Game Thoughts: Spurs @ Suns Mar. 9

[timvp]

This was an odd game for the San Antonio Spurs. This was unlike any game the Spurs played against the Phoenix Suns in recent history. For once, the Spurs were the smaller team. The Spurs also couldn’t grab as many rebounds as they felt like grabbing and they couldn’t humiliate the Suns in the paint repeatedly.

The man responsible for this change was none other than longtime Spurs nemesis Shaquille O’Neal. O’Neal was dominant for big portions of the game. He was motivated, seemingly in good shape and was crafty enough to defend against what the Spurs wanted to do on both ends of the court. When he wasn’t forcing Tim Duncan to shoot jumpers, he was clogging the paint and making it difficult for Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker to get to the rim. When he wasn’t pounding the boards, he was jumping into the stands trying to kill Suns fans.

Besides O’Neal, I have to give Mike D’Antoni a lot of credit. Since acquiring O’Neal, D’Antoni has implemented a new-look offense that is much more suited to playoff basketball. The run-and-gun Suns have been replaced by a team that uses pin downs, cross screens and point guard picks in the half court offense. I thought I was watching a Jerry Sloan coached team for a minute.

All that said, the Spurs had this game won late in the fourth quarter. Up by five points with just a little more than five minutes to go in the game, the Spurs suddenly went ice cold. They only made one more basket as the Suns ran away with a 94-87 victory. The 14-2 run to end the game was difficult to watch as a Spurs fan but it wasn’t shocking to see. The Spurs have been streaky offensively this season – and they hit a bad streak at the worst possible time.

Overall, I’m pretty disappointed by this turn of events. The Suns are no longer the soft, paper champions that they’ve been in the past. The Spurs aren’t playing championship basketball at all right now. I can’t remember the last time the Spurs came out and thoroughly played Spurs Basketball from tip to buzzer against a quality opponent.

-Tim Duncan was horrible, especially in the second half. He let O’Neal dominate him in the second half. Duncan either settled for a jumper or made a weak attempt to draw a foul when he had the ball in the second half. Defensively, his one-on-one defense was only average. His team defense was lacking and his overall energy just wasn’t there. For the game, Duncan finished with 17 points and 10 rebounds, while hitting 6-of-19 shots from the field. It was like he saw the Suns uniform and couldn’t figure out why he couldn’t easily dominate like he has since he’s been in the league. Note to Duncan: That big, sweaty guy who looked like Shaquille O’Neal was in fact Shaquille O’Neal. Remember, you actually have to try against him.

-Manu Ginobili wasn’t his regular superstar self against the Suns. In the first half, he played like a stubborn chucker. He wasn’t looking for the open man – he was just looking to score the ball. In the third quarter, he went the other extreme and wasn’t aggressive enough. In the fourth, he mixed a few poor shot attempts with a couple passive possessions. Coming off the bench again, Ginobili had 22 points, five rebounds, two assists and five turnovers, while shooting 7-for-19 from the floor. He was actually hitting shots from downtown, as he was 4-for-6. Although, that means he was just 3-for-13 on two-pointers. You can blame a lot of that on O'Neal clogging things in the middle.

-Tony Parker had a streaky game. In the first half, he looked like he was laboring yet again on his ankle. Luckily, he was hitting his outside shot in the first half and went a perfect 4-for-4 in the first two quarters. In the second half, Parker showed a burst of health in a few instances. Overall though, Parker just doesn’t look right – and that’s damn scary. His stats actually turned out decently as he scored 21 points, dished out five assists and hit 7-of-15 shot attempts. However, I’m not convinced that he’s 100% at the moment because Steve Nash was able to stay with him defensively. A healthy Parker would laugh at Nash while blowing by him to lay the ball up.

-Bruce Bowen played 38 minutes but I didn’t think he really did much of anything. Pop didn’t put him on Nash as much as he usually does. When Bowen was on Nash, Bowen didn’t do as good a job as he usually does. Offensively, Bowen went 1-for-5 from the field. It was a forgettable game for Bowen, to say the least.

-Kurt Thomas started yet again at center and played very well in the second half after struggling in the first half. He got abused by O’Neal in the first half but his defense, rebounding and shotmaking abilities were much better in the second half. He finished with 11 points, seven rebounds and went 4-for-9 from the field. All of his field goals were standstill jumpers from about 18-feet away. He even mixed in a stare down to the Suns bench after drilling back-to-back jumpers.

-Michael Finely started at shooting guard and sucked. He missed all six of his shots in his 23 minutes of action. His defense was bad on whoever he was defending. His only other contributions other than missing shots were his two rebounds. For Finley to keep starting, he’s going to have to snap out of this slump. If not, the Spurs have plenty of players who will be more than happy to take his minutes.

