Why there shouldn't be a CP3/Deron debate

**BRHornet45** · 03-08-2009

I didn't make it. And it's not twisting anything. It's a timeline of their stats month by month. I can't help that Paul's numbers have been in months long decline while Deron's have been steadily rising as he's gotten healthy. That's just what the stats are. And they don't lie.

Paul's numbers in a month long decline??? yet he is still beating Williams in damn near every single stat department AND leading the league in assist, steals, and triple doubles.

**BRHornet45** · 03-08-2009

sons LMAO at ballijuana and his little chicken chart that a Jazz homer made. I can totally see ballijuana sitting in a Mormon church in Utah with 12 other Jazz fans having meetings on how to justify that Williams is the best PG in the NBA despite the fact that Paul's stats are always better every year ....

they are all sitting at the round table and ballijuana offers his opinion ... "hey guys! Williams had .3 more points and .2 more assist than Paul did for 3 weeks straight in February!" with another Jazz fan screaming "yea thats right! ballijuana you are on to something here!!!" ... then another Jazz fan offers his thoughts .... "not to mention guys, Williams skin tone is lighter than Paul's which is ALWAYS a plus here in Utah!" ... and everyone erupts in cheers.

**DUNCANownsKOBE2** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by BRHornet45

"not to mention guys, Williams skin tone is lighter than Paul's which is ALWAYS a plus here in Utah!" ... and everyone erupts in cheers.

It is funny how many white players Utah has.

**balli** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by BRHornet45

not to mention guys, Williams skin tone is lighter than Paul's which is ALWAYS a plus here in Utah!

you BR. That's unnecessary. This isn't about race and I'm not a ing racist. Or a mormon. And you know it. And seriously, I'm not going to be accused of that because of where I live. Asshole.

It is funny how many white players Utah has.

off. As few or as many as anybody else. In case you haven't noticed two thirds of our roster is African American. As are most of our draft picks. Clueless .

**Brickhouse** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by JamStone

Your evidence is faulty.

First of all, Pargo took the last shot in a game with a 9 point difference. Unless that lay-up was going to be worth 9 points, it doesn't matter who takes that last shot in a game that was decided at that point.

Second of all, Paul was being guarded by Bruce Bowen most of that fourth quarter. Deron Williams was being guarded by Derek Fisher for most of that fourth quarter. Fisher is still a decent defender, but this is not the first time Bowen has played great denial defense on a player.

Third, Pargo was shooting ing lights out. A selfish egotistical player would have taken all of Pargo's shots in that fourth quarter. He scored 16 points in that quarter. It would be something different if Pargo missed all of his shots. He didn't. A good point guard keeps milking the hot hand.

Fourth, Okur and Kirilenko made the big three pointers in that Jazz-Lakers game that even allowed the Jazz to have a chance to tie that game back up, not Deron. 1:02 left in the game, down 9, Okur makes a three pointer, Kirilenko makes two three pointers, Okur takes and misses another three pointer, with 4 seconds left mind you. That was the real last shot if you paid attention to the play-by-play. Deron Williams' last shot was off of an offensive rebound scattered play.

still waiting for Ghazi's brilliant analysis in reply...

**Spur-Addict** · 03-08-2009

Pipe?

**DUNCANownsKOBE2** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by ballijuana

off. As few or as many as anybody else. In case you haven't noticed two thirds of our roster is African American. As are most of our draft picks. Clueless .

lol, why are you so defensive about it?

**lil_penny** · 03-08-2009

Maybe stern will read this thread and arrange a utah vs. NO 1st round matchup.... regardless of who we all think is better it would be a very exciting matchup no doubt.

**balli** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by Brickhouse

still waiting for Ghazi's brilliant analysis in reply...

I don't agree with Ghazi about the specific plays or games he brought up in the op, but I do think it's clear, however, that Deron is the more poised and clutch player. I don't watch all that many NOH games, but I've seen and heard enough to know that when the chips are down, Paul's at ude can become problematic for his team.

**balli** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by DUNCANownsKOBE

lol, why are you so defensive about it?

Because it's no small thing to imply that I'm a racist. Or my team. Or to laugh at the suggestion. No permanent offense meant, but I didn't like taking the dog for a walk and coming home to a website that has one dude calling me racist and another dude laughing about it. I'm not a racist and I'm offended by the suggestion. But, whatever, life goes on.

**Pelicans78** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by ballijuana

I don't agree with Ghazi about the specific plays or games he brought up in the op, but I do think it's clear, however, that Deron is the more poised and clutch player. I don't watch all that many NOH games, but I've seen and heard enough to know that when the chips are down, Paul's at ude can become problematic for his team.

If I haven't seen many Hornets game how do you know CP3 isn't clutch late in games. I don't have to give you examples, but you hate on CP3 way more than me or BR45 hating on Williams. The only time I ever mention Williams is when your sorry ass says crap about CP3.

**Pelicans78** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by ballijuana

Because it's no small thing to imply that I'm a racist. Or my team. Or to laugh at the suggestion. No permanent offense meant, but I didn't like taking the dog for a walk and coming home to a website that has one dude calling me racist and another dude laughing about it. I'm not a racist and I'm offended by the suggestion. But, whatever, life goes on.

