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  1. #26
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    If you want to speculate about behind the scenes management (i.e. handling players, managing egos, etc), I could buy that, since Pop, before the Kawhi saga, was a coach players highly respected and fell in line for, but I'm over the idea that there exists a "voodoo system" that will completely catch opponents off-guard. Great players can flourish under any "system" (as long as the system is analytically valid, ex. no coach is going to win too many games today going back to a post-centric offense with bigs). Many of the big sports are kind of "solved" in regard to what works and what doesn't, so talent really is the main deciding factor now.
    The Spurs results are an anomaly if you consider all teams since the inception of the NBA, and that the Spurs have done this with basically one superstar who, for the most part, was not putting up superstar numbers for a good portion of his career. What other coach has accomplished so much with so little?

  2. #27
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    No, I'm saying that system wouldn't have won with lesser players?



    Because he isn't even 1/8th as good as he was in 2013 and 2014.



    lol Manu had Pop on the other side when he turned himself into a HoF lock, tbh.



    I'm not saying any coach could have taken that team to the finals 2x. I'm saying that no coaching in the World matters if you don't have good enough players. Talent is waaaaaay more important than coaching.

    I don't know if any coach could have taken those players to two consecutive finals, but many of them could. That team was just that good and that talented. Who knows, maybe some other coaches could have repeated with that roster. All they needed to do was not taking out your best player in the most important possession of the season.
    This makes no ing sense

  3. #28
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    So coaching couldn't stop them from getting their pushed in? It's almost like it doesn't matter
    Coaching probably helped them to get their pushed in during that series, with all the intentional fouling and Pop's "look at me" . However every team eventually loses.

    Mark Jackson was getting his ass kicked in early rounds. This is the same team that won 73 games under Steve Kerr. All Steve had to do was recognize they had the fewest passes per shot in the league. Kerr made them the team with the most passes per shot. Ball movement is key. Coaches have to recognize that and get away from their "I'm going to make you like I was" mantra. This is why coaches who were good players are often ineffective - they are player focused and look for superstars.

  4. #29
    Billy Bob
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    How's the system working now that they don't have hof players in Timmy,manu,tp9,kwitter? Talent matters more in the nba than in any other bball league. You wont win if you dont have top 5 nba talent. Of all the teams that have ranged during the last 20 years I could only think of the 2004 detroit pistons that didn't have a top 5 talent leading them on, but they had allstars in rip, chauncy, wallace and big ben leading them on. Not exactly the brin forbes of the league.

  5. #30
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    How's the system working now that they don't have hof players in Timmy,manu,tp9,kwitter? Talent matters more in the nba than in any other bball league. You wont win if you dont have top 5 nba talent. Of all the teams that have ranged during the last 20 years I could only think of the 2004 detroit pistons that didn't have a top 5 talent leading them on, but they had allstars in rip, chauncy, wallace and big ben leading them on. Not exactly the brin forbes of the league.
    They aren't bottom of the pack and it's too early to tell otherwise.

    All Stars are voted in based on their team success during the RS. It's not an endorsement as to the overall talent of that player, else he'd continue being an all star. Kobe was voted in while he didn't even suit up, just like Yao Ming.

  6. #31
    Believe. anon's Avatar
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    It's time to retire to the antiquated system angle. Who in this Curry/Durant decade publicly uses the word "system" anymore? None of the players use it, none of the blog boy journalists use it, none of the coaches talking to reporters about how they use their players use the term. It's a player's league more than ever.

  7. #32
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    How's the system working now that they don't have hof players in Timmy,manu,tp9,kwitter? Talent matters more in the nba than in any other bball league. You wont win if you dont have top 5 nba talent. Of all the teams that have ranged during the last 20 years I could only think of the 2004 detroit pistons that didn't have a top 5 talent leading them on, but they had allstars in rip, chauncy, wallace and big ben leading them on. Not exactly the brin forbes of the league.
    Who on the 2014 spurs was a top five talent?

  8. #33
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    This makes no ing sense
    Any= any other coach

    And no, I don't know if a coach like Isiah Thomas would have led that Spurs roster to two consecutive NBA finlas.

    But there are many others that I think could have, like Brad Stevens, Budenholzer, Quin Snyder, etc.

  9. #34
    Billy Bob
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    Who on the 2014 spurs was a top five talent?
    Tp9 was considered behind lebron in 2013 as an mvp candidate. Was supposedly the best point guard in the league according to nba analysts in 2013/2014. Winning 2014 fmvp makes kawhi into a superstar, thus a top 5 talent. Manu and td21 had resurgence years. They were not exactly a bunch of scrubs that won a le.

  10. #35
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Tp9 was considered behind lebron in 2013 as an mvp candidate. Was supposedly the best point guard in the league according to nba analysts in 2013/2014. Winning 2014 fmvp makes kawhi into a superstar, thus a top 5 talent. Manu and td21 had resurgence years. They were not exactly a bunch of scrubs that won a le.
    So Andre Iguodala was a superstar in 2016? Odd that he wasn't voted into the AS game.

  11. #36
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Any= any other coach

    And no, I don't know if a coach like Isiah Thomas would have led that Spurs roster to two consecutive NBA finlas.