-Ime Udoka played 20 minutes off the bench and did reasonably well. He had eight points, six rebounds and two steals, while hitting 3-of-7 shots from the field. His defense was good for the most part and he was taking quality shots offensively. Udoka easily led the team in plus/minus with a +17. That said, I’m not convinced he has the mental aspect of Spurs Basketball down yet. He seems to get flustered too easily for my liking. Udoka needs to work on keeping his concentration throughout every minute he’s on the court.

-Fabricio Oberto played 10 minutes and did about as well as he’s going to do in limited time. He had four points and five rebounds and hit both of his shots from the field. However, I’m guessing when Oberto has nightmares, his nightmares feature Shaquille O’Neal. Literally every time Oberto goes against O’Neal, Oberto ends up bruised up, bloodied or injured. This time, it was Oberto’s lip that O’Neal busted open.

-Damon Stoudamire was on the court for ten minutes behind Parker at point guard. To put it bluntly, Stoudamire was putrid. Whatever Pop is telling him to do is not working. At. All. Pop wants Stoudamire to be a fearless gunner. The problem is that Stoudamire hasn’t been a fearless gunner since about 1996. Stoudamire these days is most valuable as a playmaker and a distributor. Hopefully he’s allowed to go back to that role. (I often wonder why Pop doesn’t find a point guard who is a fearless gunner instead of trying to force those characteristics into point guards. Like say, why not go after Earl Boykins? Boykins has never met a shot that he didn’t like and is a fearless gunner naturally. And Boykins was available when Stoudamire was signed. Just wondering …)

-Robert Horry played seven invisible minutes. The only reason why he was noticed was because Suns fans booed him whenever he got the ball. With the way Horry has shot this season, Suns fans should have actually been rooting for him to take more shots.

-Jacque Vaughn played a couple seconds. Vaughn better enjoy this vacation because with the way things are going, he’ll get his backup point guard job back pretty soon.

-Pop didn’t do anything too horrendous this game. I don’t think there was a magic button to push when the team couldn’t buy a bucket late in the game. The defense against the Suns was mostly solid – it was just a very poor offensive showing, even before the collapse.

With all the difficult games forthcoming on the schedule, the Spurs have to just be in survival mode at the moment. They need to put this loss behind them and move on. If they dwell on this two game losing streak, they could be looking at a five or six game losing streak before they know what hit ‘em.

The bottomline is the Spurs still have a ways to go before they can be considered playoff ready. Hopefully los killer instinct can be formed, los Duncan and Ginobili can stay healthy, los Parker can get 100% healthy, los defense can become more consistent and los offense can find the rhythm it had in los early season games. Until then, the Spurs need a win on Monday against the Denver Nuggets. The Nuggets beat the Spurs just a couple days ago. Revenge is a dish that is best served old.

Believe.

[Streakyshooter08]

I saw the game live and was really disappointed. My biggest concern is Tony right now. In the first half he was not really aggressive in the second half he was better but still far away from his normal form. Nash was able to guard him well and that is not good sign. Timmy also played really poor.

The only positive thing was the Spurs still had a chance to win this game:

- None of the big 3 had a good game
- they shoot only 35% from the field
- get outrebounded 52-44
- score one basket in the final minutes...

and still lose by only 7 points. This is the only bright spot I see. Kurt also played a good game.

One other thought: Maybe Pop should give Udoka the start if he wants to bring Gino off the bench. Finley seems to be much better if he is not starting...

[batboy]

I'd rather have a flustered Udoka than a comatose Finley

[whottt]

You left out that psychologically Shaq isn't intimidated by the Spurs at all...unlike all the other Spurs owned and operated Suns. That might be the biggest thing he gives them...that little change of chemistry.




It'll be good to have Brent Back when we play the Suns, because not only is he a Suns killer...he's also a Shaq killer.


IF you don't believe me go take a look at what he did against the Shaq Kobe Lakers...when his teams went 12-6 against them. You'll literally choke when you see some of the games he had against them.



Then take a look at what he's done against teams with Shaq on them in his Spurs career as well.


He'll play good against the Suns...so hopefully Pop will continue to give him minutes against them.

[whottt]

PS: I'd like to take this moment to drop a big FU on everyone who told me I was stupid for saying this was a good trade for the Suns, and they will match up better with us because of it...you know who you are.


Like I said...you go out there and take it into the paint on Shaq and then say he's a joke....it's not about his ability to come out on picnrolls and rotate on defense...it's about his ability to knock the living out of anyone coming into the paint, just by shrugging. Shawn Marion he aint...

[ShoogarBear]

Yep, the One-Game-I-Told-You-Sos are out in full force.

