Most underrated president?

[Tully365]

And that was a conservative stance, as was balancing the budget.

Do you mean "conservative", in the general sense, i.e., prudent, or conservative in the American political sense?

I don't think it's accurate to say wanting a balanced budget is a part of the conservative agenda in the last 25 years. Reagan criticized Carter's deficit and then quadrupled it, and GW did the same with Clinton's surplus.

Honestly, i think money management transcends political parties. A person who doesn't want to be crippled by debt is just generally smart about finances, even if he or she is a gay tree-hugger who drives a hybrid car, smokes pot, vacations in Bolivia, and works for Planned Parenthood.

[whottt]

Do you mean "conservative", in the general sense, i.e., prudent, or conservative in the American political sense?

Conservative as in Reagan pushed hard for the balanced budget amendment.


Conservative also as in Republicans seizing control of congress in 1994 on that promise and being Clinton's chief allies in balancing the budget and producing a surplus.

I don't think it's accurate to say wanting a balanced budget is a part of the conservative agenda in the last 25 years. Reagan criticized Carter's deficit and then quadrupled it, and GW did the same with Clinton's surplus.

True...both times the primary culprit was defense spending though, which always seems to take priority over the domestic issues with Republicans.

Honestly, i think money management transcends political parties. A person who doesn't want to be crippled by debt is just generally smart about finances, even if he or she is a gay tree-hugger who drives a hybrid car, smokes pot, vacations in Bolivia, and works for Planned Parenthood.

Well now...I don't agree with that. The President actually doesn't have much control over the money...it's congress that allocates money(or not). The President can't do without congressional approval....he can neither spend nor save without them.

The Republican Congress was a big reason Clinton was able to do a lot of the things he was able to do.

It was a good match.


That's(dynamic) what people were hoping would happen when they put the Democrats in power in 2006, and one would argue they are less popular than Bush is now. Hasn't been a good match...and those guys being paired up with Obama is going to be an even worse match.

[whottt]

By the way...what's hurting our country the most right now is the extreme polarization between our elected officials...we have a staunchly Republican President and a staunchly Democratic congress...no moderates.

[Galileo]

James Madison

The only president to win a war against against a nation with a higher GNP than us.

The only president to follow the Cons ution during a war.

He lead us to voctory in the second war of Independence, aka, the forgottten war.

He was the most popular president in history at the end of his second term.

He keep all his promises.

Simply the best.

[whottt]

He was the most popular president in history at the end of his second term.

Which means he wasn't truly underrated.

[Galileo]

Which means he wasn't truly underrated.

He's underrated, because he's usually hailed for his work at the Cons utional Convention, not his work as president.

He also got trashed in 1889 by Henry Adams (grandson of John Quincy Adams).

Adams trashed the Madison presidency, and most historians followed Adams analysis to the 1950s and even to this day.

Madison's work as president made a comeback following the work of Irving Brant in the 1950s.

Adams trashed Madison's presidency because he wasn't an aggressive executive leader who liked to shred the Cons ution and build up the military industrial complex.

Brant and some today now realize that this was precisely why Madison was a great president.

Modern scholars who admire Madison are Gordon Wood and Lance Banning.

[Shastafarian]

The same James Madison who was president while Washington was being burned? That James Madison?

[Galileo]

The same James Madison who was president while Washington was being burned? That James Madison?

No, the same FDR who was president while Pearl Harbor was bombed. The same Abrham Lincoln who was president while the Union forces were being slaughtered by Stonewall Jackson. And the same George Bush who was reading "My Pet Goat" while the World Trade Center was attacked.

[Shastafarian]

So you're equating the presidents who led during World War II and the Civil War to the president who by all intents and purposes lost a war where the US was invaded? I don't doubt Madison was a good president but was he one of the best? I don't think so.

[Galileo]

So you're equating the presidents who led during World War II and the Civil War to the president who by all intents and purposes lost a war where the US was invaded? I don't doubt Madison was a good president but was he one of the best? I don't think so.

Madison won the war of 1812. And he had tougher compe ion than Lincoln, FDR, or Bush.

[Shastafarian]

Madison won the war of 1812.

uh....the best outlook was it was a stalemate

But an estimate may be made based on the increased borrowing undertaken during the period, with the American war as a whole adding some £25 million to the national debt.[47] In America the cost was $105 million, though because the British pound was worth considerably more than the dollar, the costs of the war to both sides were roughly equal.

But then again I don't seem to remember any English cities burning at the hands of the Americans.

And he had tougher compe ion than Lincoln, FDR

I seriously hope you're kidding.

[Galileo]

uh....the best outlook was it was a stalemate



But then again I don't seem to remember any English cities burning at the hands of the Americans.



I seriously hope you're kidding.

1) We were the underdogs and held our ground at Baltimore and kicked the British ass at New Orleans. The treaty of Ghent was very favorable, a victory for us. We achieved our war aime of ending impressment. We also stopped the british from instigating Indian attacks. We also were granted free trade with France and England and had a post war economic boom, the greatest in our history which started the Era of Good feelings.

2) We trashed the capital of Canada, York.

3) I'm not kidding. Strength of schedule is a big factor in football rankings, basketball rankings, and president rankings.

[Shastafarian]

3) I'm not kidding. Strength of schedule is a big factor in football rankings, basketball rankings, and president rankings.

Oh I thought you were talking about their wartime enemies. I still disagree on the war of 1812 being a victory for the US. If anything, it was a "tie".

[cool hand]

Cheney.

[The Reckoning]

imagine if jimmy would've annexed canada. thank God he didnt

madison proposed the bill of rights, which is a huge
(i know it wasnt during his presidency, but atleast that meant he wouldnt take them away like current presidents)

oh and dont forget about ol' hickory slaughtering the british at the battle of new orleans during the war of 1812

[Tully365]

By the way...what's hurting our country the most right now is the extreme polarization between our elected officials...we have a staunchly Republican President and a staunchly Democratic congress...no moderates.

I agree with you 100% on that.

[spurster]

I agree on Madison. Good arguments.

I'm amazed by all the W love still going on.

[Supergirl]

W...it'll be 30 to 40 years before anyone realizes that he was the right president for this time in american history.

LOL. I predict in 30-40 years people will reflect on Bush and wonder how anyone could have elected him...twice. Oh wait, they didn't. But you know, still -- how so many damn people could have voted him into office. It shouldn't have even been close, at least not the second time.

[The Reckoning]

bump

[The Reckoning]

John Tyler of course! He was so good he didn't even need to get voted into office (though I guess the same could be said of Dubya).

Ben Franklin was so good that he didnt even need to be president.

[Das Texan]

Pre 20th century:

Polk (acquired more land than any other President among other things)


Modern era (1900 - present)

T. Roosevelt (basically made the world know we were a world power amongst other things)