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Just dumb?
I was curious what light the audio would shed on the first video, never expected something like this.
Well that was dumb.You were asking about that audio? How about a second video from inside the truck too?
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=488_1457473498
Burns, OR - An FBI agent is suspected of lying about firing twice at Robert "LaVoy" Fini and may have gotten help from four other FBI agents in covering up afterward, authorities revealed Tuesday.
The bullets didn't hit Fini and didn't contribute to his death, but now all five unnamed agents, part of an elite national unit, are under criminal investigation by the U.S. Justice Department. Inspector General Michael Horowitz is leading the independent inquiry.
The remarkable disclosure came as a team of local investigators released findings that two state troopers shot Fini three times in the back during the chaotic scene at a police roadblock Jan. 26. One bullet pierced his heart, an autopsy showed.
A prosecutor ruled the fatal shooting was legally justified, saying state law allows use of deadly force when officers believe a person is about to seriously injure or kill someone. Fini kept moving his hands toward a pocket that contained a loaded handgun. Although he was shot
from behind, Fini had a trooper in front of him armed with a Taser who was thought to be in danger.
Fini , 54, an Arizona rancher, was one of the leaders of the Jan. 2 takeover of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge near Burns.
Investigators gave no details to explain why the one FBI agent, a member of the Hostage Rescue Team, wouldn't report the two shots. They also didn't indicate what his four colleagues on the team did to warrant investigation other than saying it was related to conduct after the shooting.
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http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-sta...ie_uncove.html
Bullet hole on LaVoy Fini 's truck traced to elite FBI team
BEND – Something didn't seem right about the bullet hole in the top of Robert "LaVoy" Fini 's white Dodge pickup.
Investigators from the Deschutes County Sheriff's Office could account for bullet holes in the left front hood, the driver's side mirror and the front grille. They came from the automatic weapon of a state trooper who had fired three times at the truck as Fini raced at 70 mph toward a police roadblock on Jan. 26.
The angle of a fourth bullet hole didn't match the others.
An elaborate computer analysis, a review of the FBI aerial video of the shooting scene and a video from a passenger in Fini 's pickup produced a result that startled the team poring over evidence into Fini 's fatal shooting that day.
The fourth round, police concluded, was fired by an FBI agent who subsequently twice denied to investigators ever firing his gun. As the investigation proceeded, detectives determined he also fired a second time, but didn't hit anything at the scene.
The discovery of that gunfire and conduct afterward by the agent and four other agents have triggered a criminal investigation that could result in the prosecution of all five. The agents all serve on the FBI's Hostage Rescue Team. Authorities on Tuesday released few details about the matter and didn't identify the agents by name.
But the disclosure is a jolt to the FBI. The Oregon investigators two weeks ago flew to Washington, D.C., to directly brief top FBI officials about their findings. The U.S. Justice Department's Office of Inspector General is now investigating along with the Deschutes County Sheriff's Office. The Inspector General's Office, which is separate from the FBI, doesn't discuss active investigations.
As the 41-day takeover of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge unfolded, the violent outcomes of standoffs at Idaho's Ruby Ridge and in Waco, Texas, were on the minds of law enforcement, occupiers and self-styled militia. No one wanted to trigger a confrontation similar to those events, which resulted in the deaths of civilians and led to harsh criticism of federal agents.
Detectives investigating the Fini shooting questioned the five FBI agents at least twice, including the night of the shooting. Such questioning is standard for officer-involved shootings.
The Hostage Rescue Team is among the FBI's most elite outfits. The members have no other job but to work full time as a SWAT-style group, operating from the FBI base in Quantico, Virginia. The team is the FBI's global resource for anti-terrorism operations, but it also is selectively deployed across the country to deal with hostage situations or other unique crises.
One investigator working on the task force pulled together by the Deschutes County Sheriff's Office reported that he had been told soon after the shooting that two state troopers and two FBI agents had fired. He said the FBI agents approached him later to say they hadn't fired their weapons.
In separate interviews later that night, those two FBI agents and the other three on duty at the shooting scene said they hadn't discharged their weapons and repeated these statements in a second round of interviews Feb. 5, investigators reported.
The second time, the agents insisted that an attorney be present and that they be given an opportunity to "reference their prior statements" if they were going to be asked questions they had already answered in the first interview.
"Of particular concern to all of us is that the HRT (Hostage Rescue Team) operators did not disclose their shots to our investigators or their superiors," said Deschutes County Sheriff Shane Nelson in a prepared statement. "Nor did they discuss specific actions they took after the shooting, which are the subject of an ongoing investigation."
Authorities haven't described those "specific actions."
