So Let's Talk Whole Offseason

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Yeah that happened alright.
He was supposedly warned by the ref to stay off his phone multiple times during the game. He was able to sit in the student section though after the ejection.

I’m not condoning his behaviour by any means but Hornets fans knew their team wasn’t good enough around the All-Star break yet he still refused to play his rookies meaningful minutes at any time.

For example - In their play-in game against the Hawks, which they lost by 29 points and trailed by 30+ points at multiple points in the 4th; the rookies didn’t check into the game at all.

Pop's disciple.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Yuk! They seem to just have a toxic culture.


Yeah, before deciding how much weight to lay on Borrego, remember all the drama that surrounded Lonzo Ball and his dad. Then LaMelo and the dad... again. LaMelo having his own sportswear line, etc.

Could one young diva plus an older family member contribute an awful lot to a toxic culture for a coach? I wouldn't be surprised if Borrego contributed, but I wouldn't blackball him unless I knew a lot more.

[rascal]

https://www.si.com/nba/hornets/news/james-bouknights-rookie-campaign



We’re talking about the 10th pick here for a team that didn’t make the playoffs. Unsurprisingly, Kai Jones is second on that list.

Yeah, he didn't play the rookies and the team wasn't doing well. He needed to go.

[rascal]

Depends on which way they're going. If they want immediate results, then a trade for Poeltl can be more likely. But just as easily he might not appeal to the new coach, or they may make a strategic decision to continue building through the draft, so who knows.

They may want to add a veteran instead of adding two more rookies so maybe the Spurs can work a trade with them to get the 13 or 15 pick. Should be some good players falling into that range.

[SAGirl]

I think Borrego has 2 years left on his contract... man, the money that NBA teams throw around! I guess it's time to head to Italy for a few months and relax with lots of cappuccinos in the morning and nightly bottles of wine. Not a bad life.
The fact he got fired with 2 years left makes it worse in my eyes. He lost the locker room and for that I think it couldn’t have been just one guy. Also I mentioned it at the time but Charlotte looked to be about the worst of the play in teams. His guys weren’t ready to play. One thing is missing shots and having a bad game bc of bad shot selection or just a bad shooting night but a very different one is seeing guys playing no defense, no hustle, no kind of cohesion on defense. Charlotte looked listless.

[TimmehC]

They clearly wanted Poeltl at the deadline. Maybe they'll be more willing to throw in the necessary kickers to get it done now.

[Leetonidas]

LaMelo probably didn't like Borrego and that's all it takes now sadly. Wouldn't mind seeing him back on the sidelines as an assistant tbh

[Sugus]

They clearly wanted Poeltl at the deadline. Maybe they'll be more willing to throw in the necessary kickers to get it done now.

Yeah, Charlotte flaming out like they did is relatively great for the Spurs, provided they're still interested in that previous offer. Relatedly, I don't know what Bridges' contract situation is, but could a trade be had featuring Jakob and him (with compensation around it, obviously)? I've always liked his style of play, and the Spurs guards could really use a big man with his dynamism.

[PhantomDashCam]

Kai Jones doesn‘t seem to be a guy who fits into the Spurs culture if that‘s true. Given that Borrego mismanaged their roster - you can‘t act like that, especially as a rookie.

It was an immature thing to do, without question. I don’t think it’s indicative at all though of Kai as a person. These kids are going to make mistakes on social.
Let’s not forget George Hill’s lewd image leaks, even DJ’s “WTF?” after Primo was drafted.

There is a video version of this but couldn’t find it.

1514987092882903044

[ZeusWillJudge]

It was an immature thing to do, without question. I don’t think it’s indicative at all though of Kai as a person. These kids are going to make mistakes on social.
Let’s not forget George Hill’s lewd image leaks, even DJ’s “WTF?” after Primo was drafted.

There is a video version of this but couldn’t find it.


LOL. 19-21 year old kids who go from all the coeds they can handle to becoming instant millionaires, and we're surprised at some "bad" behavior? I'll probably get skewered for saying this, but let's be honest - Tony's affair with a teammate's wife is the kind of thing that can really mess up team chemistry. But if it hadn't become public?

I don't like when players like Kawhi and AD go public, and screw over team, teammates, and fans. And I don't like it when players publicly dog a coach. Take it upstairs, privately.

[Ariel]

I think Borrego has 2 years left on his contract... man, the money that NBA teams throw around! I guess it's time to head to Italy for a few months and relax with lots of cappuccinos in the morning and nightly bottles of wine. Not a bad life.
Yup. I feel sorry for them... for the few seconds that it takes me to remember they'll make more money in one year (month in many cases) that most of us will make in our entire lifetimes. Tough life :lol

[PhantomDashCam]

I just want to be clear that I have nothing against Borrego and we will likely never know the full extent of why a (firing) decision was made.
I just wanted to report some of the things I heard across the season that was.
But it’s unlikely that it’s just one person or issue that lead to this…

[ZeusWillJudge]

I just want to be clear that I have nothing against Borrego and we will likely never know the full extent of why a (firing) decision was made.
I just wanted to report some of the things I heard across the season that was.
But it’s unlikely that it’s just one person or issue that lead to this…


Oh, hey, I wasn't jamming you up. I appreciate information. I was just laughing at the thought of 20 year old instant millionaires acting immature. If you really want to know the whole truth, I was thinking about myself as a 20 year old instant millionaire, and what a pillar of maturity I would have been. I started wondering why I sort of overlook some guys and not others.

[PhantomDashCam]

Oh, hey, I wasn't jamming you up. I appreciate information. I was just laughing at the thought of 20 year old instant millionaires acting immature. If you really want to know the whole truth, I was thinking about myself as a 20 year old instant millionaire, and what a pillar of maturity I would have been. I started wondering why I sort of overlook some guys and not others.

All good mate. Honestly never took it as such. Just felt like the perception on the board may be because I’m interested in Kai Jones’ development as a prospect that I’d shy away from the objective truth in the matter, siding with the players/fans over coaches.

Honestly just want to see Kai do well in whatever situation he ends up.

I thought it was a hand and glove fit last draft between Spurs and the Texas product FWIW. The fact being that rumours started to swirl around the trade deadline that the Spurs may be interested in Kai, again, rekindled some of those hopes. (And possibly lead to the idea that the Spurs did try to trade down to get both Primo and Jones in that draft).

The fact we didn’t end up with him and traded my favourite Spur too, D.White, wasn’t the greatest of days for me. :lol

[scott]

All good mate. Honestly never took it as such. Just felt like the perception on the board may be because I’m interested in Kai Jones’ development as a prospect that I’d shy away from the objective truth in the matter, siding with the players/fans over coaches.

Honestly just want to see Kai do well in whatever situation he ends up.

I thought it was a hand and glove fit last draft between Spurs and the Texas product FWIW. The fact being that rumours started to swirl around the trade deadline that the Spurs may be interested in Kai, again, rekindled some of those hopes. (And possibly lead to the idea that the Spurs did try to trade down to get both Primo and Jones in that draft).

The fact we didn’t end up with him and traded my favourite Spur too, D.White, wasn’t the greatest of days for me. :lol

Your interest in Kai as a prospect is all good... trade a lotto pick for him should have you institutionalized though :P

[SAGirl]

1518068261266489349 (https://twitter.com/dame_lillard/status/1518068261266489349?s=21&t=TFjAkQVI0ltixe0ZZePU0A)

[Dex]

1518068261266489349 (https://twitter.com/dame_lillard/status/1518068261266489349?s=21&t=TFjAkQVI0ltixe0ZZePU0A)

I love seeing player reactions about other teams in the playoffs.

Meanwhile, Portland be like..."we're gonna run it back with you and CJ and hope Nurk and Zollins stay healthy" for like 5 straight years.

Dude must be looking at other options at this point. Maybe he likes Tex-Mex and churros? :hungry:

[Atl Spur]

We have some desirable trade candidates : Dougie, j rich, poodle…. Our off season should be truly interesting!

[R. DeMurre]

1518068261266489349 (https://twitter.com/dame_lillard/status/1518068261266489349?s=21&t=TFjAkQVI0ltixe0ZZePU0A)


The impressive thing too is that they went against conventional wisdom and drafted two guys who were considered T-rex athletes, both of whom were red flagged comment-wise all over the place for their measurements. Brandon Clarke's wingspan was the same as his height in shoes-- underwhelming for a forward-- and Desmond Bane has the very unusual situation of having a wingspan almost 2" shorter than his height, which is incredibly rare in the NBA.

[SAGirl]

The impressive thing too is that they went against conventional wisdom and drafted two guys who were considered T-rex athletes, both of whom were red flagged comment-wise all over the place for their measurements. Brandon Clarke's wingspan was the same as his height in shoes-- underwhelming for a forward-- and Desmond Bane has the very unusual situation of having a wingspan almost 2" shorter than his height, which is incredibly rare in the NBA.
both guys are among their best players. I’ve seen somewhere that age is just one factor, which I take to mean, yeah how young the prospect is, it’s important but doesn’t paint the whole picture. I think measurements are kind of the same, they are a factor, but don’t paint the whole picture. Both guys were drafted late in the first, were not “lottery talent” but have outperformed many other blue chip guys because they could always play basketball and were very good right out of the gate, and getting better with more confidence and experience.
I think the Grizzlies went for the home run play with Ziaire, so we’ll see what happens there.

[Dverde]

Spurs may actually have a shot at getting Zach Lavine with this Bulls sloppy exit. Not sure I’d want him, but I thought the chance was zero before the playoffs.

[Atl Spur]

Spurs may actually have a shot at getting Zach Lavine with this Bulls sloppy exit. Not sure I’d want him, but I thought the chance was zero before the playoffs.

Not worth the money in my opinion and doesn’t seem to be a go to guy in the clutch.

[ZeusWillJudge]

1518068261266489349 (https://twitter.com/dame_lillard/status/1518068261266489349?s=21&t=TFjAkQVI0ltixe0ZZePU0A)


Bane was on my very short (and public) list in 2020. Haliburton was my first choice, but I was convinced that there was a deal that the Spurs could have done to get both of them. Bane had talent, but also an excess of toughness. And that intangible quality of being a "winner".

Last year I really, really wanted the Spurs to grab Davion Mitchell, for a lot of the same reasons, even if it meant trying to move up a couple of slots. (As it turned out, two slots still wouldn't have been enough, but TIMVP and I are still going to have an I-told-you-so moment after his second year, even if I'm the one eathing crow.) But Sengun and Duarte were my fallback positions if Mitchell was already off the board.

I also screamed for the Spurs to take Max Strus in the second round, or at least have a contract waiting if he went undrafted. He's now starting in the playoffs for the best (record) team in the Eastern Conference, and shot a paltry .410 from 3P this season.

So what about this year? I'm pretty confident that if the media pieces are right, Jabari Walker is going to be one of those draft day sliders that will wind up being a solid rotation player. And if PBJ really does slip out of the first round, like many are saying, he's a no-brainer.

People keep talking about the Spurs dealing one of their FRP's. One direction I haven't read anyone talk about is trading down with one of them. Say to Indiana or Orlando or Toronto, for 31 or 32 or 33, and a future lottery-protected 1st. There are several guys in this draft that I think will be playing in the NBA by 2023 that will likely be available in the early 2nd round, if the Spurs don't want another rookie scale contract on the books.

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1518068261266489349 (https://twitter.com/dame_lillard/status/1518068261266489349?s=21&t=TFjAkQVI0ltixe0ZZePU0A)

Yes, they have. And they're developing talent and fitting in FA pieces too. As much as I cannot stand them, Memphis is setting itself up for years of success.

[KingKev]

Yes, they have. And they're developing talent and fitting in FA pieces too. As much as I cannot stand them, Memphis is setting itself up for years of success.

They have a pretty cap good situation too. Could easily be layers this offseason if they wanted to by moving Adams last year and renouncing fathead and Tyus Jones would give them 35mm to play with.

[scott]

Looks like John Collins had a pretty meh playoffs. Does this make him more likely to be moved by Atlanta? Does he still have the same appeal to the John Collins stans here? Averaged 9.4 pts, 4.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 0.2 blks in the series against Miami.

What would you be willing to give up?

[tbdog]

Looks like John Collins had a pretty meh playoffs. Does this make him more likely to be moved by Atlanta? Does he still have the same appeal to the John Collins stans here? Averaged 9.4 pts, 4.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 0.2 blks in the series against Miami.

What would you be willing to give up?

He was injured. He came back for the playoffs.

[Chinook]

Have people talked about Oladipo on here? Unlike a lot of the scoring guards the team could target, Dipo is known for being stout defensively. If folks are worried about the defense taking a hit as it adds offensive star power, it could be a good compromise. I also think he'd come cheaper than most players of his caliber considering his injury history. With all of their other contracts, Miami probably doesn't see him as a priority to re-sign anyway. It wouldn't be a perfect fit, but on a short term "prove it again" deal, signing him would be a move that could raise the team's ceiling quite a bit without really hurting their floor.

[KingKev]

Have people talked about Oladipo on here? Unlike a lot of the scoring guards the team could target, Dipo is known for being stout defensively. If folks are worried about the defense taking a hit as it adds offensive star power, it could be a good compromise. I also think he'd come cheaper than most players of his caliber considering his injury history. With all of their other contracts, Miami probably doesn't see him as a priority to re-sign anyway. It wouldn't be a perfect fit, but on a short term "prove it again" deal, signing him would be a move that could raise the team's ceiling quite a bit without really hurting their floor.

Even if we let Walker go we have JRich, Vassell, Primo and Langford on the roster who all will see time at the 2. Dipo makes good sense for someone competing and that simply isn’t us. He makes 0 sense for a rebuilding team other than to sign him and flip him if he performs. If you bring in another 2 it should be a young high upside player.

[Seventyniner]

I think Richardson makes someone like Oladipo redundant. There's room for one late-20s vet presence at SG on the roster but not two.

It seems like the Spurs are more worried about cap space in 2023 than 2022, and it would probably take a lot of money to get Oladipo to take a one-year deal in the case that Richardson is traded.

[mo7888]

Have people talked about Oladipo on here? Unlike a lot of the scoring guards the team could target, Dipo is known for being stout defensively. If folks are worried about the defense taking a hit as it adds offensive star power, it could be a good compromise. I also think he'd come cheaper than most players of his caliber considering his injury history. With all of their other contracts, Miami probably doesn't see him as a priority to re-sign anyway. It wouldn't be a perfect fit, but on a short term "prove it again" deal, signing him would be a move that could raise the team's ceiling quite a bit without really hurting their floor.

I can see it but, to me that would signal that we are committing to building quickly around DJ and Poeltl on more of a shorter term trajectory. Now, I've been an advocate of taking one of two paths 1) building around DJ and moving young players/picks for win now moves or 2) moving DJ and Poeltl and building with the younger guys and picks.

So I'd be good with it as long as we are packaging other assets for that PF we all talk about needing. That said, I kind of feel like the FO is going to take the slower path...trade Poeltl this summer and botch things up a little by holding DJ to long without adding win now players... hopefully we strike gold in the lottery and that forces our hand a little bit..

[Chinook]

Even if we let Walker go we have JRich, Vassell, Primo and Langford on the roster who all will see time at the 2. Dipo makes good sense for someone competing and that simply isn’t us. He makes 0 sense for a rebuilding team other than to sign him and flip him if he performs. If you bring in another 2 it should be a young high upside player.

I have the upside of Oladipo getting healthy as being worth way more than the prospect of any of the young guards developing. Certainly, I don't care about Langford and don't want the Spurs to consider him when making any roster moves. I like Richardson, but he's a role-player. He can and would have a role on a more serious Spurs team even if they signed a starting two-guard. Like it or not, the Spurs are very unlikely to see a big distinction between their SG and SF positions, and you may even be able to throw backup PF into that mix. There's plenty of space to play multiple wings.

I don't think the Spurs can be said to be rebuilding. They don't have anything worth rebuilding around. They have a few decent players they can use to compete, but they don't have anybody where you can project a future window opening up through growth. I'm a strong opponent of the "championship or bust" mentality, so I think the team should look to compete if they can do so without overleveraging their future. They should be able to assemble a strong rotation without giving up future picks or even their best prospect. They even have multiple pathways to doing so. To me, that's worth freezing lower-level prospects out if they can't win their competitions.

