Robert E Lee ex

[sickdsm]

and honestly you should really read more than a wikipedia summary if youre going to devote this much time to defending someone.

Man, you really need to commit to something in life if you think i'm devoting a lot of time here.


So which is it? That its a public/private deal, that he was on the losing side, or because of his slavery issues? I'd mention the monument of Benedict Arnold but I doubt i've done enough research for you. I can definitely take some pictures of BIA funded programs that have NA war hereo's on the wall. I'm not sure how much investigative research i need to do to reply or start a thread on ST.


Wiki is an excellent starting point for a casual conversation, do you disagree with that?

[Adam Lambert]

dont be so sensitive, my point is youve spent more time asking questions about lee than it would have taken to read a more detailed summary of his life.

i have already told you why its justifiable to remove his statues from public grounds. you are free to disagree with that reasoning, but the fact that you can find other examples that fit the description doesnt invalidate the reasoning. well get to the rest later, be patient. plenty of outrage to go around in due time.

basically it seems like youre saying that unless we evenly distribute the sum total of our criticism across every single outdated or wrongly erected monument, we shouldnt criticize any of them. thats a fallacy.

[sickdsm]

dont be so sensitive, my point is youve spent more time asking questions about lee than it would have taken to read a more detailed summary of his life.

i have already told you why its justifiable to remove his statues from public grounds. you are free to disagree with that reasoning, but the fact that you can find other examples that fit the description doesnt invalidate the reasoning. well get to the rest later, be patient. plenty of outrage to go around in due time.

basically it seems like youre saying that unless we evenly distribute the sum total of our criticism across every single outdated or wrongly erected monument, we shouldnt criticize any of them. thats a fallacy.

I appreciate your replies, even though you could bring a lot more tact to it, you at least bring a legitimate response to the table. I'm assuming most people here are internet hereo's that would never be in a position to respond to someone in person because their certified s here.

I'm not saying we shouldn't criticize them, i'm asking what makes him so much more vilified than others?

[Pavlov]

Eh, I think Lee is pretty overrated as a general. One competent union general and the war is over a bit after the peninsular campaign.

[monosylab1k]

Stonewall Jackson > Robert E. Lee

[Spurtacular]

Mainly, that George was on the winning team.

Lee was on the winning team, too. His battle victories against Mexico and the like were legendary. It was well known in all the land that he was the best military mind before the Civil War. Both sides fought to get him. Also, Lee only lost The Civil War b/c of his lesser numbers. He was constantly winning battles with lesser numbers though.

He had planned to side with the North until his home state of Virginia seceded. That is why he fought for the South.

[Spurtacular]

Stonewall Jackson > Robert E. Lee

That's like comparing Daryl Johnston to Tom Brady

[Adam Lambert]

I'm not saying we shouldn't criticize them, i'm asking what makes him so much more vilified than others?

they represent a view of humans that is still too prevalent today. those monuments were built to honor racism moreso than the people depicted in the monuments. evidence is in the ridiculous reaction to even the slightest hint that one of those monuments might be taken down (note that militias have shown up by the hundreds because of fake facebook pages to protect monuments that were never under attack). i doubt youd see that kind of reaction to a public movement to remove a statue of, like, billy the kid.

[ElNono]

Lee was on the winning team, too. His battle victories against Mexico and the like were legendary. It was well known in all the land that he was the best military mind before the Civil War. Both sides fought to get him. Also, Lee only lost The Civil War b/c of his lesser numbers. He was constantly winning battles with lesser numbers though.

He had planned to side with the North until his home state of Virginia seceded. That is why he fought for the South.

You mean "It was well known in all the land that he was the best military mind before he took a giant L"?..

[apalisoc_9]

Lee was on the winning team, too. His battle victories against Mexico and the like were legendary. It was well known in all the land that he was the best military mind before the Civil War. Both sides fought to get him. Also, Lee only lost The Civil War b/c of his lesser numbers. He was constantly winning battles with lesser numbers though.

He had planned to side with the North until his home state of Virginia seceded. That is why he fought for the South.

I trust Spurtacular depiction of the sad events at chart..afterall, we all know he was there because...

[Pavlov]

Lee was on the winning team, too. His battle victories against Mexico and the like were legendary. It was well known in all the land that he was the best military mind before the Civil War. Both sides fought to get him. Also, Lee only lost The Civil War b/c of his lesser numbers. He was constantly winning battles with lesser numbers though.

