Meltdown.

[hater]

Your point? Are you saying this isn't to be expected?

are you saying this was expected? link?

[Wild Cobra]

are you saying this was expected? link?
Why should I have to provide a link with someones theory that higher levels of radioactivity are uncommon after a disaster at a nuclear plant?

What matters, is what type of radiation are we reading with these higher numbers, and what is it's half-life. If it's just radioactive steam that condensed, then it will dissipate rather fast. If it's nuclear material, then it can take millions of years or longer. Numbers without context are meaningless. As for the pools outside, there were also the spend fuel ponds that probable spilled over. Again, radioactive water will dissipate quickly, if that's what it is.

Again.... need more facts and context rather than just numbers that may be short lived.

[mouse]

Your point? Are you saying this isn't to be expected?


I think his point was they were way off on their original levels they thought the water contained. So if they are that off on radiation levels it means three things.

1: They need better equipment.

2: If they are off on their original findings or if they are lying now then how can we trust them if the situation gets worst, (Pm Manny?)

3: People like you need to be updated daily since it seems like you live in a Bubble.



http://www.topnews.in/health/files/Mobile-phone-radiation.jpg

[Winehole23]

Fearing the potential impact on crews, cargo and vessels worth tens of millions of dollars, some of the world’s biggest container shipping lines have restricted or barred their ships from calling on ports in Tokyo Bay over concerns about radiation from the damaged Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/26/business/global/26shipping.html?hp

[Agloco]

are you saying this was expected? link?

:lol

Link.....

Hater, it was expected.

[Agloco]

I think his point was they were way off on their original levels they thought the water contained. So if they are that off on radiation levels it means three things.

1: They need better equipment.

2: If they are off on their original findings or if they are lying now then how can we trust them if the situation gets worst, (Pm Manny?)

3: People like you need to be updated daily since it seems like you live in a Bubble.



http://www.topnews.in/health/files/Mobile-phone-radiation.jpg

Their equipment couldn't have been damaged? How about the circumstances under which the initial set of assumptions was arrived at?

[mouse]

The point I was making is...... someone is either lying, or they don't have the proper equipment if they can't seem to figure out what the accurate Radiation levels are.

If your cable bill says you owe 100 dollars then two days later they say you owe 20 dollars wouldn't you want to know who is in charge, and if they know what they are doing?

What many people fail to realize is Radiation in itself is faily new as far as what Scientist know about it. They have no idea what Radiation can do after a certain amount of years.

That is why The Atom Bomb dropped in Japan and Chernobyl scenarios keep coming up when people try to figure out what Radiation exposure really does to the human body.

Did we have Nuclear radiation in the 1800s? Who is to say that 10 years from now Babies born by radiation infected mothers back in 1986 will have a short lifespan? It's only been 25 or so years. People who keep saying radiation is your friend you get it from the sun, from cell phones, X-ray machines, those people are dangerous.


The commercials on Cancer research centers and other TV exposure makes people used to the disease to the point they don't question it anymore. Its normal conversation now.

People are so occupied with their 401k and whats on face book they can't even see their world going to shit.

[Cry Havoc]

The point I was making is...... someone is either lying, or they don't have the proper equipment if they can't seem to figure out what the accurate Radiation levels are.

Mouse, the armchair expert, who somehow knows more living 4000 miles away than people do on the scene but can't explain why.


If your cable bill says you owe 100 dollars then two days later they say you owe 20 dollars wouldn't you want to know who is in charge, and if they know what they are doing?

Ah yes. The old cable bill - nuclear radiation analogy. Classic.


What many people fail to realize is Radiation in itself is faily new as far as what Scientist know about it. They have no idea what Radiation can do after a certain amount of years.

But you're going to educate us with fear-mongering pictures, yes? :lol


That is why The Atom Bomb dropped in Japan and Chernobyl scenarios keep coming up when people try to figure out what Radiation exposure really does to the human body.

Yes, shocking how the two worst nuclear disasters of all-time would be used to determine the effects of radiation.


Did we have Nuclear radiation in the 1800s? Who is to say that 10 years from now Babies born by radiation infected mothers back in 1986 will have a short lifespan? It's only been 25 or so years. People who keep saying radiation is your friend you get it from the sun, from cell phones, X-ray machines, those people are dangerous.

:lmao FEAR! TERROR! Mouse is the modern day equivalent of chicken little. :lol



The commercials on Cancer research centers and other TV exposure makes people used to the disease to the point they don't question it anymore. Its normal conversation now.

This is a statement that makes sense.


People are so occupied with their 401k and whats on face book they can't even see their world going to shit.

Yes, there are definitely no threads on SpursTalk or in other forums expressing concern over the state of the world. It's all Winehouse and Wild Cobra talking about diversifying their portfolio. :lmao

[hater]

:lol

Link.....

Hater, it was expected.

Fail

noone was expecting water leakage from reactors or high radiation hundreds of miles away.

Feared? yes. Expected? no.

[Winehole23]

The radioactive core in a reactor at the crippled Fukushima nuclear power (http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/nuclearpower) plant appears to have melted through the bottom of its containment vessel and on to a concrete floor, experts say, raising fears of a major release of radiation at the site.
The radioactive core in a reactor at the crippled Fukushima nuclear power (http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/nuclearpower) plant appears to have melted through the bottom of its containment vessel and on to a concrete floor, experts say, raising fears of a major release of radiation at the site.

The warning follows an analysis by a leading US expert of radiation levels at the plant. Readings from reactor two at the site have been made public by the Japanese authorities and Tepco, the utility that operates it.Richard Lahey, who was head of safety research for boiling-water reactors at General Electric when the company installed the units at Fukushima, told the Guardian workers at the site appeared to have "lost the race" to save the reactor, but said there was no danger of a Chernobyl-style catastrophe.

Workers have been pumping water into three reactors at the stricken plant in a desperate bid to keep the fuel rods from melting down, but the fuel is at least partially exposed in all the reactors.At least part of the molten core, which includes melted fuel rods and zirconium alloy cladding, seemed to have sunk through the steel "lower head" of the pressure vessel around reactor two, Lahey said.

"The indications we have, from the reactor to radiation readings and the materials they are seeing, suggest that the core has melted through the bottom of the pressure vessel in unit two, and at least some of it is down on the floor of the drywell," Lahey said. "I hope I am wrong, but that is certainly what the evidence is pointing towards."

The major concern when molten fuel breaches a containment vessel is that it reacts with the concrete floor of the drywell underneath, releasing radioactive gases into the surrounding area. At Fukushima, the drywell has been flooded with seawater, which will cool any molten fuel that escapes from the reactor and reduce the amount of radioactive gas released.




Lahey said: "It won't come out as one big glob; it'll come out like lava, and that is good because it's easier to cool."


The drywell is surrounded by a secondary steel-and-concrete structure designed to keep radioactive material from escaping into the environment. But an earlier hydrogen explosion at the reactor may have damaged this.
"The reason we are concerned is that they are detecting water outside the containment area that is highly radioactive and it can only have come from the reactor core," Lahey added. "It's not going to be anything like Chernobyl, where it went up with a big fire and steam explosion, but it's not going to be good news for the environment."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/29/japan-lost-race-save-nuclear-reactor

[Winehole23]

Radioactive caesium and iodine has been deposited in northern Japan far from the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, at levels that were considered highly contaminated after Chernobyl.


The readings were taken by the Japanese science ministry (http://www.mext.go.jp/english/radioactivity_level/detail/1304099.htm), MEXT, and reveal high levels of caesium-137 and iodine-131 outside the 30-kilometre evacuation zone, mostly to the north-north-west.


Iodine-131, with a half-life of eight days, should disappear in a matter of weeks. The bigger worry concerns caesium-137, which has a half-life of 30 years and could pose a health threat for far longer. Just how serious that will be depends on where it lands, and whether remediation measures are possible.


The US Department of Energy has been surveying the area with an airborne gamma radiation detector. It reports (http://www.energy.gov/news/10194.htm) that most of the "elevated readings" are within 40 kilometres of the plant, but that "an area of greater radiation extending north-west… may be of interest to public safety officials".
Caesium contamination

An analysis of MEXT's data by New Scientist shows just how elevated the levels are. After the 1986 Chernobyl accident (http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19225780.042-the-worlds-worst-nuclear-accident.html), the most highly contaminated areas were defined as those with over 1490 kilobecquerels (kBq) of caesium per square metre. Produce from soil with 550 kBq/m2 was destroyed.


People living within 30 kilometres of the plant have evacuated or been advised to stay indoors. Since 18 March, MEXT has repeatedly found caesium levels above 550 kBq/m2 in an area some 45 kilometres wide lying 30 to 50 kilometres north-west of the plant. The highest was 6400 kBq/m2, about 35 kilometres away, while caesium reached 1816 kBq/m2 in Nihonmatsu City and 1752 kBq/m2 in the town of Kawamata, where iodine-131 levels of up to 12,560 kBq/m2 have also been measured. "Some of the numbers are really high," says Gerhard Proehl, head of assessment and management of environmental releases of radiation at the International Atomic Energy Agency (http://www.iaea.org/).
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20305-caesium-fallout-from-fukushima-rivals-chernobyl.html

[The Reckoning]

so was bill nye right all along?

[Winehole23]

What did the Science Guy say?

[The Reckoning]

af-41E5mndk

it was posted before...they had him on the show like the day after it happened

[CosmicCowboy]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/29/japan-lost-race-save-nuclear-reactor

Japan may have lost race to save nuclear reactor
Fukushima meltdown fears rise after radioactive core melts through vessel – but 'no danger of Chernobyl-style catastrophe'


Highly radioactive water is now being detected outside the containment area at Fukushima, experts have warned.
The radioactive core in a reactor at the crippled Fukushima nuclear power plant appears to have melted through the bottom of its containment vessel and on to a concrete floor, experts say, raising fears of a major release of radiation at the site.

The warning follows an analysis by a leading US expert of radiation levels at the plant. Readings from reactor two at the site have been made public by the Japanese authorities and Tepco, the utility that operates it.

Richard Lahey, who was head of safety research for boiling-water reactors at General Electric when the company installed the units at Fukushima, told the Guardian workers at the site appeared to have "lost the race" to save the reactor, but said there was no danger of a Chernobyl-style catastrophe.

Workers have been pumping water into three reactors at the stricken plant in a desperate bid to keep the fuel rods from melting down, but the fuel is at least partially exposed in all the reactors.

At least part of the molten core, which includes melted fuel rods and zirconium alloy cladding, seemed to have sunk through the steel "lower head" of the pressure vessel around reactor two, Lahey said.

"The indications we have, from the reactor to radiation readings and the materials they are seeing, suggest that the core has melted through the bottom of the pressure vessel in unit two, and at least some of it is down on the floor of the drywell," Lahey said. "I hope I am wrong, but that is certainly what the evidence is pointing towards."

The major concern when molten fuel breaches a containment vessel is that it reacts with the concrete floor of the drywell underneath, releasing radioactive gases into the surrounding area. At Fukushima, the drywell has been flooded with seawater, which will cool any molten fuel that escapes from the reactor and reduce the amount of radioactive gas released.

Lahey said: "It won't come out as one big glob; it'll come out like lava, and that is good because it's easier to cool."

The drywell is surrounded by a secondary steel-and-concrete structure designed to keep radioactive material from escaping into the environment. But an earlier hydrogen explosion at the reactor may have damaged this.

"The reason we are concerned is that they are detecting water outside the containment area that is highly radioactive and it can only have come from the reactor core," Lahey added. "It's not going to be anything like Chernobyl, where it went up with a big fire and steam explosion, but it's not going to be good news for the environment."

The radiation level at a pool of water in the turbine room of reactor two was measured recently at 1,000 millisieverts per hour. At that level, workers could remain in the area for just 15 minutes, under current exposure guidelines.

A less serious core meltdown happened at the Three Mile Island nuclear plant in Pennsylvania in 1979. During that incident, engineers managed to cool the molten fuel before it penetrated the steel pressure vessel. The task is a race against time, because as the fuel melts it forms a blob that becomes increasingly difficult to cool.

In the light of the Fukushima crisis, Lahey said all countries with nuclear power stations should have "Swat teams" of nuclear reactor safety experts on standby to give swift advice to the authorities in times of emergency, with international groups co-ordinated by the International Atomic Energy Authority.

The warning came as the Japanese authorities were being urged to give clearer advice to the public about the safety of food and drinking water contaminated with radioactive substances from Fukushima.

Robert Peter Gale, a US medical researcher who was brought in by Soviet authorities after the Chernobyl disaster, in 1986, has met Japanese cabinet ministers to discuss establishing an independent committee charged with taking radiation data from the site and translating it into clear public health advice.

"What is fundamentally disturbing the public is reports of drinking water one day being above some limit, and then a day or two later it's suddenly safe to drink. People don't know if the first instance was alarmist or whether the second one was untrue," said Gale.

"My recommendation is they should consider establishing a small commission to independently convert the data into comprehensible units of risk for the public so people know what they are dealing with and can take sensible decisions," he added.

[Winehole23]

#511:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5092671&postcount=511

[cheguevara]

'no danger of Chernobyl-style catastrophe'


that's a relief :rolleyes

[MannyIsGod]

So much for those GE containment vessels.

[RandomGuy]

'no danger of Chernobyl-style catastrophe'

Until of course, there is.


There is no danger that house prices will fall and make our mortgage backed securities worthless.

Until there was.

Pardon me if I put off booking my trip to the hotel in the town next door to the reactor.

Any takers for my hotel room booking?

[LnGrrrR]

But I thought that our corporate overlords said everything would be ok? :lol

[Agloco]

Fail

noone was expecting water leakage from reactors or high radiation hundreds of miles away.

Feared? yes. Expected? no.

Spoken like a true layperson. Keep up the fear mongering though. You're pretty good at it.

Edit: What time point are you referring to? I'm speaking about events after we found out about the seawater being sprayed on the cores.

[Agloco]

The point I was making is...... someone is either lying, or they don't have the proper equipment if they can't seem to figure out what the accurate Radiation levels are.

Based on many years of experience, it's probably due to many indirect measurements being made in order to reduce the amount of exposure the crew is getting. It's not as accurate as it should be, but it gives an idea about the safety of an area before anyone spends a significant amount of time near the measurement point. After the initial reading, direct measurements can then be made (usually) for a more accurate picture.

Also keep in mind: The amount of radiation present (and subsequently detected) can fluctuate quite a bit based on prevailing winds. In addition, it was noted that most of the equipment had either malfunctioned or failed as a result of the quake/tsunami. They rolled with what they had at the time.


If your cable bill says you owe 100 dollars then two days later they say you owe 20 dollars wouldn't you want to know who is in charge, and if they know what they are doing?

Not really. I'd ask the experts (read: the billers) for more info about the nature of the 80 dollar discount. I wouldn't immediately question the competency of those who work with billing on a day to day basis. Perhaps there's some food for thought here mouse.....




What many people fail to realize is Radiation in itself is faily new as far as what Scientist know about it. They have no idea what Radiation can do after a certain amount of years.

Such is the nature of radiation and it's effects on biologic systems. Stochastic processes are a bitch. Don't fall into the same trap that habitual gamblers do here. Reality is, there are shades of gray in the world. It's not all black and white. No one can guarantee that you won't develop some sort of ailment (including cancer) as a result of radiation just as no one can guarantee that you won't develop an ailment.




That is why The Atom Bomb dropped in Japan and Chernobyl scenarios keep coming up when people try to figure out what Radiation exposure really does to the human body.



Which should offer you a perspective on exactly how rare situations like these are. Both of those events were as a result of extraordinary circumstances, the likes of which we are unlikely to ever see again. Ditto for Fukushima, especially with all of the safety data being gathered during this crisis.




Did we have Nuclear radiation in the 1800s? Who is to say that 10 years from now Babies born by radiation infected mothers back in 1986 will have a short lifespan? It's only been 25 or so years. People who keep saying radiation is your friend you get it from the sun, from cell phones, X-ray machines, those people are dangerous.

No. What's really dangerous are people who don't understand the difference between exposure at Chernobyl and exposure from background radiation and electronics. Fear mongering at it's worst tbh.

Also, read my comment above. You can't guarantee that something will happen, just as I can't guarantee that something won't.



The commercials on Cancer research centers and other TV exposure makes people used to the disease to the point they don't question it anymore. Its normal conversation now.

I don't follow your train of thought here. Are you maintaining that it's been sensationalized? In talking to patients I find that the exposure (pardon the pun) helps quite a bit in terms of awareness. Education is number one. Idle speculation in the absence of education leads to what we have here in this thread, and more generally what the government and public's opinion of nuclear power will be after all of this is over. Shameful really.


People are so occupied with their 401k and whats on face book they can't even see their world going to shit.

My new EVO 4G rocks btw. I can do status updates on FB in between radiation treatments. There's also a neat Wells Fargo app that allows me to look at all of my investments........

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Radiation Traces Found in U.S. Milk

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703806304576233221749626458.html?m od=googlenews_wsj

[Wild Cobra]

Radiation Traces Found in U.S. Milk

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703806304576233221749626458.html?m od=googlenews_wsj
So?

Know how small a pico is?

[mouse]

So?

Know how small a pico is?

Twice the size of your brain, or your package?


Drinks on me!

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/50/131012552_74c0a6bc96.jpg

[hater]

"We know we don't normally see iodine-131 in milk. We know there's been an incident where it's been released," the spokesman said. "And now we're seeing it."

[clambake]

no big deal. wc prefers govt. cheese.

[DarrinS]

"We know we don't normally see iodine-131 in milk. We know there's been an incident where it's been released," the spokesman said. "And now we're seeing it."



You better get to work on that fallout shelter. And you'd better hurry because idonine-131 has a half life of 8 days.

[hater]

You better get to work on that fallout shelter. And you'd better hurry because idonine-131 has a half life of 8 days.

hey moron. It is an interesting statement thus why I quoted it. I am not saying anybody is gona die from it.

Moron.

[ChumpDumper]

You better get to work on that fallout shelter. And you'd better hurry because idonine-131 has a half life of 8 days.Do you know what half life means?

[DarrinS]

Do you know what half life means?

Sure do.

[hater]

Sure do.

half life means 1/2 of the radiation will be gone in 8 days. then another 8 days and 1/2 of that is gone, and so on. This goes on pretty much forever.

you're welcome.

[DarrinS]

half life means 1/2 of the radiation will be gone in 8 days. then another 8 days and 1/2 of that is gone, and so on. This goes on pretty much forever.

you're welcome.


Thanks Einstein. What's your point?

[ChumpDumper]

Why is it so important to you to try downplaying the dangers of radiation leaks in a foreign country?

[mouse]

Based on many years of experience, it's probably due to many indirect measurements being made in order to reduce the amount of exposure the crew is getting. It's not as accurate as it should be, but it gives an idea about the safety of an area before anyone spends a significant amount of time near the measurement point. After the initial reading, direct measurements can then be made (usually) for a more accurate picture.

And what devise do you use to determine if you or anyone you know has been exposed to dangerous amounts to radiation?

one of these?

http://www.safety.duke.edu/Radsafety/dosim/fetalbadge.jpg


Or do you use one of these?
http://assets.svpply.com.s3.amazonaws.com/small/364963.jpg

or.....
http://www.fast-autos.net/diecast-cars-models/diecast-car-image-large/radiation-detector-dosimeter-geiger-counter-new_190513018709.jpg

You know I like to use what the the soldiers from the gulf war use as far as detecting harmful radiation levels , to me its much more effective.











They're offspring.


http://www.erichufschmid.net/TFC/img/US-uranium-baby.JPG



http://pubrecord.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/DUbaby.jpg





Also keep in mind:

More "brain washing" to come.....





