NBA: Jason Collins comes out of the closet

[Woo Bum-kon]

Again, you assume that ALL Christians believe that way.

No, only the intellectually consistent do.

[Chinook]

My computer is ing up. I'd bet money that you're a Christian who's saying you're not a Christian to improve your credibility as an unbiased observer. It's a trick I've seen countless times.

No. I have a semi-fundie father, so I had my fill of Christianity really early. I don't really have many Christian friends, other than the one I mentioned upthread that's trying to belief his way to heterosexuality. I am a theist, though, and I believe therefore in religious freedom. I'm a deist, so I am a functional atheist when it comes to most extensions of religion. I don't believe in things like prayer or good and evil. I still celebrate Christmas with my family and like to hear the songs, but I don't into a fervor over them. They're just songs expressing culture, and I find that interesting.

Opposing gay marriage means you oppose gay couples being able to file their tax return jointly which means you support gay couples paying up to 60% more in taxes than straight couples. These are simple facts.

I don't think so. That's why it's such a murky issue. Civil Unions seem to get shot down by gay people, not by religious folks. They claim it's about using the word. Who knows for sure. Different people take different stances. Some are bigots, others just believe in the sanc y of marriage, whatever that means. That's why there needs to be a discussion so everyone can see where the issues are.

when has a civil rights struggle ever been about "enforcing already present civil rights", it's always been about when someone is getting civil rights. 20 years from now, we'll be referring to this time as the civil rights movement for gay people and I'll be able to laugh at all the dumb s who had an epiphany sometime during this period and flip flopped on the issue.

Every civil rights case that ends with a court ruling or enforcement law and not a cons utional amendment is one enforces already existent rights. Do you not understand the Civil Rights Movement at all. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965 didn't give black people rights, they just added enforcement to the rights already granted by the amendments. Black people HAD the right to vote after the 15th Amendment was passed. Jim Crow just denied it to them.

People are calling this a civil rights movement now, and it's inappropriate. There was a gay civil rights movement already. This is something else. I support it, because I don't think anyone has the authority to tell anyone else who they can marry, so long as they're consenting adults. But that's not because anyone has a civil right to it.

[z0sa]

DoK calling himself a civil right activist is the highlight of this thread and maybe his posting career

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

I have already addressed both of these things.



I'm not sure what direction you're trying to go here. You admit to being extreme and obsessive then retract your statements and ask me to provide evidence. You clamor on about certain religious groups and challenge people to logically attack your arguments, all while you continue to make intentionally illogical arguments.


If you think this type of obsession rooted in hatred is moderate behavior then so be it. If you don't think you're obsessed then so be it.

I admit I'm obsessed with ting on religion and I'm obnoxious towards it, you can argue the obsession itself is extreme but none of my specific views are that extreme imo. It's not like I'm advocating Churches should be forced to hold a marriage ceremony for gay couples.

I've also said I wouldn't be so obsessed with it if it didn't have such a strong influence on policy. Gay marriage opposition isn't even the most bothersome part of Christianity to me, climate change is.

[ElNono]

Theism and religion aren't the same thing. Theism hinges on a premise; it doesn't propose any different explanation beyond that premise.

They both hinge on the same non-scientific premise: the deity. Scientifically speaking, their value is garbage and it's a showstopper to address the actual logical conclusion ("more scientific research on this area is needed").

I personally recognize that religion can be a psychological crutch that in some instances help people. Be it through fear ("god is punishing you for doing X"), intimidation (the whole what you do will land you in 'paradise'/' ' ), etc, for some people it works.

As such a tool, I think there's some usefulness there.

[Blake]

That didn't have anything to do with what I said.

You are lumping together a group and hating them based on crusades from hundreds of years ago (by catholics and their pope) and people like the Westboro peeps with others who don't believe the way they do. Regardless of them being born that way or choosing to believe that way you still have no idea what you are talking about.
Speaking about choices, you have the choise to not talk about things that you really don't know about.

You're the one that compared religion to race.

I'm well aware that Christians like to pick out the feel good parts of the Bible and ignore the "bear eats kids for making fun of bald prophet" parts.

[DPG21920]

DoK: you're a relatively smart guy. You honestly don't see how your opinion might be cloudy when self-admittedly say you passionately hate something? Being obnoxious aside (which is ironic because bible thumpers are obnoxious & you hate them), when you hate something so much in addition to having a lack of knowledge (I might just be making assumptions, but I doubt you have really studied or been a part of Christianity) you come off sounding just like those you hate. It's like SA210 hijacked your account with the links to things like evil bible.com and with random accusations of people lying to gain favor. If you stepped back and saw someone arguing like you are about a different topic you'd smash them.

Not only that - you hate minorities (from what most would gather), yet you claim to be into civil rights. This all makes little sense.

[Blake]

Direct orders? Where is that part? would be interesting to discuss ...

Pretty sure this is the second time I've posted this here:

Leviticus 20

13*If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an*abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their*blood*shall be upon them.

