Foundational Falshoods of Creationism

[spurraider21]

discipline is also a non-issue and since the classes are so small, she's automatically on the volleyball and basketball teams
yeah that's another aspect, terrible sports. i actually made the soccer team at my school

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Way too many questions to address especially if you are not willing to discuss it, but rather only want to see a very narrow view of things.
Yes, your view of Christianity is extremely limited and narrow minded, because Christianity encompasses quite a large number of faiths and few of them agree on much except that Jesus Christ was the Son of God.
The rest is open to each sects interpretation, but you focus entirely on just one interpretation.
That, my friend, is a limited narrow minded viewpoint.
Do you understand this?
Plus you make open ended statements that you apparently contend are true for all, when in fact it is NOT shared by ALL elements of Christianity.
This is why it is practically impossible to have a discussion with you on this topic.
Maybe my criticism of you being a pseudo intellectual is harsh, but this is exactly what one of those does.

I am not your friend and empty platitudes are contemptible.

It's funny, ever since I pointed out how your discussion of universal rhythms being pseudo-intellectual nonsense, you have despearately tried to pin it on me. That was months ago and you claim that you don't hold grudges. Are you just typical cognitive dissonance or are you simply another lying piece of shit?

I get that you are afraid of the answers you came up with regrading my questions and believe me it is not lost on anyone that you dodge them in a very cowardly fashion as you pointedly ignore my response to your claims of my overgeneralization.

Anyway i am done feeding your desperate need for attention. Have fun trolling the others.

[xmas1997]

I am not your friend and empty platitudes are contemptible.

It's funny, ever since I pointed out how your discussion of universal rhythms being pseudo-intellectual nonsense, you have despearately tried to pin it on me. That was months ago and you claim that you don't hold grudges. Are you just typical cognitive dissonance or are you simply another lying piece of shit?

I get that you are afraid of the answers you came up with regrading my questions and believe me it is not lost on anyone that you dodge them in a very cowardly fashion as you pointedly ignore my response to your claims of my overgeneralization.

Anyway i am done feeding your desperate need for attention. Have fun trolling the others.

I was the one who said you were the pseudo intellectual here, not the other way around.
This is well known.
It is not that I don't want to discuss it with you in a rational reasonable manner, but in the past you have shown absolutely no inclination to do that.
Rather you chose to deflect, misrepresent, and take things out of context, to support your views.
Plus you take a very narrow minded view of things that can only be talked about in general, and then you generalize them as if it were true for all parties concerned, not to mention you attribute to me statements that I never make, and it just does not work that way.
You can't do this and have a competent discussion when you fly all over the subject and apply one tenet from one sect and apply it to all sects.
It just does not work that way.

[boutons_deux]

"Fucking bible god is such an asshole"

the OT God was one crazy, sadistic, vengeful mofo, that's why "Christians" prefer the OT God to that socialist, banker-hating, revolutionary, poor-loving hippy of the NT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrlWOhtj3g

[RandomGuy]

I read the bible plenty.

Maybe you can answer this one:

There are quite a few instances where Yahweh orders the wholesale slaughter of towns.

Joshua 8:1-29
Joshua 6:20-21
Judges 20:48
Exodus 32:26-29

Etc, etc.

If you were ordered by the Lord to hack children to death, would you do it?
[first time question was asked-RG]
Remember:
You can't know God's plan, He could ask this of you tomorrow.


I doubt God would ask of me to murder children. And you're reading with an agenda. You aren't looking for answers. You're looking to find things that are wrong or flawed in your eyes. Those were different times and different sets of laws and different circumstances.




No one knows God's plan.

God commanded others to kill in His name.

You can't know that. Doubt all you want.

The question would remain. If God commanded you to kill children, would you?
second time question was asked-RG]





Really? Really? LOL, and you claim to read the Bible.


Not really an answer to the question.

That is the second or third time you have dodged it.

If God commanded you to kill children, would you?
[third time question was asked-RG]
You can't or won't answer it, and that should tell you something about your belief system.

It won't go away. Yes or no?



Because you are stupid and clearly do not read the Bible. God's plan is very clear in the Bible.

He wouldn't ask me that. Why would I answer a question I know God wouldn't ask me.

You really are an idiot. You do realize that in most cases you referred to were instances of war in a very different time and era.

I am an idiot, but you, who are smarter than I am, cannot answer a simple yes or no question that my childern could easily answer, were I to ask them.


I gon't give a flying fuck what the time or era was, I would say hacking 2 year olds to death with swords is immoral.

You however, have to make that excuse, because you think the God you believe in is some source of morals.

Let's put it this way then, since you aren't being intellectually honest. I can give you some more rope. For the fourth time.

If you were a soldier in Moses' army, would you have hacked infants to death? Would you have thought it moral then, since God commanded it?

[RandomGuy]

Yeah, because evil bible really isn't biased at all. :lmao

A website that is biased against smoking and tells you that smoking is bad for you is still right about smoking. Their claims are either valid, or they aren't, independent of their bias.

This is a logical fail, known as an ad hominem logical fallacy.

[RandomGuy]

And for the millionth time, you speak to me as if I am the official spokesman of the Bible and then end all be all to these questions. I don't know all of the answers. Your smugness isn't helping you at all. You act is if you're winning at something just because I can't answer all of your questions. As stated before, there are plenty of people who know more about the subjects at hand. You can find them all around if you really want answers.

You are not the spokesman of the Bible. You are, however, your own man, capable of reaching your own conclusions, and taking responsibility for yourself, your beliefs and your actions.

You have never considered these questions before, because you have only been exposed to people who reinforce your pre-existing beliefs, and don't want you to think for yourself.

Beginning to do so, is hard, very hard. That is why you are struggling so much to answer a simple question.

All I am doing is asking you to step outside your pre-existing beliefs and take a look at what you really believe. If they are worth having, they are worth being honest about.

That is my only agenda. Ultimately, I am concerned about your well-being, and that of others. Believing that the Bible is 100% real is actively harmful, and the excuses you are having to make for it should be a clue to you about how and why that is.

To me, a God worth worshipping would not require me to make excuses, and would allow me to make my case honestly.

[RD2191]

You're an idiot. I honestly don't know what the fuck you're even talking about. All of your questions are stupid and idiotic and make zero sense. I know what I believe and I am sure of what I believe. You ask me if I would murder children if God asked me to do it. My answer is simple. God wouldn't ask me that so that is my answer. All of your examples are also stupid, seeing as at that time the people being instructed to attack were Gods chosen people at the time. Unlike spurraider, you really seem to have some sort of hatred towards God and the Bible. That's on you though.

[leemajors]

You're an idiot. I honestly don't know what the fuck you're even talking about. All of your questions are stupid and idiotic and make zero sense. I know what I believe and I am sure of what I believe. You ask me if I would murder children if God asked me to do it. My answer is simple. God wouldn't ask me that so that is my answer. All of your examples are also stupid, seeing as at that time the people being instructed to attack were Gods chosen people at the time. Unlike spurraider, you really seem to have some sort of hatred towards God and the Bible. That's on you though.

little of this makes sense, you're arguing that he is an asshole and calling him an idiot.

[RandomGuy]

Why won't God heal amputees?:lmao What a stupid question.

Does God answer prayers?

[RD2191]

little of this makes sense, you're arguing that he is an asshole and calling him an idiot.
He is an idiot, his questions are also stupid.

[RD2191]

Does God answer prayers?
Of course he does. Does he answer all prayers? No. Is an amputee gonna grow a leg or an arm back just because they pray for it? No. That's not the way things work.

[leemajors]

He is an idiot, his questions are also stupid.

You having no idea how to address them doesn't make them stupid.

[RD2191]

You having no idea how to address them doesn't make them stupid.
Why would I address them when they don't make any sense. All of his questions are answered in the Bible. He doesn't want an answer. He just wants something to argue about.

[RD2191]

Would I murder children if God asked me to? God wouldn't ask me that so how can I answer a question that I will never be asked.

Does God answer prayers? Yes, he does.

Will God give amputees limbs when they ask for them? As of now, no.

[leemajors]

Why would I address them when they don't make any sense. All of his questions are answered in the Bible. He doesn't want an answer. He just wants something to argue about.

He wants you to substantiate your claims, and you can't begin to besides "it's in the bible." From his replies, it appears he is better versed in the bible than yourself. I'm done here.

[RD2191]

He wants you to substantiate your claims, and you can't begin to besides "it's in the bible." From his replies, it appears he is better versed in the bible than yourself. I'm done here.
Yeah, sure he is. What kind of idiot asks why God doesn't heal amputees? He doesn't even know that most of his examples are also prophecy. Yeah, you're done getting your ass handed to you.

[xmas1997]

:lmao
Rob, owning the trolls as usual and making a laughing stock out of blake and his ignorant troll buddies.

[leemajors]

Yeah, sure he is. What kind of idiot asks why God doesn't heal amputees? He doesn't even know that most of his examples are also prophecy. Yeah, you're done getting your ass handed to you.

I believe the words you are looking for are allegory and/or metaphor. Ass handed to me, :lol

[RD2191]

I believe the words you are looking for are allegory and/or metaphor. Ass handed to me, :lol
I'm talking about his question on murdering children, asshat. The verses he posted are ones of prophecy. Keep it going though.

[RD2191]

:lmao
Rob, owning the trolls as usual and making a laughing stock out of blake and his ignorant troll buddies.
Someone has to keep these guys in check. Good work on chump over in the Spurs forum.

[RD2191]

Oh any by the way. The prophecy on Babylon stand to this day. Twice Saddam has tried to rebuild it and twice he has failed. Shove that in your pipe and smoke it.

[RD2191]

Maybe you didn't post any passages on Babylon but either way, just an example of Bible prophecy.

[RD2191]

Isaiah 13:19,2019 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/13/#v23013019) And Babylon, the most glorious of kingdoms,The beauty and the pride of the Chal·de′ans,Will be like Sod′om and Go·mor′rah when God overthrew them.20 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/13/#v23013020) She will never be inhabited,
Nor will she be a place to reside in throughout all generations.No Arab will pitch his tent there,
And no shepherds will rest their flocks there.

[leemajors]

Oh any by the way. The prophecy on Babylon stand to this day. Twice Saddam has tried to rebuild it and twice he has failed. Shove that in your pipe and smoke it.

The Muslims rebuilt it into the cultural center of their kingdom -it was the largest city in the world in the Middle Ages (pop over 1 million), and it thrived until Gengis Kahn destroyed it and everyone in it that wasn't a scholar.

[RD2191]

The Muslims rebuilt it into the cultural center of their kingdom -it was the largest city in the world in the Middle Ages (pop over 1 million), and it thrived until Gengis Kahn destroyed it and everyone in it that wasn't a scholar.
Is it inhabited today?

[RD2191]

So whoever has tried to rebuild it and live in it has gotten their ass handed to them? Thank you and good day.

