Trayvon Martin - black kid armed with skittles killed in "self-defense" - Part 1

[Creepn]

Why are you so fucking stupid? If you mean the sentence "Blacks tend not to," then I suggest you do some fact checking as to words and phrase meanings. It's a generalization based on statistics, and not a statement that carries fact for all. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. Period. However, my observations of life over these last many decades tell me that in general, blacks are lazier as a class as other races.

What other observations and or fact that show poorly on a class do you want to call racist, bigotry, etc? Does using the statistics that show blacks commit more crime per capita than whites mean one is racist?

My God man... Grow up. Stop being butthurt over the truth.

Those stats are deeply and dangerously flawed. Inaccurate. Period.

[Trill Clinton]

first time watching faux news and i can see why it gets such a bad wrap.

this zimmerman interview is so scripted its disgusting. dude said he wouldnt do anything different that night smh.

[Yonivore]

first time watching faux news and i can see why it gets such a bad wrap.

this zimmerman interview is so scripted its disgusting. dude said he wouldnt do anything different that night smh.
That would suggest he did something wrong.

[Creepn]

He said that? He wouldn't do anything different? He wouldn't announce himself to avoid a needless death? Fucked up.

[Yonivore]

He said that? He wouldn't do anything different? He wouldn't announce himself to avoid a needless death? Fucked up.
Announced himself? He contends Martin blind-sided him. How do you announce yourself to someone approaching you without your knowledge?

[Trill Clinton]

aye yoni, go play in traffic. now is not the time.

[Yonivore]

aye yoni, go play in traffic. now is not the time.
Hey, Trill; GFY. This thread is for discussing the Martin shooting.

[Wild Cobra]

Those stats are deeply and dangerously flawed. Inaccurate. Period.
Maybe they are, maybe they aren't.

Did you see where I said:

"If I'm wrong, I'm wrong."

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Why are you so fucking stupid? If you mean the sentence "Blacks tend not to," then I suggest you do some fact checking as to words and phrase meanings. It's a generalization based on statistics, and not a statement that carries fact for all. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. Period. However, my observations of life over these last many decades tell me that in general, blacks are lazier as a class as other races.

What other observations and or fact that show poorly on a class do you want to call racist, bigotry, etc? Does using the statistics that show blacks commit more crime per capita than whites mean one is racist?

My God man... Grow up. Stop being butthurt over the truth.




The hard facts are simply that more black people fall into that social class that wants the government handouts.

This is bullshit as more white people are on welfare in this country.


Hispanics tend to accel rather well in this nation after a generation or two. They have work ethics. Blacks tend not to.

'Tend not to' is a generalization of the entire race, dolt. And show me a statistic that says black people 'tend not to' have work ethics.


And as long as one race has more than ten times as many who act like animals. people will fear them.

I'm sure you have stats for this one.


Well, in my experience, far more blacks speak poorly than white. Being in the Army for 11 years, I saw a good mix of people from all over. I say there's a significant difference.

This one speaks for itself.


I don't like most black people. There are very few who I have met that grew up in a cultural setting I have any respect for. Most I have met are out right thugs, and lack integrity. I could say I don't like black people, but there are some exceptions. If I based all my decisions on statistics, I would stay clear of blacks.

Hmm, you saying you do not like another group of people somehow makes you not racist for saying that you don't like black people? You are such a coward.


The Jacksons and Sharptons of this world need to stop blaming the white man, and blame their own people for presenting themselves so poorly to the rest of us.

So what is the statistic for for presenting themselves so poorly to 'us?'

[Creepn]

Announced himself? He contends Martin blind-sided him. How do you announce yourself to someone approaching you without your knowledge?

Lol blind-sided? No Zimmerman shown himself to Martin on more than one occasion. The final confrontation they walked up to each other and still Zimmerman failed to announce himself. He threatened him instead by telling a black guy "what are you doing in my nieghborhood?" Do you know the historical aspect to those words? Very threatening.

[Yonivore]

Lol blind-sided? No Zimmerman shown himself to Martin on more than one occasion.
If Martin saw him, what would Zimmerman announce? Why wouldn't the same be required of Martin?


The final confrontation they walked up to each other and still Zimmerman failed to announce himself.
Not according to Zimmerman. He was walking back to his vehicle when Martin approached him from the left and behind.


He threatened him instead by telling a black guy "what are you doing in my nieghborhood?" Do you know the historical aspect to those words? Very threatening.
Actually, both Zimmerman and Martin's girlfriend (who was on the phone with Martin at the time) disagree with this characterization.

Both agree Martin spoke first when he said something to the effect of "what do you want" or "why are you following me" after which the girlfriend states the person to whom Martin spoke said, "what are you doing here?" [I don't think Zimmerman has said how he responded and the rest of his account isn't repeated by the girlfriend]

From that point, Zimmerman has said Martin asked him, "Do you have a problem?" and that it quickly escalated to Martin punching him in the face, breaking his nose. Zimmerman stated, tonight, that Martin attacked when he reached for his cell phone and that from that point on he was fighting for his life.

And, as I've said before, all the known evidence tends to support this version of events.

[Yonivore]

And, again, no one answers the question of how Martin ended up less than a hundred feet from where Zimmerman told police "he ran," when it was a full two-minutes before the end of Zimmerman's call.

How far can you run in 2 minutes? How far can you walk in 2 minutes?