A final thing of note is that Oladipo is likely to take a short-term deal given his injury history. So the team isn't likely to be committing to him too strongly. They can tech back into a rebuild if it doesn't work out with him.

[Chinook]

I can see it but, to me that would signal that we are committing to building quickly around DJ and Poeltl on more of a shorter term trajectory. Now, I've been an advocate of taking one of two paths 1) building around DJ and moving young players/picks for win now moves or 2) moving DJ and Poeltl and building with the younger guys and picks.

So I'd be good with it as long as we are packaging other assets for that PF we all talk about needing. That said, I kind of feel like the FO is going to take the slower path...trade Poeltl this summer and botch things up a little by holding DJ to long without adding win now players... hopefully we strike gold in the lottery and that forces our hand a little bit..

I don't think the Spurs are going to be as interested in trading Poeltl as they were back in February. They finished the year stronger and now have the cap space to see if they can improve. I think if they get a great deal for him, they would take it, but I also think they have little interest in 2022 draft capital for him given how much they have already. Therefore, they might think it makes more sense to keep him and either extend him in October or trade him later in the season. The same is true for Murray as well, though obviously they are probably even less inclined to trade him. I agree that it makes more sense to predict the Spurs are going to slow-play this off-season. I'm hoping I'm wrong, but I've yet to hear rumblings about them wanting to meet with guys. We're still months out from free agency though, so we'll just have to wait to see what develops.

[ZeusWillJudge]

I have the upside of Oladipo getting healthy as being worth way more than the prospect of any of the young guards developing. Certainly, I don't care about Langford and don't want the Spurs to consider him when making any roster moves. I like Richardson, but he's a role-player. He can and would have a role on a more serious Spurs team even if they signed a starting two-guard. Like it or not, the Spurs are very unlikely to see a big distinction between their SG and SF positions, and you may even be able to throw backup PF into that mix. There's plenty of space to play multiple wings.

I don't think the Spurs can be said to be rebuilding. They don't have anything worth rebuilding around. They have a few decent players they can use to compete, but they don't have anybody where you can project a future window opening up through growth. I'm a strong opponent of the "championship or bust" mentality, so I think the team should look to compete if they can do so without overleveraging their future. They should be able to assemble a strong rotation without giving up future picks or even their best prospect. They even have multiple pathways to doing so. To me, that's worth freezing lower-level prospects out if they can't win their competitions.

A final thing of note is that Oladipo is likely to take a short-term deal given his injury history. So the team isn't likely to be committing to him too strongly. They can tech back into a rebuild if it doesn't work out with him.


I think that's a great idea, top to bottom. That quad rupture is a tough injury, but he's only 8-9 years in, so still young enough to get back to something like his old form if it's in the cards. Healthy he would be a HUGE lift to this team, but even at reduced capacity he's been good enough to invest in.

I read an article from his surgeon basically saying that the first surgery wasn't done right, and that his quad tendon wasn't even attached (or fully attached, or whatever). The second surgeon said that he was amazed that Oladipo had been playing on it at all.

Yeah, I would give two thumbs up for that suggestion if I could.

[mo7888]

I don't think the Spurs are going to be as interested in trading Poeltl as they were back in February. They finished the year stronger and now have the cap space to see if they can improve. I think if they get a great deal for him, they would take it, but I also think they have little interest in 2022 draft capital for him given how much they have already. Therefore, they might think it makes more sense to keep him and either extend him in October or trade him later in the season. The same is true for Murray as well, though obviously they are probably even less inclined to trade him. I agree that it makes more sense to predict the Spurs are going to slow-play this off-season. I'm hoping I'm wrong, but I've yet to hear rumblings about them wanting to meet with guys. We're still months out from free agency though, so we'll just have to wait to see what develops.

We see this very similar... extending Poetl (if he'll accept) makes a ton of sense (whether extracting trade value later or keeping him). I also hope to see them be more aggressive instead of slow playing the offseason. I'd love to see us use assets to be buyers to give us a shot at competing for playoff position next year.

[SAGirl]

Oladipo is better than all the guys in the list KingKiev mentioned and there is a spot on the team for a SG that can score and generate his own shot, specially after Lonnie is gone. It just depends on whether the team is taking a long term view or a stay “competitive” path. As someone said, if you start making win now moves, then trading Jakob doesn’t make sense. However, I also dont think SA is an attractive team for Oladipo to join, so the Spurs have to sell him on it.

I dont have much expectation for Langford because dude is an injury magnet, it has probably affected his development and is not very good. Primo is still a project that should get minutes but I think he needs to earn that playing time, not get it by default at this point. Richardson has merits, mostly because shooting is his best attribute, so he complements DJ well… with just enough ball handling and offensive game to be useful, but a healthy Oladipo is much better.

Overall, the Spurs are a tough sell without picking a direction on what they want to do, so they will have to make some judgement calls to sell agents on a role, etc.

[KingKev]

Oladipo lost out on big money these last few years. Does he bet in himself and take a a 1yr deal at 5ish hoping he can stay healthy, showout and earn what would probably be his final major paydayor do you try and get a 2-3yr deal at MLE?

Doubt he comes here in a short term deal unless it is well above market value like 15/yr.

[Chinook]

I don't have any problem with the Spurs giving Oladipo a $40M/2 deal if the second year is a team option or non-guaranteed. They have a lot of cap space and not a lot of open roster spots. I've been vocally of the opinion that the Spurs should be looking to max out a young two-guard, so taking a similar upside for a player while not having to leverage quite that much fits fine for me. If he's healthy, then the second year fits well. If he's not, then you take the loss in a meh year and move on with the newly drafted players. That's difference than Lavine and/or Sexton where you're committing to a four-year deal while giving up a good deal of flexibility to make the money work.

[SAGirl]

If I were his agent I’d try to get him paid the most he can get, specially coming to a bad team. I’d only advise a smallish contract if he were playing in a good playoff team in a location he likes, as currently for the Heat. I dont know what is on his mind obviously.

Edit: chinook already covered other aspects of this.

[Chinook]

Like here's an example of an aggressive but not overleveraged off-season:

The Spurs trade McDermott, Langford, 9 and a heavily protected future first to Detroit for Jeremi Grant

Draft: Kessler at 20, Baldwin at 25 and Alondes Williams at 38

Sign Oladipo to a short-term deal averaging $18M-$22M a year

Let Walker go but tender the other RFAs.

Training Camp Roster

Murray, Jones, Williams
Oladipo, Primo, Stewart
Vassell, Richardson, Wieskamp, Woodard
Grant, Johnson, Baldwin, Landale, KBD
Poeltl, Collins, Kessler, Cacock

They'd still have one open TC spot and probably a few more as they release guys they know aren't going to make the team but might have opportunities elsewhere. I would say two-guard is the thinnest spot, but given how many of the SFs can play there, I don't think it's a big need. It'd be a huge sacrifice to trade away a mid-lotto pick, but that team would have a competitive rotation and would have almost completely clear cap space going into the 2023 off-season. If the team feels like there's a guy with their first pick that's worth building around, they don't do this. But if they're meh on the draft, it feels like a nice send-off roster for Pop.

[Mr. Body]

Looks like John Collins had a pretty meh playoffs. Does this make him more likely to be moved by Atlanta? Does he still have the same appeal to the John Collins stans here? Averaged 9.4 pts, 4.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 0.2 blks in the series against Miami.

What would you be willing to give up?

He's a meh player.

I do think ATL tries to dump him, but his contract is so terrible they'd have to sweeten the pot. He's the classic guy who played hard for a contract and then returned to sucking.

[Mr. Body]

As for Oladipo, I've been a fan since before he entered the league and have always thought he'd be a great Spur.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Like here's an example of an aggressive but not overleveraged off-season:

The Spurs trade McDermott, Langford, 9 and a heavily protected future first to Detroit for Jeremi Grant

Draft: Kessler at 20, Baldwin at 25 and Alondes Williams at 38

Sign Oladipo to a short-term deal averaging $18M-$22M a year

Let Walker go but tender the other RFAs.

Training Camp Roster

Murray, Jones, Williams
Oladipo, Primo, Stewart
Vassell, Richardson, Wieskamp, Woodard
Grant, Johnson, Baldwin, Landale, KBD
Poeltl, Collins, Kessler, Cacock

They'd still have one open TC spot and probably a few more as they release guys they know aren't going to make the team but might have opportunities elsewhere. I would say two-guard is the thinnest spot, but given how many of the SFs can play there, I don't think it's a big need. It'd be a huge sacrifice to trade away a mid-lotto pick, but that team would have a competitive rotation and would have almost completely clear cap space going into the 2023 off-season. If the team feels like there's a guy with their first pick that's worth building around, they don't do this. But if they're meh on the draft, it feels like a nice send-off roster for Pop.


That's exactly what I was looking for when I started this thread. That's a great comprehensive look at this offseason. I'm not even going to nitpick Jerami Grant. Every player has some negative, and that overall plan is just too solid to split hairs. If that exact laundry list could be pulled off, I would sit back and take whatever result the season would bring. For those who want the Spurs back in the playoffs ASAP, that almost has to get them there.

You also nailed it about IF the Spurs feel like there's a guy to build around that will fall to their pick, it changes everything. None of us have scouts in gyms to predict that. If they were high enough on Leonard Miller to take him at 9, I would just accept that they did their due diligence, and that would change everything.

For the record, I wouldn't have started that other thread if somebody, anybody, had given a comprehensive look like you just did in this one. That's a much more balanced roster, without major long-term FA commitments. I think LaVine, for instance, would make the team a lot better, but I wouldn't want to give up what it takes to bring him here. Nice job.

[Chinook]

He's a meh player.

I do think ATL tries to dump him, but his contract is so terrible they'd have to sweeten the pot. He's the classic guy who played hard for a contract and then returned to sucking.

This is why you think everyone is in love with Collins -- you aren't objective about him. Dude made the All-Rookie second team his first year and was in the top 10 in MIP voting his second. At what point did he originally suck that he could now return to it? He didn't have a great year, and who knows how much of it was chemistry and how much of it was injuries that might linger. That could be a legit thing to monitor, but even his down year would have been at worst the third-best performance on the Spurs. Whether he ends up performing like a max player is up in the air, but it's not because the was a bad player who had a good contract year.

[Dex]

Spurs may actually have a shot at getting Zach Lavine with this Bulls sloppy exit. Not sure I’d want him, but I thought the chance was zero before the playoffs.

Looks like he will be damaged goods:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/bulls/2022/4/27/23044752/bulls-guard-zach-lavine-headed-knee-surgery-season-ends

[KingKev]

Looks like he will be damaged goods:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/bulls/2022/4/27/23044752/bulls-guard-zach-lavine-headed-knee-surgery-season-ends

Wowzers. Was just about to get the bag too.

[The Truth #6]

I'm ok with Oladipo. Philosophically it seems like a change from how they are building the roster, but in reality it doesn't change too much. We would hopefully be better with him, but still trying to make moves to get better with young players, because I don't see us doing more than maybe getting into the first round. Chinook doesn't feel we are rebuilding, which to me seems odd. If not, then we are the step before rebuilding? We are probably getting caught up in semantics, I suppose. We are a young team that currently sucks. I'd say our wins towards the end of the year should be taken lightly, even lighter than what they thought they gleaned from the Bubble play years ago. We played lots of bad teams while also, I suppose, making progress. But then the play-in showed, at least in that one game, that we were not ready for much yet at all. Anyway. Oladipo. Sounds ok to me.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Looks like he will be damaged goods:

https://chicago.suntimes.com/bulls/2022/4/27/23044752/bulls-guard-zach-lavine-headed-knee-surgery-season-ends


First I heard about that. There have been some other articles that sounded like he knows he's thiiiis close to a life-changing max contract. I get that. But trying to cover for an injury to get it is sort of a yellow flag for me. More than sort of.

I loved this part: Back in early March, LaVine was discussing the severity of the discomfort and said, “me at 80%, 70%, whatever it is, I’m still one of the best players in the NBA and damn sure one of the best players on the court when we play. So, okay, Zach - how about giving a 20-30% discount on that max (not super-max) deal, to make up for not being at full strength? Like that's ever going to happen.

Somebody, either Chicago or someone else, is going to pay him. And I didn't want to pay max for him before I knew about the injury being worse than represented. I need to give Brian Wright a call and tell him that I'm now in the "definite no" camp.

[Mr. Body]

This is why you think everyone is in love with Collins -- you aren't objective about him. Dude made the All-Rookie second team his first year and was in the top 10 in MIP voting his second. At what point did he originally suck that he could now return to it? He didn't have a great year, and who knows how much of it was chemistry and how much of it was injuries that might linger. That could be a legit thing to monitor, but even his down year would have been at worst the third-best performance on the Spurs. Whether he ends up performing like a max player is up in the air, but it's not because the was a bad player who had a good contract year.

LOL at trying to acquire this guy at $25,000,000/year. Holy shit bro.

[Mr. Body]

Like here's an example of an aggressive but not overleveraged off-season:

The Spurs trade McDermott, Langford, 9 and a heavily protected future first to Detroit for Jeremi Grant

Draft: Kessler at 20, Baldwin at 25 and Alondes Williams at 38

Sign Oladipo to a short-term deal averaging $18M-$22M a year

Let Walker go but tender the other RFAs.

Training Camp Roster

Murray, Jones, Williams
Oladipo, Primo, Stewart
Vassell, Richardson, Wieskamp, Woodard
Grant, Johnson, Baldwin, Landale, KBD
Poeltl, Collins, Kessler, Cacock

They'd still have one open TC spot and probably a few more as they release guys they know aren't going to make the team but might have opportunities elsewhere. I would say two-guard is the thinnest spot, but given how many of the SFs can play there, I don't think it's a big need. It'd be a huge sacrifice to trade away a mid-lotto pick, but that team would have a competitive rotation and would have almost completely clear cap space going into the 2023 off-season. If the team feels like there's a guy with their first pick that's worth building around, they don't do this. But if they're meh on the draft, it feels like a nice send-off roster for Pop.

Congrats on one of the worst offseasons imaginable. Coughing up the #9 for Jerami Grant (plus another first?)? And then getting Kessler and Baldwin with the rest? Might as well set the draft picks on fire.

[KingKev]

Like here's an example of an aggressive but not overleveraged off-season:

The Spurs trade McDermott, Langford, 9 and a heavily protected future first to Detroit for Jeremi Grant

Draft: Kessler at 20, Baldwin at 25 and Alondes Williams at 38

Sign Oladipo to a short-term deal averaging $18M-$22M a year

Let Walker go but tender the other RFAs.

Training Camp Roster

Murray, Jones, Williams
Oladipo, Primo, Stewart
Vassell, Richardson, Wieskamp, Woodard
Grant, Johnson, Baldwin, Landale, KBD
Poeltl, Collins, Kessler, Cacock

They'd still have one open TC spot and probably a few more as they release guys they know aren't going to make the team but might have opportunities elsewhere. I would say two-guard is the thinnest spot, but given how many of the SFs can play there, I don't think it's a big need. It'd be a huge sacrifice to trade away a mid-lotto pick, but that team would have a competitive rotation and would have almost completely clear cap space going into the 2023 off-season. If the team feels like there's a guy with their first pick that's worth building around, they don't do this. But if they're meh on the draft, it feels like a nice send-off roster for Pop.

That’s a competitive short term roster that gets you maybe the 5th or 6th seed in the west. Grant would be a nice addition but that’s too much to give up for him when you’ll have cap to sign him outright the following year.

That flexibility comes at quite the price for a moderately competitive roster that will get considerably more expensive if you want to maintain or build on it in summer 23 when Jak and Grant are UFA’s and Keldon’s extension kicks in.

[objective]

Looks like John Collins had a pretty meh playoffs. Does this make him more likely to be moved by Atlanta? Does he still have the same appeal to the John Collins stans here? Averaged 9.4 pts, 4.6 reb, 1.2 ast, 0.2 blks in the series against Miami.

What would you be willing to give up?

He was injured and playing through it. Had prp injection in his foot and an injection in his hand, he has a torn tendon with one of his fingers.