[whottt]

Yep, the One-Game-I-Told-You-Sos are out in full force.

Why not? The guys telling me I was wrong were doing it after one game..and it wasn't even against the Spurs.


This matchup went down exactly like I predicted...that's the thing...


Shaq is big and intimidating...the idea of getting hit by him is intimidating. Shawn Marion is not intimidating...the idea of taking it into the paint on him is inviting...like Salma Hayek lying naked in your bed.


It's a different game when we play the Suns now...if only because psycholgically, Shaq is used to beating the Spurs.

[J.T.]

I'm starting to get tired of the [x member of Big 3] had an off game excuse. It's stupid to assume Manu will score 40 a game. It's stupid to assume Tony will be able to drive the lane all game long. And it's stupid to assume that even though he's been so consistent for us over the years, that Duncan will dominate each and every game. Teams get in funks, players go on shooting streaks all the time. I'm sure it was a reasonable assumption to say [x member of Phoenix] wasn't on their game during their recent skids, but you wouldn't know it if you read SpursTalk, since a lot of you said Phoenix was ed and done.

If you have to make excuses, why don't you use one that's actually true, like how the Spurs have sucked on ABC afternoon games for longer than I care to remember.

[WalterBenitez]

We lost almost everything in last two 4q (DEN/SUNS) the ability to close games, to defend, to score easy shots and so on.

I'd like to see stats of las 5 minutes in latest games, we simply collapsed, it is not about a single palyer (Mike FInley would be my favorite); besides we look mentality tired, phisically exhausted.

Probably we are gonna step up at the end of the season a be even better in playoffs but right now, we are playing bad; I don't what are we doing during halftime, but we must change it.

[polandprzem]

1. Spurs had no energy at all, and when they found some it was used in wrong direction.
2. No offense at all. We saw some shots on screens against Shaq but that's not enough. The startegy was bad as it could be. TD should force O'neal to defend him down low and get some fouls. Early in the game. Run some, jeez when I was watching that game I missed Brent, not only he can provide a fast break he also is good in motioning the ofense which was not fluid that for one and was slow, so slow that every Suns player could defend to well. Mike looked lost, Pop looked lost. Suns did not hit 3ptrs good enough the game was close till the end.
3. Defense - spurs let Nash go of with his middle pickrolls, and Shaq executed well. Eliminating this we eliminate 40-50% of Suns O. I wonder why Shaq get so close to the basket, jeez where is Rasho? He did a good job of not letting Shaq get to close to the basket area. (Shaq had some 3sec violations, hehe he is not slow yea)

[Blue-Lightning]

I thought Manu played pretty well... he did force some shots, but it looked like he was trying to get at least something going while the other players looked lethargic.

BL

[DarrinS]

As poorly as they played, it was still a very winable game for the Spurs -- the type of game we've seen them win countless times. What usually gives the Spurs the edge in these kinds of games is their discipline and focus -- something they didn't have in the last minutes of the 4th quarter.


With all these young, althletic, and hungry teams in the West, the Spurs will be fighting for their playoff lives.


Tonight's game will be telling.

[wildchild]

-Fabricio Oberto played 10 minutes and did about as well as he’s going to do in limited time. He had four points and five rebounds and hit both of his shots from the field. However, I’m guessing when Oberto has nightmares, his nightmares feature Shaquille O’Neal. Literally every time Oberto goes against O’Neal, Oberto ends up bruised up, bloodied or injured. This time, it was Oberto’s lip that O’Neal busted open.

Strongly disagree.
How many of you said Oberto sucks against Shaq?
He did a hard job in only 10 minutes against him. Shaq didn't score over him in those minutes.
Maybe it isn't the best matchup for Oberto but he was able to rise to the occasion.
Good to see Oberto with his usual effort, defense and rebounds.
Unfortunately for him, Pop doesn't think the same.
Why? I don't sure. Even I guess his rebounds (Oberto finished with 5 rebounds in 10' and Thomas with 7 in 27') and defense on Shaq/Amare was good and better than Thomas in the first half game. I don't mean to discredit Thomas. I really like him in the second half especially his open shot.
I only thought Oberto deserved more minutes at the beginning of 4th quarter.
I can't explain that. When he plays well but Pop doesn't let him play more, in addition to defeat, I get into being a real fan of Oberto.
I think if he play only 10' per game maybe we would be lost a good player in playoffs.

[Southwest Texas Fan]

I am a little worried about Tony. His jumpers looked really good but he seemed a step slower and was less explosive.

[wildchild]

If you have to make excuses, why don't you use one that's actually true, like how the Spurs have sucked on ABC afternoon games for longer than I care to remember.

