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The Old/Experienced thing is what gets me the most.
Regular Season Effort Level
The Spurs have coasted through the last few regular seasons. They haven’t gone all out to secure homecourt advantage in years. However, that strategy might have to be looked at again if the Spurs end up losing Game 7.
Against the Hornets, the Spurs would be a shoo-in for the Western Conference Finals if they had homecourt advantage. If the Spurs saw firsthand how homecourt advantage can mean the difference between an early vacation and a shot at the championship, San Antonio may have to abandon their current regular season ways.
If you look at their recent history, you can’t really blame the Spurs for not caring about homecourt advantage. In 2006, 2004 and 2001, the Spurs had homecourt advantage and it ended up not being a factor. The Spurs didn’t have homecourt advantage in 2002 but the Spurs were better on the road in the playoffs that year. Homecourt advantage hasn’t really mattered since 1998 – and even that year the Spurs won in the first round despite starting the series on the road.
Old or Experienced?
The Spurs have tiptoed the line between old and experience for three or four years now. The front office has remained steadfast in their belief that the roster wasn’t too old. And as it turned out last year, the front office was correct.
But if the Spurs lose to the Hornets, it’d be very possible that the imaginary line would have been crossed. In 2004, the Spurs could point to .4 as the reason why they lost – not age. In 2006, the Spurs could point to the unfortunate whistle and poor matchup – not age. Against the Hornets, there would really be nothing blame it on. The Hornets have already blown out the Spurs five times this season. There would be nothing unlucky or flukish about dropping this series.
The Spurs’ only real recourse to a loss to the Hornets would be to reload. That’d mean waiving goodbye to the older pieces. Robert Horry, Bruce Bowen, Brent Barry, Kurt Thomas, Michael Finley and Jacque Vaughn would be the ones put under the microscope. If the Spurs win Game 7, the Spurs could ultimately decide to keep the squad together for another run next year.
Playoff Confidence
When the Spurs find themselves in tough spots in the playoffs, they can usually point to a prior experience as evidence that all hope isn’t lost. But the Spurs have never recovered from losing the first two games of the series. The Spurs have never recovered from being down 2-3 in a series.
If the Spurs can win this series, the Spurs would become just about as playoff tested as possible. No matter what trouble the Spurs would find themselves in the future, they’d have the experience and the knowledge to fight their way out of the hole.
On the other hand, if the Spurs lose, they’d have to start wondering about their playoff toughness. The Spurs would have lost two consecutive Game 7’s where they entered the series as the favorites. Instead of being confident in big games, the Spurs may begin to wonder why they’ve struggled against beatable teams in win or go home situations.
The Repeating Window
The lone remaining negative aspect the media can point to when discussing this era of Spurs basketball is the fact that the Spurs haven't won two straight les. Truthfully, I don’t care too much about the criticism. To try to belittle the four championships the Spurs have won because they haven’t come in back-to-back years is laughable.
That said, if the Spurs don’t repeat as champions this year, the window to do so may be all but closed. Not only is the core getting older, there are a lot of young teams that are rapidly improving. While I do think the Spurs have three or four years of high level play remaining (barring injury), it’d be extremely difficult to imagine the team repeating at some point in the future.
Get this win.
1.
Believe.
The Old/Experienced thing is what gets me the most.
i don't think we should get ride of Bruce yet.
other than that, great read.
- Mars
Of those pieces, only Horry and Finley should be gotten rid of.
Maybe Vaughn if we find a surprise PG in the draft.
Kurt Thomas still has a lot to give us before he really starts declining, and I think if Brent can overcome his calf injury completely, he can go back to being the pre-injury 08 Brent Barry.
Good thoughts.
Of course, if the Spurs had put a little more thought and effort into what was at stake in the summer of 2003, questions about age and repeats might not be mentioned as much today.
it is still to early to get rid of bowen
the other ones yes but not bowen
let him teach the younger plays one more year
Bowen another year. The rest can go.
Why would anyone want to get rid of Bowen?? He's what makes us, us. With him its like we're playing 5 vs 4 out there.
This scares me and gives me hope at the same time.
I believe in this team, and I believe that they know what's at stake. This is the best shot at repeating they've had. Duncan wants it. I think he wants it more than he has in the past because he knows that window is closing. That may be the piece that gets them through this. The first 2 losses will serve them well. Duncan is taking nothing for granted. Game 7 falls on your best players to shine, letting your role players do their job. It's Duncan's time.
This is a particulary lame effort at a post.