Well, in this case, Martin could have probably crawled to his condominium in two minutes; that's how close he was to his house.

It doesn't add up that Martin ended up at the scene of the shooting unless he made the decision to be there.

[Creepn]

If Martin saw him, what would Zimmerman announce? Why wouldn't the same be required of Martin?

Because Martin wasnt't the one stalker. He tired himself out by running from him and wanted to establish diplomacy to find out what his deal was. He should've announced that he was the neighborhood watchman.




Not according to Zimmerman. He was walking back to his vehicle when Martin approached him from the left and behind.

Not according to Zimmerman? He's a known liar.




Actually, both Zimmerman and Martin's girlfriend (who was on the phone with Martin at the time) disagree with this characterization.

Both agree Martin spoke first when he said something to the effect of "what do you want" or "why are you following me" after which the girlfriend states the person to whom Martin spoke said, "what are you doing here?" [I don't think Zimmerman has said how he responded and the rest of his account isn't repeated by the girlfriend]

From that point, Zimmerman has said Martin asked him, "Do you have a problem?" and that it quickly escalated to Martin punching him in the face, breaking his nose. Zimmerman stated, tonight, that Martin attacked when he reached for his cell phone and that from that point on he was fighting for his life.

And, as I've said before, all the known evidence tends to support this version of events.

Where did all this bullshit come from? Nobody knows who did initial contact. Where is this "evidence" to support this speculation? I got mine from the interview. "What are you doin here" is still pretty bad to ask anyone and you know it.

[Creepn]

And, again, no one answers the question of how Martin ended up less than a hundred feet from where Zimmerman told police "he ran," when it was a full two-minutes before the end of Zimmerman's call.

How far can you run in 2 minutes? How far can you walk in 2 minutes?

Well, in this case, Martin could have probably crawled to his condominium in two minutes; that's how close he was to his house.

It doesn't add up that Martin ended up at the scene of the shooting unless he made the decision to be there.

That's been answered a couple of times already in this thread.

[Yonivore]

That's been answered a couple of times already in this thread.
Okay, answer it again because I didn't see it and I don't think there is any reasonable explanation other than Martin made the decision to wait until Zimmerman was off the phone and accosted him.

[Creepn]

Okay, answer it again because I didn't see it and I don't think there is any reasonable explanation other than Martin made the decision to wait until Zimmerman was off the phone and accosted him.

Martin tried shaking off his pursuer multiple times and was scared. After confirmation that Zimmerman was indeed chasing him, he didn't want to lead this stranger to the house where his little brother was. Pretty heroic of him tbh.

[Yonivore]

Because Martin wasnt't the one stalker. He tired himself out by running from him and wanted to establish diplomacy to find out what his deal was. He should've announced that he was the neighborhood watchman.
A football player that tired out after a few feet of running? I don't buy it. Besides, Zimmerman said tonight it wasn't really a run as much as he kind of trotted off, (he said "skip," I think but, he was obviously trying to express that Martin wasn't hauling ass away from him.)

In the context of this incident, two minutes is an eternity. In the two minutes after Zimmerman said Martin took off, Zimmerman walked completely across the block from where his car was parked to the the street on which he lived. He was headed back to where his car was parked when the shooting occurred. BUT.THAT.TOOK.TWO.MINUTES.

What was Martin doing for those two minutes? Look at a Google Earth image of the scene and tell me Martin could be in his house ripping open a bag of Skittles and unscrewing the bottle of tea BEFORE Zimmerman ever completed his call with police.


Not according to Zimmerman? He's a known liar.
Except the evidence is consistent with his version of events. We know what Zimmerman was doing for the two minutes after Martin ran; he was walking and talking to Police on the phone. Ending up where the shooting occurred is perfectly consistent with his story of walking across to the other street and being on his way back to the car.

Again, if you look at an overview of the scene, it would take about two minutes to walk the distance Zimmerman describes.


Where did all this bullshit come from? Nobody knows who did initial contact. Where is this "evidence" to support this speculation? I got mine from the interview. "What are you doin here" is still pretty bad to ask anyone and you know it.
If Martin's girlfriend is to be believed, and she gave an interview to the media early on (also somewhere in this thread), Zimmerman asking, "what are you doing here?" is in response to Martin -- who was on the phone with her when the two made contact -- asking Zimmerman "why are you following me?"

She said, immediately after that exchange, the scuffle started and Trayvon's phone disconnected because she presumed the blue tooth ear piece had been knocked off or fell off.

[Yonivore]

Martin tried shaking off his pursuer multiple times and was scared. After confirmation that Zimmerman was indeed chasing him, he didn't want to lead this stranger to the house where his little brother was. Pretty heroic of him tbh.
Nice fantasy. What do you have that supports any of it?

Zimmerman was on the phone with Police, sitting stationary in his car when, at one point (shortly before Martin "skipped" off), and he reports Martin is APPROACHING HIM and reaching for something in his waistband.

You're going to have to suggest Zimmerman was fabricating a scenario that would fit a series of event not yet known to anyone, even as he was on the phone with police.

[Creepn]

Sorry Yoni I'm tired. We will have to continue this tomorrow. I wasn't expecting to post but couldn't resist.

[clambake]

his lawyer made him take a bath. lol

[clambake]

yoni refuses to accept that george is a liar.

just like his beloved bush.