The amount of radiation present (and subsequently detected) can fluctuate quite a bit based on prevailing winds. In addition, it was noted that most of the equipment had either malfunctioned or failed as a result of the quake/tsunami. They rolled with what they had at the time.

Dude what is with all the spin? Either radiation is good or it isn't pick a side already.




Not really. I'd ask the experts (read: the billers) for more info about the nature of the 80 dollar discount. I wouldn't immediately question the competency of those who work with billing on a day to day basis. Perhaps there's some food for thought here mouse.....


I am done listening to any so called "Experts"

http://wishididntknow.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/japan-boss-cries.jpg











Such is the nature of radiation

Don't use he word "nature" and "Radiation" in the same sentence.



and it's effects on biologic systems. Stochastic processes are a bitch. Don't fall into the same trap that habitual gamblers do here. Reality is, there are shades of gray in the world. It's not all black and white. No one can guarantee that you won't develop some sort of ailment (including cancer) as a result of radiation just as no one can guarantee that you won't develop an ailment.

Done sugar coating?



http://www.womenshealthmag.com/files/images/0608-sugar-quiz.jpg



Seriously, how much smoke can one person blow up another persons ass?






Which should offer you a perspective on exactly how rare situations like these are. Both of those events were as a result of extraordinary circumstances,

Getting stuck by lightning and winning the lotto is rare also but it happens everyday. Stop making this incident out to be a fairytale.




the likes of which we are unlikely to ever see again. Ditto for Fukushima, especially with all of the safety data being gathered during this crisis.

Now I know your either drunk or you work for BP oil. You know how many Nuclear plants are in the world today? And just because something "rarely" happens that means its ok?

Hey share some of those anxiety pills with the rest of us. With your frame of thinking......You probably tell your kids the Jewish Holocaust was just another harmless Nazi Bar B Q.




No. What's really dangerous are people who don't understand the difference between exposure at Chernobyl and exposure from background radiation and electronics. Fear mongering at it's worst tbh.


Harmful to who? To me it's better to be overly cautious and not need the gas mask and can of Spam than to be so laid back like your xannx drinking self and wake up to a mushroom cloud.



Also, read my comment above. You can't guarantee that something will happen, just as I can't guarantee that something won't

We are past "grantees" dude, the shit hit the fan, the radiation is leaking, enough of your Enron CEO everything will be fine motivation speeches.

Wake up and smell the contaminated coffee made with contaminated milk




I don't follow your train of thought here

Translation: I can't follow your level of intelligent thinking.



Are you maintaining that it's been sensationalized? In talking to patients I find that the exposure (pardon the pun) helps quite a bit in terms of awareness. Education is number one. Idle speculation in the absence of education leads to what we have here in this thread, and more generally what the government and public's opinion of nuclear power will be after all of this is over. Shameful really.




Maybe your to young to remember but back in the 70s-80s-and early 90s

Someone getting Cancer or Aids was rare and people would take notice and wonder why, and it was something that effected only a small group of people. In fact no one I knew personally had either disease and It seemed like something that (your way of thinking) happens only on rare occasions.


Now not only is Aids and Cancer so common they already have commercials on places to go get treatment like having the brakes done on your car.

It's almost like a commercial for back pain.....

example:

Actor one: Hey Ralph how is your Cancer coming along?

Actor two: It's no biggie Steve! I go to Zap Away Cancer clinics of America. It's convenient, its in my budget, and get this..they have a play room for my kids and a snack bar while they wait for me to get my daily radiation treatments.

And if you sign up for their Platinum plan now! you get your Zap treatments at home!

Actor one: Wow that is fantastic Ralph I can't wait till I get Cancer I will use Zap Away Cancer clinics of America also !

Actor two: Don't forget to take your W-2 form they now also do taxes!

Remember dial 1-800-Zap Away

(camera zoom in on happy neighbors face)

:Cue in cheesy Total recall music: "Zap Away" "Zap Away" Toooooodayyy!

(fade to black)






My new EVO 4G rocks btw. I can do status updates on FB in between radiation treatments. There's also a neat Wells Fargo app that allows me to look at all of my investments........


Wake me up when it can detect radiation.

[DarrinS]

Why is it so important to you to try downplaying the dangers of radiation leaks in a foreign country?


Probably no need to downplay the "danger" of radation that is much less than the amount found in your average banana.

[ChumpDumper]

Probably no need to downplay the "danger" of radation that is much less than the amount found in your average banana.It's that level in Japan?

[hater]

Probably no need to downplay the "danger" of radation that is much less than the amount found in your average banana.

there are Cecium 131, 137 and Plutonium in bananas?

[DarrinS]

It's that level in Japan?

I was responding to the infinitesimal trace found in US milk.

[ChumpDumper]

I was responding to the infinitesimal trace found in US milk.But you spent most of this thread downplaying the radiation dangers in Japan.

Why is it important for you to do that?

[DarrinS]

But you spent most of this thread downplaying the radiation dangers in Japan.

Why is it important for you to do that?



Radiation is dangerous, but the amount of attention paid to that issue is blown out of proportion considering the tens of thousands that died from the tsunami.

[mouse]

Radiation is dangerous, but the amount of attention paid to that issue is blown out of proportion considering the tens of thousands that died from the tsunami.

So the 9/11 victims ain't shit compared to the Jewish Holocaust?

[DarrinS]

So the 9/11 victims ain't shit compared to the Jewish Holocaust?


???

[mouse]

???


Your outdated techniques on avoiding the hard questions with cheesy comparisons is nothing new. It's call the Strawdog effect.

[Agloco]

And what devise do you use to determine if you or anyone you know has been exposed to dangerous amounts to radiation?

one of these?

http://www.safety.duke.edu/Radsafety/dosim/fetalbadge.jpg


Or do you use one of these?
http://assets.svpply.com.s3.amazonaws.com/small/364963.jpg

or.....
http://www.fast-autos.net/diecast-cars-models/diecast-car-image-large/radiation-detector-dosimeter-geiger-counter-new_190513018709.jpg

You know I like to use what the the soldiers from the gulf war use as far as detecting harmful radiation levels , to me its much more effective.

They're offspring.


http://www.erichufschmid.net/TFC/img/US-uranium-baby.JPG

http://pubrecord.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/DUbaby.jpg

They both work. Unfortunately your example doesn't do much good for the people working at the plant now. Or perhaps they should all stop for 40 weeks and go bone some random Tokyo hooker so we can see your system in action? Brilliant. :rolleyes


More "brain washing" to come.....


"Someone might actually know more than I do about the situation or subject matter and make my witty replies look more like douchebaggery."

fify




Dude what is with all the spin? Either radiation is good or it isn't pick a side already.

Says who? I know a few cancer patients who would like a word in private.

You seem to subscribe to a black and white world. More likely it's just a lack of knowledge about this. I understand.


I am done listening to any so called "Experts"

Based on your responses, it's likely that you never listened in the first place.




Don't use he word "nature" and "Radiation" in the same sentence.

Done sugar coating?


Radiation is found in nature. Done fear mongering? Probably not huh?




Getting stuck by lightning and winning the lotto is rare also but it happens everyday. Stop making this incident out to be a fairytale.

Earthquakes, tsunamis and nuclear meltdowns with primary power failures don't though. Your analogy fails, miserably.


Now I know your either drunk or you work for BP oil. You know how many Nuclear plants are in the world today? And just because something "rarely" happens that means its ok?

No. Just because it happened, doesn't mean it's a calamity either.

http://www.mattfind.com/12345673215-3-2-3_img/movie/d/i/a/chicken_little_2005_580x862_910200.jpg



Hey share some of those anxiety pills with the rest of us. With your frame of thinking......You probably tell your kids the Jewish Holocaust was just another harmless Nazi Bar B Q.

Perspective......... you missed the boat. So with your vast repository of knowledge on the matter, you'll no doubt fill in the blanks for us. I can't wait for your "analysis".



Harmful to who? To me it's better to be overly cautious and not need the gas mask and can of Spam than to be so laid back like your xannx drinking self and wake up to a mushroom cloud.

:tu

In the meantime, your speculation, inaccurate posts and half-witty remarks add nothing of substance to the conversation. When you have something serious or factual to add I'll be happy to entertain your concerns.




We are past "grantees" dude, the shit hit the fan, the radiation is leaking, enough of your Enron CEO everything will be fine motivation speeches.

Wake up and smell the contaminated coffee made with contaminated milk.

Just used my Enron collectors mug and poured me a full cup. I don't take my coffee black either, so I'm bound to bathe my thyroid in plenty of I-131.......

Too bad it has such a short half life, I'll never know if that cancer I'll get at age 65 was due to my own negligence. :lol

But you'll be there with the answer, right mouse?


Translation: Mouse used yet another crappy analogy and won't sack up

Again, fify


Maybe your to young to remember but back in the 70s-80s-and early 90s

Someone getting Cancer or Aids was rare and people would take notice and wonder why, and it was something that effected only a small group of people. In fact no one I knew personally had either disease and It seemed like something that (your way of thinking) happens only on rare occasions.


Now not only is Aids and Cancer so common they already have commercials on places to go get treatment like having the brakes done on your car.

It's almost like a commercial for back pain.....

example:

Actor one: Hey Ralph how is your Cancer coming along?

Actor two: It's no biggie Steve! I go to Zap Away Cancer clinics of America. It's convenient, its in my budget, and get this..they have a play room for my kids and a snack bar while they wait for me to get my daily radiation treatments.

And if you sign up for their Platinum plan now! you get your Zap treatments at home!

Actor one: Wow that is fantastic Ralph I can't wait till I get Cancer I will use Zap Away Cancer clinics of America also !

Actor two: Don't forget to take your W-2 form they now also do taxes!

Remember dial 1-800-Zap Away

(camera zoom in on happy neighbors face)

:Cue in cheesy Total recall music: "Zap Away" "Zap Away" Toooooodayyy!

(fade to black)

More douchebaggery. Why am I not surprised?

To elaborate on your "crown jewel" here, there are a million advertisements now because there are many more effective treatments available.

WARNING: This is another attempt by an "expert" to educate you, feel free to ignore what follows:

Mouse, you stated that:


Now not only is Aids and Cancer so common they already have commercials on places to go get treatment like having the brakes done on your car.

Incidence is the number of new cases year over year while prevalence is the number of people who are alive with the disease at any given time. Guess what happens to the prevalence when more effective treatments are developed?

Incidence is also increasing because we are able to detect cancer at much earlier stages than before which results in more cases diagnosed year over year.

Soooooo.......how much did Chernobyl or the Gulf-War contribute to either metric? Yes cancer is more common now, but not due any of the reasons you stated.


Wake me up when it can detect radiation.

Not yet, but I'll be able to detect cancer in the clinical setting quite soon:

http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/onepercent/2011/02/detect-cancer-from-your-smartp.html

It requires the detection of RF radiation. Detecting ionizing radiation is only a hop, skip and a jump away.

[Agloco]

Probably no need to downplay the "danger" of radation that is much less than the amount found in your average banana.


there are Cecium 131, 137 and Plutonium in bananas?

To answer Haters question: No, but it's a bit deeper than that.

I won't go into the specifics, but it wold require a dose calculation which I'm frankly too lazy to perform atm.

On a lighter note, this article was being circulated between a few of my colleagues and myself. Enjoy:

http://nuclearfissionary.com/2010/10/22/radioactive-banana/

[mouse]

http://www.mattfind.com/12345673215-3-2-3_img/movie/d/i/a/chicken_little_2005_580x862_910200.jpg




Where do you see me posting "the end is near" comments?

If you think clowning around with your amateur night tactics by posting cheesy movie posters is the way to have a serious debate about Radiation , then I can see I am just wasting my time trying to educate you.

[RandomGuy]

Where do you see me posting "the end is near" comments?

If you think clowning around with your amateur night tactics by posting cheesy movie posters is the way to have a serious debate about Radiation , then I can see I am just wasting my time trying to educate you.

:rollin

Dude is a bona fide nuclear scientist, and you are going to "educate" him about radiation.

:rollin

I love ya man, that was too funny by half. :tu

[Agloco]

If you think clowning around with your amateur night tactics by posting cheesy movie posters is the way to have a serious debate about Radiation , then I can see I am just wasting my time trying to educate you.

Just following in the masters footsteps.

Posting pictures of fetuses with hydrocephalus or otherwise malformed visages at this stage is inappropriate in its own right.

I got a rise out of you, and more importantly a very abbreviated response. I'd say I passed with flying colors. :lol

For the record, I do admire your humor. I just find it to be out of place here (in this thread).

[mouse]

:rollin

Dude is a bona fide nuclear scientist



Pics?




, and you are going to "educate" him about radiation.

:rollin


If you think your wannabee Jack Lemmon is such a well educated Nuclear Scientist wouldn't he be "warning" the "uneducated" about the "Dangers" ahead?

Instead he goes on and on about his online credentials and constantly toots his horn 24/7 about being the leading scientist during the Manhattan project and how he is related to the second cousin of Einstein meanwhile people are being exposed to deadly radiation and he has yet to do anything about it.

I on the other hand an Ex Military and MIT student don't go tooting my horn 24/7 I at least try to warn and educate people, not use the www to belittle them with smoke and mirrors.

[mouse]

Just following in the masters footsteps.

Posting pictures of fetuses with hydrocephalus or otherwise malformed visages at this stage is inappropriate in its own right.

Your a scientist you should be able to stomach a photo of a radiation victim. Or did you skip that class?




I got a rise out of you, and more importantly a very abbreviated response.

If you think by me posting on the fly is a sign I am heated you have allot to learn about me pal.



I'd say I passed with flying colors. :lol

I guess this is further evidence your here for shits and giggles and to push peoples buttons?


For the record, I do admire your humor. I just find it to be out of place here (in this thread).

If you can find humor in my postings then you wasted your time going to Darwin....errrr I meant Science academy you should be a talent scout for SNL.

I am sure your chicken little poster will be a huge hit.

[DarrinS]

News coverage of this milk "contamination" is really embarassing. The level is 5000 times lower (5000 times LOWER) than a level that would even be of concern. Diane Sawyer just had an MD on an asked "Is is really safe to drink the milk?".


Face palm

[mouse]

News coverage of this milk "contamination" is really embarassing. The level is 5000 times lower (5000 times LOWER) than a level that would even be of concern.

You wouldn't know about contaminated milk if you spent all night sucking on some Japs tit.

[DarrinS]

You wouldn't know about contaminated milk if you spent all night sucking on some Japs tit.



I actually don't drink milk, so I'm "safe".

[mouse]

Cheers!

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/raditation-mouse-milk.gif

[mouse]

Based on extraordinary circumstances, the likes of which we are unlikely to ever see again. D


List of nuclear accidents

This article lists notable civilian accidents involving nuclear material or nuclear reactors.
1950s

December 12, 1952 — INES Level 5[citation needed] - Chalk River, Ontario, Canada - Reactor core damaged
A reactor shutoff rod failure, combined with several operator errors, led to a major power excursion of more than double the reactor's rated output at AECL's NRX reactor. The operators purged the reactor's heavy water moderator, and the reaction stopped in under 30 seconds. A cover gas system failure led to hydrogen explosions, which severely damaged the reactor core. The fission products from approximately 30 kg of uranium were released through the reactor stack. Irradiated light-water coolant leaked from the damaged coolant circuit into the reactor building; some 4,000 cubic meters were pumped via pipeline to a disposal area to avoid contamination of the Ottawa River. Subsequent monitoring of surrounding water sources revealed no contamination. No immediate fatalities or injuries resulted from the incident; a 1982 followup study of exposed workers showed no long-term health effects. Future U.S. President Jimmy Carter, then a Lieutenant in the US Navy, was among the cleanup crew.[1]
October 10, 1957 - INES Level 5 - Windscale, Cumbria, Great Britain - Core fire
The graphite core of a British nuclear [weapons programme] reactor at Windscale, Cumberland (now Sellafield, Cumbria) caught fire, releasing substantial amounts of radioactive contamination into the surrounding area. The event, known as the Windscale fire, was the worst nuclear accident in Great Britain.
May 24, 1958 — INES Level needed - Chalk River, Ontario, Canada - Fuel damaged
Due to inadequate cooling a damaged uranium fuel rod caught fire and was torn in two as it was being removed from the core at the NRU reactor. The fire was extinguished, but not before radioactive combustion products contaminated the interior of the reactor building and, to a lesser degree, an area surrounding the laboratory site. Over 600 people were employed in the clean-up.[2][3]
October 25, 1958 - INES Level needed - Vinča, Yugoslavia - Criticality excursion, irradiation of personnel
During a subcritical counting experiment a power buildup went undetected at the Vinca Nuclear Institute's zero-power natural uranium heavy water moderated research reactor.[4] Saturation of radiation detection chambers gave the researchers false readings and the level of moderator in the reactor tank was raised triggering a criticality excursion which a researcher detected from the smell of ozone.[5] Six scientists received radiation doses of 2—4 Sv (200—400 rems) [6] (p. 96). An experimental bone marrow transplant treatment was performed on all of them in France and five survived, despite the ultimate rejection of the marrow in all cases. A single woman among them later had a child without apparent complications. This was one of the first nuclear incidents investigated by then newly-formed IAEA.[7]

July 26, 1959 — INES Level needed - Santa Susana Field Laboratory, California, United States - Partial meltdown
A partial core meltdown may have taken place when the Sodium Reactor Experiment (SRE) experienced a power excursion that caused severe overheating of the reactor core, resulting in the melting of one-third of the nuclear fuel and significant releases of radioactive gases. [8]

[edit] 1960s

July 24, 1964 - INES Level needed - Charlestown, Rhode Island, United States - Criticality Accident

An error by a worker at a United Nuclear Corporation fuel facility led to an accidental criticality. Robert Peabody, believing he was using a diluted uranium solution, accidentally put concentrated solution into an agitation tank containing sodium carbonate. Peabody was exposed to 10,000rad (100Gy) of radiation and died two days later. Ninety minutes after the criticality, a plant manager and another administrator returned to the building and were exposed to 100rad (1Gy), but suffered no ill effects.[9][10]

October 5, 1966 — INES Level needed - Monroe, Michigan, United States - Partial meltdown

A sodium cooling system malfunction caused a partial meltdown at the Enrico Fermi demonstration nuclear breeder reactor (Enrico Fermi-1 fast breeder reactor). The accident was attributed to a zirconium fragment that obstructed a flow-guide in the sodium cooling system. Two of the 105 fuel assemblies melted during the incident, but no contamination was recorded outside the containment vessel.[11]

Winter 1966-1967 (date unknown) – INES Level needed – location unknown – loss of coolant accident
The Soviet icebreaker Lenin, the USSR’s first nuclear-powered surface ship, suffered a major accident (possibly a meltdown — exactly what happened remains a matter of controversy in the West) in one of its three reactors. To find the leak the crew broke through the concrete and steel radiation shield with sledgehammers, causing irreparable damage. It was rumored that around 30 of the crew were killed. The ship was abandoned for a year to allow radiation levels to drop before the three reactors were removed, to be dumped into the Tsivolko Fjord on the Kara Sea, along with 60% of the fuel elements packed in a separate container. The reactors were replaced with two new ones, and the ship re-entered service in 1970, serving until 1989.

