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  1. #1751
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    rmt, you're conned fool, benighted by ideology and bull
    No, bou, it's an educated guess backed up by this year's data. Everyone's rushing to sign up and do their procedures before Obamacare gets repealed.

  2. #1752
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    Judge Rules Aetna Lied About Reason for Leaving Obamacare Exchanges

    This is a really critical story on a number of levels.

    The debate over Obamacare has been shaped to a great extent over the last year by Aetna's decision to withdraw from exchanges in a number of states because, it claimed, it was losing money.

    But in a ruling today which
    blocked a proposed merger between Aetna and Humana, federal Judge John D. Bates held that Aetna's claim was bogus.

    Rather than being a business decision based on the inability to make a profit in those states, Bates

    ruled that Aetna had withdrawn from Obamacare exchanges at least in part as a strategy to threaten its way out of the anti-trust case.

    From Michael Hiltzik's piece in the LA Times ...

    Bates found that this rationalization was largely untrue. In fact, he noted,

    Aetna pulled out of some states and counties that were actually profitable to make a point in its lawsuit defense — and then misled the public about its motivations.

    Bates’ analysis relies in part on a “smoking gun” letter to the Justice Department in which Chief Executive Mark Bertolini explicitly ties Aetna’s participation in Obamacare to the DOJ’s actions on the merger, which we reported in August.

    But it goes much further.
    Among the locations where Aetna withdrew were 17 counties in three states where the Department of Justice asserted that the merger would produce unlawfully low levels of compe ion.

    By pulling out, Aetna could say that it wasn’t competing in those counties anyway, rendering the government’s point moot: “The evidence provides persuasive support for the conclusion that Aetna withdrew from the on-exchange markets in the 17 complaint counties to improve its litigation position,” Bates wrote. “The Court does not credit the minimal efforts of Aetna executives to claim otherwise.”


    Indeed, he wrote,

    Aetna’s decision to pull out of the exchange business in Florida was “so far outside of normal business practice” that it perplexed the company’s top executive in Florida, who was not in the decision loop.

    The Court also found that Aetna had gone to lengths to conceal its decision-making which in themselves bordered on wrongdoing.

    There's quite a lot here - not least the adverse impact this had on Obamacare in the political realm.

    But it also points to much deeper issues about monopoly practices, the political impact of corporate gigantism and a company like AETNA making individual policy holders into what amounts to political and legal cannon fodder in a battle to get a merger okayed by the federal government.

    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/...+%28TPMNews%29


    The Corporatocracy is totally corrupt, a vampire squid sucking wealth out of citizens.





  3. #1753
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    More than eight-in-ten Democrats and Democratic-leaning independents (85%) say the federal government should be responsible for health care coverage, compared with just 32% of Republicans and Republican leaners…. The belief that the government has a responsibility to ensure health coverage has increased across many groups over the past year, but the rise has been particularly striking among lower- and middle-income Republicans.
    http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2017/...yer-march.html

  4. #1754
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    So, if you squint hard and envision the Democrat Party as it used to be, instead of the party dominated by smug squilllionare-servicing professionals it is today, you can see that not only is the Democrat base for single payer, but Republicans are there for the taking as well

  5. #1755
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    In a surprise move made in response to President Donald Trump’s push to repeal and replace the Affordable Care Act, two California lawmakers Friday introduced legislation to replace private medical insurance with a government health care system covering all 38 million Californians — including its undo ented residents.

    “We’ve reached this pivotal moment and I thought to myself: ‘Look, now more than ever is the time to talk about universal health care,'” one of Senate Bill 562’s authors, Sen. Ricardo Lara, D-Bell Gardens, said in an interview Friday.


    The Healthy California Act, co-authored by Sen. Toni Atkins, D-San Diego, was submitted just before the deadline for new legislation. It doesn’t yet offer many specifics other than the lawmakers’ intent: to create a so-called single-payer system that would pay for coverage for everyone.
    http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/02/1...lan-on-friday/

  6. #1756
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    Good luck with single payor - along with becoming a sanctuary state - all the illegals will be flocking to California. I suspect that there will also be a mass exodus of taxpayers leaving CA.

