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  1. #701
    Believe. Calispursfan11's Avatar
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    I wasn't saying its the norm. I said the video looked like he made some solid plays in that one game. Is someone equating this to the norm? I just can't say as I haven't seen him play much this year. I saw him stink up the 3 point contest but other than that, not much to go on...

  2. #702
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    You act like I'm not making points yet that's what each of my posts have done. I care much less about semantics on an Internet forum than I would in a professional environment.
    That's always the excuse for being sloppy. You've spent hours in this thread alone, and yet you pretend it's not important enough for you to clearly lay out your thoughts in a concise manner. Instead, you slop it on because, in my opinion, you have no other option.
    You brush off the assist totals as irrelevant when convenient but tried to get clever by highlighting his marginal assist decrease when pulling up his W/L splits. If you thought they were irrelevant, you wouldn't have specifically highlighted those figures. Now you are backtracking with your assists don't matter shenanigans.
    Not irrelevant, but not as indicative of a distributing PG as you make it out to be. If I was talking about two different people, then using the assists as an indicator would be fallacious based on my argument, however since the PG isn't variable, the assists have the same numerical value ergo a lower number vs a higher number, in light of the W/L and points is indeed notable. I don't expect you to get that though, because you're superficial understanding of the game won't allow it... yet.
    I also have addressed the discrepancy in more than one post. Since you seem simple, I can reiterate yet again. His teammates, particularly David Lee and Klay Thompson (those 3 are the main sources of GS offense) have had significant struggles in their losses, evidenced my the very large decrease in FG% in their splits. When teammates can't hit shots, the onus is on Curry to make sure they get points however they can, so he presses. His shooting% isn't even a full % lower in any case.
    The "struggles" angle breaks down if you consider other teams' PGs that don't have higher scoring numbers in losses than wins, unless you think only GS experiences scoring slumps that somehow don't affect the PG. What about when Curry has a scoring slump? Those games where he has poor shooting and yet the team wins? Don't you think that affects the point differential of the W/L? Or do you think Curry has the ability to average 27ppg at will?

    You do like to ignore the real questions and cherry pick the ones you think you have solved. You haven't solved anything, btw...


    I also brought up the point that you are confusing the cause and effect in the scoring figures. They aren't necessarily losing because he is scoring more, but rather he is pressured to score points when they are losing and his main partners in crime are struggling to score. Alternately, like we have seen with the spurs, many times in blowout wins we have a collection of guys chipping in 10-15 points rather than having one or two dominant scorers. Do we win because nobody is particular is putting up big figures, or rather, are the minutes/shots getting distributed due to the comfortable lead that is held throughout the game?
    What stats support your take? The Spurs share points and assists because they move the ball. It has little to do with blowout wins.
    these are points I had made before that you seem to ignore just so you can bull me with your "you haven't made an argument" shtick. you would get shredded in court since there is a stenographer typing up every word spoken in the courtroom. You are like an attorney that snoozed during the trial and tells the jury "the other guy didn't prove anything!"
    If you've made an argument, I've not seen it. What I have seen from you is unsupported conjecture that's easily defeated.

  3. #703
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    I wasn't saying its the norm. I said the video looked like he made some solid plays in that one game. Is someone equating this to the norm? I just can't say as I haven't seen him play much this year. I saw him stink up the 3 point contest but other than that, not much to go on...
    You just quoted the video, you didn't post it. Ergo I wasn't referring to your post.

  4. #704
    Believe. Calispursfan11's Avatar
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    That's always the excuse for being sloppy. You've spent hours in this thread alone, and yet you pretend it's not important enough for you to clearly lay out your thoughts in a concise manner. Instead, you slop it on because, in my opinion, you have no other option.

    Not irrelevant, but not as indicative of a distributing PG as you make it out to be. If I was talking about two different people, then using the assists as an indicator would be fallacious based on my argument, however since the PG isn't variable, the assists have the same numerical value ergo a lower number vs a higher number, in light of the W/L and points is indeed notable. I don't expect you to get that though, because you're superficial understanding of the game won't allow it... yet.
    The "struggles" angle breaks down if you consider other teams' PGs that don't have higher scoring numbers in losses than wins, unless you think only GS experiences scoring slumps that somehow don't affect the PG. What about when Curry has a scoring slump? Those games where he has poor shooting and yet the team wins? Don't you think that affects the point differential of the W/L? Or do you think Curry has the ability to average 27ppg at will?

    You do like to ignore the real questions and cherry pick the ones you think you have solved. You haven't solved anything, btw...

    What stats support your take? The Spurs share points and assists because they move the ball. It has little to do with blowout wins.

    If you've made an argument, I've not seen it. What I have seen from you is unsupported conjecture that's easily defeated.
    Is assraider really worth this kind of effort 'ol sport?