May 1967 — INES Level needed - Dumfries and Galloway, Scotland, United Kingdom - Partial meltdown

Graphite debris partially blocked a fuel channel causing a fuel element to melt and catch fire at the Chapelcross nuclear power station. Contamination was confined to the reactor core. The core was repaired and restarted in 1969, operating until the plant's shutdown in 2004.[12][13]

January 21, 1969 — INES Level needed - Lucens, Canton of Vaud, Switzerland - Explosion

A total loss of coolant led to a power excursion and explosion of an experimental nuclear reactor in a large cave at Lucens. The underground location of this reactor acted like a containment building and prevented any outside contamination. The cavern was heavily contaminated and was sealed. No injuries or fatalities resulted.[14][15]

[edit] 1970s

December 7, 1975 – INES Level 3 - Greifswald, Germany (then East Germany) - Partly damaged

Operators disabled three of six cooling pumps' electrical supply circuits to test emergency shutoffs. Instead of the expected automatic shutdown, a fourth pump failed causing excessive heating which damaged ten fuel rods. The accident was attributed to sticky relay contacts and generally poor construction in the Soviet-built reactor.[16]

February 22, 1977 – INES Level 4 - Jaslovské Bohunice, Czechoslovakia - Fuel damaged

Operators neglected to remove moisture-absorbing materials from a fuel rod assembly before loading it into the KS 150 reactor at power plant A-1. The accident resulted in damaged fuel integrity, extensive corrosion damage of fuel cladding and release of radioactivity into the plant area. The affected reactor was decommissioned following this accident.[17]

March 28, 1979 – INES Level 5[citation needed] - Middletown, Dauphin County, Pennsylvania, United States - Partial meltdown

Equipment failures and worker mistakes contributed to a loss of coolant and a partial core meltdown at the Three Mile Island Nuclear Generating Station 15 km (9 miles) southeast of Harrisburg. While the reactor was extensively damaged, on-site radiation exposure was under 100 millirems (less than annual exposure due to natural sources). Area residents received a smaller exposure of 1 millirem (10 µSv), or about 1/3 the dose from eating a banana per day for one year. There were no fatalities. Follow-up radiological studies predict between zero and one long-term cancer fatality.[18][19][20]

See also: Three Mile Island accident

[edit] 1980s

March 13, 1980 - INES Level 4 - Orléans, France - Nuclear materials leak

A brief power excursion in Reactor A2 led to a rupture of fuel bundles and a minor release (8 x 1010 Bq) of nuclear materials at the Saint-Laurent Nuclear Power Plant. The reactor was repaired and continued operation until its decommissioning in 1992.[21]

March, 1981 — INES Level 2 - Tsuruga, Japan - Radioactive materials released into Sea of Japan + Overexposure of workers

More than 100 workers were exposed to doses of up to 155 millirem per day radiation during repairs of the Tsuruga Nuclear Power Plant, violating the Japan Atomic Power Company's limit of 100 millirems (1 mSv) per day.[22]

January 25, 1982 - INES Level unknown - Ontario, New York - Radioactive materials released

A steam pipe burst at the Ginna Nuclear Generating Station, resulting in a loss of coolant and gasses were intentionally vented to the atmosphere to reduce risks of explosion.

September 23, 1983 — INES Level 4 - Buenos Aires, Argentina - Accidental criticality

An operator error during a fuel plate reconfiguration in an experimental test reactor led to an excursion of 3×1017 fissions at the RA-2 facility. The operator absorbed 2000 rad (20 Gy) of gamma and 1700 rad (17 Gy) of neutron radiation which killed him two days later. Another 17 people outside of the reactor room absorbed doses ranging from 35 rad (0.35 Gy) to less than 1 rad (0.01 Gy).[23] pg103[24]

April 26, 1986 — INES Level 7 - Prypiat, Ukraine (then USSR) - Power excursion, explosion, complete meltdown

An inadequate reactor safety system[25] led to an uncontrolled power excursion, causing a severe steam explosion, meltdown and release of radioactive material at the Chernobyl nuclear power plant located approximately 100 kilometers north-northwest of Kiev. Approximately fifty fatalities (mostly cleanup personnel) resulted from the accident and the immediate aftermath. An additional nine fatal cases of thyroid cancer in children in the Chernobyl area have been attributed to the accident. The explosion and combustion of the graphite reactor core spread radioactive material over much of Europe. 100,000 people were evacuated from the areas immediately surrounding Chernobyl in addition to 300,000 from the areas of heavy fallout in Ukraine, Belarus and Russia. An "Exclusion Zone" was created surrounding the site encompassing approximately 1,000 mi² (3,000 km²) and deemed off-limits for human habitation for an indefinite period. Several studies by governments, UN agencies and environmental groups have estimated the consequences and eventual number of casualties. Their findings are subject to controversy.

See also: Chernobyl disaster

May 4, 1986 – INES Level needed - Hamm-Uentrop, Germany (then West Germany) - Fuel damaged

A spherical fuel pebble became lodged in the pipe used to deliver fuel elements to the reactor at an experimental 300-megawatt THTR-300 HTGR. Attempts by an operator to dislodge the fuel pebble damaged its cladding, releasing radiation detectable up to two kilometers from the reactor.[26]

October 19, 1989 – INES Level 3 - Vandellos Nuclear Power Plant, Spain -fire in one of its two turbogenerators

After the fire in the turbogenerators the Spanish comission determined a large list of issues in the plant that was closed by the owners due to economical unviability.

[edit] 1990s

April 6, 1993 — INES Level 4 - Tomsk, Russia - Explosion

A pressure buildup led to an explosive mechanical failure in a 34 cubic meter stainless steel reaction vessel buried in a concrete bunker under building 201 of the radiochemical works at the Tomsk-7 Siberian Chemical Enterprise plutonium reprocessing facility. The vessel contained a mixture of concentrated nitric acid, uranium (8757 kg), plutonium (449 g) along with a mixture of radioactive and organic waste from a prior extraction cycle. The explosion dislodged the concrete lid of the bunker and blew a large hole in the roof of the building, releasing approximately 6 GBq of Pu 239 and 30 TBq of various other radionuclides into the environment. The contamination plume extended 28 km NE of building 201, 20 km beyond the facility property. The small village of Georgievka (pop. 200) was at the end of the fallout plume, but no fatalities, illnesses or injuries were reported. The accident exposed 160 on-site workers and almost two thousand cleanup workers to total doses of up to 50 mSv (the threshold limit for radiation workers is 100 mSv per 5 years).[27][28][29]

June, 1999 — INES Level 2[30] - Ishikawa Prefecture, Japan - Control rod malfunction

Operators attempting to insert one control rod during an inspection neglected procedure and instead withdrew three causing a 15 minute uncontrolled sustained reaction at the number 1 reactor of Shika Nuclear Power Plant. The Hokuriku Electric Company who owned the reactor did not report this incident and falsified records, covering it up until March, 2007.[31]

September 30, 1999 — INES Level 4 - Ibaraki Prefecture, Japan - Accidental criticality

Inadequately trained part-time workers prepared a uranyl nitrate solution containing about 16.6 kg of uranium, which exceeded the critical mass, into a precipitation tank at a uranium reprocessing facility in Tokai-mura northeast of Tokyo, Japan. The tank was not designed to dissolve this type of solution and was not configured to prevent eventual criticality. Three workers were exposed to (neutron) radiation doses in excess of allowable limits. Two of these workers died. 116 other workers received lesser doses of 1 mSv or greater though not in excess of the allowable limit.[32][33][34][35]

See also: Tokaimura nuclear accident

[edit] 2000s

April 10, 2003 — INES Level 3 - Paks, Hungary - Fuel damaged

Partially spent fuel rods undergoing cleaning in a tank of heavy water ruptured and spilled fuel pellets at Paks Nuclear Power Plant. It is suspected that inadequate cooling of the rods during the cleaning process combined with a sudden influx of cold water thermally shocked fuel rods causing them to split. Boric acid was added to the tank to prevent the loose fuel pellets from achieving criticality. Ammonia and hydrazine were also added to absorb iodine-131.[36]

April 19, 2005 — INES Level 3 - Sellafield, England, United Kingdom - Nuclear material leak

20 metric tons of uranium and 160 kilograms of plutonium dissolved in 83,000 litres of nitric acid leaked over several months from a cracked pipe into a stainless steel sump chamber at the Thorp nuclear fuel reprocessing plant. The partially processed spent fuel was drained into holding tanks outside the plant.[37][38]

November 2005 — INES Level needed - Braidwood, Illinois, United States - Nuclear material leak

Tritium contamination of groundwater was discovered at Exelon's Braidwood station. Groundwater off site remains within safe drinking standards though the NRC is requiring the plant to correct any problems related to the release.[39]

March 6, 2006 — INES Level 2[40] - Erwin, Tennessee, United States - Nuclear material leak

Thirty-five litres of a highly enriched uranium solution leaked during transfer into a lab at Nuclear Fuel Services Erwin Plant. The incident caused a seven-month shutdown. A required public hearing on the licensing of the plant was not held due to the absence of public notification.[41][42][43][44]

[edit] 2010s
See also: Timeline of the Fukushima nuclear accidents

March 11-20, 2011 - INES Level 5[45] , previously 4[46] or higher (6[47][48][49] as of March 15 according to Andre-Claude Lacoste, president of France's nuclear safety authority. It is not an official rating[50])
Fukushima I Nuclear Power Plant, Japan - Overheating, explosions, fire, radioactivity emergency

Main article: Fukushima I nuclear accidents

After the 2011 Tōhoku earthquake and tsunami of March 11, the emergency power supply of the Fukushima-Daiichi nuclear power plant failed. This was followed by deliberate releases of radioactive gas from reactors 1 and 2 to relieve pressure. On March 12, triggered by falling water levels, a hydrogen explosion occurred at reactor 1, resulting in the collapse of the concrete outer structure.[51][52][53][54][55] Although the reactor containment itself was confirmed to be intact,[56][57][58] the hourly radiation from the plant reached 1,015 microsievert (0.1015 rem) - an amount equivalent to that allowable for ordinary people in one year."[59][60] Residents of the Fukushima area were advised to stay inside, close doors and windows, turn off air conditioning, and to cover their mouths with masks, towels or handkerchiefs as well as not to drink tap water.[61] By the evening of March 12, the exclusion zone had been extended to 20 kilometres (12 mi) around the plant[62] and 70,000 to 80,000 people had been evacuated from homes in northern Japan.[63] A second, nearly identical hydrogen explosion occured in the reactor building for Unit 3 on March 14, with similar effects.[64] A third explosion in the “pressure suppression room” of Unit 2[65] initially was said not to have breached the reactor’s inner steel containment vessel,[66] but later reports indicated that the explosion damaged the steel containment structure of Unit 2 and much larger releases of radiation were expected than previously.[65]
Disposed rods of reactor Unit 4 were stored outside the reactor in a separate pool which ran dry, yielding fire and risk of serious contamination.[67]
Staff was brought down from 800 Fukishima, who have been named the "Fukishima 50" by the press.[67] Events are still developing.

March 11-13, 2011 - INES Level 3[68], Fukushima II Nuclear Power Plant, Japan - Overheating, possible radioactivity emergency

After the 2011 Tōhoku earthquake and tsunami of March 11, the cooling systems for three reactors (numbers 1, 2 and 4) of the Fukushima-Daini nuclear power plant were compromised due to damage from the tsunami.[69] Nuclear Engineering International reported that all four units were successfully automatically shut down, but emergency diesel generators at the site were Damaged by the 9.2 magnitude earthquake[70] People were evacuated around 10 kilometres (6.2 mi) from the plant. An evacuation order was issued, because of possible radioactive contamination.

[Wild Cobra]

half life means 1/2 of the radiation will be gone in 8 days. then another 8 days and 1/2 of that is gone, and so on. This goes on pretty much forever.

you're welcome.
So how many atoms of iodine-131 must be in a mol with such a high rate of decay to produce measurable results at the x times 10e-12 level?

[Agloco]

Pics?

What would those prove? That I own a cool looking lab jacket and pocket protector?

Try looking at my prior posts in this thread. Those speak for themselves.




If you think your wannabee Jack Lemmon is such a well educated Nuclear Scientist wouldn't he be "warning" the "uneducated" about the "Dangers" ahead?

My PM is open to anyone who has questions. What warning? What dangers lie ahead?

lol Jack Lemmon



Instead he goes on and on about his online credentials and constantly toots his horn 24/7 about being the leading scientist during the Manhattan project and how he is related to the second cousin of Einstein meanwhile people are being exposed to deadly radiation and he has yet to do anything about it.

Just be grateful that I haven't begun citing any journal articles. The shit is really gonna hit the fan then.

Oh, and people are being exposed to deadly radiation. Helping them is gonna require a lot more sunscreen than I can afford though.


I on the other hand an Ex Military and MIT student don't go tooting my horn 24/7 I at least try to warn and educate people, not use the www to belittle them with smoke and mirrors.

MIT? That explains a lot.

Sooooo, educate me. What am I missing here?

[Agloco]

List of nuclear accidents

This article lists notable civilian accidents involving nuclear material or nuclear reactors.
1950s

December 12, 1952 — INES Level 5[citation needed] - Chalk River, Ontario, Canada - Reactor core damaged
A reactor shutoff rod failure, combined with several operator errors, led to a major power excursion of more than double the reactor's rated output at AECL's NRX reactor. The operators purged the reactor's heavy water moderator, and the reaction stopped in under 30 seconds. A cover gas system failure led to hydrogen explosions, which severely damaged the reactor core. The fission products from approximately 30 kg of uranium were released through the reactor stack. Irradiated light-water coolant leaked from the damaged coolant circuit into the reactor building; some 4,000 cubic meters were pumped via pipeline to a disposal area to avoid contamination of the Ottawa River. Subsequent monitoring of surrounding water sources revealed no contamination. No immediate fatalities or injuries resulted from the incident; a 1982 followup study of exposed workers showed no long-term health effects. Future U.S. President Jimmy Carter, then a Lieutenant in the US Navy, was among the cleanup crew.[1]
October 10, 1957 - INES Level 5 - Windscale, Cumbria, Great Britain - Core fire
The graphite core of a British nuclear [weapons programme] reactor at Windscale, Cumberland (now Sellafield, Cumbria) caught fire, releasing substantial amounts of radioactive contamination into the surrounding area. The event, known as the Windscale fire, was the worst nuclear accident in Great Britain.
May 24, 1958 — INES Level needed - Chalk River, Ontario, Canada - Fuel damaged
Due to inadequate cooling a damaged uranium fuel rod caught fire and was torn in two as it was being removed from the core at the NRU reactor. The fire was extinguished, but not before radioactive combustion products contaminated the interior of the reactor building and, to a lesser degree, an area surrounding the laboratory site. Over 600 people were employed in the clean-up.[2][3]
October 25, 1958 - INES Level needed - Vinča, Yugoslavia - Criticality excursion, irradiation of personnel
During a subcritical counting experiment a power buildup went undetected at the Vinca Nuclear Institute's zero-power natural uranium heavy water moderated research reactor.[4] Saturation of radiation detection chambers gave the researchers false readings and the level of moderator in the reactor tank was raised triggering a criticality excursion which a researcher detected from the smell of ozone.[5] Six scientists received radiation doses of 2—4 Sv (200—400 rems) [6] (p. 96). An experimental bone marrow transplant treatment was performed on all of them in France and five survived, despite the ultimate rejection of the marrow in all cases. A single woman among them later had a child without apparent complications. This was one of the first nuclear incidents investigated by then newly-formed IAEA.[7]

July 26, 1959 — INES Level needed - Santa Susana Field Laboratory, California, United States - Partial meltdown
A partial core meltdown may have taken place when the Sodium Reactor Experiment (SRE) experienced a power excursion that caused severe overheating of the reactor core, resulting in the melting of one-third of the nuclear fuel and significant releases of radioactive gases. [8]

[edit] 1960s

July 24, 1964 - INES Level needed - Charlestown, Rhode Island, United States - Criticality Accident

An error by a worker at a United Nuclear Corporation fuel facility led to an accidental criticality. Robert Peabody, believing he was using a diluted uranium solution, accidentally put concentrated solution into an agitation tank containing sodium carbonate. Peabody was exposed to 10,000rad (100Gy) of radiation and died two days later. Ninety minutes after the criticality, a plant manager and another administrator returned to the building and were exposed to 100rad (1Gy), but suffered no ill effects.[9][10]

October 5, 1966 — INES Level needed - Monroe, Michigan, United States - Partial meltdown

A sodium cooling system malfunction caused a partial meltdown at the Enrico Fermi demonstration nuclear breeder reactor (Enrico Fermi-1 fast breeder reactor). The accident was attributed to a zirconium fragment that obstructed a flow-guide in the sodium cooling system. Two of the 105 fuel assemblies melted during the incident, but no contamination was recorded outside the containment vessel.[11]

Winter 1966-1967 (date unknown) – INES Level needed – location unknown – loss of coolant accident
The Soviet icebreaker Lenin, the USSR’s first nuclear-powered surface ship, suffered a major accident (possibly a meltdown — exactly what happened remains a matter of controversy in the West) in one of its three reactors. To find the leak the crew broke through the concrete and steel radiation shield with sledgehammers, causing irreparable damage. It was rumored that around 30 of the crew were killed. The ship was abandoned for a year to allow radiation levels to drop before the three reactors were removed, to be dumped into the Tsivolko Fjord on the Kara Sea, along with 60% of the fuel elements packed in a separate container. The reactors were replaced with two new ones, and the ship re-entered service in 1970, serving until 1989.

May 1967 — INES Level needed - Dumfries and Galloway, Scotland, United Kingdom - Partial meltdown

Graphite debris partially blocked a fuel channel causing a fuel element to melt and catch fire at the Chapelcross nuclear power station. Contamination was confined to the reactor core. The core was repaired and restarted in 1969, operating until the plant's shutdown in 2004.[12][13]

January 21, 1969 — INES Level needed - Lucens, Canton of Vaud, Switzerland - Explosion

A total loss of coolant led to a power excursion and explosion of an experimental nuclear reactor in a large cave at Lucens. The underground location of this reactor acted like a containment building and prevented any outside contamination. The cavern was heavily contaminated and was sealed. No injuries or fatalities resulted.[14][15]

[edit] 1970s

December 7, 1975 – INES Level 3 - Greifswald, Germany (then East Germany) - Partly damaged

Operators disabled three of six cooling pumps' electrical supply circuits to test emergency shutoffs. Instead of the expected automatic shutdown, a fourth pump failed causing excessive heating which damaged ten fuel rods. The accident was attributed to sticky relay contacts and generally poor construction in the Soviet-built reactor.[16]

February 22, 1977 – INES Level 4 - Jaslovské Bohunice, Czechoslovakia - Fuel damaged

Operators neglected to remove moisture-absorbing materials from a fuel rod assembly before loading it into the KS 150 reactor at power plant A-1. The accident resulted in damaged fuel integrity, extensive corrosion damage of fuel cladding and release of radioactivity into the plant area. The affected reactor was decommissioned following this accident.[17]

March 28, 1979 – INES Level 5[citation needed] - Middletown, Dauphin County, Pennsylvania, United States - Partial meltdown

Equipment failures and worker mistakes contributed to a loss of coolant and a partial core meltdown at the Three Mile Island Nuclear Generating Station 15 km (9 miles) southeast of Harrisburg. While the reactor was extensively damaged, on-site radiation exposure was under 100 millirems (less than annual exposure due to natural sources). Area residents received a smaller exposure of 1 millirem (10 µSv), or about 1/3 the dose from eating a banana per day for one year. There were no fatalities. Follow-up radiological studies predict between zero and one long-term cancer fatality.[18][19][20]

See also: Three Mile Island accident

[edit] 1980s

March 13, 1980 - INES Level 4 - Orléans, France - Nuclear materials leak

A brief power excursion in Reactor A2 led to a rupture of fuel bundles and a minor release (8 x 1010 Bq) of nuclear materials at the Saint-Laurent Nuclear Power Plant. The reactor was repaired and continued operation until its decommissioning in 1992.[21]

March, 1981 — INES Level 2 - Tsuruga, Japan - Radioactive materials released into Sea of Japan + Overexposure of workers

More than 100 workers were exposed to doses of up to 155 millirem per day radiation during repairs of the Tsuruga Nuclear Power Plant, violating the Japan Atomic Power Company's limit of 100 millirems (1 mSv) per day.[22]

January 25, 1982 - INES Level unknown - Ontario, New York - Radioactive materials released

A steam pipe burst at the Ginna Nuclear Generating Station, resulting in a loss of coolant and gasses were intentionally vented to the atmosphere to reduce risks of explosion.

