Phoenix Suns expect to part ways with Kevin Durant this offseason. Could the Spurs be a good landing place?

[LeBowen]

The Spurs better "prioritize" Castle if he doesn't learn to be a positive player. Both Steph and Harper have to earn their minutes, and in a scenario where Sochan is a better fit in the lineup than them, I don't think one can justify not going with him. While you can develop guys on a winning team, you do that in a different way than you do on a losing team. I've expressed my interest in giving Harper a chance as the starting SG before. I still believe that. But that's because I think he has the skill-set to make it work, not because I'm worried about his status.

Trading for a star, then purposefully not playing the best guys around him would be way more sub-optimal. I don't know that opinions truly vary there.

You know who else should've earned their minutes? Vassell and Sochan. But those were just handed to them.
Instead Champagnie who had the best stretch of his career got benched during the team's best stretch od the season just so Devin can go back to cosplaying Kobe and playing awful defense.

[scott]

Jeremy is no where near the level of Brooks on being a distraction for his team. Yeah, Sochan does some here and there, but it's not even comparable. If for nothing else, Brooks riling up Lebron and then being banished from Memphis should prove that. Is Brooks better than Sochan now? Sure. At the same age? Well at the same age Brooks was a ROOKIE in the NBA. I don't think Sochan has much of a future on this team because his shooting, but I do think Sochan will be have a better NBA career than Devin ing Brooks when all is said and done.

You underestimate Dillon Brooks the player. He's been a useful player for HOU, and a key part of turning the culture around there. It's not like the Rockets were trying to dump him.

Brooks riling up Lebron in that playoff series against the Lakers is exactly the kind of Jeremy does... except Jeremy's never been in a playoff game and he does his talking on social media, as if that makes him some kind of badass. Jeremy is just as much a fake tough guy as Brooks... but at least Brooks has been a positive contributor (and All Defense Team player) on multiple playoff teams.

By what measure are you betting Sochan will have a better NBA career than Brooks? Longevity? Career earnings? Some composite stat? Manny's Feel Good Points?

Brooks is on my shortlist of NeverSpurs... I don't particularly want anyone who emulates him, but at least he does his bull while contributing to winning teams, not just being a pest as an occasional starter on a lottery team. People talk about him as the "personality of the team" but I don't particularly value his personality as one I want to embody the team at all. I'd much rather point to a guy like Keldon (hard working, humble, full of passion) for something like that. Thankfully we're starting to fill the roster with actual basketball players instead of just having a roster full of characters.

Spurs fans would absolutely hate him while simultaneously laughing at him if he wasn't a Spur.

I'm just going to chalk this post up to typical Manny Uber Homer musings.

[PhantomDashCam]

I never bought the idea the Spurs would trade key (arguably), rotation pieces to a conference rival.
Like it or Lump it, CREAM (as some have dubbed it), does indeed rule the Spurs decision making process.

[FkLA]

Meh, don't sweat it. The Suns got more from the Rockets than anything the Spurs could have offered without overpaying, so it's all good in my eyes. Unless you were willing to offer another first round pick (which would have been a mistake), the Spurs weren't beating the Rockets' offer.

Another first round pick would not have prevented me from making the deal. Isn't that the whole point of stockpiling first round picks, to be able to trade for someone like KD?

Spurs want to trade rape everyone like they did the Kings and that's a stupid way to go about things when you haven't been any good for so long. A slight overpay is not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

[Mr. Body]

Another first round pick would not have prevented me from making the deal. Isn't that the whole point of stockpiling first round picks, to be able to trade for someone like KD?

Spurs want to trade rape everyone like they did the Kings and that's a stupid way to go about things when you haven't been any good for so long. A slight overpay is not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

People really need to understand that Durant was a very awkward fit after this coming season, both salary-wise, which is considerable, but in team structure and pecking order. This isn't EA Sports. The Spurs knew what they were willing to part with for him and that's why they did.

[scott]

The Spurs better "prioritize" Castle if he doesn't learn to be a positive player. Both Steph and Harper have to earn their minutes, and in a scenario where Sochan is a better fit in the lineup than them, I don't think one can justify not going with him. While you can develop guys on a winning team, you do that in a different way than you do on a losing team. I've expressed my interest in giving Harper a chance as the starting SG before. I still believe that. But that's because I think he has the skill-set to make it work, not because I'm worried about his status.

