Game Blog: Lakers @ Spurs, March 12, 2009

[TheManFromAcme]

Same to you. See you all in the WCF. Let's both stay healthy, so no excuses, win or lose. :toast


:toast

BTW, I think you guys got something there with Gooden. Time will tell.

[lefty]

LOL!!!

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n230/gallenb123/NBA/Spurs-Suck.jpg

From the 2008 NBA Finals

http://bighugelabs.com/flickr/userdata/37/3769/37697b/37697b261be0d4f56d851a5fdb54250b/saved/motivator5262024.jpg

[NBAdime]

Tonight tho I did learn one thing ....I bow down to the man that is Tony Parker :clap

[Quiet Strength]

We're about 7 games back from LA.

Even with the win, we would be about 6 games back.

The chance of us overtaking the Lakers was almost zero.

They were going to have HCA anyways.

Yup I agree.. I wanted the spurs to win tonight so they could stay ahead of those other teams that are close... never thought the spurs were going to catch the lakers

[boutons_]

The Spurs lost every stat category. Outhustled, outshot, out rebounded, out stolen, and shot for shit from FT line.

This is a VERY EXPENSIVE loss.

Lakers have HCA throughout the playoffs.

[lefty]

Tonight tho I did learn one thing ....I bow down to the man that is Tony Parker :clap

Half - man actually

[TampaDude]

The Spurs lost every stat category. Outhustled, outshot, out rebounded, out stolen, and shot for shit from FT line.

This is a VERY EXPENSIVE loss.

Lakers have HCA throughout the playoffs.

A win is a win and a loss is a loss, dude...they all count the same in the regular season. :lol

[Mavs<Spurs]

I would gladly trade away my $1300 in coin that I just won for a Spurs win.


And I hate that Pop did such a poor job coaching.


But with Manu back into the lineup and with Gooden fully assimilated into our team and playing major minutes, I think that we can beat the Lakers even though the Lakers will have hca.

It wasn't a statement game because of the difference maker that Manu is and how much Gooden will help us.

So, I don't read too much into it.

[crc21209]

Their was no way the Spurs were ever going to catch the Lakers for the 1 seed. They can have it for all I care. This Spurs team healthy and ready can take out any team in the league, and that's all that matters. Fuck seeds. I just want this team healthy.

[crc21209]

The thing I LOVE about Gooden is that the short amount of time he was out there, he was GOING for Rebounds, hustling for them, bringing them down aggressively. His energy and hustle are going to pay off big time for this team.

[alchemist]

Anyone think Pop didn't insert Gooden back into the game so the Lakers couldn't get a feel for him?

[lefty]

Anyone think Pop didn't insert Gooden back into the game so the Lakers couldn't get a feel for him?

I'll keep posting it: Pop went CIA hardcore

[DrHouse]

I've said this many times before but it bears repeating.

To beat this Laker team you have to find a way to stop their points in the paint. The Lakers again outscored the Spurs in the paint and in 2nd chance points. You simply can't expect the outcome in the playoffs to be any different if that doesn't change.

[Ice009]

This coming from YOU???? :wow

I've never given up. I get real shitty during the regular season, but that doesn't mean I'm even close to giving up on the big picture.

[Mavs<Spurs]

Half - man actually

and now half amazing?

Tony Parker has become a hell of a player !

This is not the same Tony Parker that the Lakers were able to stymie.

:toast to Tony Parker !

[lefty]

and now half amazing?

Tony Parker has become a hell of a player !

This is not the same Tony Parker that the Lakers were able to stymie.

:toast to Tony Parker !

I didn't mean half amazing

I meant half man, because he sucked major donkey ass in the 1st half

[Yorae]

We did outscore them for 3 qtrs but 1st qtr lead was just too much.

[Don Quixote]

Do you really think Manu and Drew are going to make that much of a difference in the playoffs? Sure ... it's possible, but not likely. And certainly, to suggest that they absolutely WILL get us over the hump is absurd. That's just grasping at that point.

I've thought all year that the Spurs should be able to handle any comers in the WC playoffs ... UNTIL they have to play the Lakers. Then it will a totally different story. It will be a repeat of tonight and last year's playoffs.

Are there any reasons to expect any different of a result from last year's 4-1 faceplant? Any rational reasons, that is?

[Ice009]

I would gladly trade away my $1300 in coin that I just won for a Spurs win.


And I hate that Pop did such a poor job coaching.


But with Manu back into the lineup and with Gooden fully assimilated into our team and playing major minutes, I think that we can beat the Lakers even though the Lakers will have hca.

It wasn't a statement game because of the difference maker that Manu is and how much Gooden will help us.

So, I don't read too much into it.

The main reason we can beat the Lakers with out home court advantage is a guy called Manu Ginobili.