[boutons_deux]

JackS, you'll be gratified to know your God planned for Z to murder M.

http://www.latimes.com/news/la-naw-zimmerman-interview-20120718,0,4171414.story

No word yet from the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

[jack sommerset]

Yes my brother, it was God plan. God bless

[Sportcamper]

How stupid is Zimmerman’s attorney to let him conduct an interview like that knowing what he would say?

[jack sommerset]

How stupid is Zimmerman’s attorney to let him conduct an interview like that knowing what he would say?

More like innocent, not stupid. God bless

[Trill Clinton]

Barbara Walters from ABC flew to Florida last night to interview Zimmerman. She walked away because he wanted her to pay for a month long stay in a hotel

From Tracy Martin " To ask us if we will forgive a guy who DOESNT EVEN REGRET taking our son's life is too much to ask right now." Attorney Ben Crump "just unbelievable" he was speechless

Most people are saying GZ came off as an a-hole because "he doesnt regret getting out of his car, carrying a gun and would not do anything differently"

Reading the analysis online, I dont see how this interview did him in favors. Natalie Jackson called the interview a "prosecutors dream"

Here are some of the questions she posed:

GZ says he was never more than 100ft from his car- so why was Tray's body found so far away from the truck?

GZ didnt mean to tell the dispatch that he was following Tray but meant that he was going in the same direction-

GZ said Tray was "skipping" wouldnt skipping imply that he was happy and carefree not a criminal?

GZ said he used the phrase "F-ing punks" when going after Trayvon. What made him profile a teen walking home as a "punk" and asshole"

GZ said that Trayvon didnt look like a "fitness fanatic"-is he finally admitting that Tray wasnt physically imposing.

[Creepn]

Zimmerman said Martin was skipping now?? He told dispatcher that he was running though. Good god this man changes his story so many times it's pathetic. This is exactly what I'm talking about. What's worse is that his supporters argue with a new version of Zimmerman's story without realizing they are being strung along. Sad.

"According to Zimmerman" lol get outta here with that sht. I need to watch that interview.

[jack sommerset]

Very Non interesting comments from Jackson. Skipping could imply he was high on drugs, which he was. You know, these types of questions, comments Jackson has made has been made before. Seriously, Zimmerman will not be convicted of murder using this as evidence. For her to say this is a "prosecutors dream" is absolutely nonsense and not true. A dream would be Zimmerman saying he murdered him cuz he was a punk and ahole, he let that weak child get on top of him to make it look like self defense. This will be my last post until trial about Zimmerman. Same old stale arguments. I would wager this forum has talked more about Zimmerman than 99.999999 percent of other political forums. It's boring now. God bless

[Trill Clinton]

Zimmerman said Martin was skipping now?? He told dispatcher that he was running though. Good god this man changes his story so many times it's pathetic. This is exactly what I'm talking about. What's worse is that his supporters argue with a new version of Zimmerman's story without realizing they are being strung along. Sad.

"According to Zimmerman" lol get outta here with that sht. I need to watch that interview.

Creepn my brother, you must watch it. you will be shaking your head and laughing. he came off as crazy and delusional.

I think Hannity did more harm than good. the entire interview was a plea for public support for the cowardice child killer and a way for Hannity to clear his name since its speculated he offered to pay for zimmerman's legal fees.

in the jail conversations zimmerman mentions a "SH" will help pay, I wonder who that is?

[Trill Clinton]

Very Non interesting comments from Jackson. Skipping could imply he was high on drugs, which he was.

:lmao

[DarrinS]

I don't completely buy Z's account of what transpired up to the confrontation with Trayvon; however, his account of events after that are believable and are supported by physical evidence. Seems to me, it is a clear case of self-defense when there is a gun within reach of two people in a fight -- unless there's some really compelling evidence that the prosecution has not revealed yet.

[clambake]

there was a gun within the reach of just one person.

martin never had a chance.

the idea that some people believe the accounts of this confirmed liar is laughable and sad.

[DarrinS]

there was a gun within the reach of just one person.

martin never had a chance.

the idea that some people believe the accounts of this confirmed liar is laughable and sad.


Martin is on top of a man with a holstered weapon, and it's not within reach?

Being a liar doesn't make you a murderer, last time I checked.

[clambake]

Martin is on top of a man with a holstered weapon, and it's not within reach?

Being a liar doesn't make you a murderer, last time I checked.

thats what george says. and george is a confirmed liar.

confirmed. so is his wife.

confirmed.

[Trill Clinton]

Dear God, It Wasn't Your Plan To Kill Trayvon! By Michael Skolnik

Posted 39 min 44 sec ago by Michael Skolnik (http://globalgrind.com/celebrities/michael-skolnik)

http://s0.2mdn.net/viewad/817-grey.gif (http://ad.doubleclick.net/click;h=v8/3cb7/0/0/%2a/c;44306;0-0;0;79070299;13220-540/100;0/0/0;;~sscs=%3f) Advertisement http://static.globalgrind.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/article_images_540/images/2012_july/trayvon-hl-12-7-19.jpg
I have prayed with the Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus and the non-believers. I have celebrated Passover, the end of Ramadan and Easter. I have sat in churches, mosques, synagogues, temples and the homes of beautiful, religious people all around the world. I have prayed. I continue to pray. I believe in prayer. And today, I pray to you, God, that you hear this prayer and let us all know that there is no way in hell that it was your plan to kill Trayvon Martin.