    But there are many others that I think could have, like Brad Stevens, Budenholzer, Quin Snyder, etc.
    All coaches that have never led a team to the Finals. One is a Pop disciple. There's a reason the rest of the league is adopting the "system" and hiring Pop disciples.

  12. #37
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    All coaches that have never led a team to the Finals. One is a Pop disciple. There's a reason the rest of the league is adopting the "system" and hiring Pop disciples.
    All coaches that never had a roster as talented as that Spurs team.

  13. #38
    Veteran
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    lol son. That entire Argentina team will get into the Hall just for that one run.
    Exactly. Pop got Manu in as an individual.

  14. #39
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Exactly. Pop got Manu in as an individual.
    No, Manu got himself individually winning Euroleague MVP and being the best player of the team that beat US for the first and maybe only time.

    If anything, Pop took away from Manu's individual accomplishments when he made him a 6th man. A decision that probably no other coach would have taken.

  15. #40
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    Tp9 was considered behind lebron in 2013 as an mvp candidate. Was supposedly the best point guard in the league according to nba analysts in 2013/2014. Winning 2014 fmvp makes kawhi into a superstar, thus a top 5 talent. Manu and td21 had resurgence years. They were not exactly a bunch of scrubs that won a le.
    Parker wasn’t top five.
    Kawhi wasn’t top five. He won finals mvp because the spurs won the finals. Was billions top five in 2004?
    Duncan wasn’t top five.
    ginobily wasn’t top five.

    Nobody said the spurs were scrubs. They just didn’t have any top five players like you claimed is a must to win les.

    In fact, I’m not even sure you can put anyone on the 2008 celtics as a top five then. But you can argue that.

  16. #41
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    All coaches that never had a roster as talented as that Spurs team.


    You're just going to "nuh uh" regardless of the evidence against your re ed take.

  17. #42
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    No, Manu got himself individually winning Euroleague MVP and being the best player of the team that beat US for the first and maybe only time.

    If anything, Pop took away from Manu's individual accomplishments when he made him a 6th man. A decision that probably no other coach would have taken.
    Yet nobody ever heard of the mother er. 57th overall.

  18. #43
    Billy Bob
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    Parker wasn’t top five.
    Kawhi wasn’t top five. He won finals mvp because the spurs won the finals. Was billions top five in 2004?
    Duncan wasn’t top five.
    ginobily wasn’t top five.

    Nobody said the spurs were scrubs. They just didn’t have any top five players like you claimed is a must to win les.

    In fact, I’m not even sure you can put anyone on the 2008 celtics as a top five then. But you can argue that.
    Wasn't tp an mvp candidate during the 2012-2014 seasons that fueled those spurs teams and helped got them those 60+ wins? And kawhi was already considered by many analysts as the top perimeter defender and a future superstar by many in nba circles and spurstalk. Thats 2 players in the top 5. Never said duncan or manu were top 5 during those years, but they had good years.

    I don't know if billups was considered a top 5 player but he was considered a top 3 point guard behind nash and jkidd during those years. They also had two top defensive players in wallace bros and i think ben was a dpoy winner that year. Dont forget rip was an allstar also.

  19. #44
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    You're just going to "nuh uh" regardless of the evidence against your re ed take.
    I'm giving you simple, easily comprobable facts. The are you talking about?

    Tell me which of those coaches I named had the chance to coach a team as talented as the 2014 Spurs? I'll wait.

  20. #45
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Yet nobody ever heard of the mother er. 57th overall.
    Basketball folks heard about him in '02 and '04 just fine, tbh.

  21. #46
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    I'm giving you simple, easily comprobable facts. The are you talking about?

    Tell me which of those coaches I named had the chance to coach a team as talented as the 2014 Spurs? I'll wait.
    "a roster as talented as the Spurs team" is not a factual remark. It's both nebulous and based on opinion. How can anyone disprove "as talented as"? I can show you what most of the players on that roster did before and after the Spurs. You'll dismiss it.

  22. #47
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Basketball folks heard about him in '02 and '04 just fine, tbh.
    57th

  23. #48
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    It was all Manu, tbh, knowledgeable basketball people knew this...

  24. #49
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    Wasn't tp an mvp candidate during the 2012-2014 seasons that fueled those spurs teams and helped got them those 60+ wins? And kawhi was already considered by many analysts as the top perimeter defender and a future superstar by many in nba circles and spurstalk. Thats 2 players in the top 5. Never said duncan or manu were top 5 during those years, but they had good years.

    I don't know if billups was considered a top 5 player but he was considered a top 3 point guard behind nash and jkidd during those years. They also had two top defensive players in wallace bros and i think ben was a dpoy winner that year. Dont forget rip was an allstar also.
    I’m not even sure what criteria you are going on. Parker was number 12 in mvp awards share in 13-14. That’s pretty far from number five.

    As for Kawhi, which part of up and coming star means top 5 player? Is doncic a top five player now?

    YOU said the pistons didn’t have any top five players in 04 and you are now trying to argue against it? What the is wrong with you?

  25. #50
    俺はまんこが大好きなんだよ baseline bum's Avatar
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    My 38-44 projection not looking so bad now

    I think Vegas still has the Spurs winning 43 games this season, but I'm expecting them to go 38W - 44L. So pretty well out of the playoff hunt but also pretty well out of the high lottery.

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