Hollinger's greatest shooters of all time article

[poop]

seriously, House doesnt even belong in this conversation

[cobbler]

who cares, nobody hits them all, plus he was already on the decline big time.
anyone who watched him in the playoffs during the '90's, knows what im talking about. ive never seen ANYONE do what he did consistently

Just messing with ya. He's a UCLA boy. Can never hate on them.

[poop]

everyone knew when it was MILLER TIME !!!!

[cobbler]

seriously, House doesnt even belong in this conversation

Hollingers whole article is BS. His minimum requirements alone remove some of the greatest shooters of all time.

[ezau]

Miller was amazing during the 90s. You think he's not going to make it because of his awkward-looking shots, but he does. Peja meanwhile was an unbelievable shooter during his prime in Sacramento.

[mogrovejo]

And what is the criteria for the contested level?

Wide-open - no serious attempt to close-out, fastbreaks
Open - half hearted run out to the shooter, single hand raised, staying on ground
Contested - both hands high with the defender on the ground, shot-blocking hand raised to the shooters face
Heavily contested - defender rises up with the shooter w/ both hands outstretched, double-teams

House is just a streak shooter in every sense. He has nights where he could hit shots over centers, and he has nights where he misses no matter how open he is.

Yes, but his streakiness is not night-by-night; he goes hot/cold for longer periods - hits everything in a month, doesn't hit any in the following 2 weeks, etc.

[Goran Dragic]

Yes, but his streakiness is not night-by-night; he goes hot/cold for longer periods - hits everything in a month, doesn't hit any in the following 2 weeks, etc.

that's def. true. Sums up his one season with the Suns perfectly.

[poop]

you know when your team is down a couple possessions with seconds left, and you think 'we can still win...they just have to run down and hit a 3..then steal it and hit another 3 real quick, etc..etc..' ....well, reggie miller ACTUALLY DID that,by himself in a playoff game

[Goran Dragic]

And yeah, the argument about the rest doesn't matter. The indisputable thing that shows Hollingers' system is re ed is that Reggie is #1, Ray Allen is a close 2nd, and everyone is way behind them.

[cobbler]

Wide-open - no serious attempt to close-out, fastbreaks
Open - half hearted run out to the shooter, single hand raised, staying on ground
Contested - both hands high with the defender on the ground, shot-blocking hand raised to the shooters face
Heavily contested - defender rises up with the shooter w/ both hands outstretched, double-teams
.

Kinda subjective. Nothing for double and triple teams?

.... but clearly proves your point between House and Peja if taken correctly.

[mogrovejo]

Kinda subjective. Nothing for double and triple teams?

.... but clearly proves your point between House and Peja if taken correctly.

Charting games is always subjective to some extent. Even filling a boxscore can be, let alone evaluating the contestedness level of a shot.

Double-teams are there, in level 4. Triple teams are included in that one, as well.

Btw, I feel most fans grossly underrate the importance of contesting shots.

[Mr Bones]

If Nash is in fact one of the greatest shooters of all time (and I agree he is), it just proves once again that defense wins championships.

[L.I.T]

Eh...whether he tried to take into account by creating CSR I still think guys today have more space to get a shot off than players during the 90s. The rules of today create that space.

Which is why, for me, Miller >> Nash as a shooter. Miller was constantly getting bodied up while shooting.

Nash no doubt though is one of the more underrated shooters in NBA history; but the best ever? Not close.

[mogrovejo]

Miller was a better cutter than shooter. He was great getting looks. Cutting is an under-appreciated skill.

[monosylab1k]

I remember him missing the rim on a wide open conference-winning shot.

Does one shot make a career? All I can say in that regard is that at least Peja had a big shot to take. Mark Price had exactly .

[ambchang]

Actually he acknowledges those factors but it does seem like a simplistic stat:

"From there, I set about creating a formula to rank the best shooters. I thought I'd have to dream up something very complex to adjust for all the variables involved, but it turned out a simple formula worked far better than any of my more exotic concoctions. I simply added a player's 2-point, 3-point and free throw percentages. We'll call this "Combined Shooting Rating," or CSR for short.

CSR works for a few reasons. First, the free throw is a pretty fair arbiter of shooting ability. It's the only true apples-to-apples measurement we have, because it's always 15 feet from the hoop and unguarded, regardless of what system the team runs or how the player is used. It's only one shot among many that need to be in a player's arsenal, but it's an important one.

Second, the yin and yang of 2-point and 3-point ability balance each other out. Some players are more effective midrange shooters than long-range marksmen, while others are more comfortable bombing away. And using this method makes the system more fair to players from the 1980s and early '90s, when teams didn't utilize the 3 as often or as effectively."

How does simply adding up FT%, FG% and 3P% make it fair to the players from the 80s and 90s? Shouldn't each player have their FG% and 3P% adjusted to that particular year instead? FT% should always stay constant, as 15 feet is 15 feet.

[endrity]

Does one shot make a career? All I can say in that regard is that at least Peja had a big shot to take. Mark Price had exactly .

It's all about selective memory Mono, same as with Dirk. I remember Peja hitting countless clutch shots, in the NBA and the Euro and World Championships he led Yugoslavia to. He made an amazing 3pt plus the foul to tie the game against Minny in the 04 playoffs which was just sick. I think it's still around in youtube somewhere.

But when he missed that one jumper against the Lakers, that's all it took for people to label him with the stereotype of the "soft, choker, European", which is what everyone was always ready to label him as. Just as with Dirk, it doesn't matter how many clutch shots he's made, how many games he has won, how he has been one of the best 4th quarter scorers for years now in the league (I think he is second after Bron this year). As soon as he misses one, there it is, he is a choker again.

[313]

Bump?

[DAF86]

Finally, two young players on the Golden State Warriors have established a great chance of finishing their careers near the top of this list. Rookie Stephen Curry is at 1.770 thus far in his brief career, and should that number hold up, he'll finish his career in the top 10. Since players' shooting often improves dramatically in their second through fifth seasons, he could finish as one of the top-ranked players of all time.

Godlinger

[DMC]

I'm not saying he could or that he will I'm just saying you haven't shown that he won't - spurrollinger21

[DAF86]

I'm not saying he could or that he will I'm just saying you haven't shown that he won't - spurrollinger21

He was literally saying that he could.