George Zimmerman said it was your plan. The guy who pulled a 9mm gun that rainy night in Sanford, Florida, said last night on TV, that it was your plan. Said he had no regrets. No regrets about getting out of the car. No regrets about having a gun. No regrets. No regrets about shooting an unarmed teenager with one bullet in his chest that put an end to his life.

Forgiveness. We seek to forgive. But as Trayvon's father said this morning, "To ask us if we will forgive a guy who doesn't even regret taking our son's life is just too much to ask right now." Maybe one day, but just not now. Not at this moment, not at this time. Not after what Mr. Zimmerman said last night. His words last night did not help him and did not help us. George Zimmerman will be put through our justice system and we will assume he is innocent until proven guilty. However, we will not accept that this was your plan, just cause he said it. We will not accept that a young man's life was cut short because a man holding a gun didn't like the way he walked or how he looked. All of the good books teach us those lessons about judgment...by now we should have gotten the message.

I never got a chance to meet Trayvon, so you tell him hello for me. Tell him that we got our hoodies up and that we will continue to seek justice for his family. Tell him that LeBron wrote his name on his shoes. Tell him the President of the United States said if he had a son, he would look like him. Tell him that strangers, complete strangers, people him nor I ever met, marched in streets all across this country because of him. Tell him his friends miss him...really, really miss him. Tell him that his mother, father and brother are some of the most incredible people in the world...I am sure he already knows that. But, please just remind him.

And God, one more thing...if you are not going to listen to my prayer, please listen to the words of Trayvon's father, Tracy, "We must worship a different God, because there's no way MY God would have wanted George Zimmerman to murder my teenage son."

~Michael Skolnik
Michael Skolnik is the Editor-In-Chief of GlobalGrind.com and the political director to Russell Simmons. Prior to this, Michael was an award-winning filmmaker. Follow him on twitter @MichaelSkolnik (http://www.twitter.com/michaelskolnik)






Read more: http://globalgrind.com/news/god-plan-george-zimmerman-fox-news-sean-hannity-trayvon-martin-michael-skolnik-blog#ixzz2158HuhBn (http://globalgrind.com/news/god-plan-george-zimmerman-fox-news-sean-hannity-trayvon-martin-michael-skolnik-blog#ixzz2158HuhBn)

[DarrinS]

thats what george says. and george is a confirmed liar.

confirmed. so is his wife.

confirmed.


Broken nose -- confirmed. Injuries to back of head -- confirmed. Injuries to Trayvon's hand -- confirmed. Bullet fired from close range -- confirmed.

[DarrinS]

It's shocking that confrontations between wannabe gangsta thugs and armed, hypervigilant neighborhood watchmen don't go well.

[Trill Clinton]

It's shocking that confrontations between wannabe gangsta thugs and armed, hypervigilant neighborhood watchmen don't go well.

what gives you the impression Trayvon was a wannabe thug that night? no gang colors, no weapons, most importantly no criminal history. stop stereotyping him beause he's black.

[clambake]

Broken nose -- confirmed. Injuries to back of head -- confirmed. Injuries to Trayvon's hand -- confirmed. Bullet fired from close range -- confirmed.

broken nose lol

scratches lol

trayvons hands because he was the only one fighting for his life.

bullet close range, the plan all along.

prays to god in between telling lies. lol

gods plan includes him being a liar. lol

[clambake]

birther supporting this liar cuz hannity told him to. lol

[DarrinS]

broken nose lol

scratches lol

trayvons hands because he was the only one fighting for his life.

bullet close range, the plan all along.

prays to god in between telling lies. lol

gods plan includes him being a liar. lol


Physical evidence doesn't lie. Use your head and stop emoting.

[clambake]

scratches lol

poor baby got scratched after hunting this kid down. lol

[DarrinS]

scratches lol

poor baby got scratched after hunting this kid down. lol


lol. Prosecutors can only hope they have a group of retards like you on the jury -- no proof required.

[clambake]

birther is upset. lol

[FuzzyLumpkins]

It's shocking that confrontations between wannabe gangsta thugs and armed, hypervigilant neighborhood watchmen don't go well.

Getting punch in the nose and falling down is not grounds to shoot someone. The guy that testified that Zimmerman was going MMA recanted that statement. The injuries to the back of his head did not require a single stitch.

There was also a statement that Martin was saying "okay you got me, you got me" after he shot him though the hear and his lungs were filling with blood. Maybe he could hear it through the frothy bubbling. Or more likely he heard that before he shot him.

Now he is saying that he went for Zimmerman's gun but how exactly did he know he had a gun. Zimmerman is a slimy deceptive piece of shit and no the physical evidence does not match up with the account. Getting your head beaten on concrete requires stitches.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Physical evidence doesn't lie. Use your head and stop emoting.

It sure it does when you grandstand and exaggerate it. I have seen nothing about the gun wounds themslelves in relation to the account.

But hey how about you regale us about how a broken nose and light abrasions on the back of one's head that require no stitches corroborate the account.

[Trill Clinton]

If zimmerman walks, they need to free OJ. He was just trying to get his shit back.

[clambake]

It sure it does when you grandstand and exaggerate it. I have seen nothing about the gun wounds themslelves in relation to the account.

