Manu
Dirk
Manu all the way hobags, ing Dirk sucks ass like Tony Parker.
Manu >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the rest.
/thread
Manu plays like a 1 when he's playing, but the best player on a team is expected to play big minutes night in and out and score 20 every night playing 38 mpg+. His type of game would never allow that. You have to take that into consideration when saying Manu is a franchise player.
Still, Manu is the man and has the hardware. Only in a forum discussion does Dirk have the upper hand.
Not true. Go take a look at '05 video. Every game of the playoffs. With under 3 mins to go, give the ball to Ginobili, TP GTFO, and TD wait under the basket until further notice. ISO at the top of the key with a pick from Nazr. Penetration and dunk/layup/dish to bowen/handout to Tim.
Mike D'Antoni is still trying to figure out how to stop it.
I think you massively overrate Dirk, and underrate Manu.
I never claimed he's a franchise player.
Manu Ginobili would not have life nearly as easy w/o Tim Duncan.
In his prime, he could torch anybody. And I mean anybody. The difference, I think, is that Manu knows also how to take full advantage of another attention gatherer like Duncan. And that's one if his better qualities. His BB IQ as a complete team player is phenomenal. He knows when he needs to be the man, and he knows when it's better to get the team involved.
Obviously, stuff like that doesn't show in the stat sheet, so people tend to underrate him.
He's a very good player. Deserved that All Star selection too. Dirk is still decisively better.
Dude, how can you prove that? Maybe they would maybe they wouldn't but stop using assumptions to argue. Manu has three NBA rings playing with Duncan, Manu has won everywhere he played, Manu lead his NT to the gold medal beating a US team that had Duncan, Iverson, Kidd, Lebron James, Dwyane Wade, etc. and also Manu owns the head to head on international matches against Dirk, these aren't inventions these things actually happened in real life.
If you think Dirk at his prime was better than Manu at his prime cool, I don't think that is the case but I accept that that could be easily true. But dude if you think that Dirk is way way better than Manu, to the point that can't even be arguable, then you don't trully know how great Manu is and you have only saw him playing on the NBA.
Manu in a landslide.
Anyhow, agree to disagree. I'm surprised nobody played the 'soft' card on Dirk yet...
Benefactor is right. You're talking about basically minor league basketball and FIBA play, which should merit no consideration. And it's not really arguable that Manu is better than Dirk in their prime, because 30 out of 30 coaches and GMs would disagree with you.
Since you all love pretending let's pretend.
Put Dirk on the Spurs at age 24 like Manu when he got to the NBA playing behind Duncan and Robinson, let's pretend they would have still defetead LA in 2003 and then go onto win at least two of the next 4 championships. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't have developed the way he did on the Mavs. At best He would be now considered a great sidekick to one of the greatest of all-time and depending on the season he would be a bordeline all-star.
Now put Manu on the NBA at age 20 (so he has time to develop on the league and doesn't waste two of his best years adapting as a rookie and a sophemore) on team where he could be the man. I'm sure that with time he would lead a team pretty far into the playoffs ('cause that what he does, sooner or later he will win) maybe don't win it all but deep enough to be considered a bonafide franchise player.
Who do you think most NBA fans would select as the better player?
I'll be generous and say Manu is as good as Joe Johnson. In which case, he could win a playoff series in the East and make the playoffs in the West as a #1 guy. Dirk has a Western Conference le. Sorry, Dirk is a top 10 guy, Manu is a top 30 guy. If Manu had been put on ty lottery team at the age of 21 without the benefit of playing alongside Tim Duncan and Tony Parker and for the best coach in the league, I'm not sure he even makes it to Top 30 status.
Overwhelmingly Dirk.Who do you think most NBA fans would select as the better player?
The Mavs have never been a ty team like the Spurs acted as in the 96-97 season, and predictably they got the No.1 pick that year which turned to be Tim Duncan on the draft night.
Homer take #3
Okay, the homerism is getting ridiculous. First off, if you pop in the 2005 video, you'd see Duncan taking on both Wallaces and besting them in the 4 wins. Remember, at the time, this was one of the most feared duos defensively. Duncan was an absolute monster on two bad ankles.
Second, Gino isn't a second banana anymore, Parker is. Gino has special qualities for sure, but Parker in his prime has one piece of NBA hardware that Gino doesn't have, a Finals MVP.
Third, Dirk is far and away a superior player than Gino because, as fun and great as Gino was, there were other wing players as good or better. Gino was a winner, but if TMac, Kobe, VC, Lebron or even Wade were in his place, I'd imagine that Spurs would be just as successful.
However, name me another big man that could play alongside Duncan and be as good as Dirk. KG, Rasheed and maybe the Pau Gasol we've been seeing the past two years. Dirk would be much harder to replace than Gino.
At this point, Manu is a glorified role player. Parker's been the second best player on the team for a while now.
While I don't agree with it, some have argued Parker is the best player on the Spurs right now.
Good lawd, you freaking homers are ridiculous. Even the Parker homers are willing to concede that Dirk on this team would be better than TP.
It's not rocket science. Dirk is arguably the greatest shooting PF of all time. Bird is the only one that could even be considered better. If you take him and put him next to one of the greatest post players of all time you get a ton of championships...especially a player like Duncan whose game matches up perfectly with shooting bigs. And stop it with the "that's just an assumption, you don't know that for sure" garbage. It's a cop out and makes sound even more like a homer. News flash....every single bit of NBA recruiting is based on assumption. The Lakers trade for Gasol because they assume that putting him next to Kobe will get them les. The Spurs draft Tim Duncan because it's safe to assume that he has the potential to be a franchise player. If you put Dirk and Duncan on the same front line you will get a bunch of damn championships. Only a dumbass or completely blind, biased fans like yourselves would think otherwise.
And what a good night it was
You're a dumbass.
Only reason to take Dirk is for pure offense. A good reason.. however Manu gives you offense from a diff. perspective, the slashing, driving, passing and pull up 3's. Yes, Dirk can do some of that too but Manu's style of play when healthy really keeps the defense off balance. Dirk is not a traditional big, so he can't bang and won't block shots. Besides Manu has more cajones and is more clutch than Dirk. **choker**
I have to admit the conclusion is still lightyears away from the debate on whose career is better between Dirk and Manu, as it's truely a hard job to define how much a ring weighs, but you can only embarrass yourself to claim Manu a better player (which means more talented) than Dirk when it comes to the abilities of the two individuals. Dirk is even more skillful than most guards in NBA league in shooting, dribbling and assisting, and if you are asked to name another guy with both his size and skills as great as Dirks, you will have to go back to the 1980s for Larry Bird, even if Dirk is by a hair less great than Bird. Manu just fits in a system that also fits him well, his skills are unarguably more than decent but such skills aren't so amazing for a 6'7 guard as for a guy in Dirk's size. And Manu doesn't have any advantage in basetball IQ either, at most the prime Manu is just Josh Howard with a slightly higher basketball IQ.
If Dirk is a choker, then so is Manu. Real clutch play here from Manu:
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