[objective]

Have people talked about Oladipo on here? Unlike a lot of the scoring guards the team could target, Dipo is known for being stout defensively. If folks are worried about the defense taking a hit as it adds offensive star power, it could be a good compromise. I also think he'd come cheaper than most players of his caliber considering his injury history. With all of their other contracts, Miami probably doesn't see him as a priority to re-sign anyway. It wouldn't be a perfect fit, but on a short term "prove it again" deal, signing him would be a move that could raise the team's ceiling quite a bit without really hurting their floor.

No thanks from me.

30 year old injury ridden guard who sulked his way out of Indiana. Even if he's a 20 point a game scorer, he helps the Spurs right out of the playoffs into a lame 8th seed to continue a treadmill of mediocrity. And if he's not, he's a waste of capspace.

[Chinook]

LOL at trying to acquire this guy at $25,000,000/year. Holy shit bro.

Care to actually have a substantive conversation about this? Even if you think Collins sucks, you wouldn't be correct in saying he had a good year and then went back to sucking. He was about as good during that fourth year as he had been the previous years. If he didn't suck in that year, he didn't suck before that.

[The Truth #6]

Wowzers. Was just about to get the bag too.

Injured player? That's when the Spurs pounce. His chance of signing here just increased dramatically.

[KingKev]

Injured player? That's when the Spurs pounce. His chance of signing here just increased dramatically.

A knee scope usually isn’t that serious but this could be the catalyst for the Bulls to not offer him a max pushing him closer to being in play this free agency.

[Chinook]

Congrats on one of the worst offseasons imaginable. Coughing up the #9 for Jerami Grant (plus another first?)? And then getting Kessler and Baldwin with the rest? Might as well set the draft picks on fire.

I'm going to assume your post is in good faith and not just an exclamation you have no interest in defending. I do think Grant's a fit for the roster, and getting off McDermott's last year has value in this context where the Spurs are basically burning clean fuel making an honest effort to make Pop's final year a good one. I would love for it to be too much and for the Spurs to save on assets. I'd be willing to pay that much, though, to complete the rotation while basically leaving the future picks untouched.

As far as Kessler, Baldwin and Williams go, I don't care if you want to swap them out with other prospects. I think the Spurs have long-term needs at PG, PF and C, though, and they have the picks to get good but not great prospects. Given that the rotation is already full, I don't see any reason to worry about the win-now potential of any of the guys they're picking. Like most Spurs fans, I imagine, I have been spending whatever scouting energy I have on guys near the team's natural first. I don't have a ton of knowledge on the middle of the draft. But obviously good players will be drafted there. It's up to the Spurs to snag them.

[Chinook]

That’s a competitive short term roster that gets you maybe the 5th or 6th seed in the west. Grant would be a nice addition but that’s too much to give up for him when you’ll have cap to sign him outright the following year.

That flexibility comes at quite the price for a moderately competitive roster that will get considerably more expensive if you want to maintain or build on it in summer 23 when Jak and Grant are UFA’s and Keldon’s extension kicks in.

You're saying both that the Spurs will have the cap space to sign Grant if he's not on the team but will have to worry about re-signing him if he's on the team. That doesn't make a ton of sense. If salary is something to worry about in 2023, it would be a bigger worry for a team using cap space rather than a team just trying to stay under the tax. That's ignoring that Grant would be most useful next season when the Spurs can afford to have him and Oladipo/some other guard as well as having Richardson in his final season of his deal. Waiting an extra season has a cost. I wouldn't even be completely sure on the team keeping Johnson anyway. I think he'd be a great sixth man, but he's also limited to such an extent that he can be 80/20'd by another player. I certainly would plan on keeping him, but I probably wouldn't have a ton of interest in extending him unless the team acquires some long-term contracts this summer.

[KingKev]

You're saying both that the Spurs will have the cap space to sign Grant if he's not on the team but will have to worry about re-signing him if he's on the team. That doesn't make a ton of sense. If salary is something to worry about in 2023, it would be a bigger worry for a team using cap space rather than a team just trying to stay under the tax. That's ignoring that Grant would be most useful next season when the Spurs can afford to have him and Oladipo/some other guard as well as having Richardson in his final season of his deal. Waiting an extra season has a cost. I wouldn't even be completely sure on the team keeping Johnson anyway. I think he'd be a great sixth man, but he's also limited to such an extent that he can be 80/20'd by another player. I certainly would plan on keeping him, but I probably wouldn't have a ton of interest in extending him unless the team acquires some long-term contracts this summer.

I didn’t say that at all. I’m saying if you want to BUILD on that roster you most likely can’t in 2023 and you have up a #9 pick and another FRP along the way. Whereas you could keep your draft capital and have the same result ti start the 2023-24 season.

[Chinook]

I didn’t say that at all. I’m saying if you want to BUILD on that roster you most likely can’t in 2023 and you have up a #9 pick and another FRP along the way. Whereas you could keep your draft capital and have the same result ti start the 2023-24 season.

You said the 9th pick was too much to pay in part because the Spurs can just sign Grant the next year, but the Spurs are likely going to have less financial flexibility in 2023, especially with McDermott and the ninth pick on the books. That's more than $18 Million extra on the books, and rather than being able to use the full projected $154 Million of space under the tax to keep a team together, you can only to up to the $127-Million salary cap. Functionally then, the Spurs have and extra $45 Million (and can even be more if they were to convey their 2023 first as part of the trade) in 2023-2024 salary flexibility by making this trade versus not doing so. That alone is enough for the second year of Oladipo's option and the first year of a max extension for Grant, with a decent chunk left over. It's way easier to form a strong 2023-2024 team if they make the trade. They are missing out on whomever they would have taken at 9, true, but they are also getting that better team a year earlier and still have multiple chances to get young players.

[Chinook]

The Capulator isn't working properly right now, so I can't export the mock off-season, but the Spurs should have a full roster with enough salary space to give Murray the renegotiation/extension needed to help keep the future cap healthy. I'd rather them do that after acquiring the long-term running mates he needs like say Lavine and our good friend John Collins or Sexton and Siakam or whatever. But regardless, it becomes way more possible if the team isn't committing almost $14 Million to McD and $5 Million to a pick.

[KingKev]

You said the 9th pick was too much to pay in part because the Spurs can just sign Grant the next year, but the Spurs are likely going to have less financial flexibility in 2023, especially with McDermott and the ninth pick on the books. That's more than $18 Million extra on the books, and rather than being able to use the full projected $154 Million of space under the tax to keep a team together, you can only to up to the $127-Million salary cap. Functionally then, the Spurs have and extra $45 Million (and can even be more if they were to convey their 2023 first as part of the trade) in 2023-2024 salary flexibility by making this trade versus not doing so. That alone is enough for the second year of Oladipo's option and the first year of a max extension for Grant, with a decent chunk left over. It's way easier to form a strong 2023-2024 team if they make the trade. They are missing out on whomever they would have taken at 9, true, but they are also getting that better team a year earlier and still have multiple chances to get young players.

In any scenario I’d hope McD is dumped. I could sit here and map out how we could easily get to the same opening roster in fall 2023 without giving #9 but going back and forth is a pretty useless exercise. I’ll acknowledge your scenario makes it easier to go over the cap to retain players. That flexibility cost you #9 and an FRP. We just rented out 20mm in cap space for a late 2022 FRP, so I can not see us paying that cost for Grant’s bird rights in any scenario.

[Chinook]

In any scenario I’d hope McD is dumped. I could sit here and map out how we could easily get to the same opening roster in fall 2023 without giving #9 but going back and forth is a pretty useless exercise. I’ll acknowledge your scenario makes it easier to go over the cap to retain players. That flexibility cost you #9 and an FRP. We just rented out 20mm in cap space for a late 2022 FRP, so I can not see us paying that cost for Grant in any scenario.

I don't know why you continue to act like only the 2023 season matters. They aren't paying the pick just for the flexibility. They're trading it to get a good player now and to free up 22 cap space. I'm not even saying it's Grant in particular. I just think Grant is the most "gettable" of the middle-class PFs on the market. It doesn't hurt that he's expiring and a good defender. If you prefer someone the Spurs can't just sign (which has always assumed the Spurs would be able to sign anyone they had enough cap space to keep), then swap in Collins, Randle or whomever. Doing Oladipo and Grant is the conservative path that still leaves $11 Million in space. They can bump that up to Lavine and Collins without much sweat, and neither of those guys is going to be attainable for cap space in 2023.

Of course, I'm not telling you the Spurs have to trade that pick. There are other pathways. But that's a way for them to be aggressive while also still continuing to fill their coffers for the future. It's a rare moment of flexibility when a team can make huge strides in both directions at once.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Congrats on one of the worst offseasons imaginable. Coughing up the #9 for Jerami Grant (plus another first?)? And then getting Kessler and Baldwin with the rest? Might as well set the draft picks on fire.



So offer up a better ending roster. Just (please) don't make it based on getting ping-pong balls, and don't have one of the Top 4 still miraculously on the board at #9.

For the record, I absolutely think PBjr would be worth a throw with the second pick, and Kessler is big enough to actually provide some muscle in the middle that the Spurs desperately lack. I get that you would like to see something better from that 9 pick. Toss out who you think would be available, and how you would spend some of that cap money. I'm not throwing rocks at people for anything that looks possible.

[ZeusWillJudge]

The Capulator isn't working properly right now, so I can't export the mock off-season, but the Spurs should have a full roster with enough salary space to give Murray the renegotiation/extension needed to help keep the future cap healthy. I'd rather them do that after acquiring the long-term running mates he needs like say Lavine and our good friend John Collins or Sexton and Siakam or whatever. But regardless, it becomes way more possible if the team isn't committing almost $14 Million to McD and $5 Million to a pick.


That's why I liked it. Parameter based, and checks most of the boxes for what they need to do, and what they can't do. They really can't get in the position of having to spin off DJ without the best return because they can't afford to pay him. He may not be a franchise, but he's definitely someone they need to keep around unless the perfect deal comes up. And you're right, you have to count the rookie scale of the #9 pick in the math.

[TD 21]

Skimming through this, I get that this is just an example of a scenario to pursue, but that offer isn't getting it done for Grant (word awhile back was that the Trail Blazers would need to add a second significant asset to their projected 1st to get it done) and Siakam isn't available.

My guess is the Pistons would want 9/10, one of 20/25 or a future protected 1st projected to be equal or greater and Richardson.

As for this notion of Johnson as a 6th man or maybe future piece, be prepared for something similar to the White extension on the eve of next season.


We see this very similar... extending Poetl (if he'll accept) makes a ton of sense (whether extracting trade value later or keeping him). I also hope to see them be more aggressive instead of slow playing the offseason. I'd love to see us use assets to be buyers to give us a shot at competing for playoff position next year.

He's the linchpin of the off season . . .

- Jump into the top 4 (yeah right) and extending him becomes a virtual no brainer.
- Stick at 9 or drop to 10 and extending him could still makes sense as they could take that + some combination of the Raptors/Celtics 1sts and Richardson to slightly move up and/or target Collins, Grant, Barnes, etc.
- Or they could instead attach him to 9 or 10 and utilize that as the vehicle to add a significant piece(s) while reorienting the core.

[ZeusWillJudge]

That’s a competitive short term roster that gets you maybe the 5th or 6th seed in the west. Grant would be a nice addition but that’s too much to give up for him when you’ll have cap to sign him outright the following year.

That flexibility comes at quite the price for a moderately competitive roster that will get considerably more expensive if you want to maintain or build on it in summer 23 when Jak and Grant are UFA’s and Keldon’s extension kicks in.


Last thing - if Grant gets back to full strength, you probably trade (or S&T) him later. He would be a solid trade chip if that happens. But if he doesn't the Spurs aren't saddled to a huge long-term deal. There are worse outcomes.

I don't think there's any way this team rises so quickly from the ashes that a step-wise approach should be rejected. I think that team could at least get to the second round, which looks pretty much unattainable at this point. With a little luck, maybe even the WCF. If you're thinking about another year of play-in and the #7-9 pick next year, say so. Another thread I've wanted to start has to deal with the horizon, and whether people would be willing to toss off another season to look much better in two. I'm not against that, but I think I'm in the minority.

Look at the thread title, and talk about WHOLE offseason rather than individual players. I'm all ears to whatever people are thinking.

[The Truth #6]

Maybe the most interesting to me, though minor, part of Chinook's proposal was drafting Alondes Williams with the SRP. Wasn't famililar with him but he looks to be very interesting, and hopefully other teams get worried about his age and he falls to us as a possibility.

[Chinook]

Maybe the most interesting to me, though minor, part of Chinook's proposal was drafting Alondes Williams with the SRP. Wasn't famililar with him but he looks to be very interesting, and hopefully other teams get worried about his age and he falls to us as a possibility.

Yeah, he feels like a really good pick in the middle of the draft. I didn't know much about him either and still don't, but as cheap depth, he checks a lot of boxes. I also think people tend to undervalue production in college. Both Alondes and Trevion Williams are guys I'd be very intrigued with the Spurs taking with their final pick, despite their age

[ZeusWillJudge]

Maybe the most interesting to me, though minor, part of Chinook's proposal was drafting Alondes Williams with the SRP. Wasn't famililar with him but he looks to be very interesting, and hopefully other teams get worried about his age and he falls to us as a possibility.


I know zip about Alondes Williams. Nada. He never appeared on my radar. I keep seeing his name on mocks, some even into the late teens. But a lot of those mock draft guys want to show that they "discovered" some standout in the upcoming season. They don't get hammered for being wrong, but if they hit the player lotto they get to come back and crow (and get more hits on next year's dozen mock draft articles). It looks like Chinook did some homework on him, and I definitely have not. Hard to go too wrong with a SRP, so once again I didn't nitpick.

[XDT76]

I know zip about Alondes Williams. Nada. He never appeared on my radar. I keep seeing his name on mocks, some even into the late teens. But a lot of those mock draft guys want to show that they "discovered" some standout in the upcoming season. They don't get hammered for being wrong, but if they hit the player lotto they get to come back and crow (and get more hits on next year's dozen mock draft articles). It looks like Chinook did some homework on him, and I definitely have not. Hard to go too wrong with a SRP, so once again I didn't nitpick.

Didn't really check him out but if we take a look at those mock draft scouting report we would be wondering why is everyone not a top 3 prospect. There is a site stating this guy with 16 strengths and the only concern are catch and shoot and age. However like you say for a SRP hardly any issue if things does not work out

[ZeusWillJudge]

Didn't really check him out but if we take a look at those mock draft scouting report we would be wondering why is everyone not a top 3 prospect. There is a site stating this guy with 16 strengths and the only concern are catch and shoot and age. However like you say for a SRP hardly any issue if things does not work out


That's pretty funny. Maybe Top 10, but your point is well taken. Any guy who's played a year or two of college ball without seven or eight plays for a highlight reel is a true scrub. So you're either totally worthless, or a contender for the lottery. That's the world of YouTube.

[SAGirl]

Not saying this happens, but there surely there will be some guys traded this summer.

1520246427774906369

And not that the Spurs need him for anything, but it might affect all those “trade Jakob” few fans. I’d place Adams in the potential trade block as well if I were Memphis.

[KingKev]

Not saying this happens, but there surely there will be some guys traded this summer.

1520246427774906369

And not that the Spurs need him for anything, but it might affect all those “trade Jakob” few fans. I’d place Adams in the potential trade block as well if I were Memphis.

I expect Memphis to make a splash. They will be a coveted free agent destination with their recent rise and because of Ja. Lots of draft capital and they can clear up good cap soce this summer if they move Adam’s expiring deal.

[mo7888]

We've talked a good bit about signing Lavine (or getting him in a S&T) but, what about Donovan Mitchell? There a real chance he goes on the market this summer.... would you rather have Mitchell or Lavine?

[KingKev]

We've talked a good bit about signing Lavine (or getting him in a S&T) but, what about Donovan Mitchell? There a real chance he goes on the market this summer.... would you rather have Mitchell or Lavine?

Spida is on a cheaper deal and younger but probably
costs you alot more in a trade.

I prefer a healthy Lavine. Seems tk be a better character, teammate, more willing to play defence. Alot bigger.

[mo7888]

Spida is on a cheaper deal and younger but probably
costs you alot more in a trade.

I prefer a healthy Lavine. Seems tk be a better character, teammate, more willing to play defence. Alot bigger.

I'm a little torn but ultimately I'll have to agree with you... I prefer Mitchell strictly as a player(less injury prone) but, the whole diva thing he's been doing in Utah makes me believe he wouldn't fit here. Lavine's character gives him an edge with me..