He had planned to side with the North until his home state of Virginia seceded. That is why he fought for the South.

Pétain pretty much single handedly saved France twice in WWI but after he turned against the Third Republic they locked him up and threw away the key. Counterfactuals don't change anything. Lee betrayed his country and lost in spectacular fashion. He's lucky Lincoln was the most magnanimous dude to ever be President; Lee should've rotted in prison at the very least.

[Spurtacular]

I trust Spurtacular depiction of the sad events at chart..afterall, we all know he was there because...

Try making sense, snowflake.

[Spurtacular]

You mean "It was well known in all the land that he was the best military mind before he took a giant L"?..

It was the Milwaukee Bucks vs. the 97 Bulls, dude.

[RandomGuy]

Disclaimer: I'm a northerner who's only exposure to confederacy has been Dukes of Hazzard shows when i was a kid and ty later career kid rock songs. I didn't grow up with the aura or alternate history. What i've been reading lately is that there maybe another side of Lee than what i was taught 25 years ago. When we were in school all confederate soldiers were horrible people that owned, beat, and sold slaves. Light wikipedia reading, ok, more like skimming, says he leaned towards the north and reluctantly went along with his state seceding. Other comments i've read said he freed his families slaves prior to the civil war. His legacy grew after his death, especially in northern states. Everything on the internet is to be taken with a grain of salt.

My point is, i get the difference between monuments of Washington and Lee. Mainly, that George was on the winning team.

But is the hatred of Lee's statues because of his treatment to slaves? Because it sounds like a lot of America's "hero's" were die hard slave fans. Was it because the victors write history?

What makes Lee's statues worth protesting either for or against but Crazy Horse and the like's do not receive such fanfare?

The vast majority of confederate soldiers were not slave-holders. They were, however, fighting to preserve a government that enthusiastically condoned and engaged in it.

The issue boils down to slavery. The Confederacy was, in the end, simply trying to preserve a monstrous evil.

Not something we should build monuments to.

[ducks]

most slaves were treated better then most kids in America
most treated them better then their kids
there were some bad slave owners though

[ElNono]

It was the Milwaukee Bucks vs. the 97 Bulls, dude.

Which means he chose wrong. That doesn't sound like the best mind of anything, or his ego got to him.

[ElNono]

most slaves were treated better then most kids in America
most treated them better then their kids
there were some bad slave owners though

Start picking cotton instead of posting on ST, let's see how well treated you feel.

Shut the up, that's a Wild Chodebra-level argument.

[baseline bum]

most slaves were treated better then most kids in America
most treated them better then their kids
there were some bad slave owners though

Trump's base in a nuts

[ducks]

Start picking cotton instead of posting on ST, let's see how well treated you feel.

Shut the up, that's a Wild Chodebra-level argument.

so if the Mexicans pick in lettuce it is like slavery?
working hard in the fields is bad?

that is the problem everyone wants a easy high paying job that does not require work

in Yuma roofers start at 10 pm at night to avoid the heat but you know what they are not wanting the gov to feed them in the welfare line

[Adam Lambert]

so if the Mexicans pick in lettuce it is like slavery?
working hard in the fields is bad?

can that mexican choose to go work somewhere else if he wants to, you unbelievable ing moron?

[ducks]

actually I had a friend try to work there and get experience
everything was in Spanish and was treated like he did not belong
he was in Yuma but was told to drive to summerton and get on the bus to drive to Yuma to pick the lettuce

the Mexican can not chose because they do not have welfare in mexico so they have to work in the lettuce field so no they have no choice
no one will hire them to do anything else since they have no skill
the ones that have skills have a choice but they are already welding or being a dentist

[ducks]

what has the democrats did for the blacks?
nothing but lets pick on the republicans
the only reason the media is all over this is so they think they can brain wash the blacks to continue voting for them and not do anything for them

[DarrinS]

I get why people want these monuments removed, but where do you draw the line? There are loads of these monuments across the US.

Should we blow up Stone Mountain?

[ducks]

should take all statues down!
I am sure they did something bad in their life and it could offend someone!

[Pavlov]

I get why people want these monuments removed, but where do you draw the line? There are loads of these monuments across the US.

Should we blow up Stone Mountain?

Since that was the birthplace of the modern Klan, I think the GA state lege should consider altering it. I understand the historic antebellum laser light show must be preserved tho.