Jimmer Fredette to the Spurs (Update: Mostly Non-Guaranteed Training Camp Deal)

[playjimmer]

This thread nearing 30 pages is starting to look embarrassing, tbh...

People doubting Jimmer is embarrassing, tbh...

[Birn]

This whole narrative about his shot needs fixing is a complete fallacy made up by some message board jerk off who thinks he's an NBA shooting coach. If Jimmer performs well in camp and makes plays, he'll make the team. If he doesn't stand out or prove to add some value to the team, he'll be released. Simple as that. Don't know where all this talk is coming from about his shooting form. If someone can post a link or something that has been published about the Spurs wanting to see him change his form, please share.

[Chinook]

This whole narrative about his shot needs fixing is a complete fallacy made up by some message board jerk off who thinks he's an NBA shooting coach. If Jimmer performs well in camp and makes plays, he'll make the team. If he doesn't stand out or prove to add some value to the team, he'll be released. Simple as that. Don't know where all this talk is coming from about his shooting form. If someone can post a link or something that has been published about the Spurs wanting to see him change his form, please share.

[Obstructed_View]

This thread nearing 30 pages is starting to look embarrassing, tbh...

What's really stupid is that someone thinks that his shooting is the weak part of his game.

[Chinook]

What's really stupid is that someone thinks that his shooting is the weak part of his game.

It's more than some group of people think that his calling card isn't NBA level, which calls into question is ability to stick in the league.

[spurraider21]

What's really stupid is that someone thinks that his shooting is the weak part of his game.

nobody is calling it his weak point. he's a one trick pony and the trick is shooting. people are questioning if he's good enough at that trick to stick in the nba

[Obstructed_View]

It's more than some group of people think that his calling card isn't NBA level, which calls into question is ability to stick in the league.

I tend to agree with that, which is why he's taking non-guaranteed contracts to be the 15th guy on the roster. I guess I somehow misunderstood "his shot is broken". His calling card was good enough to get him drafted in the lottery. But it's realistically every other part of his game which calls into question his ability to stick in the league. Pop usually has a guard version of Matt Bonner. Last year it was Marco, and he's got some other skills that Jimmer probably doesn't possess.

[Chinook]

I tend to agree with that, which is why he's taking non-guaranteed contracts to be the 15th guy on the roster. I guess I somehow misunderstood "his shot is broken". His calling card was good enough to get him drafted in the lottery. But it's realistically every other part of his game which calls into question his ability to stick in the league. Pop usually has a guard version of Matt Bonner. Last year it was Marco, and he's got some other skills that Jimmer probably doesn't possess.

I think it's just semantics. Of course I agree that if Jimmer were an all-around player, the fact that his shooting form is broken wouldn't matter. Look at Marion and his busted form (which was at least quick, mind you). But I also think that if his form weren't broken (if he could get his shot off fast enough to be as successful in the NBA as in college), he'd be fine.

Simply put, his form is not ideal, and it leaves no margin for error. That's just not acceptable for a guy who's supposed to be a shooter. Even if he fixes, his form, he's not going to be much better than the slew of other shooters in and around the league. Jimmer has a lot of growth ahead of him if he's to make a legit rotation.

[beirmeistr]

Speaking of someone needing his shot fixed, I wonder what would have happened if the Spurs had drafted Shawn Marion?

[Chinook]

Speaking of someone needing his shot fixed, I wonder what would have happened if the Spurs had drafted Shawn Marion?

"They did." - TGY

[beirmeistr]

"They did." - TGY

are you kidding?

[Chinook]

are you kidding?

Lucky you for not knowing that schtick.

[beirmeistr]

Lucky you for not knowing that schtick.

I don't get it---I looked it up and Marion was drafted by the Suns. Were the Spurs interested or what?

[Yuixafun]

I think someone compares Kawhi to Marion..

[Chinook]

I don't get it---I looked it up and Marion was drafted by the Suns. Were the Spurs interested or what?

TGY ( TheGreatYacht ) has a schtick where he says Kawhi is essentially Marion reincarnated (meaning a defender who's offensively limited and who isn't able to be a true star).

[beirmeistr]

TGY ( TheGreatYacht ) has a schtick where he says Kawhi is essentially Marion reincarnated (meaning a defender who's offensively limited and who isn't able to be a true star).

ok, now I get it. thanks for the explanation.

[dabom]

Jimmer is 6 2 and cant defend people his size. He's going to go up again way taller people for his position. Dude shoots top low for the the NBA. Dude Isa Bum

[HankChinaski]

NBA Training Camp needs to start tomorrow for a lot of people here. 26 pages of jimmer talk...

[Birn]

Jimmer is 6 2 and cant defend people his size. He's going to go up again way taller people for his position. Dude shoots top low for the the NBA. Dude Isa Bum

JJ Re says o.

[BatManu20]

Jimmer is 6 2 and cant defend people his size. He's going to go up again way taller people for his position. Dude shoots top low for the the NBA. Dude Isa Bum

6'2 is a generous listing too, tbh. Looks closer to 6'1.