[Don Quixote]

Anyone think Pop didn't insert Gooden back into the game so the Lakers couldn't get a feel for him?


Yeah, I'm so sure Drew Gooden is the missing ingredient to our title aspirations. He keeps Kobe & co. up at night, wondering how they're going to defend him. :lol

[Ice009]

Do you really think Manu and Drew are going to make that much of a difference in the playoffs? Sure ... it's possible, but not likely. And certainly, to suggest that they absolutely WILL get us over the hump is absurd. That's just grasping at that point.

I've thought all year that the Spurs should be able to handle any comers in the WC playoffs ... UNTIL they have to play the Lakers. Then it will a totally different story. It will be a repeat of tonight and last year's playoffs.

Are there any reasons to expect any different of a result from last year's 4-1 faceplant? Any rational reasons, that is?

No one is saying that they will guarantee us a win, well they shouldn't be saying that, but they will definitely give us a real shot to win it.

[lefty]

Do you really think Manu and Drew are going to make that much of a difference in the playoffs? Sure ... it's possible, but not likely. And certainly, to suggest that they absolutely WILL get us over the hump is absurd. That's just grasping at that point.

I've thought all year that the Spurs should be able to handle any comers in the WC playoffs ... UNTIL they have to play the Lakers. Then it will a totally different story. It will be a repeat of tonight and last year's playoffs.

Are there any reasons to expect any different of a result from last year's 4-1 faceplant? Any rational reasons, that is?

- Pop not going CIA in the playoffs
- We are much better this year with the additions of CLUTCH Mason and Hill, who's an upgrade over JV
- a rested Bowen playing more minutes = good D and corner 3's
- No Hill on Kobe
- Gooden playing more
- Bonner playing less
- Manu playing...duh!

- AND if we are 100% healthy

[bdictjames]

We need a Gasol and Odom stopper. Forget about Kobe.

[Don Quixote]

I've said this many times before but it bears repeating.

To beat this Laker team you have to find a way to stop their points in the paint. The Lakers again outscored the Spurs in the paint and in 2nd chance points. You simply can't expect the outcome in the playoffs to be any different if that doesn't change.

Agree totally. The Lakers are a much, much better team. And if you want to beat a squad that much better, you gotta bring your A-game. This includes interior D and 2d-chances.

No reason to expect any different of an outcome than last year.

That said ... I'm still looking forward to the playoffs. It'll be a good month before we have to play the Lakers in the WCF. The fun will end then, but May will be good at least.

[NBAdime]

Considering Kobe's best friend in LA is the video-coordinator...I doubt he is wondering how Gooden plays.

[ThaiFanofSpurs]

No more Bonner. I think that could be a good idea starting Thomas and using Gooden more off the bench.

Bonner might be helpful against other teams, but I think he is pretty much bordering on useless against the Lakers. I really don't think he needs any minutes against the Lakers.

Agreed!

Not happy with the loss but not worried to play them in the playoffs.

[lefty]

agreed!

Not happy with the loss but not worried to play them in the playoffs.

+1

Man, I can't wait to see a healthy Manu and Gooden shoking the Lakers in the playoffs

[TampaDude]

Spurs with Manu > Lakers with Bynum

See you all in the WCF! GO SPURS GO!!!!! :flag:

[Don Quixote]

- Pop not going CIA
- We are much better this year with the additions of CLUTCH Mason and Hill, who's an upgrade over JV
- a rested Bowen playing more minutes = good D and corner 3's
- No Hill on Kobe
- Gooden playing more
- Bonner playing more
- Manu playing...duh!

- AND if we are 100% healthy


I appreciate your endless optimism. I certainly hope these things come to pass.

Are they possible? Sure. Are they all likely to have any bearing on the final result? No. I agree that Mason was a nice pickup, and his basket in Dec. gave us that one lucky win, but it's not like we haven't had good shooters against these guys in the past. Is he an upgrade? Sure. But a difference-maker? Not at all.

Bowen will make Kobe work ... but Kobe will still get his and prevail in the end. And it's not like Bruce can guard all the Lakers.

And I'm sure you don't mean to say that Gooden or Bonner scare the Lakers one bit. I like the Gooden pickup, but he's not what would make the difference.

A healthy Manu ... maybe. But how likely is that, given his track record? And, the one time he owned the Lakers in the playoffs, that was with a much inferior Laker team. These Lakers ... are no joke.

And I don't buy the CIA Pop stuff. At least not tonight.

[JohnnySixString]

I've never given up. I get real shitty during the regular season, but that doesn't mean I'm even close to giving up on the big picture.