September 23, 1983 — INES Level 4 - Buenos Aires, Argentina - Accidental criticality

An operator error during a fuel plate reconfiguration in an experimental test reactor led to an excursion of 3×1017 fissions at the RA-2 facility. The operator absorbed 2000 rad (20 Gy) of gamma and 1700 rad (17 Gy) of neutron radiation which killed him two days later. Another 17 people outside of the reactor room absorbed doses ranging from 35 rad (0.35 Gy) to less than 1 rad (0.01 Gy).[23] pg103[24]

April 26, 1986 — INES Level 7 - Prypiat, Ukraine (then USSR) - Power excursion, explosion, complete meltdown

An inadequate reactor safety system[25] led to an uncontrolled power excursion, causing a severe steam explosion, meltdown and release of radioactive material at the Chernobyl nuclear power plant located approximately 100 kilometers north-northwest of Kiev. Approximately fifty fatalities (mostly cleanup personnel) resulted from the accident and the immediate aftermath. An additional nine fatal cases of thyroid cancer in children in the Chernobyl area have been attributed to the accident. The explosion and combustion of the graphite reactor core spread radioactive material over much of Europe. 100,000 people were evacuated from the areas immediately surrounding Chernobyl in addition to 300,000 from the areas of heavy fallout in Ukraine, Belarus and Russia. An "Exclusion Zone" was created surrounding the site encompassing approximately 1,000 mi² (3,000 km²) and deemed off-limits for human habitation for an indefinite period. Several studies by governments, UN agencies and environmental groups have estimated the consequences and eventual number of casualties. Their findings are subject to controversy.

See also: Chernobyl disaster

May 4, 1986 – INES Level needed - Hamm-Uentrop, Germany (then West Germany) - Fuel damaged

A spherical fuel pebble became lodged in the pipe used to deliver fuel elements to the reactor at an experimental 300-megawatt THTR-300 HTGR. Attempts by an operator to dislodge the fuel pebble damaged its cladding, releasing radiation detectable up to two kilometers from the reactor.[26]

October 19, 1989 – INES Level 3 - Vandellos Nuclear Power Plant, Spain -fire in one of its two turbogenerators

After the fire in the turbogenerators the Spanish comission determined a large list of issues in the plant that was closed by the owners due to economical unviability.

[edit] 1990s

April 6, 1993 — INES Level 4 - Tomsk, Russia - Explosion

A pressure buildup led to an explosive mechanical failure in a 34 cubic meter stainless steel reaction vessel buried in a concrete bunker under building 201 of the radiochemical works at the Tomsk-7 Siberian Chemical Enterprise plutonium reprocessing facility. The vessel contained a mixture of concentrated nitric acid, uranium (8757 kg), plutonium (449 g) along with a mixture of radioactive and organic waste from a prior extraction cycle. The explosion dislodged the concrete lid of the bunker and blew a large hole in the roof of the building, releasing approximately 6 GBq of Pu 239 and 30 TBq of various other radionuclides into the environment. The contamination plume extended 28 km NE of building 201, 20 km beyond the facility property. The small village of Georgievka (pop. 200) was at the end of the fallout plume, but no fatalities, illnesses or injuries were reported. The accident exposed 160 on-site workers and almost two thousand cleanup workers to total doses of up to 50 mSv (the threshold limit for radiation workers is 100 mSv per 5 years).[27][28][29]

June, 1999 — INES Level 2[30] - Ishikawa Prefecture, Japan - Control rod malfunction

Operators attempting to insert one control rod during an inspection neglected procedure and instead withdrew three causing a 15 minute uncontrolled sustained reaction at the number 1 reactor of Shika Nuclear Power Plant. The Hokuriku Electric Company who owned the reactor did not report this incident and falsified records, covering it up until March, 2007.[31]

September 30, 1999 — INES Level 4 - Ibaraki Prefecture, Japan - Accidental criticality

Inadequately trained part-time workers prepared a uranyl nitrate solution containing about 16.6 kg of uranium, which exceeded the critical mass, into a precipitation tank at a uranium reprocessing facility in Tokai-mura northeast of Tokyo, Japan. The tank was not designed to dissolve this type of solution and was not configured to prevent eventual criticality. Three workers were exposed to (neutron) radiation doses in excess of allowable limits. Two of these workers died. 116 other workers received lesser doses of 1 mSv or greater though not in excess of the allowable limit.[32][33][34][35]

See also: Tokaimura nuclear accident

[edit] 2000s

April 10, 2003 — INES Level 3 - Paks, Hungary - Fuel damaged

Partially spent fuel rods undergoing cleaning in a tank of heavy water ruptured and spilled fuel pellets at Paks Nuclear Power Plant. It is suspected that inadequate cooling of the rods during the cleaning process combined with a sudden influx of cold water thermally shocked fuel rods causing them to split. Boric acid was added to the tank to prevent the loose fuel pellets from achieving criticality. Ammonia and hydrazine were also added to absorb iodine-131.[36]

April 19, 2005 — INES Level 3 - Sellafield, England, United Kingdom - Nuclear material leak

20 metric tons of uranium and 160 kilograms of plutonium dissolved in 83,000 litres of nitric acid leaked over several months from a cracked pipe into a stainless steel sump chamber at the Thorp nuclear fuel reprocessing plant. The partially processed spent fuel was drained into holding tanks outside the plant.[37][38]

November 2005 — INES Level needed - Braidwood, Illinois, United States - Nuclear material leak

Tritium contamination of groundwater was discovered at Exelon's Braidwood station. Groundwater off site remains within safe drinking standards though the NRC is requiring the plant to correct any problems related to the release.[39]

March 6, 2006 — INES Level 2[40] - Erwin, Tennessee, United States - Nuclear material leak

Thirty-five litres of a highly enriched uranium solution leaked during transfer into a lab at Nuclear Fuel Services Erwin Plant. The incident caused a seven-month shutdown. A required public hearing on the licensing of the plant was not held due to the absence of public notification.[41][42][43][44]

[edit] 2010s
See also: Timeline of the Fukushima nuclear accidents

March 11-20, 2011 - INES Level 5[45] , previously 4[46] or higher (6[47][48][49] as of March 15 according to Andre-Claude Lacoste, president of France's nuclear safety authority. It is not an official rating[50])
Fukushima I Nuclear Power Plant, Japan - Overheating, explosions, fire, radioactivity emergency

Main article: Fukushima I nuclear accidents

After the 2011 Tōhoku earthquake and tsunami of March 11, the emergency power supply of the Fukushima-Daiichi nuclear power plant failed. This was followed by deliberate releases of radioactive gas from reactors 1 and 2 to relieve pressure. On March 12, triggered by falling water levels, a hydrogen explosion occurred at reactor 1, resulting in the collapse of the concrete outer structure.[51][52][53][54][55] Although the reactor containment itself was confirmed to be intact,[56][57][58] the hourly radiation from the plant reached 1,015 microsievert (0.1015 rem) - an amount equivalent to that allowable for ordinary people in one year."[59][60] Residents of the Fukushima area were advised to stay inside, close doors and windows, turn off air conditioning, and to cover their mouths with masks, towels or handkerchiefs as well as not to drink tap water.[61] By the evening of March 12, the exclusion zone had been extended to 20 kilometres (12 mi) around the plant[62] and 70,000 to 80,000 people had been evacuated from homes in northern Japan.[63] A second, nearly identical hydrogen explosion occured in the reactor building for Unit 3 on March 14, with similar effects.[64] A third explosion in the “pressure suppression room” of Unit 2[65] initially was said not to have breached the reactor’s inner steel containment vessel,[66] but later reports indicated that the explosion damaged the steel containment structure of Unit 2 and much larger releases of radiation were expected than previously.[65]
Disposed rods of reactor Unit 4 were stored outside the reactor in a separate pool which ran dry, yielding fire and risk of serious contamination.[67]
Staff was brought down from 800 Fukishima, who have been named the "Fukishima 50" by the press.[67] Events are still developing.

March 11-13, 2011 - INES Level 3[68], Fukushima II Nuclear Power Plant, Japan - Overheating, possible radioactivity emergency

After the 2011 Tōhoku earthquake and tsunami of March 11, the cooling systems for three reactors (numbers 1, 2 and 4) of the Fukushima-Daini nuclear power plant were compromised due to damage from the tsunami.[69] Nuclear Engineering International reported that all four units were successfully automatically shut down, but emergency diesel generators at the site were Damaged by the 9.2 magnitude earthquake[70] People were evacuated around 10 kilometres (6.2 mi) from the plant. An evacuation order was issued, because of possible radioactive contamination.

Good list. Is there a point to it?

[Agloco]

Your a scientist you should be able to stomach a photo of a radiation victim. Or did you skip that class?

Irrelevant. Your pictures still make no sense given the information at hand. Try again.



If you think by me posting on the fly is a sign I am heated you have allot to learn about me pal.

I'm sure that you're a barrel of laughs in person.




I guess this is further evidence your here for shits and giggles and to push peoples buttons?

Looking in the mirror as you posted this? :lol


If you can find humor in my postings then you wasted your time going to Darwin....errrr I meant Science academy you should be a talent scout for SNL.

Actually, I find them to be macabre and laden with cynicism. Especially the ones with pictures.


I am sure your chicken little poster will be a huge hit.

http://images.fanpop.com/images/image_uploads/Stuart-Little-movies-72582_1024_768.jpg

Better?

[mouse]

Good list. Is there a point to it?


Yes Mr. Scientist there is. Maybe you and your slide rule can figure it out.


http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/vlcsnap-1605731.png

[mouse]

What would those prove? That I own a cool looking lab jacket and pocket protector?

If you have to have your arm twisted to post a pic of yourself that alone speaks volumes.

Maybe you can photoshop yourself sitting next to someone of the opposite sex so I don't feel so awkward with you stalking me.


Try looking at my prior posts in this thread. Those speak for themselves.


I will later tonight when I need help trying to fall asleep

I know your style, allot of book smarts .....your just lacking in common sense.




My PM is open to anyone who has questions

Are you single, whats your favorite color?


What warning?

What dangers lie ahead?


lol Jack Lemmon

I was hoping you got that one. (you do know the reference?)




Just be grateful that I haven't begun citing any journal articles. The shit is really gonna hit the fan then.

Hey all BS aside I debate to maybe learn and thing or two and help educate. It's about time you do the same brah!


Oh, and people are being exposed to deadly radiation. Helping them is gonna require a lot more sunscreen than I can afford though.

You know you shouldn't downplay radiation no matter how small and the source take this shit serious dude.




MIT? That explains a lot.

Hey I go into it 3 days after I arrived. If not for a gay professor who was tight with members of the board I woulds have had to provide better test scores and GPO.

I really stayed because I was getting laid and i had a sweet speed/crank connection in San Antonio. I mainly hung out with the reverse engineering club, the evil one the ones who "break the rules/laws"

You don't know what fun is until you take apart an Apple II with a room full of pot and a fridge full of beer.


Sooooo, educate me. What am I missing here?

Well lets do the math........


Japan has explosion at the Nuclear power plant. I tell you and others it's serious you tell them its not

Later they say its serious. I say they need to bury it in lead and cement, you said they don't need to. They come out and say that is what they are going to do.

I said the radiation will spread throughout America and that

food and milk will show up radiation in the next three weeks. you and others say I am a retard now the News is backing my claims.

I would say my batting average is up there. How about you tell me about the DU used in desert storm.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllen-Radiataion.jpg

[mouse]

Irrelevant. Your pictures still make no sense given the information at hand. Try again.

If you find them in bad taste I will remove them but don't say they are Irrelevant. they show radiation damage this is a radiation topic.




I'm sure that you're a barrel of laughs in person.

So then roll out the barrel.




Looking in the mirror as you posted this? :lol

And I see the man in the mirror.





Actually, I find them to be macabre and laden with cynicism. Especially the ones with pictures.

macabre? are you serious? Are you wearing a red turtleneck sweater with a pipe in your mouth while sipping hot tea?

Don't worry i have nothing against you Shepperd's pie eating britt's.



Better?

my screen name is a pc mouse not a rodent. If you went to the last Home brew meeting you would know that esse!

[Wild Cobra]

Mouse, the more words you try to use, the less you make sense.

Maybe you should stick to conspiracy theories. You understand them better than real science.

[mouse]

Mouse, the more words you try to use, the less you make sense.

Maybe you should stick to conspiracy theories. You understand them better than real science.

That was weak dude, at least show some effort and try to prove me wrong or pull out your slide rule and paste some shit. I told your taint sniffing ass two weeks ago the food will be contaminated and your inbred ass laughed, now you don't have the almonds to give me props? read more post less.


BTW where did Professor Whoopee run off to?
I had a question about Desert Storm.

[The Reckoning]

hey mouse i know you love some documentaries...

watch this and let me know how you feel about it

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/discovering-ardi-ardipithecus-ramidus/

[ChumpDumper]

Radiation is dangerous, but the amount of attention paid to that issue is blown out of proportion considering the tens of thousands that died from the tsunami.Are there tsunami currently occurring in Japan?

[Wild Cobra]

That was weak dude, at least show some effort and try to prove me wrong or pull out your slide rule and paste some shit. I told your taint sniffing ass two weeks ago the food will be contaminated and your inbred ass laughed, now you don't have the almonds to give me props? read more post less.

I wouldn't call those levels contamination.

[Agloco]

BTW where did Professor Whoopee run off to?
I had a question about Desert Storm.

I'm here. Fire away. No pun intended.

[Agloco]

If you find them in bad taste I will remove them but don't say they are Irrelevant. they show radiation damage this is a radiation topic.

They distort the reality of the current situation and inspire undue panic. I'd rather you leave them up so that everyone reading can know exactly what you're about.


macabre? are you serious? Are you wearing a red turtleneck sweater with a pipe in your mouth while sipping hot tea?

Don't worry i have nothing against you Shepperd's pie eating britt's.

A serious as a Fukushima radiation leak......

I'm not a brit btw. I do like tea and shepperds pie though. :tu


my screen name is a pc mouse not a rodent. If you went to the last Home brew meeting you would know that esse!

Ahhhh yes, I'm not in with your clique. Perhaps that why you're having a hard time acknowledging my point of view?

[Agloco]

If you have to have your arm twisted to post a pic of yourself that alone speaks volumes.

Maybe you can photoshop yourself sitting next to someone of the opposite sex so I don't feel so awkward with you stalking me.

Don't flatter yourself.




I will later tonight when I need help trying to fall asleep

I know your style, allot of book smarts .....your just lacking in common sense.


As opposed to not having any book smarts on this matter as well as lacking common sense? :lol

Oh, I also recommend a couple of cookies and a glass of West Coast milk to help you sleep.



Are you single, whats your favorite color?

Married, Blue



I was hoping you got that one. (you do know the reference?)


I got it, hence the :lol



Hey all BS aside I debate to maybe learn and thing or two and help educate. It's about time you do the same brah!

I never maintained to know it all. If you have some credible info which leads you to post those pictures, I'm all ears. Thus far, we haven't seen any. It's idle speculation.


You know you shouldn't downplay radiation no matter how small and the source take this shit serious dude.

Who's downplaying it? I recommended you go back and look at my previous posts. My angle is one of cautious observation due to the lack of reliable info coming out of Japan. Besides that, all I did was to offer perspective.


You don't know what fun is until you take apart an Apple II with a room full of pot and a fridge full of beer.

I'll be sure to PM you the next time I run across one. My life suddenly feels emptier.


Well lets do the math........

And this is at the heart of the matter. You haven't done any, and I strongly suspect you never will.

So there's I-131 in milk on the West coast? Why don't you calculate the exposure from drinking a pint for us? No? It would really help your argument if you could back your speculation with some numbers or ground truths.



Japan has explosion at the Nuclear power plant. I tell you and others it's serious you tell them its not

Later they say its serious. I say they need to bury it in lead and cement, you said they don't need to. They come out and say that is what they are going to do.

Congrats on being on the correct side of a 50/50 call. Just as so many before you, now you know more more than the people on scene while having based your conclusion on nothing concrete.




I said the radiation will spread throughout America and that

food and milk will show up radiation in the next three weeks. you and others say I am a retard now the News is backing my claims.

Same as above. Perhaps you can shed some light on the significance. Try to do this without inundating us with more DU-baby pictures and fancy glowing milk advertisements. If you could please leave out the inaccurate dose maps, that would be great too.


I would say my batting average is up there. How about you tell me about the DU used in desert storm.

I'd say your batting average is 1.000 based on the two arguments above. Your accuracy in portraying the situation as we know it to be now is 0.

What info can I share with you about U-238?

[Wild Cobra]

Mouse...

You just don't realize, you're being eaten alive. Do you?

[Cry Havoc]

while having based your conclusion on nothing concrete.

I see what you did there.

[mouse]

What info can I share with you about U-238?

Tell me why you haven't put your education to good use and maybe support the troops infected with DU?



http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/th_MAllenArt-radiation.jpg (http://s125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/?action=view&current=MAllenArt-radiation.mp4)

[Agloco]

I see what you did there.

Shhhhh. :lol

[Agloco]

Tell me why you haven't put your education to good use and maybe support the troops infected with DU?

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/th_MAllenArt-radiation.jpg (http://s125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/?action=view&current=MAllenArt-radiation.mp4)

We have. Some of my colleagues have dedicated much research time into the deleterious effects of U-238. A man by the name of Dr. Gunther authored a book in 1996 on the matter as well. I worked with one of the groups that collaborated with him on that project. I don't believe it's available in the US though. Surprise, surprise.

It's a terrible thing really. Leaving nuclear waste in and around civilian areas is unethical IMO. I don't believe I'd find anyone who works in my field that would disagree.

If you understand the molecular genesis of cancer, you understand why effective treatments are slow in coming. Most of my research is aimed at unlocking the molecular events which initiate neoplastic transformations. Look here:

http://img1.wantitall.co.za/images/ShowImage.aspx?ImageId=The-Molecular-Basis-of-Cancer-Expert-Consult-Online-and-Print|51MenQNvZCL.jpg

You can pop into the UTHSCSA library and read a few pages. Don't take my word for it, start learning. Beware though, I did help with the editing of a few of the chapters in this text.

Or try this one:

http://www.chipsbooks.com/undcarcn.jpg

Most students find it to be a good read.

If you're really serious, I'll sit down with you personally and explain the finer points. I have patents who grill me on a daily basis, and they should leave no stone unturned.

But why post pictures that show those U-238 after effects in between dialogue pertaining to the Japanese situation? That's my beef.

[mouse]

Great links and info. To bad instead of joining me in educating the milk drinkers in this forum you rather talk smack.


http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllentArt-Radiation/th_MAllenArt-radiation-6.jpg (http://s125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllentArt-Radiation/?action=view&current=MAllenArt-radiation-6.mp4)

[mouse]

hey mouse i know you love some documentaries...

watch this and let me know how you feel about it

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/discovering-ardi-ardipithecus-ramidus/

Thanks doing so now.