[leemajors]

nah, that was pure bullshit. baghdad and babylon are 50 miles apart. thanks for playing.

[RD2191]

:lol

[RD2191]

From what I've read the Muslims invaded but pretty much did away with it as a city.

[Blake]

Yeah, sure he is. What kind of idiot asks why God doesn't heal amputees? He doesn't even know that most of his examples are also prophecy. Yeah, you're done getting your ass handed to you.

The point is that Bible God heals only specific types of illness which means there's no point in having faith that he can do anything.

you and xmas high fiving each other in this thread is hilarious. :lmao

[xmas1997]

The point is that Bible God heals only specific types of illness which means there's no point in having faith that he can do anything.

you and xmas high fiving each other in this thread is hilarious. :lmao

Are you still arguing about things you know nothing about?
That is as you say, a stupid thing to do.
Stupid is, as stupid does.
:lmao

[Blake]

Stupid is, as stupid does.
:lmao

Oh look. A Forrest Gump burn.

Next will be more '90s cracks like "you're smart........















































































....not.

":lmao"

[xmas1997]

Oh look. A candy bar.

Next will be my cracks............snot.":lmao"

What a mature adult response. ^
How does it feel for Rob to always educate you to the point of owning?
Inquiring minds want to know.

[spurraider21]

Of course he does. Does he answer all prayers? No. Is an amputee gonna grow a leg or an arm back just because they pray for it? No. That's not the way things work.
why would he heal cancer patients but not paraplegics

[RD2191]

why would he heal cancer patients but not paraplegics
Who said he cures cancer patients?

[spurraider21]

Who said he cures cancer patients?
you'd be surprised

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/01/05/a-gift-from-god-woman-and-her-doctor-say-prayer-miraculously-healed-her-malignant-cancerous-tumor/

[RD2191]

you'd be surprised

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/01/05/a-gift-from-god-woman-and-her-doctor-say-prayer-miraculously-healed-her-malignant-cancerous-tumor/
Odds are something else cured her cancer, I'm not saying God didn't do it, but from my understanding God no longer performs miracles. I could be wrong and will do more research though. What do you think cured it?

[leemajors]

Odds are something else cured her cancer, I'm not saying God didn't do it, but from my understanding God no longer performs miracles. I could be wrong and will do more research though. What do you think cured it?

The Eagles

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Rob is christian of convenience like most American christians. Simply ignore all the stuff about slavery, baby killing, eternal torture and suffering, etc and pick and choose the stuff that you like.

:lol God would never order the deaths of babies except when he does.

Its little surprise. It is the religion that gives pedophiles an institutional pass after all.

[RandomGuy]

I read the bible plenty.

Maybe you can answer this one:

There are quite a few instances where Yahweh orders the wholesale slaughter of towns.

Joshua 8:1-29
Joshua 6:20-21
Judges 20:48
Exodus 32:26-29

Etc, etc.

If you were ordered by the Lord to hack children to death, would you do it?
[first time question was asked-RG]
Remember:
You can't know God's plan, He could ask this of you tomorrow.


I doubt God would ask of me to murder children. And you're reading with an agenda. You aren't looking for answers. You're looking to find things that are wrong or flawed in your eyes. Those were different times and different sets of laws and different circumstances.




No one knows God's plan.

God commanded others to kill in His name.

You can't know that. Doubt all you want.

The question would remain. If God commanded you to kill children, would you?
second time question was asked-RG]





Really? Really? LOL, and you claim to read the Bible.


Not really an answer to the question.

That is the second or third time you have dodged it.

If God commanded you to kill children, would you?
[third time question was asked-RG]
You can't or won't answer it, and that should tell you something about your belief system.

It won't go away. Yes or no?



Because you are stupid and clearly do not read the Bible. God's plan is very clear in the Bible.

He wouldn't ask me that. Why would I answer a question I know God wouldn't ask me.

You really are an idiot. You do realize that in most cases you referred to were instances of war in a very different time and era.


I am an idiot, but you, who are smarter than I am, cannot answer a simple yes or no question that my childern could easily answer, were I to ask them.


I gon't give a flying fuck what the time or era was, I would say hacking 2 year olds to death with swords is immoral.

You however, have to make that excuse, because you think the God you believe in is some source of morals.

Let's put it this way then, since you aren't being intellectually honest. I can give you some more rope. For the fourth time.

If you were a soldier in Moses' army, would you have hacked infants to death? Would you have thought it moral then, since God commanded it?



God wouldn't ask me that so that is my answer.

You're right. God would command you.


Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

All the inhabitants. Men, women, toddlers and babies.


1) If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB)


The LORD then gave these further instructions to Moses: 'Tell the people of Israel to keep my Sabbath day, for the Sabbath is a sign of the covenant between me and you forever. It helps you to remember that I am the LORD, who makes you holy. Yes, keep the Sabbath day, for it is holy. Anyone who desecrates it must die; anyone who works on that day will be cut off from the community. Work six days only, but the seventh day must be a day of total rest. I repeat: Because the LORD considers it a holy day, anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death.' (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT)


"Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, "Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children. But do not touch anyone with the mark. Begin your task right here at the Temple." So they began by killing the seventy leaders. "Defile the Temple!" the LORD commanded. "Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!" So they went throughout the city and did as they were told." (Ezekiel 9:5-7 NLT)

More killing children directly commanded by the Lord you worship.

Of course the Lord is not content with having others kill for him. Sometimes he actively decides to massacre children.


If even then you remain hostile toward me and refuse to obey, I will inflict you with seven more disasters for your sins. I will release wild animals that will kill your children and destroy your cattle, so your numbers will dwindle and your roads will be deserted. (Leviticus 26:21-22 NLT)

It goes on...

The Bible God did command to kill, and killed a lot. So we can throw aside the "he wouldn't" because "he did", IF the Bible is true, as you think it is.

So, your excuse is to claim that you KNOW the mind of GOD, who created the universe.

The question remains. Fifth time.

If God had commanded you to hack children to death, if you had been there, worshiping the same God you do now, would you have?

[RandomGuy]

He is an idiot, his questions are also stupid.

That uncomfortable feeling is called "cognitive dissonance".

Easier to call me an idiot, than to think about the question, despite how important it is.

It is ok. I understand.

If you were to quit reading the bible without an agenda, and open your eyes, you might see.

[RandomGuy]

Rob is christian of convenience like most American christians. Simply ignore all the stuff about slavery, baby killing, eternal torture and suffering, etc and pick and choose the stuff that you like.

:lol God would never order the deaths of babies except when he does.

Its little surprise. It is the religion that gives pedophiles an institutional pass after all.

I haven't even gotten to slavery yet.

[Blake]

Who said he cures cancer patients?

Bible says he heals the blind.

he'll give eyes, just not arms or legs.

[johnsmith]

Don't worry Robdiaz, randomguy has made WAY smarter people than you look stupid on this website.

Oh, and celebrating with the site jester doesn't help your argument. You're losing regardless of if an idiot says different.


But hey, at least you called him names a lot.

[boutons_deux]

Bible says he heals the blind.

he'll give eyes, just not arms or legs.

He needs to heal all y'all ignorant creationists, so blinded by infantile Bible literalism.

[johnsmith]

He needs to heal all y'all ignorant creationists, so blinded by infantile Bible literalism.

You realize that the people arguing in here will believe you and don't understand sarcasm right?

[xmas1997]

He needs to heal all y'all ignorant creationists, so blinded by infantile Bible literalism.

Wow, truer words were never uttered. Ignorance reigns!
:lol

[Blake]

You realize that the people arguing in here will believe you and don't understand sarcasm right?

Lol right on cue


Wow, truer words were never uttered. Ignorance reigns!
:lol

[Big Empty]

Do any of you athiest believe there was a preacher man named Jesus that wasnt God? Do you feel the whole Jesus character is made up?

[Blake]

Do any of you athiest believe there was a preacher man named Jesus that wasnt God? Do you feel the whole Jesus character is made up?

yeh, there's probably enough evidence of there being a galilean Jew named Jesus.

[johnsmith]

Wow, truer words were never uttered. Ignorance reigns!
:lol

Wow

[leemajors]

yeh, there's probably enough evidence of there being a galilean Jew named Jesus.

Yeshua or Joshua was the more likely name.

[boutons_deux]

Do any of you athiest believe there was a preacher man named Jesus that wasnt God? Do you feel the whole Jesus character is made up?

I think He was very probably a real person, very highly evolved intellectually, spiritually, emotionally, and charismatic.

Was He the unique Number One Greatest World Champion in human history with those characteristics? HELL NO

There were lots of competing world views in the first and succeeding centuries.

I think the marketing around Jesus (which was not by Jesus himself), esp decades, centuries after his death was/is bullshit to sucker people into Christianity.

Christ's marketers hyped Him dishonestly to beat the other world views.

Our guy is better than your guy because:

1. He is really God

2. He came back from the dead, and all you are born guilty with "He died for your sins", so you guilty sinners must suffer like hell to pay Him back.

3. He performed miracles.

4. He didn't come about from a man's sperm.

5. And the banal inevitable in all world views: if you aren't a Christian, you're going to hell.

6. And make your 10% check out to .... ( Christ just can't manage his finances (George Carlin). )

[RD2191]

:lolRG is stupid, there is no way around that. All of his questions have been answered. He conveniently runs away and comes back the next day with paragraph answers.

[RD2191]

Oh and God wouldn't command me to kill children, idiot. Wanna keep on getting your ass handed to you? Your knowledge on the Bible is terrible.

[RD2191]

Rob is christian of convenience like most American christians. Simply ignore all the stuff about slavery, baby killing, eternal torture and suffering, etc and pick and choose the stuff that you like.

:lol God would never order the deaths of babies except when he does.

Its little surprise. It is the religion that gives pedophiles an institutional pass after all.
Who said I was a christian? Talking out of your ass.

[xmas1997]

Lol right on cue

Few people in here understand sarcasm unfortunately, that is why some of us use the blue font.
By the same token even fewer people here can use sarcasm in an effective humorous way.
See blake, the pseudo theology professor.
:lmao

[RD2191]

Don't worry Robdiaz, randomguy has made WAY smarter people than you look stupid on this website.

Oh, and celebrating with the site jester doesn't help your argument. You're losing regardless of if an idiot says different.


But hey, at least you called him names a lot.
He doesn't even know what prophecy is. His questions also make zero sense. If he had any knowledge of the Bible he would know why God doesn't heal amputees.

[RD2191]

That uncomfortable feeling is called "cognitive dissonance".

Easier to call me an idiot, than to think about the question, despite how important it is.

It is ok. I understand.

If you were to quit reading the bible without an agenda, and open your eyes, you might see.
lol idiot

[RD2191]

You're right. God would command you.



All the inhabitants. Men, women, toddlers and babies.