LMFAO.
mmmmmmmmmm....justification. Feels good, doesn't it? :rollin

[Avitus1]

spurs with manu > lakers with bynum

see you all in the wcf! Go spurs go!!!!! :flag:

+1

[alchemist]

Yeah, I'm so sure Drew Gooden is the missing ingredient to our title aspirations. He keeps Kobe & co. up at night, wondering how they're going to defend him. :lol
he works around the Post where the Spurs struggle to get anything against the Lakers, he won't be a solve-it-all piece but he'll be something extra the Spurs can throw out there.

[Ice009]

- Pop not going CIA in the playoffs
- We are much better this year with the additions of CLUTCH Mason and Hill, who's an upgrade over JV
- a rested Bowen playing more minutes = good D and corner 3's
- No Hill on Kobe
- Gooden playing more
- Bonner playing more
- Manu playing...duh!

- AND if we are 100% healthy

You want to play Bonner more against the Lakers?

[lefty]

I appreciate your endless optimism. I certainly hope these things come to pass.

Are they possible? Sure. Are they all likely to have any bearing on the final result? No. I agree that Mason was a nice pickup, and his basket in Dec. gave us that one lucky win, but it's not like we haven't had good shooters against these guys in the past. Is he an upgrade? Sure. But a difference-maker? Not at all.

Bowen will make Kobe work ... but Kobe will still get his and prevail in the end. And it's not like Bruce can guard all the Lakers.

And I'm sure you don't mean to say that Gooden or Bonner scare the Lakers one bit. I like the Gooden pickup, but he's not what would make the difference.

A healthy Manu ... maybe. But how likely is that, given his track record? And, the one time he owned the Lakers in the playoffs, that was with a much inferior Laker team. These Lakers ... are no joke.

And I don't buy the CIA Pop stuff. At least not tonight.

Do you seriously think Pop would have put Hill on Kobe in the postseason vs LA?

Or would have kept Bonner and Ime that long on the court, and Bowen that much on the bench?

And he'll give more minutes to Gooden too

[lefty]

You want to play Bonner more against the Lakers?

Opoooops I meant playing less

[NRHector]

Yeah, I'm so sure Drew Gooden is the missing ingredient to our title aspirations. He keeps Kobe & co. up at night, wondering how they're going to defend him. :loli'm sorry you are seeing the whole picture here

[Don Quixote]

No one is saying that they will guarantee us a win, well they shouldn't be saying that, but they will definitely give us a real shot to win it.


I think adding Gooden and having Manu back will give us a better chance of beating L.A. in the playoffs, sure.


But the odds were'nt very high to begin with. Without that duo, we were looking at getting swept or going down 4-1.

With them, 4-2 ... if the Spurs play their best.

[Ice009]

LMFAO.
mmmmmmmmmm....justification. Feels good, doesn't it? :rollin

What are you on about? Like I said to Ruff. Don't take anything I say too serious during a game thread, especially in the regular season.

I think we can win it. If you don't go laugh somewhere else.

[Ice009]

Opoooops I meant playing less

Good stuff man. I now agree with pretty much everything you said. You really had me going there by saying Bonner playing more ;).

[crc21209]

Do you seriously think Pop would have put Hill on Kobe in the postseason vs LA?

Or would have kept Bonner and Ime that long on the court, and Bowen that much on the bench?

And he'll give more minutes to Gooden too


:toast. Pop will not use Ime and Bonner so much in the Playoffs playing like that.

Fin, Mason, Manu > Udoka (odd man out)

TD, Thomas, Gooden > Bonner & Fab (odd men out, unless really needed)

[JohnnySixString]

Don't take anything I say too serious during a game thread, especially in the regular season.



:lmao

[Ice009]

I think adding Gooden and having Manu back will give us a better chance of beating L.A. in the playoffs, sure.


But the odds were'nt very high to begin with. Without that duo, we were looking at getting swept or going down 4-1.

With them, 4-2 ... if the Spurs play their best.

If healthy and in form i disagree. We'll have a real shot to win.

[Ice009]

:lmao

During a game thread, not after the game is over dipshit. When the game is over you stfu and listen :).

[ThaiFanofSpurs]

Tony Parker showed that he has matured in tonight's game. This was a game where he had a bad first half and turned it all around in the same game when it mattered most. Tony did what he has been doing a lot lately. That is some real mental toughness from TP. Games like this from TP show that his mental toughness is getting up there with Manu. Great to have another player with a steel will. Props to TP for laying it out there.

I agree with you again. TP has always been a great player with a little question in his mental toughness (especially when he plays the Lakers.) Tonight's game has shown that he can be that player who can break out from bad situation. He and Manu together will be great for us in the Playoffs.

[Don Quixote]

Do you seriously think Pop would have put Hill on Kobe in the postseason vs LA?