[SAGirl]

1521151173750931457 (https://twitter.com/thenbacentral/status/1521151173750931457?s=21&t=ykxpga02IaK0ff6EYAQVgw)

[mo7888]

1521151173750931457 (https://twitter.com/thenbacentral/status/1521151173750931457?s=21&t=ykxpga02IaK0ff6EYAQVgw)

I hope that one is true...

[SAGirl]

It’s real… and I don’t think it surprises anybody. Rudy and Donovan haven’t gotten along since Rudy started the Covid nBA lockdown by hanging out hugging everyone while having symptoms. Only downhill from there.
1521237008592498688

[Seventyniner]

If Gobert really is saying things like that, and they're getting leaked to the public, his relationship with Mitchell is doomed. The Jazz are basically forced to trade one of them now.

Losing in the first round to the Mavs with Doncic only playing 3 games is a good excuse to break things up anyway.

[KingKev]

It’s real… and I don’t think it surprises anybody. Rudy and Donovan haven’t gotten along since Rudy started the Covid nBA lockdown by hanging out hugging everyone while having symptoms. Only downhill from there.
1521237008592498688

He’s already denied it. The idea of getting traded in the next few days is also suspect.

I can’t imagine trading for either of these guys. Go sign Dipo and Whiteside for 25mm combined and duck out in the 1st round for a quarter buck.

[SAGirl]

He’s already denied it. The idea of getting traded in the next few days is also suspect.

I can’t imagine trading for either of these guys. Go sign Dipo and Whiteside for 25mm combined and duck out in the 1st round for a quarter buck.
It’s the tip of the iceberg IMO. Obviously trade doesn’t need yo happen right away. Look at how long Dallas took to move Porzinguis.

[KingKev]

It’s the tip of the iceberg IMO. Obviously trade doesn’t need yo happen right away. Look at how long Dallas took to move Porzinguis.

Yeah, agreed. They’ve been playing just the tip for awhile and now the Jazz are about to get fked LOL. I think they’ve both shown they are immature and over paid but will still likely command a decent return. Jazz would be smart to sell both right now. No interest from my vantage point.

[KobesAchilles]

Ok so I don't know how these QO things work, but can we offer Jordan Poole the max after next year? Bc if the answer is yes, then I don't see how Golden St can afford that. I would love for us to get him somehow. And if Golden St does match the offer then we can get Wiggins who is a legit 3 with size and speed of a 3 and a plus defender. Something like 3 years 90 million would do it. Either way is a win for us. I'm starting to see a light out of this playoff drought

[KingKev]

Ok so I don't know how these QO things work, but can we offer Jordan Poole the max after next year? Bc if the answer is yes, then I don't see how Golden St can afford that. I would love for us to get him somehow. And if Golden St does match the offer then we can get Wiggins who is a legit 3 with size and speed of a 3 and a plus defender. Something like 3 years 90 million would do it. Either way is a win for us. I'm starting to see a light out of this playoff drought

Poole likely gets an extension this summer before he becomes a UFA in 2023.

Wiggins has been solid these last few years on both sides of the ball and could be a potential target in 2023 but 30/yr is a steep price. Warriors are fully committed to Steph/Klay/Donkey’s final years together so I doubt they let Wiggins walk for free. That might up his price.

[mo7888]

It looks like Minnesota is going to try and unload Russell this summer... I'm not sure it impacts us directly (unless we're interested) but, it might have a tangential effect..

[Mr. Body]

Utah should dump both Mitchell and Gobert. Just start over. Keeping one of them isn't going to work.

D'Angelo Russell makes an insane amount of money, but it looks like only one more season.

[SAGirl]

Timberwolves want to get better, so they will be looking for some veterans that can help their core now in exchange. Do not be proposing salary dumps in exchange for their picks because that does nothing for them. Richardson could be an interesting piece, but it really depends here on what Minnesota wants and what else is there for the taking in the trade market.

The situation in Utah will be interesting just from a spectator POV.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Timberwolves want to get better, so they will be looking for some veterans that can help their core now in exchange. Do not be proposing salary dumps in exchange for their picks because that does nothing for them. Richardson could be an interesting piece, but it really depends here on what Minnesota wants and what else is there for the taking in the trade market.

The situation in Utah will be interesting just from a spectator POV.


That thing you posted about Gobert and Mitchell the other day was pretty strong. I sort of laughed - my first thought was, "Denial in 3, 2, 1..." Almost any time you see one of those stories about players not liking each other, or a player and coach not getting along, they almost always deny everything instantly. But there's usually at least a little fire behind the smoke. I thought the bit about a trade within days was a little much, and I don't see Utah having any kind of fire sale over it.

[R. DeMurre]

No interest in Donovan Mitchell. Ask yourself this: when's the last time a team with a 6'1" starting SG won a championship? For three straight years, the Jazz have been slightly better with him off the floor than with him on. CJ McCollum became immediately more effective in New Orleans after they made him the PG and put a great defender next to him. Portland wasted the better part of a decade losing early in the playoffs with a micro back court that couldn't stop anyone.

[rjv]

mitchell is too poor of a defender to give up value for and then turn around and tie up all that cap space with.

[KingKev]

Both Mitchell and Gibert make me puke in my mouth. They make Ben Simmons look intriguing.

For the pipe dreamers remember that outside of their max contracts they aren’t Russ type depressed contracts so you’ll have to pay up in assets just to have the pleasure to pay max for of their services.

[Leetonidas]

Not saying I love the thought of paying Gobert 40 mil a season but i have to wonder if him getting sonned in the playoffs is more a result of the fact that the other 4 players around him are turnstiles on defense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDTrUdGRUvA&t

Video does a pretty good job of illustrating this point. Imagine Gobert on a team with a bunch of lanky dudes that actually get after it on defense. Put him on a team like Boston and they are instantly the title favorites. Not saying he puts us in contention but if a scenario somehow presented itself to get Lavine by swinging a trade for Gobert and showing that we're serious about winning and Spurs could field a big three of DJ/Lavine/Gobert, i think you have to try. no real shot of happening obviously but fun to think about :lol

[KingKev]

Not saying I love the thought of paying Gobert 40 mil a season but i have to wonder if him getting sonned in the playoffs is more a result of the fact that the other 4 players around him are turnstiles on defense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDTrUdGRUvA&t

Video does a pretty good job of illustrating this point. Imagine Gobert on a team with a bunch of lanky dudes that actually get after it on defense. Put him on a team like Boston and they are instantly the title favorites. Not saying he puts us in contention but if a scenario somehow presented itself to get Lavine by swinging a trade for Gobert and showing that we're serious about winning and Spurs could field a big three of DJ/Lavine/Gobert, i think you have to try. no real shot of happening obviously but fun to think about :lol

Gobert could out a top team over the top for sure; as a final piece when you are already well over the cap.

Gobert as a building block when you are one of the worst teams in the league with no real cornerstone players like the Spurs? That is a death wish.

[Leetonidas]

Gobert could out a top team over the top for sure; as a final piece when you are already well over the cap.

Gobert as a building block when you are one of the worst teams in the league with no real cornerstone players like the Spurs? That is a death wish.

Like I said, not really a fan of the idea of paying him 40 million a season. Would entertain it if Lavine told SA he would join the Spurs if they could add another star or something, kinda like Kawhi/PG. It's not the best big three for sure but the NBA has been pretty wide open the last couple years with no super teams so this could be a chance to capitalize. but for sure i realize that this is incredibly unlikely to happen and even if it did we'd probably have 2nd round ceiling max :lol

[CGD]

It looks like Minnesota is going to try and unload Russell this summer... I'm not sure it impacts us directly (unless we're interested) but, it might have a tangential effect..

Stay.Away.From.Russell

[CGD]

Utah should dump both Mitchell and Gobert. Just start over. Keeping one of them isn't going to work.

D'Angelo Russell makes an insane amount of money, but it looks like only one more season.

I'd keep Mitchell for now. One of the podcast shows was speculating GSW with the Wiggins expiring contract and Wiesman as the foundations for the framework. Naturally, Utah would want draft assets to go with given Wiggins' expiring status and uncertainty around Weisman, but I can see that benefiting both teams.

[CGD]

Not saying I love the thought of paying Gobert 40 mil a season but i have to wonder if him getting sonned in the playoffs is more a result of the fact that the other 4 players around him are turnstiles on defense.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDTrUdGRUvA&t

Video does a pretty good job of illustrating this point. Imagine Gobert on a team with a bunch of lanky dudes that actually get after it on defense. Put him on a team like Boston and they are instantly the title favorites. Not saying he puts us in contention but if a scenario somehow presented itself to get Lavine by swinging a trade for Gobert and showing that we're serious about winning and Spurs could field a big three of DJ/Lavine/Gobert, i think you have to try. no real shot of happening obviously but fun to think about :lol

I'd just re-sign Jak in this case. Once you hold for the style points, the drop off between his and Yaks production is not THAT much by the numbers. Hard pass on Rudy's contract.

[CGD]

Do we think any of these teams cough up assets to dump they deals:

- ATL: Danilo's last year (~21M)
- SAC: Barnes last year (~18M)
- LAC: Bledsoe's last year (~19M)

[SAGirl]

Do we think any of these teams cough up assets to dump they deals:

- ATL: Danilo's last year (~21M)
- SAC: Barnes last year (~18M)
- LAC: Bledsoe's last year (~19M)
No, specially if they are giving up a pick, not in the way you frame it.

The only point of trading a pick together with an expiring deal is to be buyers for someone they think will improve their team. The Spurs don’t have valuable trade assets that they can spare outside of Richardson who probably doesn’t improve any of those teams all that much. Just IMO. I don’t know if the Spurs are really looking to trade Jakob, it’s something they will only do if they get a haul for him, which likely doesn’t happen (specially from those teams, ATL is set with Capela, SAC just traded for SAbonis, and LAC wont be looking to trade for a C, their best lineups are all perimeter based.)

[SAGirl]

Well Atlanta is already making public that they’ll be active in the trade market. Not sure what they want or who they will move though.
1522271464493391875

[rjv]

Well Atlanta is already making public that they’ll be active in the trade market. Not sure what they want or who they will move though.
1522271464493391875

i imagine they want to move collins but what they would want in return is the question.

[JPB]

Well Atlanta is already making public that they’ll be active in the trade market. Not sure what they want or who they will move though.
1522271464493391875

The way he talks about his players is marvelous. I'm sure they'll appreciate.

[Mr. Body]

i imagine they want to move collins but what they would want in return is the question.

They'll probably have to put a draft pick or something with him. His contract isn't absolutely absurd, but it's bad for a player who is as mediocre as he is.

[Dverde]

Well Atlanta is already making public that they’ll be active in the trade market. Not sure what they want or who they will move though.
1522271464493391875

Should have gone after McNuggets.

[exstatic]

Do we think any of these teams cough up assets to dump they deals:

- ATL: Danilo's last year (~21M)
- SAC: Barnes last year (~18M)
- LAC: Bledsoe's last year (~19M)

Clippers have no assets. Other than Barnes, the other two are washed.

The rock that I would turn over is Saric from Phoenix. They will be in financial distress from paying Ayton, and will have a FRP to trade in 2024. He fits a position of need, PF/C, and can be flipped to a contender at the deadline for another asset. His contract is $9.67M, and expires in 2023.

[CGD]

Clippers have no assets. Other than Barnes, the other two are washed.

The rock that I would turn over is Saric from Phoenix. They will be in financial distress from paying Ayton, and will have a FRP to trade in 2024. He fits a position of need, PF/C, and can be flipped to a contender at the deadline for another asset. His contract is $9.67M, and expires in 2023.

Good point, that would be a smart cap rental

[CGD]

Well Atlanta is already making public that they’ll be active in the trade market. Not sure what they want or who they will move though.
1522271464493391875

That’s a good Gobert destination. Collins/Capella should do it.

[PhantomDashCam]

That’s a good Gobert destination. Collins/Capella should do it.

Interesting.
I’ve only watched a few Hawks games this year, sans Playoffs, but the prevailing thought seems to be they want to give Okungwu a clear path for minutes.
Will be interested to see which direction they take.

[SAGirl]

Interesting.
I’ve only watched a few Hawks games this year, sans Playoffs, but the prevailing thought seems to be they want to give Okungwu a clear path for minutes.
Will be interested to see which direction they take.
Okungwu was good for them in the playoffs. The only game they won they made a comeback in with Okungwu playing. I didn’t know who he was and had to look him up. I actually wonder if Dallas isn’t a better landing spot for Gobert.

[CGD]

Interesting.
I’ve only watched a few Hawks games this year, sans Playoffs, but the prevailing thought seems to be they want to give Okungwu a clear path for minutes.
Will be interested to see which direction they take.

Good point about Okungwu. he’s undersized at the 5, but if they play him at the 4 with Rudy that would be atrocious spacing.

[KingKev]

Clippers have no assets. Other than Barnes, the other two are washed.

The rock that I would turn over is Saric from Phoenix. They will be in financial distress from paying Ayton, and will have a FRP to trade in 2024. He fits a position of need, PF/C, and can be flipped to a contender at the deadline for another asset. His contract is $9.67M, and expires in 2023.

Saric had another surgery on his knee today.

[Seventyniner]

Saric had another surgery on his knee today.

For the Spurs he'd be another Al-Farouq Aminu. Pure salary ballast only taken on for a draft pick. It would also signify punting on 2022 cap space and rolling it over to 2023.

[KingKev]

For the Spurs he'd be another Al-Farouq Aminu. Pure salary ballast only taken on for a draft pick. It would also signify punting on 2022 cap space and rolling it over to 2023.

I understand that. Doubt PHX pays an FRP to dump him though and he probably wouldn’t double as a contract we could dump at the deadline.

[BackHome]

Question if Charlotte still wants poodle what is our asking price?

[Mr. Body]

I think Phoenix is still in their "never dealing with San Antonio" mode.

[Mr. Body]

Question if Charlotte still wants poodle what is our asking price?

I would pair McDermott with him, maybe, and take a look at those 13 and 15 picks, either one or both outright or swapping our later picks for them.

[baseline bum]

Yeah we happily pay greater income taxes to be free of Texas. Never going back.

But you missed our electric grid going to shit because we had subantarctic temperatures that got all the way down into the twenties. Had rolling blackouts for four days with power only half the time, entire city shut down. Was fun driving to the other side of town to get my COVID shot with the highways shut down and no traffic lights working on the surface streets thanks to the blackouts, took forever. Also got warned by ERCOT of possible rolling blackouts this Saturday because it'll be *gasp* 100 degrees in San Antonio. But hey we banned CRT in schools and have an abortion law that would make Saudi Arabia jealous.

[Mr. Body]

But you missed our electric grid going to shit because we had subantarctic temperatures that got all the way down into the twenties. Had rolling blackouts for four days with power only half the time, entire city shut down. Was fun driving to the other side of town to get my COVID shot with the highways shut down and no traffic lights working on the surface streets thanks to the blackouts, took forever. Also got warned by ERCOT of possible rolling blackouts this Saturday because it'll be *gasp* 100 degrees in San Antonio. But hey we banned CRT in schools and have an abortion law that would make Saudi Arabia jealous.

And Gov. Abbott appealing to cryptocurrency miners to take up more of the energy output from the grid. He thinks this is a way of 'fixing' the problem. Sorry, ya guys are fuckt.


https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-01-27/texas-governor-eyes-bitcoin-mining-to-fortify-the-electric-grid

[HemisfairArena]

But you missed our electric grid going to shit because we had subantarctic temperatures that got all the way down into the twenties. Had rolling blackouts for four days with power only half the time, entire city shut down. Was fun driving to the other side of town to get my COVID shot with the highways shut down and no traffic lights working on the surface streets thanks to the blackouts, took forever. Also got warned by ERCOT of possible rolling blackouts this Saturday because it'll be *gasp* 100 degrees in San Antonio. But hey we banned CRT in schools and have an abortion law that would make Saudi Arabia jealous.