But hey how about you regale us about how a broken nose and light abrasions on the back of one's head that require no stitches corroborate the account.

he's just doing what hannity tells him to do.

[DarrinS]

I have seen nothing about the gun wounds themslelves in relation to the account.

Look harder

[Yonivore]

GZ says he was never more than 100ft from his car- so why was Tray's body found so far away from the truck?
He's a poor judge of distances? He didn't have a tape measure available to measure the distance and was just estimating? It's clear to everyone he was at least as far away from his truck as the vicinity where Martin was shot -- unless, of course, he was claiming he didn't shoot him.


GZ didnt mean to tell the dispatch that he was following Tray but meant that he was going in the same direction-
I don't recall hearing him say he didn't mean to tell the dispatcher that he was following Trayvon but that he was merely walking in the same direction. I do recall him saying he got out of his truck, while on the phone with police, (apparently his seat belt unbuckling and door opening can be heard on the recording), in order to see if he could maintain sight of Martin so he could tell police where he went. That could be construed as following but, not pursuing as has been suggested. He then said when the dispatcher said he didn't need to do that (when he answered yes to the question of "Are you following him?"), he continued across the complex to his street to get an address off the house on the other side.


GZ said Tray was "skipping" wouldnt skipping imply that he was happy and carefree not a criminal?
It was pretty clear, to me anyway, Zimmerman was struggling to come up with a word, instead of "run," because, while Martin didn't walk away, he wasn't in a flat out run either. "Skip" is what his brain produced. What word would you use to describe a person moving faster than a walk but not sprinting? After thinking a few seconds, I came up with "trot" or "lope." But, it is a condition a person on the phone with police (and you may not be aware I have an extensive background in this area) might 1) struggle with describing on the phone and 2) just use one of the two most common words associated with people moving on their feet...walking or running. He chose run because Martin wasn't walking. In the interview last night, it was clear he was trying to arrive at a descriptor that indicated Martin was doing more than walking but wasn't running. Sue him.


GZ said he used the phrase "F-ing punks" when going after Trayvon. What made him profile a teen walking home as a "punk" and asshole"
Because he was suspicious (leisurely walking in rain, going between houses, appeared intoxicated, etc...), in a neighborhood experiencing a rash of property crimes which, apparently, weren't being solved by police at the rate Zimmerman thought they should. The "Fucking Punks" always get away is an appropriate response by someone frustrated by the lack of criminal arrests in a neighborhood plagued by crime when he is on the phone with police and the "fucking punk" takes off and he loses sight of them.


GZ said that Trayvon didnt look like a "fitness fanatic"-is he finally admitting that Tray wasnt physically imposing.
I took it to mean Martin wasn't dressed as if he were training for some athletic event. Long distance runners and bicyclers are known to train in the rain.

I'm still wondering how Martin ended up at the scene of the shooting when there is a full two minutes from the time Zimmerman said he ran until the end of Zimmerman's call with police ended. What was Martin doing for those two minutes?

[Trill Clinton]

lol

[Yonivore]

I need to watch that interview.
If you're going to keep referring to it, that'd be advisable.

[clambake]

believing a confirmed liar. lol

[Trill Clinton]

zimmerman couldn't think of another word for walking fast or brisk walk but he can remember everything else lmaooo. whew!

[Yonivore]

I don't completely buy Z's account of what transpired up to the confrontation with Trayvon; however, his account of events after that are believable and are supported by physical evidence. Seems to me, it is a clear case of self-defense when there is a gun within reach of two people in a fight -- unless there's some really compelling evidence that the prosecution has not revealed yet.
As his counsel, I wouldn't have allowed him to do the interview.

But, nothing he said is inconsistent with his original story. He's just really bad at relating what happened.

And, on the point of what happened up to the point of the confrontation -- most of what he relayed in the interview last night, happened while he was on the phone with police. If I remember correctly the entire call lasted around 4 minutes with 2 of those occurring after Martin moved away from Zimmerman, between the condos, at faster than a walk (fuck, I don't even know what word to use).

That timeline is perfectly consistent with Zimmerman walking from his truck, across the complex to he street and walking back toward his truck before terminating the call.

An important piece of evidence will be the amount of time between the termination of Zimmerman's call with police and the termination of Martin's call with his girlfriend. That will tell us how long after Zimmerman hung up with police that the confrontation occurred.

We already know from Martin's girlfriend, Martin spoke first. So, the closer to the same time both calls terminated the more likely it is Martin waited for Zimmerman to end his call and confront him. The greater the time difference, the more time there would be for a scenario Zimmerman's critics claim happened...not that it means it did happen that way.

Bottom line, the timeline supports Zimmerman being where he was when the confrontation occurred. There is no reason for Martin to have still been that close to the scene after two minutes unless he was detained or waited or returned. None. And, I've listened to the police recording and there is nothing to suggest Zimmerman was detaining Martin until the end of the call.

[clambake]

liar....always referring to god. lol

[Yonivore]

zimmerman couldn't think of another word for walking fast or brisk walk but he can remember everything else lmaooo. whew!
Actually, if you watch the interview, he was unclear on a number of details -- particularly those that occurred after Martin started bashing his head against the concrete.

Besides, memory and vocabulary are two different things.

[clambake]

bashing lol

[Trill Clinton]

Actually, if you watch the interview, he was unclear on a number of details -- particularly those that occurred after Martin started bashing his head against the concrete.