Or would have kept Bonner and Ime that long on the court, and Bowen that much on the bench?

And he'll give more minutes to Gooden too


(1) No. He wanted to see what the kid could do. But that's no exactly covert ops. Smart coaches do that. Kobe knows what Bruce does and vice versa. It'll be a fun matchup, and I agree that Bruce is still one of the best at what he does, but there's no way Kobe loses it. Kobe may have to work for it, but he'll still get his, and there's still Gasol, Odom, Fisher to worry about too.

(2) In general I agree that Pop will shorten his bench come playoff time. But how is this year's group any better than the one that got spanked last year? Even with Gooden.

Overall ... I'm tired of the excuses. Well, if we'd had a better 1st Q, or if we'd had fewer turnovers, or made FTs, or hadn't played Ime so much, blablabla. That's what losers and Sons fans say (same thing, but whatever). The point is, we lost again to them, just like last year's playoffs, and it is very likely to happen that same way again this year. And Manu and Gooden won't make a darn bit of difference.

[JohnnySixString]

During a game thread, not after the game is over dipshit. When the game is over you stfu and listen :).

LMAO...that's right...assert your power! The internet is strong with this one!:rolleyes

Now go make me some more of that lemonade bitch!:hat

[Ice009]

I agree with you again. TP has always been a great player with a little question in his mental toughness (especially when he plays the Lakers.) Tonight's game has shown that he can be that player who can break out from bad situation. He and Manu together will be great for us in the Playoffs.

Two players with steel will that will not give up is better than one.

TP played with heart tonight.

[Mavs<Spurs]

I appreciate your endless optimism. I certainly hope these things come to pass.

Are they possible? Sure. Are they all likely to have any bearing on the final result? No. I agree that Mason was a nice pickup, and his basket in Dec. gave us that one lucky win, but it's not like we haven't had good shooters against these guys in the past. Is he an upgrade? Sure. But a difference-maker? Not at all.

Bowen will make Kobe work ... but Kobe will still get his and prevail in the end. And it's not like Bruce can guard all the Lakers.

And I'm sure you don't mean to say that Gooden or Bonner scare the Lakers one bit. I like the Gooden pickup, but he's not what would make the difference.

A healthy Manu ... maybe. But how likely is that, given his track record? And, the one time he owned the Lakers in the playoffs, that was with a much inferior Laker team. These Lakers ... are no joke.

And I don't buy the CIA Pop stuff. At least not tonight.


I understand that you are pessimistic about the Spurs chances, but I think that you are underselling Mason and Gooden and making an assumption that Ginobili can't or won't recover.


Mason is a double digit scorer for us and can score more. He also made the team younger.

We don't need a lot to be even with the Lakers. We needed a legitimate second big who can help us rebounding and keep defenses honest. Gooden is that person. And he can definitely fill that role. This game was a perfect illustration of the difference between Bonner as a rebounder and Gooden. And rebounding and second chance points were a major factor in the loss.

We played without our third best player on the team. Now, any team that has lost a player of Ginobili's ability will be significantly weaker. But I'm not going to assume that Ginobili can't come back healthy. The Spurs don't seem to believe that.

So, as most of the posters here have said, with a healthy Manu Ginobili and an assimilated Gooden who plays major minutes, this team can beat the Lakers.

I see what I view as a mistake in your premise: the Lakers are far better than us and we need some huge change and another superstar to beat them. I don't see that as true. WE just needed the improvements that come from Gooden playing more minutes (and knowing the system) and Ginobili healthy. That and Mason and Hill. And that makes us completely capable of beating them and not, in my view, major underdogs. We might be slight underdogs, but no more than slight and I would say that we have an equal shot at winning the series against them.

:flag:

[Don Quixote]

Gooden works around the Post where the Spurs struggle to get anything against the Lakers, he won't be a solve-it-all piece but he'll be something extra the Spurs can throw out there.

That's all fine. I like Gooden, thought it was a fine pickup. But to say he's that much better than the bigs we already have is stretching it. Gasol, Odom, and Bynum (when they get his leg reattached) will own him like they own Thomas, Oberto, and Bonner.

[Ice009]

LMAO...that's right...assert your power! The internet is strong with this one!:rolleyes

Now go make me some more of that lemonade bitch!:hat

Have you actually got anything good to say? I'd like to hear something about the game from you other that soft takes.

[lefty]

(1) No. He wanted to see what the kid could do. But that's no exactly covert ops. Smart coaches do that. Kobe knows what Bruce does and vice versa. It'll be a fun matchup, and I agree that Bruce is still one of the best at what he does, but there's no way Kobe loses it. Kobe may have to work for it, but he'll still get his, and there's still Gasol, Odom, Fisher to worry about too.