:wakeup

[Agloco]

Great links and info. To bad instead of joining me in educating the milk drinkers in this forum you rather talk smack.


http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllentArt-Radiation/th_MAllenArt-radiation-6.jpg (http://s125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllentArt-Radiation/?action=view&current=MAllenArt-radiation-6.mp4)

Educate away, I'm done boring the masses for now. I'll lurk until someone asks a question. It's your show.......

[mouse]

Educate away, I'm done boring the masses for now. I'll lurk until someone asks a question. It's your show.......


I figured you would bail.....if this was a horn tooting topic you would be posting away.

I will lurk also. Let these lactose educed douche bags figure it out for themselves!


See you in the next Evolution/Bible topic.

:toast

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllentArt-Radiation/th_MallenArt-radiation-2.jpg (http://s125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllentArt-Radiation/?action=view&current=MallenArt-radiation-2.mp4)

[RandomGuy]

Thanks doing so now.

:wakeup

Do also let us know when you get done reading the introductory textbook that was given to you on the subject as well.

Classic mouse. :toast

[DarrinS]

Are there tsunami currently occurring in Japan?


There are still thousands of dead bodies laying around, but none from radiation.

[ChumpDumper]

There are still thousands of dead bodies laying around, but none from radiation.
You didn't answer the question.

Are there tsunami currently occurring in Japan?

[DarrinS]

You didn't answer the question.

Are there tsunami currently occurring in Japan?


No. Do all the tsunami-related problems go away when the tsunami is over?

[admiralsnackbar]

No. Do all the tsunami-related problems go away when the tsunami is over?
Not as much as they get they dwarfed by the lingering prospect of a nuclear disaster with global implications.

[DarrinS]

Not as much as they get they dwarfed by the lingering prospect of a nuclear disaster with global implications.


The death toll by sea water and debris may reach 100K, but go ahead and worry about your milk. :lmao

[ChumpDumper]

No.Finally. No reason to be such a pussy.
Do all the tsunami-related problems go away when the tsunami is over?The nuclear power plant problems are tsunami-related.

Way to kick your own ass. :tu

[DarrinS]

finally. No reason to be such a pussy.

The nuclear power plant problems are tsunami-related.

Way to kick your own ass. :tu


100k > 0

[ChumpDumper]

100k > 0You already explained why the tsunami related nuclear problems are news.

Thanks.

[mouse]

There are still thousands of dead bodies laying around, but none from radiation.

So everything is a body count to you?

I guess in the warped world you live in DWI is much worst than child molestation since one kills more people than the other?

If your so cocky about about what is less damaging... then, here's a challenge, meet me in person and I will bring a pint of west coast Milk you to drink it and in return I will swim in the ocean to see who dies first.

deal, or no deal?


http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/raditation-mouse-milk.gif

[mouse]

such a pussy.
Way to kick your own ass. :tu


^ This is old school 1999 Jim Rome smack chat forum style of comebacks!


Rack!

:toast

[Agloco]

If your so cocky about about what is less damaging... then, here's a challenge, meet me in person and I will bring a pint of west coast Milk you to drink it and in return I will swim in the ocean to see who dies first.

:lol

[DarrinS]

So everything is a body count to you?

I guess in the warped world you live in DWI is much worst than child molestation since one kills more people than the other?

If your so cocky about about what is less damaging... then, here's a challenge, meet me in person and I will bring a pint of west coast Milk you to drink it and in return I will swim in the ocean to see who dies first.

deal, or no deal?




Levels that are 5000x below levels of concern set by the FDA, including levels set for infants and children?

I smoke, work in the sun from time to time, and eat bananas. Color me unafraid.

Maybe you and chump can spoon together for comfort.

[DarrinS]

^ This is old school 1999 Jim Rome smack chat forum style of comebacks!


Rack!

:toast


Nah, it's just evidence that someone is washed up and has no creativity. At least your shtick is half-assed amusing.

[DarrinS]

A SANE take by the Australians.

v8wKbpsw-OE

[mouse]

Levels that are 5000x below levels of concern set by the FDA,


FDA? the same people who allowed Jack N The box to use tainted meat? or the FDA that allowed growth hormones in milk?

3SXVpvgXo9Q

I rather you support the CIA.

[DarrinS]

FDA? the same people who allowed Jack N The box to use tainted meat? or the FDA that allowed growth hormones in milk?

3SXVpvgXo9Q

I rather you support the CIA.


:whine

[mouse]

:whine

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/mouse-lives.jpg

[Wild Cobra]

But why post pictures that show those U-238 after effects in between dialogue pertaining to the Japanese situation? That's my beef.
No kidding. I agree.

My understanding is that U238, like many other particulate debris, is most harmful in a very fine dust when inhaled. U238 has the unique added problem in that it is relatively slightly radioactive, compared to other radioactive materials. The dust can stay in the lungs without being scrubbed out with a cyanide based heavy metal cleanser.

Now am I right that the dust of it is more harmful than the radioactivity? There would definitely be radioactivity limits as well, but when a DU round does it job on armor... there is metallic dust in the air everywhere, till it settles.

[Wild Cobra]

There are still thousands of dead bodies laying around, but none from radiation.
I forget the confirmed deaths and missing, but remember the total is about 28,000 between the two.

[jack sommerset]

I forget the confirmed deaths and missing, but remember the total is about 28,000 between the two.

What about the "meltdown"? How many peeps dies from that so far?

[Wild Cobra]

Mouse, we know all about the health effects of hormones on cows. As a consumer, you have the ability to buy milk labeled "no rstb's used," or what ever that term is. You own link says only about 255 of the dairy production uses these hormones.

Give it a break Chicken Little.

[Wild Cobra]

What about the "meltdown"? How many peeps dies from that so far?
As far as I know, it's like you said.

ZERO!

[mouse]

Give it a break Chicken Little.

So you prefer a large Cock?

[mouse]

As far as I know!

Catch phrase on the Politics forum.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/raditation-mouse-milk.gif

[mouse]

I wonder if Wild Cold Brah would make a good babysitter.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/reactor-leak.jpg

[Wild Cobra]

So you prefer a large Cock?
No thanx, I already have the one attached to me.

[Agloco]

No kidding. I agree.

My understanding is that U238, like many other particulate debris, is most harmful in a very fine dust when inhaled. U238 has the unique added problem in that it is relatively slightly radioactive, compared to other radioactive materials. The dust can stay in the lungs without being scrubbed out with a cyanide based heavy metal cleanser.

Now am I right that the dust of it is more harmful than the radioactivity? There would definitely be radioactivity limits as well, but when a DU round does it job on armor... there is metallic dust in the air everywhere, till it settles.

Both U238 and U235 are pure alpha emitters, and therefore not harmful unless ingested or inhaled. I've held U235 in my hands before, it's warm and glows a bit in low light. The problem begins when it's taken into the body. As you said, particulate matter is created from the impact of those U238 rounds on armor, as well as oxidation due to the fact that uranium is pyrophoric. Those dust particles contain sufficient amounts of DU to create a major health hazard, settling into the lungs and eventually causing all manner of damage. It's alpha radiation too which means that the relative biologic effect will be 20x greater than an equivalent dose of gammas or betas (it's densely ionizing). The amount of damage overwhelms the cellular DNA repair mechanisms, and the cells which manage to survive pass on DNA which is badly damaged. Bad bad stuff.

Smokers should take heed as well. You're getting alpha radiation in your lungs too in the form of lead 210 and polonium 210. (around the equivalent of 300+ chest x-rays per year). :tu

[mouse]

Both U238 and U235 are pure alpha emitters, I've held U235 in my hands before,:tu

Don't take it personal if I don't shake your hand when we meet.:toast

Ps: Great job educating Loud Cobra the man runs around insulting others without taking in any info many of us post.

You think after this radiation topic dies down you can maybe help educate him on 9/11 or the true age of the earth?

[Agloco]

Don't take it personal if I don't shake your hand when we meet.:toast

I'd be crushed. Would you hug me instead?


You think after this radiation topic dies down you can maybe help educate him on 9/11 or the true age of the earth?

Can't wait to see what you think about those. :toast

[Wild Cobra]

Ps: Great job educating Loud Cobra the man runs around insulting others without taking in any info many of us post.
Educating me? I already knew that.

FYI... I spend 6 years supporting the nuclear weapons theater in Europe. If you recall, on past threads, I was never very concerned about DU, and the pyrophoric nature is why it makes great armor piercing rounds.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x262/Wild_Cobra/military/M900.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x262/Wild_Cobra/military/Sabot_separating.gif

A buddy of mine at work used to work on submarine nuclear reactors.

You think after this radiation topic dies down you can maybe help educate him on 9/11 or the true age of the earth?
LOL...

Whatever...

[hater]

As far as I know, it's like you said.

ZERO!

Best case scenario:
some of the workers will eventually die of radiation exposure...

Worst case scenario:
nobody knows yet how many ppl could eventually die

[Cry Havoc]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/04/05/japan.nuclear.reactors/index.html?hpt=T1

Radiation in water rushing into sea tests millions of times over limit

okyo (CNN) -- Japanese utility and government authorities suffered fresh setbacks Tuesday with the detection of radiation in a fish and news that water gushing from the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant into the Pacific had radiation levels more than millions of times above the regulatory limit.

Readings from samples taken Saturday in the concrete pit outside the turbine building of the plant's No. 2 reactor -- one of six at the crisis-plagued plant -- had radiation 7.5 million times the legal limits, said an official with the Tokyo Electric Power Company, which runs the plant. Newer findings, from Tuesday afternoon, showed a slight drop to 5 million times the norm.

The utility company also noted Tuesday that the radiation levels diminished sharply a few dozen meters from the leak, consistent with their assessment that the spill might have a minimal effect on sealife. But even in these spots, radiation levels remained several hundred-thousand times the legal limit.

The entire issued underlined that getting a grip on how to minimize the amount of radiation in the Pacific Ocean is the new, primary battlefront in the weeks-long crisis at the nuclear plant.

About the same time as the Tokyo Electric news, Japanese Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano said the presence of radioactive iodine "in one sample of fresh fish" prompted authorities to regulate the radiation in seafood for the first time.

While fishing has been forbidden within 20 kilometers (12 miles) of Fukushima Daiichi, there had been no restrictions on seafood, as there were for some vegetables and milk from certain locales. Now, the same radiation standards that apply to vegetables will apply to ocean products as well.

"The "provisional ingestion limit, equivalent to vegetables and applied to fish and shellfish, will take effect immediately," the Cabinet minister said.

Earlier Tuesday, Edano apologized for the decision to intentionally dump 11,500 tons of radioactive water into the sea -- all part of the effort to curb the flow of the more toxic liquid spotted days ago rushing from outside the No. 2 unit.

The process of expelling contaminated water in the plant's water treatment facility and around several of its reactors began Monday and will take five days, a Tokyo Electric official said.

"The water contains a high level of radiation," Edano said of the liquid being dumped into the Pacific. "We are sorry for this decision we have to make."

The most contaminated batches of this water comes from outside the No. 6 reactor, likely having gotten in via groundwater (and not a breach in the unit itself), officials said. It has a concentration of iodine-131 that would be 100 times more than the maximum amount of tap water that infants could drink, and 10 times more than what would be OK in food.

Overall, the dump equates to about 3 million gallons, notes Gary Was, a nuclear engineering professor from the University of Michigan.

Yet Hidehiko Nishiyama, an official with Japan's nuclear and industrial safety agency, said, "We've decided that discharging the contaminated water into the sea poses no major health hazard."

Experts say this is a fair assessment, given the likelihood the contamination should quickly dilute, especially if the tainted material is largely iodine-131, which loses half its radiation every eight days.

"To put this in perspective, the Pacific Ocean holds about 300 trillion swimming pools full of water, and they are going to release about five swimming pools full," said Timothy Jorgensen, chair of the radiation safety committee at Georgetown University Medical Center. "So hopefully the churning of the ocean and the currents will quickly disperse this so that it gets to very dilute concentrations relatively quickly."

John Till, president of the South Carolina-based Risk Assessment Corp., said he does not expect to see any permanent effects on marine life, even close to the plant. However, he added that officials should monitor radiation levels closely -- in the ocean as well as in seafood that reach restaurants and markets.

One piece of good news, according to Japanese government reports, is that airborne radiation appears to be steadily falling around northeast Japan. Two measures from 15 kilometers or less from the plant showed amounts of radioactive iodine-131 at between 2 and 3.7 times the legal standard, with levels of a far longer-lasting cesium isotope well below the official limit.

Also, utility and government officials have described conditions recently in the Fukushima Daiichi plant's reactors and spent nuclear fuel pools as generally stable. There have been exceptions -- like the new need to pump 3-meter deep water from a drain outside the Nos. 5 and 6 units for fear it could rise, enter nearby turbine buildings and short out power for the units' nuclear fuel cooling systems. But such problems aren't occuring at the same pace, or with the same apparent severity, as was evident weeks ago.

The top priority, however, is stopping the water that's been gushing directly into the Pacific through a cracked concrete shaft outside the No. 2 reactor.

Edano said Monday that the decision to dump tainted water from other reactors and the waste water treatment facility was "unavoidable" in order to ensure "the safety" of the No. 2 reactor core.

The idea is to expeditiously pump the tainted water from around the No. 2 reactor's turbine building, lowering levels inside so that water no longer rushes out into the sea, a Japanese nuclear safety official said. This comes after two attempts failed to plug the problematic crack -- one by pouring in concrete, the other using a chemical compound mixed with sawdust and newspaper.

Reactors No. 1 and No. 3, which have lower levels of water, need to be drained as well. Tokyo Electric's plan is to pump that water to other storage tanks, including some that still need to be set up. Water in and around the Nos. 5 and 6 reactors are being jettisoned directly in the sea, officials said.

Another big problem may be that authorities still don't know how exactly the gushing water got contaminated, where it came from, or how to fix potential leaks and cracks deep inside the reactor complex and nuclear fuel.

Michael Friedlander, a former senior U.S. nuclear engineer, said late Monday that authorities will continue to have problems related to excess, radioactive water -- and the need to dump some of it -- as long as they inject huge amounts in to prevent fuel rods from overheating in reactors' cores and spent fuel pools.

"This is not a one-off deal," Friedlander said of dumping adioactive water into the ocean. "This issue of water and water management is going to plague them until they can get (fully operating) long-term core cooling."

----

Horrible. We won't know the true impact of this event for quite some time.

[hater]

Japan raising fish legal radiation limit

what's the point of having a limit if you gonna raise it when there is a nuclear crisis :lol

[Cry Havoc]

Japan raising fish legal radiation limit

what's the point of having a limit if you gonna raise it when there is a nuclear crisis :lol

Maybe there's a shorter half-life than expected? I dunno. Shady either way. Japan has not handled this crisis well. Of course, they're doing a lot better than we did with Katrina, but still.

[CosmicCowboy]

Those are some awfully heavy elements. It seems like they would drop to the ocean bottom fairly quickly (like panning for gold) and create a nasty little dead zone offshore...

[MB20]

:shrug


The idea being contemplated is to lower a silt fence into the water. Silt fences are used in civil engineering projects to prevent the spread of polluted water. The fence is suspended from a float and extends to the seabed like a curtain and is designed to limit the movement of seawater.

The water off the coast of the Fukushima No. 1 plant has a depth of between five to six meters. One idea being considered is to install the fence near the seawater intake from where contaminated water is flowing as well as near embankments that surround the waters off the plant site.

TEPCO also said Monday it had started pouring low-level radioactive water into the sea. The amount of the relatively uncontaminated water is 11,500 tons at the facilities to process wastewater and in the buildings which house the No. 5 and No. 6 reactors at the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant, it added.

The release of the water may affect fish and seaweed near the plant, but TEPCO officials explain that eating these on a daily basis will total only as much as one-fourth the amount of radiation that people receive from natural sources.



http://www.asahi.com/english/TKY201104040141.html

[Agloco]

Since most folks are now interested in the seawater concentration, I've attached a link to the pdf which shows how and where the water is being sampled.

http://www.jaif.or.jp/english/news_images/pdf/ENGNEWS01_1302167890P.pdf

It should be noted that the final graph is logarithmic, that is, every vertical line is a multiple of ten.

I've also attached a pdf link of the air kerma (dose rates) in the affected area.

http://www.jaif.or.jp/english/news_images/pdf/ENGNEWS01_1302144863P.pdf

And finally some specifics on the recators themselves including the exact readings obtained from the concrete pit of Reactor 2.

http://www.jaif.or.jp/english/news_images/pdf/ENGNEWS01_1302175357P.pdf

Some notes:


Radiation dose higher than 1000 mSv was measured at the surface of water accumulated on the basement of Unit 2 turbine building and in the tunnel for laying piping outside the building on Mar. 27th.

Plutonium was detected from the soil sampled at Fukushima Dai-ichi NPS site on Mar. 21st, 22nd, 25th and 28th. The amount is so small that the Pu is not harmful to human body.

Radioactive materials exceeding the regulatory limit have been detected from seawater sample collected in the sea surrounding the Fukushima Dai-ichi NPS since Mar. 21st.

On Apr. 5th, 7.5 million times the legal limit of radioactive iodine, I-131, was detected from the seawater, which had been sampled near the water intake of Unit 2 on Apr. 2nd.

It was found on Apr. 2nd that there was highly radioactive (more than 1000mSv/hr) water in the concrete pit housing electrical cables and this water was leaking into the sea through cracks on the concrete wall. It was confirmed on Apr. 6th that the leakage of water stopped after injecting a hardening agent into holes drilled around the pit. Release of some 10,000 tons of low level radioactive wastewater into the sea began on Apr. 4th, in order to make room for the highly radioactive water mentioned above.

Regarding the influence of the low level radioactive waste release, TEPCO evaluated that eating fish and seaweed caught near the plant every day for a year would add some 25% of the dose that the general pubic receive from the environment for a year.

[“bright and shiny”]

According to Wild Cobra the future of Japan is looking "Bright"

:)

[Wild Cobra]

According to Wild Cobra the future of Japan is looking "Bright"

:)
We have one area that might glow, but the rest of the nation should be fine.

[mouse]

We have one area that might glow, but the rest of the nation should be fine.


Wild Nobra

You have the nerve to compare Radiation leaking to the USA no worst than eating a banana?

For the love of all that is Holy ...mail me some of that shit your smoking.

:lmao

[Wild Cobra]

For the love of all that is Holy ...mail me some of that shit your smoking.

:lmao
Make a trip to Oregon some time and get some of our native home grown bud.

[Wild Cobra]

Low Concentrations Of Radiation Found In Mass. (http://www.thebostonchannel.com/r-video/27338488/detail.html)

[mouse]

Make a trip to Oregon some time and get some of our native home grown bud.


Dude you live by Mount St. Helens?

[Wild Cobra]

Dude you live by Mount St. Helens?
The drive and walk makes for a nice day trip. It's about 2 hours away. Lived in The Dalles when she blew, had ash on my property.

[mouse]

The reason I ask is I had an old pal I used trade sports cards with back in the 1985-1999 era his AOL name was OldManMuddy he used to post pics of himself by the Mount St. Helens. His stance on radiation was similar to yours.

I was wondering if people in the Mount St. Helens area are desensitized to other dangers in the world due to having to only worry about Mount St. Helens during childhood.

How old was you when it erupted?

[Wild Cobra]

The reason I ask is I had an old pal I used trade sports cards with back in the 1985-1999 era his AOL name was OldManMuddy he used to post pics of himself by the Mount St. Helens. His stance on radiation was similar to yours.