Nelson said "conclusive evidence" about the agents' conduct was presented to U.S. Attorney Bill Williams in Bend on Feb. 18. The next day, the evidence was shown to Greg Bretzing, special agent in charge of the Portland FBI office. On Feb. 20, agents from the Justice Department's inspector general and the FBI's Inspections Division traveled to Bend to review the evidence.
Nelson and Dan Norris, the Malheur County district attorney overseeing the shooting investigation, then traveled to brief top FBI officials in Washington.
Tim Colahan, Harney County district attorney who asked Norris to handle the shooting investigation, said in a prepared statement that "we will continue to work to determine how the HRT operators' actions played into the events. We reserve the right, as Oregonians, to hold wrongdoers accountable for their actions."
With the indications of FBI misconduct, the Malheur takeover now carries echoes of Ruby Ridge, which resulted in scathing investigations of the FBI and the eventual conviction of an FBI official. The 1992 siege in Idaho started when police sought to arrest anti-government extremist Randy Weaver. His son and his wife were both shot to death during that operation, as was a U.S. marshal.
The resulting investigations into misconduct and mistakes forced the FBI to overhaul its policy for using deadly force and for how it investigates agent-involved shootings. It also prompted changes in the way the FBI deploys the Hostage Rescue Team.
The Justice Department investigated as did the Senate Judiciary Committee's Subcommittee on Terrorism, Technology and Government Information. Both found numerous problems with the FBI's conduct during and after Ruby Ridge. The Senate committee cited a poorly executed search by the FBI for evidence, among other things.
"At least one important piece of evidence – a bullet – was removed and then replaced by FBI agents coordinating the search," the committee found.
"Throughout the course of its many reports, the FBI accorded its own agents undue deference," the report said. "Their stories were accepted at face value and were only rarely subject of probing inquiry."
The committee urged public airings of government misconduct for accountability.
"If our government is to maintain – indeed, even deserve – the trust of the American people, it cannot fear or avoid the truth," the committee said in its final report.
Is there a deeper conspiracy attached to this?
Just dumb?
I was curious what light the audio would shed on the first video, never expected something like this.
Yes. i see no real reason for the agents to do this.
Is there a deeper conspiracy you are attaching to this?I was curious what light the audio would shed on the first video, never expected something like this.
I said from the start I just wanted to hear the audio to see what actually happened and when shots were fired as the initial footage was inconclusive. Drop the conspiracy talk.
Why would an elite FBI agent lie about firing shots, and why would his team also lie to cover for him? What this elite FBI team dis was not "just dumb".
Is there a deeper conspiracy you are attaching to this?
Yes or no.
No. But I'll continue to follow the story and ask questions. You are welcome to participate.
Why would an elite FBI agent lie about firing shots, and why would his team also lie to cover for him?
Finally.
Because he Fd up and they are backing their compadre?
Glad that's out of the way. Why would an elite FBI agent lie about firing shots, and why would his team also lie to cover for him?
ed up how?
My guess is they had stricter rules of engagement than the troopers and didn't want their superiors finding out they fired in that situation. If there is no deeper conspiracy as you finally claimed, what else would you think it is?
By firing a firearm.
This wasn't your average itchy trigger fingered cop, this was the FBI's elite.
Don't know, but I'll continue to follow the story as it progresses.
So you see no other possible motive for their actions despite your following the progress of the story all this time?
I guess you'll have to stick to Nbadanesque innuendo.
You obviously see other possible motives as well unless this is your only guess and you'd like to revise it to a statement.
"My guess is they had stricter rules of engagement than the troopers and didn't want their superiors finding out they fired in that situation."
How does that statement imply other guesses?
It doesn't.
That is my guess.
Period.
My statement stands as posted.
If you want to discuss other possibilities you have thought of, no one is stopping you from revising your statement claiming you don't know of any other possibilities.
Do you want to discuss other possibilities you have thought of or do you just want your innuendo to be your statement, dan?
Could your guess be wrong?
Don't change your question now. Answer mine.
Do you want to discuss other possibilities you have thought of or do you just want your innuendo to be your statement, dan?
I haven't made any guesses for any motive that was all you. Could your guess be wrong?
Don't change your question now. Answer mine.
Do you want to discuss other possibilities you have thought of or do you just want your innuendo to be your statement, dan?
So your question would be why did he fire.
I don't know.
What do you think?
Whoa didn't see a copy paste of the same question coming you are really changing your game up, who'd have guessed.
Your question was answered I haven't made any guesses to the FBI's motive, I don't have an "other" possibility to discuss.
Dont run away from your guess/statement now. Could your guess be wrong? This is where you answer yes and this is where I ask you what else could they be lying about...being that you came out with your guess and all.
Yes. And I don't know either.
So there's really nothing to discuss.
I made my guess and that's it.
Keep "monitoring that situation" or maybe just grow a pair and say what you think happened, dan. I already did.
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