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  1. #451
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    Read this.
    http://hardwoodparoxysm.com/2014/12/...k-tony-parker/



    "So when a player shows improvement in an area as important as shooting, how do you balance that against his decline in other areas? Each overall player metric weights these things differently. I like math, so I find the case for Wins Produced, which places a higher value on passing and rebounding than metrics like PER, compelling, and Parker’s Wins Produced this year says that he’s a below average player, dragged down by basically everything he does that isn’t shooting the ball.
    Fortunately, the Spurs employ two above-average point guards: Cory Joseph and Patty Mills. These players aren’t completely interchangeable. The energetic Mills is an up-tempo player and excellent three-point shooter while Joseph is more adept at facilitating the offense and finishing at the rim. But both Mills and Joseph are playing at a higher overall level than Parker, and the Spurs should explore lineups that take advantage of their skills. It’d be a shame to see Joseph lose minutes to Parker as he returns.
    Not all measures agree with this assessment of the Spurs’ point guards (if you’re a diehard PER partisan, you’re not going to find this persuasive), but Parker and Joseph’s on/off court numbers this season support the case: ESPN’s on-court impact metrichas Cory Joseph ranked a respectable 21stamong all NBA point guards, with Tony Parker coming in at 75. The Spurs just aren’t playing as well when Parker is on the floor."

    dat double standard
    I'm sure Mills and Cojo do a great job racking up nice stats in garbage time.

  2. #452
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    ^oh Roberto still not talking about yesterday's game

  3. #453
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    He's been up and down, but during the time when the Spurs played the best basketball, he was their starting point guard and he was playing well. You may not like him, but when you are advocating playing Cojo or Mills for 30 minutes, then you have to wonder if you have any idea what you are talking about. And Pop sees the same stats that you look at, and he's smart enough to know that they do not answer everything. Especially when Parker gets his stats against starters, and Mills and Cojo get their stats against third and fourth string players.
    Cojo started multiple games this season. Stop it, just stop it. This is getting to kobe- level fandom.

  4. #454
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    ^oh Roberto still not talking about yesterday's game
    Kawhi had a better game than Parker yesterday. What more is there to say?

  5. #455
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    7:01 Tony Parker misses 18-foot jumper
    6:47 Tony Parker lost ball turnover (Matt Barnes steals)

    6:05 Tony Parker misses 23-foot three point jumper
    3:28 Tony Parker misses 9-foot jumper
    1:46 Tony Parker misses 25-foot three point jumper
    9:10 Tony Parker misses 10-foot jumper
    8:22 Tony Parker misses 9-foot jumper
    7:56 Tony Parker lost ball turnover (Blake Griffin steals)


    kobe-esque
    chucker
    worst starting pg in the playoffs
    1 ASSIST
    ball stopper
    tried to hero and failed per usual
    got on by cliff paul
    died during the game

    6:33 Kawhi Leonard makes two point shot (Tim Duncan assists)
    5:43 Kawhi Leonard makes free throw 1 of 2

    8:21 Kawhi Leonard makes 11-foot jumper (Boris Diaw assists)
    1:37 Kawhi Leonard makes 4-foot jumper
    1:12 Kawhi Leonard makes 20-foot two point shot
    9:40 Tiago Splitter makes layup (Kawhi Leonard assists)
    2:59 Manu Ginobili makes 24-foot three point jumper (Kawhi Leonard assists)
    2:13 Kawhi Leonard makes two point shot (Manu Ginobili assists)
    1:19 Kawhi Leonard makes layup (Manu Ginobili assists)
    0:00 Kawhi Leonard makes 25-foot three point jumper (Manu Ginobili assists)
    11:12 Patty Mills makes 24-foot three point jumper (Kawhi Leonard assists)
    4:28 Kawhi Leonard makes free throw 1 of 2
    4:28 Kawhi Leonard makes free throw 2 of 2


    refused to let parker drag the spurs down
    did the best he could while porker was chucking
    more assist than the starting pg
    still had 6 rebounds and 4 steals
    manu always being a better pg than porker
    Last nights game. There, I talked about it Brazil.

