Will Pop let his players kneel during the anthem?

[baseline bum]

Jesus Loves you

Did you hear that in a Mexican prison?

[apalisoc_9]

Did you hear that in a Mexican prison?

[Birn]

Probably unnoticed in Pop's interview is how he aknwoledged that typically change only happens through political pressure. It's a great touch in history. It's always wrong to kill people or be violent about your stance, but in many cir stances, the problems oppressed people face are way too deep for a gradual systematic change to happen.

Kapernick and all the kneelers are not even being violent. They're simply applying societal pressure on the US in hopes for a change. It's brave and People should stand up to what is right.

The United States of America is not Justice..You dont blindly go patriotic on whatever america does and its societal structure. You take actions to improve the current structure.

If every american in the 1800-1900 was your typical white american ignorant trump supporter..Muslims demons, black are thugs, mexicans this etc.. The US wouldnt be the country it is today full of power.

The forefathers like Abraham Lincoln are all closer to TGY, trill, TD21, Harlem in thinking than your average white poster.

Abraham Lincoln - Republican
Martin Luther King - Republican
George Washington Carver - Republican
Harriet Tubman - Republican
Frederick Douglas - Republican
Jackie Robinson - Republican
Edward Brooke - Republican
Sojourner Truth - Republican
Mary McLeod Bethune - Republican
Rosa Parks - Republican

KKK - founded as the militant arm of the Democratic Party
Senator Robert Byrd - Democrat - first member of KKK elected to Congress and was a mentor of Hillary Clinton

Democrats like Robert Byrd, George Wallace, Bull Connor and their ilk fought viciously against Civil Rights while Republican leaders throughout history have fought for freedom and liberty for ALL Americans.



Republicans forced Congress to bring the Civil Rights Act to a vote in 1960 and never gave up until finally convincing racist Democrat president LBJ to sign it into law. Democrats in Congress were overwhelmingly against the law.

[Birn]

All the various gestures are now a fad. The impact is over. That being said, I can see a LaMarcus Aldridge doing it because he is a follower. Sadly, nothing is going to be done about the problem until the public holds the government accountable for positive change. All this other stuff is "look at me" bull .

Agree 100%.

It's all about drawing attention to themselves. If you have a genuine and sincere belief in what you're protesting then you should be able to effectively communicate and defend your positions. The problem is most of these athletes are just following along thinking that kneeling during the anthem is actually going to make a difference. They're incapable of communicating about these issues. A far more effective approach is to actually get involved in these "oppressed" communities and give your time and your money to improve people's lives. These idiots make the same mistakes that so many other people make in that they think it's the government's job to bring the systemic change in our society. Newsflash....if you want to get anything done right don't rely on government buraucrats to get it done. People have to be the engine of change and the only country on earth where the people determine their own success is in the USA. That's a big reason why 99% of Americans stand during the playing of the national anthem.

[dabom]

Only ing re s don't understand the transition between republicans and democrats in history. Let's just keep it short and simple. The south has and will always be backwards. Except Texas.

[Chinook]

Did you hear that in a Mexican prison?

"Te quiero, vato. Now, don't move."

[Chinook]

All the various gestures are now a fad. The impact is over. That being said, I can see a LaMarcus Aldridge doing it because he is a follower. Sadly, nothing is going to be done about the problem until the public holds the government accountable for positive change. All this other stuff is "look at me" bull .

"Look at me" is the point of the protests, though. That this thread exists and that people are asking players and coaches about it every interview is showing that it's relevant still. This isn't going to be like sit-ins and boycotts, where there is a huge economic threat to force change. The oppressing party is too diffuse, and if it's supposed to be the police, that's just a horrible idea to "boycott" them. So the only other option is to annoy/guilt people into agreeing for the change. And that happens by this never ending and increasing and it taking away from the game. Folks want sports to be a refuge from politics. Well, take that refuge away and don't give it back until you get what you want.

[benefactor]

Did you hear that in a Mexican prison?

[tmtcsc]

"Look at me" is the point of the protests, though. That this thread exists and that people are asking players and coaches about it every interview is showing that it's relevant still. This isn't going to be like sit-ins and boycotts, where there is a huge economic threat to force change. The oppressing party is too diffuse, and if it's supposed to be the police, that's just a horrible idea to "boycott" them. So the only other option is to annoy/guilt people into agreeing for the change. And that happens by this never ending and increasing and it taking away from the game. Folks want sports to be a refuge from politics. Well, take that refuge away and don't give it back until you get what you want.

Discussions are centering around "who is deciding to gesture", "what their gesture is", if the Spurs are going to allow their players to gesture, etc. My point is that the efforts to improve the situation have now taken a back seat to the problem. Black on black homicides and cops killing black people are all the result of a bigger problem. I've said all along that this isn't just a race issue, its an economic issue. Cops having itchy trigger fingers, blacks not trusting the police, poor people turning to crime, much of this is directly related to poor people not getting equal opportunities. There are people who will never be able to change their lives but the country can do something now to help those who want to. Invest $$ in low-income areas - especially in the education system, improve efforts to rehabilitate prisoners, legalize marijuana..those are just some ideas. Anyhoo, back to sports.

