The reality for this years Suns and their fans is that the Suns' margin for error is practically nill. The Suns will struggle to win 50-55 games.
Their defense is the worst its been since the return of Nash and the rebounding is even worse. I touted last year as the year for the Suns. They had the ego, the chip on their shoulder, the salary cap, etc. Everything was aligning for them, but things happened and they didn't win.
They have a serious lack of intensity and effort, chemistry issues and a coach that will be gone after the season anything short of a le. The Suns don't have the ability to "flip the switch", the west is tougher than ever; and the teams that have gotten better are playing up tempo as well as playing some D.
Not to mention the Suns are the second oldest team, or one of the top five, isn't it?
The franchise has continually traded away draft picks and always offered Marion in trades.
I've been a supporter of D'Ant, but he has yet to evolve as a coach and i suspect this will be his last year as coach if they don't win a le - they can't just out score everyone anymore. To be a great team you must, MUST have success against your division and conference.
Boris, obviously, is overpaid, but Sarver couldn't afford another JoJo fiasco. That being said, Boris needs to be starter as does Barbosa. But where? Bell has struggled this year and after Skinner there is no bench.
D'Ant's "big" signing as GM was Banks, yet he treats him like now. I really wish D'Ant would start:
C - Skinner
PF - Amare
SF - Marion
SG - Barbosa
PG - Nash
The bench would be Diaw, Hill, Bell, Banks, Marks.
Having "7 or 8 starters" has really become an achillies heal for the Suns - more so than ever.
Planet Orange glasses wearing fans probably won't like this, but it's the reality of the 07/08 Suns as we wallow through another unfulfilled season.
Bookmark this and check back in April.
Starting Barbosa is not a good idea; the Suns bench is already poor to begin with, so they need Leandro as a 6th man; moreover, they need Bell's defense from the tip off.
They just need a better bench; I was thinking Marion on the bench, and move Diaw to the starting lineup.
Hill is better than Marion in my opinion, and Diaw seems to be more comfortable as a starter than as a subs ute. Plus, putting Marion on the bench would be a wake-up call for him.
They also need a good backup for Nash, other than Barbosa; Van Gundy said yesterday that Leandro is better as a small SG than as a PG, and I agree with him.
Also, they should have worked harder to keep Joe Johnson; he was their most versatile player.
Well, we shouldn't be too hard on the Suns.
No one has ever expected them to win a championship and they've never been the favorite to win a championship.
They are just losing to teams they're supposed to lose to.
I agree with everything BillsCarnage just said. I hit the panic button after that disgusting game against the Lakers yesterday.
As a Spurs fan, I don't have the same impending sense of doom from neither Phoenix nor Dallas this year.
Do I think it be an easy series were the playoffs to start tomorrow? No.
But they just don't seem to have the same swagger that carried them in recent years past.
Two humble Suns fans in one thread. Unreal.
Hill really screwed up siging on with the Suns. He's supposed to be smart, didn't he realize the Suns and their piss poor approach will never win a le.
"That's fine. We got two more match-ups this season," Adolph D'Antoni.
Hill did the best thing for himself. In Phoenix he will get many touches and doesn't have to worry about getting jumped on for not playing defense. He gets to run and gun the way he likes to and doesn't have to worry about riding the bench as a 1st year player that doesn't get the system yet. It's the right place for him.
I can't see Marion ever being willing to come off the bench. This is a guy who has expressed anger over being seen as the "third wheel" and said that he thinks he could/should be "the man" on a team. His ego wouldn't allow him to come off the bench
Well, in that case, they must trade him
I'll have to agree, but I've been ringing this bell of warning since Thomas was given away for a tidy pocketing of cash. In July I mentioned posted that I believed the Suns should still win the Pacific, but that it wouldn't be by a lot. I posted that they'd struggle to a finish of 54-to-58 wins. I liked both the Hill and Skinner signings, but felt the Suns offseason really screwed them in the immediate and longterm.
I few weeks ago I argued to a few Spurs fans that they shouldn't write off the Suns just because they hadn't played anyone out West, but should rather wait until after Christmas. Well, it's now time to note the two wins (skidding Utah, parker-less San Antonio) vs. three losses (Dallas, Hornets and Lakers).
Right now the Suns shooting isn't at the point where they can simply out-shoot its opponant to make up for its weaknesses any longer. It struggles on the boards nightly, struggles to make the promt defensive rotations often, gives up too much size in the paint, doesn't go deep enough and this is despite playing only seven to eight players for roughly 30-to-40 minutes a night.
There's been no player development, which scares me when injuries strike. There's been very little attempt to address its size issues by either playing Skinner more, which would be smart regardless since he's not an issue on offense, or by acquiring a legit 7-footer. Nash is playing way too many minutes way too often and Hill, despite proving he is and will still be a player both for this and future seasons, is fastly wearing out, I fear. Amare doesn't look the same. Not even close. And while he's improved his shot blocking, it's come at the expense of his man-to-man focus. Marion has been consistant and up to snuff, but how long can he take playing 40 minutes a night? Barbosa has been great, but not to the point to make up for Bell's lackings. Diaw is a mystery nightly and even on good offensive nights, he's still a defensive liability.