Besides, memory and vocabulary are two different things.
:lmao

he knew exactly what he was doing, the interview was scripted, rehearsed and he still managed to fuck up.

happy barbara walters realized how much of a snake he is before giving him an interview:toast

[Trill Clinton]

http://thegrio.com/2012/07/19/george-zimmerman-writes-letter-to-supporters/
The day after he gave an interview to Sean Hannity of Fox News, in which he expressed “no regrets” over the incidents surrounding the shooting death of Trayvon Martin, George Zimmerman relaunched his website, and sent a message to his supporters.

“I want to reach out to each supporter personally, however, the overwhelming support has made that effort challenging. I thank each and every one of you for your support, whether through your hard-earned money, words of encouragement, or most importantly through prayer,” Zimmerman said on the site, which had been shuttered by his attorney, Mark O’Mara, after the attorney took over the case in April. Zimmerman initially created TheRealGeorgeZimmerman.com while in hiding, prior to being charged with second degree murder in the Martin killing. His previous attorneys quit after losing touch with him, and included in their reasons for resigning, Zimmerman’s launching of the website, and an associated PayPal account, without consulting them. The following day, Zimmerman was charged with second degree murder.

That PayPal account eventually took in more than $209,000 — more than $135,000 of which was in the Zimmermans’ bank account on the day before his April 20 bond hearing. Zimmerman’s wife, Shellie, faces perjury charges for misleading the court about the money, raised from supporters. O’Mara declared the couple indigent at the hearing, and Zimmerman’s bond was revoked in June, after prosecutors discovered the existence of the money.

Now, the website is back.

Zimmerman explained why, in his letter to supporters:

“This has been the most difficult time of my life. I have been charged and arrested for murder, I have been accused of being a racist, and my family and I have to live in hiding because of threats against my life. I am not a murderer, and I am not a racist. Rumors and lies about the case and me are rampant on the Internet. I want to set the record straight about some things. I created this website to give me, the real George Zimmerman, a place to do that,” the post read. And Zimmerman added: “This is not my website, this is our website.”

The post includes a pitch for donations to the Zimmerman legal defense fund, which O’Mara placed under a trustee’s control in April.

“I also want a place where people can send me words of encouragement, and while I wish I didn’t have to ask, a place for those able to donate to my defense fund,” Zimmerman writes. “I started a defense fund to help pay my living expenses, to help with legal expenses, and help with security expenses as needed. I have had no other means of generating income for five months let alone pay the enormous expenses surrounding this case.”

Zimmerman in the post states that his living and security expenses have proved to be much larger than anticipated: “We have been in hiding in temporary housing, and our security needs have been extremely high,” he writes. “The fund has been devastated by the need to pay $100,000 to a bondsman and almost $50,000 in security expenses. The skyrocketing legal costs have gone unpaid. The defense fund is at its lowest point since its inception; in fact, with outstanding expenses yet unpaid, the fund is near depletion.”

O’Mara created a separate site, GZLegalCase.com, back in April, to disseminate information about the case. But Zimmerman indicates his site will do so, too. A previous version of the site drew controversy for including pictures of pro-Zimmerman graffiti scrawled on a black cultural center at Ohio State University.

The new site includes none of the original content. O’Mara confirmed to NBC News that the site is being administered by George Zimmerman. The full text of his letter is below:

Hello,

Thank you for taking the time to visit our website. I want to reach out to each supporter personally, however, the overwhelming support has made that effort challenging. I thank each and every one of you for your support, whether through your hard-earned money, words of encouragement, or most importantly through prayer. I want to tell you why I have created this site. This has been the most difficult time of my life. I have been charged and arrested for murder, I have been accused of being a racist, and my family and I have to live in hiding because of threats against my life. I am not a murderer, and I am not a racist. Rumors and lies about the case and me are rampant on the Internet. I want to set the record straight about some things. I created this website to give me, the real George Zimmerman, a place to do that. This is not my website, this is our website. I am going to use this as a chance to communicate with you and listen to you, and as an opportunity to share important things about the case.

I also want a place where people can send me words of encouragement, and while I wish I didn’t have to ask, a place for those able to donate to my defense fund. I started a defense fund to help pay my living expenses, to help with legal expenses, and help with security expenses as needed. I have had no other means of generating income for five months let alone pay the enormous expenses surrounding this case.

Given the extraordinary circumstances surrounding this case, we have now realized that it is much larger than we ever thought regarding its extent and cost. We have been in hiding in temporary housing, and our security needs have been extremely high. The fund has been devastated by the need to pay $100,000 to a bondsman and almost $50,000 in security expenses. The skyrocketing legal costs have gone unpaid. The defense fund is at its lowest point since its inception; in fact, with outstanding expenses yet unpaid, the fund is near depletion.

I don’t have the words to express the gratitude that my family and I feel toward you. Thank you for your generosity and your support in the past. We need your help again. It is only through your support that we have come this far and I’m learning there is a long way to go.

Once again, I humbly thank you.

Sincerely,
Your Friend, George

[Trill Clinton]

The child killing molestor's story continues to change

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/07/george_zimmerman_changes_story_fox.php

Nick R. Martin (http://talkingpointsmemo.com/nick_r_martin.php) July 19, 2012, 1:12 PM 11196[/URL]

George Zimmerman’s interview on Wednesday night with FOX News host Sean Hannity made it clear for the cable viewing nation that his story continues to shift in small but important ways.

