How the Spurs overplayed their hand and alienated Kawhi Leonard

[Seventyniner]

I wonder how long it'll be before it comes out that Magic has been hardcore tampering. I don't think it's explicitly illegal to talk to Uncle Dennis, but that would so violate the spirit of the rule that I think it would warrant punishment.

The absolute most Magic will get hit with is a 1 million dollar fine. Chump change if it means a chance at Kawhi, and the Lakers organization would pay it anyway.

[callo1]

The mainstream media, which is controlled by the big markets created this dung storm, and so many people in SA went with it when there was nothing tangible going on. They wanted to create a rift between Kawhi and the Spurs, and now you have zoo tickets being revoked.

If you follow the bread crumbs back to last summer, the Lakers were "rumored" to go all in after Kawhi (as soon as PG signed with the Thunder). Social media is such garbage, and people are lemmings.

Now Magic Johnson can use his tempering skills to tell Kawhi to play for a town and an organization that "wants him".

Lakers already trying to deep six their tampering by saying they arn't even sure if they want Kawhi because of the risk of his injury.

Kawhi could be in a different uniform next year, but I seriously doubt it.

[tholdren]

This isn't so much about Parker as it is about Porker fans calling Kawhi fans player fans.

You dont write well.

[RD2191]

You dont write well.

[spurs2112]

Just follow the money.

Spurs great = meh money for Spurs and even less meh for the rest of the league
Lakers great = cha-ching money for the Lakers and mini-cha-ching money for the rest of the league

Great small market teams will have a long hiatus between peaks, and there will be very few of great small market teams

Small market teams have historically been farms to find superstars for large market teams.

Sounds about right.

[Play Boban]

Making up, you should go eff yourself.

Do you watch the games tbh?

[Chinook]

The absolute most Magic will get hit with is a 1 million dollar fine. Chump change if it means a chance at Kawhi, and the Lakers organization would pay it anyway.

I think at this point, he'd get the book. Three strikes and all that.

[tholdren]

How old are you using emojis?

[RD2191]

How old are you using emojis?

[rasuo214]

Well that's one side of the story....the other side is that he had a career altering injury and wants to get the bigmax over the spurs concerns of durability. The spurs can't give the super max to a greg oden.we are not portland. Sometimes you have to take old yeller, your faithful pup, and put a bullet in him. I respect my team for holding the line and not giving into bullying and leaks.

Kawhi could have appeared in friendly press. Because he didn't, it left pop, parkers , etc with the bag. Either kawhi is an adult and can handle his , or he's a baby and the team should pay him less.

Then they should trade him while he still has value.

[tholdren]

^^^^^^^^
45k.....

[KimmyGib]

I think he was definitely hurt in the off-season and probably to start the season, it seems like everybody agrees with that and there wasn't any real bad blood at the time..they gave him time to figure things out, at least from a mental standpoint..

It's very evident that he sat out the 2nd half of the season for non-basketball reasons, though, that isn't even debatable IMO..everything we have heard these past 2 weeks adds up, it's a money issue, SA is reluctant to supermax him..there's NO WAY that Parker and Ginobili make those public comments(which they wouldn't have made without Pop co-signing) if that wasn't the case, it doesn't make any sense to jeopardize the team's relationship with its franchise cornerstone simply over a dispute over the diagnosis of an injury..the only reason that narrative got any play was because the Isiah Thomas situation(which was very rare, too) was so fresh in everybody's mind..

IMO the only consistent factors here are 1- Supermax/money dispute 2- As Woj reported, Kawhi's team is very disorganized and constantly changing their story

It's not a coincidence that Kawhi's team leaked that they were working things out and a meeting was imminent to discuss money, but then all of a sudden it's leaked that he is going to demand a trade

If the Spurs and Kawhi had agreed on the money, I bet none of this would have happened IMO..it's all been leverage game since then..misdiagnosis of injury, doesn't like the roster, mad about the way Pop is approaching things, furious that Parker and Ginobili made comments through the media

All narratives to save face, they are fully aware of how the public reacts to athletes regarding money disputes..I mostly disagree with the way fans view athletes and their money(especially in the NBA and NFL), I find it strange that they generally side with management over the employees, but I understand, I suppose..