Yeah because living in a state like Cali with raging fires, smog, uncontrolled homelessness and earthquakes is so much better. Not to mention the brain dead laws they pass like transgender bathrooms or they are now a sanctuary state for illegals,,,what about shutting down the economy because of covid and enforcing a mask mandate that doesnt work and the democrat politicians in cali dont follow but expect their braindead voters to follow,,,,also high taxes and high crime rate,,,,nice. Im sure thats much better than a bad power grid,,,,:lmao

[Mr. Body]

Yeah because living in a state like Cali with raging fires, smog, uncontrolled homelessness and earthquakes is so much better. Not to mention the brain dead laws they pass like transgender bathrooms or they are now a sanctuary state for illegals,,,what about shutting down the economy because of covid and enforcing a mask mandate that doesnt work and the democrat politicians in cali dont follow but expect their braindead voters to follow,,,,also high taxes and high crime rate,,,,nice. Im sure thats much better than a bad power grid,,,,:lmao

Homicide rate is higher in Texas than California, as is rate of property crime. Firearm violence, unsurprisingly, is far higher in Texas. It's more expensive to live in California due to supply and demand -- more people want to live there. California has an overall death rate due to Covid lower than Texas despite getting hit much earlier and before vaccines. Their economy is booming and the legislature has a huge surplus to attend to people's needs. The Texas governor wrecked hundreds of millions in produce and products on the border because he's a dope. National Guardsmen are killing themselves on the border because he's forcing them to stay there indefinitely for some electoral ploy, unable to see their families. Only numbskulls give a fuck where grown adults take a whizz.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Well I came back hoping that the offseason might be more reasonable. And for a couple of weeks, people actually talked some basketball. I guess as the lottery drew near, they opened the lid to the cesspool.

The only two things I will say are:

You have clearly never been to Saudi
and
Buh'bye

[KingKev]

I would pair McDermott with him, maybe, and take a look at those 13 and 15 picks, either one or both outright or swapping our later picks for them.

No one want’s McDermott and you probably are the one attaching assets to unload him but if so you’d have to take salary back for both McDermott and Jak and that would probably be Hayward.

The amount of posts I’ve seen recently who believe attaching our largest/worst contract is a route to moving up in the draft….

[Mr. Body]

No one want’s McDermott and you probably are the one attaching assets to unload him but if so you’d have to take salary back for both McDermott and Jak and that would probably be Hayward.

The amount of posts I’ve seen recently who believe attaching our largest/worst contract is a route to moving up in the draft….

Poeltl moves you up the draft. If they don't want bad salary I don't trade him. Good luck losing again in hideous fashion.

[KingKev]

Poeltl moves you up the draft. If they don't want bad salary I don't trade him. Good luck losing again in hideous fashion.

They don’t have the cap to take 23mm so we’d have to take back similar contracts back.

McDipshit won’t easily be moved before the trade deadline.

[baseline bum]

Homicide rate is higher in Texas than California, as is rate of property crime. Firearm violence, unsurprisingly, is far higher in Texas. It's more expensive to live in California due to supply and demand -- more people want to live there. California has an overall death rate due to Covid lower than Texas despite getting hit much earlier and before vaccines. Their economy is booming and the legislature has a huge surplus to attend to people's needs. The Texas governor wrecked hundreds of millions in produce and products on the border because he's a dope. National Guardsmen are killing themselves on the border because he's forcing them to stay there indefinitely for some electoral ploy, unable to see their families. Only numbskulls give a fuck where grown adults take a whizz.

LOL that retard talking about Cali smog when today is an ozone action day in San Antonio

[exstatic]

Saric had another surgery on his knee today.

Meniscus. Thats’s common after ACL repairs. Doesn’t really change the situation. PHO will want out of his contract, and he’ll be ready to go next season.

[exstatic]

For the Spurs he'd be another Al-Farouq Aminu. Pure salary ballast only taken on for a draft pick. It would also signify punting on 2022 cap space and rolling it over to 2023.

It was a meniscus cleanup, which often happens after an ACL repair. Likely he’ll be ready to go, but if not, that gives PHO more motivation to attach that FRP.

You should probably prepare yourself for a punt. I can’t even see the Spurs proffering an offer sheet for Ayton, and Lavine isn’t going to leave that extra year and $40+M on the table to sign with a play in team.

[exstatic]

I understand that. Doubt PHX pays an FRP to dump him though and he probably wouldn’t double as a contract we could dump at the deadline.

LuxTax is at $136M for next year. Their payroll, assuming a max deal for Ayton, is estimated at $188M. Being able to shave close to $10M off that saves them both the salary, and the matching tax payment. This will be Phoenix’s 3rd straight year in the tax, so the repeater penalties get pretty stiff. With the graduated penalties, us taking that $10M could save PHO $40M in taxes, plus the salary.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

LuxTax is at $136M for next year.

https://www.si.com/nba/2022/03/31/nba-releases-updated-projections-for-salary-cap-luxury-tax

Luxury tax is projected to be $149 mil for next season.


Their payroll, assuming a max deal for Ayton, is estimated at $188M. Being able to shave close to $10M off that saves them both the salary, and the matching tax payment. This will be Phoenix’s 3rd straight year in the tax, so the repeater penalties get pretty stiff. With the graduated penalties, us taking that $10M could save PHO $40M in taxes, plus the salary.

Phoenix isn't a tax paying team. https://www.spotrac.com/nba/phoenix-suns/cap/2021/

[CGD]

Meniscus. Thats’s common after ACL repairs. Doesn’t really change the situation. PHO will want out of his contract, and he’ll be ready to go next season.

Question is what they’re willing to attach to it. Their late first next year would be nice.

Trying to remember what the going rate for picks was last year. Didn’t that DET SRP we acquired last year essentially end up being close to $10M?

[exstatic]

https://www.si.com/nba/2022/03/31/nba-releases-updated-projections-for-salary-cap-luxury-tax

Luxury tax is projected to be $149 mil for next season.

So they’re not a repeat payer. It’s still 2/1, so a FRP saves them the salary and the identical tax payment, ONLY $20M.

Phoenix isn't a tax paying team. https://www.spotrac.com/nba/phoenix-suns/cap/2021/

OK, so we can ONLY save them a total of close to $20M for a late first rounder.

[exstatic]

Question is what they’re willing to attach to it. Their late first next year would be nice.

Trying to remember what the going rate for picks was last year. Didn’t that DET SRP we acquired last year essentially end up being close to $10M?

We can’t get next year’s pick, because they traded this year’s to OKC. Earliest would be 2024, two years between pick trades.

[offset formation]

Homicide rate is higher in Texas than California, as is rate of property crime. Firearm violence, unsurprisingly, is far higher in Texas. It's more expensive to live in California due to supply and demand -- more people want to live there. California has an overall death rate due to Covid lower than Texas despite getting hit much earlier and before vaccines. Their economy is booming and the legislature has a huge surplus to attend to people's needs. The Texas governor wrecked hundreds of millions in produce and products on the border because he's a dope. National Guardsmen are killing themselves on the border because he's forcing them to stay there indefinitely for some electoral ploy, unable to see their families. Only numbskulls give a fuck where grown adults take a whizz.

His brain is on Fox News. Or Newsmax. Or OANN.

And there's no cure for willful ignorance. Were there, he wouldn’t be regurgitating easily refutable nonsense.

I often wonder what its like to be so fucking daft, and to be that way because your parents raised you to be.

[Seventyniner]

We can’t get next year’s pick, because they traded this year’s to OKC. Earliest would be 2024, two years between pick trades.

My understanding of the Stepien Rule is that you can't make a trade that leaves you in a situation where you don't have a first round pick in consecutive future years, and that the window rolls over on draft night. If that's right the Suns could trade their 2023 first on draft night because they would still have their firsts in 2024 and beyond.

Can teams even make trades prior to draft night anyway?

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

My understanding of the Stepien Rule is that you can't make a trade that leaves you in a situation where you don't have a first round pick in consecutive future years, and that the window rolls over on draft night. If that's right the Suns could trade their 2023 first on draft night because they would still have their firsts in 2024 and beyond.

This is correct. Phoenix can trade their 2023 first.


Can teams even make trades prior to draft night anyway?

Yes, non playoff teams can make trades after their last game of the season. Payoff teams can make trades after they're eliminated.

[MannyIsGod]

But you missed our electric grid going to shit because we had subantarctic temperatures that got all the way down into the twenties. Had rolling blackouts for four days with power only half the time, entire city shut down. Was fun driving to the other side of town to get my COVID shot with the highways shut down and no traffic lights working on the surface streets thanks to the blackouts, took forever. Also got warned by ERCOT of possible rolling blackouts this Saturday because it'll be *gasp* 100 degrees in San Antonio. But hey we banned CRT in schools and have an abortion law that would make Saudi Arabia jealous.

Nah lol, I was still there during that Feb. We didn't lose power, but everyone else in our family did. Fucking shit show. And yeah, they didn't do shit to fix that so it'll 100% happen again in the future because they DGAF if you suffer, they just fly to Cancun.

[MannyIsGod]

Homicide rate is higher in Texas than California, as is rate of property crime. Firearm violence, unsurprisingly, is far higher in Texas. It's more expensive to live in California due to supply and demand -- more people want to live there. California has an overall death rate due to Covid lower than Texas despite getting hit much earlier and before vaccines. Their economy is booming and the legislature has a huge surplus to attend to people's needs. The Texas governor wrecked hundreds of millions in produce and products on the border because he's a dope. National Guardsmen are killing themselves on the border because he's forcing them to stay there indefinitely for some electoral ploy, unable to see their families. Only numbskulls give a fuck where grown adults take a whizz.

This is what people don't seem to get. Its so expensive to live in certain places because A LOT OF PEOPLE WITH MONEY WANT TO LIVE THERE! The neighborhood we live in in DC (we rent, lol @ us being able to buy here) most houses are going for a mil+ because its a pretty awesome place to live. Houses don't sit on the market at all here.

[CGD]

We can’t get next year’s pick, because they traded this year’s to OKC. Earliest would be 2024, two years between pick trades.

Totally OK with me.

[Dverde]

Wait Miles Bridges is a lefty and his middle name is Emmanuel…this guy worth a look?

[Dverde]

This is what people don't seem to get. Its so expensive to live in certain places because A LOT OF PEOPLE WITH MONEY WANT TO LIVE THERE! The neighborhood we live in in DC (we rent, lol @ us being able to buy here) most houses are going for a mil+ because its a pretty awesome place to live. Houses don't sit on the market at all here.

DC blows. Weather sucks, everything is crowded, tourists everywhere. It’s only expensive because people have to work in that small overcrowded area. I’d rather live in NY or California if I was super rich, but I’m glad you are happy there. Nice finding a place you enjoy and I understand it’s just my opinion.

[montgod]

Wait Miles Bridges is a lefty and his middle name is Emmanuel…this guy worth a look?

Lol! He's restricted. No way they let him go. He'll definitely be getting the max too. He would be an awesome get for the Spurs though if it was possible.

[BackHome]

But you missed our electric grid going to shit because we had subantarctic temperatures that got all the way down into the twenties. Had rolling blackouts for four days with power only half the time, entire city shut down. Was fun driving to the other side of town to get my COVID shot with the highways shut down and no traffic lights working on the surface streets thanks to the blackouts, took forever. Also got warned by ERCOT of possible rolling blackouts this Saturday because it'll be *gasp* 100 degrees in San Antonio. But hey we banned CRT in schools and have an abortion law that would make Saudi Arabia jealous.

Well don’t move to Cali we always having rolling brown and blackouts because our forest are burning down and definitely don’t move to New Orleans or anywhere on the coast cause when a major hurricane hits you won’t have water or electricity for awhile

[BatManu20]

Not happening but one can dream.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSF-Lt5VUAEsRhv?format=png&name=900x900

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSF-PleVsAESdHL?format=png&name=900x900

[SAGirl]

Yea. That’s a dream.

[baseline bum]

Well don’t move to Cali we always having rolling brown and blackouts because our forest are burning down and definitely don’t move to New Orleans or anywhere on the coast cause when a major hurricane hits you won’t have water or electricity for awhile

Temps getting down to the 20s being comparable to a hurricane :lol

[PhantomDashCam]

Not happening but one can dream.


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSF-Lt5VUAEsRhv?format=png&name=900x900

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSF-PleVsAESdHL?format=png&name=900x900

Love how they’ve turned the comments off :lol They listed Doug as a G? They must’ve looked at his rebounding numbers.

[KingKev]

^ which one of Spurstalk posters is Greg Patuto LOL

We even free up salary in that trade… genius! Next trade Zollins for a future first, trade 9 and 25 for a top 4 pick and draft Banchero, sign Lavine to a discounted deal (Banchero and DJ are from the same city duhhh), make Primo work with Manu so he can become a future HoFer.

[pad300]

That's roughly what I expect a Ayton S&T to look like this summer (except with the 2022 pick replaced by a 2023 spurs pick). Sarver has historically been unwilling to pay the lux tax, even for a contender (see how the Seven Seconds or Less Suns came apart). Now the lux penalties are even greater. If this Suns team doesn't win this year, CP3 is a year older...

Will Sarver eat at least 2 years in the Lux tax (probably 3; CP3's contract extends to 24/25) to keep a team that doesn't look like a real contender to me? (They don't have an actual MVP candidate - Luka, Jokic, Embiid, Giannis, ?Tatum? are the top 5 IMO). Personally I doubt it.

Financially, they have painted themselves into a corner. They are committed to CP3 and Booker for ~$65M annually for the next 2 years (and then they can let Booker walk, which they won't). They have also committed to Bridges at $20M annually. Some one (the Spurs, IMO should) will put a Max in front of Ayton, so he's not getting less than that... Either they let him go, negotiate an S&T or eat the tax...

As a package, it's about as good as they can expect - a cheap replacement for Ayton (Poeltl), 2 usable players (Richardson, McDermott), a pick (Spurs 2023?) and further cap relief (us taking Saric)...

[CGD]

^ I do think it hinges on whether they win or not this year, but their penny pinching history is well-known.

IIRC they can’t aggregate Saric in a S&T though, so would have to be only Ayton

[pad300]

^ I do think it hinges on whether they win or not this year, but their penny pinching history is well-known.

IIRC they can’t aggregate Saric in a S&T though, so would have to be only Ayton

Yeah, but in this case you could just make a 2nd deal, Richardson for Saric straight up...

[SAGirl]

That's roughly what I expect a Ayton S&T to look like this summer (except with the 2022 pick replaced by a 2023 spurs pick). Sarver has historically been unwilling to pay the lux tax, even for a contender (see how the Seven Seconds or Less Suns came apart). Now the lux penalties are even greater. If this Suns team doesn't win this year, CP3 is a year older...

Will Sarver eat at least 2 years in the Lux tax (probably 3; CP3's contract extends to 24/25) to keep a team that doesn't look like a real contender to me? (They don't have an actual MVP candidate - Luka, Jokic, Embiid, Giannis, ?Tatum? are the top 5 IMO). Personally I doubt it.

Financially, they have painted themselves into a corner. They are committed to CP3 and Booker for ~$65M annually for the next 2 years (and then they can let Booker walk, which they won't). They have also committed to Bridges at $20M annually. Some one (the Spurs, IMO should) will put a Max in front of Ayton, so he's not getting less than that... Either they let him go, negotiate an S&T or eat the tax...

As a package, it's about as good as they can expect - a cheap replacement for Ayton (Poeltl), 2 usable players (Richardson, McDermott), a pick (Spurs 2023?) and further cap relief (us taking Saric)...
Thats a convincing argument, I am not sure that Ayton is the guy they shed though, but you made a good case. I’d definitely want the Spurs to try to get him.

[Mr. Body]

Ayton? I don't know. Phoenix is thick with contracts, but even if they weren't, giving him the max must give them pause. He's clearly a good and improving player, but he doesn't shoot threes and doesn't even block shots.

[KingKev]

That's roughly what I expect a Ayton S&T to look like this summer (except with the 2022 pick replaced by a 2023 spurs pick). Sarver has historically been unwilling to pay the lux tax, even for a contender (see how the Seven Seconds or Less Suns came apart). Now the lux penalties are even greater. If this Suns team doesn't win this year, CP3 is a year older...

Will Sarver eat at least 2 years in the Lux tax (probably 3; CP3's contract extends to 24/25) to keep a team that doesn't look like a real contender to me? (They don't have an actual MVP candidate - Luka, Jokic, Embiid, Giannis, ?Tatum? are the top 5 IMO). Personally I doubt it.