Hannity was a mostly sympathetic interviewer, having [URL="http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/04/george_zimmerman_sean_hannity_attorneys.php"]defended Zimmerman (http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/07/george_zimmerman_changes_story_fox.php#pagecomment s) for months as a misunderstood and maligned victim who almost certainly was forced to kill unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin in self defense.

But even Hannity managed to catch the former neighborhood watchman on some inconsistencies early in the interview. The FOX host asked him to talk about the night of the Feb. 26 killing, when he first spotted the teen walking in the rain through the gated neighborhood in the Orlando suburbs.

From inside his vehicle that night, Zimmerman, 28, called the police and asked them to come out and investigate what Martin was up to. He had no idea that Martin was staying in the neighborhood with his father and his father’s girlfriend and was walking back from the store.

On a recording of the call, Zimmerman could be heard at one point telling the dispatcher that Martin had taken off. “Shit, he’s running,” Zimmerman said. At almost the same moment, the audio captured him taking off his seat belt, opening the door to his vehicle and getting out to follow the teen.



Authorities have said Martin ran because he was afraid of Zimmerman and that the neighborhood watchman chased him down, confronted him and eventually shot and killed him.

But on Wednesday night’s broadcast, Zimmerman changed his story from what he told the dispatcher that night. He also said there was no way Martin was afraid of him. Here’s part of the transcript (http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/hannity/2012/07/18/exclusive-george-zimmerman-breaks-silence-hannity/print) prepared by FOX News:


HANNITY: Why do you think that he was running then?

ZIMMERMAN: Maybe I said running, but he was more —

HANNITY: You said he’s running.

ZIMMERMAN: Yes. He was like skipping, going away quickly.
But he wasn’t running out of fear.

HANNITY: You could tell the difference?

ZIMMERMAN: He wasn’t running.

HANNITY: So he wasn’t actually running?

ZIMMERMAN: No, sir.

HANNITY: OK. Because that’s what you said to the dispatcher, that you thought he was running.


Zimmerman went on to say he was “going in the same direction” as the teen to watch where he was headed but was not “actually pursuing him.”

The discrepancies could end up being damaging to his defense. Prosecutors charged him with second-degree murder and said his actions led to a fight and ultimately to Martin’s death. He has pleaded not guilty, said the teen attacked him first.

But that wasn’t the only inconsistency in his story on Wednesday. He also shifted what he said happened after coming face to face with the teen.

Zimmerman in the past has told authorities some slightly different versions about the encounter. All seem to involve the teen punching him in the nose, knocking him to the ground and getting on top of him.

But in one version, Zimmerman has said the teen repeatedly punched him in the face while he was flat on his back and then slammed his head into the concrete. In another version, he never mentioned the punches, saying only that the teen got on top of him and immediately started to slam his head onto the ground.

Zimmerman told the first version to investigators just hours after the shooting in an interrogation room in Sanford, Fla. The interview was recorded on video and released to the public in recent weeks.
“He ended up on top of me and he just kept punching my face and my head,” Zimmerman said in the interrogation. “I got a little bit of leverage and I started to sit up, and he took my head and slammed it into the concrete.”

The second version came days later when Zimmerman was taken back to the neighborhood by police investigators to reenact the events of that night. It was also recorded on video (http://core.talkingpointsmemo.com/tv/videos/george-zimmermans-reenactment-of-night-he-shot-trayvon) and recently released.
“He got on top of me somewhere around here and that’s when I started screaming ‘help, help’ as loud as I could. Oh, that’s when he grabbed me — I tried to sit up and that’s when he grabbed me by the head and tried to slam my head down,” Zimmerman said.

Zimmerman returned to his first version of the story on Wednesday night with Hannity. He said the teen punched him “more than a dozen” times while he was on the ground. Here again is the FOX News transcript (http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/hannity/2012/07/18/exclusive-george-zimmerman-breaks-silence-hannity/print):

HANNITY: OK. So after that first hit, what happened next?
ZIMMERMAN: He started bashing my head into the concrete sidewalk. I was — as soon as he broke my nose, I was — I started yelling for help. So, I was disoriented. And he started slamming my head into the concrete.

HANNITY: Which is where the lacerations came from?

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir.

HANNITY: You said it was like your head was going to explode was a comment that you had given to the police.

ZIMMERMAN: Yes, sir. He continued to punch me in the head.

HANNITY: How many times would you estimate that he punched you?

ZIMMERMAN: Several. More than a dozen.

HANNITY: And hitting you hard.

Zimmerman is free on a $1 million bond. His trial is expected to begin next year.

*waits for the spurstalk GZ legal team to counter*

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Look harder

I have an the autopsy report and such do not include a layout of the supposed location, any signs of gunpowder or anything else that I am not an expert on or the like in regards to the shooting.

I did look and found the following.


I would want to review the autopsy report and interview the medical examiner who conducted the autopsy to find out whether he noticed any injuries other than the fatal gunshot. For example, did Martin have any abrasions on his hands and fingers.

I would have a lot of questions for the medical examiner regarding the nature of the gunshot wound and Martin’s clothing.