More killing children directly commanded by the Lord you worship.

Of course the Lord is not content with having others kill for him. Sometimes he actively decides to massacre children.



It goes on...

The Bible God did command to kill, and killed a lot. So we can throw aside the "he wouldn't" because "he did", IF the Bible is true, as you think it is.

So, your excuse is to claim that you KNOW the mind of GOD, who created the universe.

The question remains. Fifth time.

If God had commanded you to hack children to death, if you had been there, worshiping the same God you do now, would you have?
:lolSame question same answer.

[RD2191]

Any more stupid questions?

[xmas1997]

lol idiot

:lmao
Keep up the good work of bashing these trolls, Rob.
They don't know if you are coming or going at this point.
And they are even getting the concept of sarcasm mixed up.
:rollin

[RD2191]

:lmao
Keep up the good work of bashing these trolls, Rob.
They don't know if you are coming or going at this point.
And they are even getting the concept of sarcasm mixed up.
:rollin
:lolEh, RG is just an ignorant piece of crap, his questions have been answered. I already explained that those were different times and people had different views and ways of life. He can keep spinning however he likes but all that does in confirm that he has never actually read the Bible in the way it is supposed to be read.

[Bill_Brasky]

lol 5 posts in a row. definitely not buttmad that someone is shitting all over your precious faggot book......

[spurraider21]

Who said I was a christian?
lol wut

[RandomGuy]

https://voicesofglass.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/surrender.jpg

Sokay. I accept your surrender on that point.

You can't answer it honestly.

You can't:

1) Admit the God you believe in commanded people to kill, despite the bible quotes to the contrary.

or

2) Admit you would have to kill children if God told you to, as your faith requires.

The reason for that, by the way:


In psychology, cognitive dissonance is the excessive mental stress and discomfort[1] experienced by an individual who (1) holds two or more contradictory beliefs, ideas, or values at the same time or (2) is confronted by new information that conflicts with existing beliefs, ideas, or values. Included, stress and discomfort may also arise within an individual who holds a belief and performs a contradictory action or reaction.

You hold the belief that you are a decent person.
You hold the belief that Bible God is loving, and must be obeyed.

For your belief in God to be loving, God cannot have ordered evil acts.
For your belief in yourself to be decent, you would not commit evil acts.

When shown that God, by His own words, is evil, and unloving, you have to simply reject that out of hand, and then attack me.

That is how you reduce that discomfort.

It isn't, sadly, how you get to truth.

That is the kind of thing that minds do, in order to believe things they know on some level to be false. Bible God is not loving, and is, arguably, an evil psychopath.

[RandomGuy]

:lolEh, RG is just an ignorant piece of crap, his questions have been answered. I already explained that those were different times and people had different views and ways of life. He can keep spinning however he likes but all that does in confirm that he has never actually read the Bible in the way it is supposed to be read.

I am always willing to keep an open mind, despite what you might think. I want only to believe as many true things as possible, and reject as many false things as possible.

How is it "supposed to be read"?

[xmas1997]

:lolEh, RG is just an ignorant piece of crap, his questions have been answered. I already explained that those were different times and people had different views and ways of life. He can keep spinning however he likes but all that does in confirm that he has never actually read the Bible in the way it is supposed to be read.

And blake has?

That's a laugh in and of itself. :lol

The atheistic pseudo theologian who sends his child to a religious school and at the same time makes fun of theists!

How hypocritical can someone get?

And then he does absolutely nothing in life and never ever adds anything to any discussion except "criticize"!

Where does he have any wiggle room whatsoever to criticize anything, or anyone, when he has shown himself to be nothing but a dismal failure at life, when he doesn't even have a successful marriage to fall back on!

And then he feels qualified to criticize others?

How much more hypocritical can you get?

It's what makes me think it is all a vast fantasy make believe world he has made up to give his pathetic life some meaning, because he is really just a 13, 14, or 15 year old kid, and a loser on top of that!

:lmao

[RandomGuy]

He doesn't even know what prophecy is. His questions also make zero sense. If he had any knowledge of the Bible he would know why God doesn't heal amputees.

I know the bible far better than you do.

T
The Bible clearly promises that God answers prayers. For example, in Mark 11:24 Jesus says, "Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours." And billions of Christians believe these promises. You can find thousands of books, magazine articles and Web sites talking about the power of prayer. According to believers, God is answering millions of their prayers every day.

So what should happen if we pray to God to restore amputated limbs? Clearly, if God is real, limbs should regenerate through prayer. In reality, they do not.

[RD2191]

:lmaoWhat a garbage take.

[RD2191]

God no longer performs miracles so why would he grant limbs to whoever asks for them? God does not listen to all prayers.

[RD2191]

lol 5 posts in a row. definitely not buttmad that someone is shitting all over your precious faggot book......
that's all you got queer?

[RD2191]

I know the bible far better than you do.

T
Evilbible.com? :lmao

[RD2191]

And blake has?

That's a laugh in and of itself. :lol

The atheistic pseudo theologian who sends his child to a religious school and at the same time makes fun of theists!

How hypocritical can someone get?

And then he does absolutely nothing in life and never ever adds anything to any discussion except "criticize"!

Where does he have any wiggle room whatsoever to criticize anything, or anyone, when he has shown himself to be nothing but a dismal failure at life, when he doesn't even have a successful marriage to fall back on!

And then he feels qualified to criticize others?

How much more hypocritical can you get?

It's what makes me think it is all a vast fantasy make believe world he has made up to give his pathetic life some meaning, because he is really just a 13, 14, or 15 year old kid, and a loser on top of that!

:lmao
Go easy on him pal, these dudes are some special kind of people. Not all there if you know what I mean.

[RD2191]

What part of Gods chosen people against Gods enemies do you not understand? Are you really that stupid?

[RandomGuy]

How Prayer Works

For believers, it is obvious why so many prayers are answered. In the Bible, Jesus promises many times that he will answer our prayers. For example, in Matthew 7:7 Jesus says:


Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!

Ask and you will receive. What could be simpler than that?
In Matthew 17:20 Jesus reiterates that same message:


For truly, I say to you, if you have faith as a grain of mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move; and nothing will be impossible to you.

Since a mustard seed is a tiny inanimate object about the size of a grain of salt, it is easy to imagine that the faith of a mustard seed is fairly small. So, paraphrasing, what Jesus is saying is that if you have the tiniest bit of faith, you can move mountains.

Jesus says something similar in Matthew 21:21:


I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done. If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.
The message is reiterated Mark 11:24:


Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

In John chapter 14, verses 12 through 14, Jesus tells all of us just how easy prayer can be:

"Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I go to the Father. Whatever you ask in my name, I will do it, that the Father may be glorified in the Son; if you ask anything in my name, I will do it.
In Matthew 18:19 Jesus says it again:


Again I say to you, if two of you agree on earth about anything they ask, it will be done for them by my Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

Seems pretty unambiguous.

Prayers will be answered.

Unless, of course, they aren't.

[RD2191]

And God wouldn't ask me to kill people. Do you wanna keep going?

[RD2191]

Yawn, I don't want copy and paste.

[RD2191]

:sleep

[RandomGuy]

Excuses, excuses

I get it already. You have made up your mind to ignore how evil God is, and that I am an idiot for pointing out the obvious to you.

Sheesh. I have moved on.

[RD2191]

And like I said, God does answer prayers. Will he give amputees limbs? No.

[RD2191]

I get it already. You have made up your mind to ignore how evil God is, and that I am an idiot for pointing out the obvious to you.

Sheesh. I have moved on.
No you haven't. Which is why you're still crying and getting your ass handed to you. You have provided nothing of significance.

[mrsmaalox]

lol wut

I admit I've only popped in here to read now and then, but his "logic" pretty much screams Jehovah's Witness

[RD2191]

When did I say I was a christian? Seriously. I said I one day hope to be able to call myself a christian.

[xmas1997]

:lolEh, RG is just an ignorant piece of crap, his questions have been answered. I already explained that those were different times and people had different views and ways of life. He can keep spinning however he likes but all that does in confirm that he has never actually read the Bible in the way it is supposed to be read.

I know you have some differences of opinion with RG, But I like the guy even though he and I differ on a few things too, he is cool, and I can honestly say he does try to be open minded. He has an excellent lay mans grasp of a lot of things, religion and Christianity being a couple, just as you do, and you both try to throw in humor whenever you both can.

Just as you lean a little more toward one side of the issue, he seems to lean a little more toward the other.

And he seems to like "playing the devils' advocate" a lot.

I think he has mentioned before that his wife is employed in the biological science field and yet has no problems balancing that with being a Christian herself and defending her Christianity, plus he is a Christian too if I am not mistaken.

So things are all relative, one mans' poison, is another mans' pie.

[RD2191]

:lmaoYour interpretation of what prayer is for. Ho Lee shit, you really are a borderline tard.

[RandomGuy]

Yawn, I don't want copy and paste.


14 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/james/2/#v59002014) Of what benefit is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but he does not have works?+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8914259/) That faith cannot save him, can it?+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8914265/) 15 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/james/2/#v59002015) If a brother or a sister is lacking clothing* (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/james/2/#fn8914282) and enough food for the day, 16 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/james/2/#v59002016) yet one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but you do not give them what they need for their body, of what benefit is it?+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8914297/) 17 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/james/2/#v59002017) So, too, faith by itself, without works, is dead.+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8914318/)


16 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/matthew/19/#v40019016) Now look! someone came up to him and said: “Teacher, what good must I do to gain everlasting life?”+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8901961/) 17 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/matthew/19/#v40019017) He said to him: “Why do you ask me about what is good? One there is who is good.+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8901989/) If, though, you want to enter into life, observe the commandments continually.”+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8902004/) 18 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/matthew/19/#v40019018) He said to him: “Which ones?” Jesus said: “You must not murder,+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8902036/) you must not commit adultery,+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8902055/) you must not steal,+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8902075/) you must not bear false witness,+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8902089/) 19 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/matthew/19/#v40019019) honor your father and your mother,+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8902121/) and you must love your neighbor as yourself.”+ (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/mcr/8902141/) 20 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/matthew/19/#v40019020)

Sure, if you say so.

I can get to the point:

Bible says God will answer prayers, pretty much without fail. No ifs, ands, or buts.

Prayers aren't answered. Not even close.

Every time a Christian says, "The Lord answered my prayer," what we are seeing instead is a simple coincidence or the natural effects of self-talk. Christians never discuss failed prayers, but if we look at all the prayers that fail as well as the prayers that work, a statistical analysis proves that God does not answer prayers.

[RD2191]

I know you have some differences of opinion with RG, But I like the guy even though he and I differ on a few things too, he is cool, and I can honestly say he does try to be open minded. He has an excellent lay mans grasp of a lot of things, religion and Christianity being a couple, just as you do, and you both try to throw in humor whenever you both can.