(2) In general I agree that Pop will shorten his bench come playoff time. But how is this year's group any better than the one that got spanked last year? Even with Gooden.

Overall ... I'm tired of the excuses. Well, if we'd had a better 1st Q, or if we'd had fewer turnovers, or made FTs, or hadn't played Ime so much, blablabla. That's what losers and Sons fans say (same thing, but whatever). The point is, we lost again to them, just like last year's playoffs, and it is very likely to happen that same way again this year. And Manu and Gooden won't make a darn bit of difference.

(1) I'm not sggesting that Bruce can stop Kobe; but making him work harder, so he can misses a few jump shots is a good thing


With Manu and Gooden, it will make a difference; we played like shit tonight, but almost made a come back; so imagine at full strength and Pop really coaching

[Ice009]

That's all fine. I like Gooden, thought it was a fine pickup. But to say he's that much better than the bigs we already have is stretching it. Gasol, Odom, and Bynum (when they get his leg reattached) will own him like they own Thomas, Oberto, and Bonner.

If you come with the attitude that you are, which is giving up before the game even starts you've got no chance. Let's just lay it out there and give it a shot huh?

Anyone on this board want to spin it up in the other direction rather than giving up straight away?

[crc21209]

(1) No. He wanted to see what the kid could do. But that's no exactly covert ops. Smart coaches do that. Kobe knows what Bruce does and vice versa. It'll be a fun matchup, and I agree that Bruce is still one of the best at what he does, but there's no way Kobe loses it. Kobe may have to work for it, but he'll still get his, and there's still Gasol, Odom, Fisher to worry about too.

(2) In general I agree that Pop will shorten his bench come playoff time. But how is this year's group any better than the one that got spanked last year? Even with Gooden.

Overall ... I'm tired of the excuses. Well, if we'd had a better 1st Q, or if we'd had fewer turnovers, or made FTs, or hadn't played Ime so much, blablabla. That's what losers and Sons fans say (same thing, but whatever). The point is, we lost again to them, just like last year's playoffs, and it is very likely to happen that same way again this year. And Manu and Gooden won't make a darn bit of difference.

(2). This team is waaaay better than last yrs. team that went down in the WCF's. Hill, Mason, Bonner, Gooden from this year's team > Vaughn, Udoka, and Horry's corpse from last years.

[JohnnySixString]

Have you actually got anything good to say? I'd like to hear something about the game from you other that soft takes.:lol

Obviously I don't get as worked up as you. Get your panties out of a knot already.:downspin:

And for the record, since you acknowledge you talk out of your ass during the game, why in the fuck should anyone listen to your fairweather ass after the game? :lmao

[Don Quixote]

I understand that you are pessimistic about the Spurs chances, but I think that you are underselling Mason and Gooden and making an assumption that Ginobili can't or won't recover.


Mason is a double digit scorer for us and can score more. He also made the team younger.

We don't need a lot to be even with the Lakers. We needed a legitimate second big who can help us rebounding and keep defenses honest. Gooden is that person. And he can definitely fill that role. This game was a perfect illustration of the difference between Bonner as a rebounder and Gooden. And rebounding and second chance points were a major factor in the loss.

We played without our third best player on the team. Now, any team that has lost a player of Ginobili's ability will be significantly weaker. But I'm not going to assume that Ginobili can't come back healthy. The Spurs don't seem to believe that.

So, as most of the posters here have said, with a healthy Manu Ginobili and an assimilated Gooden who plays major minutes, this team can beat the Lakers.

I see what I view as a mistake in your premise: the Lakers are far better than us and we need some huge change and another superstar to beat them. I don't see that as true. WE just needed the improvements that come from Gooden playing more minutes (and knowing the system) and Ginobili healthy. That and Mason and Hill. And that makes us completely capable of beating them and not, in my view, major underdogs. We might be slight underdogs, but no more than slight and I would say that we have an equal shot at winning the series against them.

:flag:


Another optimist! I hope you folks are right!

I agree that Mason was a great pickup and I love him starting for us. We'll see how he does come playoff time. He wouldn't be the first Spurs shooter to start laying bricks against the Lakers in the playoffs.

Gooden -- a journeyman. Certainly capable of doing most of the things the Spurs want from their bigs. But to say that he'll be the difference maker, I'm skeptical. The Lakers are far better. They lost their 3d best player (Bynum) and they'll still cruise to the Finals. We lost ours and we will flounder in the WCF. (As good a measure as any.)

They might beat the Lakers once or twice. But not 4 out of 7.

[Ice009]

:lol

Obviously I don't get as worked up as you. Get your panties out of a knot already.:downspin:

And for the record, since you acknowledge you talk out of your ass during the game, why in the fuck should anyone listen to your fairweather ass after the game? :lmao

You just answered the question. I'm not worked up after the game like I am during the game. Also, I like almost everyone on this board. Don't now about T-Park though ;). In the game thread I don't mean to be like that it just happens. I'm not trying to make anything personal with anyone on here.

