It arguable. I'm not going to complain if someone wants to put Kareem above Kobe.
But Shaq above Kobe? No ing way! Kobe has definitely had the better career as a Lakers player.
For what it's worth, Kobe's career in LA isn't over, but Shaq's is. No matter how they are ranked now, Kobe may move up and Shaq may move down when it's all said and done.
Make it a top 10, then you can add Mikan and Worthy, then argue about who else joins up. Gail Goodrich? Derek Fisher? Michael Cooper?
Probably the realest article you will ever read on the subject..here's a sampling:
"Later that night, Magic told me Kobe is now his equal, although not yet his superior.
"The great thing about the Lakers is that we judge by championships,'' said Magic, who -- along with Kareem, Kobe and crucial role player Derek Fisher -- has won a handful of rings with the Lakers. "So when Kobe gets that next one, then he'll be The Man; he'll be the greatest Laker. And I'll have no problem giving him that.''
In my heart, I agree with Magic, the starting point guard on my all-time first five. But when I judge Magic by the same standard that everyone in the post-MJ period is judged by, I have to, albeit grudgingly, put Kobe atop the Lakers pantheon."
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playof...ge=kobe-100618
You forgot one thing: Chamberlain is not only not a PF, he can't even be reasonably placed there, like Russell. He, like Abdul-Jabbar, O'Neal, etc. is strictly a C, plain and simple. So by moving him to PF just to make the Lakers all-time lineup look better, you come off as nothing more than a homer with little to no credibility.
If you were being honest, you'd have put Gasol on the first team, which would change the entire dynamic of the hypothetical match-up, because if we're to consider each player at their best, prime Duncan would annihilate Gasol.
I love how Lakers fans continue to arrogantly pretend as if they've had all these great players based solely on merit, as if there weren't other factors at work (namely where they're located) that played a major part in them having had the depth of great players they've had.
Lol. Quit rewriting history so it falls in line with your guard infatuation. You were alive to witness it, and everyone considered those early 80s Lakers teams Kareem's. You know this.
Key word here is early.
From 80-84, those teams were unmistakably Kareem's. The torch was officially passed when Magic nailed that hook shot to bury Boston. Granted, Kareem was the Finals MVP, but Magic had a better overall playoffs and created what is perhaps the defining moment of the Lakers franchise.
In before Lakaluva cites the breakout game against Philly in the 80 Finals when Kareem went down with an injury.
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You know Showtime didn't officially began until Worthy arrived, which gave the Lakers a PF who could run the floor like no other. Check Magic's assist numbers before and after Worthy. He never even averaged 10 assists per game until Worthy got there. Why? Because they didn't break as much and played more of a half-court oriented game that was built around Kareem.
I know you hate big men and prefer the flash and marketing appeal of guards, but while this history can be rewritten, it can't be disproven. Even if you were to ask Magic himself, he would agree.
Why do you insist on using anecdotal quotes as some kind of evidence? Players often get caught up in the moment and gush with praise when it's really not justified. Besides, Erving vs. Kareem was arguably the second biggest player rivalry of all-time behind Bird vs. Magic, so there's a strong possibility that Dr. J made those comments as a subtle dig at Kareem.
Also worth mentioning is that Kareem's combined playoff stats were a notch better than Magic's that year.
Lol. No he didn't. Lern2BasketballReference. Magic averaged 9.5 the year before Worthy got there. In Worthy's rookie season, Magic finally had his first 10 assist per game season.
And you don't think Magic's assists were hampered by Kareem dominating the ball more in those years than in the year's to come?
Over the years, Magic has become inextricably linked with Showtime, so of course it makes a snazzy le for the introduction to his article.
But an article written in hindsight doesn't do much in strengthening your case. If Magic was truly the leader of the Lakers in those early years, how in the did the Lakers still go 54-28 in 80-81 when Magic missed half the season? They went 60-22 the year prior. I'd be willing to bet the 80-81 Lakers don't break 45 wins if Kareem were to miss that many games.
Rounding?
Who are you, Allanon?
Sorry, but they don't "round up" when logging NBA statistics. Not the way it works.
Boom, headshot:
By the 1984–85 season, the Lakers' so-called "Showtime"[1] era was in full swing. Showtime was a fast-paced style of basketball, described as a mix of "no-look passes off the fastbreak, pin-point alley-oops from halfcourt, spinning feeds and overhand bullets under the basket through triple teams."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History...Angeles_Lakers
Luva, I grew up here during that time, and the media didn't start throwing around the "Showtime" label until the mid-80s. They weren't as flashy and as fast breaking in the earlier years. They still had some flash, because of Magic, but it was nothing compared to later years. I'll say it again: You know this.
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In 78, Kareem missed 20 games, and the next year, Adrian Dantley, arguably the Lakers second best player, missed 22 games.
And what does Magic leading the Lakers to the Finals with Divac as a center really prove? We know Magic is a top 5 player off all time, so it stands to reason he'd be able to do such. On the other side of the coin, Kareem WON an NBA le with a past his prime Oscar Robertson as the 2nd option. So they're equal in that regard of being able to lead without each other.
Read the book Winnin' Times. It do ents the situation with a lot more depth than the simple story of "Magic ran Westhead out" we've all come to believe as fact.
Fact is, Buss wanted Westhead gone. The Lakers team as whole didn't like Westhead, but Magic was the only one to publicly speak out about it.
Another myth eviscerated by the blade of truth.
Jerry Buss.
As a Laker, Kobe > KAJ
Careerwise regardless of what they did on LA, KAJ > anyone not named Michael Jordan
I guess. Kareem did win an NBA le without Magic, while Magic couldn't win one without Kareem. It's why Kareem tops Magic on most all-time lists.
Anyhow, we'll go in circles all day with this. I'm fully aware of the bias you have toward big men, mainly due to the fact that you used to play guard. Naturally, you identify with them. , I don't think I've ever seen you talk nice about a big man on here. So how can I expect you to give a big man credit when a flashy guard of similar skill level is on the same team?
I mean, Gasol could average 40 and 20 next year and you'd still claim Kobe's the better player.
Everyone thinks they're a leader and not a follower. You ask Koriwhat with his male secretary position if he's a leader or a follower, and he'll claim the former.
Or ask Koolaid_Man with the way he has his nose up your ass and tries to copy everything you do if he's a leader or a follower, and he'll claim the former.
Magic's quote doesn't prove anything.
nice list but if I had to rank it
1 Magic
2 Kareem
3 Kobe
4 Logo
5 Shaq
Not necessarily referring to Gasol, but you remain steadfast in your conviction that the 3 peat Lakers were Kobe's team when all the evidence, both empirical and anecdotal, says otherwise. Maybe you don't like the way Shaq left LA, but that doesn't disprove the fact that Shaq was clearly the best player on the Lakers in those years.
I remember all you Laker fans on the message boards back then, "How you gonna stop Shaq?" "Shaq's the greatest big man ever." "Wait until Shaq comes back, motivated." You guys were talking up Shaq like he was the most transcendent talent to ever step foot on the hardwood. Yeah, you guys were talking up Kobe, as well, but it was mostly in threads comparing him to Tracy McGrady and Vince Carter.
According to Kobe-fan, the game only lasts 6 min (the last half of the 4th), and since Kobe was the first option during that time due to his ability to make free throws while still being a scoring threat, he was the true leader of the Lakers.it's downright shameful the way laker fan throws shaq under the bus. he's a greater laker than kobe, at least during his more brief stay
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