  6. #456
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    Cojo started multiple games this season. Stop it, just stop it. This is getting to kobe- level fandom.
    Multiple games. Stop it. He played like five games. And I believe we lost most of them. level to advocate Cojo as our starting point guard. level to watch Clippers ignore him when the Spurs are on offense and play 5 on 4. when the Clippers double Parker when he penetrates, but do no such thing when Cojo does. Stop pretending that advanced stats are telling us something they are not.

  7. #457
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    Multiple games. Stop it. He played like five games. And I believe we lost most of them. level to advocate Cojo as our starting point guard. level to watch Clippers ignore him when the Spurs are on offense and play 5 on 4. when the Clippers double Parker when he penetrates, but do no such thing when Cojo does. Stop pretending that advanced stats are telling us something they are not.
    Give me stats or quit talking out of your ass. Just because you keep saying Parker is a good PG doesn't make it true. He also isn't the best option at PG as you keep saying.

  8. #458
    Veteran Floyd Pacquiao's Avatar
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    Tony Parker was terrible last night

  9. #459
    5 is real faggy! Mikeanaro's Avatar
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    Last nights game. There, I talked about it Brazil.
    Yeah but if you look into Kawhi plays and change all the ¨makes¨ to ¨misses¨ then its clearly obvious Parker had a better game.

  10. #460
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    When is it appropriate? Tell me. Because last night was a fest from Parker.
    Yesterday isn't on Parker.
    Keep reaching though Mr. Fantastic

  11. #461
    Rum and Coke SupremeGuy's Avatar
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    The parker fans are just embarrassing themselves in this thread, tbh.

  12. #462
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    Keep reaching though Mr. Fantastic
    That's it. Give me an answer please. When is it appropriate to blame Parker? Give me an example of when Parker can be blamed.

  13. #463
    The Most Sexy Troll on the Interwebs Hemotivo's Avatar
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    Tony Parker was terrible last night
    yep

  14. #464
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    The parker fans are just embarrassing themselves in this thread, tbh.
    They have been for a while now.

  15. #465
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    That's it. Give me an answer please. When is it appropriate to blame Parker? Give me an example of when Parker can be blamed.
    Anytime the team plays well despite him tbh.

    Last night wasn't one of those instances. It isn't that hard.

  16. #466
    Rum and Coke SupremeGuy's Avatar
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    Keep reaching though Mr. Fantastic
    He's asking when it's appropriate to blame parker? He the bed for most of the season and rob has posted the stats to back up that statement, but still many people in this thread continue to deflect blame.

  17. #467
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    That's it. Give me an answer please. When is it appropriate to blame Parker? Give me an example of when Parker can be blamed.
    It's not that you can't blame Parker for losses, it's just that the shtick of focusing solely on him gets old. Sure, he played a terrible game. He needs to neutralize Paul, if he doesn't do that, we are in trouble. But advocating Mills and Cojo playing 30 minutes a game, is just not believable. I don't care what your advanced stat says, because it measures stats that Mills/Cojo get in junk time against inferior talent. Most of their minutes this season have been as bench players, and often in blow outs. The real indicator is how the Clippers defend them. Cojo can shoot well, but he can't guard anyone in the half court for 30 minutes. Cojo can guard people, but he can't shoot enough to keep the defense honest for 30 minutes. Parker is the best we have, regardless if you think he is the worst starting point guard in the NBA. And Leonard isn't to blame for the loss, even though he played subpar. They all were to blame. Dumb turnovers, missed free throws, poor ball movement (Leonard is as guilty as Parker is of stopping the ball and burning shot clock time without getting anything from it), lazy transition defense... all those things were to blame. And yes, Parker was part of that, but not the only one.

