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Could you please blend these two together?Popovich hasn't gotten past the first round without Kawhi or Tim and probably never willhe's the GOAT, still..
Could you please blend these two together?Popovich hasn't gotten past the first round without Kawhi or Tim and probably never will
lol
that pussy actually made me root for and respect russell westbrook
what a weak
I mean, technically, missed time is the fairest argument. Not sure how it could be fairer that A B testing, tbh.
When you have the most dangerous offensive player of all time, the two best shooters and a guy who turned out to be the highest IQ defender of all-time, not much coaching was ever needed outside of avoiding being Mark Jackson.they didn't need coaching at that point
Here's a good breakdown of what exactly Mark Jackson did while he was Golden State's head coach.
Meh, Kerr "putting his system in place" and Kerr "instilling a winning culture" are terms made up by the same people who were cheering on Meyers Leonard tonight in order to deflect some of the praise that should be directed at Curry, Draymond and Klay, tbh.
That's mostly because:
1) Curry was struggling with ankle injuries.
2) Draymond wasn't Draymond yet.
3) Mark Jackson was sabotaging everything.
Even given that, in hindsight, they could have been championship contenders as early as 2013.
Mostly coincidence and an accident. If Stan Van Gundy hadn't turned down the job before Kerr got it, they would have still won championships.
Kerr's "presence" is far down on the list. Only vanilla fans who want to take away the limelight from where it's truly due would even point to that as a top ten reason, tbh.
True. Good job. If I want to homer out, I'd hype Kerr too because he has at least a couple branches connected to the Pop tree -- especially if you look at his assistant coach hires.
But if I'm being honest, it's mostly just narrative the media likes to harp on.
Agree. But, I mean, that's what it sounds like you're doing with Kerr, tbh., you can bet that the media and fans would be eating Pop's ass every day if he had built this
The most vanilla of vanilla fan takes is that the winning coach of a playoff series "outcoached" the losing coach. The truth is that NBA coaches rarely outcoach each other to the point that it impacts winning or losing a playoff series. "Kerr is such a genius
No, not really. Right place, right time, didn't mess it up, stayed out of the way. Well done but he doesn't deserve as much credit as he gets.
Yep. I don't think Harlem believes in the coaching myth, either. As I said earlier ITT:
The most vanilla of vanilla fan takes is that the winning coach of a playoff series "outcoached" the losing coach. The truth is that NBA coaches rarely outcoach each other to the point that it impacts winning or losing a playoff series. "
No, not really. Right place, right time, didn't mess it up, stayed out of the way. Well done but he doesn't deserve as much credit as he gets.
"Unfortunately for the egos of head coaches, I think those standards will cease to exist soon, since the data (which of course you're familiar with) illustrates coaching doesn't have much of an impact on win total. The true "chess match" is in front offices trying to out roster build and out data each other. Sure, coaches can have big in game impacts with their rotation strategies, but that is also something that is informed by front office data. The infamous pulling Duncan in Game 6 is an example. Data showed Duncan was poor closing out on shooters, Miami was obviously going to shoot a three, so Pop made the statistically correct decision in subbing in Diaw. If Diaw were to block the shot, Pop looks like a genius. A funny bounce off the rim made him look like the fool, and fans hindsighted his decision to death, but what if he kept in Duncan and he failed to close out on a shooter?
Point is fans become results oriented and thinking a coach is imparting his ego on the game with his rotation choices, when in fact those choices are made long beforehand, and most likely informed by data collected by front offices. Boiled down, front offices are really the en ies that run teams now. As Cub would say, "you can pick any of these coaches out of a hat. It doesn't matter." "
Yeah, I find it amusing that fans and media think coaches have some arcane strategy they use to "out think" and "out chess match" the other coach. I don't think Pop is being flippant at all when the media asks him what went wrong and he replies, "They made more shots." That's what basketball comes to do. But the media and fans like the idea of the tortured genius coach sitting there in a dimly lit room, watching hours of film, and devising some super secret playbook that is going to totally take the opponent by storm. Pop even said every coach knows what the other is going to do. He's about making sure he does his thing as perfectly as possible. Basketball tactics and strategy are pretty formalized now. It's about who executes better, and better talent typically executes better.
Belichick has the same myth surrounding him, as if he saw in his chess master like ways Pete Carroll calling that slant when the obvious play was to run, and set up his defense perfectly to put Butler in that position. You can read the run up to what Belichick called, and at the last second, he said "goal line," a "formal" defensive alignment that already is built to defend a short slant pass anyway. Butler just made an outstanding play. Had nothing to do with Belichick "out thinking" Carroll. Any coach calls goal line in that situation.
Now if they beat Milwaukee without Durant, THEN you can clown him.
I guess beating the Rockets in 2017 doesn’t count. Kawhi was hobbled, or not playing at the end of games, or missing game 6.He's a great coach, but he's an example of why their impact is limited..his system with Al Horford leading it gets swept in the playoffs, while his team with Giannis can win the le..
Popovich hasn't gotten past the first round without Kawhi or Tim and probably never will
Good post, I'm not going to lie, tbh.
