Cavs: For the LeBron stans

[Clipper Nation]

They only great team in the West was the Dream/Sampson Rockets, a team quickly derailed by injuries as they look poised to dominate the conference for years to come.

And the Showtime Lakers lost to them in 5, since they weren't the usual cupcake opponent

[JoeTait75]

Blazers were not good throughout Drexler's career? Kevin Johnson's Suns were scrubs too? The WC was not chocked with scrub teams. And the EC was LOADED. So loaded that MJ didn't win during Bird's or Magic's primes.

The Blazers and Suns didn't become le contenders until the end of the 1980's. During that entire decade the only WC team that beat the Lake Show in a playoff series was the Houston Rockets, while the only WC teams the Lake Show didn't beat in the playoffs were the Rockets and the Clippers (who never made the playoffs in the '80s.) There were no teams like the 76ers or Bucks to counterbalance L.A.'s dominance out West.

The Lakers beat the Pistons, Celtics (twice), and Philly (twice) in the Finals. From 1980-1989, either the Lakers or Boston (or BOTH) were in the Finals every year. We were STACKED.

Of course they were stacked, but that's my point: playing in the weaker conference didn't make the Showtime Lakers any less great.

[baseline bum]

Yep. The Suns didn't become a threat until they paired Barkley with KJ. And Drexler's Blazers were a one hit wonder Finals appearance. They only great team in the West was the Dream/Sampson Rockets, a team quickly derailed by injuries as they look poised to dominate the conference for years to come.

That Rockets team wasn't . They never looked poised to dominate the conference, not with soft ass Ralph Sampson getting owned by Jerry Sichting and their horrible guard play. The Lakers just the bed that series. And the Blazers were an early 90s team, they had one 50 win season in the 80s.

[baseline bum]

The Blazers and Suns didn't become le contenders until the end of the 1980's. During that entire decade the only WC team that beat the Lake Show in a playoff series was the Houston Rockets, while the only WC teams the Lake Show didn't beat in the playoffs were the Rockets and the Clippers (who never made the playoffs in the '80s.) There were no teams like the 76ers or Bucks to counterbalance L.A.'s dominance out West.

Yeah, Portland never took off until they landed Buck Williams. Man I hated seeing him wasted on that garbage Nets team for so many years.

[Malik Hairston]

memphis nearly knocked OKC out last year in the first round... and had a strong chance is zbo wasn't suspended. the spurs were pushed to 7 by dallas. even though memphis and dallas weren't contenders... they very nearly knocked out the 2 strongest contenders in the conference.

the spurs were rolling in the 2nd half of the season but lost because they got the clippers in the first round. switch the spurs and the cavs, and the spurs are in the finals right now tbh

Lebron's teams have had great records vs. the West

[Bynumite]

Lebron's teams have had great records vs. the West

2 of 5 is hardly a great record vs the west

[Malik Hairston]

2 of 5 is hardly a great record vs the west

I thought we were discussing the regular season, no?

[K...]

On one hand, you have lebron, teaming up with the 2 next best eastern conf players and going 2-4 against the WEst in the finals. That's good.

Then you have Cleveland going to the finals twice and lets assume they get swept again.
Has Lebron proven anything by taking Cleveland to the finals? Imean losing in the finals is sweet and all, spursfans right? But isn't it a loser nonetheless?






Now, lets imagine two years from now Durant goes to DC. Durant goes to the finals and is swept. Durant now has a finals loss with OKC (and a solid playoff run regardless) and finals loss with DC, IS he equal to Lebron?


I mean the comparison holds up except we don't get to see Durant in his "Heat" years. But we can easily imagine OKC a three superstar team, playing in the east and easily reaching the ECF. If OKC and Miami played in the ECF 3 years in a row how to you feel that goes? Is durant > Lebron?



I'm splitting hairs here,Lebron has never had a losing team since entering his prime. Only guy better than that is Duncan who never missed the playoffs.

On the other hand you have lebron beating some good eastern teams in Cavs saga pt 1. You have him beating some good eastern teams in Miami and 50% against WC. Then you have this years garbage. THats some pretty weak battles when you look at the western conf.



To sum up. Lebrons legacy depends on a few more things. Can he win a third le. Second, will he be tied to drug use. If we start testing for HGH and future stars are forbidden from using it, and a guy like Dirk managed to put up amazing stats without juicing, how do you correct their stats? Third, the personality. It's not the worse nor the best. You have Jordan and bird as assholes. You have Duncan as the quiet type, and you have Lebron the part time clown.

[K...]

it, it's true Durant is just as good as lebron. The only difference is western conf vs eastern.


And we can be damn sure Durant doesn't juice.

[spurraider21]

Lebron's teams have had great records vs. the West

are you implying that he'd have an easier time in the playoffs in the west?

you yourself were saying "regular seasons dont matter in these discussions" and now you keep citing lebron's regular season record vs the same west teams...

[DMC]

Odd missing years there between 2004 and 2008. What happened? I must have missed it.

Also of note, assuming 50 wins in a lockout season yet giving the Spurs an asterisk for winning a championship in a lockout season. Caveat Bynumite.

[DMC]

On one hand, you have lebron, teaming up with the 2 next best eastern conf players and going 2-4 against the WEst in the finals. That's good.

Then you have Cleveland going to the finals twice and lets assume they get swept again.
Has Lebron proven anything by taking Cleveland to the finals? Imean losing in the finals is sweet and all, spursfans right? But isn't it a loser nonetheless?






Now, lets imagine two years from now Durant goes to DC. Durant goes to the finals and is swept. Durant now has a finals loss with OKC (and a solid playoff run regardless) and finals loss with DC, IS he equal to Lebron?