Just as you lean a little more toward one side of the issue, he seems to lean a little more toward the other.

And he seems to like "playing the devils' advocate" a lot.

I think he has mentioned before that his wife is employed in the biological science field and yet has no problems balancing that with being a Christian herself and defending her Christianity, plus he is a Christian too if I am not mistaken.

So things are all relative, one mans' poison, is another mans' pie.
Not really, RG is obviously an idiot who doesn't understand even the simplist things in the Bible. All of his questions are there answered in the Bible. He is copying and pasting from a website called evilbible.com. I mean really? That's really thinking for oneself isn't it?:lol

[RD2191]

Sure, if you say so.

I can get to the point:

Bible says God will answer prayers, pretty much without fail. No ifs, ands, or buts.

Prayers aren't answered. Not even close.

Every time a Christian says, "The Lord answered my prayer," what we are seeing instead is a simple coincidence or the natural effects of self-talk. Christians never discuss failed prayers, but if we look at all the prayers that fail as well as the prayers that work, a statistical analysis proves that God does not answer prayers.
I'm quoting the Bible, different than copying and pasting from a website.

[RandomGuy]

And like I said, God does answer prayers. Will he give amputees limbs? No.

A) God answers prayers.

B) An amputee prays for regenerated limbs.

C) Therefore God does not answer prayers.

Whut?

Do you even see the words coming out of your mind?

[RD2191]

Failed prayer? You mean when people ask for things that they know are impossible? (as of now) Why won't God make my leg grow back? Really? :lol

[RD2191]

A) God answers prayers.

B) An amputee prays for regenerated limbs.

C) Therefore God does not answer prayers.

Whut?

Do you even see the words coming out of your mind?
That is not how prayer works. If you actually opened a Bible you would know what prayer is for and what you can and can not ask for.

[RandomGuy]

I'm quoting the Bible, different than copying and pasting from a website.

Oh yes, much different. I see that now that you pointed that out to me.

http://www.cryptozoic.com/sites/default/files/icme/u2793/rofl_logo.jpg

[RandomGuy]

That is not how prayer works. If you actually opened a Bible you would know what prayer is for and what you can and can not ask for.

Tell me what prayer is for then.

Enlighten me, but try not to use the passages I have already shown that I have read.

Surely I am missing something about God not wanting to answer the prayers of amputees.

[RD2191]

I'm not gonna tell you, you aren't looking for answers. They're in the Bible if you want to find them.

[RandomGuy]

PRAYERS TO ST. FRANCIS FOR OUR PETS:



Good St. Francis, you loved all of God's creatures.
To you they were your brothers and sisters.
Help us to follow your example
of treating every living thing with kindness.
St. Francis, Patron Saint of animals,
watch over my pet
and keep my companion safe and healthy.
Amen.

Prayer is for our pets.
http://www.care2.com/c2c/share/detail/977719

[RD2191]

Don't go to evilbible.com though. You won't find the answers there.

[RandomGuy]

Prayer is for winning football games.
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Sports/2012/0112/Poll-God-helps-Tim-Tebow-win-football-games.-Does-Tim-Tebow-agree

[RD2191]

PRAYERS TO ST. FRANCIS FOR OUR PETS:




Prayer is for our pets.
http://www.care2.com/c2c/share/detail/977719
What does St Francis have to do with the Bible? Damn bro, I'm surprised you can work a computer seeing as you're not all there.

[RandomGuy]

Prayer is for not being depressed:


Jesus Is in the Darkness with You': Praying When Depressed
Read more at http://www.beliefnet.com/Faiths/Christianity/2004/05/Jesus-Is-In-The-Darkness-With-You-Praying-When-Depressed.aspx#04iAZGlFQK0tw6KH.99

[RD2191]

So in other words your posting things dumb people who have no knowledge of the Bible think they can pray for? Sounds like RG.

[xmas1997]

I admit I've only popped in here to read now and then, but his "logic" pretty much screams Jehova's Witness

That is an extremely broad and harsh statement IMHO.
"Screams"? Jehovah Witness? (by the way there is an "h" at the end of "Jehovah", I see you caught it in your edit)
You do realize they are an extremist and fanatical sect, right?
I often wonder WHY it gives you so much pleasure to be one of the ones who always sides with the trolls on here?
That has become your habit of choice apparently.
I guess you haven't yet realized how truly ignorant they really are.
But it is amusing to the rest of us decent, intelligent, and critical thinkers on here, so keep it up.
:lmao

[RandomGuy]

A Prayer for Healing against various diseases and illnesses
December 17, 2010 • 13 Comments

There are different types of healing mentioned in Bible verses–physical healing, emotional healing andPrayer for healing diseases spiritual healing. The Bible has scriptures touching on several aspects of health and healing. There is no formula on how to pray for healing but the bible does offer several scriptures that you can pray verbatim as prayers for healing. We just need to learn what the Bible has to say about healing and pray the scriptures for healing.
The following prayer is for physical healing against sickness and diseases. Prior to praying the prayer try to read and meditate on these scriptures below. They will help to build your faith.
http://www.missionariesofprayer.org/2010/12/prayer-healing-diseases-illnesses/

Prayer is for healing all sorts of diseases.

[RandomGuy]

Prayer is for winning bingo games.
http://www.bingochatter.com/showthread.php?t=5953

[RD2191]

Okay, so where are these in the Bible? Does it say in the Bible that you can pray for football games and pets? Or are you once again talking out of your ass?

[RD2191]

That's what I though.:lol

[RD2191]

Keep the stupid questions coming.

[spurraider21]

When did I say I was a christian? Seriously. I said I one day hope to be able to call myself a christian.
a christian is a believer of christianity, and you have always been arguing that the bible is true and the word of god, etc

[RandomGuy]

Okay, so where are these in the Bible? Does it say in the Bible that you can pray for football games and pets? Or are you once again talking out of your ass?

Already gave you the quotes. Come on, you aren't even trying now.

But prayer isn't for amputees.

Tell me how you know this. I am really dying to know, how you have such insight into the mind of God.

You know he wouldn't ask you to kill children, and you know he will never heal amputees, no matter how hard they pray.


The easy answer is that bible god doesn't exist.

The fascinating thing is that we can prove that prayer has no effect in exactly the same way that we can prove that horseshoes have no effect. We take 1,000 cancer patients. We pray over 500 of them and we leave the other 500 alone. Then we look at cancer remission rates between the two groups. What we find is that prayers have zero benefit. We would see no statistical difference between the remission rates in the two groups of 500 patients.

[RD2191]

Will God give amputees limbs? No.

Will God ask me to murder children? No.

Did God's people at one time murder women and children and an entire city? Yes.

Does that mean that God is evil? No.

[RD2191]

a christian is a believer of christianity, and you have always been arguing that the bible is true and the word of god, etc
It is, but when did I claim to be a christian? If I were a christian I would not be calling RG an idiot and other people on here fags and queers.

[RD2191]

Your stupid questions have been answered RG. Try getting your answers from somewhere other than evilbible.com

[spurraider21]

It is, but when did I claim to be a christian? If I were a christian I would not be calling RG an idiot and other people on here fags and queers.
if you believe in the bible, you are a christian. never said ur a good christian :lol

[RandomGuy]

Sokay. Lunch is over and Rob has waved the white flag.

Again, Rob, despite what you think, I do care for you. It does make me a bit sad that you think all these conflicting, immoral things.

I wish I could show you how to examine these weird things you believe in rationally, in a way that you understand.

Look for answers in the bible. They are there, you just aren't looking hard enough, or honestly enough. Lose the agenda.

[RD2191]

White flag? LOL, I said to keep your stupid questions coming. Just because you think you won doesn't mean you did. You're still obviously an idiot. Good day, asshat.

[RandomGuy]

Will God give amputees limbs? No.

Will God ask me to murder children? No.

Did God's people at one time murder women and children and an entire city? Yes.

Does that mean that God is evil? No.

Hell, give me a working definition of what you think God *is* then.

We can easily test those beliefs to see if they make sense. See you tomorrow.

[RD2191]

Read the Bible and you will find answers, stay away from evilbible.com

[RD2191]

Oh and keep changing the subject every time one of your stupid questions is destroyed.

[mrsmaalox]

That is an extremely broad and harsh statement IMHO.
"Screams"? Jehovah Witness? (by the way there is an "h" at the end of "Jehovah", I see you caught it in your edit)
You do realize they are an extremist and fanatical sect, right?
I often wonder WHY it gives you so much pleasure to be one of the ones who always sides with the trolls on here?
That has become your habit of choice apparently.
I guess you haven't yet realized how truly ignorant they really are.
But it is amusing to the rest of us decent, intelligent, and critical thinkers on here, so keep it up.
:lmao

It's only funny how you always say this AND something extremely stupid in most your posts. Show me where I sided with a anybody in this thread. Show me where I said one view is correct and the other is not. I did no such thing. I responded to someone who questioned Rob's Christianity by stating my own observation that Rob argues like a typical JW. If anything, I was AGREEING with Rob that he is not Chrisitian.

[RD2191]

:wakeup

[Aztecfan03]

A) God answers prayers.

B) An amputee prays for regenerated limbs.

C) Therefore God does not answer prayers.

Whut?

Do you even see the words coming out of your mind?

Read more of the bible.

[RD2191]

RG has zero knowledge of the Bible. That is clear.

[RD2191]

I have the answers to all of his questions. Why would I answer them though when it is clear that he is not looking for the truth. He simply wants to argue about God being evil.

[xmas1997]

It's only funny how you always say this AND something extremely stupid in most your posts. Show me where I sided with a anybody in this thread. Show me where I said one view is correct and the other is not. I did no such thing. I responded to someone who questioned Rob's Christianity by stating my own observation that Rob argues like a typical JW. If anything, I was AGREEING with Rob that he is not Chrisitian.

Ah, I see, the proverbial "backhanded" complement. :lol
Yup, no change here.

[RD2191]

Xmas, I actually have studied with the witnesses though and I do believe they know the truth. I haven't attended any meetings though in a very long time. Have you had a bad experience with them?

[mrsmaalox]

Ah, I see, the proverbial "backhanded" complement. :lol
Yup, no change here.

Good gawd you are stupid. There was no complement there, backhanded or otherwise. Just an observation. You may disagree with my observation and that's fine. Doesn't change the idiocy of you accusing me of taking sides in this religious thread, when I clearly have not.

[RD2191]

http://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/wp20140401/does-god-answer-prayers/#?insight[search_id]=86475ffb-67b5-47b3-b044-42003a262dcb&insight[search_result_index]=45

Pulling an old RG here with answers that are not it my own words. That article should answer some of your questions on prayer if you really are interested.

[DisAsTerBot]

stop catfishing xmas@!&*!!!

[johnsmith]

Robdiaz, you come off as a very angry person...why is that?