  5. #705
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Is assraider really worth this kind of effort 'ol sport?
    Most of the conversation on this forum is about obvious things. What I've pointed out wasn't obvious to a lot of people, and in fact only recently have the pundits come on board with my takes on this. People get enamored with the shooting ability of Curry and grant a pass on the detrimental aspects of his game. Even in that video Curry takes long 3pt shots over 2 defenders with a wide open shooter on the wing that he ignores. You don't grant a pass to a guy because he hits some of those. That's chucking at its finest.

  6. #706
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    You have yet to show evidence of his assists usually comprising of last second dump offs, yet you boldly make that claim. I have shown you one game, you have shown be none, yet I'm supposed to believe that the onus is on me to provide further evidence? You always tell me (and I would agree) that the box scores don't tell the whole story, yet literally all you do is wait for some bad games and post box scores. I have addressed Curry's scoring discrepancy about 3-4 times now yet you keep asking me to. I'm not going to continue to run around with circles. You still bring up the moderate assist differential when the numbers very clearly show that in their losing efforts , both Lee and Thompson shoot considerably lower percentages. You seemingly aren't able to connect the dots that when players have poor shooting nights, a point guard's assist numbers will likely take a hit

  7. #707
    Believe. Calispursfan11's Avatar
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    You have yet to show evidence of his assists usually comprising of last second dump offs, yet you boldly make that claim. I have shown you one game, you have shown be none, yet I'm supposed to believe that the onus is on me to provide further evidence? You always tell me (and I would agree) that the box scores don't tell the whole story, yet literally all you do is wait for some bad games and post box scores. I have addressed Curry's scoring discrepancy about 3-4 times now yet you keep asking me to. I'm not going to continue to run around with circles. You still bring up the moderate assist differential when the numbers very clearly show that in their losing efforts , both Lee and Thompson shoot considerably lower percentages. You seemingly aren't able to connect the dots that when players have poor shooting nights, a point guard's assist numbers will likely take a hit
    Them fighting words raider! Will DMC respond or give up?

  8. #708
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    That's always the excuse for being sloppy. You've spent hours in this thread alone, and yet you pretend it's not important enough for you to clearly lay out your thoughts in a concise manner.
    I have spent hours on this thread. I never said it's not important. I just shouldn't I couldn't give less s about semantics on an Internet forum. Those are independent facts.

    ing is important to me too but I'm not speaking in full, coherent sentences then either

  9. #709
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    Them fighting words raider! Will DMC respond or give up?
    He won't give up. He has a passion for arguing. Do you not know DMC?

  10. #710
    Believe. Calispursfan11's Avatar
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    He won't give up. He has a passion for arguing. Do you not know DMC?
    Let's see how long you can string him along. That would be entertaining. The two of you have developed one of the landmark feuds of early 2014.

  11. #711
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    I'm not really trying to string him along. An irrational urge to argue is a trait we share

  12. #712
    Believe. Calispursfan11's Avatar
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    I'm not really trying to string him along. An irrational urge to argue is a trait we share
    In all honesty, let it go, raider. Unless it brings you joy, let it go. If you can do that, you win. Giving him the last flawed word shows all of us that you are the bigger man and he was the butthurt try hard.

  13. #713
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    I'm having fun here so it's all good

  14. #714
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    You have yet to show evidence of his assists usually comprising of last second dump offs, yet you boldly make that claim. I have shown you one game, you have shown be none, yet I'm supposed to believe that the onus is on me to provide further evidence? You always tell me (and I would agree) that the box scores don't tell the whole story, yet literally all you do is wait for some bad games and post box scores. I have addressed Curry's scoring discrepancy about 3-4 times now yet you keep asking me to. I'm not going to continue to run around with circles. You still bring up the moderate assist differential when the numbers very clearly show that in their losing efforts , both Lee and Thompson shoot considerably lower percentages. You seemingly aren't able to connect the dots that when players have poor shooting nights, a point guard's assist numbers will likely take a hit
    The fact is that the ty games from him aren't made into montages. You'd have to watch his game to know. If all I needed was a montage from some media source to show his flaws, I'd be trailing someone else who pointed it out already.

    You've offered speculation to explain the PPG discrepancy, but you haven't found a way to weave that into the fabric of the NBA overall, with other teams. If what you're saying is true for GS, why isn't it true for other teams? Does everyone else never have bad shooting nights? Tony Parker goes into hero mode quite often when his teammates cannot put the ball in the hole, however his PPG is directly proportional to the team wins. Same is true for Kryie Irving and Chris Paul, and the same is true for other players on the GS roster.

    So it's not about him compensating for his team's lack of scoring. Notice his averages are higher in losses than in wins. That doesn't reflect him taking on the scoring duties. Instead, it says he's having a hot scoring night and thus ignores his teammates more with heat checks and basic chucking exhibitions. Sure he scores more points and he's shooting fairly well, but they aren't involved so it's easier for an opponent to shut him down when it matters, and the other players on GS aren't into it now because they weren't involved for a long stretch. I mean, unless you think he can up his shooting percentage on a whim.

