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I probably would too.
But that has nothing to do with anything, because you could also say the same for D-Will or Chris Paul or Derrick Rose. You would, don't deny it.
It is maybe legitimately arguable, there's no doubt he's great and he's very good defensively too. But when an interviewer asks you if you're the best, and you respond "Yes, I do" so assuredly when Chris Paul and Deron Williams exist...is just a complete slap in the face to those players.
Don't give me that "winner" crap...he's not a proven individual winner my friend. No.He's a winner. There are damn few of those in this league.
Right now. This minute, I'd trade any one player off our roster for him/sans Kobe.
He is a Celtic. He is no more winner than D-Will. If Deron Williams is on the Celtics, they lose maybe 5 games all year long. And then sweep the playoffs entirely including the finals.
I probably would too.
But that has nothing to do with anything, because you could also say the same for D-Will or Chris Paul or Derrick Rose. You would, don't deny it.
I find that odd, because as has been shown, Rondo seems to get the assists on offense even on plays where he didn't touch the ball, or made the 3rd to last pass to the guy that scored.
You're inconsolable over this Rondo, fellow, Al. It's personal with you.
You're never this outlandish otherwise.
Not for Williams or Paul. I don't buy those two, at all.
Rose, I would admittedly consider it.
Giuseppe, question for ya. When the Miami Heat win a championship sometime in the next 3-4 years, will you also claim LeBron a winner? I wouldn't, for obvious reasons.
Mostly likely I'd have to, Al. In order for them to ring, James will have to go to the place where all champions go in order to ring. He won't ring at the level he's played at to this point.
Thats stupid, tbh.
Well given if you're not trading Kobe for Rondo, you're going to have to give up Pau most likely. You're going to need offense, not just passing and never shooting. Is Rondo only going to pass to Kobe and average 13 assists there as well? Perhaps...but the Lakers would lose almost every game because a Laker team without Pau, given how much Kobe chucks...it would take probably 40 FGA per game from Mamba for Rondo to keep those averages up.
You would be much better off with a guy like CP3 or Deron Williams, who can do everything Rondo does while scoring a lot as well.
I won't hesitate to admit I do not like the Celtics. I respect the out of essentially all of their players, and I'm clearly arguing against their at udes in this thread.
To summarize and restate, when you are Rajon Rondo and Chris Paul and Deron Williams exist, you don't claim yourself to be the best PG in the league so assuredly.
Even Kobe Bryant might not do something like that when asked who is the best player in the league, all around. He might say he's the best one on one player, but I'm not sure he would respond:
"Me, next question, on to the next one. KD & Bron don't have over me."
I certainly would take either over Kobe at this point, but this is another one of those margin of error cases. None of those are miles ahead than the other.
If you interpret "winner" in the literal sense, you're right.
But I don't think Giuseppe meant it in the literal sense when describing Rondo. If he did, that would be equally stupid in this argument, since he said he'd take Rondo partially because he's a winner (literally a championship winner). Nazr Mohammed is a winner as well in this sense.
Oh well in that case, I agree with you.
Rondo could probably be a much better scorer if he had to be. He just has more capable offensive weapons at his disposal.
In any other pertinent category, he is the most efficient PG in the league. His abilty to not be hindered by his limitations just makes him more effective.
Paul and Williams have their flaws as well.
Wrecker/goods/precise style.
Probably the best point guard that is a zero scoring threat to ever play the game. That being said. There are many (at least 4) PGs in the NBA right now that are better.
But, none of those have rang.
Ah the "put him on another team" card being used here. Yes Rondo has flaws. Yes he isn't the best pg in the league. I bet Rondo would be successful anywhere else. The guy isn't a scrub and he isn't "all hype". He is a damn good pg. It helps that he doesn't have as much pressure, but the guy is talented. I can't believe you are denying that.No he's not. He's hype and of course he himself thinks he is
As already said, put him on another team and see how he does/sucks.
This is almost as funny as the other spurs fan who shat all over Perkins considering he is better than any other spurs big outside of Duncan.
Bukefail should stick to making game threads tbh.
Not really saying a whole bunch there tbh. Perkins is a tough, physical, defender, but pretty limited offensively. I do like him as a player though.
LOTS of Rondo butthurt on this forum.
I'm trying to understand your reasoning, Culburn. Dwyane Wade carried his team to a championship, and you're not sure he's a winner. Rondo won a Championship as the fourth best player (i.e., a role player) on his team, but he's a winner?
I have no empiricals to bear out my reasoning twixt the two.
The '06 ring by Wade and Miami is a difficult one to stomach, but, I have to because it's my religion, so I don't & I won't qualify it, but, it does shade my judgment as to the worthyness of Wade. I need desperately to see Wade win another before I'll let him go in peace. I don't need that with Rondo. One was enough. His behavior in Game 7 when all was lost on that final three from the corner was astounding. Bryant there did not believe in Rondo and ran to Allen. It was a seminal moment.
Rondo will become lost in the game. Wade is still enamored watching it.
So, let me get this straight: the fact that Rondo made one 3-pointer after Kobe left him is enough to declare Rondo a winner? You do know that Kobe left him because nobody on the Lakers respected his shot? You do know that the Lakers dared Rondo to hit jumpshots the entire series, and Rondo failed to make them pay, right?
So, you are saying that Rondo is a winner because he hits one 3-pointer? That's what makes him better than Paul and Williams?
Dwyane Wade carried his team to a championship--something Rondo has never done--but Rondo is a winner because he hit a 3-pointer when down five? Using that logic, isn't Derek Fisher even better? Fisher has made many big shots on on championship teams. Fisher has won five rings as a role player and Rondo has won one, so isn't Fisher the best point guard in the NBA?
You're being purposefully unreasonable, Red. Why, I don't know. I try and have a candid conversation with you about this in a civilized manner and you put words in my mouth and insitutute Fish into the conversation.
That ain't right, Red.
I'm not putting words in your mouth. You have misunderstood my point. I am comparing Fisher and Rondo. I am, not you. I am comparing them so I can ask you a question.
That question is as follows:
If both Rondo and Fisher have hit big shots, and if Rondo and Fisher have won championships as role players, why--using the reasoning you have used in this thread--isn't Fisher the best point guard in the NBA?
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