[johnsmith]

stop catfishing xmas@!&*!!!

Lol

[RD2191]

Robdiaz, you come off as a very angry person...why is that?
I'm actually a very calm person.

[johnsmith]

I'm actually a very calm person.

Do you generally settle all your intellectual discussions by constant name calling rather then continuing the discussion?

[RD2191]

Do you generally settle all your intellectual discussions by constant name calling rather then continuing the discussion?
I do when the questions being asked have already been answered. Like I said though, my answers don't matter to RG. In his mind the God that he doesn't believe in is evil.

[xmas1997]

Xmas, I actually have studied with the witnesses though and I do believe they know the truth. I haven't attended any meetings though in a very long time. Have you had a bad experience with them?

Yes, many bad experiences with them. They know "some" truths, but they tend to skew and distort the rest to suit their own agendas.
Many "fringe" Christian sects do this, like the "holy Rollers, etc.
I do consider them a very extreme and fanatical sect, but to each his or her own.
No offense meant.
A word to the wise though, just be very very careful, keep an open critical mind, and whatever you do, do not accept their word for anything, rather look and examine everything they say deep "inside yourself", that is where God will provide the true answers to any questions you have.

[johnsmith]

I do when the questions being asked have already been answered. Like I said though, my answers don't matter to RG. In his mind the God that he doesn't believe in is evil.

So you didn't really want to have a discussion with him then?

[johnsmith]

Yes, many bad experiences with them. They know "some" truths, but they tend to skew and distort the rest to suit their own agendas.
Many "fringe" Christian sects do this, like the "holy Rollers, etc.
I do consider them a very extreme and fanatical sect, but to each his or her own.
No offense meant.
A word to the wise though, just be very very careful, keep an open critical mind, and whatever you do, do not accept their word for anything, rather look and examine everything they say deep "inside yourself", that is where God will provide the true answers to any questions you have.

What makes them wrong and you right?

[RD2191]

So you didn't really want to have a discussion with him then?
I did and I am. But as I said before, his questions have been answered. He also has no knowledge regarding the Bible. He is simply picking and choosing verses/passages and taking them out of context.

[RD2191]

Yes, many bad experiences with them. They know "some" truths, but they tend to skew and distort the rest to suit their own agendas.
Many "fringe" Christian sects do this, like the "holy Rollers, etc.
I do consider them a very extreme and fanatical sect, but to each his or her own.
No offense meant.
A word to the wise though, just be very very careful, keep an open critical mind, and whatever you do, do not accept their word for anything, rather look and examine everything they say deep "inside yourself", that is where God will provide the true answers to any questions you have.
I question everything. Which is why I question everything that they preach and their prior history. I am satisfied with the answers they have given me. And no offense taken. You are respectful man with an open mind.

[johnsmith]

I did and I am. Bu as I said before, his questions have been answered. He also has no knowledge regarding the Bible. He is simply picking and choosing verses/passages and taking them out of context.

But if the bible is open to interpretation the way it clearly is, how can someone take passages out of context? If you really wanted to argue or debate or even discuss with him and not come off as a pissed off teenager, you would have refuted his points rather then just saying, "you're taking it out of context and that would never happen....idiot".

[johnsmith]

I question everything. Which is why I question everything that they preach and their prior history. I am satisfied with the answers they have given me. And no offense taken. You are respectful man with an open mind.

Do you think Xmas is a respectful man in general or just to you?

[DisAsTerBot]

I did and I am. But as I said before, his questions have been answered. He also has no knowledge regarding the Bible. He is simply picking and choosing verses/passages and taking them out of context.

im not trying to get in this discussion because it's obviously pointless but the bold part is what the majority, believers and non believers, do. tbhfwiwimo

[RD2191]

But if the bible is open to interpretation the way it clearly is, how can someone take passages out of context? If you really wanted to argue or debate or even discuss with him and not come off as a pissed off teenager, you would have refuted his points rather then just saying, "you're taking it out of context and that would never happen....idiot".
The verses he posted on God being a murderer are not open to interpretation. God did order for HIS people to destroy HIS enemies. As I keep saying, times and customs were different back then. Why God did these things are answered in the Bible. He simply chooses to ignore them.

[Blake]

When did I say I was a christian? Seriously. I said I one day hope to be able to call myself a christian.

What are you waiting for?

[Blake]

The verses he posted on God being a murderer and not open to interpretation. God did order for HIS people to destroy HIS enemies. As I keep saying, times and customs were different back then. Why God did these things are answered in the Bible. He simply chooses to ignore them.

God was too lazy to destroy his own enemies himself.

He must have been taking one of those 7th day/1000 year rest breaks.

[RD2191]

im not trying to get in this discussion because it's obviously pointless but the bold part is what the majority, believers and non believers, do. tbhfwiwimo
I agree, which is the problem with modern day religions. They all worship saints, Mary, and other various things that are not in the Bible. Which is why the Bible states that simply believing in Jesus as many think is not enough to save you.

[johnsmith]

The verses he posted on God being a murderer are not open to interpretation. God did order for HIS people to destroy HIS enemies. As I keep saying, times and customs were different back then. Why God did these things are answered in the Bible. He simply chooses to ignore them.

Why did God do that? I'm really asking here too, I've never read the OT.

[johnsmith]

I agree, which is the problem with modern day religions. They all worship saints, Mary, and other various things that are not in the Bible. Which is why the Bible states that simply believing in Jesus as many think is not enough to save you.

Wait, so you're for or against "modern religions"?

[RD2191]

Wait, so you're for or against "modern religions"?
I'm against false religion.

[Blake]

I agree, which is the problem with modern day religions. They all worship saints, Mary, and other various things that are not in the Bible. Which is why the Bible states that simply believing in Jesus as many think is not enough to save you.

The Bible states that salvation is a free gift.

You're dumb.

[Blake]

Why did God do that? I'm really asking here too, I've never read the OT.

You mean you never read the story of God sending a bear to eat kids just because they made fun of a prophet's receding hair line?

and many more awesome stories....

Why do you waste time at a catholic church?

[johnsmith]

I'm against false religion.

Fair enough...so I assume that according to you "false religion" is anything that isn't in the bible? What about other readings that weren't included in the bible but are attributed to characters that are discussed in the bible?

Also, could you address my other question regarding why God made people wipe out cities?

[RD2191]

Why did God do that? I'm really asking here too, I've never read the OT.
Dude, I really don't know. I haven't read enough on the subject to give you an answer. From what I've read God was pretty much taking back what belonged to him and his people. (Israelites)

[johnsmith]

You mean you never read the story of God sending a bear to eat kids just because they made fun of a prophet's receding hair line?

and many more awesome stories....

Why do you waste time at a catholic church?

Dude, I haven't been to church in several years...but I certainly don't think it's a waste. When I do go (which the wife and I decided we're gonna start again) at the very least, it provides a wonderful sense of community with some very good people that I'd love to have as part of my family's life.

[johnsmith]

Dude, I really don't know. I haven't read enough on the subject to give you an answer. From what I've read God was pretty much taking back what belonged to him and his people. (Israelites)

Wait, wasn't one of your main criticisms of RG that he was talking out of his ass and pulling things out of context? I would think that if you're going to complain about that then you'd certainly have some information to support why you know he was doing that.

[Blake]

Dude, I haven't been to church in several years...but I certainly don't think it's a waste. When I do go (which the wife and I decided we're gonna start again) at the very least, it provides a wonderful sense of community with some very good people that I'd love to have as part of my family's life.

It's certainly one way to meet people.

If it works for you, that's great, but I'd say there are better ways to get involved with the community and making it better than by sitting in a wooden pew on Sunday morning.

Not judging, just saying.

[RD2191]

And to be honest it isn't all that easy to explain, you have to read books before and after to really get a picture of what happened and why it happened. Joshua pretty much took over the Israelites after Moses died. God encouraged him to do so. So Joshua was on a conquest to take the land that God had promised to his people.

[RD2191]

Wait, wasn't one of your main criticisms of RG that he was talking out of his ass and pulling things out of context? I would think that if you're going to complain about that then you'd certainly have some information to support why you know he was doing that.
No, what RG was doing was claiming that God is evil because he supposedly murders children. I simply stated that if he had any knowledge of what happened he would know that that wasn't the case. As I said before. It takes a lot of reading to understand what happened and why it happened.

[Blake]

Dude, I really don't know. I haven't read enough on the subject to give you an answer. From what I've read God was pretty much taking back what belonged to him and his people. (Israelites)

:cry I haven't read the Bible but I know RG is wrong.

:cry I hope to be a Christian some day, faggot.

[Blake]

No, what RG was doing was claiming that God is evil because he supposedly murders children.

You think that only adults died in the Flood?

[RD2191]

I normally avoid laying out my personal stuff on the internets, but hell, I'm reeling so much right now, I'm asking everyone/anyone in sight what to do.

I had some nukes dropped on me this past week regarding the wife, which after looking back the past 1-2 years I should have seen it and I realize I am a fucking idiot. I've mulled over everything a billion times and there's no where to go but to get a divorce.

I have a 7 year old and some have already told me I need to go all out to get full custody. Any other practical advice? Step 1? Step 2?

Fuckity fuck fuck fuck.

:depressed

[Blake]

^ Christian wannabe doing God's work

[RD2191]

I normally avoid laying out my personal stuff on the internets, but hell, I'm reeling so much right now, I'm asking everyone/anyone in sight what to do.

I had some nukes dropped on me this past week regarding the wife, which after looking back the past 1-2 years I should have seen it and I realize I am a fucking idiot. I've mulled over everything a billion times and there's no where to go but to get a divorce.

I have a 7 year old and some have already told me I need to go all out to get full custody. Any other practical advice? Step 1? Step 2?

Fuckity fuck fuck fuck.

:depressed:lol

[johnsmith]

Not gonna lie Rob, criticizing others for "talking out their ass" and then saying, "I can't explain it because, books", doesn't really help your case.

Having said that, you surprised me by answering my questions as honestly as you could and you deserve props for that...not that my approval means dick, but I'm impressed that you made an effort.

[RD2191]

And johsmith, I stated many times before that I do not know everything about the Bible and that I am learning new things every day. I didn't claim to know it all.

[johnsmith]

It's certainly one way to meet people.

If it works for you, that's great, but I'd say there are better ways to get involved with the community and making it better than by sitting in a wooden pew on Sunday morning.

Not judging, just saying.

It's an hour out of the week...big deal. My kids get to meet other kids and then go play afterwards, my wife and I get some reflection time and then go eat brunch and we're all happy. It's an opportunity to put on our "Sunday Best" and go feel good about ourselves for a bit and prepare for another week. That's why we're going to go back because frankly, the only other thing we would generally do on a Sunday morning is watch cartoons and eat Captain Crunch and that seems like a far larger waste of time then going and celebrating with a bunch of people that we have at least one thing in common with.