[lefty]

Those things healthy Manu can do the Lakers

http://i13.tinypic.com/85naety.gif


http://i16.tinypic.com/81ev5v5.gif

[JohnnySixString]

You just answered the question. I'm not worked up after the game like I am during the game.

You must have 3 inches of fur on the end of your shoe from all the puppies you've kicked during the games then.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y273/Akio666/467px-CobraCommander-150.jpg

[Mavs<Spurs]

(1) No. He wanted to see what the kid could do. But that's no exactly covert ops. Smart coaches do that. Kobe knows what Bruce does and vice versa. It'll be a fun matchup, and I agree that Bruce is still one of the best at what he does, but there's no way Kobe loses it. Kobe may have to work for it, but he'll still get his, and there's still Gasol, Odom, Fisher to worry about too.

(2) In general I agree that Pop will shorten his bench come playoff time. But how is this year's group any better than the one that got spanked last year? Even with Gooden.

Overall ... I'm tired of the excuses. Well, if we'd had a better 1st Q, or if we'd had fewer turnovers, or made FTs, or hadn't played Ime so much, blablabla. That's what losers and Sons fans say (same thing, but whatever). The point is, we lost again to them, just like last year's playoffs, and it is very likely to happen that same way again this year. And Manu and Gooden won't make a darn bit of difference.


So the syllogism runs as follows:

1. Lakers beat the Spurs last year in the playoffs when we didn't have Gooden or Mason or Hill and beat the Spurs in a regular season game tonight when Gooden played his first minutes for the Spurs ever and played less than four minutes and Manu didn't play at all.

2. ???? The question means I'm not certain what other axiom you would place here. It appears to be: what happened in the past will certainly happen again. Or something similar.

3. Therefore, when the Spurs have assimilated Gooden and play him major minutes and when Manu returns, the Spurs will have no shot at beating the Lakers in the playoffs this year.



Now, that's an interesting syllogism.

Axiom 2 seems very shaky to me. I would need a proof of 2. And no hand waving proof either. You can try to prove it by induction, by contradiction, using an indirect or even a direct argument.

And as the circumstances are undeniably different now then they were last year, even 2 doesn't actually hold up. Mason was not on the team last year. Neither was Gooden. Ginobili might / is expected to be healthy when he returns.

So, please prove axiom 2.

Otherwise, I must say that you have not proved your theorem.

I mean a rigorous proof (ie like we use in math).

:nope

[Don Quixote]

(2). This team is waaaay better than last yrs. team that went down in the WCF's. Hill, Mason, Bonner, Gooden from this year's team > Vaughn, Udoka, and Horry's corpse from last years.

You are correct there. It's still not even close in quality to L.A.'s bench, but that might make the final score a bit more respectable at least.

What matters is the final score. And this Laker team has beaten the Spurs consistently, time and again, for the past year and a half. And there's no great reason to expect things to be different this time. You say the Spurs will play better, coach better, tighten it up. Well, so will the Lakers. And they don't even need to have their A-game to win it, like we do.

Don't get me started on my Sisyphus analogy, or asking which Spur starters would crack the Laker rotation (answer:2).

[Horse]

Do you really think Manu and Drew are going to make that much of a difference in the playoffs? Sure ... it's possible, but not likely. And certainly, to suggest that they absolutely WILL get us over the hump is absurd. That's just grasping at that point.

I've thought all year that the Spurs should be able to handle any comers in the WC playoffs ... UNTIL they have to play the Lakers. Then it will a totally different story. It will be a repeat of tonight and last year's playoffs.

Are there any reasons to expect any different of a result from last year's 4-1 faceplant? Any rational reasons, that is?
Real simple Manu, And I truely believe we win last season if he's healthy. Also Gooden he really will help another big body and he rebounds, scrotum and gaysol can't just focus on Tim with Gooden in there, He can score.

[Don Quixote]

So the syllogism runs as follows:

1. Lakers beat the Spurs last year in the playoffs when we didn't have Gooden or Mason or Hill and beat the Spurs in a regular season game tonight when Gooden played his first minutes for the Spurs ever and played less than four minutes and Manu didn't play at all.

2. ???? The question means I'm not certain what other axiom you would place here. It appears to be: what happened in the past will certainly happen again. Or something similar.

3. Therefore, when the Spurs have assimilated Gooden and play him major minutes and when Manu returns, the Spurs will have no shot at beating the Lakers in the playoffs this year.



Now, that's an interesting syllogism.

