Thunder: Not worried here

[Kai]

It will come down to OKC and SA again, IMO.

[smaka]

Worried or not, Spurs>Thunder

[lakerhaterade]

Spurs are currently a better team than the Thunder. It remains to be seen in the long run if Kmart can be integrated into the lineup but I strongly believe he will fit in decently, just not to the magnitude of the uber effect given by Harden.

Still, ATM, Spurs > Thunder

[lakerhaterade]

I believe you're wrong. OKC is a different team without Harden, but they aren't any worse. I truly believe that. People look at Harden's two games in Houston and make individual comparisons to him and Martin. Of course Harden is the superior player overall, but in OKC's system, he's no more effective than Martin will be.

atm, OKC is a worse team without Harden.

I don't even know whether to take the rest of this post seriously or to just toy with you tbh.

[Richie]

Well, yes, but this isn't a Martin for Harden swap where Martin is expected to go in and do exactly what Harden did. He can't and won't. But he can provide the same scoring output as Harden would have. It's just that the adjustments will have to be made. The dynamic of the team is different now, lineups will change, but with the players they have I believe they are potentially just as good, if not better.

Martin can replace Hardens points per game, no question. The problem is that for OKC he was so much more than just scoring. He is far and away a better defender than Martin, he was your 4th quarter playmaker, and he was every bit as clutch as Durant IMO.

Maybe Martin will be able to replicate some of Hardens clutch play, he's never had the pressure of a serious contender so we will wait and see, but he will never be the defender or playmaker Harden was.

Offensively I think the Thunder will be around the same level, maybe a little worse, but defensively I think you will be really lacking. To keep that offence ticking over though, Martin has to play and even if you play Durant at the 4 with Sefelosha to bolster your defence next to Westbrook and Martin, I just don't see you being able to get the stops to win the west.

[thunderfan]

atm, OKC is a worse team without Harden.

I don't even know whether to take the rest of this post seriously or to just toy with you tbh.

Martin needs to come in and give OKC 14-18 ppg...He can and will do that. THat's all James Harden did and ever was going to do in OKC. OKC doesn't need a Harden throwing up big numbers. Houston does. OKC doesn't need Kevin Martin throwing up big numbers. Houston did. THe offensive motor in OKC is KD and RW, period, end of story. That's the situation and the reality. That's why Harden wasn't worth a max contract given the situation and dynamics of the team. Martin is a different player than Harden, but the desired end result is the key here.

[benefactor]

Horrible take.

[thunderfan]

Martin can replace Hardens points per game, no question. The problem is that for OKC he was so much more than just scoring. He is far and away a better defender than Martin, he was your 4th quarter playmaker, and he was every bit as clutch as Durant IMO.

Maybe Martin will be able to replicate some of Hardens clutch play, he's never had the pressure of a serious contender so we will wait and see, but he will never be the defender or playmaker Harden was.

Offensively I think the Thunder will be around the same level, maybe a little worse, but defensively I think you will be really lacking. To keep that offence ticking over though, Martin has to play and even if you play Durant at the 4 with Sefelosha to bolster your defence next to Westbrook and Martin, I just don't see you being able to get the stops to win the west.

Those are good points, but I think you'll see some alternate playmaking lineups and strategies with Harden gone. Harden is far from the only 4th quarter playmaker OKC can throw out there. Playmaking comes in different forms, as I'm sure out know. My whole point is, Martin isn't really replacing Harden. He can't. He's replacing some aspects of what Harden brought, but he's not a replacement. But he's a nice piece of the puzzle still. YOu move some things arounds, make some adjustments, and make it work. I still truly feel we have the players to make it work.

By the way...Jeremy Lamb..very intriguing. This guy could do something.

[Richie]

Martin needs to come in and give OKC 14-18 ppg...He can and will do that. THat's all James Harden did and ever was going to do in OKC. OKC doesn't need a Harden throwing up big numbers. Houston does. OKC doesn't need Kevin Martin throwing up big numbers. Houston did. THe offensive motor in OKC is KD and RW, period, end of story. That's the situation and the reality. That's why Harden wasn't worth a max contract given the situation and dynamics of the team. Martin is a different player than Harden, but the desired end result is the key here.

To say all Harden gave you was points is ludicrous and I think you're burying your head in the sand. Harden did so much more for the Thunder than score 14-18ppg, you can't replace his intangibles.

[thunderfan]

Horrible take.

Horrible, two worded, meaningless response with nothing to support your opinion.

[benefactor]

You are too ing dumb to bother with typing one.

[thunderfan]

To say all Harden gave you was points is ludicrous and I think you're burying your head in the sand. Harden did so much more for the Thunder than score 14-18ppg, you can't replace his intangibles.

Eh..bad phrasing on my part. Of course it's not all he did. I was just referring to the fact that he would never have been anything but a #3 offensive option in OKC. I fully understand the intangibles he brought. I'd rather have Harden, believe me. I'm just saying, in the not too distant future, with the pieces that we have now, with adjustments, with rotation changes, OKC could be as powerful a team as they were with Harden.

[thunderfan]

You are too ing dumb to bother with typing one.

