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  1. #76
    EAT IT!!! Kawhitstorm's Avatar
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    It was so funny to watch Lebron struggling like against him
    Le also struggled against Diaw 1.0 in 2013:


  2. #77
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    Kyle has had a terrible junior year, but that can be attributed to playing too much SF -- which isnt the best position for him.

    Kyle is best at the PF spot.

    He has the size, length and can move his feet well -- which is huge for switching in PnRs or switching on back door cuts or down screens. Its an edge the Spurs have when he plays the small ball PF or PF defensively -- since most offense in todays NBA is initiated from the PnR or from perimeter. On top of that, hes a solid rebounder, and just about every team doesnt have a PF that can execute efficiently from the low block in the long run -- so there shouldnt be a concern regarding Kyles post defense against physical PFs.

    Offensively, Kyle can actually utilize his strengths more effectively since the players guarding him are typically slower/ not as athletic. He can also utilize his true skills as the secondary play maker if hes the PnR roller -- setting the screen, receiving a pocket pass around FT line after the ball handler is hedged. In this position, Kyle would have the ball in his hands to make a play in a 4 on 3 situation that lasts about 3 seconds til the hedger recovers. So much better than just being parked at the 3 point line as he would as a back up wing, helping the defense play 5 on 4 -- since most teams just ignore him or cheat over closer to the strong side of the play.

    Spurs will have to go small in the playoffs against the best teams ( GS, CLE, HOU ) and thats where I think Bertans and Kyle will be more valuable than Gasol.
    I think there's a good chance, that Anderson and Bertans are rotation players next season. They're ideal compliments to one another, since the former can provide the defensive rebounding that the latter can't and the latter can provide the spacing that the former can't.

    Since Bertans is a more versatile shooter than the typical stretch four and has a quick release, it wouldn't surprise me if teams have a wing defend him and hide their power forward on Anderson. Unless it's a mobile four, that's when Anderson's ability to create for himself should come into play.

    He'll technically be the small forward because that's who he'll be guarding, but he'll essentially be playing power forward offensively.

  3. #78
    Guest Personality Hoops Czar's Avatar
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    That wasn't his man FFS. And it was Korver who burned him (twice), not Irving.
    It was a simple slip screen. Kyle should have made the switch but instead, let Love free himself for an open three in the corner. Kawhi couldn't because he was draped all over Irving. Great defenders have to be self aware. Kyle has his moments but he's nowhere near great because he has too many mental lapses on the court.

  4. #79
    MORE LIFE SOON COME 313's Avatar
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    Not sold on that yet... today he had a good defensive game though

  5. #80
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    It was a simple slip screen. Kyle should have made the switch but instead, let Love free himself for an open three in the corner. Kawhi couldn't because he was draped all over Irving. Great defenders have to be self aware. Kyle has his moments but he's nowhere near great because he has too many mental lapses on the court.
    No. Kyle's man was Thompson. Anderson was supposed to trap, not Kawhi.

  6. #81
    Veteran sasaint's Avatar
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    No. Kyle's man was Thompson. Anderson was supposed to trap, not Kawhi.
    In the post-game interview, Kawhi sounded as if it were his blown coverage, although he didn't actually say so.

  7. #82
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    No. Kyle's man was Thompson. Anderson was supposed to trap, not Kawhi.
    The idea was to guard the perimeter and that's what he was doing. Why would you put a great defender on the only non threat to tie the game? Danny green was originally guarding Love. When Irving went to the top of the key, Green went to help Kawhi on the trap leaving Kyle to switch onto Love. So which great defender made the mistake? Green or Kyle?

  8. #83
    Good to Great hsxvvd's Avatar
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    Good. Let's trade him then. If he's so legit, I'm sure teams are lighting up the phones.

  9. #84
    Good to Great hsxvvd's Avatar
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    we may need him to be against GS ... someone has to defend Durant when Kawhi and Green are on the Splash Brothers
    Then we should quit now.

  10. #85
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    like always after one good game... cannot wait next 15 crappy ones with the 2 pts 1 reb and 1 assist in 17 mn

  11. #86
    Done with the NBA
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    we may need him to be against GS ... someone has to defend Durant when Kawhi and Green are on the Splash Brothers
    The only way to guard Curry and Klay is to switch everything so I don't know what the plans are. If Kyle is in the plans then he should be playing more in the regular season in some smaller lineups.

  12. #87
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    The idea was to guard the perimeter and that's what he was doing. Why would you put a great defender on the only non threat to tie the game? Danny green was originally guarding Love. When Irving went to the top of the key, Green went to help Kawhi on the trap leaving Kyle to switch onto Love. So which great defender made the mistake? Green or Kyle?
    Green was guarding Irving, Kawhi Love, Kyle, Thompson. Irving cut to the ball with Green trailing. The Spurs clearly planned to trap off Thompson, but instead of doing that, Kawhi jumped out. Kyle was supposed to do that, but for some reason he also thought Kawhi was supposed to do that. So Kawhi's man leaked to the corner. It's extremely obvious who's covering who if you watch the whole pre-inbounds movement and not just a still.