[RD2191]

And tbh, a quick read of the scriptures he posted would at least give one an idea of what was happening. If all he got from those passages is that God is a murderer then he has some serious comprehension skills.

[xmas1997]

I agree, which is the problem with modern day religions. They all worship saints, Mary, and other various things that are not in the Bible. Which is why the Bible states that simply believing in Jesus as many think is not enough to save you.


This is a common misconception that many detractors use to impose their own agenda.
The actual truth is, no one worships any of those.
Mary, the saints, archangels, etc., are "go-betweens" or "interceders" in the "spiritual realm", nothing more, and similar to the way priests, preachers, theologians, and religious teachers are in the "physical realm".
But the detractors love using this tactic as examples of idolatry, or of pseudo Christian practices that are false, but the truth is they are distorting and twisting the truth of the matter in order to confuse you and put their own agenda in it's place.
They also love to say we worship statues, comparing them to false idols, but this is another ignorant distortion of the truth.
Statues are no more than artistic representations (sculptures) similar to paintings of an artists view, they happen to be of religious themes.
You see common depictions of people kneeling down and praying in front of a statue, and so the distorters say, "see there, they are praying to a statue, a false god", when the real truth is they are praying to God "in front of a sculpture that easily reminds them of their inner conception of God" or one of God's interceders.
I seriously doubt any intelligent person would say that the painting of The Last Supper was idolistic.
To make of it more than that is to invite ridiculous distortions of the truth, yet they use this distortion quite often.

[johnsmith]

And johsmith, I stated man times before that I do not know everything about the Bible and that I am learning new things every day. I didn't claim to know it all.

Understood, but you shouldn't be so quick to criticize those that don't agree with you. There are a billion people on the other side of the planet that think your belief structure is dumb, so you have to keep an open mind. I don't think RG has near as open a mind as he claims, but he argues this shit In a civil manner without resorting to name calling. Does he come off arrogant, sure, but he does it respectfully.

And there is nothing wrong with the answer to some of those questions with "faith". Faith isn't a scientific answer but it's an answer nonetheless and that's the only way you can discuss this stuff with non believers sometimes. It's frustrating because you haven't seen God and therefore can't prove your belief beyond a shadow of a doubt but that is what you have to accept.

I personally don't discuss my beliefs with other people because they're my beliefs only. I have a tremendous amount of respect for everyone's thoughts on God or lack thereof though and I recommend trying to do the same.

[leemajors]

Many Catholics worship Mary, tbh. I'm not saying they were ever instructed to, but they do. I attended Catholic Mass from ~5-18, also attending CCD and saw it all the time.

[RD2191]

Doesn't the Bible say not to make any graven images?

[johnsmith]

This is a common misconception that many detractors use to impose their own agenda.
The actual truth is, no one worships any of those.
Mary, the saints, archangels, etc., are "go-betweens" or "interceders" in the "spiritual realm", nothing more, and similar to the way priests, preachers, theologians, and religious teachers are in the "physical realm".
But the detractors love using this tactic as examples of idolatry, or of pseudo Christian practices that are false, but the truth is they are distorting and twisting the truth of the matter in order to confuse you and put their own agenda in it's place.
They also love to say we worship statues, comparing them to false idols, but this is another ignorant distortion of the truth.
Statues are no more than artistic representations (sculptures) similar to paintings of an artists view, they happen to be of religious themes.
You see common depictions of people kneeling down and praying in front of a statue, and so the distorters say, "see there, they are praying to a statue, a false god", when the real truth is they are praying to God "in front of a sculpture that easily reminds them of their inner conception of God or one of God's interceders.
I seriously doubt any intelligent person would say that the painting of The Last Supper was idolistic.
To make of it more than that is to invite ridiculous distortions of the truth, yet they use this distortion quite often.

:rolleyes

[johnsmith]

Many Catholics worship Mary, tbh. I'm not saying they were ever instructed to, but they do. I attended Catholic Mass from ~5-18, also attending CCD and saw it all the time.

My understanding is that Catholics are supposed to ask for help from Mary or any other Saint...like when you hear people say, "please pray for me".

[RD2191]

Understood, but you shouldn't be so quick to criticize those that don't agree with you. There are a billion people on the other side of the planet that think your belief structure is dumb, so you have to keep an open mind. I don't think RG has near as open a mind as he claims, but he argues this shit In a civil manner without resorting to name calling. Does he come off arrogant, sure, but he does it respectfully.

And there is nothing wrong with the answer to some of those questions with "faith". Faith isn't a scientific answer but it's an answer nonetheless and that's the only way you can discuss this stuff with non believers sometimes. It's frustrating because you haven't seen God and therefore can't prove your belief beyond a shadow of a doubt but that is what you have to accept.

I personally don't discuss my beliefs with other people because they're my beliefs only. I have a tremendous amount of respect for everyone's thoughts on God or lack thereof though and I recommend trying to do the same.
He was doing more mocking than anything. His smug attitude also doesn't help the situation. I provided some answers and he simply changed the subject. He doesn't want answers because in his mind God is evil and I doubt anything will change that. Of course his hatred is unfounded seeing as he doesn't even believe in God.

And thank you for your advice. I take it you're older than me so I appreciate your viewpoint on the situation.

[RD2191]

This is a common misconception that many detractors use to impose their own agenda.
The actual truth is, no one worships any of those.
Mary, the saints, archangels, etc., are "go-betweens" or "interceders" in the "spiritual realm", nothing more, and similar to the way priests, preachers, theologians, and religious teachers are in the "physical realm".
But the detractors love using this tactic as examples of idolatry, or of pseudo Christian practices that are false, but the truth is they are distorting and twisting the truth of the matter in order to confuse you and put their own agenda in it's place.
They also love to say we worship statues, comparing them to false idols, but this is another ignorant distortion of the truth.
Statues are no more than artistic representations (sculptures) similar to paintings of an artists view, they happen to be of religious themes.
You see common depictions of people kneeling down and praying in front of a statue, and so the distorters say, "see there, they are praying to a statue, a false god", when the real truth is they are praying to God "in front of a sculpture that easily reminds them of their inner conception of God" or one of God's interceders.
I seriously doubt any intelligent person would say that the painting of The Last Supper was idolistic.
To make of it more than that is to invite ridiculous distortions of the truth, yet they use this distortion quite often.
Where is that in the Bible?

John 14:6 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/john/14/#v43014006)6 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/john/14/#v43014006) Jesus said to him: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

[DisAsTerBot]

This is a common misconception that many detractors use to impose their own agenda.
The actual truth is, no one worships any of those.
Mary, the saints, archangels, etc., are "go-betweens" or "interceders" in the "spiritual realm", nothing more, and similar to the way priests, preachers, theologians, and religious teachers are in the "physical realm".
But the detractors love using this tactic as examples of idolatry, or of pseudo Christian practices that are false, but the truth is they are distorting and twisting the truth of the matter in order to confuse you and put their own agenda in it's place.
They also love to say we worship statues, comparing them to false idols, but this is another ignorant distortion of the truth.
Statues are no more than artistic representations (sculptures) similar to paintings of an artists view, they happen to be of religious themes.
You see common depictions of people kneeling down and praying in front of a statue, and so the distorters say, "see there, they are praying to a statue, a false god", when the real truth is they are praying to God "in front of a sculpture that easily reminds them of their inner conception of God" or one of God's interceders.
I seriously doubt any intelligent person would say that the painting of The Last Supper was idolistic.
To make of it more than that is to invite ridiculous distortions of the truth, yet they use this distortion quite often.

for fucks sake people are having an actual discussion! gtfo

[leemajors]

My understanding is that Catholics are supposed to ask for help from Mary or any other Saint...like when you hear people say, "please pray for me".

Yeah, they are. Doesn't really stop the ones that want to.

[Blake]

And johsmith, I stated many times before that I do not know everything about the Bible and that I am learning new things every day. I didn't claim to know it all.

Then you're an idiot for calling anyone else out on their knowledge.

[xmas1997]

Many Catholics worship Mary, tbh. I'm not saying they were ever instructed to, but they do. I attended Catholic Mass from ~5-18, also attending CCD and saw it all the time.

This is entirely false and extremely stupid and misinformed to think and say this.
No Catholic "worships" any other entity other than God, period!
We do believe that God is a Trinity in the spiritual sense, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. but we only "worship" God.
Catholics appreciate, they love, they use, they adore, and they pray "THROUGH" Mary (the mother of Jesus Christ), but not "TO" Mary, and they ABSOLUTELY DO NOT "WORSHIP" Mary.
That is the epitome of stupidity to say this.
It isn't even a dumb opinion, it is a blatant falsehood and misconception and lie.

[RD2191]

Actually I know most Catholics pray to Mary herself.

[RD2191]

From my experience anyways. And Mary is mentioned nowhere in the Bible as a mediator or someone that should be prayed through.

[Blake]

This is a common misconception that many detractors use to impose their own agenda.
The actual truth is, no one worships any of those.


not one person?

[leemajors]

This is entirely false and extremely stupid and misinformed to think and say this.
No Catholic "worships" any other entity other than God, period!
We do believe that God is a Trinity in the spiritual sense, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. but we only "worship" God.
Catholics appreciate, they love, they use, they adore, and they pray "THROUGH" Mary (the mother of Jesus Christ), but not "TO" Mary, and they ABSOLUTELY DO NOT "WORSHIP" Mary.
That is the epitome of stupidity to say this.
It isn't even a dumb opinion, it is a blatant falsehood and misconception and lie.

You didn't read what I said at all, lmao

[xmas1997]

Where is that in the Bible?

John 14:6 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/john/14/#v43014006)6 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/john/14/#v43014006) Jesus said to him: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

There is nothing contradictory here IMHO.

[Blake]

:lol

Lol

Why are you waiting to become a Christian? Join today.

[johnsmith]

He was doing more mocking than anything. His smug attitude also doesn't help the situation. I provided some answers and he simply changed the subject. He doesn't want answers because in his mind God is evil and I doubt anything will change that. Of course his hatred is unfounded seeing as he doesn't even believe in God.

And thank you for your advice. I take it you're older than me so I appreciate your viewpoint on the situation.

It took me a looooong ass time in my life to understand that not everyone thinks the same as I do, you need to remember that. RG is an extremely logical thinker and he asked you a yes or no question. To him that requires a yes or no answer. When you reply with an explanation and exclude the yes or no, to him that is dodging the question. So it's not that he was mocking, it's that you weren't answering.

Don't get me wrong either, guys like RG can drive a more emotional thinker absolutely fucking insane, you just have to remember that the feeling is mutual...and yet another reason to not discuss religion.

[xmas1997]

You didn't read what I said at all, lmao

Yes, I did read what you said, and even quoted it. If you meant to say something different, then you should have said that.