[Ricky Davis]

I'm really happy for Jason Collins. He's a hero to a lot of people and his courage is inspiring.

Hopefully one day this won't be such a big deal.

[AaronY]

Pretty sure this is the second time I've posted this here:

Leviticus 20

13*If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an*abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their*blood*shall be upon them.

Lets not start posting all the re ed in the bible..well be here all day.

[AaronY]

Favorite bible quote is #4 here: http://www.evilbible.com/Rape.htm

3 is great too

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

DoK: you're a relatively smart guy. You honestly don't see how your opinion might be cloudy when self-admittedly say you passionately hate something? Being obnoxious aside (which is ironic because bible thumpers are obnoxious & you hate them), when you hate something so much in addition to having a lack of knowledge (I might just be making assumptions, but I doubt you have really studied or been a part of Christianity) you come off sounding just like those you hate.

My hatred towards Christianity stems from the effect it has had on society and more specifically America during my lifetime, regardless of the actual religion itself and what its intent is. One reason why I ridicule it so much and scoff it is because from what I've read about Jesus, modern day Christianity is a total bas ization of his teachings. I highly doubt Jesus would have any kind of issue with gay marriage or vote for "Christians" like Ronald Reagan and George Bush.

I think Judaism and Islam are perhaps even more backwards than Christianity, but you don't see me complaining about them because they little to no effect on America's values and beliefs.

Not only that - you hate minorities (from what most would gather), yet you claim to be into civil rights. This all makes little sense.

My use of racial slurs indicates it, however whottt you said about me being against affirmative action and wasn't true. My opinion towards affirmative action is that it should be expanded to cover any race/gender based completely off financial need.

[NASpurs]

One reason why I ridicule it so much and scoff it is because from what I've read about Jesus, modern day Christianity is a total bas ization of his teachings. I highly doubt Jesus would have any kind of issue with gay marriage or vote for "Christians" like Ronald Reagan and George Bush.

That's cool with me personally. I'm a Christian and I feel the same way. I'm a spiritual Christian but not religious because it's been tainted beyond the teachings of Jesus for the personal gain of the Church and people in power. Even my father who was a priest isn't religious anymore. He's a devout Christian (spiritually) but not religious.

[Trill Clinton]

Pretty sure this is the second time I've posted this here:

Leviticus 20

13*If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an*abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their*blood*shall be upon them.

where is the direct order from God in that verse that he wants christians to kill sinners? God is the ultimate judge, not man. god isn't responsible for our free will choices, but we will pay the penalty for them because sin( in this case sexuality) has its consequences. i pray when that day comes, the blood that is upon them is the blood of jesus, amen.

[AaronY]

Lawlz, The Lord ordered little kids dead for making fun of bald people (dead srs http://www.evilbible.com/Murder.htm) in the bible..I'm sure he wants you to burn s too, so get to work true believer

[jag]

where is the direct order from God in that verse that he wants christians to kill sinners? God is the ultimate judge, not man. god isn't responsible for our free will choices, but we will pay the penalty for them because sin( in this case sexuality) has its consequences. i pray when that day comes, the blood that is upon them is the blood of jesus, amen.

[ElNono]

[AaronY]

More fun Bible quotes:

Kill everyone in a city if just one of its inhabitants is promoting a different religion:

Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

Stone any non-virgin who tries to get married:

But if this charge is true (that she wasn't a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father's house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB)

i can't even understand the logic behind this one might need a bible scholar to help me..they're moving the ark of the covenant and its wobbling and about to fall over, so a guy tries to help out and grab it to hold it steady..God burns him to ash lol

The ark of God was placed on a new cart and taken away from the house of Abinadab on the hill. Uzzah and Ahio, sons of Abinadab guided the cart, with Ahio walking before it, while David and all the Israelites made merry before the Lord with all their strength, with singing and with citharas, harps, tambourines, sistrums, and cymbals. When they came to the threshing floor of Nodan, Uzzah reached out his hand to the ark of God to steady it, for the oxen were making it tip. But the Lord was angry with Uzzah; God struck him on that spot, and he died there before God. (2 Samuel 6:3-7 NAB)

lol pouty lol got..tantruming because he didn't get his way

[DPG21920]

Ugly sight when GNSF tries to fit in.

[Trill Clinton]

Lawlz, The Lord ordered little kids dead for making fun of bald people (dead srs http://www.evilbible.com/Murder.htm) in the bible..I'm sure he wants you to burn s too, so get to work true believer

okay, i will first start with you. i will burn the sin from your flesh and hope you turn from your sexual ways, amen.

[AaronY]

Lol personal attacks..naturally

[I. Hustle]

"Ugh, why can't Christians just accept that everyone is different?! They are so stupid for not believing like me!"


LOL

[I. Hustle]

oh

/thread

[DPG21920]

Lol trying so hard

[DPG21920]

Aaron - just be yourself and you will be bolded