Oh, ok. Enjoy your day.

[benefactor]

acting like your coach and can actually coach

Your bag of is just getting fuller and fuller.

[lakerhaterade]

Eh..bad phrasing on my part. Of course it's not all he did. I was just referring to the fact that he would never have been anything but a #3 offensive option in OKC. I fully understand the intangibles he brought. I'd rather have Harden, believe me. I'm just saying, in the not too distant future, with the pieces that we have now, with adjustments, with rotation changes, OKC could be as powerful a team as they were with Harden.

So the current team at this moment isn't as powerful? That would make them worse, no?

[Richie]

Those are good points, but I think you'll see some alternate playmaking lineups and strategies with Harden gone. Harden is far from the only 4th quarter playmaker OKC can throw out there. Playmaking comes in different forms, as I'm sure out know. My whole point is, Martin isn't really replacing Harden. He can't. He's replacing some aspects of what Harden brought, but he's not a replacement. But he's a nice piece of the puzzle still. YOu move some things arounds, make some adjustments, and make it work. I still truly feel we have the players to make it work.

By the way...Jeremy Lamb..very intriguing. This guy could do something.

I actually don't hate the deal long term, I think that Raptors pick could be worth a lot and you have some good young pieces like Lamb and PJ3. Personally I dont think you'll ever get back the ceiling that Harden, Durant and Westbrook had but I hope Durant wins in OKC, just after Duncan has retired and the Spurs blow it up.

I agree with your argument that lineups will change to compensate and that's true, but the problem is you've lost such a good all round player that you lineup will never be as complete as it was with Harden. Maynor can pick up his playmaking slack, but won't have his scoring or defence. Martin can replace his scoring but without his playmaking or defence. Sefelosha can replace his defence but without his scoring and playmaking.

I hope OKC wins in the future, I like Durant and would be happy to see him with a couple rings in OKC especially at the expense of LeBron. It's just much less likely to happen any time soon.

[Kai]

You guys need to cool it on thunderfan. It's nice to have an actual Thunder fan around here, and if you keep trying to circle jerk on him he's gonna leave. That would be like killing an endangered species.

[thunderfan]

So the current team at this moment isn't as powerful? That would make them worse, no?

Yes, of course they are worse now. We're 2 games into the whole thing. I thought my choice of words indicated that I believed there was a possibility of them being as powerful with some adjustments, time, etc.

[jeebus]

You guys need to cool it on thunderfan. It's nice to have an actual Thunder fan around here, and if you keep trying to circle jerk on him he's gonna leave. That would be like killing an endangered species.

him leaving would ruin my poll

[thunderfan]

Ah, I'm not leaving. I can take all the crap.

Hey - Thabo was the leading 3 point shooter on our roster last year - 44%.

To clarify - I do AGREE OKC would be a better team with Harden, now and for the rest of the season and probably next season, but I still contend that with our current roster we could be as strong of a team, or stronger, than we were last season. Beyond this season, who knows...What does Lamb turn out to be? ANother Harden? A dud? And PJ3? A lot of unknowns.

[thunderup]

One can't automatically use these first two games as a barometer for choosing which team got the better end of the deal. Until Coach Brooks plays Lamb and solidifies Martin into the rotation, the jury will still be out.

and Harden won't continue to play at this level. He's playing on Jordan mode, he'll come back down to earth.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Martin needs to come in and give OKC 14-18 ppg...He can and will do that. THat's all James Harden did and ever was going to do in OKC. OKC doesn't need a Harden throwing up big numbers. Houston does. OKC doesn't need Kevin Martin throwing up big numbers. Houston did. THe offensive motor in OKC is KD and RW, period, end of story. That's the situation and the reality. That's why Harden wasn't worth a max contract given the situation and dynamics of the team. Martin is a different player than Harden, but the desired end result is the key here.

Westchucker will still be running the offense come crunchtime and you've seen how well that works out. Harden was the one that closed out games against the Lakers and Spurs. You keep telling yourself that Martin can fill that role while Westbrook is forcing shots, turning the ball over and showing the emotional maturity and mental toughness of a 13 year old girl.

[Kai]

[DAF86]

Well, yes, but this isn't a Martin for Harden swap where Martin is expected to go in and do exactly what Harden did. He can't and won't. But he can provide the same scoring output as Harden would have. It's just that the adjustments will have to be made. The dynamic of the team is different now, lineups will change, but with the players they have I believe they are potentially just as good, if not better.

Well. I stronlgy disagree. there's a (slim) chance Martin puts similar ppg than Harden but he won't ever be able to provide the playmaking, decision making or any other things. Martin might be the emptiest scorer of all-time.

And I just don't see how the players you have now can be considered "potentially just as good, if not better". But we will have to wait and see.

[DAF86]

One can't automatically use these first two games as a barometer for choosing which team got the better end of the deal. Until Coach Brooks plays Lamb and solidifies Martin into the rotation, the jury will still be out.

and Harden won't continue to play at this level. He's playing on Jordan mode, he'll come back down to earth.

Dude, we didn't use the first two games of the season to determine that. We all already knew who got the better end of the deal the minute the trade was made, tbh.