I still say they stave off the Lakers in the long run and win the Pacific, but it's going to be very difficult and will likely mean D'Antoni further exhausting Nash, Hill, Marion among others. I stick by my claim of 54-to-58 wins, but fear it is closer to 54-to-55 TOPS right now.
I'd very much like to see this team take a risk and go after Artest. Diaw and the Atlanta pick may be tempting and if an expiring contract like Piatkowski is thrown in, it should work, if offered and accepted. He'd be very welcome and could provide depth at three positions, supply energy and hustle and could hopefully team up with Marion and Bell to lock-down the perimeter.
While I suspected Utah would be the biggest threat to supplanting the Suns from the "big-3" of the West status, it may very well turn out to be the Lakers. They have the size, depth, leadership and coaching to do so. If Bynum keeps up his recent play and Kobe remains trusting of his young teammates, then I see no reason why they can't challenge for 52-to-57 wins.
If the Suns don't win the Pacific, they may very well fall into the bottom half of the playoff seeds. That would likely doom them in the first round.
Can you really say objectively that Barbosa has been "great"? It seems to me that he has caused lots of problems for the Suns--and he can't even hit his shots anymore, especially when we really need him to. I can't stand his play anymore, and would love to trade him (+ filler) for Marcus Camby, if possible.
Would you settle for Elson?
...he's not that bad.
weren't there similar doom! threads earlier when the mavs were struggling? Not saying mavs or suns don't have holes that have been exposed, but i still see them as the top teams in the west below the spurs. Lakers will have to prove more to me but they do look solid, obviously better than last year but again, it will be a matter of how all these teams play down the road.
I agree with most of what's been said here.
The one bright side is that Grant Hill has been everything advertised, and more. Even his defense has been better than expected.
The down side is that, unbelievably, it seems that the interior defense and rebounding has gotten worse. The blame for that has to be laid at the feet on D'Antoni.
I think the Mavs are in much better shape than the Suns. A lot of their struggles have been because they are trying to add new wrinkles which they hope will pay dividends in the postseason.
D'Antoni, on the other hand, has personified the old joke about insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
The Suns are still the most talented team in the league, and they will still be a tough out. But as BillsCarnage said, they're getting older, and they don't seem to have been taught any new tricks.
with the apparent stagnation of the suns and the mavs, the struggles of the rockets, the steady rise of the lakers and the jazz, excitement by the trailblazers and the hornets, and the hunger by the warriors.... the home stretch in the west will be one crazy ride.
one thing's for sure...
........ its going to be one of a western playoffs come summertime.
the spurs will keep its head above water and continue flying under the radar until then.
to trade Thomas was the worst mistake the Suns made in the offseason.
What an idiot.Disconnect Between Kerr And D'Antoni?
Suns GM Steve Kerr and the rest of the personnel team have used the last run of games as an evaluation tool, and a 3-5 record with wins over Utah, Tony Parker-less San Antonio and Toronto might not be enough to instill confidence.
There appears to be at least a peripheral disconnect between Kerr -- a staunch believer in defense and depth -- and Mike D'Antoni's high-octane offense/tight rotation mantra that will also play a role in the decision-making.
"The last time I checked, we're one or two games off the lead in the West, so I think we're OK," D'Antoni said. "Could we dominate? Maybe, but we're not. Each year presents a different problem." -- East Valley Tribune
Going Big Next Step For Suns ...
# The Suns are going to give more time to the front-line combination of Brian Skinner and Amaré Stoudemire starting with tonight's game in Los Angeles against the Clippers, whose center, Chris Kaman, is averaging 18.6 points and 14 rebounds.
Suns coach Mike D'Antoni was hesitant to use the big-man pairing, but it looks more palatable after a series of games in which Phoenix has been shredded by interior scoring. That means less of Shawn Marion at power forward, where his shooting has not kept defenses honest. -- The Arizona Republic
If they fizzle out of the playoffs again this season, D'Antoni's ass better start auditioning for the Bulls jobs or something.
The Suns have let slip away several gilt-edged chances to improve their rotation this season:
1. Trading Amare and change for Garnett.
2. Trading overrated drama queen Marion for Kirilenko or Odom
3. Keeping Kurt Thomas instead of trading him for $$
Even during this season, one would think D'Antoni would try and address the flaws that have stumped his team in past years:
1. Playing a genuine big man next to Amare to help rebounding and defense
2. Playing his backup PGs more to rest Nash (even if it means taking a few losses in the short term while giving them enough time to adjust to the offense)
3. Spread his minutes across a 10-man rotation and not play Hill 35 mpg
He hasn't done any of that this season. They really don't have anyone else to blame but their coach's stubborn ways.
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