I mean the comparison holds up except we don't get to see Durant in his "Heat" years. But we can easily imagine OKC a three superstar team, playing in the east and easily reaching the ECF. If OKC and Miami played in the ECF 3 years in a row how to you feel that goes? Is durant > Lebron?



I'm splitting hairs here,Lebron has never had a losing team since entering his prime. Only guy better than that is Duncan who never missed the playoffs.

On the other hand you have lebron beating some good eastern teams in Cavs saga pt 1. You have him beating some good eastern teams in Miami and 50% against WC. Then you have this years garbage. THats some pretty weak battles when you look at the western conf.



To sum up. Lebrons legacy depends on a few more things. Can he win a third le. Second, will he be tied to drug use. If we start testing for HGH and future stars are forbidden from using it, and a guy like Dirk managed to put up amazing stats without juicing, how do you correct their stats? Third, the personality. It's not the worse nor the best. You have Jordan and bird as assholes. You have Duncan as the quiet type, and you have Lebron the part time clown.

Kidd K thinking his ty takes are suddenly worth something because he just uses "K" now.

A: You say too much that makes no ing sense
B: You're a flaming sexual
C: You still had that avatar that said you like giving head
D: What the are you talking about?

[Malik Hairston]

are you implying that he'd have an easier time in the playoffs in the west?

you yourself were saying "regular seasons dont matter in these discussions" and now you keep citing lebron's regular season record vs the same west teams...

I'm saying it wouldn't matter, his teams records were just as good vs. the West during the regular season, if we're playing this game..

[spurraider21]

I'm saying it wouldn't matter, his teams records were just as good vs. the West during the regular season, if we're playing this game..

you yourself said regular season records dont matter. now suddenly lebron's regular season records vs those same teams matter

[DMC]

you yourself said regular season records dont matter. now suddenly lebron's regular season records vs those same teams matter

Philo you don't ing get it. Maybe a hair got across your eyes and blindfolded you.

If you're using RS like this thread is, then that's one thing, but that doesn't mean Harlem agrees that RS is relevant.

[Bynumite]

I'm saying it wouldn't matter, his teams records were just as good vs. the West during the regular season, if we're playing this game..

Just a few months ago you thought Lebron was a coon and an uncle tom and you hated his guts for leaving Miami.

Damn son. You jumped back on the Lebron bandwagon faster than Lebron went back to ol' massa Gilbert

[Malik Hairston]

you yourself said regular season records dont matter. now suddenly lebron's regular season records vs those same teams matter

They don't matter..this thread is about the ing regular season, though..

The records discussed in this thread are regular season records..

[Malik Hairston]

Philo you don't ing get it. Maybe a hair got across your eyes and blindfolded you.

If you're using RS like this thread is, then that's one thing, but that doesn't mean Harlem agrees that RS is relevant.

[Malik Hairston]

Just a few months ago you thought Lebron was a coon and an uncle tom and you hated his guts for leaving Miami.

Damn son. You jumped back on the Lebron bandwagon faster than Lebron went back to ol' massa Gilbert

I don't like Lebron and I don't even think he has been that great in the playoffs this year, I'm just arguing the points the OP is attempting to make..

[Bynumite]

Coasting through sweeps vs weak eastern teams =/= 6/7 game series vs elite 50+ wins western teams

Lebron goes to the Finals with more rest and probably less games as well and only has a 2/5 Finals record to show for it

[Malik Hairston]

Coasting through sweeps vs weak eastern teams =/= 6/7 game series vs elite 50+ wins western teams

Lebron goes to the Finals with more rest and probably less games as well and only has a 2/5 Finals record to show for it

that's some terrible logic, tbh..the path to the Finals has virtually no effect on the outcome in the actual Finals, there are dozens and dozens of examples of it..

The East series' are probably more grueling, though, tbh..teams with lesser talent generally play harder and more physical, since they can't rely on offensive talent..Lebron's Heat had a more difficult time with the Pacers and Celtics than they did vs. the Thunder and even the Spurs, for example..

[spurraider21]

They don't matter..this thread is about the ing regular season, though..

The records discussed in this thread are regular season records..

this thread is about playoff wins. its not asking "how many regular season wins does lebron have against 50 win teams"

but your point in all this is that lebron would have just as easy a time reaching the finals in the west... to make that point, you are saying

a) the regular season record of west teams dont matter

but at the same time are saying

b) lebron's good regular season record against them is indicative of how he'd do in the playoffs

its not consistent

[Malik Hairston]

this thread is about playoff wins. its not asking "how many regular season wins does lebron have against 50 win teams"

but your point in all this is that lebron would have just as easy a time reaching the finals in the west... to make that point, you are saying

a) the regular season record of west teams dont matter

but at the same time are saying

b) lebron's good regular season record against them is indicative of how he'd do in the playoffs

its not consistent

Bro, are you serious? How are those win totals calculated? Based on the outcomes of which games? The thread is discussing 50-win regular season teams and implying that the win totals of those teams is indicative of the quality of that team..

[spurraider21]

i get what the thread is about. but you dismiss the strength of the west by saying their regular season records dont matter.... and then use lebron's regular season record vs the west as an indication that he'd do just as well. you dismiss the importance of regular season records to make one point, and then use regular season records to make your second point. its inconsistent.

[Malik Hairston]

You used that logic before I did, by implying that Lebron would have a more difficult time in the West, based on the records of the teams in the West..I only rebutted, using your logic, G..

I don't really use the regular season as any type of barometer for teams, I was just replying to the logic used in this thread(yours included) that is implying Lebron would have a tougher time in the West, which is an argument completely dependent on the regular season records of those teams as the basis of the argument..