Axiom 2 seems very shaky to me. I would need a proof of 2. And no hand waving proof either. You can try to prove it by induction, by contradiction, using an indirect or even a direct argument.

And as the circumstances are undeniably different now then they were last year, even 2 doesn't actually hold up. Mason was not on the team last year. Neither was Gooden. Ginobili might / is expected to be healthy when he returns.

So, please prove axiom 2.

Otherwise, I must say that you have not proved your theorem.

I mean a rigorous proof (ie like we use in math).

:nope


I love syllogisms. I have heard that one of the pimary tasks of philosophy is to analyze propositonal statements. I do make propositions, but no syllogism was intended, my friend. At least not up to now. I am actually agreeing that the mythical healthy Manu and Drew will improve the Spurs' odds slightly. My proposition is that any adjustments we make between now and June won't amount to much against L.A., although they might make life against New Orleans or Utah easier.

If I may offer one, though ...
(1) Better teams beat inferior teams the majority of the time.
(2) The Lakers consistently beat the Spurs. Not always, but usually.
(3) Therefore, we have no prima facie reason to expect any different of a result this June.

[Mavs<Spurs]

Speaking of 2, I'm still waiting on a proof of axiom 2.

But I just hear crickets (analogous to not reading an answer to my comment).

[Don Quixote]

Well, I've said all I needed to. And I didn't have to go into my Lakers-are-better-at-every-position rant. Let's see if I'm wrong come June. But I don't think so. I'd be willing to lay some real American dollars on it too, if gambling were legal, Godly, or moral.

[Mavs<Spurs]

I love syllogisms. I have heard that one of the pimary tasks of philosophy is to analyze propositonal statements. I do make propositions, but no syllogism was intended, my friend. At least not up to now. I am actually agreeing that the mythical healthy Manu and Drew will improve the Spurs' odds slightly. My proposition is that any adjustments we make between now and June won't amount to much against L.A., although they might make life against New Orleans or Utah easier.

If I may offer one, though ...
(1) Better teams beat inferior teams the majority of the time.
(2) The Lakers consistently beat the Spurs. Not always, but usually.
(3) Therefore, we have no prima facie reason to expect any different of a result this June.



You must define your terms more carefully (ie Lakers and Spurs). You are aware that the Celtics of Russell which won quite a bit (11 of 13) don't play today, right?

You also must prove that these Lakers are better than these Spurs in Late May and you make the assumption that the changes in interim won't matter much.

You can't assume what you wish to prove. That is called circular reasoning.

My use of syllogisms is in mathematics, not philosophy. Almost all we do are prove mathematical theorems. That's pretty much it.

An assertion isn't a proof.

:nope

[milkyway21]

18-pt deficit in the 1Qtr down to just 2 in the 4th.... :tu

[Don Quixote]

Speaking of 2, I'm still waiting on a proof of axiom 2.

But I just hear crickets (analogous to not reading an answer to my comment).

[Gets out a can of Raid]

No, I get your objection. And I read it. I had not offered a rigorous argument up to that point, but I get what you are saying. Premise 2 is generally reasonable, although I affirm it with far less certainty than you ascribe to me. I am not saying that things in the future are CERTAIN to be like they are in the past (in this very limited discussion, the playoffs, that is). I am saying that this year's playoffs are highly likely to turn out the same.

On the other hand, could we have developed science without at least taking (2) for granted? Anyway ...

[Ice009]

You must have 3 inches of fur on the end of your shoe from all the puppies you've kicked during the games then.

I'll try and lay off a bit.

[Mavs<Spurs]

[Gets out a can of Raid]

No, I get your objection. And I read it. I had not offered a rigorous argument up to that point, but I get what you are saying. Premise 2 is generally reasonable, although I affirm it with far less certainty than you ascribe to me. I am not saying that things in the future are CERTAIN to be like they are in the past (in this very limited discussion, the playoffs, that is). I am saying that this year's playoffs are highly likely to turn out the same.

On the other hand, could we have developed science without at least taking (2) for granted? Anyway ...

Okay, fine. My only point is that while your view has merit and has some arguments for it, it is not certain and others (like me) do have some meritorious arguments for our belief as well.

But, we can move on.

Both of us want the Spurs to win.

:toast

[Don Quixote]

You also must prove that these Lakers are better than these Spurs in Late May and you make the assumption that the changes in interim won't matter much.

You can't assume what you wish to prove. That is called circular reasoning.

My use of syllogisms is in mathematics, not philosophy. Almost all we do are prove mathematical theorems. That's pretty much it.

An assertion isn't a proof.

:nope

You don't like my very inductive, a posteriori reasoning. Very well then. I don't claim to have an a priori basis for my belief. My conclusion is based on my observation of the evidence: better teams beat lesser ones, the Lakers pretty consistently beat the Spurs, and I don't see any major reasons to believe that the Spurs will get that much better in 2mo to mount a serious challenge to L.A.