Financially, they have painted themselves into a corner. They are committed to CP3 and Booker for ~$65M annually for the next 2 years (and then they can let Booker walk, which they won't). They have also committed to Bridges at $20M annually. Some one (the Spurs, IMO should) will put a Max in front of Ayton, so he's not getting less than that... Either they let him go, negotiate an S&T or eat the tax...

As a package, it's about as good as they can expect - a cheap replacement for Ayton (Poeltl), 2 usable players (Richardson, McDermott), a pick (Spurs 2023?) and further cap relief (us taking Saric)...

That IS NOT cap relief. They are taking back basically the same amount of salary in year 1. In year 2 they can let JRich walk but will have to pay Jak to retain him so REMAIN in the luxury tax with probably a worse team.

Great logic.

[SAGirl]

That IS NOT cap relief. They are taking back basically the same amount of salary in year 1. In year 2 they can let JRich walk but will have to pay Jak to retain him so REMAIN in the luxury tax with probably a worse team.

Great logic.
lol thanks for clearing that up. Honestly I don’t think they shed Ayton, he’s still a young and improving player. I think it would be a mistake, but what do I know right? They are still in a tight situation and will probably shed somebody.

[KingKev]

lol thanks for clearing that up. Honestly I don’t think they shed Ayton, he’s still a young and improving player. I think it would be a mistake, but what do I know right? They are still in a tight situation and will probably shed somebody.

I don’t have a strong view on what they will do with Ayton but I think it’s foolish to conclude Sarver and the Suns FO are stupid.

I’m not even advocating we go after Ayton but he is going to get max money from someone and Phoenix isn’t letting him walk for free. The Suns committed big bucks to Chris Paul in the twilight of his career so this whole the Suns are cheap narrative might not hold true these days.

I doubt the Spus even have interest in Ayton but if Phoenix is looking to sign and trade him to save money and keep the championship window open something along the lines of Jak, Vassell and a future FRP would probably be more realistic.

[R. DeMurre]

Owners have done stranger things, so it's hard to say. Mark Cuban didn't re-sign a 28 year old Tyson Chandler after the Mavs won a championship. He later admitted it was a mistake, but it still happened... and after that, the Mavs didn't contend at all.

[XDT76]

A lot of these MAX contract players do not make sense to us, those available are not gonna be first options for a championship team, Lavine, Ayton, Miles Bridges, they might be worth it to their team but definitely not for us. They might improve us but not gonna make us title contenders.

[exstatic]

A lot of these MAX contract players do not make sense to us, those available are not gonna be first options for a championship team, Lavine, Ayton, Miles Bridges, they might be worth it to their team but definitely not for us. They might improve us but not gonna make us title contenders.

I read an article about Aytons situation that basically there is no such thing as a max contract player, only players who have the leverage to get one. OPJ got one. Tobias Harris is on one now.

[R. DeMurre]

I wish it was easier to pigeonhole all moves, but it can be so unpredictable how things work out with contracts. DeRozan might've been an overpay on his last Raptor contract, but then Ujiri flipped it to get Kawhi, and their only championship... so ultimately, you have to view that as a success. According to the rumor mill, the 76ers have been trying to convert Tobias Harris's contract to multiple players or better fits for a couple of years without success. My inclination is to to say that maxing out a non-max impact player is a bad move, but even that isn't true sometimes. I'm not a huge fan of LaVine, but he could be a piece in a future trade that nets a true #1 option.


https://www.si.com/nba/2016/07/01/demar-derozan-raptors-free-agency-contract-grades-kyle-lowry

[XDT76]

I read an article about Aytons situation that basically there is no such thing as a max contract player, only players who have the leverage to get one. OPJ got one. Tobias Harris is on one now.

I agree, I called them MAX contract players bcos some posters wanted to offer them the MAX contract. There a are a few who really worth it though like gianni, luca and embiid where they forced the other team to really game plan against them with multiple defenders.

[SAGirl]

^There are obvious max contract players, which you dont even think about like Doncic and Morant. There are a lot of other guys though that you need, are young and improving and you can’t easily replace. The max contract for young players is not the same for veterans, so if a young and improving player is worth it to you, maybe it gives you pause, but someone will poach them while you hesitate.

I actually hesitate a lot more on maxing the veterans, their contracts are huge and depending on their age and game they will turn out not to be worth it. Only HOF talent is worth it late in their careers and you still have the risk that they will fall off any year now.

[baseline bum]

That's roughly what I expect a Ayton S&T to look like this summer (except with the 2022 pick replaced by a 2023 spurs pick). Sarver has historically been unwilling to pay the lux tax, even for a contender (see how the Seven Seconds or Less Suns came apart). Now the lux penalties are even greater. If this Suns team doesn't win this year, CP3 is a year older...

Will Sarver eat at least 2 years in the Lux tax (probably 3; CP3's contract extends to 24/25) to keep a team that doesn't look like a real contender to me? (They don't have an actual MVP candidate - Luka, Jokic, Embiid, Giannis, ?Tatum? are the top 5 IMO). Personally I doubt it.

Financially, they have painted themselves into a corner. They are committed to CP3 and Booker for ~$65M annually for the next 2 years (and then they can let Booker walk, which they won't). They have also committed to Bridges at $20M annually. Some one (the Spurs, IMO should) will put a Max in front of Ayton, so he's not getting less than that... Either they let him go, negotiate an S&T or eat the tax...

As a package, it's about as good as they can expect - a cheap replacement for Ayton (Poeltl), 2 usable players (Richardson, McDermott), a pick (Spurs 2023?) and further cap relief (us taking Saric)...

Honestly think they're just hoping he agrees to a max deal with someone and then they can match. So they get him on a four year deal with 5% yearly raises instead of a five year deal with 8% yearly raises. Not even Sarver could be cheap enough to dump Ayton off a title contender. Especially when Ayton's max is 25% of the cap, it's not like he'd be paying a Harden max contract at 35% of the cap to keep him.

[R. DeMurre]

^There are obvious max contract players, which you dont even think about like Doncic and Morant. There are a lot of other guys though that you need, are young and improving and you can’t easily replace. The max contract for young players is not the same for veterans, so if a young and improving player is worth it to you, maybe it gives you pause, but someone will poach them while you hesitate.

I actually hesitate a lot more on maxing the veterans, their contracts are huge and depending on their age and game they will turn out not to be worth it. Only HOF talent is worth it late in their careers and you still have the risk that they will fall off any year now.


And it's funny how so many opinions will hinge on the results of this season. Phoenix certainly has a chance at a championship, and if they do win it, people will say "see, it makes sense to max out an older guy like Chris Paul." But if they don't win (for the second year in a row), especially if CP3 gets injured, people will say it isn't a good strategy. But sometimes it all comes down to the natural variance in percentages, and the outcomes really don't prove anything. The Lakers both won and lost in a way with this strategy: they got their 2020 championship with LeBron and AD, which is a success story, but now they look relatively doomed for the future.

[pad300]

That IS NOT cap relief. They are taking back basically the same amount of salary in year 1. In year 2 they can let JRich walk but will have to pay Jak to retain him so REMAIN in the luxury tax with probably a worse team.

Great logic.

Yeah, you're not understanding the problem.

Without something like this, they max and keep ayton, they are have 4 roster spots eating ~ 115 million next year. They have 6 other committed salaries (Crowder, Sarid, Payne, Craig, Johnson, Shamet) for $46 million. 161 Million in total. They have to fill 12 spots (so 2 more). The lux tax line is at 147 Million next year; they're 9 million over, have 2 more spots to fill and Saric isn't likely an actual player. If Saric can't play, I believe they have to fill his spot as well... With the proposed trade, they only have 1 space left to fill, and instead of Ayton and Saric (~40 M) have Poeltl, Richardson and McDermott for (~35M). They save $5M and don't have to fill 2 roster spots... Also, Poeltl, Richardson and McDermott are all expiring, so they are not paying the repeater tax in 23-24 and 24-25...

We could save them even more money not sending them McDermott and taking part of Ayton's salary into capspace, but I don't think they get that good of a deal given the situation they are in.

[KingKev]

A lot of these MAX contract players do not make sense to us, those available are not gonna be first options for a championship team, Lavine, Ayton, Miles Bridges, they might be worth it to their team but definitely not for us. They might improve us but not gonna make us title contenders.

There isn’t a player in the league who would make us immediate title contenders. Some max players are obviously better than others but if you aren’t going to tank and you aren’t going to pay up in free agency, especially when most FAs require a premium to play here than why even try.

[KingKev]

Yeah, you're not understanding the problem.

Without something like this, they max and keep ayton, they are have 4 roster spots eating ~ 115 million next year. They have 6 other committed salaries (Crowder, Sarid, Payne, Craig, Johnson, Shamet) for $46 million. 161 Million in total. They have to fill 12 spots (so 2 more). The lux tax line is at 147 Million next year; they're 9 million over, have 2 more spots to fill and Saric isn't likely an actual player. If Saric can't play, I believe they have to fill his spot as well... With the proposed trade, they only have 1 space left to fill, and instead of Ayton and Saric (~40 M) have Poeltl, Richardson and McDermott for (~35M). They save $5M and don't have to fill 2 roster spots... Also, Poeltl, Richardson and McDermott are all expiring, so they are not paying the repeater tax in 23-24 and 24-25...

We could save them even more money not sending them McDermott and taking part of Ayton's salary into capspace, but I don't think they get that good of a deal given the situation they are in.

McDermott is not expiring. You failed to include the salary for an FRP and I could go on for days how dumb that scenario is for Phoenix but you aren't worth debating.

[Mr. Body]

Honestly think they're just hoping he agrees to a max deal with someone and then they can match. So they get him on a four year deal with 5% yearly raises instead of a five year deal with 8% yearly raises. Not even Sarver could be cheap enough to dump Ayton off a title contender. Especially when Ayton's max is 25% of the cap, it's not like he'd be paying a Harden max contract at 35% of the cap to keep him.

I agree with this. Normally I would hesitate to give the C position 25% of the cap. But he's proving to be a difference maker, a great clean-up guy and strong enough to give teams problems who don't have good Centers. They're also still in the Chris Paul window. Whether they ring this year or not, this era isn't coming again for a while. I think it's one thing for the Spurs to use up that kind of cap for Ayton, who isn't needed, quite another for the Suns to lose him.

[XDT76]

There isn’t a player in the league who would make us immediate title contenders. Some max players are obviously better than others but if you aren’t going to tank and you aren’t going to pay up in free agency, especially when most FAs require a premium to play here than why even try.

So we should get ourselves into situation where we overpay good players and get to nowhere and with no teams willingly to eventually take these rubbish contracts? Did the few years of Aldridge and DDR teach us nothing?

[KingKev]

So we should get ourselves into situation where we overpay good players and get to nowhere and with no teams willingly to eventually take these rubbish contracts? Did the few years of Aldridge and DDR teach us nothing?

No we should just complain that every possible FA doesn’t make us instant contenders so not even bother and continue to tell ourselves guys like Primo and Vassell are going to being us back to relevancy one day.

[BackHome]

I am hoping that out of the 4 possible draft picks we have 1 or 2 become quality starters on a good team and then I am hoping we tank the following year and get us a true Star to rebuild around. That will give us Murray and our future Star and at least two other good players. At that point I start looking to find a really good player to add that will help us win Playoff games - Rome was not built in a year and the Spurs will not be rebuilt unless they get lucky in the draft ie. right pick..right player....

[exstatic]

I am hoping that out of the 4 possible draft picks we have 1 or 2 become quality starters on a good team and then I am hoping we tank the following year and get us a true Star to rebuild around. That will give us Murray and our future Star and at least two other good players. At that point I start looking to find a really good player to add that will help us win Playoff games - Rome was not built in a year and the Spurs will not be rebuilt unless they get lucky in the draft ie. right pick..right player....

We didn’t tank this year, and won’t next year, either. You know better.

[KingKev]

I am hoping that out of the 4 possible draft picks we have 1 or 2 become quality starters on a good team and then I am hoping we tank the following year and get us a true Star to rebuild around. That will give us Murray and our future Star and at least two other good players. At that point I start looking to find a really good player to add that will help us win Playoff games - Rome was not built in a year and the Spurs will not be rebuilt unless they get lucky in the draft ie. right pick..right player....

If we even come away with one long term starter that will be a win but it’s unlikely to be a first year impact player. We are likely picking in the 7-14 range for the foreseeable future and we are probably as equally as likely to have to tear it down again as we are to become a competitive playoff team in the next 2-3 years.

[CGD]

If we even come away with one long term starter that will be a win but it’s unlikely to be a first year impact player. We are likely picking in the 7-14 range for the foreseeable future and we are probably as equally as likely to have to tear it down again as we are to become a competitive playoff team in the next 2-3 years.

This possibility really sunk in for me after we traded Derrick. If the spurs choose not to surround DJ and Yak with players on their time line this summer, it feels like a matter for time until they’re moved and we’re on to a new core around Vassel/Primo/2022 FRP picks.

[mo7888]

This possibility really sunk in for me after we traded Derrick. If the spurs choose not to surround DJ and Yak with players on their time line this summer, it feels like a matter for time until they’re moved and we’re on to a new core around Vassel/Primo/2022 FRP picks.

I see ot the same...we have 2 potential timelines and this summer will tell us which one we're taking..

[KingKev]

I see ot the same...we have 2 potential timelines and this summer will tell us which one we're taking..

My timeline isn't about age as much as it is about the fact we are headed towards a roster of 10-12 average to slightly above average NBA players. There is only so long we can draft and develop guys like Keldon, Vassell, Primo etc who are at best solid role players. Even DJ (admittedly my favourite player) is not a true centrepiece. He’s more Marcus Smart than Jason Tatum. He’s a solid building block if you surround him with talent but we have no talent.

If we come away with 2-4 more eventual solid role players this draft we are going to have to start getting aggressive in consolidating role players as there isn’t enough time or money to go around when it comes time to extend guys.

if we don’t hit in a draft pick over the next few years i’m all for completely
tearing it down and finally bottoming out.

[talkspurs]

Homicide rate is higher in Texas than California, as is rate of property crime. Firearm violence, unsurprisingly, is far higher in Texas. It's more expensive to live in California due to supply and demand -- more people want to live there. California has an overall death rate due to Covid lower than Texas despite getting hit much earlier and before vaccines. Their economy is booming and the legislature has a huge surplus to attend to people's needs. The Texas governor wrecked hundreds of millions in produce and products on the border because he's a dope. National Guardsmen are killing themselves on the border because he's forcing them to stay there indefinitely for some electoral ploy, unable to see their families. Only numbskulls give a fuck where grown adults take a whizz.

You might want to look at your information again. It may have been better in 2020 but that was because most people were locked up. Typically Tx is better then cali in vilent crime. https://www.kcra.com/article/newsom-statement-violent-crime-higher-texas-than-california-misleading-heres-why/38489825# in 2020 Tx also had less homicides but more per capita but I bet that also had something to do with being locked down.
As far as the Texas not haveing power during a winter storm which was rare. Cali is looking at not having enough during this summer and years to come. Something they should be more use to. interesting how the national media is not talking about it much. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/california-says-it-needs-more-power-keep-lights-2022-05-06/

If people want to live in Cali so much then where is there such a mass exodus from there. It is more expensive do to lots of laws that raise up prices. Cali also has a massive shortfall if they would repair several of the things that need to be repaired. Texas also has a surplus and has for awhile.

[wildbill2u]

No interest in Donovan Mitchell. Ask yourself this: when's the last time a team with a 6'1" starting SG won a championship? For three straight years, the Jazz have been slightly better with him off the floor than with him on. CJ McCollum became immediately more effective in New Orleans after they made him the PG and put a great defender next to him. Portland wasted the better part of a decade losing early in the playoffs with a micro back court that couldn't stop anyone.

Gave me an idea with your post. Maybe we can find a team that likes micro back-courts and trade Tre Jones who can't shoot and is vertically challenged. We need to prune the guard ranks.

[wildbill2u]

Nah lol, I was still there during that Feb. We didn't lose power, but everyone else in our family did. Fucking shit show. And yeah, they didn't do shit to fix that so it'll 100% happen again in the future because they DGAF if you suffer, they just fly to Cancun.