I assume you meant "the Spurs better *de-prioritize( Castle if he doesn't learn..." because otherwise I'm not sure what you are saying here.

Sure... if Castle doesn't improve, then they should no longer prioritize him... but why would they de-prioritize him (and Harper) for a player who is currently worse than them after the benefit of 3-pressure free seasons where he's been gifted his minutes on the team? Why Do Steph and Harper need to earn their minutes over a guy who didn't have to earn his? This makes no sense.

There are reasons to believe Castle can be a a very high level (meaning, borderline all-star or better) part of your core going forward (as evidenced by winning ROTY). There are reasons to believe Harper can also be that (if not, then why are you drafting him at #2?). There are no real reasons to believe Sochan can be that.

To go out of our way to sign another player to start ahead of Castle so that you can make Sochan work in the starting lineup is just an insane team building philosophy. You could just sign the wing who makes the better player (Castle) have a better fit rather than the player who makes the worse player fit. Unless of course you don't believe in Castle (which I gather from your opinions, you don't). In which case... you could just say that instead.

Trading for a star, then purposefully not playing the best guys around him would be way more sub-optimal. I don't know that opinions truly vary there.

Everyone agree with that... only a small handful (which apparently includes you) think Sochan is one of the "best guys" over Castle and Harper. That's your opinion, and yes... it varies from the consensus.

[exstatic]

Am I programmed to be right all the time? Yes I am. I actually have conviction in what I say. You just continue to spout out wrong and incorrect statements at every turn which is why you won’t take the bet bc you don’t actually believe the Spurs are going to make the playoffs. You have doubt. Bc if you didn’t you would take the bet.

And you can say otherwise But once you seriously go back and look at my posts you will be hard pressed to find when I was wrong. Heck I even said the Spurs were going to get a top 4 pick this year before the season even started. I’m just tired of being right at this point.

Fox isn’t shaking up the roster. He was a nice addition but we didn’t really give up anything to get him. We still have a roster filled with flawed players. My brain damaged mind wants the Spurs to exchange those flawed players for better players. It’s a weird concept I know. I am a fan of the organization. I am not a player fan. I want the organization to be a winner again. If a player isn’t helping the organization win then I want them gone.

Well you said we had missed the playoffs for 8 years, and it’s actually 6, so apparently you are not programmed to be right all of the time.

[poopbox]

Our core is literally 3 lottery picks from the last 3 drafts (including 25). I think we probably DO make the playoffs this year because Wemby is that guy, but honestly saying this is a make or break season to make the playoffs is pretty insane. This is 100% a developmental season. That's 100% the reason you don't blow your wad on Durant. Wemby is what, 21? 22? And he's the oldest of the core. Yeah man, this is a developmental season but one where we probably make the playoffs. But still.

You can't have 5 straight losing seasons and going into at least year 4 of a rebuild and still sell people on "we are developing players". Someone should be fired if that is the case. We have players who have gone their whole rookie contracts on losing teams. We have players who into their second contract having never played on a team with a winning record. This off season and next off season should be used to get the losers out (branhim, wesley, sochan, devin, and keldon). Nobody wins with the players they tank with. Spurs won't be the exception.

[objective]

Another first round pick would not have prevented me from making the deal. Isn't that the whole point of stockpiling first round picks, to be able to trade for someone like KD?

Spurs want to trade rape everyone like they did the Kings and that's a stupid way to go about things when you haven't been any good for so long. A slight overpay is not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

Rockets obviously wanted him, and I don't think any upped Spurs offer would have withstood a Rockets counter offer. They have plenty more first round picks also, and more recent young prospects to match anything else player wise the Spurs could have added like Sochan, Wesley, or Branham.

Maybe Spurs should have tried just to get the Rockets to pay more, but for whatever reason they don't like to play those games just to raise a price tag like with the Reaves RFA situation.

[rascal]

.

[MannyIsGod]

You underestimate Dillon Brooks the player. He's been a useful player for HOU, and a key part of turning the culture around there. It's not like the Rockets were trying to dump him.

Brooks riling up Lebron in that playoff series against the Lakers is exactly the kind of Jeremy does... except Jeremy's never been in a playoff game and he does his talking on social media, as if that makes him some kind of badass. Jeremy is just as much a fake tough guy as Brooks... but at least Brooks has been a positive contributor (and All Defense Team player) on multiple playoff teams.