  18. #468
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    It's not that you can't blame Parker for losses, it's just that the shtick of focusing solely on him gets old. Sure, he played a terrible game. He needs to neutralize Paul, if he doesn't do that, we are in trouble. But advocating Mills and Cojo playing 30 minutes a game, is just not believable. I don't care what your advanced stat says, because it measures stats that Mills/Cojo get in junk time against inferior talent. Most of their minutes this season have been as bench players, and often in blow outs. The real indicator is how the Clippers defend them. Cojo can shoot well, but he can't guard anyone in the half court for 30 minutes. Cojo can guard people, but he can't shoot enough to keep the defense honest for 30 minutes. Parker is the best we have, regardless if you think he is the worst starting point guard in the NBA. And Leonard isn't to blame for the loss, even though he played subpar. They all were to blame. Dumb turnovers, missed free throws, poor ball movement (Leonard is as guilty as Parker is of stopping the ball and burning shot clock time without getting anything from it), lazy transition defense... all those things were to blame. And yes, Parker was part of that, but not the only one.
    k thanks. but even his raw stats are ty. he had 1 assist last night. keep it going though.

  19. #469
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    Anytime the team plays well despite him tbh.

    Last night wasn't one of those instances. It isn't that hard.
    You mean like all season? Because Parker has had plenty of games yet Parker fans bring up his plus minus only when it's convenient. He gets carried by the starters. He has been all season. I never once saw Parker get the blame for any of his games this season.

  20. #470
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    k thanks. but even his raw stats are ty. he had 1 assist last night. keep it going though.
    Yeah, I guess you missed the point where I acknowledged he had a bad game last night. The problem is you think that Cojo would have had a better game. That's because you look at stats, but don't look at how the Clippers didn't guard him. That's a problem when you rely on spacing. That's why he didn't get back in the game and why he'll be the third point guard in this series barring an injury. Danny Green also shot poorly, but I wouldn't bench him for Manu or Beli, who both shot way better than him. I trust Green's overall defense and his ability to hit shots, even if he has a bad game.

  21. #471
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    Yeah, I guess you missed the point where I acknowledged he had a bad game last night. The problem is you think that Cojo would have had a better game. That's because you look at stats, but don't look at how the Clippers didn't guard him. That's a problem when you rely on spacing. That's why he didn't get back in the game and why he'll be the third point guard in this series barring an injury. Danny Green also shot poorly, but I wouldn't bench him for Manu or Beli, who both shot way better than him. I trust Green's overall defense and his ability to hit shots, even if he has a bad game.
    It isn't just one game though. He's been most of the season.

  22. #472
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    You are looking for an opinion or just using that to throw another cute punch at Parker ?
    Opinion, tbh

  23. #473
    selbstverständlich Agloco's Avatar
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    He has been all season. I never once saw Parker get the blame for any of his games this season.
    A great many games yes, not all year though. Leave the hyperbole on the curb, it makes it hard to take you seriously. He's gotten plenty of blame even from members of his fan club. You haven't been looking hard enough my friend.

  24. #474
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    It isn't just one game though. He's been most of the season.
    Again, what's your point? He's still better than what we got behind him, by far. You can complain all you want, but he's what we got, and despite what you think, there wasn't another player out there that you could get to upgrade. That said, he's good enough to get us a le, like he did last year. And before you start saying how bad he was last year, save it. You can think he sucks, just don't propose silly solutions like playing Mills and Cojo for 30 minutes. You might as well advocate for more minutes for Ayers, and go completely nonsensical.

  25. #475
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    A great many games yes, not all year though. Leave the hyperbole on the curb, it makes it hard to take you seriously. He's gotten plenty of blame even from members of his fan club. You haven't been looking hard enough my friend.
    OP wants to blame KawhI and wants Kawhi to receive the bulk of the blame. While Parker has received part of the blame his fans have never said that he was the main reason the game was lost even though he was responsible for plenty of them.

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