  13. #88
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    In the post-game interview, Kawhi sounded as if it were his blown coverage, although he didn't actually say so.
    Yes... and Pop after the game was still talking to the team 20 minutes about the play per the media ElNono shared. I doubt just the one guy messed up... It's possible Pop emphasized the discussion bc it was several guys who didn't execute the coverages Pop wanted. It's possible both Kawhi and Kyle were to blame...

    I agree with Chinook that Kawhi was guarding Love and decided to trap when that was not his role prompting a confusion and a switch rotation that wasn't automatic. If Kawhi trapped and it wasn't his role Kyle needed to switch but it wasn't automatic bc maybe they weren't going to switch or trap. Were they supposed to not trap at all? Did Irving evade Danny prompting all of them to blow all their coverages?

    I thought Kyle still realized the situation and made it to a contest but Pop emphasizing the breakdown so much means to me that it was on more than just the one guy who made it to a close out at the end. There was more than one defensive problem in the play I think.

    Still I enjoyed this game and win very much.

  14. #89
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    https://youtu.be/nIeST5J0gbI?t=552

    As I said above, there are two possibilities for what kind of D the Spurs were playing: man or zone. Either case would have resulted in Kawhi having the responsibility for Love there.

    In man it was Simmons > Shumpert, Green > Irving, LMA > James, Kawhi > Love, Anderson > Thompson. In that case, Kawhi was supposed to not help on Irving, and indeed, the way he's oriented on the play suggests that he wasn't supposed to do that. Kyle is set up to be between Irving and the basket, and Kawhi was between Love and basket until Kevin cut.

    If it was zone, Kawhi was the outside man and Kyle was the top man. So if Irving ran out of Green's zone, he was running into Anderson's, not Leonard's. Love cutting to the corner was running into Kawhi's zone. So he should have been the one to go, and Anderson should have stayed.

    Either way, Kyle was where he was supposed to be. The issue is that he pointed to Leonard to cover Irving, and that made no sense. Only possible explanation is that they didn't know Love had cut and were playing zone, in which case, Kyrie would be the outside man and Kawhi's responsibility.

  15. #90
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    Were they supposed to not trap at all? Did Irving evade Danny prompting all of them to blow all their coverages?
    I can guarantee you that Pop told his guys that Kyrie wasn't going to get the ball under any cir stances. You can see Green looking and Irving but not chasing him too fast, which to me signifies bracket coverage. They were worried about a stunt and fade. Had Green been close to Irving, all Lebron would have needed was a lob over the top. But the way the Cavs reacted, it seems like Irving was their play and Lebron just made a great play to get it to Love. Kyle does deserve credit, because he did pressure the attempt.

  16. #91
    Guest Personality Hoops Czar's Avatar
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    Green was guarding Irving, Kawhi Love, Kyle, Thompson. Irving cut to the ball with Green trailing. The Spurs clearly planned to trap off Thompson, but instead of doing that, Kawhi jumped out. Kyle was supposed to do that, but for some reason he also thought Kawhi was supposed to do that. So Kawhi's man leaked to the corner. It's extremely obvious who's covering who if you watch the whole pre-inbounds movement and not just a still.
    That must be stupider than I thought. How do you mistake Kevin Love fore Kyrie Irving unless he wasn't guarding Kyrie? Like I said above, they weren't playing man to man. They were guarding the perimeter against the three point shot. Danny Green started off guarding love (He wasn't even looking at Kyrie). When Kevin made the slip, it was up to Kyle or Kawhi to track him down. As a matter of fact, Once Love made the slip, Green was out of the play altogether. There was some obvious miscommunication but, Leonard took Kyrie at the last second and nobody took Kevin Love resulting in a quality shot from the corner. It's possible Kawhi could have made the mistake of not covering Love but, Chinook, unless you were in that huddle, you know about as much as I do as to who was suppose to cover who. However, from my perspective, it makes more sense to put your best defender on the opposing team's best offensive threat. As for the point by Kyle... That could have been him saying Oh , there goes my man.


  17. #92
    Spurs forever DeRozan m8's Avatar
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    This has all gotta be sarcasm surely

    He's absolute trash

  18. #93
    Hope springs eternal. SAGirl's Avatar
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    That must be stupider than I thought. How do you mistake Kevin Love fore Kyrie Irving unless he wasn't guarding Kyrie? Like I said above, they weren't playing man to man. They were guarding the perimeter against the three point shot. Danny Green started off guarding love (He wasn't even looking at Kyrie). When Kevin made the slip, it was up to Kyle or Kawhi to track him down. As a matter of fact, Once Love made the slip, Green was out of the play altogether. There was some obvious miscommunication but, Leonard took Kyrie at the last second and nobody took Kevin Love resulting in a quality shot from the corner. It's possible Kawhi could have made the mistake of not covering Love but, Chinook, unless you were in that huddle, you know about as much as I do as to who was suppose to cover who. However, from my perspective, it makes more sense to put your best defender on the opposing team's best offensive threat. As for the point by Kyle... That could have been him saying Oh , there goes my man.

