I can't agree with you entirely. He's not suppose to be rebounding. You can't rebound when your on the perimeter. His defense isn't great, but I can't say its worse than bonner or RJ. Roger isn't suppose to be better than Tim, Manu, Tony, or Rj, and I think he probably is better than bonner.
However, I would definitely explore the marketplace before spending the MLE on Mason. I'm sure their are better alternatives.
His defense is worse than Bonner's and RJ's and he is not by any means a better player than Bonner. Consider Bonner's contract, that's what Mason will be looking for. I doubt any other team throws the MLE at him but who knows, the Grizz are always there to make a stupid move.
Give him Finley's money next year.
I would hope they don't waste MLE-level money on Roger Mason. If he gets any offer from the Spurs, it will probably be less than he makes now.
Restate that! Bonner is by know means a better player than mason!!! Bonner does one thing well, shoot three pointers. Roger is more versatile. He can take is man off the dribble and drive. He can hit the three-ball, he can create his own shot and he can be an emergency pg (not that he belongs their by any means). Matt Bonner is a black hole. He is useless if he's not shooting three's.
I don't see Roger Mason leaving San Antonio because he has found a home here and is getting enough minutes for him to contribute. In my opinion not too many teams will try and over pay for him because like others said he is just a jump shooter, maybe a great jump shooter but just a jump shooter.
I can't believe anyone would be stating this to begrudge Bonner and defend Mason.Truly unbelievable.
I'm not begrudging anyone. I'm stating facts. Bonner terrible at everything but three's. Mason's more versitile. However, I wouldn't give either of them the full MLE.
Of course you can rebound on the perimeter. Jason Kidd has made a Hall of Fame career out of it. For comparison's sake, let's look at other Spurs players' per 36 minute career rebounding rate.
George Hill - 4.0
Manu Ginobili - 5.2
Richard Jefferson - 5.3
Tony Parker - 3.4
Roger Mason - 3.3
This is why I consider Mason a poor rebounder.
As a defender, I consider Mason to be the poorest on the team. I base this on his adjusted plus/minus defensive rating which you can see for yourself at basketballvalue.com. I've made the argument many times on this site that Bonner is an average NBA defender for his position but because he's an unathletic white guy, he's constantly underrated. RJ is actually a much-improved defender this year but we'll have to wait and see if it holds up in the long run.
Finally, I don't see any way you can consider Mason a better player than Bonner. I've already mentioned the defense. On top of that, per 36 minutes Bonner is averaging more points, rebounds, and less turnovers this year. Bonner is shooting .451 from 3 compared to Mason's .349 (below his career average but he's never been as accurate as Bonner) and factor in the value Bonner brings to the rest of the offense by drawing an opposing big out to the perimeter to open up the paint for Tim and Tony and there is really no comparison. Mason is making almost $3.8M this year and Bonner only $3.2M and I'd be surprised to see Mason on the Spurs next year if he expects any sort of pay raise.
Both are useless if they're not hitting the 3.Both are pretty one-dimensional role players, both are on similar contracts and on about as much as they deserve and would ever get.
Anyway, this thread is not about comparing Bonner to Mason but about how much would it cost to keep Mason. My guess is the Spurs wouldn't top 10mil over 3 years if they make him an offer at all in the summer and I also don't expect any team to throw more money his way unless he plays really well in the playoffs.
I am not defending Matt Bonner here but he has improved his game tremendously. He is able to set a good screen that leads to the 16-18 foot jumper, and he nails them well. His 3 point shot is also respected enough that his shot fakes work most of the time and can dribble a bit, granted it looks sloppy. He also now has that sweet high arching hook which works sometimes. There is no use bashing Bonner cause he is not the same Bonner as last season.
I agree. I don't think it will come to that. I expect him gone in February. I think the better he does from now until then will only increase his trade value. The spurs have very few tradeable assets at this point that will interest teams. I don't think Pop will get rid of Bonner at this point.
your going to tell me finleys a better defender? oh man this is crazy finley just broke his ankle trying to slow down when he was running too fast, he guards no one and only wants to shoot
I thought I said it wasn't his JOB to rebound. Of course he can rebound. Secondly, your comparing apples with oranges. You put Bonner on the perimeter guarding shooters and he will be lit up like a white christmas tree. They play two separate positions. As far as his three point shooting goes, he's a better shooter, but lousier in the clutch. But, I don't expect it to be an issue because he will probably be traded.
Finley was definitely a better defender than Mason in the series against the Mavs last playoffs.
I'm not sure why so many Spurs fans erase from their minds how atrocious Mason was in the post season. I guess it's because everyone else on the team played poorly as well. Mason didn't even try to play D, he was immobile.
like some of the guys mentioned above ^ once next year rolls around finley better be gone, and we can use that money for mase! that will take care of everything. i like mason because he at least shows passion and heart out there, even though hes not a great defender he hustles to his man better than parker and finley. im not just talking crap here if you want to talk about suck ass D lets talk parker and finley because thats crap too
to keep the payroll next season to be like this, either finley moves and mason get his money, ginoboli earning less then what his on currently....
bonner is gone anyway....who else is expiring?
Way too early to talk about this..
Mason looks improved over last year..his D is better and his passing is significantly better..like Kori said though, he looked really bad in the playoffs, so that's how he'll be judged again this season..
I consider Finley to be a slightly better defender than Mason. I consider the defensive abilities to be ranked as follows:
1. Sack of potatoes
2. Mike Finley
3. Roger Mason
4. Brick mailbox
I think Bonner is better than Mason as well, but I don't like how you're using his adjusted defensive ratings against him for this year, but ignoring that he had a better rating than some of our main guys last year, including significantly better than Finley..
all of a sudden matt bonner is a fan favourite, ship his ass if the right deal comes along
Agreed. He seems to have broken out of his slump but the playoffs are where he will be made or broke. Hopefully he continues to play at a high level as we really need his shooting off the bench.
If Mason does perform well in the playoffs, I think this still applies. He has already stated that one of the reasons he signed the contract he did is so that he can get in on the 2010 free agency rush. I pretty sure that some team that loses out will overpay him and he will be gone...as the Spurs are not going to offer him much more than he is making now.
That would be typical nba role player scenario. Perform well. Help win championship. Get overpaid for the rest of their career.
Happens all the time. I just hope he can help the team win another championship. What happens after that...Meh.
Last year and the first 3 weeks of the season I would agree that Mason does not have defensive chops, but the last month has been different. He is moving his feet now and not causing silly fouls. I think his defense has really improved and he is getting better.
Add in the fact that his ball handling skills and # of assists improvement, and you have a very solid clutch player. He should remain a Spur.
If Mason wants to stay and the Spurs make a reasonable offer, there is a good chance he stays. This guy is truly a money manager and runs his own businesses. Construction, if I remember correctly. So hopefully, max dollars is not his prime motivator, but who knows?
Mason and MLE? Mason 6-8 million?? jesus, Isiah Thomas would be shocked about such ideas.
Mason is overpayed at the 3.8 he get's right now. (Spurs overpayed to outbid Miami in 2008 to get him).
and this doesn't mean that I don't want Masons (or a player like him) on the roster. but I also want at least 3 wings, who are significantly better than him, best case 4.
to burn 4 or 5 million for his one trick means you can't use this money for a player, who has two or three tricks. IMO Mason is a LLE player at best. if Spurs need to outbid a LLE type offer to keep him (let's say up to 5 million for 2 years) it's ok. if he get's more than that elsewhere, let him go.
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