  7. #1757
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    I suspect that there will also be a mass exodus of taxpayers leaving CA.
    Hasn't happened so far, neither fleeing CA, nor fleeing USA after ACA raised taxes on the wealthy. They already know how to avoid/evade taxes, like Mnuchin's $100M he "forgot about".

  8. #1758
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    Hasn't happened so far, neither fleeing CA, nor fleeing USA after ACA raised taxes on the wealthy. They already know how to avoid/evade taxes, like Mnuchin's $100M he "forgot about".
    So who do you expect will be paying for all those illegals and all those who flock there expecting free health care? CA can't print $ like the Feds. The very rich and Hollywood types would probably stay, but IMO the ordinary taxpayer will balk.

  9. #1759
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Initial attempts to repeal Obamacare not going as well as expected:

    Among the increasingly concerned Republicans are those who represent the 24 congressional districts that Hillary Clinton won in the presidential election — roughly the numerical edge Republicans hold over Democrats in the House — and another dozen in districts that President Barack Obama took in 2012 but President Trump won in November. If 25 conservative hard-liners oppose any robust replacement plan, and 30 swing-district House members demand a more generous plan, passage of a compromise bill will be in jeopardy.

    What these silly Republicans are forgetting is that ObamaCare is a Heritage Foundation plan in the first place. It’s already as bad as it is politically feasible to be! But I have a solution: Make some minor changes, rebrand ObamaCare as FreedomCare, and declare victory. That way conservatives get themselves out of a jam, liberals get to #SaveTheACA, and both factions get to deep six #MedicareForAll and kick the left, which is their only goal in life, at this point, anyhow, except the lucrative job later on K Street
    .http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2017/...r-2232017.html

  10. #1760
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    Another (biased) poll (Pew) used with (CNN) headline "Support for Obamacare at all-time high" but 37% more Dems/leaning Dems than Rep/leaning Reps.

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/24/politi...t-record-high/

    http://www.people-press.org/2017/02/...2/#methodology

    http://assets.pewresearch.org/wp-con...or_release.pdf

  11. #1761
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    So who do you expect will be paying for all those illegals and all those who flock there expecting free health care? CA can't print $ like the Feds. The very rich and Hollywood types would probably stay, but IMO the ordinary taxpayer will balk.
    free health care is not why they come. They come to make money, economic refugees, and/or to save their lives, political refugees.

    You've been so sucked, lied to by the racist Repugs.

  12. #1762
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    free health care is not why they come. They come to make money, economic refugees, and/or to save their lives, political refugees.

    You've been so sucked, lied to by the racist Repugs.
    I'm referring to them going to CA should single payer pass there.

  13. #1763
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    I'm referring to them going to CA should single payer pass there.
    s/p will benefit CA white people more than illegals

  14. #1764
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    death spiral: uninsured rate remains flat

    https://khn.org/morning-breakout/uni...at-health-law/

  15. #1765
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    hmm, "people who lost insurance 2017" says between 2M and 4M
    Last edited by boutons_deux; 05-23-2018 at 10:21 AM.

  16. #1766
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    the inevitable death of Obamacare has been breathlessly hyped for a decade. might take another decade or two to bleed out at this rate.

  17. #1767
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    Deductible doesn't mean subsidized you stupid .
    Tax breaks for health plans does mean subsidized.

  18. #1768
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    the inevitable death of Obamacare has been breathlessly hyped for a decade. might take another decade or two to bleed out at this rate.
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/trumpcare...201655059.html

    It is slow moving, but it is being gutted and sabotaged in any way possible. GOP gets full credit for that.

    Never mind who it hurts, as long as it isn't the rich donor class.

  19. #1769
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    Articles from your link:


    It doesn't reflect congressional repeal of the health law's unpopular requirement that individuals carry health insurance, since that doesn't take effect until next year.

    https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireSt...drama-55343269


    The tax penalty for people who decline to obtain insurance will disappear entirely next year. That change alone is likely to cause several million fewer Americans to have insurance.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/22/u...last-year.html

  20. #1770
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Articles from your link:


    It doesn't reflect congressional repeal of the health law's unpopular requirement that individuals carry health insurance, since that doesn't take effect until next year.

    https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireSt...drama-55343269


    The tax penalty for people who decline to obtain insurance will disappear entirely next year. That change alone is likely to cause several million fewer Americans to have insurance.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/22/u...last-year.html
    That will do it. Funny how when Republicans get their wish, regular people get kicked in the shorts. Tax cuts for the super-rich, etc.

    pfft.