You might not be a racist but you are very hateful when it comes to CP3. I never have anything bad to say about Williams nor will I ever. But you and Ghazi go out of your way to trash CP3 for whatever reasons.

**balli** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by Hornets78

I don't have to give you examples, but you hate on CP3 way more than me or BR45 hating on Williams.

Originally Posted by balli

But at the same time, I don't watch a lot of Hornets games and I don't like cp3, but I look at his stats sometimes... and damn. There's an equally compelling argument for his camp. His Ast/TO ratio is unreal, I don't know how he gets his Reb numbers, but he does

Originally Posted by balli

I'm not going to say there aren't good arguments for paul. I get it. I understand how the case could be made that he's better. But I'm mystified by the Paul supporters who don't say the same in regards to the arguments for Deron. It's insultingly biased.

**DUNCANownsKOBE2** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by ballijuana

Because it's no small thing to imply that I'm a racist. Or my team. Or to laugh at the suggestion. No permanent offense meant, but I didn't like taking the dog for a walk and coming home to a website that has one dude calling me racist and another dude laughing about it. I'm not a racist and I'm offended by the suggestion. But, whatever, life goes on.

I was laughing at a joke about the Utah Jazz, it had nothing to do with you. Sorry if I offended you in any way.

**Pelicans78** · 03-08-2009

The examples I was talking about was CP3 being clutch late in games. I don't have to give examples to you because I already know. But you know you go out of your way to trash CP3. You take the CP3/Williams debate personally because the Jazz picked Williams. He's been great for the Jazz. I'm not saying its a bad pick. No Hornets fan will ever say it was a bad pick.

**Austin_Toros** · 03-08-2009

Are you trying to say Paul and Williams suck?

**DUNCANownsKOBE2** · 03-08-2009

And if there's any fan base that loves white/Hispanic players and has a weird bias against black players, I hate to say it but it's the Suns.

Phoenix fans go nuts whenever Amundson comes in the game, but unless Shaq scores 30 points and grabs 20 boards, they jump all over him saying trading for him is what killed the Suns.

**Ghazi** · 03-08-2009

Pargo was shooting so lights out that he missed more shots in the last 2 minutes than CP3 attempted in the 4th quarter.

**balli** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by Hornets78

The examples I was talking about was CP3 being clutch late in games.

If you don't want to give me examples fine, I'm not really asking. But like I said, I've seen enough of his bad at ude myself that I believe the analysts who say he has a tendency to occasionally take his team out of games by ing, moaning and tussling with the refs and his coach. I don't say it because I hate paul. I say it because I believe there's a legitimate debate over 8 & 3 and whether it's actually true or not, I don't watch enough NOH to say, those whispers are out there. And you know it. So don't pretend like I'm the first person to ever float the theory that Paul's at ude can be problematic. If he's clutch, cool, but so's Deron. And for me it's not really a question of who's more clutch, it's a question of who folds when things are going poorly. And what effect that has on the team as a whole.

But you know you go out of your way to trash CP3.

No I don't. If that was the case I'd be starting these threads. I debate the merits of each pg when the conversation comes up. And as I proved, I'm more than capable of complimenting Paul.

You take the CP3/Williams debate personally because the Jazz picked Williams.

Personally? I consequentially care about it more, sure. Who wouldn't? Are you telling me that you're somehow unbiased as a hornets fan, but I'm biased because I'm a Jazz fan?

**NIH** · 03-08-2009

I don't see the problem here, Jazz are happy with Williams and Hornets fans are happy with Paul. It's Milwaukee and Atlanta we should be laughing at.

**balli** · 03-08-2009

Originally Posted by DUNCANownsKOBE

I was laughing at a joke about the Utah Jazz, it had nothing to do with you. Sorry if I offended you in any way.

It's all good, sorry about the defensive hostility.

Originally Posted by NIH

It's Milwaukee and Atlanta we should be laughing at.

True that.

**Ghazi** · 03-08-2009

Bottom line:

There is no way the best PG in the game thinks this guy should shoot a ton of shots in the 4th quarter of a crucial game 7.

But Paul did think that, and thus is not the best PG in the game.

Right then and there we should've learned that Paul doesn't have a winner's mentality.

The same mentality that compelled him to punch Julius HOdge in the nuts.

The same mentality that compels him to flop and whine all over the court

The same mentality that compels him to choke a 2 game lead over the Lakers on the #1 seed, with 7 left to play. And the same mentality that allows the Hornets to fall behind by 30 with the #1 seed on the line last year v the Lakers

The same mentality that allowed 2nd seeded Wake Forest to lose in the 2nd round of the NCAA Tournament.

The SAME mentality that allowed the Hornets to blow a 2-0 lead against the Spurs, and then choke a Game 7 on their home court with Paul deferring to Jannero mutha in Pargo.

That's enough evidence for me, stats that vary on the rest of the roster and the teams' systems and are inflated by the league's marketing schemes.

Again nothing personal against Chris Paul, he's just overrated.