  15. #715
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    Your argument has been flip flopping. You originally said because of Curry's chucking ways, they will struggle when he has bad shooting nights, which is completely unreflected in the splits (unless you consider that 0.7% drop a bad shooting night). Then you acknowledged that his teammates performance played a bigger role, now you are saying they lose because he scores more. These 3 are radically different, and it's impossible to argue with somebody who is changing his mind. Just clarify which two of those comments you are rescinding an admitting were wrong, and which one you are sticking with for the time being

  16. #716
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Kobe suffers from the same statistical discrepancies. His PPG is higher during losses than during wins. Even Russell Westbrook scored more points in wins than in losses.

  17. #717
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Your argument has been flip flopping. You originally said because of Curry's chucking ways, they will struggle when he has bad shooting nights, which is completely unreflected in the splits (unless you consider that 0.7% drop a bad shooting night).
    If he's the focus on offense, it stands to reason that they will struggle if he's not on.
    Then you acknowledged that his teammates performance played a bigger role
    Because they cannot go very far with him as the focus of their offense
    , now you are saying they lose because he scores more.
    You really do lack the capacity for abstract thought. I'm saying the fact that he scores more says he's the focus of the offense.
    These 3 are radically different, and it's impossible to argue with somebody who is changing his mind.
    I've had a consistent claim throughout this thread, but your cardboard thinking process doesn't allow you to see how the pieces fit. You've been conditioned to think that scoring = good always and you don't take into account what's happening with the other 4 members of the team, and you don't consider the other end of the floor.
    Just clarify which two of those comments you are rescinding an admitting were wrong, and which one you are sticking with for the time being
    I'm not rescinding anything. If you don't understand the game of basketball, which you obviously don't, why are you discussing it? Isn't it true that the only interest you have in this is defending Curry? You were doing that from the first page and had no idea how you were going to do it. I've given you the statistical anomalies that surround GS and shown you why they exist. You've not shown how your explanation can even work, since it doesn't seem to be that way for other teams.

    In fact you've admitted that Curry is a chucker when you tried to use the defense that he shoots more when his team cannot score. Isn't that what Kobe does? Isn't that the excuse Kobe fans use for Kobe's chucking? Don't the Warriors lose more of those games than they win where Curry is scoring more points? Yes, of course they do.
    Last edited by DMC; 11-06-2014 at 01:14 AM. Reason: fixed quote tags

  18. #718
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    You're doing it again...

    no, it doesn't "stand to reason" tat they struggle when his shot is off because it isn't reflected in the win loss stats. A 0.8% fg% drop isn't enough deviation to make that kind of claim, and I have shown they have a winning record even when he shoots 40% or worse. This shows that he brings much more to the table than just shooting or chucking, such as runnin the offense, getting teammates looks. You are also once again playing both sides, saying his teammates impact is bigger than his yet pinning the blame if their losses on curry.

    You routinely ask me to back up my claims with facts or video evidence, yet you think you are exempt from this when pulling the "curry's assists are from dumping it off when there are no options" bull out of your ass.

    The notion of a team's best scorer shouldering the load in difficult games where teammates are struggling is not unique. It's something dirk, Lebron, tony, and many other great players do that wouldn't necessarily fit in your chucker category

  19. #719
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Most Inconsistent Scorer

    And the HabersTrophy goes to ... Stephen Curry Inconsistency is the only consistency when you launch an NBA-high 7.9 3-point attempts per game. Curry has three single-digit scoring games and three 40-plus scoring infernos on his ledger. Kevin Durant, Kevin Love, LeBron James and Carmelo Anthony have zero single-digit scoring games combined. For two weeks in March, Curry couldn't crack 20 points. And now he's scored 31, 24, 30, 47 and 32 in his past five games. Put it all together and he owns the NBA's highest standard deviation of scoring totals (9.2). Wild.


    lol ing chucker

  20. #720
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    lol a supossed chucker not shooting enough to make more than 9 pts in 3 games.

  21. #721
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    In those 3 games he took 8, 10 and 10 shots respectively. His team won 2 of 3. Quite the chucker.

  22. #722
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    In those 3 games he took 8, 10 and 10 shots respectively. His team won 2 of 3. Quite the chucker.
    don't bother. have you not read this thread?

  23. #723
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    don't bother. have you not read this thread?
    "It's not the numbers of shots it's the type of shots. I don't care if he plays 40 mins per game and takes only 15 shots, those are 15 bad shots. Many of them are 3's and 3's are bad shots, it doesn't matter that he shoots 40 something % from 3's."

  24. #724
    Wrecks and Effects RsxPiimp's Avatar
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    Sybok get yo ass in here, they roasting you homie.

  25. #725
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    i haven't tried to roast or anything, just warning DAF that dmc is as philopolemic as i am... he won't stop arguing

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