Not kidding dude.

[remingtonbo2001]

I'm starting to get tired of the [x member of Big 3] had an off game excuse. It's stupid to assume Manu will score 40 a game. It's stupid to assume Tony will be able to drive the lane all game long. And it's stupid to assume that even though he's been so consistent for us over the years, that Duncan will dominate each and every game. Teams get in funks, players go on shooting streaks all the time. I'm sure it was a reasonable assumption to say [x member of Phoenix] wasn't on their game during their recent skids, but you wouldn't know it if you read SpursTalk, since a lot of you said Phoenix was ed and done.

If you have to make excuses, why don't you use one that's actually true, like how the Spurs have sucked on ABC afternoon games for longer than I care to remember.

I'd agree that the Spurs may be going through some sort of pre-playoff slump. However, if the Big 3 put up their respective averages, or 2 of the 3 play extremely well, the Spurs are nearly incredibily difficult to beat.

Can anyone pull up our ABC record during the Regular Season, in the Tim Duncan era?

[ManuTastic]

The time when Tony was penetrating well was early in the 3rd when Shaq was not on the floor defending the rim. Soon as Shaq checked back in, Tony got into the paint, saw Shaq's shadow, and brought it back out. Simple as that.
Gotta give Shaq big ups for this game. I thought he was done, and that this was a bad trade for PHx, but that game was all about Shaq-fu. OTOH, I don't think he can bring that kind of game more than once a week. I still like our chances against them in a 7-game series.

[wildchild]

I am a little worried about Tony. His jumpers looked really good but he seemed a step slower and was less explosive.

FT% wasn't good. Maybe his ankle is bothering him.

[samikeyp]

I am a little worried about Tony. His jumpers looked really good but he seemed a step slower and was less explosive.

I agree and his teardrop has been way off of late.

[41times]

I was absolutely shocked at the finish of the game yesterday.
The Spurs did their usual deal and had the Suns right where they wanted them with 4 minutes to go. They had held them to about 80 points with 4 minutes to go and it was all but over.......

But then the Suns pulled a Spurs and locked down defensively, got every big rebond and made the big shots and finished the game with a 14 - 2 run! are you kidding me?

That is exactly what the Spurs used to do to people in the 4th quarter, especially the Suns.

So either Shaq made the difference or the Spurs just got tired? Regardless, I was very surprised.

I think the Division race has a new look to it today and by the end of the month it could be a toss up.

[LEONARD]

I can't believe the Spurs lost this game...

[polandprzem]

Well as I said in other thread.
Spurs needed that loss more than other loses. Phsychology

I don't know how the spurs are scheudled but they need a day offffffff.

[Russ]

When shots aren't falling all other aspects of the game look different. You notice the rebounding problems, the defensive lapses, etc. If the Spurs hit a couple shots, everyone forgets about those deficiencies and we all think the win was ordained from the beginning.

Phoenix hit jumpers and the Spurs didn't at the end. Just the way it was in their playoff series last year, close all the way with the winner hitting the big shots.

Stoudamire did look clueless, though (running around without any purpose).

[Solid D]

I didn't get to see the game, yet. Thanks for the synopsis, timvp.

I wasn't surprised the Suns won this home game. Grant Hill did an excellent job defending (both) his man & doubling on Tim in their previous games this year. The addition of Shaq only exposes the Spurs outside shooting weakness more. As I mentioned in another thread, the Spurs aren't as good as they were this time last year because they don't have Brent's scoring and their baseline/weakside help is slow and soft. Any team that can clog the lane and play Timmy physical will force the Spurs to hit their outside shots. The offense is necessary because the defense cannot be relied upon to consistently get stops down the stretch,

[cash459]

Tony IS playing scared or with a serious lack of confidence. Plus, he tweaked his ankle again in the 3rd (i think) so hopefully that doesnt screw with his confidence anymroe.

Tim didnt play w/ as much drive and enthusiasm/want as we need him to. TWO easy shots blown, that is just unacceptable. , dunk it if you have to.

Also, how the do the Spurs allow BOTH amare & shaq to play almost 6 minutes each in a huge 4th quarter with 5 fouls and not get at least one of them fouled out!?!? Run a pick 'n roll involving one of them, take it to the basket more consistenly, if not every time....but allowing them each to have 5 fouls for that long and not getting either one of them fouled out is beyond me..... They have to recognize potential weaknesses and attack them to give us an advantage. You know that if it were Tim or any of the other big 3, other teams would run the offense with getting them out of the game being the main objective.

They need to make some changes or spend more time in the gym or something....i know that we are aging, but we cannot allow this to be something looming over our heads. And come playoff time, we are going to need to win some games on the road.