"eye" test
We went into that series against a 66 win team...without homecourt advantage. It's because of Green's shooting that we were even in a positon to win. Not his fault that the "MVP candidate" first option on the team picked the worst time to choke. Tony let everyone down. Manu too but expectations were low for Ginobili considering his overall season and playoffs weren't too good to begin with. Replace Green in that series with any version of Bowen and we probably lose in five/six games.
You must not remember 2012. It's still his best year as a Spur (ever) by a pretty large margin now that he's come back to Earth a bit this year. 2013 he had a great playoffs including the Finals (Spurs would have won in five had anyone else showed up for Game Two). Last year, he didn't have many signature plays. He was the best defender in the last two series, but he was held in check for the most part offensively. This season he started off as a top 3-5 SG and is now hanging around 10 or so. We'll see what happens after the break.disagree. he was average in 2012. Went cold at the worst time in 2013. Very very good in 2014 and efficientand he's been struggling the last 2 months of this season. Love him but he's no Bruce Bowen yet
You do realize that the "eye test" still isn't, "I know what I see", right? It's still things you can talk about, evaluate and challenge. I think "eye test" folks would have a much stronger argument if they actually tried to make point instead of just saying their view is self-evident.
Bruce stopped Lebron.
Everyone on the Heat was stopped, except for Kawhi's assignment.
This isn't even close. Tbqh
Pretty sure there's a vid posted in this very thread showing how Lebron was defended in 2007. Both Bowen and Leonard get too much credit for their individual defense against James. It took an army both times.
I know what I watch and the stats and the context better than you tbh. I don't just really on the eye test.
If the initial defender sucks, your team is going to lose no matter who you have back there. Kinda like tony this year.
The credit is warranted.
Bruh, you're gonna have to learn that this isn't argument as much as it's filler. It's a direct refusal to actually discuss something.
You haven't demonstrated any knowledge of stats. You've only demonstrated skepticism toward them. But you think Fundamentalists are awesome biologists too.and the stats and the context better than you tbh.
You don't even rely on the eye test. You rely on just saying "yep, I'm right" over and over.I don't just really on the eye test.
Chinook so mad.
Whatever on that bolded part.
But you're wrong on the remaining parts. Players who can't shoot like 07 Lebron could be contained by collapsing the paint. Not saying Bowen has bad by any means, since he was able to funnel James into Duncan on some of those blocks. But no way that level of defense would have stopped 2013 James.
I'm almost certain I've been more "mad" from your posts than right now. In fact, I'd say that's more of an olive branch than anything. I'm asking you to show why you think Bowen is better. That's by no means a sign of "madness".Chinook so mad.
I don't know. We did 4-0 them in 2007. We lost in 2013 because the initial defender wasn't playing tight defense. Kawhi was doing as told by pop and playing off of him. We lost in 2013 because pop didn't change his strat. I'm sure 2007 bruce bowen could play suffocating defense like he usually does. Sure he also played off of lebron in 2007 but to say he couldn't play tight man defense is ing idiotic.
I'm saying bowen is better than green not kawhi but I can play too.
See something like that is not the "eye test". It completely ignores that James was significantly better and that the Heat were significantly better than the 07 Cavs. James didn't have a post game back then (pretty much no one Bowen faced had one outside of Kobe and Dirk (and we know how well Bowen guarded Dirk), and that was a huge reason why Pop couldn't change his strategy.
Also, the league is different now, and "playing suffocating defense" for a whole series is pretty much impossible in today's foul-driven league. Finally, Tim being more mobile in 07 allowed Bowen to play tighter defense. Green and Leonard have to funnel their men to specific spots in order for Tim to get there. 07 Duncan could pick up players on the PnR. Current Tim at least allows an open jumper.
None of this mentions that James only had one poor game in 2007. So it's not like Bowen had a ton of success against him. That finals was one HoFer in his youth versus three HoFers at or near their primes. It was by no means the same as the 2013 series.
Nah, you were saying Bowen's 2007 defense was better than Kawhi's 2013 (and maybe 2014) D. You've made no argument as to why Green's D isn't as good besides just repeating that it's not and laughing.
Find a quote where I said that except the last one where I'm playing with you.
So you're saying now that you don't believe 2007 Bowen played better defense than 2013/2014 Kawhi? Or is your quote referencing something else?
I don't know what ur saying man. Like seriously.
Just to be clear I don't what anyone is saying anymore.
Where you said what? Which part of my previous posts are you denying? Are you saying you don't truly think Bowen defended James better than Kawhi or that you don't really think Bowen is better than Green? Or something else? I'm not even arguing anything; I'm asking for clarification of a quote I'm supposed to find.Find a quote where I said that
You realize that Kawhi wasn't guarding LeBron for every single shot he took right? People that look at the final stats of the game and accredit those stats as all against a defender are either stupid, or being purposely obtuse.
Kawhi held LeBron well below his averages when he was on him. Unfortunately there are still fast breaks, switches, and obviously times when one isn't on the court.
2013/14 Lebron would destroy 2007 Lebron.
No way in ing would Bowen allow Barnes and Hayward to train him..
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