First: there is no "repeat" pressure on the Spurs. They go out and try to win the le every year. It's only a statistical oddity that it's happened in the pattern it has.
Second: the Spurs are exactly correct in their approach to the regular season vs. the playoffs. And what is this "shoo-in if they had HCA" deal? If they had HCA it would probably still be 3-3 and going to a game 7 in San Antonio. That's hardly a shoo-in.
Third: You are talking as if the Spurs had already lost the series!
You know, when you put it that way, I'm not seeing the downside to losing.
I think they are too old. If the line wasn't crossed this year, it was dangerously trod upon, and they should be looking to reload with younger talent regardless. Much love and thanks to Horry, Finley, Vaughn and Barry - but I'd not cry for a moment if three of those four didn't return. And in this case, younger doesn't need to mean early twenties. Late 20s and early 30s are younger for these Spurs.
They don't need to overextend their effort in the regular season and go balls out, but more effort would not be amiss, and hopefully they see that regardless. They should be good enough that HCA doesn't matter, and until this series, I argued they were. But winning just one or two more games would have made a tremendous difference in the context of this series, and should they be lucky enough to escape, the next. To let that go because Tim Duncan was bored with the regular season or because Pop wanted to mash things up for fun - that's quickly becoming inexcusable. The gap that was there a couple of years ago is GONE. They need to wake up to that fact.
All year they lost to teams they shouldn't have lost to and didn't hold their own against good teams. That needs to improve - they should have more pride, but pride aside - they get paid enough that they should make themselves care a little more. After all - the fans pay for those seats or for that LP all season long.
If some of this stuff changes as a result of losing the series - well, that's not a bad thing, in short. If winning this series means they think the status quo is ok -- well that spells larger problems for this organization and team, imo. I hope this stuff gets re-examined regardless.
The biggest problem for the Spurs has been mental mistakes and weakness. They expected things to be easier and forgot to hustle. They fell back on old gameplans that weren't working and refused to try until their backs were against the wall. They are the best team in the league when they play to their potential - if they play to their potential and lose, I can live with that. It sucks, but somedays they are going to be outplayed. But to lose as they've lost in this series- settling for bad shots, indecision, turnovers, conceding rebounds and lost balls, begging for calls. It's disgusting. That is not Spurs basketball. That needs to change.
I hope they draw on their experience and make it count now. I hope they have some pride and that it takes them through. I hope they beat the out of NO in their arena and make a statement that they are still here and still have to be dealt with.
I believe in the Spurs - they can get it if they want it.
The Spurs are "experienced" when they win and "old" when they lose.
Duncan's age is what really gets me, he's been experienced for awhile now, but during these next few years he'll just be getting old.
Udoka?
The lack of aggressiveness by the FO in locking up Stephen Jackson is their one fatal flaw in recent years. We would have beaten the '04 Lakers and '06 Mavs with him. That's not to say we wouldn't have fallen in later rounds but seriously, think about it.
'04 would have been T'Wolves and then Pistons
'06 would have been PHOENIX and MIAMI
The 2006 elimination hurts the most because that was the Spurs best shot at repeating. ing Phoenix and Miami.
At this point I would actually try to get him back, since it's obvious to everyone that the Warriors are a Phoenix Suns imitation and their roster is only good for things like eliminating the soft Dallas Mavericks in the first round. Please come home, SJax.
I don't think there's any question in Duncan's toughness even though he's getting older. Duncan has been NAILS in the playoffs for his entire career. Any decline in his numbers isn't his age catching up to him, it's the rise of talented players around him.
Another thing about the '04 loss is that too many people cop out and blame it on Derek Fisher's miracle shot. The real culprit in the Spurs losing that series was The Hedo Experiment, which was the equivalent of having Michael Finley on a bad day for the entire series. It's should come as no surprise that the Spurs won two championships and came damn close to making it three in a row since dumping his ass, putting Manu in the starting line up, and getting a better wingman in Brent Barry to come off the bench.
And in '06 you could blame The Rasho and Nazr Experiment, otherwise known as Small Ball.
I was referring to all the older players when I said "the rest".
Horry & Finley I can see going with Barry & Vaughn 50/50. We will get younger next year - Ian and Tiago - but not at the wing position which seems to be the critical one now. Draft/FA/trades seem unlikely to produce anyone to fit the 3 now. Draft: takes time to develop and our position wouldn't reallistically net a good 3 - FA: $$$ - is the FO going ot open the bank and to who?? - Trades: what do we really have to give up to get good quality talent?? The Big 3 are most likely untouchable and if you trade one of them aren't you essentially scrapping the team and starting over? Maybe and then again maybe not - it all depens on who we trade and get in return - which is a whole new thread for the off season.