  21. #1771
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    That will do it. Funny how when Republicans get their wish, regular people get kicked in the shorts. Tax cuts for the super-rich, etc.

    pfft.
    Funny how liberals are all about choice but when people (especially the young who are paying too much to subsidize the old and sick) DECLINE to carry insurance, they're getting kicked in the shorts.

    My point in posting was - read the articles you (not you RG) link to - invariably, if the article is halfway honest, there's something in it that bursts the rah-rah ACA headline. Fortunately, for you liberals, the most insidious part of Obamacare (Medicaid expansion) is alive and well but unfortunately for the states which expanded, the (state's) bill came due last year and is increasing.

  22. #1772
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Funny how liberals are all about choice but when people (especially the young who are paying too much to subsidize the old and sick) DECLINE to carry insurance, they're getting kicked in the shorts.

    My point in posting was - read the articles you (not you RG) link to - invariably, if the article is halfway honest, there's something in it that bursts the rah-rah ACA headline. Fortunately, for you liberals, the most insidious part of Obamacare (Medicaid expansion) is alive and well but unfortunately for the states which expanded, the (state's) bill came due last year and is increasing.
    People who decline to get insurance force the rest of us to bear the costs of their healthcare in one way or another.

    Making this mandatory just brings the fact of the cost shifting that already goes on out in public.

    I have zero problem with an individual mandate.

  23. #1773
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    CBO projects the costs of Trumpcare:

    https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/115...cecoverage.pdf

  24. #1774
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Virginia not betting on the death spiral:

    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...pansion-578513

  25. #1775
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    Trump administration won’t defend ACA in case brought by GOP states

    The Trump administration said Thursday night that it will not defend the Affordable Care Act against the latest legal challenge to its cons utionality — a dramatic break from the executive branch’s tradition of arguing to uphold existing statutes and a land mine for health insurance changes the ACA brought about.

    In a brief filed in a Texas federal court and an accompanying letter to the House and Senate leaders of both parties, the Justice Department agrees in large part with the 20 Republican-led states that brought the suit.

    They contend that the ACA provision requiring most Americans to carry health insurance soon will no longer be cons utional and that, as a result, consumer insurance protections under the law will not be valid, either.

    it puts the law on far more wobbly legal footing in the case, which is being heard by a GOP-appointed judge who has in other recent cases ruled against more minor aspects.

    the administration’s striking position raises the possibility that major parts of the law could be struck down

    — a year after the Republican Congress failed at attempts to repeal core provisions.

    “would be breathtaking in its effect,’ said Timothy Jost, a retired Washington and Lee law professor who follows such litigation closely.

    “Of all of the actions the Trump administration has taken to undermine individual insurance markets, this may be the most destabilizing. . . . [If] I’m an insurer, I don’t know what I am supposed to do or not.”

    raises new questions about whether insurers still will be required to charge the same prices to all customers, healthy or sick.

    the administration’s legal argument contradicts promises by Trump that he would not tamper with the ACA’s protections for people with preexisting medical conditions.

    . “If the Justice Department can just throw in the towel whenever a law is challenged in court,

    it can effectively pick and choose which laws should remain on the books,” he wrote.

    “That’s not a rule of law I recognize. That’s a rule by whim. And it scares me.”

    the Texas lawsuit contends, “the country is left with an individual mandate to buy health insurance that lacks any cons utional basis. . . . Once the heart of the ACA — the individual mandate — is declared uncons utional, the remainder of the ACA must also fall.”

    Texas and the accompanying states have asked for a preliminary injunction that could suspend the entire law while the case plays out in court.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...s=mcnewsletter

    So those pesky, "losers" with medical conditions (rightwing assholes are Strong, don't have medical conditions) will have to pay poverty-inducing more and rely on taxpayer assistance, if they can even find it.

    iow, Repugs are redistributing the costs of BigInsurance to taxpayers.

    10Ks of the Repugs' victims will suffer and/or die. Repug willful manslaughter.





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