I was wondering if people in the Mount St. Helens area are desensitized to other dangers in the world due to having to only worry about Mount St. Helens during childhood.

How old was you when it erupted?
I was already able to legally buy liquor.

[mouse]

Do you still feel Japan is in no more danger than one of us buying a banana?

[Agloco]

Video of the wall of water hitting Fukushima:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/04/09/japan.nuclear.reactors/index.html?iref=obnetwork

[Wild Cobra]

Do you still feel Japan is in no more danger than one of us buying a banana?
That's not what I said.

I said the levels of radiation we are receiving are not a concern. I don't believe they will be a concern here. Yes, I could be wrong.

I wouldn't want to be too close to the action though.

[Wild Cobra]

Video of the wall of water hitting Fukushima:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/04/09/japan.nuclear.reactors/index.html?iref=obnetwork
Damn...

That's a lot of force.

Looks like the water shot half way up the height of the stack.

[Agloco]

Do you still feel Japan is in no more danger than one of us buying a banana?

Banana peels can be particularly dangerous. Haven't you seen any good cartoons recently?

[Agloco]

And now sadly, a much different tone to this disaster:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/04/12/japan.nuclear.reactors/index.html?hpt=T1


Japan declared the Fukushima Daiichi crisis a Level 7 event on the international system for rating nuclear accidents Tuesday, putting it on par with the 1986 Chernobyl disaster in the former Soviet Union. The top-scale designation was based on the massive release of radioactivity since the accident began, particularly in its early days, and classifies Fukushima Daiichi a "major accident" requiring long-term countermeasures.

:depressed

[MannyIsGod]

It has serious potential to be worse, IMO. Water is a much more efficient transport system than the atmosphere is.

[CosmicCowboy]

One would think that as heavy as those molecules are they will sink to the bottom fairly quickly after being dispersed into the ocean, kind of like dropping a lead sinker. Could end up being a very localized but very hot area off the coast of the plant...

[Agloco]

It has serious potential to be worse, IMO. Water is a much more efficient transport system than the atmosphere is.


One would think that as heavy as those molecules are they will sink to the bottom fairly quickly after being dispersed into the ocean, kind of like dropping a lead sinker. Could end up being a very localized but very hot area off the coast of the plant...

The good part about it being in water is twofold (for humans that is):

1) The ionizing radiation will be more efficiently attenuated. In English that means the "dangerous" radiation zone will be more confined.

2) Alpha radiation doesn't have a chance of being inhaled.

Most all of the dose will come from gamma emitters (I-131, Cs-134, Cs-137, Zr-95, Sr-90, etc). I'll try to locate a source for the exact amounts of each as this will influence the dose rate quite a bit.

While their weights play a prominent role, we also have to consider the solubility of each atom in seawater separately. They're different and it depends largely on the tendency of each to combine into salts, sulfates, etc. For instance, Cs-137 is quite water soluble and that's unfortunate since that's one of the isotopes that you'd like to see settle out.

[MannyIsGod]

No danger of inhalation, a much greater of danger of consumption though. At least I would think.

[Agloco]

No danger of inhalation, a much greater of danger of consumption though. At least I would think.

Absolutely. At least in this scenario you know what product(s) and areas to avoid. That's a bit trickier when it's airborne over a larger area. You may not be able to avoid it at all.

[jack sommerset]

Does anyone know the head count of deaths so far caused by the radiation?

[Agloco]

Does anyone know the eventual head count of deaths caused by the radiation?

This is a much better question actually.

[jack sommerset]

This is a much better question actually.

If you say so. So whats up there. Have not heard much lately. How many folks died already and how many will die. Any clue?

[Agloco]

If you say so. So whats up there. Have not heard much lately. How many folks died already and how many will die. Any clue?

Nope. Only time will tell.

[Wild Cobra]

Does anyone know the head count of deaths so far caused by the radiation?
My understanding from bits and pieces I heard from a local expert is that there are none yet from the radiation. Future cancer predictions are too early until more data is collection.

[boutons_deux]

For some US milk somewhere, I'm seeing this headline many places:

Fukushima Radiation Taints US Milk Supplies At Levels 300% Higher .

[Wild Cobra]

For some US milk somewhere, I'm seeing this headline many places:

Fukushima Radiation Taints US Milk Supplies At Levels 300% Higher .

You would cream your pants. Wouldn't you?

[DarrinS]

Does anyone know the head count of deaths so far caused by the radiation?



Still zero, but the enviro wackos have their fingers crossed.



But, I wouldn't be surprised if the people who have been working at the center of all this will get radiation sickness and probably die earlier than they would have otherwise.

[ChumpDumper]

Still zero, but the enviro wackos have their fingers crossed.



But, I wouldn't be surprised if the people who have been working at the center of all this will get radiation sickness and probably die earlier than they would have otherwise.What a bold prediction.

[mouse]

It has serious potential to be worse, IMO. Water is a much more efficient transport system than the atmosphere is.

About time you saw the light, nice to have you on board! :tu

[mouse]

I wouldn't be surprised if the people who have been working at the center of all this will get radiation sickness and probably die earlier than they would have otherwise.


Didn't you say radiation is no worst than getting a tan or using a cellphone?

[mouse]

That's not what I said.
.

what was your banana theory?

[mouse]

Oh, by the way, this is nothing even remotely close to Chernobyl. What part of that don't YOU understand?

:wakeup

[ManuBalboa]

Hc8SjDLjdTU

[LnGrrrR]

The U.S.-built robot probes measured radiation doses as high as 57 millisieverts inside the housing for reactor No. 3 and up to 49 millisieverts inside the No. 1 reactor building, Japan's Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency reported. Levels found between the double doors of the airlocks of the reactor buildings were much higher -- 270 millisieverts in the case of reactor No. 1 and 170 millsieverts in No. 3, the agency said.

By comparison, the average resident of an industrialized country receives a dose of about 3 millisieverts per year. Emergency standards for plant workers battling the month-old nuclear disaster limit their annual exposure to 250 millisieverts, while a CT scan produces just under 7 and a chest X-ray delivers a one-time dose of about .05 millisieverts.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/04/18/japan.nuclear.reactors/index.html?hpt=T1

[boutons_deux]

Several articles the last couple days were about dozens of US reactors that have been "uprated", supercharged with more radioactive elements or radioactive elements of higher energy. The result is a hotter core and more energy output.

Everybody waves uprating through, of course, until one of these uprated thingies melts and proves that uprating was overrated vs. the $Bs to recover from it and lives lost.

The higher output means the owners make more money.

The failed reactors means the US taxpayers (the insurer) are on the hook while the operator declares bankruptcy and melts away itself.

[RandomGuy]

Where did you get that 200,000 figure from? Greenpeace?


Oh, by the way, this is nothing even remotely close to Chernobyl. What part of that don't YOU understand?

Japan Lifts Atomic Alert to Highest Level, Matching Chernobyl (http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Japan-Lifts-Atomic-Alert-to-bloomberg-2326037179.html?x=0&.v=1)

:lmao

C_Kh7nLplWo

That was just too good to pass up. Sadly Darrin seems not to have mastered the art of important qualifiers like "so far".

[RandomGuy]

Several articles the last couple days were about dozens of US reactors that have been "uprated", supercharged with more radioactive elements or radioactive elements of higher energy. The result is a hotter core and more energy output.

Everybody waves uprating through, of course, until one of these uprated thingies melts and proves that uprating was overrated vs. the $Bs to recover from it and lives lost.

The higher output means the owners make more money.

The failed reactors means the US taxpayers (the insurer) are on the hook while the operator declares bankruptcy and melts away itself.

Pure socialism. The government subsidizing all the risks = socialism.

That is one little tidbit that most nuclear proponents gloss over and hope no one notices.

Everybody here should take a long, hard look at your homeowner policies. Go ahead and get them. I'll wait...










You found it? Good. Now look at the exclusions. Care to guess if you are covered if the local nuclear reactor goes kerflooie?

Surprise! You aren't. Ain't no way in hell any private insurance company is going to touch that risk, no how, no way.

I used to be mildly against nukes, but not anymore. Fuck nuclear power. If you can't make it safe enough to privately insure, you can't make energy economically, and can better put energy dollars elsewhere.

[boutons_deux]

safe nukes? How about just getting construction financing from Wall St? Wall St can get much higher returns, faster, elsewhere.

[mouse]

covered if the local nuclear reactor goes kerflooie?
Surprise! You aren't. Ain't no way in hell any private insurance company is going to touch that risk, no how, no way.
. Fuck nuclear power. .

It's no worst than having a few bananas in you kitchen.

[Winehole23]

The industry ministry's Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency on Monday acknowledged that nuclear fuel rods have melted at the No. 1 to No. 3 reactors of the crippled nuclear power plant in Fukushima Prefecture, northeastern Japan.
http://jen.jiji.com/jc/eng?g=eco&k=2011041900018

[Wild Cobra]

It's no worst than having a few bananas in you kitchen.
Detecting the Nuclear Terrorist (http://www.ara.com/Newsroom_Whatsnew/press_releases/pr_nuclear_terr.html), snippet:


They also detect the radiation that normally occurs in, for example, ceramic tiles, fertilizer, coffee, bananas, or a person who has recently had a medical procedure using radioactive tracers. This results in false alarms that can cause expensive and time-consuming delays at security checkpoints.

[Agloco]

Oh, by the way, this is nothing even remotely close to Chernobyl. What part of that don't YOU understand?

Not yet....

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/bestoftv/2011/04/12/exp.arena.chernobyl.japan.nuclear.cnn.html

[RandomGuy]

Not yet....

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/bestoftv/2011/04/12/exp.arena.chernobyl.japan.nuclear.cnn.html

Heard an eyebrow raising bit that made sense on NPR when they were saying it could take the better part of a decade to really finish cleaning up this mess.

Hopefully that decade will be devoid of earthquakes and 8 meter tsunamis. :spless:

[mouse]

Maybe Halliburton can get the contract so it will only take 15 years.

[ManuBalboa]

TMXvpWoHzeE

Oh shit.

[LnGrrrR]

Heard an eyebrow raising bit that made sense on NPR when they were saying it could take the better part of a decade to really finish cleaning up this mess.

Hopefully that decade will be devoid of earthquakes and 8 meter tsunamis. :spless:

Can the radiation fill up the Superdome yet though?

And there's probably some bacteria that will evolve that's capable of absorbing and then dispelling nuclear radiation safely. Mother Earth can't possibly be influenced by anything us puny humans can do.

[CosmicCowboy]

Can the radiation fill up the Superdome yet though?

And there's probably some bacteria that will evolve that's capable of absorbing and then dispelling nuclear radiation safely. Mother Earth can't possibly be influenced by anything us puny humans can do.

Actually, I don't remember all the details but there were some pretty interesting evolutionary adaptations in the Chernobyl area as far as animals/plants coping with the radiation.

*edit*

quick search

http://www.planetizen.com/node/17057

[LnGrrrR]

Actually, I don't remember all the details but there were some pretty interesting evolutionary adaptations in the Chernobyl area as far as animals/plants coping with the radiation.

*edit*

quick search

http://www.planetizen.com/node/17057

Not sure if that's adaptation as much as rapid natural (so-to-speak) selection, but the two go somewhat hand-in-hand anyways.

That said, the article doesn't exactly present a rosy picture.



Humans spending long periods of time there would suffer a build-up of radiation that would shorten lives and raise newborn mortality. "It would be a disaster for humans," Morris says.

[mouse]

The world is like the first 5 pages of a 30 page topic, the good shit has already happened.

[Wild Cobra]

Anyone see any recent updates? Seems the news stopped trying to scare us.

I like this image showing the destruction of external power, from a 4/25 article:

http://pubs.acs.org/cen/_img/89/i17/8917NOTW1_pg7-1.jpg (http://pubs.acs.org/cen/news/89/i17/8917notw1.html)

[RandomGuy]

Anyone see any recent updates? Seems the news stopped trying to scare us.

I like this image showing the destruction of external power, from a 4/25 article:

http://pubs.acs.org/cen/_img/89/i17/8917NOTW1_pg7-1.jpg (http://pubs.acs.org/cen/news/89/i17/8917notw1.html)

It seems like the really scary stuff has past.

Besides we have other hot-button topics to talk about.

[RandomGuy]

I wonder if Agloco went:

International Conference on Advances in Nuclear Power Plants as reported at the Economist. (http://www.economist.com/blogs/babbage/2011/05/japans_nuclear_disaster)


TO CALL it a hot ticket might, in the circumstances, seem a tad tasteless. But no session at this year’s International Conference on Advances in Nuclear Power Plants, held in the south of France, was as well attended as the late-running special plenary hastily arranged to provide an update on the nuclear disaster at the Fukushima Dai-ichi plant in Japan and its attendant radioactive leaks. "hot ticket" Gotta love the dry Brit sense of humor. :lol

[RandomGuy]

More-than-expected damage found at Japan reactor (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110512/ap_on_re_as/as_japan_earthquake)


TOKYO – One of the reactors at Japan's crippled nuclear power plant has been damaged more severely than originally thought, officials said Thursday — a serious setback for efforts to stabilize the radiation-leaking complex.

Repairs to monitoring equipment revealed the new data, which also showed that the water level in the core of Unit 1 at the Fukushima Dai-ichi plant is much lower than previously thought, leaving the portion of the fuel rods still intact fully exposed. Other fuel has slumped to the bottom of the pressure vessel and is thought to be covered in water.

The findings also indicate a greater-than-expected leak in that vessel. Radioactive water pouring from troubled reactors has pooled around the complex, hindering work to bring the plant under control.

However, temperatures in the unit are still far below dangerous levels because the plant's operator, Tokyo Electric Power Co., continues to inject new water to keep the rods cool. That radioactive water is apparently then leaking into and through the larger, beaker-shaped drywell, or containment vessel.

"The situation (in the core) hasn't changed since (early in the crisis), and the fuel rods are being cooled by water continuously being injected into the core," nuclear official Takashi Sakurai said.

Nuclear Industrial and Safety Agency officials said the new data indicates that it is likely that partially melted fuel had fallen to the bottom of the pressurized vessel that holds the reactor core together and possibly leached down into the drywell soon after the March 11 quake and tsunami that struck Japan's northeastern coast.

While officials said it was unlikely that the chunks of fuel were still dangerously hot or that they could melt through the concrete base of containment vessel, they acknowledged that the level of damage could complicate plans detailed in April to bring the plant to a cold shutdown within nine months. Further examination was needed to ascertain the full extent of damage, they said.

TEPCO had adopted an unorthodox method of trying to cool Unit 1's reactor by trying to fill the drywell with water leaking from the core, but the possibility that chunks of melted fuel had fallen and damaged part the containment vessel raised questions about how successful this method would be. It also called into question the utility's timeline for stabilizing the reactor.

"We have to revise the flooding method, as we need to re-examine the way we carry it out," Matsumoto said.

Recent temperatures inside Unit 1's core were at the most 237 degrees Fahrenheit (114 Celsius), well below the normal operating temperature of about 570 Fahrenheit (300 Celsius). Zirconium fuel rod casing begin to break down at 2,200 Fahrenheit (1,200 Celsius) and melt at 3,900 Fahrenheit (2,200 Celsius).

The new findings became available as workers fixed a water meter Tuesday after entering the building for the first time since a March 12 hydrogen explosion at the unit.

The gauge showed that the water was at least three feet (one meter) below the 13-foot-long (four-meter-long) fuel rods, which are suspended in the pressure vessel. Some of the rods has melted away, however, and the chunks of damaged fuel are presumed to be sitting at the bottom of the vessel, covered in water.

The low level of water indicates that the core of Unit 1 had a bigger breach than expected, said TEPCO spokesman Junichi Matsumoto.

Cooling water has been leaking from the reactor cores of Units 2 and 3 as well, allowing an estimated 70,000 tons of contaminated water to pool inside the complex, which TEPCO has been struggling to bring under control for two months.

To prevent contaminated water from leaking into the ocean, workers in April began pumping it into a waste processing building while a system to decontaminate the water is set up.

The plant, 140 miles (220 kilometers) north of Tokyo, has a total of six reactors. Units 5 and 6 have already reached cold shutdown. Unit 4 contained no fuel rods at the time of the earthquake, but workers have needed to spray water into its spent fuel pool where still-hot rods are stored and structural damage and leakage are suspected.

...

[Winehole23]

One of the reactors at the crippled Fukushima Daiichi power plant did suffer a nuclear meltdown, Japanese officials admitted for the first time today, describing a pool of molten fuel at the bottom of the reactor's containment vessel.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/japan/8509502/Nuclear-meltdown-at-Fukushima-plant.html

[mouse]

It seems like the really scary stuff has past.


Sure.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/randomlie-sucks.jpg

[CosmicCowboy]

It's OK. They are going to build a tent over it so we won't have to look at it.

[LnGrrrR]

Can all the radiologically affected people fill up the Superdome yet? All I know is I'll be watching them closely should they decide to board an airplane with me.

[mouse]

It's OK. They are going to build a tent over it so we won't have to look at it.

^ :lmao This vato gets it!

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/MAllenArt.jpg

[boutons_deux]

Problems cited with nuclear backup power

Nuclear plant emergency generators like those that failed in Japan following the March earthquake and tsunami also failed during tests at the Seabrook Station in New Hampshire and 32 other US plants in the past eight years,


http://articles.boston.com/2011-05-13/news/29540672_1_nrc-nuclear-plants-vermont-yankee

[mouse]

That last rain San Antonio had trace amounts.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/Here_comes_rain_again.jpg

[Agloco]

That last rain San Antonio had trace amounts.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/Here_comes_rain_again.jpg

Why don't you go ahead and calculate how detrimental it was to your health......

http://www.epa.gov/rpdweb00/understand/calculate.html

[Agloco]

I haven't had an opportunity to read much in the past few weeks but here's another morsel.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/05/16/tepco-idUSL4E7GG39O20110516

[mouse]

Why don't you go ahead and calculate how detrimental it was to your health......



Unlike you I am a 'zero' tolerance guy when it comes to radiation. no unnecessary calculating needed.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/412-17-nuclear-test-victim.jpg

[Winehole23]

Data shows meltdowns occurred at the No. 2 and No. 3 reactors of the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant, creating huge problems for the plant operator that had presented a more optimistic scenario. http://www.asahi.com/english/TKY201105170428.html

[Agloco]

Unlike you I am a 'zero' tolerance guy when it comes to radiation. no unnecessary calculating needed.

Probably not doing too well from day to day then are you?

[boutons_deux]

UCA is USA's biggest radiation enemy. Remember that jerkoff Chertoff lobbied for these scanners.

http://motherjones.com/blue-marble/2011/05/why-secrecy-airport-scanners

http://www.naturalnews.com/032425_airport_scanners_radiation.html

[mouse]

Probably not doing too well from day to day then are you?


Avoiding an STD

You:
Have sex everyday and hope you choose the right hooker as you calculate the odds of her having an STD by asking her many questions maybe use a slide ruler on her vagina and feed the info onto the computer.

Me:
Masturbate

[ChumpDumper]

Unlike you I am a 'zero' tolerance guy when it comes to radiation. no unnecessary calculating needed.All kinds of radiation?

[Wild Cobra]

Me:
Masturbate
Yes, you are a master-baiter

[RandomGuy]

Avoiding an STD

You:
Have sex everyday and hope you choose the right hooker as you calculate the odds of her having an STD by asking her many questions maybe use a slide ruler on her vagina and feed the info onto the computer.

Me:
Masturbate

Translation:

http://www.clipartguide.com/_named_clipart_images/0511-0702-0211-2545_Businessman_Waving_a_White_Flag_Behind_His_De sk_clipart_image.jpg

"I can't really go toe to toe with someone who actually knows anything, so I will limit myself to horrendous, emotionally heavy pictures of children, and generally tasteless personal attacks, because I don't know enough science to really make any meaningful arguments."

