Grades: Spurs @ Thunder - Oct. 9, 2023

[FuzzyLumpkins]

its the first preseason game...obviously the plan was to give him 6 minutes a quarter and rest the 4th lol.

are you serious?

Serious about what? He had a string of bad plays in that span. Do you disagree?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

There's some merit to Wemby leaking out because the coaches told him to. But a couple of things.

1) No playing on the perimeter doesn't give a player -- especially a power-forward -- carte blanche to not rebound. Getting the board is every player's responsibility. That goes double for the tallest players. Leaking out is good if the Spurs get the board, but if they give up offensive rebounds then not only are they having to play another possession but now they have their best defensive player 30 or 40 feet away from the basket. Like all types of gambles, they look great when they work out, and there are folks who are smarter about when to take them. But they're never NOT gambles, and they more they're used, the less net benefit they tend to have.

2) Wemby's lack of rebounding isn't just a choice. His technique needs work. At his height, he's going to get a fair number of boards just by high-pointing the ball. But his lower-body action needs to be tightened up. While there is a range he can reach that basically no one else in the league can, within that mroe normal range he still stands a risk of losing important caroms. If he does his work early and holds his ground, Wemby should be able to basically secure half the rim's worth of bounces, if not more. But if he's taking false steps toward the other basket, getting caught behind his man, and getting pushed off his spot, he's going to end up either letting smaller dudes rack in boards on him or get called for quite a few over-the-back calls trying to rely on his height and length.

I'm probably going to stop saying this after this post, but talking about what Wemby needs to do or what I hope Wemby develops is not hating on him or whatever. He's obviously a generational talent and is playing well beyond reasonable expectations in a number of ways. But he still has a way to go, and there is a chance he doesn't improve enough on some facets, especially while he's young. No one's panicking or doom-saying. But there are definitely holes in his game right now which probably puts a ceiling on how much his performance will help the team get wins this season. Maybe that doesn't matter, but it's been a matter of discussion for a few months.

I'm not sure what you are talking about technique. We have seen plenty of times him bodying people and pogoing for the ball over his career. Its not lost on him that he can reach the rim without jumping. His timing seems fine. He wasn't getting pushed off of spots.

[ambchang]

Serious about what? He had a string of bad plays in that span. Do you disagree?

What does that have to do with the price of eggs?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

What does that have to do with the price of eggs?

Both are real.

[Chinook]

can anybody point to an example where he leaked out in a situation that the team did not already have position to secure the rebound

maybe it happened...idk. but from my observations he picked situations to leak out where the team had the rebound secured and he would be able to receive the pass from a team mate.

sure he could crash every single time regardless and get the rebound because he's a foot taller than everyone but why do that if he can use his physical tools to turn the rebound into points.

So on both of his dunks, he started going before his team got possession of the ball. It was a rebound situation where the Spurs had the 4-3 advantage in the paint, but it ended up being that Tre Jones got the rebound while surrounded by three OKC players after Collins sort of tipped it to him. By the time Jones actually secured the rebound, Wemby was already in the paint on the other side. Had any of the bigger Thunder players taken the ball before Jones, it would've been 3-on-1 against Collins in the paint. On the second one, Wemby seemingly gets the steal (haven't looked to see if he got credited one), and he's sort of trying to make sure the Spurs have it before leaking. By the time he starts running back, it looks like Branham should be the first to the ball, though it's still possible that Dort will beat him there. What's significant here is that Wemby's man (Giddy) actually cuts to the rim behind Vassell, and if the Thunder were to have gotten the ball before Branham, it would've been an easy dunk. Even if Victor would've reacted immediately, and even with his length, he would've been out of the play.

Ultimately, while Wemby's offensive game is going to determine his ceiling, I think his future greatness is going to be driven by his defense. It's hard to be a DPOY let alone a DGOAT candidate leaking out. Coast-to-coast steals or blocks? Yes. But the farther away from the rim he is on that end, the smaller the arc length he's going to be able to guard, in terms of pi and even ro given how the closer a shot is to the rim the less height it's likely to get. As I said, it doesn't matter this year. But leaking out (for anyone, not just Wemby obviously) is only somewhat viable on high-deflection offenses like the Prime Heatles. Even then it's not as sustainable against certain offense. It's good for highlight reels but probably not a great strategy for a team that is full of underperforming defenders outside of the guy who's leaking out most often.