[Splits]

Did you hear that in a Mexican prison?

[Chinook]

Discussions are centering around "who is deciding to gesture", "what their gesture is", if the Spurs are going to allow their players to gesture, etc. My point is that the efforts to improve the situation have now taken a back seat to the problem. Black on black homicides and cops killing black people are all the result of a bigger problem. I've said all along that this isn't just a race issue, its an economic issue. Cops having itchy trigger fingers, blacks not trusting the police, poor people turning to crime, much of this is directly related to poor people not getting equal opportunities. There are people who will never be able to change their lives but the country can do something now to help those who want to. Invest $$ in low-income areas - especially in the education system, improve efforts to rehabilitate prisoners, legalize marijuana..those are just some ideas. Anyhoo, back to sports.

But what's a guy like Kaep, or Marshall or Bennett going to do about it? They're not going to pull Pat Tillmans and forsake their careers to be a drop in a bucket. They can do no more on the streets than the average schmuck community organizer could. Sure, they can give all their money to programs aimed at tackling the issue. But compared to the money it would take to actually do anything, it's pitiful, and that wouldn't tackle the social issues anyway.

So instead, he creates a bunch of drama by sitting, and that snowballs into the storylines in the US's two major sports being heavily influenced by what he did and whether others would do the same thing. So now all the folks who just want to get "back to sports" can't, because every game someone is going to be sitting, or kneeling or with a fist of freedom in the air, and the commentators will be talking about it. Or a couple of times every NBA game, the league will run some type of add where they talk about the violence and how it needs to stop. Is that going to instantly cause change? No. But all those people who keep thinking it's not a problem are going to be worn down by the persistent assertions that it is.

Do I agree with you that there are bigger issues going on that affect these incidents than just police training? Of course. But you have to start some place. Letting this drop just brings us back to an untenable status quo. As I said in another thread, there's a real fear culture for both police officers stopping blacks and blacks who are stopped by police officers. I was pulled over the other day, and my friend reached into his pocket to grab his ID, and I legit thought we could both die from it. That's not okay, and that can be addressed before fixing the poverty cycle.

[tmtcsc]

But what's a guy like Kaep, or Marshall or Bennett going to do about it? They're not going to pull Pat Tillmans and forsake their careers to be a drop in a bucket. They can do no more on the streets than the average schmuck community organizer could. Sure, they can give all their money to programs aimed at tackling the issue. But compared to the money it would take to actually do anything, it's pitiful, and that wouldn't tackle the social issues anyway.

So instead, he creates a bunch of drama by sitting, and that snowballs into the storylines in the US's two major sports being heavily influenced by what he did and whether others would do the same thing. So now all the folks who just want to get "back to sports" can't, because every game someone is going to be sitting, or kneeling or with a fist of freedom in the air, and the commentators will be talking about it. Or a couple of times every NBA game, the league will run some type of add where they talk about the violence and how it needs to stop. Is that going to instantly cause change? No. But all those people who keep thinking it's not a problem are going to be worn down by the persistent assertions that it is.

Do I agree with you that there are bigger issues going on that affect these incidents than just police training? Of course. But you have to start some place. Letting this drop just brings us back to an untenable status quo. As I said in another thread, there's a real fear culture for both police officers stopping blacks and blacks who are stopped by police officers. I was pulled over the other day, and my friend reached into his pocket to grab his ID, and I legit thought we could both die from it. That's not okay, and that can be addressed before fixing the poverty cycle.

When I typed "Anyhoo, back to sports", I meant to get back to this being a Spurs basketball forum. I am sure there is a political forum for this type of discussion.

[Chinook]

When I typed "Anyhoo, back to sports", I meant to get back to this being a Spurs basketball forum. I am sure there is a political forum for this type of discussion.

There is, and it has a longer and more heavily debated Kaep thread. And pretty much every other thread on this subforum has nothing to do with this topic and can be discussed freely. So no one's gonna follow you around and badger you about this if you post in like the training camp thread, for example.

But you trying to make this a basketball forum again is exactly why what Kaep is doing is effective. You aren't ignoring it, you're trying to ignore it and not all the way succeeding so far. So long as that inconvenience is there, Kaep's doing his job.

[tmtcsc]

There is, and it has a longer and more heavily debated Kaep thread. And pretty much every other thread on this subforum has nothing to do with this topic and can be discussed freely. So no one's gonna follow you around and badger you about this if you post in like the training camp thread, for example.

But you trying to make this a basketball forum again is exactly why what Kaep is doing is effective. You aren't ignoring it, you're trying to ignore it and not all the way succeeding so far. So long as that inconvenience is there, Kaep's doing his job.

Eh, I said my peace. That's all. We are going to see diminishing returns from the gesturing if we haven't already. Its going to get boring, won't be covered and will lose the attention of the controversy-starved media. Its up to people to get involved with voting and action. Politicians and people much more knowledgeable than me, need to explore and implement change. Offer solutions up for us (or elected reps) to vote on.