[Spurtacular]

Tebow won one playoff game and then got destroyed. Even when he was "winning", he was horrible statistically. The point I was making is that despite being a high-character guy, he didn't seem to think he needed to make obvious changes to his game to make it to the pros. The same seems true of Jimmer. He's been in the league for too damned long to shoot like his does.



Essentially, people who are arguing that the Spurs' system will get the best out of him are asserting that the looks he'll get will allow him to show how good of a shooter he is. But there are probably a hundred players who can make threes at a good rate if all they do is spot up. I'd much rather have Eddie, who's a better shooter and bigger (and younger) over Jimmer for the role Fredette would have.



Don't understand this at all.

Well, I don't know how much of it was that Tebow wouldn't change or couldn't change or I'd argue a third option that he legitimately didn't see the benefit of changing (drastically). But all that is beside the point I guess.

I've followed Jimmer; and to the best of my knowledge, the Kings and Pelicans never asked him to change his shooting mechanics. If the Spurs want to work with him at changes, I believe he'll be receptive. Personally, I don't think his mechanics are necessarily the issue that people are making it out to be. Yes, Jimmer has a high release. So, did Ray Allen. The Spurs worked with KL to get his release higher. But certainly, Jimmer could be aided by learning to release at different points ala Curry.

There are plenty of good three shooters. But the argument that Jimmer is only one of many should be tempered. We wouldn't use that argument for Danny Green. Even before he improved his defense and mental for ude, we weren't going there, imo. Jimmer is a guy that can shoot 40 plus percent from three; and there aren't that many guys like that, tbh. He has led the league from deep threes at times; so, he is at another elite level when it comes to shooting the three. That is obviously the intrigue about him for many. Also, he is a guy who wants to shoot the ball in the pressure situations; he is a guy that has proved that he will make some of his biggest shots when they count the most.

As for for Eddie, I mentioned a critical mass of minutes, and you say you don't understand. Well, what's better having him on the bench night after night or being in the d-league working on his game? That's the same reason that Anderson was sent to Austin last year (in addition to his early struggles), and it's the reason that CoJo volunteered to go to the d-league at one point. So, bringing Eddie up for him to sit on the end of the bench doesn't make sense if Pop thinks Jimmer can contribute. And tbh, I believe this is how the FO sees it.

[Spurtacular]

No way in McCallum will be cut.

I don't think it's likely. I'm just noting that it's within the realm of possibility.

[ChumpDumper]

I don't think it's likely. I'm just noting that it's within the realm of possibility.

If he dies or something like that.

[Spurtacular]

Let's be clear, I didn't make it out to be anything. It's widely used. I was also not even the first to bring it up. Someone else told you how bad Jimmer's ratio was. They were off a little though as it's about 1.75. Still ty. But, not me. I didn't make it out to be anything it is not, or even bring it up. It is one stat of many, it gives some glimpse, and it is not a positive one. I used their number, but do agree with them. And, Kobe? LMFAO. You're comparing a HOFer with Jimmer based upon his asst to turnover ratio. No, Kobe's ratio isn't that relevant. Kobe had a few other things to hang his hat on when he sold himself on the market. You are tryin' to market a limited Jimmer as a point guard, quite significantly, and Jimmer doesn't have Kobe's other talents. So, yes, Jimmer's ratio will be relevant and scrutinized. Lastly, one of the most criticized aspects of Kobe's game was he was a black hole that didn' get his teammates involved, so even that aspect of Kobe's game was scrutinized! I don't know that it's a win for you to be comparing him to Kobe. And, Kobe is not a PG, either. Compare him to PG if you want to talk up his ability to play that position and talk down McCallum's, but you probably tried to find some other PG with ty ratios and found out they were all ty players so you ran with Kobe.

But, could he improve in a better situation, sure. He could. But, he still has an uphill battle vs the points as a point, or the shootings as a shooting guard.

As someone who's watched Jimmer, I've never been overly concerned with his turnovers. His value is in whether he's getting shots and getting them to drop. His secondary value is being an offensive catalyst. His ability to drive and kick as well as to spread the floor has created offense not explicitly represented by an a:t ratio. His presence has led to a lot of frantic defensive rotations; and I'd say due to defenders crashing on him, he racks up a lot of hockey assists not counted on a normal a:t ratio.

And I wasn't comparing Jimmer to Kobe btw. I was simply showing you one example of the limitations of a:t ratio.

And as an aside, Jimmer has played for coaches who have routinely taken him out when he does any little thing wrong. Pop will do that to players when a mistake is so egregious; but he doesn't do it as a routine. I expect Jimmer's faith in the system that doesn't punish him for any mishap to help him to improve confidence and subsequently various stats including hopefully a:t ratio.

[Spurtacular]

I think I'm going to enjoy the rest of my evening now offline, but I urge you to rethink and listen to that interview if you have any hope that McCallum will be cut.

I have listened to that interview. In fact, I've quoted that interview to you. And I never said I hoped that McCallum got cut. I am actually 'hoping' it's Reggie Williams that is cut/traded at this point. I was just telling you that if certain players play well and McCallum doesn't, then you may not be seeing him around for long.