[sfernald]

Strife between young rookie and coaching staff confirmed.

This is clearly not going to work out. What they need to do is change coaching ASAP.

[BackHome]

As usual people overreacting to a pre season game..lol

[ambchang]

Both are real.

And thus related?

[Dex]

Wemby was defending on the perimeter. Why would he crash the board? I’ve got no problem with him leaking out.

I also think it's an easy way to get him comfortable and get some easy buckets as he learns the NBA game.

I think the Spurs should be opportunistic to use it, but I doubt it will be a staple of his game after a year or two.

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

This is clearly not going to work out. What they need to do is change coaching ASAP.

Will the Spurs pick Pop or Wemby???

[FuzzyLumpkins]

And thus related?

Is anything?

[EricB]

So many folks have been touting Vassell's body building and how it will improve his shooting. After last nite Im still waiting. Gotta hit those shots if he expects to win some honors or even continue starting.

continue starting? Wut 😂

[ambchang]

Is anything?

Yes.

[rankingtear]

Stop ting on Devin, him and Wemby shared the most court time for a reason. He makes sure their best perimeter defender is nowhere close to Wemby when he dribbles. The french guy just have to find him wide open on the opposite side.

[The Truth #6]

Two competing goals for this season:

1. Pop says he wants to win.
2. Pop also says he wants to let Wemby figure things out.

I'm more convinced of point number 2 than number 1. But we'll know more in a month. Those two goals are somewhat contradictory and makes me curious to see how Pop handles both.

Personally I think he's perfectly fine being back in the lottery as long as he gave Wemby the comfort, freedom, and opportunity to learn from his mistakes, with the assumption that this season is an investment in Wemby more than anything else, and that from this season Wemby will be acclimated to make a hard push next year.

A lot can change so we'll see. But I'm still not convinced of a hard push for the playoffs.

[Mr. Body]

Those goals are not contradictory. Point two shows they see this as an extremely long time frame well beyond not just the next few years, but the next ten.

Clearly they're not chips-all-in on the playoffs this year, but that doesn't mean tanking or losing on purpose. They want to try to win games because this means their players will learn to win games. It's just a process of learning how best to do it.

[The Truth #6]

It sounds like we actually may be seeing the situation similarly but you are choosing not to acknowledge that Pop said the goal is to win games this year, in contrast to last season.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Yes.

How?

[Mr. Body]

It sounds like we actually may be seeing the situation similarly but you are choosing not to acknowledge that Pop said the goal is to win games this year, in contrast to last season.

I'm not acknowledging that Pop wants to win games this year?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Those goals are not contradictory. Point two shows they see this as an extremely long time frame well beyond not just the next few years, but the next ten.

Clearly they're not chips-all-in on the playoffs this year, but that doesn't mean tanking or losing on purpose. They want to try to win games because this means their players will learn to win games. It's just a process of learning how best to do it.

Yeah Pop's has seen many successful seasons spending until the end of Winter tinkering with lineups and schemes and then hammering in what works best for the playoff run going into Summer. He has developed multiple HoF in that process.

[ambchang]

How?

Kai Jones suck (in nba terms) but still demanded a trade.
Kai Jones got cut.

Both facts, both related.

[spurraider21]

Kai baptized Wemby and allowed him to get over himself

for that i will forever be grateful

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Kai Jones suck (in nba terms) but still demanded a trade.
Kai Jones got cut.

Both facts, both related.

Sure but I was not arguing a relationship with anything other than reality.

[ambchang]

SO the coaches gave him the quick hook because he was doing what they told him to?

Sure but I was not arguing a relationship with anything other than reality.

Use of because suggests otherwise.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Use of because suggests otherwise.

What does the use of a ? mean to you?

Wemby had two bad turnovers and two bricks right before he sat for the final time. That did not happen because the coaches told him to. That was the point of the question. Of course you realize this thus you intentionally misunderstanding.