    Frankly the Spurs defend as a team and Kawhi statement as well as Pop talking so much about it tell me that was much more than just bad fathead off to the doghouse you go... far too easy be it to blame the only guy who did realize the slip by Love and made a contest. As I said it doesn't seem clear that was his coverage bc they appeared to zone and Kyle had to completely leave his zone to go in the opposite direction of where he was starting standing on the play... and it made sense that Kawhi was going to guard the corner based on where he stood to start the play and the fact he appeared to be zoning that side of the court...

  19. #94
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    That must be stupider than I thought. How do you mistake Kevin Love fore Kyrie Irving unless he wasn't guarding Kyrie? Like I said above, they weren't playing man to man. They were guarding the perimeter against the three point shot. Danny Green started off guarding love (He wasn't even looking at Kyrie). When Kevin made the slip, it was up to Kyle or Kawhi to track him down. As a matter of fact, Once Love made the slip, Green was out of the play altogether. There was some obvious miscommunication but, Leonard took Kyrie at the last second and nobody took Kevin Love resulting in a quality shot from the corner. It's possible Kawhi could have made the mistake of not covering Love but, Chinook, unless you were in that huddle, you know about as much as I do as to who was suppose to cover who. However, from my perspective, it makes more sense to put your best defender on the opposing team's best offensive threat. As for the point by Kyle... That could have been him saying Oh , there goes my man.

    You don't defend a quick shot like you defend an iso possession. Even the best defenders will give up a look if they stay hyper focused on their men. All it takes is a good cut to get space when you don't have to worry about dribbling.

    It does seem like the zone theory is more likely than the man one, though, seeing how Green and Simmons are passing men off. If that's the case, then it definitely was Kawhi's outside rotation. If they wanted Anderson to cover the corner, he would have been on the other side of Kawhi to start. Otherwise, you are setting up the slowest player on the floor to run the longest distance (which he did and seemingly blocked Love's shot).

    I do really appreciate the gif, though, as it does a much better job of showing the play than a still would. You can definitely see that Anderson didn't have Love in man. Even if he was supposed to pick him up, he was also supposed to drop him off to Kawhi and take Irving. Actually, looking at it in motion repeatedly makes it seem less like Anderson was pointing to Leonard and more like he was getting an arm up to Irving, which is something everyone else was doing on the play as well. It seems now like he was going to take Irving, saw Kawhi out of position, went like "Oh " ran to Love, and blocked his three-point attempt to seal the win.

  20. #95
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Kiwi said it postgame, miscommunication... they should've been assertive, one of them should've told the other "Go with him" and follow Love, instead they both jumped into Irving...

  21. #96
    2 Doors Down BillMc's Avatar
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    You don't defend a quick shot like you defend an iso possession. Even the best defenders will give up a look if they stay hyper focused on their men. All it takes is a good cut to get space when you don't have to worry about dribbling.

    It does seem like the zone theory is more likely than the man one, though, seeing how Green and Simmons are passing men off. If that's the case, then it definitely was Kawhi's outside rotation. If they wanted Anderson to cover the corner, he would have been on the other side of Kawhi to start. Otherwise, you are setting up the slowest player on the floor to run the longest distance (which he did and seemingly blocked Love's shot).

    I do really appreciate the gif, though, as it does a much better job of showing the play than a still would. You can definitely see that Anderson didn't have Love in man. Even if he was supposed to pick him up, he was also supposed to drop him off to Kawhi and take Irving. Actually, looking at it in motion repeatedly makes it seem less like Anderson was pointing to Leonard and more like he was getting an arm up to Irving, which is something everyone else was doing on the play as well. It seems now like he was going to take Irving, saw Kawhi out of position, went like "Oh " ran to Love, and blocked his three-point attempt to seal the win.
    I have no idea if Kyle screwed up or did a heroic cover for Kawhi's error, but just for the record in the postgame interview Love said the shot was not blocked and he got it off cleanly.

  22. #97
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    I have no idea if Kyle screwed up or did a heroic cover for Kawhi's error, but just for the record in the postgame interview Love said the shot was not blocked and he got it off cleanly.
    Thanks for the tidbit, Bill. Love would know a lot better than I would. Still looked like a solid contest.

    There's a lot going on when trying to defend this play. The Spurs and Cavs were both on the far side, because it takes significantly longer to catch, turn and shoot than to just catch and shoot. You can sort of see on the gif that Love got an extra quarter of a second to get his shot off. That's the issue with having to inbound the ball from that angle.

    Does anyone else find it odd that Korver wasn't in for that play? I mean, Thompson did absolutely nothing on that play. Korver would have been so much more useful.

  23. #98
    You have no idea UZER's Avatar
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    That was actually a well designed play. Both Kyle and kawhi thought love was going to set a pick for Kyrie which is why the jumped to kyrie, but love just slipped it.

    It was great misdirection.

  24. #99
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    That was actually a well designed play. Both Kyle and kawhi thought love was going to set a pick for Kyrie which is why the jumped to kyrie, but love just slipped it.

    It was great misdirection.
    I'll admit, it was much better than that ty Hammer play.

  25. #100
    Veteran daledondale's Avatar
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    Thank god Love is not clutch.

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