I also see how (2) looks like (3) and could be seen as question-begging. perhaps it is. But (2) is past tense and (3) is future.

Lastly, you don't want to suggest that maths and philosophy are all that separate. Aristotle, Newton, and Descartes would hit you in the face with a hammer!

[ThaiFanofSpurs]

I am not happy with the loss... but there are some positive things from this game that make me believe more and have more faith in my team.

1. Our additions of Hill, Mason, and Gooden will give us more oftions for game plans in the playoffs. That will give us more rest for Tim, Tony and Manu throughout the playoffs.
2. Manu should come back 100% or at least almost 100% healthy. I am sure Manu is still Manu who can make the different outcome when he is healthy. And he is the energy and spirit of the team.
3. I am convinced that since the playoffs in 2003-4 when Tony lost to the Lakers, he was intimidated by the Lakers. Now he has broken that funk and I believe that he will bring his best to play the Lakers from now on. Like Ice009 and lefty said, Tony and Manu together, we should be great when we play them again.
4. Timmy always plays better in the playoffs. Hopefully, today's game was just another game that he didn't place much importance upon. In the playoffs, we need to see that leadership in him again.
5. Pop should have a lot of things to think about after this game (his experiment.)
6. I am sure that the Spurs can beat any team in the playoffs including the Lakers. The Spurs as a team can play well on the road in the playoffs. I know the HCA will be good but if we want to win it all we have to beat any team anywhere we play. Hopefully, the Lakers will make it to the WCF and that we will play them again.

Go Spurs Go!

[Cry_For_Me_Sky]

I'm new on here BTW, FROM SA 210!! IMO, lakers beat an injured Spurs. That was NOT Spurs basketball at all! When Spurs have their full line up and healthy, they dominate. They are unpredictable. By the way, Gooden did a pretty good job for playing such a short time. So i'm looking foward to seeing him on the court more.. Anyway.. this win doesn't matter right now.. We'll see when it comes to playoff time..

[The_Game]

I'm new on here BTW, FROM SA 210!! IMO, lakers beat an injured Spurs. That was NOT Spurs basketball at all! When Spurs have their full line up and healthy, they dominate. They are unpredictable. By the way, Gooden did a pretty good job for playing such a short time. So i'm looking foward to seeing him on the court more.. Anyway.. this win doesn't matter right now.. We'll see when it comes to playoff time..

don't act like lakers were healthly either

[The_Game]

lets hope so....won't be much of a series if they aren't.

[Cry_For_Me_Sky]

don't act like lakers were healthly either


i know they are not healthy either.. but i'm just hoping Manu and Bynum get better, so that way we can have a good game if they meet again this season.. but that was not Spurs basketball at all tonight.. yes they hit them 3 pointers.. but where was the rest? i just hope everyone is healthy come playoff time..

[NewJerSpur]

The next time we see L.A. is in the playoffs. This was the final meeting between these two teams this season.

[BeeGee]

No Manu

Pop was experimenting

You are gonna be so disappointed this summer :rollin


:violin Another Spurs fan-turned master violinist following a loss to the Lakers. :loser

====================================
No Bynum

The Lakers weren't making excuses

You are gonna be suicidal this summer...

[Cry_For_Me_Sky]

:violin Another Spurs fan-turned master violinist following a loss to the Lakers. :loser

====================================
No Bynum

The Lakers weren't making excuses

You are gonna be suicidal this summer...



Another Spurs fan,.. Your another Lakers fan.. let fans be fans!

[Fabbs]

We were making a good comeback in the mid to late 2nd qtr when Kurt T got a nice offensive rebound and putback vs Gasoft.

Tweet the refs intervened and rang up KT for the offensive foul.
Doug Collins as usual was performing oral on Kobme and TNT did not replay, something they annoyingly did on many momentum calls favoring the Lakers.

Anyone see, record this play? KT really do an offensive foul? He seemed genuinely upset with the call. Me thinks it was bogus.

[RedsLakers24]

No Bynum, Lakers were on a back to back after Kobe playing over 40 min the night before and Gasol as well, and still winning the game, I LOVE MY LAKERS

[lefty]

:violin Another Spurs fan-turned master violinist following a loss to the Lakers. :loser

====================================
No Bynum

The Lakers weren't making excuses

You are gonna be suicidal this summer...

Comaring Bynum to Manu ? :lmao:rollin

Another Lakers fan turned dumbass :donkey

[Horse]

Jesus once and for all please stop sucking bynums little dick. The lakers without bynum is like us without Kurt, What has the kid really done? Like I said I'd much rather have bynum start than odom.