I've never claimed Pop is the GOAT for similar reasons. I'm obviously a huge Pop fan, spend a lot of my ST defending him but -- as you said -- NBA coaches are rarely the deciding factor between wins and losses ... especially today. There are some anomalies (Kerr taking over for Mark Jackson, Bud taking over for Jason Kidd, Avery Johnson taking over for a 99.9% retired Don Nelson) where putting a competent person in charge allows players to play up to their potential but for the most part, NBA coaching impact is highly overrated. For that reason, I don't think it's possible or even worthwhile to determine whether Pop is the GOAT. Pop and Belichick are similar: impressive longevity due to a willingness to change with the times and avoid personal landmines, had the good fortune of coaching great players, not afraid to surround themselves with strong minds, and an ability to move on from the highs and the lows of the job.
The first half of this Game 4 was the worst WCF basketball in terms of intensity/defense I've every seen.
It was more like a regular season game with zero stakes.
Stots is so terrible. Blazers were playing pathetic defense. Not because players are that bad but simple fact of setting the defense. lazy and pathetic defense. Ofensively they never figured out doble teams and traps.
The level of basketball in this Finals was so low that idk what to tell. Kerr could play towel two towel boys and still win this.
And now that ty GS team that I hate has almost a centry to rest b4 the Finals.
Early opening series lines from BetOnline
Warriors -180 Bucks +160
Warriors -300 Raptors +250
Should've been Denver in the WCF imo.
Denver, Portland, OKC, Spurs... would be the same result
Not that horrible sweep. At least Mike Malone can coach for something
I'm gonna bet Dur got Finals MVP at ~+250. Not just because I think MIL will do whatever it takes to get the ball out of Curry's hands and bait KD into attacking his mismatches, but also as fan insurance in case this piece of indeed steals the award from Steph AGAIN.
Hopefully Milwaukee wins though
111-108 after White Bread dunks and only 1:50 left in regulation. One of the most egregious Blazer ups. Donkey Green in hero mode tries to take the ball coast to coast and forces a drive into the paint. Gets his pushed in by Evan Turner and it's a jump ball. Donkey tips it to Klanus, who is double teamed at the top of the arc. Both Blazer players retreat. Literally backing up 5-10 feet in a "I got him no you take him" moment. Leaves Klanus with a wide open trey. He rattles it in. Van Gundy drops to his knees and begins to blow Klanus.
Unreal.
Per BSPN: the Blazers became the only team over the past two decades to lose three games that they led by at least 15 points in the same playoff series.
IMO Kerr gets some credit for Green. When Jackson was coach Green filled in for injured David Lee a hand full of times and did well, but Jackson still didn't replace Lee with Green in the starting lineup. Most NBA coaches are so frightened about changing the status quo that they would be too worried about the optics of replacing Lee with Green if it backfired.
Kerr also gets credit for how well he manages regular season workload so his team is fresh for the playoffs. It's not a coincidence the year they go 44-2 with Walton is the year they run out of gas in the finals. Walton went 44-2 by increasing the best players' minutes (2016 is the only year in the last 5 where Curry or Draymond averaged > 34 MPG in the regular season) and doing nothing to curtail the amount of energy being spent on regular season games, a particularly stupid strategy for a team that's coming off a long season playing into June and doesn't need to be playing extended regular season minutes to gain experience together. Compare that to how Kerr managed the Warriors the last two years where they were clearly coasting at times during the regular season but they also clearly have more left in the tank now than whatever team they're up against. The 2016 Warriors definitely don't win 73 regular season games with Kerr as the coach but they also beat Cleveland imo if Kerr had been coaching them the whole season.
With the new three point chuck league, valuing possessions is out the window.
Teams play the last 5 minutes of a playoff game like they play the first five minutes of a regular season game in January, chuck chuck chuck. Disgusting.
No one is watching
To be fair to the basketball gods, that was mostly luck. Kerr started David Lee the entire preseason despite calls from a lot of fans and stats nerds who noted that Lee was actually a negative influence on the court. Lee pulled his hamstring during the last preseason game, which forced Green into the starting lineup.
By the time Lee was healthy, the Warriors were 25-3 (IIRC) and Green had begun to blossom into the monster he is today and it was obvious to keep starting him.
Somewhat agreed but then again, the year before Kerr got the Warriors job, the Spurs had just won a championship with no one averaging more than 30 MPG ... so resting during the regular season wasn't really a novel approach.
Last edited by timvp; 05-21-2019 at 01:30 PM.
^ ya and i was surprised Kerr left Twinky Curry on the floor as long as he did in last nights OT game.
IIRC there was a game or 2 in early November when Lee came back (before getting injured again) and Green was starting over him then.
It's not a novel approach, but it's something that most coaches aren't very good at (Popovich is probably the GOAT at it), particularly coaches in new situations who don't have a lot of job security. Most coaches stepping into new jobs take the Thibodeau approach of juicing the win column by running starters into the ground just so they can say they made the team better than the last coach did.
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