I can't blame Pop for his management of the team this year. I thought he did an excellent job in watching their minutes as to not wear them down during the regular season. As for the HCA in the playoffs who could have predicted that it would be so critical? As of now - Celtics/Cavs game not over the record stands at 20-2 for the HC team. That is an unbelievable stat. A 91% winning % at home! I can't remember that happening and it sure doesn't occur on a regular basis or we would be seeing a lot more teams jockeying for HCA down the stretch of the regular season.
We do need more youth and now. How it plays out I'm not certain but something has to give on this. We can't continue ot stay the course or we will be a perenial lottery team in a few years. I don't see the FO or Pop allowing that to happen. They may choose other players not to many of our likings but they won't sit back and do little if anything.
As for the SJax situation - wasn't he wanting $9-10 M to sign with us? We didn't pursue that due to the lame courtship of JKidd but was he worth it at the time? He was a head case and dissing Pop with his immature behavior. Yeah, I know he is very talented but was also a very streaky player at that time. Damn even Hedo has matured into a consistent player in Orlando, But the dude signed for - what $18M - even after his meltdown in the '04 playoffs.
The Spurs - woulda/coulda/shoulda - at times it's a gamble. Win a few and lose a few.
LETS see who is coming back for sure 1st.
The following 5 are under contract for at least 2 more years.
1. TD under contract till 2011/12
2. TP 2010/11
3. MANU 2009/2010
4. Bruce 2009/2010
5. MAtt 2009/2010
Of these 5, its obvious that the top 4 will be back. Matt Bonner will be used to entice a trade or he will be kept as insurance. His spot will be important.
the next group have contracts that go till next year.
6. Jacque Vaughn 2008/2009
7. Ime Iduka 2008/2009
8. IAN Mahinmi 2008/2009
9 Brent Barry 2008/2009
* all these 4 players have a contract of about 1 million for next year.
Of this group, Id say Ime and Mahinmi are sure ins. Jacque's status will be depend if spurs can get a young back up for TP. Brent will be real iffy, but think he will make one more run.
10. Splitter...ill assume we will sign him this summer.
players not under contract next year.
11. Kurt tomas
12. Robert Horry
13. Michael finley
14. Damon Staudamire
15. Fabricio Oberto
OF these 5, its easy to say goodbye to Horry and Damon. Kurt tomas is a good player, but his last year he made 8 million. I just dont know if he is worth it.
Finley nay have a year left in him. I still havent heard him say the word retire.I wonder what he would cost. I think we absolutly have to have Oberto signed. He has the IQ and expereince to help bring along our new bigs.
I think we need to do what the spurs have always done, which is to bring in veterans. Older vetrans are only usefull for 2-3 years and i think we have gotton all we can out of Finley, Barry, Horry, Jacque. We need to get some veterans who are 28-30 years old who know there role. This is how pop has done it for a long time. Its just this time around we have kept veterans a little longer then normal. Anyone else forget the few years we got out of kerse and willis amoung many others? I see us going out and doing it again with other veterans.
Last edited by YODA; 05-18-2008 at 05:02 PM.
we would be stupid to get rid of bruce bowen
I thought Oberto signed a 3 year deal at the beginning of last year giving him 2 more years under contract?
Well, with the BOS/CLE series in the books, I have to say that there is one silver lining that comes from Boston's win. The likelihood of TWO teams that trailed 0-2 coming back to win Game 7s on the road in the same round would have been a phenomenal feat in professional sports. The Spurs should take a good look at how the Celtics played and anticipate that level from the Hornets. If West isn't 100%, look for Chris Paul to have a lights out game like Pierce did today.
Fortunately for the Spurs, I think that if faced with the same situation as Cleveland was (down by one in the final minutes), that they would fare better. Just look at Game 1 of the Phoenix series this year. The only problem is that this game is on the road. The Spurs need that kind of intensity down the stretch to win this game. If they don't, Duncan will be fishing off of a pier in the Virgin Islands next weekend.
Affirmative.
I don't care about what the media can say about Spurs. I don't care if Spurs are called or not a dynasty. What is important to me are the great moments I had watching Spurs basketball.
An NBA offseason is very long, we will have a lot of time to speak of what Spurs should do this summer to retool the team. I rather wait the end of the season to speak about what should be Spurs' plan than speculate now.
Everything is at stake for Game 7. If they ing lose I'll commit suicide.
This is not the time for this.
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