Not to worry. If everyone will just buy an electric car, we won't have any more energy problems. Oh wait, the current grid wouldn't sustain a few million EVs charging every day and night, so we'd have to upgrade our grid with additional solar and wind power greater than the current 25%. But then I'm not sure where I will be able to charge my family's cars in our current apartment complex since we don't have garages, but I'm sure it will be easy to work out who goes first at the electric power post with all my moron neighbors . Gosh, I hope they don't raise my rent in order to build all those electric charging posts near my parking places. We are in for some really fun futures that we can imagine quite easily if we try., eh?

[KingKev]

^ take your politics elsewhere.

Bringing left vs right US politics to a public sports forum just exacerbates how ignorant and uneducated both sides appear to the rest of the world.

[TD 21]

This possibility really sunk in for me after we traded Derrick. If the spurs choose not to surround DJ and Yak with players on their time line this summer, it feels like a matter for time until they’re moved and we’re on to a new core around Vassel/Primo/2022 FRP picks.

Poeltl, maybe (probably?). Murray, the White trade was probably an indication that they'll build around him.

They spent a half decade helping to develop him into the player he's become, they desperately need star power and will probably continue to have difficulty procuring it via the draft by intentionally having an adverse effect on their odds.

I also don't think he'd have the trade value (going on 26, inefficient on ball, a liability off ball) commensurate with his fringe star status and given that and how long it took him to secure face of the franchise status, I doubt he'll want to leave so long as they continue to gradually improve.

[montgod]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/266826/Robert-Covington-Clippers-Agree-To-Two-Year-$24M-Extension

Would have been a nice possibility and they signed him pretty cheap.

[KingKev]

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/266826/Robert-Covington-Clippers-Agree-To-Two-Year-$24M-Extension

Would have been a nice possibility and they signed him pretty cheap.

Doubt he would even consider signing here.

Blazers really blew things up for pennies on the dollar though.

[exstatic]

Doubt he would even consider signing here.

Blazers really blew things up for pennies on the dollar though.

Why, again, do you want to sign a guy who will be 32 next season?

[KingKev]

Why, again, do you want to sign a guy who will be 32 next season?

I don’t gramps. If you actually read my posts instead of always trying to argue with me I’m heavily against all of these Batum, RoCo, Harrison Barnes, Dipo popular Spurstalk targets.

[exstatic]

I don’t gramps. If you actually read my posts instead of always trying to argue with me I’m heavily against all of these Batum, RoCo, Harrison Barnes, Dipo popular Spurstalk targets.

Well, OK, sonny boy.

[Atl Spur]

Patience young Jedi ……..

[BackHome]

I am all in for 2023 Tank..........:lma

[Drom John]

^ take your politics elsewhere.

Bringing left vs right

Lefties:
Deandre Ayton
Marvin Bagley Jr.
Kent Bazemore
Jalen Brunson
Miles Bridges
Ed Davis
Rodney Hood
Joe Ingles
DeAndre Jordan
D'Angelo Russell
Tristan Thompson
Thaddeus Young

[Chinook]

^ I do think it hinges on whether they win or not this year, but their penny pinching history is well-known.

IIRC they can’t aggregate Saric in a S&T though, so would have to be only Ayton

They can totally aggregate Saric with a S&T though. No idea where that meme started, but I've seen it on multiple forums.

Not that signing Ayton or trading for Saric makes sense to me.

[PhantomDashCam]

1525144553682001920

My obsession knows no bounds….:lol

Unrealistic but the numbers appear to work so putting it out into the ether.

With D’antoni likely running a system akin to what he has in the past, Poeltl becoming a Hornet seems a lot less likely/palatable.
Josh Richardson, however, would appear to be a perfect candidate to pair with Ball as a 2/3…

__________________

Proposed 3 Team Trade

SA receives Gordon Hayward, Kai Jones, Indiana 14th pick in the 2022 Draft

Indy receives Doug McDermott, Zach Collins, Charlotte 13th & 15th picks in 2022 Draft, SA 20th pick in 2022 Draft, SA 2024 First Round Pick, Charlotte 2024 First round pick

Charlotte receives Myles Turner, Josh Richardson

_________________

Why would SA do it?

Hayward has always felt like a Spurs type guy IMO. Even though his contract is horrendous, Spurs would likely value his veteran leadership, Offensive versatility and role tutelage capabilities for KJ, Vassell and Primo.
Kai Jones would offer the team an athletic presence at the 4/5 whose ceiling is sky high.
The Indy 14th could be paired potentially with 9th to get to 6 or 7th in the draft to grab Keegan Murray who I believe fits this team perfectly.

Depth Chart

Starters
DJ, Vassell, KJ, Keegan Murray, Poeltl

Bench
Hayward, Primo, Kai Jones, Tre Jones, Jock Landale, 25th Pick, Weiskamp, 38th Pick

Why would Indy do it?
Indy has significant means to add (almost) 3 lottery type talents in this draft and subsequent future flexibility of adding more.

Why would Charlotte do it?
In long need of a C, Myles Turner has long said to be of interest to Charlotte. Shedding Hayward’s salary to help achieve that task, even while giving up two first rounders, is still a no brainer.
A starting lineup of LaMelo, Rozier, J Rich, Bridges and Turner offers the kind of on paper lineup that would allow D’Antoni’s Offense to thrive.

[KingKev]

^ wow that is terrible!!! Indy nets four FRP for Turner to eat two years of Doug McDdermott? Are you kidding? We pay a hefty price to unload McDermott and take on a terrible contract? WTF.

Hard pass.

[Robz4000]

1525144553682001920

My obsession knows no bounds….:lol

Unrealistic but the numbers appear to work so putting it out into the ether.

With D’antoni likely running a system akin to what he has in the past, Poeltl becoming a Hornet seems a lot less likely/palatable.
Josh Richardson, however, would appear to be a perfect candidate to pair with Ball as a 2/3…

__________________

Proposed 3 Team Trade

SA receives Gordon Hayward, Kai Jones, Indiana 14th pick in the 2022 Draft

Indy receives Doug McDermott, Zach Collins, Charlotte 13th & 15th picks in 2022 Draft, SA 20th pick in 2022 Draft, SA 2024 First Round Pick, Charlotte 2024 First round pick

Charlotte receives Myles Turner, Josh Richardson

_________________

Why would SA do it?

Hayward has always felt like a Spurs type guy IMO. Even though his contract is horrendous, Spurs would likely value his veteran leadership, Offensive versatility and role tutelage capabilities for KJ, Vassell and Primo.
Kai Jones would offer the team an athletic presence at the 4/5 whose ceiling is sky high.
The Indy 14th could be paired potentially with 9th to get to 6 or 7th in the draft to grab Keegan Murray who I believe fits this team perfectly.

Depth Chart

Starters
DJ, Vassell, KJ, Keegan Murray, Poeltl

Bench
Hayward, Primo, Kai Jones, Tre Jones, Jock Landale, 25th Pick, Weiskamp, 38th Pick

Why would Indy do it?
Indy has significant means to add (almost) 3 lottery type talents in this draft and subsequent future flexibility of adding more.

Why would Charlotte do it?
In long need of a C, Myles Turner has long said to be of interest to Charlotte. Shedding Hayward’s salary to help achieve that task, even while giving up two first rounders, is still a no brainer.
A starting lineup of LaMelo, Rozier, J Rich, Bridges and Turner offers the kind of on paper lineup that would allow D’Antoni’s Offense to thrive.

:lol this is a pretty awful trade

[PhantomDashCam]

^ wow that is terrible!!! Indy nets four FRP for Turner to eat two years of Doug McDdermott? Are you kidding? We pay a hefty price to unload McDermott and take on a terrible contract? WTF.

Hard pass.


:lol this is a pretty awful trade

:lol That’s fair gents.
Look, I won’t try and defend it. I will say this:
- Hayward has a fair chance to rehabilitate his image and health in SA.
- Keegan gives the Spur a mid-post option and a potential starting quality ‘4’.
- Kai Jones, well, I’ve written enough about him


https://youtu.be/79ZO2kWgffc

[KingKev]

:lol That’s fair gents.
Look, I won’t try and defend it. I will say this:
- Hayward has a fair chance to rehabilitate his image and health in SA.
- Keegan gives the Spur a mid-post option and a potential starting quality ‘4’.
- Kai Jones, well, I’ve written enough about him


https://youtu.be/79ZO2kWgffc

Hayward if/when healthy is a pretty good 2way player I just think you should be getting compensated to take that risk.

He is a Spurs type guy for sure but I’d want compensation and some other chips would have to fall in place (Lavine and a top 4 pick) for him to make sense for us. Just my opinion / unrealistic expectation.

[scott]

Ran a sim on 2k22 because I'm tired of waiting until this offseason.

Took a shit ton of trades, but here is your 2022-23 Spurs Roster

PG: Murray / Alec Burks
SG: Mathurin / Primo / Procida (2nd Round Pick)
SF: Johnson / Vassell / Iguodala / Sterling Brown
PF: Miles Bridges (4yrs $102MM) / Obi Toppin / Larry Nance Jr.
C: Duren / Collins / Ibaka

We still have all our 1s going forward plus :

2024 Top 3 Protected from MEM
2025 Cavs 1st
2025 Top 10 Protected from CHI
2026 Unprotected from BKY
2026 Unprotected from DAL
2027 Unprotected from UTA

Pay attention Brian Wright

[Ariel]

My obsession knows no bounds….:lol

Unrealistic but the numbers appear to work so putting it out into the ether.

With D’antoni likely running a system akin to what he has in the past, Poeltl becoming a Hornet seems a lot less likely/palatable.
Josh Richardson, however, would appear to be a perfect candidate to pair with Ball as a 2/3…
I've been thinking the exact same thing, but on a different angle... they could really use Josh Richardson, and though him alone won't get one of the two picks they have, maybe him + 25 could land us 13 or 15. I'd do that.

PS: way too complicated trades (good or bad) are almost impossible to anticipate... no point bothering.

[SAGirl]

Surprised no one has made a thread to say: “Let’s trade for Ayton now!” Send McDermott and surpluss for him, maybe the 25th pick in this years draft… then do the Jakob deal with Hornets! Lol I have no idea what I am talking about but this thread needs some bumping.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Ayton will be a S&T , not an outright signing for anyone, even if they have cap space, unless he's burnt all bridges and wants to fuck the Suns over and himself as well that is.

I'm not sure I'd be happy giving up whatever will be needed to outbid other teams while also maxing out a center.

[tbdog]

Surprised no one has made a thread to say: “Let’s trade for Ayton now!” Send McDermott and surpluss for him, maybe the 25th pick in this years draft… then do the Jakob deal with Hornets! Lol I have no idea what I am talking about but this thread needs some bumping.

Suns would want Poeltl and a legit backup pg as a starting point for discussion.

[Dex]

I like Ayton...he's a poor man's Duncan, but still pretty much exactly what this team needs. Put him around our young pieces, and it at least gets us back in the playoff conversation.

If Spurs could find a way to get him (either as an FA, or through trade without selling the farm)...I'd be all for it.

[lmbebo]

I like Ayton...he's a poor man's Duncan, but still pretty much exactly what this team needs. Put him around our young pieces, and it at least gets us back in the playoff conversation.

If Spurs could find a way to get him (either as an FA, or through trade without selling the farm)...I'd be all for it.

I'd do McDermott, Jones (unless a FA) and 25th pick for Ayton. Not sure how that works though.

[KingKev]

I'd do McDermott, Jones (unless a FA) and 25th pick for Ayton. Not sure how that works though.

I’d rather save McDermott and an FRP for a trade for super star.

[KingKev]

Surprised no one has made a thread to say: “Let’s trade for Ayton now!” Send McDermott and surpluss for him, maybe the 25th pick in this years draft… then do the Jakob deal with Hornets! Lol I have no idea what I am talking about but this thread needs some bumping.

haha see above… you nailed it

[rascal]

Suns would want Poeltl and a legit backup pg as a starting point for discussion.

They wouldn't be interested in anything the Spurs have on the roster.

They would want an established star, preferably a big in return.

[rascal]

I'd do McDermott, Jones (unless a FA) and 25th pick for Ayton. Not sure how that works though.

In your dreams Phoenix would have any interest in that low ball offer.

[SAGirl]

In your dreams Phoenix would have any interest in that low ball offer.
Problem is that Phoenix is dealing with a distressed asset here. They don’t have all the leverage.

Having said that though, the Spurs were able to get a good deal out of Derozan considering he was leaving anyways. And yet the Spurs have assets right now that they have to turn into an improvement. So that’s the tricky part. How to use those assets. Also, the player needs to want to join the Spurs to begin with.

I am lukewarm on Ayton myself. I like him enough to be interested, but I have my doubts with him. I don’t watch him enough, bottom line and he can come up short so often when you need him. I am interested in what others think.

[CGD]

^ I'm lukewarm on all the trade/FA targets honestly -- Ayton, Lavine, Beal. They all seem LaMarcus "empty calories" Aldridge-like to me.

[exstatic]

I like Ayton...he's a poor man's Duncan, but still pretty much exactly what this team needs. Put him around our young pieces, and it at least gets us back in the playoff conversation.

If Spurs could find a way to get him (either as an FA, or through trade without selling the farm)...I'd be all for it.

I don’t want to pay $30M to be in the playoff conversation, I want to pay $30 M to be in the conference finals.

[CGD]

I'd do McDermott, Jones (unless a FA) and 25th pick for Ayton. Not sure how that works though.

More like Doug and Richardson, which together gets you closer to the matching salary on Year 1 an Ayton' 4 year max. But, PHX would likely need more, which could be one of the picks we select, a future pick, or a young guy on the roster. Or, the teams could make the deal bigger with Spurs taking back Saric and sending our Romeo/other meh asset.

[KingKev]

More like Doug and Richardson, which together gets you closer to the matching salary on Year 1 an Ayton' 4 year max. But, PHX would likely need more, which could be one of the picks we select, a future pick, or a young guy on the roster. Or, the teams could make the deal bigger with Spurs taking back Saric and sending our Romeo/other meh asset.

No fking chance we are interested in Ayton and rightfully so. Pop and Monty are close and I’m sure they compare notes.

JRich, Jak and an FRP (top 14 protected) would be a fair market value but I am absolutely not interested at all. He is Andrew Bynum 2.0 with upside; might make sense for the certain teams but not us.

[CGD]

No fking chance we are interested in Ayton and rightfully so. Pop and Monty are close and I’m sure they compare notes.

JRich, Jak and an FRP (top 14 protected) would be a fair market value but I am absolutely not interested at all. He is Andrew Bynum 2.0 with upside; might make sense for the certain teams but not us.

I do think any interest the Spurs may have had, if they even did, took a huge hit after Game 7 and Monty's "internal" comment.

[R. DeMurre]

Ayton is so underwhelming... far fewer blocks & assists than Poeltl, and pretty pedestrian impact stats, especially for a guy on a 64 win team. I suppose it's the same situation as LaVine: use the salary space to grab a guy who can be flipped later in a bigger move to get a truly impactful star-- but it's hard to get too excited over him.

[SAGirl]

^ I'm lukewarm on all the trade/FA targets honestly -- Ayton, Lavine, Beal. They all seem LaMarcus "empty calories" Aldridge-like to me.
Lamarcus carried a couple of poor SA teams to the playoffs… but LMA is actually who came to mind. Different games of course, but just a player that doesn't have a higher gear when you need him.

I do keep coming back to what do you do with 4 picks and some contracts who are really not keepers? This is not about an evaluation of Ayton or Lavine in a ranking of the top players in the NBA. It’s a real world evaluation within context. It’s them versus what you have on the roster.

I do think the Spurs need to turn some of their assets into at least some kind of improvement somewhere. The worst that could happen is that you draft all those 4 guys, none of which has a chance to be as good as Lavine or Ayton right now. And if we are optimistic, let’s say they get one hit, the other 3 are below average, average at best, and nowhere close to the trade targets.

They also have some salary they can turn into a different player. So its a lot about opportunity cost, trying to get better in context, and building around the pieces that you have.

A franchise player is not up for trade, so you can only consider among the options that you have.

[SAGirl]

Ayton is so underwhelming... far fewer blocks & assists than Poeltl, and pretty pedestrian impact stats, especially for a guy on a 64 win team. I suppose it's the same situation as LaVine: use the salary space to grab a guy who can be flipped later in a bigger move to get a truly impactful star-- but it's hard to get too excited over him.
Absolutely bc people love the idea of picks … then those guys are drafted and only one or two look like a keeper, and I am being generous here. I really want them to continue building through the draft, but I think they also need to be a savvy FO that is opportunistic getting a young asset when they can, to play right now and as a bargaining chip in future trades as well like you point out.