I appreciate your insight. Agreed, it doesn't make much sense. But does it make any less sense than for the Spurs to have been so reluctant to supermax him, unless the injury were a major factor? In other words, if it's all a money issue, then I'd think the injury must've played a key role in making it an issue to begin with, and therefore Kawhi may have been legitimately unfit to play all year.

[toki9]

I appreciate your insight. Agreed, it doesn't make much sense. But does it make any less sense than for the Spurs to have been so reluctant to supermax him, unless the injury were a major factor? In other words, if it's all a money issue, then I'd think the injury must've played a key role in making it an issue to begin with, and therefore Kawhi may have been legitimately unfit to play all year.

It's $219 million, starting at 35% of cap and if the cap increase doesn't keep pace, could easily rise to over 35% of cap over 5 years...it's not exactly a good contract from the team's perspective unless everything is airtight...but it could be that the money topic never even came up with Kawhi's camp...I think (and this is pure speculation) the Spurs diagnosis of potentially degenerative quad was taken by Kawhi's uncle/agent as an excuse by the Spurs to lowball the supermax, or rather, not offer the supermax...and that's why they went and sought 2nd, and then 3rd opinion--and kept the Spurs at arm's length. The irony here is that the Spurs probably would have offered the supermax had everyone been on the same page since the team's stance has consistently been that the quad needs proper treatment and management...if any team understands managing the long term health of their franchise player, it's the Spurs...Duncan basically played on one leg for years and years...but because of subsequent actions by Kawhi's camp, the Spurs probably grew increasingly uncomfortable with offering the supermax and thus the public posturing.

[szkorhetz]

I don't want us to give him the supermax even if he is 100% healthy and engaged .

[r0drig0lac]

Just follow the money.

Spurs great = meh money for Spurs and even less meh for the rest of the league
Lakers great = cha-ching money for the Lakers and mini-cha-ching money for the rest of the league

Great small market teams will have a long hiatus between peaks, and there will be very few of great small market teams

Small market teams have historically been farms to find superstars for large market teams.

spurs is the exception and would remain if Kawhi's uncle was not an ambitious idiot, so whatever;
treating spurs like any other small-market franchise is oversimplifying one of the strangest situations in league history

[DMC]

spurs is the exception and would remain if Kawhi's uncle was not an ambitious idiot, so whatever;
treating spurs like any other small-market franchise is oversimplifying one of the strangest situations in league history

Spurs drafted David and Tim, and got lucky with Tony and Manu. Outside of those, they have Kawhi. You could say Bowen and Avery but let's be real, neither of those guys belongs in the rafters of an NBA team. David and Tim stayed in San Antonio because neither of them is socially ambitious. Kawhi appears that way as well, but Kawhi is facing a retiring coach and a future of struggle with G league level teammates against stacking teams, and SA isn't going to magically begin to attract big named free agents. If Lebron goes to SA, that's an oddity. It won't happen.

It's SA's time to ride the pine, and you can bet the NBA and sports media won't be pining for them to return to glory like they do the Lakers. They won't be wringing their hands trying to figure out which trades would make them contenders. They will be with the Minnesota's and Milwaukee's of the league.

[r0drig0lac]

Spurs drafted David and Tim, and got lucky with Tony and Manu. Outside of those, they have Kawhi. You could say Bowen and Avery but let's be real, neither of those guys belongs in the rafters of an NBA team. David and Tim stayed in San Antonio because neither of them is socially ambitious. Kawhi appears that way as well, but Kawhi is facing a retiring coach and a future of struggle with G league level teammates against stacking teams, and SA isn't going to magically begin to attract big named free agents. If Lebron goes to SA, that's an oddity. It won't happen.

It's SA's time to ride the pine, and you can bet the NBA and sports media won't be pining for them to return to glory like they do the Lakers. They won't be wringing their hands trying to figure out which trades would make them contenders. They will be with the Minnesota's and Milwaukee's of the league.

I understand your point (and it makes sense in a way), but I believe the franchise deserves the benefit of the doubt for never having been through anything like that.

[DMC]

I understand your point (and it makes sense in a way), but I believe the franchise deserves the benefit of the doubt for never having been through anything like that.

Kawhi hasn't been through it either.

In this case, the benefit of doubt relates to outcome, not blame. I don't know of any case in the NBA where a player is cleared to play and decides to sit out all year.

[YGWHI]

I don't want us to give him the supermax even if he is 100% healthy and engaged .