By what measure are you betting Sochan will have a better NBA career than Brooks? Longevity? Career earnings? Some composite stat? Manny's Feel Good Points?

Brooks is on my shortlist of NeverSpurs... I don't particularly want anyone who emulates him, but at least he does his bull while contributing to winning teams, not just being a pest as an occasional starter on a lottery team. People talk about him as the "personality of the team" but I don't particularly value his personality as one I want to embody the team at all. I'd much rather point to a guy like Keldon (hard working, humble, full of passion) for something like that. Thankfully we're starting to fill the roster with actual basketball players instead of just having a roster full of characters.

Spurs fans would absolutely hate him while simultaneously laughing at him if he wasn't a Spur.

I'm just going to chalk this post up to typical Manny Uber Homer musings.

Sochan is a better player at 21 than Brooks was at 22. Jeremy's teamates love him. Brook's teammates hate him. I don't know why you think Brook's career numbers are something that Sochan can't reach. Brooks has made all defense 2nd team once. The voting for that is lol, and he did it off the strength of being on a good defensive team. I'm not saying he's a bad defender, but neither is Sochan. You say I am under estimating Brooks and I say you are over estimating him.

I love how I'm the homer when I literally say that he'll probably get traded. If you want to start insults just because you - someone who claims to always want data based arguments - don't want to actually have a data based discussion then I'll just chalk it up to typical Scott Uber Full of musings.

[MannyIsGod]

You can't have 5 straight losing seasons and going into at least year 4 of a rebuild and still sell people on "we are developing players". Someone should be fired if that is the case. We have players who have gone their whole rookie contracts on losing teams. We have players who into their second contract having never played on a team with a winning record. This off season and next off season should be used to get the losers out (branhim, wesley, sochan, devin, and keldon). Nobody wins with the players they tank with. Spurs won't be the exception.

Yes, you have to get the guys who haven't developed out. If the roster outside of maybe 5 players is someone you want to trade, how is it NOT a development year? The ? You're telling me most of the roster sucks but it's a must make the playoff year?

[tbdog]

Regardless, Spurs need to make moves to bridge their flaws. Durant made sense court wise, just that shooting and scoring with that height.

[KobesAchilles]

Well you said we had missed the playoffs for 8 years, and it’s actually 6, so apparently you are not programmed to be right all of the time.

My prediction 6 years ago was to miss it 8 years in a row. Some poster was talking the Kings and how badly they are run and I was explaining to said poster how easy it was for us to become like the Sacramento Kings.

I basically said that once the elder Holts left us I could easily envision us becoming a franchise due to bad ownership. I’m a big believer in what Jerry Krause said as far as organizations are what win championships. Great players obviously help but you can be the best player in the world (Jokic and Giannis) and not even sniff the finals for several years due to bad organizational mistakes.

Bad ownership leads to bad everything was my take. And I still haven’t moved off of that take.

[scott]

Sochan is a better player at 21 than Brooks was at 22.

By what measure? I didn't watch a lot of Grizzlies games in 2017-18, did you? Their stats look pretty comparable, except Brooks was a decent shooter on decent volume and Sochan was not.

Jeremy's teamates love him. Brook's teammates hate him. I don't know why you think Brook's career numbers are something that Sochan can't reach. Brooks has made all defense 2nd team once. The voting for that is lol, and he did it off the strength of being on a good defensive team. I'm not saying he's a bad defender, but neither is Sochan. You say I am under estimating Brooks and I say you are over estimating him.

How much do you want to bet that Sochan will never have a single season in his career where he averages 18ppg or shoots .397 from 3 on 6+ attempts per game? I 100% believe those are things that Sochan can't reach. Do you?

I love how I'm the homer when I literally say that he'll probably get traded. If you want to start insults just because you - someone who claims to always want data based arguments - don't want to actually have a data based discussion then I'll just chalk it up to typical Scott Uber Full of musings.

You're a homer because you say the homerest imaginable, frequently. What data have you brought to this discussion? I went back and double checked... you've provided none. Let me know when you have some, I'd love to discuss. Post it up in the Sochan thread and make sure to tag me.