[Chinook]

Eh, I said my peace. That's all. We are going to see diminishing returns from the gesturing if we haven't already. Its going to get boring, won't be covered and will lose the attention of the controversy-starved media. Its up to people to get involved with voting and action. Politicians and people much more knowledgeable than me, need to explore and implement change. Offer solutions up for us (or elected reps) to vote on.

Well, yeah. But that's not for Kaep to worry about doing himself. All he can do is leverage his position to raise awareness. And I think he's done a fine job at it. If the NBA and NBPA do what they keep hyping, this will keep escalating. You need politicians to change the law, but you need people to be inconvenienced to convince politicians to do anything -- especially right now.

[Brazil]

Oh, horse ... you ing understand it, because Canadians do the same ing thing. You just enjoy America-bashing and white-bashing. You're en led to your own opinions, but you're not en led to your own facts, you ing racist hypocrite.

http://www.torontosun.com/2015/08/24...orlds-ceremony
http://www.themanitoban.com/2014/10/...-anthem/21322/
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/baseball/ml...ange-1.3676477

It's only been a few months since Dwayne Wade caused a storm for shooting jumpers during O Canada.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...nada-1.3572578


Oh, and the fact that you don't understand doesn't mean . You see EVERYTHING through a ed up lens, so there's a lot you don't understand. I hate ing racists, and you're just as bad as the damned skinheads on the other end of the spectrum.

I did not check this thread untill today but yeah at least somebody got triggered pretty bad tbh

[Brazil]

the whole sport is about getting people together and should be free of politics argument is heavily moronic.

For one Sport has always been involved politics see the black panther fist in 68, jesse owens refusing to do the nazi salute in 36 (pretty sure bunch of whities were giving some arguments about sport in 36 too), terrorist attacks, boycotts etc etc... Then I love the "folks want sport to be a refuge from politics" say who ? The ones annoyed by the kneeling ? Pretty hilarious to believe the way you see the world is the same for everybody... smh

Besides, when you feel discriminate at work you just stand pat and do nothing or do you try the discrimination to stop ? In what universe we should forbid athletes to protest ? Are they doing something illegal ?

Finally kuddos to Harlem, Apo, TGY to shake stuff up...

[boutons_deux]

Coach Pop Calls Race "the Elephant in the Room," Defends Athlete Protesters

“Race is the elephant in the room in our country and the social situation that we’ve all experienced is absolutely disgusting in a lot of ways,” said Popovich.

"What’s really interesting is the people that jump right away to say one is attacking the police or the people that jump on the other side.

It’s a question where understanding and empathy has to trump, no pun intended, any quick reactions of an ideological or demagogical nature.

It’s a topic that can’t just be swung at.

People have to be very accurate and direct in what they say and do.”

“I absolutely understand why they’re doing what they’re doing and I respect their courage for what they’ve done,” said Popovich.

“The question is whether it will do any good or not because it seems that change really seems to happen through political pressure no matter how you look at it.

Whether it’s Dr. King getting large groups of people together and boycotting buses or what’s happened in Carolina with the NBA and other organizations pulling events to make it known what’s going on.

But I think the important thing, with Kaepernick and others, is to keep it in the conversation.”

“My players are engaged citizens who are fully capable of understanding what their values are, what they think is appropriate and inappropriate, what they feel strongly about," he told reporters.

"Whatever actions may or may not be taken are their decisions.

I’m not gonna tell anyone ahead of time that if they don’t do A, B, and C, they’re gonna be gone or traded.

I think that’s ignorant.”

http://www.sacurrent.com/the-daily/a...ete-protesters

[tmtcsc]

“The question is whether it will do any good or not because it seems that change really seems to happen through political pressure no matter how you look at it." -- Coach Pop

Exactly.

[Trill Clinton]

how can you hate pop after hearing this? man i love being a spurs fan

the balls on this guy

[spurs10]

"Look at me" is the point of the protests, though. That this thread exists and that people are asking players and coaches about it every interview is showing that it's relevant still. This isn't going to be like sit-ins and boycotts, where there is a huge economic threat to force change. The oppressing party is too diffuse, and if it's supposed to be the police, that's just a horrible idea to "boycott" them. So the only other option is to annoy/guilt people into agreeing for the change. And that happens by this never ending and increasing and it taking away from the game. Folks want sports to be a refuge from politics. Well, take that refuge away and don't give it back until you get what you want.

It's not as though there are many people who don't want to see less people being unnecessarily shot by the police or anyone else. I thought Pop sounded thoughtful and graceful on the subject.

[ducks]

Nba players have to stand
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/gr...their-courage/

[boutons_deux]

why the play the anthem anyway? why make kids say the pledge of allegiance? It's all statist, empire, military bull brain washing.

[tbdog]

why the play the anthem anyway? why make kids say the pledge of allegiance? It's all statist, empire, military bull brain washing.

Exactly. Heck in 2014, spurs had 9 players who were non American, (10 if you want to include TD). Why have a national anthem for a global game?

EDIT

Add one more. I already forgot about Bonner.

[jermaine]

Welp.... Pop answered that question. He's not telling his players what they can or can't do.