[DisAsTerBot]

This is entirely false and extremely stupid and misinformed to think and say this.
No Catholic "worships" any other entity other than God, period!


these two sentences in a row are gold!

[DisAsTerBot]

i like how xmas knows exactly what every catholic does. ever.

[johnsmith]

This is entirely false and extremely stupid and misinformed to think and say this.
No Catholic "worships" any other entity other than God, period!
We do believe that God is a Trinity in the spiritual sense, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. but we only "worship" God.
Catholics appreciate, they love, they use, they adore, and they pray "THROUGH" Mary (the mother of Jesus Christ), but not "TO" Mary, and they ABSOLUTELY DO NOT "WORSHIP" Mary.
That is the epitome of stupidity to say this.
It isn't even a dumb opinion, it is a blatant falsehood and misconception and lie.


See Rob, this is an example of not even acknowledging what someone said and then emotionally going off on it. The quote that Xmas is referring to was just an observation and Xmas goes off on a tangent about how stupid it was.

I too know people that pray directly to Mary, but according to Xmas, it's his way or the highway. In religion, this is referred to as "being a fucking asshole".

[xmas1997]

Yeah, they are. Doesn't really stop the ones that want to.

Johnsmith is correct.

[johnsmith]

Yes, I did read what you said, and even quoted it. If you meant to say something different, then you should have said that.

You just didn't understand it.

I also think that I got to you so much that you had to put me on ignore is fucking hilarious.

How's the job hunt going?

[RD2191]

Xmas is a good dude, imo. But nowhere in the Bible does it say that Mary should be worshiped or used as a mediator between oneself and God. Mary is not the mother of God. She was simply a good woman who was used by God to bring Jesus to earth. She isn't anymore special than any other true Christian.

[johnsmith]

Xmas is a good dude, imo. But nowhere in the Bible does it say that Mary should be worshiped or used as a mediator between oneself and God. Mary is not the mother of God. She was simply a good woman who was used by God to bring Jesus to earth. She isn't anymore special than any other true Christian.

That's fine...but what Xmas is saying is that no Catholic anywhere could possibly misunderstand Mary's role and that nowhere is there a Catholic that could possibly be praying directly to Mary.

[xmas1997]

Doesn't the Bible say not to make any graven images?

They are not "graven images", they are artistic renderings, like the artistic rendering of a proposed stadium is not the blueprints of the actual stadium.

[RD2191]

This is a common misconception that many detractors use to impose their own agenda.
The actual truth is, no one worships any of those.
Mary, the saints, archangels, etc., are "go-betweens" or "interceders" in the "spiritual realm", nothing more, and similar to the way priests, preachers, theologians, and religious teachers are in the "physical realm".
But the detractors love using this tactic as examples of idolatry, or of pseudo Christian practices that are false, but the truth is they are distorting and twisting the truth of the matter in order to confuse you and put their own agenda in it's place.
They also love to say we worship statues, comparing them to false idols, but this is another ignorant distortion of the truth.
Statues are no more than artistic representations (sculptures) similar to paintings of an artists view, they happen to be of religious themes.
You see common depictions of people kneeling down and praying in front of a statue, and so the distorters say, "see there, they are praying to a statue, a false god", when the real truth is they are praying to God "in front of a sculpture that easily reminds them of their inner conception of God" or one of God's interceders.
I seriously doubt any intelligent person would say that the painting of The Last Supper was idolistic.
To make of it more than that is to invite ridiculous distortions of the truth, yet they use this distortion quite often.
Exodus 20:4, 5 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/exodus/20/#v2020004-v2020005)4 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/exodus/20/#v2020004) “You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or on the earth below or in the waters under the earth. 5 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/exodus/20/#v2020005) You must not bow down to them nor be enticed to serve them, for I, Jehovah your God, am a God who requires exclusive devotion, bringing punishment for the error of fathers upon sons, upon the third generation and upon the fourth generation of those who hate me,



Isaiah 44:13-19 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044013-v23044019)13 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044013) The wood-carver stretches the measuring line, tracing out the pattern with red chalk.He works it with a wood scraper and traces it with a compass.He patterns it after a man,With the beauty of a man,
To sit in a house.14 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044014) There is one whose work is to cut down cedars.He selects a certain type of tree, an oak,
And he lets it grow strong among the trees of the forest.He plants a laurel tree, and the rain makes it grow.15 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044015) Then it becomes fuel for a man to make fires.He takes part of it to warm himself;
He builds a fire and bakes bread.But he also makes a god and worships it.He makes it into a carved image, and he bows down before it.16 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044016) Half of it he burns up in a fire;
With that half he roasts the meat that he eats, and he is satisfied.He also warms himself and says:“Ah! I am warm as I watch the fire.”17 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044017) But the rest of it he makes into a god, into his carved image.He bows down to it and worships it.He prays to it and says:“Save me, for you are my god.”18 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044018) They know nothing, they understand nothing,Because their eyes are sealed shut and they cannot see,
And their heart has no insight.19 (http://www.jw.org/en/publications/bible/nwt/books/isaiah/44/#v23044019) No one reflects in his heart
Or has knowledge or understanding, saying:“Half of it I burned up in a fire,
And on its coals I baked bread and roasted meat to eat.Should I, then, make the rest of it into a detestable thing?Should I worship a block of wood from a tree?”

[Blake]

This is entirely false and extremely stupid and misinformed to think and say this.
No Catholic "worships" any other entity other than God, period!
We do believe that God is a Trinity in the spiritual sense, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. but we only "worship" God.
Catholics appreciate, they love, they use, they adore, and they pray "THROUGH" Mary (the mother of Jesus Christ), but not "TO" Mary, and they ABSOLUTELY DO NOT "WORSHIP" Mary.
That is the epitome of stupidity to say this.
It isn't even a dumb opinion, it is a blatant falsehood and misconception and lie.

" Hail Holy Queen

Hail, Holy Queen, Mother of mercy,our life, our sweetness and our hope.To thee do we cry, poor banished children of Eve:to thee do we send up our sighs,mourning and weeping in this valley of tears.Turn then, most gracious Advocate,thine eyes of mercy toward us,and after this our exile,show unto us the blessed fruit of thy womb, Jesus.O clement, O loving, O sweet Virgin Mary! Amen."


Lol Queen

[johnsmith]

Xmas attitude is what turns me off from church to be honest. If there is something out there that brings me closer to God or spirituality or whatever, who is he to tell me I'm wrong.

[xmas1997]

Xmas is a good dude, imo. But nowhere in the Bible does it say that Mary should be worshiped or used as a mediator between oneself and God. Mary is not the mother of God. She was simply a good woman who was used by God to bring Jesus to earth. She isn't anymore special than any other true Christian.

Rob, do you think the bible is the "infallible Word of God"?
In other words, do you think it is inspired by God and thus none of it can be wrong?
Just asking, because depending on what you say, I have a point to make.

[Blake]

It's an hour out of the week...big deal. My kids get to meet other kids and then go play afterwards, my wife and I get some reflection time and then go eat brunch and we're all happy. It's an opportunity to put on our "Sunday Best" and go feel good about ourselves for a bit and prepare for another week. That's why we're going to go back because frankly, the only other thing we would generally do on a Sunday morning is watch cartoons and eat Captain Crunch and that seems like a far larger waste of time then going and celebrating with a bunch of people that we have at least one thing in common with.

cool, whatever makes you feel good, tbh.

I'll think about you while I'm watching nfl pre game. :tu

[johnsmith]

cool, whatever makes you feel good, tbh.

I'll think about you while I'm watching nfl pre game. :tu

What, you think I don't go to the early mass for that very reason? Come on Blake!

[xmas1997]

Also johnsmith used the word "supposed" and that part is incorrect.
Catholics are not supposed to worship anything or anyone other God, period.
If you think this, then you are wrong in your thinking, that simple.
We are NOT "supposed" to worship God through Mary or through any other entity.
She is merely a spiritual interceder, nothing more and nothing less.
Some of you are trying to make it more than it is, or else you are giving in to misunderstandings.

[johnsmith]

Also johnsmith used the word "supposed" and that part is incorrect.
Catholics are not supposed to worship anything or anyone other God, period.
If you think this, then you are wrong in your thinking, that simple.
We are NOT "supposed" to worship God through Mary or through any other entity.
She is merely a spiritual interceder, nothing more and nothing less.
Some of you are trying to make it more than it is, or else you are giving in to misunderstandings.

For a guy that has me on ignore, you sure reference me a lot. God you're a pussy.

[xmas1997]

Speaking of graven images, and false gods, and idols, many things qualify for that depending on each individual.
I am quite sure most of you can list off quite a few. Rob,
But, if someone prays TO a statue, carving, picture, or whatever, that would be considered a graven image.
If I pray to a hamburger, that would be a graven image.

[Blake]

What, you think I don't go to the early mass for that very reason? Come on Blake!

As long as you got it figured out. :tu

[Blake]

We are NOT "supposed" to worship God through Mary or through any other entity.


Well then making common prayers like the Hail Mary was a bad idea with little foresight.

[xmas1997]

For example, blake may worship football, or the Spurs, drugs, alcohol, or his misconceptions of his life scope.
Some may worship money, social standing, or a corvette.
Others may worship a rock star, movie star, sports star, scientist, or a hero.
All would be false idols.


EDIT: Other people worship food, guns, instruments, animals, sex, your own good looks or intelligence or what have you, any of which could be false idols and/or graven images.

[johnsmith]

I might have to actually go to a GTG just so I can punch Xmas square in the face.

[xmas1997]

Some may worship statues or carvings or pictures and paintings of presidents (Mount Rushmore), great men and women, saints, etc.
The key here is the word "WORSHIP", if you worship that "thing" instead of the Entity that is God, then you are worshiping a graven image.

[Blake]

For example, blake may worship football, or the Spurs, drugs, alcohol, or his misconceptions of his life scope.
Some may worship money, social standing, or a corvette.
Others may worship a rock star, movie star, sports star, scientist, or a hero.
All would be false idols.

Wow. You must have learned that in some advanced Bible class at Dartmouth

[xmas1997]

I don't delude myself one bit here simply because I don't expect any of you to "get it" of what I explained, but those of you who do, more power to you.

[xmas1997]

Wow. You must have learned that in some advanced Bible class at Dartmouth

As is apparent you worship this forum, and that is idolatry.

:lmao

[Aztecfan03]

It took me a looooong ass time in my life to understand that not everyone thinks the same as I do, you need to remember that. RG is an extremely logical thinker and he asked you a yes or no question. To him that requires a yes or no answer. When you reply with an explanation and exclude the yes or no, to him that is dodging the question. So it's not that he was mocking, it's that you weren't answering.

Don't get me wrong either, guys like RG can drive a more emotional thinker absolutely fucking insane, you just have to remember that the feeling is mutual...and yet another reason to not discuss religion.

The point rob was making is the question is invalid because it would never happen(If you are talking about the same question I am.)