Edit: I take back what I said about you being a homer and apologize. You don't say the homerest imaginable frequently, only occasionally (maybe even rarely). You don't frequently speak from a place of homerism, only sometimes (like now).

[poopbox]

Yes, you have to get the guys who haven't developed out. If the roster outside of maybe 5 players is someone you want to trade, how is it NOT a development year? The ? You're telling me most of the roster sucks but it's a must make the playoff year?

Looks like we playing 5 players 48 min a game then

[rascal]

Sochan is a better player at 21 than Brooks was at 22. Jeremy's teamates love him. Brook's teammates hate him. I don't know why you think Brook's career numbers are something that Sochan can't reach. Brooks has made all defense 2nd team once. The voting for that is lol, and he did it off the strength of being on a good defensive team. I'm not saying he's a bad defender, but neither is Sochan. You say I am under estimating Brooks and I say you are over estimating him.

I love how I'm the homer when I literally say that he'll probably get traded. If you want to start insults just because you - someone who claims to always want data based arguments - don't want to actually have a data based discussion then I'll just chalk it up to typical Scott Uber Full of musings.

Literally

lol

[Obstructed_View]

I agree the Spurs could make a trade or two, but they need role players. Thank God they didn't pull the trigger on that loser.

[mystargtr34]

Give me PJ Washington for Keldon and their swap back.

[KobesAchilles]

Give me PJ Washington for Keldon and their swap back.

For as bad a franchise as they are? Nah you keep that pick.

[djohn2oo8]

Sochan is a better player at 21 than Brooks was at 22. Jeremy's teamates love him. Brook's teammates hate him. I don't know why you think Brook's career numbers are something that Sochan can't reach. Brooks has made all defense 2nd team once. The voting for that is lol, and he did it off the strength of being on a good defensive team. I'm not saying he's a bad defender, but neither is Sochan. You say I am under estimating Brooks and I say you are over estimating him.

I love how I'm the homer when I literally say that he'll probably get traded. If you want to start insults just because you - someone who claims to always want data based arguments - don't want to actually have a data based discussion then I'll just chalk it up to typical Scott Uber Full of musings.

Brooks teammates don’t actually hate him. You see how much worse Memphis got without him. He played well here so kind of bummed he had to go. Because you need to find another enforcer.

[scott]

Brooks teammates don’t actually hate him. You see how much worse Memphis got without him. He played well here so kind of bummed he had to go. Because you need to find another enforcer.

Yeah... everything I've heard is that his Rockets teammates seem to like him.

I can't stand the er, so I'm glad he's in a place to do slightly less damage to us.

[dbestpro]

The trade the Spurs did not make may be the best move they make. Durant will make Houston better until he breaks down and finishes the season on the injured list. Houston gave up too much.

[Mr. Body]

Yeah... everything I've heard is that his Rockets teammates seem to like him.

I can't stand the er, so I'm glad he's in a place to do slightly less damage to us.

His teammates pretend to like him so he doesn't shank them in their sleep.

[MannyIsGod]

By what measure? I didn't watch a lot of Grizzlies games in 2017-18, did you? Their stats look pretty comparable, except Brooks was a decent shooter on decent volume and Sochan was not.

Every measure other than permitter shooting? BPM and VORP? Rebounds? Assists? Stocks? eFG? TS%? The game is not just 3 point shooting.

How much do you want to bet that Sochan will never have a single season in his career where he averages 18ppg or shoots .397 from 3 on 6+ attempts per game? I 100% believe those are things that Sochan can't reach. Do you?

There are a lot of players in the NBA who won't have those stat lines and are better than Brooks. Especially since that was a one off season. I don't think you want to cherry pick Keldon's best season stats to say he's better than Brooks, do you? Anyway, no, I don't think he'll ever put up a stat line like that. But again, as valuable as 3 point shooting is - it's not everything. And that's why he doesn't fit here. But neither would Draymond Green. (No, Sochan is not Green)

Sochan tweets and dyes his hair. I get why that's annoying to some folks. It's not my cup of tea, but our best player loves him even though he is the most anti bull guy in the league. Most of the on the court isn't him trolling, it's him protecting his teammates. Probably one reason they like him. Maybe what y'all think of Sochan isn't all that accurate? Brooks on the other hand got run from a team that was primed to take over the western conference. Twice. And sure, the Rockets aren't publicly ting on him the way Memphis did, but he still got run.