Well, his camp let media know that he's 97% healthy now and 100% in training camp, that he wanted to stay in SA and was ready to sign an extension with the Spurs last week...

Then, Woj's "They are a long way from the offer of $219 contract" happened.

And his camp got mad and asked for a trade.

This is why I said the Spurs didn't handle this that well.

The team didn't need to go Woj, they could tell Kawhi's camp in the meeting they won't offer the supermax. But the Spurs were frustrated all season and wanted to expose his camp in front media.

I get why the Spurs did it but that type of actions don't help in contracts talks.

[BSfromTX]

Well, his camp let media know that he's 97% healthy now and 100% in training camp, that he wanted to stay in SA and was ready to sign an extension with the Spurs last week...

Then, Woj's "They are a long way from the offer of $219 contract" happened.

And his camp got mad and asked for a trade.

This is why I said the Spurs didn't handle this that well.

The team didn't need to go Woj, they could tell Kawhi's camp in the meeting they won't offer the supermax. But the Spurs were frustrated all season and wanted to expose his camp in front media.

I get why the Spurs did it but that type of actions don't help in contracts talks.

i would agree, but your assuming PATFO leaked to Woj. It could very well be uncle Dennis or more speculation

[YGWHI]

I think he was definitely hurt in the off-season and probably to start the season, it seems like everybody agrees with that and there wasn't any real bad blood at the time..they gave him time to figure things out, at least from a mental standpoint..

It's very evident that he sat out the 2nd half of the season for non-basketball reasons, though, that isn't even debatable IMO..everything we have heard these past 2 weeks adds up, it's a money issue, SA is reluctant to supermax him..there's NO WAY that Parker and Ginobili make those public comments(which they wouldn't have made without Pop co-signing) if that wasn't the case, it doesn't make any sense to jeopardize the team's relationship with its franchise cornerstone simply over a dispute over the diagnosis of an injury..the only reason that narrative got any play was because the Isiah Thomas situation(which was very rare, too) was so fresh in everybody's mind..

I bet this is one of the reasons why Kawhi's camp talk about "betrayed". Pop behind those words and the meeting.

It's not a coincidence that Kawhi's team leaked that they were working things out and a meeting was imminent to discuss money, but then all of a sudden it's leaked that he is going to demand a trade

"Then all of sudden"...Nah.
It was after Woj's "There're a long way from the offer of $219M" article. A few days ago his camp said he was healthy and ready to sign the extesion, after the article it seemed they felt disrespected by the Spurs.

[baseline bum]

I bet this is one of the reasons why Kawhi's camp talk about "betrayed". Pop behind those words and the meeting.



"Then all of sudden"...Nah.
It was after Woj's "There're a long way from the offer of $219M" article. A few days ago his camp said he was healthy and ready to sign the extesion, after the article it seemed they felt disrespected by the Spurs.

LOL they felt disrespected. Hard to be more disrespectful than Leonard was going AWOL from the team and not even sitting on the bench for the playoff games but then leaving New York the day after the team was eliminated. I don't know how anyone could look at that and not see he made up his mind on leaving the Spurs months ago.

[YGWHI]

The Parker/Manu narratives are specially stupid IMO..I'm sure Kawhi was annoyed by their comments, but Manu is likely retiring and TP is a Free Agent..as much as we joke on here about Pop's favoritism, there's no ing way he's telling Kawhi that he's going to choose an ancient TP over him

Pop is 70 and may be out of touch with some of these new players, but he isn't stupid, he knows talent wins in this league..

Really? Parker said he wants to retire a Spur.

He also said he wants to be an NBA GM's some day... I wonder which FO's franchise would give him a job? A franchise where he played for...?

Kawhi, Pop, all people know that Parker -in one way or another- will be on the team next seasons.

[YGWHI]

LOL they felt disrespected. Hard to be more disrespectful than Leonard was going AWOL from the team and not even sitting on the bench for the playoff games but then leaving New York the day after the team was eliminated. I don't know how anyone could look at that and not see he made up his mind on leaving the Spurs months ago.

Again, I said I understand why the Spurs got frustrated but unless they really wanted that Kawhi to leave the team, there wasn't a need to handle this situation in the way they did.

You know if they're in contracts talks, BOTH sides could avoid some things. That includes the team that wants to keep a player.

[urunobili]

Can someone link me to the Manu calling Kawhi in the media (whatever that may have been) being at the same level of 100 times worse plz?