[silverblk mystix]

It's an hour out of the week...big deal. My kids get to meet other kids and then go play afterwards, my wife and I get some reflection time and then go eat brunch and we're all happy. It's an opportunity to put on our "Sunday Best" and go feel good about ourselves for a bit and prepare for another week. That's why we're going to go back because frankly, the only other thing we would generally do on a Sunday morning is watch cartoons and eat Captain Crunch and that seems like a far larger waste of time then going and celebrating with a bunch of people that we have at least one thing in common with.


Johnsmith =


You are a little slow - so I will help you -


Blake is just feeling you out ( no pun intended) to see if you might bang his girl...


Just here to help btw.


:lmao:lmao

[xmas1997]

Rob, what I was going to say is, that just because something is NOT in the bible, does not make it any less the truth.
There are many things in life that you know to be the truth, yet they are not mentioned in the bible.
That is the point I was going to make.
We all have our particular "paths" that we are on in order to learn the truth, and no one is any better or worse than any one else, we all learn the most profound lessons by making mistakes, if we are intelligent.

[silverblk mystix]

Then you're an idiot for calling anyone else out on their knowledge.


Wow.


Did lightning just strike your entire house when you typed that out?

What a douche hypocrite piece of shit you are.


Cuck.

[leemajors]

The point rob was making is the question is invalid because it would never happen(If you are talking about the same question I am.)



For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so the thoughts of God no one knows except the Spirit of God.

[RD2191]

:lolSorry, I was making some lunch/dinner.

[RD2191]

leemajors with another example of taking scripture out of context.

[RD2191]

Rob, what I was going to say is, that just because something is NOT in the bible, does not make it any less the truth.
There are many things in life that you know to be the truth, yet they are not mentioned in the bible.
That is the point I was going to make.
We all have our particular "paths" that we are on in order to learn the truth, and no one is any better or worse than any one else, we all learn the most profound lessons by making mistakes, if we are intelligent.
Good point, will give it some thought.

[leemajors]

leemajors with another example of taking scripture out of context.

How so?

[xmas1997]

Well then making common prayers like the Hail Mary was a bad idea with little foresight.

Another distortion you are trying to pass off as real on here.
No one is praying TO Mary here in this prayer.
How can I say this? Because if someone believes in God, then thay are aware that EVERYTHING is OF God, and in this case, Mary is OF God, part of God as are all things and everyone, who ever was, ever is, and ever will be.
The Hail Mary prayer is a prayer "to" God "through" Mary (who is part of God). She in no way is a mediator, she mediates nothing, rather she is a "conduit" through which God is accessed easier, nothing more and nothing less.
If you want a drink of water, you can take a bucket and go to the well, but Mary is like the pipe that brings the well water to the taps, like a bridge or go-through, or inteceder.

[RD2191]

Well, let me rephrase that, we do not know Gods thoughts, but we do know his plan. His plan does not and will not require of us to kill people.

[leemajors]

Well, let me rephrase that, we do not know Gods thoughts, but we do know his plan. His plan does not and will not require of us to kill people.

Gotcha.

[Blake]

Wow.


Did lightning just strike your entire house when you typed that out?

What a douche hypocrite piece of shit you are.


Cuck.

The difference between me and rob is that I've read and studied the Bible. I can call people out on their bullshit because I can back it up.

Therefore I'm not a hypocrite.

But remember that time you went off about how labeling people is wrong and how you hate labeling?

You calling me a cuck here makes you a hypocrite in that regard.

See the difference?

Probably not.

[RD2191]

Just because you read something doesn't mean you understand it or know what you're talking about. You have no knowledge of the Bible.

[Blake]

Just because you read something doesn't mean you understand it or know what you're talking about. You have no knowledge of the Bible.

You admitted you have a poor understanding of the Bible and christianity so who are you to make that determination?

you have poor critical thinking skills.

which is one of the reasons so many people call you stupid.

[xmas1997]

The difference between me and rob is that I've read and studied the Bible. I can call people out on their bullshit because I can back it up.

Therefore I'm not a hypocrite.

But remember that time you went off about how labeling people is wrong and how you hate labeling?

You calling me a cuck here makes you a hypocrite in that regard.

See the difference?

Probably not.

You never read shit nor studied anything in your entire life, and especially nothing theological, that FACT has been established and further proven months ago.
So yes, you are the epitome of hypocrisy, the hypocritical god of ST, and everyone knows this except of course you.
:lmao

[RD2191]

You admitted you have a poor understanding of the Bible and christianity so who are you to make that determination?

you have poor critical thinking skills.

which is one of the reasons so many people call you stupid.
Hates the Bible/God, sends child to christian school.:lmao

[RD2191]

I admitted I have a poor understanding of the Bible? When? I stated that I don not know everything there is to know about the Bible and that I learn something new every day.

[xmas1997]

I admitted I have a poor understanding of the Bible? When? I stated that I don not know everything there is to know about the Bible and that I learn something new every day.

They just love distorting our words, it get their rocks off. :lol
And especially so in blakes case, who is the hypocritical god of ST, the epitome of hypocrisy.
He isn't called the ST village idiot for nothing.

[xmas1997]

Hates the Bible/God, sends child to christian school.:lmao

Blake has no critical skills, but hypocritical skills is another story!
:lmao

[RD2191]

They just love distorting our words, it get their rocks off. :lol
And especially so in blakes case, who is the hypocritical god of ST, the epitome of hypocrisy.
He isn't called the ST village idiot for nothing.
Yeah, he provides zero insight. All he did was attack me and call me an idiot. I've never put anyone on ignore but I'm considering it with Blake. Dude is just trying to get his jollies off by arguing and debating subjects he has no knowledge on.

[xmas1997]

Yeah, he provides zero insight. All he did was attack me and call me an idiot. I've never put anyone on ignore but I'm considering it with Blake. Dude is just trying to get his jollies off by arguing and debating subjects he has no knowledge on.

Don't put the hypocritical god on ignore, it is too much fun making fun of him.
Others make you laugh at them, but blake is so retarded and stupid that no matter what he says, he makes a total fool of himself.
That is easy to fade IMHO.

[xmas1997]

I have super hypo-critical bumbling skills.

which is one of the reasons so many people call ME stupid.

The truth is self evident.



EDIT: Rob, sorry for butting in on your "edumacation" of these idiots, but some blatant falsehoods spewed out by some of the less educated numbskulls here needed correction to reflect the truth.

[Blake]

I admitted I have a poor understanding of the Bible? When? I stated that I don not know everything there is to know about the Bible and that I learn something new every day.

Fine I'll retract and rephrase:

based on your posts in this thread, I think it's obvious your understanding of the Bible is very poor.

you calling out anyone else for a lack of Bible knowledge just adds more evidence of you being retarded.

[Blake]

The truth is self evident.

Yes, it's evident you're a liar.

Lol Dartmouth.

[xmas1997]

Yes, it's evident you're a liar.

Lol Dartmouth.

The truth hurts, doesn't it?
But please, don't let me distract you from making a further fool of yourself.

Rob, he's at your disposal.
:lmao

[Blake]

Two retards trying to tag team me.

Bleh

[RandomGuy]

Read more of the bible.
Enlighten me then.

Read the whole thing cover to cover several times.

Matthew 7:7 Jesus says: "Ask, and it will be given you"
Ask and you will receive. What could be simpler than that?
In Matthew 17:20 Jesus reiterates that same message.
Matthew 21:21
Mark 11:24

Maybe you could give me a guide as to what kind of prayers will be answered. Feel free to step up and educate me.

[RandomGuy]

Well, let me rephrase that, we do not know Gods thoughts, but we do know his plan. His plan does not and will not require of us to kill people.

How do you know that?

[RandomGuy]

How so?

PK7P7uZFf5o

[silverblk mystix]

Enlighten me then.

Read the whole thing cover to cover several times.

Matthew 7:7 Jesus says: "Ask, and it will be given you"
Ask and you will receive. What could be simpler than that?
In Matthew 17:20 Jesus reiterates that same message.
Matthew 21:21
Mark 11:24

Maybe you could give me a guide as to what kind of prayers will be answered. Feel free to step up and educate me.


What if it simply means that if you look inward and drop your opinions, theories, and what you think you know -


that truth will reveal itself?


Pretty simple - you asked = and you received.


Unless you are a judgmental prick who reads shit and needs someone to spoon feed him the truth even though his mind/heart/brain has been closed and shuttered all his life therefore making it impossible to ever allow truth in.

[RandomGuy]

What part of Gods chosen people against Gods enemies do you not understand? Are you really that stupid?

Gods enemies are babies?




The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for your children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children do survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered." O LORD, what should I request for your people? I will ask for wombs that don't give birth and breasts that give no milk. The LORD says, "All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. And if they give birth, I will slaughter their beloved children." (Hosea 9:11-16 NLT)

That's pretty sick and twisted man.

[RandomGuy]

What if it simply means that if you look inward and drop your opinions, theories, and what you think you know -


that truth will reveal itself?


Pretty simple - you asked = and you received.


Unless you are a judgmental prick who reads shit and needs someone to spoon feed him the truth even though his mind/heart/brain has been closed and shuttered all his life therefore making it impossible to ever allow truth in.

It is evil to hack babies to death or not?

I just want an answer. Pretty easy question.

[RandomGuy]

even though his mind/heart/brain has been closed and shuttered all his life therefore making it impossible to ever allow truth in.

T69TOuqaqXI

Pretty clear who is open-minded and who isn't.

[silverblk mystix]

It is evil to hack babies to death or not?

I just want an answer. Pretty easy question.


Is it stupid to take things literally when they weren't meant to be literal?


Simple yes or no will suffice.

[RD2191]

In context, no. Simple answer.

[RandomGuy]

It is evil to hack babies to death or not?

I just want an answer. Pretty easy question.



Is it stupid to take things literally when they weren't meant to be literal?


Simple yes or no will suffice.

No.

Now you can answer my question.

It is evil to hack babies to death or not?

[xmas1997]

What if it simply means that if you look inward and drop your opinions, theories, and what you think you know -


that truth will reveal itself?


Pretty simple - you asked = and you received.


Unless you are a judgmental prick who reads shit and needs someone to spoon feed him the truth even though his mind/heart/brain has been closed and shuttered all his life therefore making it impossible to ever allow truth in.

As most of us already know it is hard for someone to close off all the outside distractions in order to open ones mind to the truth, what with all the preconceived notions, programmed negativity, and ages of accepted teachings aside, in order to allow the truth to filter through the muck.

It is no wonder there are so many idiots on this site for example, it being a small microcosmic example of the macrocosm.

It is odd, my atheistic friends in real life have no problems with any of my theistic views, and the reverse is true as well, yet some fanatical atheists on here are highly offended to the point they HAVE to make fun of it.

What's up with that?