Sokay, we knew that already.

[Agloco]

Avoiding an STD

You:
Have sex everyday and hope you choose the right hooker as you calculate the odds of her having an STD by asking her many questions maybe use a slide ruler on her vagina and feed the info onto the computer.

Me:
Masturbate

Using your analogy you're also having sex everyday. Difference is, I know how to handle my business.

[mouse]

All kinds of radiation?

All kinds of Gay?

You know that is a loaded question.

[mouse]

Using your analogy you're also having sex everyday. Difference is, I know how to handle my business.

I know, it's call Penicillin you must eat them like pork skins.

[mouse]

Translation:

http://www.clipartguide.com/_named_clipart_images/0511-0702-0211-2545_Businessman_Waving_a_White_Flag_Behind_His_De sk_clipart_image.jpg

"I can't really go toe to toe with someone who actually knows anything, so I will limit myself to horrendous, emotionally heavy pictures of children, and generally tasteless personal attacks, because I don't know enough science to really make any meaningful arguments."

Sokay, we knew that already.

Dude I like your humor, wit, and downright skills. If Sarah Palin or That white guy with the chipmunk cheeks,(he was a POW) anyway you have talent I know with you they would have went further in the ticket with you as Publicist? You would have made Obama look like the "DYN-NO-MITE" dude from the tv hit show Good Times. http://www.evtv1.com/images/goodtimes2.jpg

But the truth is, your way off the mark on this one. If I was surrendering or giving up in anyway I would have not replied.

I am still here and more than ready to try and educated the ignorant, especially if it's for they're own good.



.

[boutons_deux]

Fukushima's Apocalyptic Threat

By Harvey Wasserman, Reader Supported News

20 May 11

Fukushima may be in an apocalyptic downward spiral.

Forget the corporate-induced media coma that says otherwise ... or nothing at all.

Lethal radiation is spewing unabated. Emission levels could seriously escalate. There is no end in sight. The potential is many times worse than Chernobyl.

Containing this disaster may be beyond the abilities of Tokyo Electric or the Japanese government.

There is no reason to incur further unnecessary risk. With all needed resources, it's time for the world's best scientists and engineers to take charge.

Even then the outcome is unclear.

For a brief but terrifying overview, consult Dr. Chris Busby as interviewed by RT/TV.

Fukushima Units One, Two and Three are all in various stages of melting down.

Molten fuel at Unit One may have burned through its reactor pressure vessel, with water poured in to cool it merely pouring out the bottom.

A growing pond of highly radioactive liquid is softening the ground and draining into the ocean.

There is no way to predict where these molten masses of fuel will yet go.

Especially in the event of an aftershock, steam and hydrogen explosions could blow out what's left of the containments.

The extra plutonium in the MOX fuel at Unit Three is an added liability.

At least one spent fuel pool has been on fire.

The site has already suffered at least two hydrogen explosions. Some believe a fission explosion may also have occurred.

All have weakened the structures and support systems on site.

These shocks and the soft ground may be why Unit Four has partially sunk and is tipping, possibly on the brink of collapse. Even a relatively minor aftershock could mean catastrophe.

More explosions are possible. More leaks are virtually certain.

Escalated radiation levels from any one of the reactors could force all workers to evacuate, leaving the entire site to chance.

The New York Times has now reported that critical valve failures that contributed to the Fukushima disaster are likely at numerous US reactors.

Significant radioactive debris has been found thousands of yards from the plant. Radiation levels in Tokyo, nearly 200 miles away, have risen. Fallout has been detected in North America and throughout Europe.

Radiation pouring into the sea has begun to spread worldwide.

There is much more, none of it good.

Japan and Germany have had the good survival sense to abandon future reactor construction, and to shut some existing sites.

But here, the corporate media blackout is virtually complete. Out of sight, out of mind seems the strategy for an industry desperate for federal loan guarantees and continued operation of a rickety fleet of decaying old reactors.

The Obama Administration has ended radiation monitoring of seafood in the Pacific. It does not provide reliable, systematic radiological or medical data on fallout coming to the United States.

But we may all be in unprecedented danger.

A national movement is underway to end atomic give-aways and turn to a green-powered Earth.

Now we must also move ALL the world's governments beyond denial to focus on somehow bringing Fukushima under control.

After two months of all-out effort, four reactors and at least that many spent fuel pools remain at risk.

Our survival depends on stopping Fukushima from further irradiating us all.

The world community has come together to put a new sarcophagus around Chernobyl.

A parallel, more urgent effort now needs to focus on Fukushima.

Whatever technical, scientific and material resources are available to our species, that's what needs to go there.

NOW!!!

http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/303-211/6005-fukushimas-apocalyptic-threat

==============

I don't know about apocalyptic, but it's safe to assume the Japanese and corporate media are lying about Fukushima.

How will building a sarcophagus over the site stop the leaks under the site?

[Agloco]

I am still here and more than ready to try and educated the ignorant, especially if it's for they're own good.

We're still waiting. I go grab a Snickers...........

[RandomGuy]

Dude I like your humor, wit, and downright skills. If Sarah Palin or That white guy with the chipmunk cheeks,(he was a POW) anyway you have talent I know with you they would have went further in the ticket with you as Publicist? You would have made Obama look like the "DYN-NO-MITE" dude from the tv hit show Good Times. http://www.evtv1.com/images/goodtimes2.jpg

But the truth is, your way off the mark on this one. If I was surrendering or giving up in anyway I would have not replied.

I am still here and more than ready to try and educated the ignorant, especially if it's for they're own good.



.

Vacuous personal attacks are the first sign of surrender on a topic.

If you can't acknowledge that there are topical experts in a field who know more than you do, or more than the the people who write for the websites you get your information from, then it is readily obvious that you are not being honest.

At some point, one has to simply acknowledge that the people who study stuff for decades tend to get things right a lot more often than your average blogger at infowars.com.

[boutons_deux]

IAEA Knew Within Weeks of Japanese Earthquake that Reactors Had Melted Down … Public Not Told for a Month and a Half

Chris Allison [a former manager and technical leader at Idaho National Laboratory], who had actually developed the analysis and simulation software, reported the result to the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) in late March. It was only May 15 when Tokyo Electric Power Co. (TEPCO) admitted for the first time that a meltdown had occurred at the No. 1 reactor at the Fukushima nuclear plant.

According to Allison’s report obtained by the Mainichi, the simulation was based on basic data on light-water nuclear reactors at the Laguna Verde Nuclear Power Plant in Mexico that are about the same size as that of the No. 1, 2, and 3 reactors in Fukushima.

According to the simulation, the reactor core started melting about 50 minutes after the emergency core cooling system of the No. 1 reactor stopped functioning and the injection of water into the reactor pressure vessel came to a halt.

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/05/guest-post-iaea-knew-within-weeks-of-japanese-earthquake-that-reactors-had-melted-down-public-not-told-for-a-month-and-a-half.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+NakedCapitalism+%28naked+capi talism%29

[Wild Cobra]

IAEA Knew Within Weeks of Japanese Earthquake that Reactors Had Melted Down … Public Not Told for a Month and a Half

Chris Allison [a former manager and technical leader at Idaho National Laboratory], who had actually developed the analysis and simulation software, reported the result to the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) in late March. It was only May 15 when Tokyo Electric Power Co. (TEPCO) admitted for the first time that a meltdown had occurred at the No. 1 reactor at the Fukushima nuclear plant.

According to Allison’s report obtained by the Mainichi, the simulation was based on basic data on light-water nuclear reactors at the Laguna Verde Nuclear Power Plant in Mexico that are about the same size as that of the No. 1, 2, and 3 reactors in Fukushima.

According to the simulation, the reactor core started melting about 50 minutes after the emergency core cooling system of the No. 1 reactor stopped functioning and the injection of water into the reactor pressure vessel came to a halt.

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/05/guest-post-iaea-knew-within-weeks-of-japanese-earthquake-that-reactors-had-melted-down-public-not-told-for-a-month-and-a-half.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+NakedCapitalism+%28naked+capi talism%29
Started melting and melted are two different things. I will take that article with a grain of salt.

[RandomGuy]

Started melting and melted are two different things. I will take that article with a grain of salt.

Fukushima plant suffered triple meltdown (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2011/0525/1224297712520.html)


ENGINEERS IN Japan’s ruined Fukushima nuclear plant have revealed it suffered a triple meltdown in the four days after being battered by a huge earthquake and tsunami on March 11th.

The news confirms fears that reactor three, which contains controversial mixed uranium-plutonium fuel, known as Mox, was among the casualties of the world’s worst nuclear disaster since Chernobyl. Mox is considered thousands of times more toxic than uranium nuclear fuel.

There are many other articles to that effect.

Meltdown in three reactors, cracks in the containment vessels, and all sorts of nasty shit going down.

It will be years before this is really fully contained, and decades before it is cleaned up to any reasonable degree, by what I have read.

[RandomGuy]

Personally it seemed VERY obvious to me that we were not getting the entire truth about this.

I am not hand-wavy hysterical about it, but anybody with any common sense could see that the nuclear people were being oh-so-circumspect.

[Wild Cobra]

Fukushima plant suffered triple meltdown (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2011/0525/1224297712520.html)



There are many other articles to that effect.

Meltdown in three reactors, cracks in the containment vessels, and all sorts of nasty shit going down.

It will be years before this is really fully contained, and decades before it is cleaned up to any reasonable degree, by what I have read.
Don't get me wrong, I agree this is serious. I just refuse to accept the way some people frame the facts.

[Agloco]

Personally it seemed VERY obvious to me that we were not getting the entire truth about this.

I am not hand-wavy hysterical about it, but anybody with any common sense could see that the nuclear people were being oh-so-circumspect.

You never get the whole truth in this type of situation unfortunately. That has to do with CYA on TEPCOs part as much as it has to do with not having eyes directly on the situation. You're left with taking proper precautions and preparing for a worst case scenario. This is where the Japanese failed IMO.

I think it was obvious to most radiation workers that a meltdown was likely. After that, there were many shades of gray. You must prepare for the darkest shade though. It's very unfortunate that we got one of the darkest shades possible.

[mouse]

We're still waiting. I go grab a Snickers...........

regular or king size? one takes longer to get down to the nuts. look out for that creamy nougat! :wakeup

[mouse]

Vacuous personal attacks are the first sign of surrender on a topic.

wheres the quote?




If you can't acknowledge that there are topical experts in a field who know more than you do, or more than the the people who write for the websites you get your information from, then it is readily obvious that you are not being honest.

what do you consider an expert? a piece of paper on the wall? Look at the so called experts from Japan that lied to the world. You give these so called experts to much credit. I use common sense and reality your pals with the white coats use text book analogies. These are the same experts that claimed tobacco was good for you. over the years eggs, coffee and weed was bad for you 5 years later it's good for you now its.....these so called experts have they're heads deep in their asses.


At some point, one has to simply acknowledge that the people who study stuff for decades tend to get things right a lot more often than your average blogger at infowars.com.

Kinda like at some point people like Rush,Glenn Beck,and the 9/11 commission, were to be taken serious?


Don't reduce someone because they don't drive a Lexus or went to MIT.

[jack sommerset]

I have not paid much attention to this story....Has anyone died yet from the after effects of meltdown?

[ChumpDumper]

I have not paid much attention to this story....Has anyone died yet from the after effects of meltdown?Write a letter.

[jack sommerset]

Write a letter.

Go suck some cock, fag.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Go suck some cock, fag.

sucking cock
fags
jacksommerset

[ChumpDumper]

Go suck some cock, fag.Are you an alpha male, jack?

Is it normal for an alpha male like you to talk about homosexual acts as much as you do?

[mouse]

how to get back on track.....................

[RandomGuy]

You never get the whole truth in this type of situation unfortunately. That has to do with CYA on TEPCOs part as much as it has to do with not having eyes directly on the situation. You're left with taking proper precautions and preparing for a worst case scenario. This is where the Japanese failed IMO.

I think it was obvious to most radiation workers that a meltdown was likely. After that, there were many shades of gray. You must prepare for the darkest shade though. It's very unfortunate that we got one of the darkest shades possible.

Three full out meltdowns is about as bad as it gets. If the containment was breached or cracked, as seems to be the case, yikes.

Even the Japanese, who are famous for strong pressures to not make waves, have got to be pissed about this.

Someone needs to be handed a seppuku knife, and told to do the right thing.

[Winehole23]

Radioactive soil in pockets of areas near Japan's crippled nuclear plant have reached the same level as Chernobyl, where a "dead zone" remains 25 years after the reactor in the former Soviet Union exploded.

Soil samples in areas outside the 20-kilometer (12 miles) exclusion zone around the Fukushima plant measured more than 1.48 million becquerels a square meter, the standard used for evacuating residents after the Chernobyl accident, Tomio Kawata, a fellow at the Nuclear Waste Management Organization of Japan, said in a research report published May 24 and given to the government.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2011/05/30/bloomberg1376-LLZK0I1A74E901-0PV3MV8LDJ1DOTDCLS9HQ5EHL3.DTL

[TheInternets]

Are you an alpha male, jack?

Is it normal for an alpha male like you to talk about homosexual acts as much as you do?

:lmao

[Agloco]

I have not paid much attention to this story....Has anyone died yet from the after effects of meltdown?

If you'd familiarize yourself with the health effects of radiation and the dose rates involved, you'd realize that you're a bit premature with this question.

[RandomGuy]

Radioactive soil in pockets of areas near Japan's crippled nuclear plant have reached the same level as Chernobyl, where a "dead zone" remains 25 years after the reactor in the former Soviet Union exploded.

Soil samples in areas outside the 20-kilometer (12 miles) exclusion zone around the Fukushima plant measured more than 1.48 million becquerels a square meter, the standard used for evacuating residents after the Chernobyl accident, Tomio Kawata, a fellow at the Nuclear Waste Management Organization of Japan, said in a research report published May 24 and given to the government.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2011/05/30/bloomberg1376-LLZK0I1A74E901-0PV3MV8LDJ1DOTDCLS9HQ5EHL3.DTL


Oh, by the way, this is nothing even remotely close to Chernobyl. What part of that don't YOU understand?


Whoopsies.

[Cry Havoc]

Sorry RG, but I don't think you can compare this to the level of catastrophe that Chernobyl was. It's horrible, but not nearly as severe, as far as we know.

[RandomGuy]

Sorry RG, but I don't think you can compare this to the level of catastrophe that Chernobyl was. It's horrible, but not nearly as severe, as far as we know.

With the emphasis on the last five words.

While it does not equal Chernobyl, the more we find out, the closer it seems to get.

I am not going to get all hand-wavy hysterical ala mouse, but then the other end of the spectrum such as Darrins assertion that the accident isn't even remotely close to it, also seem a bit thin at this point.

We won't really know how bad it is until we really get in there, and someone other than TEPCO who can be considered vaguely independent gives us an assessment. My guess is that we *still* have not quite gotten all the details or a full accounting of how bad it is.

[mouse]

Sorry RG, but I don't think you can compare this to the level of catastrophe that Chernobyl was. It's horrible, but not nearly as severe, as far as we know.

What are you using as a scale? The fact that Chernobyl was at a time when the cold war was still warm and people were already scared of this new thing called Nuclear power?

At least The RUSSIANS started pouring lead and cement and were already tunneling underneath to keep the meltdown secure as not to reach the water underneath. While Japan was lucky if they updated they're facebook page.

The only reason Chernobyl is still today the most famous of all meltdowns is because still today you can see kids born with no limbs and we have film of the nearest town still empty no life after 25 years. back in the 80s everyone including Johnny Carson had some glow in the dark joke. The Japan accident happened after the world got to lazy to give a shit. "it's over their" Ann Cold cuts and the media have already desensitize us with 9/11 and Iraq.

Just wait until you see the raw footage of the deformed babies and no fish or life in the seas then come in here with your Las Vegas style odds on how this disaster is any better than Chernobyl. where's your science now?

[Winehole23]

Memorable witticism:


what was your banana theory?

[Cry Havoc]

What are you using as a scale? The fact that Chernobyl was at a time when the cold war was still warm and people were already scared of this new thing called Nuclear power?

At least The RUSSIANS started pouring lead and cement and were already tunneling underneath to keep the meltdown secure as not to reach the water underneath. While Japan was lucky if they updated they're facebook page.

Are you serious? For days the USSR initially did NOTHING about the crisis. They informed no one, and only capitulated to admitting that there was ANY sort of problem when European countries began reporting radioactive isotopes in their rain.


The only reason Chernobyl is still today the most famous of all meltdowns is because still today you can see kids born with no limbs and we have film of the nearest town still empty no life after 25 years. back in the 80s everyone including Johnny Carson had some glow in the dark joke. The Japan accident happened after the world got to lazy to give a shit. "it's over their" Ann Cold cuts and the media have already desensitize us with 9/11 and Iraq.

This is absolute revisionist fallacy. NO ONE knew about Chernobyl for quite some time after it happened. You can look up the youtube recordings, the meltdown barely even warrants a mention on the news beyond a vague description of an explosion. If you want, I can link you. This most recent disaster covered the news for WEEKS. I would go so far as to say that even the 5th most powerful earthquake ever recorded took a backseat to the situation at Fukushima.


Just wait until you see the raw footage of the deformed babies and no fish or life in the seas then come in here with your Las Vegas style odds on how this disaster is any better than Chernobyl. where's your science now?

Strawman, ad hominem, got anything else that's completely unsubstantiated to lob into this thread?

[Agloco]

The International Society of Nuclear Medicine (ISNM) is in town this week at Henry B Gonzales and I've hit the open bar quite hard between my talks.......:lol


Radioactive soil in pockets of areas near Japan's crippled nuclear plant have reached the same level as Chernobyl, where a "dead zone" remains 25 years after the reactor in the former Soviet Union exploded.

How big are they? Where are they located? Were those areas previously populated?

I'd like to know a bit more. Unfortunately, we're not getting all of the information needed for an accurate assessment. That much became obvious in the early going.


Soil samples in areas outside the 20-kilometer (12 miles) exclusion zone around the Fukushima plant measured more than 1.48 million becquerels a square meter, the standard used for evacuating residents after the Chernobyl accident, Tomio Kawata, a fellow at the Nuclear Waste Management Organization of Japan, said in a research report published May 24 and given to the government.

1.48 x 10^6 Bq = 40 microCuries


For reference, that's about 1.5 million disintegrations (decays) per second per square meter. Pretty hefty cumulative doses can be had if you're around that for extended periods of time.

That's 40 uCi per square meter in outdoor spaces. You certainly can't allow people to live there with those activity levels. You certainly cant farm anything. Cs-137 is the main culprit. They'll need to conjugate it and get rid of as much as possible.

In a word: shitty

[boutons_deux]

The Kamikazes Are Back!

Japanese Retirees Ready to Risk Fukushima Front Line

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=japanese-retirees-ready-to-risk

[boutons_deux]

Japan doubles plant radiation leak estimate

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/06/07/japan-doubles-plant-radiation-leak-estimate/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheRawStory+%28The+Raw+Story% 29

[Winehole23]

The disaster is rated a maximum seven on the international nuclear accident scale, the same level as the Chernobyl meltdown 25 years ago.

[hater]

"this is nothing like Chernobyl"

anybody who keeps saying this is in a sad state of affairs

[Cry Havoc]

"this is nothing like Chernobyl"

anybody who keeps saying this is in a sad state of affairs

To be fair, anyone who says that is accurate. Chenobyl and Fukushima are vastly different from each other.