I like Jakob. I was really impressed with him in the play in game. I am just wondering if a younger center with a jumpshot wouldn’t be an improvement. I also wonder whether Ayton still has some untapped potential bc playing with CP3 I bet there is only a certain role they wanted from him. I dont have the answer, and honestly I am not sold. But I am considering it.

Wait until Jakob gets paid what he should be getting paid when he’s up for his contract, and folks will be more amenable to consider a higher upside alternative. What worries me with Ayton really is the motor issues. I wonder about him, not going to lie, but I am intrigued.

[Dex]

I don’t want to pay $30M to be in the playoff conversation, I want to pay $30 M to be in the conference finals.

Agreed, but I don't see anyone on the FA market that instantly catapults us to that position. Spurs aren't going to bring in a Durant or Luka or Giannis, etc.

I think a combination of adding someone like Ayton, hopefully getting lucky in the lottery and/or draft, and continued progress from the likes of Murray, Vassell, Primo, Johnson, etc gets us as about as close as we can reasonably hope for in the next couple years

[exstatic]

Lamarcus carried a couple of poor SA teams to the playoffs… but LMA is actually who came to mind. Different games of course, but just a player that doesn't have a higher gear when you need him.

I do keep coming back to what do you do with 4 picks and some contracts who are really not keepers? This is not about an evaluation of Ayton or Lavine in a ranking of the top players in the NBA. It’s a real world evaluation within context. It’s them versus what you have on the roster.

I do think the Spurs need to turn some of their assets into at least some kind of improvement somewhere. The worst that could happen is that you draft all those 4 guys, none of which has a chance to be as good as Lavine or Ayton right now. And if we are optimistic, let’s say they get one hit, the other 3 are below average, average at best, and nowhere close to the trade targets.

They also have some salary they can turn into a different player. So its a lot about opportunity cost, trying to get better in context, and building around the pieces that you have.

A franchise player is not up for trade, so you can only consider among the options that you have.

Our picks in this draft cannot be used to trade for either Ayton or Lavine. They both would need to be signed and traded, and that cannot happen until July. That is considered the next NBA business year.

[SAGirl]

I do think any interest the Spurs may have had, if they even did, took a huge hit after Game 7 and Monty's "internal" comment.
I had forgotten about this. That is likely a no then…
But consider this. Luka Doncic quarreled with Porzinguis and coach Rick Carlisle. He was starting to seem like a locker room cancer/diva to me.
Different year and different coach ends in a different result and a reevaluation of what was going on.

I think Ayton has been scapegoated to be quite honest with you. The whole entire Suns team didn’t show up ready to play. Some of that has to be on Monty. Then only Ayton gets the bench and the team was even worse without him. I have to evaluate this in context. He's the fall guy. Meantime CP3 saying he was playing with a hamstring injury… and where is the rest of the Suns? Where is Booker? Where is everyone else?

[SAGirl]

Our picks in this draft cannot be used to trade for either Ayton or Lavine. They both would need to be signed and traded, and that cannot happen until July. That is considered the next NBA business year.
Oh thanks. I did not know that. It changes my consideration for sure and makes me wonder what is going to happen with all those 4 guys… I find it hard to believe Spurs will have all 4 rookies in the roster. I suppose there will be a Gleague deal in there.

[mo7888]

I'm pretty lukewarm on Ayton myself. Does he have a consistent mid range shot really? What does he do better than Poeltl? Or I should say, what does he do thats worth $10-$15M more than Poeltl gets? (The range depends on if we're talking Poeltl's current salary or his salary after an extention)

[mo7888]

Oh thanks. I did not know that. It changes my consideration for sure and makes me wonder what is going to happen with all those 4 guys… I find it hard to believe Spurs will have all 4 rookies in the roster. I suppose there will be a Gleague deal in there.

My guess is we either package them to move up from 20 or we move one for a future first down the road.

[RC_Drunkford]

Spurs fans are hilarious to me. They value someone like Derrick White who's the 9th man on the Celtics, but don't want anybody who'd be the best or 2nd best player on their team, because "character" :lmao

[KobesAchilles]

I think Luka Doncic ended Ayton's career (in the west). They were in the same draft with Ayton going over him and Luka just embarrassed him over and over and over again. Luka was constantly calling for Ayton to guard him and to me, the turning point of Ayton's performance came when Luka backed him down and hit a turn around jumper on him. He had been driving past Ayton all series long, but on that play, he took away Ayton's manhood by bodying up a 7 footer like it was nothing.

Ayton needs to go East to salvage his career. I'm not saying he's a bad player, but people are going to forever compare him with Luka and he will be on the list of #1 busts simply bc they could've drafted Luka. And Luca will be eating him up his entire career if Ayton stays west. He needs to bail and go east. And the team that makes the most sense to me is the Charlotte Hornets. They trade Rozier and Harrell (and maybe the corpse of Batum or whatever filler you need) for Ayton. He gets a young running mate in Ball who loves throwing lobs and provides the Hornets with much needed improved center play.

Meanwhile Rozier provides Phoenix with a secondary scorer and a key spark off the bench that they are missing. It's a win for both teams and more importantly a win for Ayton. Because he will make the playoffs a few times in his career, he will maybe win a round or two and be thought of as a decent #1 pick who had a solid career instead of constantly losing and constantly being compared to a legend like Luka.

[exstatic]

Oh thanks. I did not know that. It changes my consideration for sure and makes me wonder what is going to happen with all those 4 guys… I find it hard to believe Spurs will have all 4 rookies in the roster. I suppose there will be a Gleague deal in there.

We might be able to kick those two late first rounders into future drafts, and then use them this summer in trades.

[SAGirl]

I'm pretty lukewarm on Ayton myself. Does he have a consistent mid range shot really? What does he do better than Poeltl? Or I should say, what does he do thats worth $10-$15M more than Poeltl gets? (The range depends on if we're talking Poeltl's current salary or his salary after an extention)
To me it seems he’s got a much better jumpshot that I saw him flash during the Pelicans series in the first round. They don’t get out of the first round without him and CP3 4th Q heroics, but I was impressed by seeing h8m really pitch in with scoring when they needed him. Obvious he was being set up by CP3, in the spots he liked and he wasn’t posting up or anything but he’s definitely a lot more talented offensively than Jakob.

[exstatic]

Spurs fans are hilarious to me. They value someone like Derrick White who's the 9th man on the Celtics, but don't want anybody who'd be the best or 2nd best player on their team, because "character" :lmao

It’s not character, it’s the Aldridge/DeRozan syndrome.

[CGD]

My guess is we either package them to move up from 20 or we move one for a future first down the road.

I really hope they swap one of the late picks for a future one. Goal should be to have multiple lotto tickets over the next 4 years.

[CGD]

Lamarcus carried a couple of poor SA teams to the playoffs… but LMA is actually who came to mind. Different games of course, but just a player that doesn't have a higher gear when you need him.

I do keep coming back to what do you do with 4 picks and some contracts who are really not keepers? This is not about an evaluation of Ayton or Lavine in a ranking of the top players in the NBA. It’s a real world evaluation within context. It’s them versus what you have on the roster.

I do think the Spurs need to turn some of their assets into at least some kind of improvement somewhere. The worst that could happen is that you draft all those 4 guys, none of which has a chance to be as good as Lavine or Ayton right now. And if we are optimistic, let’s say they get one hit, the other 3 are below average, average at best, and nowhere close to the trade targets.

They also have some salary they can turn into a different player. So its a lot about opportunity cost, trying to get better in context, and building around the pieces that you have.

A franchise player is not up for trade, so you can only consider among the options that you have.

In the absence for landing a FA or trade target, I do think the name of the game here is to do more Derrick White type deals to up your chances of getting more impact players.

I'm incredibly happy to see the Hills, Whites, Greens, Andersons, Berts, Baynes, Bobans, and CJs go one to have respectable careers in other places after they left the team. I will also be incredibly happy to see others currently on the roster be great role players elsewhere too, and I don't think any of those guys can say that the Spurs brand didnt get them PAID (elsewhere).

[KingKev]

Spurs fans are hilarious to me. They value someone like Derrick White who's the 9th man on the Celtics, but don't want anybody who'd be the best or 2nd best player on their team, because "character" :lmao

haha agreed but it’s more just a reality knowing Ayton probably isn’t on our radar given recent developments and yeah he would be the second best player but that is because we are easily in the conversation of least talented team in the league not because he is anything special. I personally could give a fk about character if they can show up on game day. Spurs culture BS has gone waaaaayyyyy too far in recent years.

[Mr. Body]

I wonder if there's a way to use the cap space to help someone in the contender range get Ayton. Not sure whether Phoenix would deal with the Spurs, but if they don't see another way of losing their center without compensation, they might. I don't get the interest from the Spurs themselves, but trying to pick up pieces with that cap space might work.

[KingKev]

I wonder if there's a way to use the cap space to help someone in the contender range get Ayton. Not sure whether Phoenix would deal with the Spurs, but if they don't see another way of losing their center without compensation, they might. I don't get the interest from the Spurs themselves, but trying to pick up pieces with that cap space might work.

If we don’t blow our load on stupid contracts like Walker and this summer’s version of McDougal this is probably our best opportunity to allocate capital - facilitating for others in an environment where cap space is limited.

[KingKev]

Spurs fans are hilarious to me. They value someone like Derrick White who's the 9th man on the Celtics, but don't want anybody who'd be the best or 2nd best player on their team, because "character" :lmao

haha agreed but it’s more just a reality knowing Ayton probably isn’t on our radar given recent developments and yeah he would be the second best player but that is because we are easily in the conversation of least talented team in the league not because he is anything special. I personally could give a fk about character if they can show up on game day. Spurs culture BS has gone waaaaayyyyy too far in recent years.

[Ocotillo]

I wonder if there's a way to use the cap space to help someone in the contender range get Ayton. Not sure whether Phoenix would deal with the Spurs, but if they don't see another way of losing their center without compensation, they might. I don't get the interest from the Spurs themselves, but trying to pick up pieces with that cap space might work.

Hmmm, earlier I was thinking if there would be any interest in Phoenix and Utah swapping centers but then I recalled Gobert makes almost $10MM more than Ayton will and Sarver doesn't want the tax hit. Maybe fashion something around that?

[CGD]

It will also be delicious to see Sarver have to match a max offer on a player who now clearly feels a certain way, while paying a massive tax bill that could result in him potentially waiving Paul next summer. That, or see him have to let Ayton walk for peanuts, a generational player that he took over Luka who just beat his ass in one of the most embarrassing Game 7s ever.

[rascal]

The Spurs can't sit on their hands on draft day and do nothing with trades like they've done in recent years.

They have draft pick trade assets and should be aggressively looking to deal.

[KingKev]

It will also be delicious to see Sarver have to match a max offer on a player who now clearly feels a certain way, while paying a massive tax bill that could result in him potentially waiving Paul next summer. That, or see him have to let Ayton walk for peanuts, a generational player that he took over Luka who just beat his ass in one of the most embarrassing Game 7s ever.

Paul is fully guaranteed next year and 15mm for 2023-24. There is no chance he is waived.

Ayton is an RFA and will garner something decent in return if they chose to go another route.

[Drom John]

What do y'all think about Mitchell Robinson as a FA target?
IMO, Robinson is better, and would cheaper, than Ayton.

[tbdog]

What do y'all think about Mitchell Robinson as a FA target?
IMO, Robinson is better, and would cheaper, than Ayton.

Ayton is a legit 2 way center. Not Robinson.

[RC_Drunkford]

It’s not character, it’s the Aldridge/DeRozan syndrome.

Ayton does not play like them

[exstatic]

Ayton does not play like them

It’s more the $25-30M treadmill player(s).

[RC_Drunkford]

It’s more the $25-30M treadmill player(s).

true Spurs fans would much rather have 2 older bench players who earn 12-15 million each per year :lol

[KingKev]

true Spurs fans would much rather have 2 older bench players who earn 12-13 million per year each:lol

haha seriously. Spurstalk will support McDermott’s deal and co-sign trading a first and Zollins for Harrison Barnes for a combed 25mm but puke at Lavine as he doesn’t make us a contender.

[tbdog]

It's not about being a contender. It's about getting better. You don't just sit there waiting for a mega star. There's 28 spots between 1 and 30.

[illusioNtEk]

Spurs really don't need anything major and drastic... we should keep what we have but we desperately need an athletic big. thats all.

[RC_Drunkford]

It's not about being a contender. It's about getting better. You don't just sit there waiting for a mega star. There's 28 spots between 1 and 30.

no according to spurstalk it's about winning a title and if you don't have a top 5 player you can't win a title so improving is pointless :lol

[Silverheart80]

I'm alright with the #9 pick in this year's draft. I don't think there's a franchise cornerstone in this one. Hoping the Spurs stand pat with arguably the least talented roster in the league and draft Sochan or Dieng depending on which has the higher BBIQ. Don't make too many aggressive roster additions and we're guaranteed to be back in the Lottery in 2023.

Hoping they'll trade out of this year's draft with picks 20, 25, and 38 and try to bank assets toward next year's Draft -- The Year of Wembanyama. That's the guy I want. Beneath him -- much deeper draft than this year's, and even if the Spurs don't finish in the top 4 of next year's draft, the free agency pool is muuuuuch more interesting than this year's (for example, Joker will be age 28 and an Unrestricted Free Agent in that one).

If we don't screw up this next season by squeezing into the Play-In, we've got a shot for next year's Lottery to be our last for a long time. Gotta get a franchise cornerstone first though, and that won't be 'til next season's draft or free agency period at the earliest.

[Silverheart80]

I'm alright with the #9 pick in this year's draft. I don't think there's a franchise cornerstone in this one. Hoping the Spurs stand pat with arguably the least talented roster in the league and draft Sochan or Dieng depending on which has the higher BBIQ. Don't make too many aggressive roster additions and we're guaranteed to be back in the Lottery in 2023.

Hoping they'll trade out of this year's draft with picks 20, 25, and 38 and try to bank assets toward next year's Draft -- The Year of Wembanyama. That's the guy I want. Beneath him -- much deeper draft than this year's, and even if the Spurs don't finish in the top 4 of next year's draft, the free agency pool is muuuuuch more interesting than this year's (for example, Joker will be age 28 and an Unrestricted Free Agent in that one).

If we don't screw up this next season by squeezing into the Play-In, we've got a shot for next year's Lottery to be our last for a long time. Gotta get a franchise cornerstone first though, and that won't be 'til next season's draft or free agency period at the earliest.

[Ariel]

Hoping they'll trade out of this year's draft with picks 20, 25, and 38 and try to bank assets toward next year's Draft -- The Year of Wembanyama. That's the guy I want. Beneath him -- much deeper draft than this year's, and even if the Spurs don't finish in the top 4 of next year's draft, the free agency pool is muuuuuch more interesting than this year's (for example, Joker will be age 28 and an Unrestricted Free Agent in that one).
No one is giving up their chance at Wembanyama, and if the Spurs didn't tank now, they sure as hell won't do it next year. The best chance at Wembanyama is an early and awful Dejounte injury that would have us 9/10 with a 20% chance at him, tops. Not likely and not worth it, so we might as well make the most out of what we have if we like what's available. If not, then yes, trade, but I don't think this draft is worse than the next in the late first round, which is where our extra picks are.

[Silverheart80]

No one is giving up their chance at Wembanyama, and if the Spurs didn't tank now, they sure as hell won't do it next year. The best chance at Wembanyama is an early and awful Dejounte injury that would have us 9/10 with a 20% chance at him, tops. Not likely and not worth it, so we might as well make the most out of what we have if we like what's available. If not, then yes, trade, but I don't think this draft is worse than the next in the late first round, which is where our extra picks are.

Completely agree that the Spurs won't tank, if tanking means purposely losing games. That's for sure. But they won't need to tank if they stick with the current roster. There's no one on this team that creates a mismatch game after game. Solid role players across the board but certainly no dawgs who can lead a team to four wins in a 7-game series, much less a championship. But in 2023, that can change. So I'm hoping they stockpile capital and assets toward that.