Why would the Spurs offer more than 3 yrs, $10 mil guaranteed to someone who has played a total of 163 minutes in the NBA?
I think the statement about Detroit matching any offers is the agent trying to get a lot more $$$$
He could be our long SF we need, but nothing over 3M a year.
No, its about Detroit scaring off any potential teams that might have interest in Johnson.
Amir Johnson is who I wanted this summer as the athletic 4/long 3 - he's a better rebounder than anyone on the Spurs outside Duncan. But it looks like (unless something weird happens) Detroit will keep him.
This could be the guy that is the Dirk solution. It would be nice to see the Spurs break form and go after him but little chance of that.
Looking at this long-term, this works fairly well, even if we unload Elson instead of Butler. Consider the squad has room for 6 bigs (Note Johnson is not an SF - he's not got much of a jumpshot. He does however, play face-up rather than back to the basket).
Guaranteed contracts, () indicates the Spurs might move him to make space
07-08 Duncan, Oberto, Horry, Bonner, (Elson), (Butler)
if we move either Elson or Butler we have room. If we further subdivide into Back to the Basket and Face-up bigs, we get
Duncan, Oberto, (Butler) - BtBB
Horry, Bonner, (Elson) - FuB
For optimum fit, moving Elson for space would be optimum, as I suggested above. Assuming trade Elson for space and bring both Mahnimi and Splitter, we get
This would give 07/08
Duncan, Oberto, Butler - BtBB
Horry, Bonner, Johnson - FuB
Next year there is a roster crunch
08/09
Duncan, Oberto, (Butler) - BtBB
Bonner, Johnson - FuB
Splitter (almost guaranteed to bring over, due to buyout structure) (BtBB or FuB, I don't know), Mahnimi (FuB) - Strong Prospects to bring over
Scola (BtBB) - Lower likelyhood prospect to bring over
We would have 3 strong prospects and 1 spot.
Duncan, Oberto, Butler, Splitter - BtBB
Bonner, Johnson, Mahnimi - FuB
if we traded Butler for space:
Duncan, Oberto, Splitter - BtBB
Bonner, Johnson, Mahnimi - FuB
The first option leaves us with only 8 spots for Wings and PGs, which might be less than optimal. The second option, moving Butler instead of Elson, we would have a better situation, but it might jeopardize our repeat chance in 07/08 (due to fit).
09/10
Duncan, Oberto (team option?), Splitter (almost certain) - BtBB
Bonner (team option?), Johnson?, Mahinmi?
If we resign Butler, and let Oberto go/Trade him,
Duncan, Butler, Splitter - BtBB
Bonner, Johnson, Mahinmi
Clearly in all of this, we would need to move Scola's rights, as he becomes caught in the numbers crunch. Does anyone think a 3 way S&T might work -
Nets Get - rights to Scola, Elson
Nets Give - Trade Exception, 08 First
Detroit Get - Nets 08 First, Trade Exception
Detroit Gives - Johnson S&T (?12 million/3 yrs?)
SA Get - Johnson S&T (?12 million/3 yrs?)
SA Gives - rights to Scola, Elson
I think the likelier scenario is that Mahinmi replaces Butler this summer and Splitter replaces Elson next summer. Their rookie contracts are much too tempting for the Spurs.
I like Amir Johnson. I think he's going to be a good player down the line. There's a chance he blows up Jermaine O'Neal style.
However, he doesn't make a huge amount of sense on the Spurs. He's more 4 than 3. And his negative attributes are concerning his rawness, slow rotations defensively and a low basketball IQ.
The Spurs and their fans would never give him time to develop. The Spurs got Jackie Butler in a similar situation and a couple weeks into having him, everyone in town was ready to throw him away. You sign Amir Johnson, you have to baby him for three or four more years.
But all that would end up happening on the Spurs is everyone would get impatient because he wouldn't be David Robinson out of the box and he wouldn't have much playing time to try to improve on the court. And the Spurs would end up trading him for a second round pick in 2009.
On top of that, he's going to cost $3-4M per year at least to actually steal him away from the Pistons. Not worth the gamble giving this team and this city's willingness to let a player develop.
Spurs should look at Jarvis Hayes.
Wizards are not going to sign him.
Last year in the NBA Amir played 8 games:
MPG - 15.5
PPG - 5.9
FG% - .545
FT% - .786
RPG - 4.6
BPG - 1.6
Now translate that into 25 MPG or even 30. And this is a 20 year old.
Something tells me the Spurs wouldn't have to "baby him for three or four more years". If he were a Spur now fans here would be creaming themselves and calling Pop an idiot for not playing him more.
Supposedly, at least one report has it, one hang up in the Pistons signing him is that he only wants a three year deal and they want to lock him up for five.
Butler is never going to be agile. He's never going to be even an average defender. He's never going to have elevation. Christ he makes Rasho look like a dunking machine. Highly questionable he'll be motivated and God forbid what he's like if he ever lands a solid long term contract.
That's too little to give someone $10 million.
MPG - 11.7
PPG - 4.9
FG% - .447
FT% - .711
RPG - 2.8
BPG - 0.2
Then again not sure Marcus would say this guy was worth $10 million either.
Bonner's shown he can play in the league. Johnson hasn't done that. All we have is 163 minutes in 11 games. Would Johnson be worth say, $5 mil over 2 years with a team option for the 2nd year? Perhaps.
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