[hater]

To be fair, anyone who says that is accurate. Chenobyl and Fukushima are vastly different from each other.

sorry about your sad state of affairs.... well, actually you might be right, Fukushima could be alot worse:




http://www.businessinsider.com/level-7-fukushima-vs-chernobyl-how-do-they-really-compare-2011-4

Nuclear Fuel Not Spent

Nuclear experts are cautioning that the situation at Fukushima is still very much in play. The amount of radioactive fuel present at Fukushima dwarfs Chernobyl. In the ATCA briefing of March 19th, "Fukushima: How To Avoid A Potential Chernobyl?" we wrote:

"The world media likes to focus on the potential of a nuclear meltdown at Fukushima's multiple reactors, including melted cores, exposed uranium and plutonium etc. In fact, the old fuel rods are much more dangerous than the nuclear meltdown scenarios because there is more radiation in the unguarded spent fuel pools than in the reactors themselves."

"The Japanese nuclear crisis has the potential to be larger than Chernobyl because there are several tons of nuclear waste stored in the reactor cores that could be lofted into the environment in the event of explosion. Cracks are already there in the containment vessels of reactors one, two and three. If those cracks grow, or if there is an explosion, this could be something beyond Chernobyl, because of the various fission products being released into the environment."

Where most attention has centred on reactors #1, #2 and #3, there is also concern amongst nuclear scientists about the separate spent fuel pond in reactor building #4. In the week following the tsunami, it became clear that the spent fuel rod cooling pond was running dry, meaning that fuel rods would soon over-heat. This meant the likely degradation, fire or disinegration of their zirconium alloy cladding. Zirconium at those temperatures separates water into oxygen and hydrogen, which as we have seen is highly explosive. By Tepco's own admission, there is a risk that then a nuclear chain reaction could begin spontaneously, the dreaded “inadvertent criticality”. This would mean that the potential for a very large atmospheric release of as much as 250 tons of radioactive fuel material sitting in that pond could then not be discounted. If that should happen, the drinking water, green leaf vegetables, and some of the food chain of the northern hemisphere could be potentially affected.

If there were to be an energetic event, there would be a very large radioactive release indeed. The priority is, as it has been all along, to restore adequate coolant to stabilise and to reduce the energy release in the spent fuel ponds and the reactors themselves -- while hoping that earthquake aftershocks, bad weather and further power outages do not cause significant further delays.

Longer Term Exposure

Experts say this accident may turn out to be much bigger and more destructive than the Chernobyl meltdown in 1986, labeled as history’s worst nuclear accident. The Japanese government has sought to calm the markets by downplaying what has really gone on at the Fukushima nuclear reactors. Today the Japanese prime minister said the situation is improving, even after the announcement that the threat level had been raised to 7. But it’s clear a nuclear power plant housing six separate reactors -- with four of them in trouble -- including several large pools holding huge quantities of spent fuel rods which are undergoing repeated explosions and sporadic episodes of nuclear fission could certainly dwarf the Chernobyl accident in size, complexity, danger and potential for long-term damage.

The Russian View

Fukushima is much bigger than Chernobyl according to some Russian nuclear experts such as Natalia Mironova, a thermodynamic engineer, interviewed by Agence France Presse (AFP). The nuclear disaster at Japan's Fukushima power plant is "much bigger than Chernobyl" and could rewrite the international scale used to measure the severity of atomic accidents. Chernobyl was level seven and it had only one reactor and lasted only two weeks. We have now [four] weeks (at Fukushima) and we have four reactors which we know are in very dangerous situations," she warned. "Chernobyl was a dirty bomb explosion. The next dirty bomb is Fukushima and it will cost much more" in economic and human terms, she added, because of the urban population centres in its proximity.

Caesium Fallout Rivals Chernobyl

The fallout of radioactive Caesium from Fukushima already rivals Chernobyl. Radioactive caesium and iodine have been deposited in northern Japan far from Fukushima at levels that were classified as highly contaminated after Chernobyl. The readings were taken by the Japanese science ministry, MEXT (Ministry of Education, Culture, Sports, Science and Technology), and reveal high levels of caesium-137 and iodine-131 outside the 30-kilometre evacuation zone, mostly to the north-north-west. Radioactive caesium is one of the main dangers from the Japanese nuclear accident. Over the longer term, the big threat to human health is caesium-137, which has a half-life of 30 years. At that rate of disintegration it takes over 200 years to reduce it to 1 percent of its former level. It is caesium-137 that still contaminates much of the Ukraine area around the Chernobyl reactor which is designated as a dead zone. Caesium-137 mixes easily with water and is chemically similar to potassium. It thus mimics how potassium gets metabolised in the human body and can enter through many food chains, including cows grazing in the countryside and the milk they produce. The relatively low levels as defined in a glass of milk or a bowl of spinach are deceptive because this radioactive contamination is bioaccumulative, especially in mammals, and grows with each additional exposure over long periods of time.

Comparisons Chernobyl vs Fukushima

After the 1986 Chernobyl accident, the most highly contaminated areas were defined as those with over 1,490 kiloBecquerels per square metre (kBq/m2) of caesium. Agricultural produce from soil with 550 kBq/m2 was destroyed. People living within 30 kilometres of the Fukushima plant have evacuated or been advised to stay indoors. Since March 18th, MEXT has repeatedly found caesium levels above 550 kBq/m2 in an area some 45 kilometres wide lying 30 to 50 kilometres north-west of the plant. The highest was 6,400 kBq/m2, about 35 kilometres away, while caesium reached 1,816 kBq/m2 in Nihonmatsu City and 1,752 kBq/m2 in the town of Kawamata, where iodine-131 levels of up to 12,560 kBq/m2 have also been measured. [New Scientist]

What About Plutonium?

In the ATCA briefing of March 22nd, "Japan Nuclear Crisis: What About The Plutonium MOX?" we wrote:

"Reactor 3 suffered significant damage after the quake and the tsunami waves on March 11th;
. The roof of the building was destroyed by a powerful explosion ... caused by an accumulation of hydrogen;
. Reactor 3 raises the most concern since it runs on MOX or Mixed Oxide fuel -- a mixture of plutonium and uranium;
. MOX is far more dangerous than uranium on its own; and
. MOX is two million times more deadly than normal enriched uranium."

"What if the release of elements in the smoke and vapour were not just radioactive iodine, caesium and uranium but a MOX combination including plutonium?
. This would explain why the workers were immediately evacuated given the deadly nature of plutonium;
. Plutonium is extremely difficult to detect because it emits limited gamma rays -- unlike radioactive iodine, caesium and uranium -- and it is deadly;
. Plutonium release would not show up as a radiation spike;
. Plutonium 239 is the deadliest element known to man;
. Half-life of Plutonium-239 in MOX is 24,000 years: Few milligrams of P-239 escaping in a smoke plume will contaminate soil for tens of thousands of years; and
. Plutonium comes from Pluto: god of wealth and power and also the god of hell and death."

While radioactive iodine and cesium (half-life 8 days and 30 years, respectively) are the most immediate threats to human health, one of the plants is leaking plutonium having a half-life of 24,000 years. The “safe” levels of radiation quoted by authorities are generally what would be experienced standing next to the hot isotopes, but if these are ingested the consequences are much more severe. If one millionth of a gram of plutonium lands in a human lung, the individual gets lung cancer. Plutonium along with other radioactive isotopes is leaking through tunnels to the ocean where it will be distributed locally by currents, concentrated in fish, and distributed world wide by migratory fish.

What Does A Level 7 Mean?

A level seven rating is defined as "An event resulting in an environmental release corresponding to a quantity of radioactivity radiologically equivalent to a release to the atmosphere of more than several tens of thousands of TeraBecquerels (TBq) of Iodine-131." One TeraBecquerel (TBq) equals one Trillion Becquerels of radioactivity. The Japanese Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency (NISA) puts the Fukushima figure at 370,000 TBq of Iodine-131 equivalent; the Nuclear Safety Commission, which has a more over-arching role in the Japanese system, says 630,000 TBq. Either way, it's clearly beyond the threshold for classification as an INES -- International Nuclear Event Scale -- level seven event, although an order of magnitude lower than the 5.2 million TBq released from the Chernobyl accident, ie, only 10% of that radiation quantum so far.

Conclusion

Level 7 is the most serious level on INES -- International Nuclear Event Scale -- describing "a major release of radioactive material with widespread health and environmental effects requiring implementation of planned and extended countermeasures." Although, by some measures, Fukushima has not reached the level of radioactive contamination caused by Chernobyl yet, we would advise caution because of the presence of plutonium and spent fuel rod pools with hundreds of thousands of tons of radioactive nuclear material. Even when we discount the Russian view and the caesium fallout levels rivalling Chernobyl, if things do not continue to go right, the potential exists for Fukushima to be much bigger than Chernobyl.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/level-7-fukushima-vs-chernobyl-how-do-they-really-compare-2011-4#ixzz1OcKLsXO2

[nkdlunch]

FF0hJtSeq0A

Kurosawa = Nostradamus?

[Agloco]

Conclusion

Level 7 is the most serious level on INES -- International Nuclear Event Scale -- describing "a major release of radioactive material with widespread health and environmental effects requiring implementation of planned and extended countermeasures." Although, by some measures, Fukushima has not reached the level of radioactive contamination caused by Chernobyl yet, we would advise caution because of the presence of plutonium and spent fuel rod pools with hundreds of thousands of tons of radioactive nuclear material. Even when we discount the Russian view and the caesium fallout levels rivalling Chernobyl, if things do not continue to go right, the potential exists for Fukushima to be much bigger than Chernobyl.

[leemajors]

i9a0Q1v93SA

[Wild Cobra]

i9a0Q1v93SA
Of course heavy elements that travel by rain water will concentrate in areas like that.

I noticed the initial 0.10 was on a hand rail, wet with rain water too. was the steady 0.10 because it was still wet with that water?

Images and videos can be deceiving from second hand accounts.

I'm all for the truth, but this looks like hype to me.

[LnGrrrR]

Could all the radiation fill up the Superdome yet?

[Agloco]

i9a0Q1v93SA


Of course heavy elements that travel by rain water will concentrate in areas like that.

I noticed the initial 0.10 was on a hand rail, wet with rain water too. was the steady 0.10 because it was still wet with that water?

Images and videos can be deceiving from second hand accounts.

I'm all for the truth, but this looks like hype to me.

The 802 is an accurate dosimeter. I've used these types a time or two during my inspections with the IAEA. It's not all that common here in the US.

Having said that, I'm not sure about it's accuracy for surface readings such as the ones being performed in this video. To put the numbers in context, 5.77 uSv/hr (the max seen I think) equates to roughly 14 times normal background radiation dose. Radiation accumulates in dirt (during visits to Chernobyl, one of the biggest rules was to stay on the asphalt or concrete) Understand, that you'd need to have an unshielded body part in constant contact with that patch of dirt for a year to get to that 14x exposure level. At one meter, which is the average height of the lowest body parts which are radiation sensitive (I'll let your imaginations figure that out.....), the dose rate is 1/1000th of what it is at the point he took those readings (which is the surface). We can also presume that said body parts are covered so that dose is predominantly from gammas. :lol

Note also that the cumulative dose on that dosimeter reads 11.4 uSv, well below the threshold for worry.

I'm not downplaying the severity of this event. I'm simply putting what you see in the video in it's proper context. It's good that people are taking the initiative and reading the dose rate regularly. With what's been coming from the Japanese government and TEPCO, you can't be too cautious.

[Wild Cobra]

The 802 is an accurate dosimeter. I've used these types a time or two during my inspections with the IAEA. It's not all that common here in the US.

I like it when people know what they are talking about here.

I looked up the 802. Now I see the 0.10 reading is it's minimum reportable dose.

tld Dosimeters (http://www.mirion.com/en/products/datasheets/ds/LIT4048_2TLDcombo_US.pdf)

[Agloco]

I like it when people know what they are talking about here.

I looked up the 802. Now I see the 0.10 reading is it's minimum reportable dose.

tld Dosimeters (http://www.mirion.com/en/products/datasheets/ds/LIT4048_2TLDcombo_US.pdf)

Wrong one,this isn't a TLD ....it's this one:

http://ndtequipment.en.made-in-china.com/product/qevEWJZolMRF/China-Personal-Radiative-Detector-DP802I-.html


Response is down to 10 nanoSieverts/hour

Main specifications
Measuring range: Dose rate: 0.01 µ Sv/h ~30mSv/h
Cumulate dose: 0.00 µ Sv ~999.9mSv
Energy range: 40Kev~1.5Mev
Energy response error: ≤ ± 30%(according to 137CS)
Relative basic error: ≤ ± 10%
Measuring time: Automatic adjustment according to radiation, quick response.

Alarm value: 0.5\1.0\2.5\10\30\50\100\500 µ Sv/h
Protective alarm response time: ≤ 5 second
Display: LCD
Display unit: Dose rate (µ Sv/h or mSv/h) and Cumulate dose (µ Sv or mSV)
Power: AAA battery 1PC, 15 days working time
Size: 90*60*17 (mm)
Weight: 80g.

[Cry Havoc]

Surprised no one posted this yet:

http://www.thirdage.com/news/fukushima-may-have-suffered-melt-through-japan-says_06-09-2011

[Cry Havoc]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/8565020/Nuclear-fuel-has-melted-through-base-of-Fukushima-plant.html

[Wild Cobra]

Surprised no one posted this yet:

http://www.thirdage.com/news/fukushima-may-have-suffered-melt-through-japan-says_06-09-2011
Do they call it the "The Brazil Syndrome?"

[Winehole23]

Radioactive cesium exceeding the legal limit was detected in tea made in a factory in Shizuoka City, more than 300 kilometers away from the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant. Shizuoka Prefecture is one of the most famous tea producing areas in Japan.

A tea distributor in Tokyo reported to the prefecture that it detected high levels of radioactivity in the tea shipped from the city. The prefectural government confirmed the contamination on Thursday, detecting 679 becquerels per kilogram of radioactive cesium. The legal limit is 500 becquerels.http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/10_01.html

[Agloco]

Fukushima workers' exposure tops 650mSV

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/10_33.html


Children in Fukushima to be given dosimeters

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/10_08.html

[Cry Havoc]

To be fair, agloco, weren't the Chernobyl workers subjected to 5-15 SV (not mSV) of radiation when they worked on the plant after it exploded?

[Agloco]

To be fair, agloco, weren't the Chernobyl workers subjected to 5-15 SV (not mSV) of radiation when they worked on the plant after it exploded?

Indeed, the scale is quite different. These posts weren't intended to draw parallels to Chernobyl, they were simply to disseminate some facts about the shady practice occurring at Fukushima and the public response to it.

The dose received by the Fukushima workers is below the threshold for deterministic effects (~1 Sv), but quite worrisome when considering stochastic effects such as long term cancer induction.

[Winehole23]

http://www.biology-online.org/dictionary/Stochastic

[RandomGuy]

http://www.biology-online.org/dictionary/Stochastic

One of my favorite words.


HA!






(seriously though, it is)

[RandomGuy]

Surprised no one posted this yet:

http://www.thirdage.com/news/fukushima-may-have-suffered-melt-through-japan-says_06-09-2011

"melt-through"

I kind of suspected this, based on reports of groundwater contamination.

Comments Darrin?

Is it "somewhere" near Chernobyl yet? :lol

[Borat Sagyidev]

The 802 is an accurate dosimeter. I've used these types a time or two during my inspections with the IAEA. It's not all that common here in the US.

Having said that, I'm not sure about it's accuracy for surface readings such as the ones being performed in this video. To put the numbers in context, 5.77 uSv/hr (the max seen I think) equates to roughly 14 times normal background radiation dose. Radiation accumulates in dirt (during visits to Chernobyl, one of the biggest rules was to stay on the asphalt or concrete) Understand, that you'd need to have an unshielded body part in constant contact with that patch of dirt for a year to get to that 14x exposure level. At one meter, which is the average height of the lowest body parts which are radiation sensitive (I'll let your imaginations figure that out.....), the dose rate is 1/1000th of what it is at the point he took those readings (which is the surface). We can also presume that said body parts are covered so that dose is predominantly from gammas. :lol

Note also that the cumulative dose on that dosimeter reads 11.4 uSv, well below the threshold for worry.

I'm not downplaying the severity of this event. I'm simply putting what you see in the video in it's proper context. It's good that people are taking the initiative and reading the dose rate regularly. With what's been coming from the Japanese government and TEPCO, you can't be too cautious.


IAEA? I have a feeling I know you. Keep up the good work. Just got back from Japan myself and have similar sentiments on the situation.

Also, 5.77 uSv/hr in soil may be also indicative of an potential internal exposure, and I'm sure you know, could have bigger implications. Although, I'm more concerned about crude products in soil personally. Toulene, Benzene, etc are more widespread contaminants than this but you won't hear most complain about that, conservative or liberal..

The highest external exposure recorded in the video was at 5.77 uSv/hr and is near the 5 rem annual limit for US radiation workers..but it would require 24/7 exposure. Not really practical and not an big deal since the 5 rem whole body limit is well below any attributable effects, many communities get more than this from background exposure

Good job keeping comments under control, especially with Wild Cobra, Darrin, Yoni and Mouse . Every time I lurk here I notice their "expert" claims on every matter that sound ridiculous . Especially on topics like this. It doesn't help when people who actually protect the public from things like this are given spokespeople that dedicate their worthless lives to comment posting.

Mouse:
People who scream constantly about small amounts of radiation , even on the other side of the world while ignoring the petrochemical plant a few miles away with multiple issues have a mental disorder, It's called "stupid." Next thing you know, we will have faked nuclear energy just like the moon landings.

Wild Cobra:
Just "knowing a guy on a nuclear sub" or being in the "nuclear theater in Europe" does not qualify you to say anything relevant on this matter. Heck, you still think Saddam had nuclear WMD's.

Allah, God, Rah bless America.

[Wild Cobra]

I still want to know if they call it "The Brazil Syndrome" over there.

[boutons_deux]

It keeps getting "better"

High levels of radioactive strontium fund near Fukushima

More bad news from Japan – in the wake of last week’s revelation that 3 of the 4 reactors had gone into meltdown and beyond, we now learn that high levels of radioactivity – in particular, particles of strontium 89 and 90 – are being found in groundwater and sea water around the facility, and even further than 60 miles away.

Now that they’re finding levels of strontium up to 240 times the legal limit (via), it’s a whole other ball game. When you ingest strontium 90 into your body – either by breathing it, drinking it in water, or eating it in your food – it gravitates toward your bones. It remains there for years, irradiating your tissues and potentially causing bone cancer or leukemia. And stontium doesn’t decay quickly – it has a half-life of 29 years, keeping the danger level in the hundreds of years.

And now it’s in the soil, in the groundwater, and in the ocean. As it’s ingested by plants and animals up the food chain, it will get more and more concentrated, too. Seafood from the region will be too toxic to eat for years, and agriculture in the surrounding country will be completely out of the question.

Source: Red Green & Blue (http://s.tt/12Eon)

[Agloco]

I still want to know if they call it "The Brazil Syndrome" over there.

Why?

[Wild Cobra]

Why?
As opposed to us here in the USA calling a meltdown The China Syndrome. Just adding some humor, but you're not originally from the states. Are you. I'm thinking you missed the cultural reference.

Brazil is the closest country opposite Japan on the globe.

Wiki; China Syndrome (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_syndrome):
The China Syndrome is a term invented to describe one possible result of a severe nuclear meltdown in which molten reactor core components penetrate their containment vessel and building. The term is misleading, since molten material from such an event could not melt through the crust of the Earth nor reach China from USA.