For example, the weapon was a black Kel Tek 9 mm PF9 semiautomatic. The bullet would have been discharged when Zimmerman pulled the trigger causing the hammer to strike the primer igniting the smokeless powder in the casing producing rapidly expanding gas (consisting of carbon monoxide, nitrogen dioxide, carbon dioxide and other gases) that ejects the bullet, burning and unburned gunpowder (the burn always is incomplete), and trace amounts of the primer that contains heavy metals, including lead, antimony, and bismuth. Depending on the nature of the wound and the presence of all, some, or none of these materials, a qualified forensic firearms expert can determine how far away the gun barrel was when the shot was fired.

The gases, including the heavy metals, and some smoke from unburned but gaseous carbon, are projected only a few inches. The effects of the gas produce what are called contact or near-contact wounds that are characterized by variable skin lacerations or tears from the expanding gases that rip the skin apart and stippling, which is blackening skin from the unburned smokeless gunpowder that is propelled out the barrel of the gun with the bullet by the rapidly expanding gas.

As the distance of the gun barrel to the skin increases, the effect of the gas diminishes and only the unburned powder and bullet are capable of penetrating the skin. Stippling is present when the gun barrel is 0.5 centimeter to 1 meter from the wound. The pattern gets larger as the distance increases. So-called distant wounds do not cause tearing or stippling.

Based on Zimmerman’s statement, I would expect Martin to have had a contact or near contact wound with skin laceration or tearing caused by the explosive gases entering the wound expanding and tearing the skin. I also would expect to see some stippling or unburned smokeless powder. If I did not see evidence of either in the wound or clothing fibers, I would conclude that the gun barrel was more than a meter away, which is at odds with Zimmerman’s statement in which he claimed that he shot Martin as Martin was on top and hitting him.

Given Zimmerman’s statement, I also would expect to see high velocity blood spatter (mist-like spray of blood drops about 1 mm in diameter) or blowback on the barrel of Zimmerman’s gun, his shooting hand, and the sleeve of his jacket.

Absence of skin tearing, stippling, and high velocity blowback or blood spatter would seriously undermine a claim of self-defense.

http://www.examiner.com/article/autopsy-report-reveals-trayvon-martin-was-shot-at-intermediate-range



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Autopsy report reveals Trayvon Martin was shot at ‘intermediate range’

Trayvon Martin Shooting
May 18, 2012
By: Isabelle Zehnder

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George Zimmerman's attorney Mark O'MaraGeorge Zimmerman's brother, Robert Zimmerman, in exclusive interview with CNN's Piers MorganTrayvon Martin, 17, shot and killed by George Zimmerman on Feb. 26, 20125 photosView the full slideshow »
George Zimmerman - blood on the back of Zimmerman's head following his scuffle with teen Trayvon Martin who he shot and killed Feb. 2012
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Trayvon Martin Shooting
George Zimmerman
Trayvon Martin
autopsy report
Jane Velez-Mitchell
Isabelle Zehnder

An autopsy report released to the public Wednesday shows Trayvon Martin, the Florida teen who was shot and killed by neighborhood watch volunteer George Zimmerman, was shot at "intermediate range."

The report shows Trayvon's gunshot wound is consistent with a wound of entrance at intermediate range, which many believe conflicts with Zimmerman's account of what happened the night of the shooting.
View slideshow: Autopsy report reveals Trayvon Martin was shot at ‘intermediate range’

HLN’s Jane Velez-Mitchell invited experts, including a forensic consultant, to weigh in Thursday on what ‘intermediate range’ means and found their answers varied greatly from three inches, to 12 inches, to 18 inches, to three feet.

The consensus, Velez-Mitchell said, is Trayvon Martin was shot anywhere from a few inches to three feet away from George Zimmerman.
Trayvon Martin, 17, shot and killed by George Zimmerman in Florida - family shares photos
Trayvon Martin, 17, shot and killed by George Zimmerman in Florida - family shares photos
Photo credit:
Family provided photo

George Zimmerman reportedly told police that Trayvon was the aggressor, and that Trayvon punched him, knocked him down, and beat his head into the ground causing him to shoot and kill Trayvon Martin in self-defense.

Velez-Mitchell posed the question: If Trayvon was on top of Zimmerman, how could the gun fire be several inches away, let alone several feet away?

Forensic consultant Mike Knox explained that when a pistol is fired there will be some type of gunshot residue. He said there would be particles of partially burned and unburned powder as well as soot from the combustion that comes from the firearm.

Knox said the residue is deposited around the wound. Based on the gunshot residue, the pathologist is able to tell that the gun was not in contact with the skin. At intermediate range, the gun would be fired at least several inches away and would be close enough to deposit the soot, the stippling, and the gun shot particle.

Read autopsy report showing "intermediate range"

Velez-Mitchell asked Knox how far away could the shot have been fired and still be considered “intermediate range.” Knox said that with most firearms, such as the 9mm Zimmerman used to kill Trayvon, about three feet would be the maximum distance. Knox said gunshot residue would not be present on the body if the gun was shot a distance of more than three feet away.

Knox confirmed distant-range means there is no presence of any type of gunshot residue, meaning the gun would have been shot from a distance greater than three feet, and close-range means the gun was touching the victim's body.

The information provided by Knox conflicts somewhat with information on the Forensics-Medicine.info website that reads:

In forensics there are four types of gunshot wound:

Contact wound - the muzzle of the gun was applied to the skin at the time of the shooting;
Close Range - the muzzle of the gun was six to eight inches away from the skin at the time of the shooting;
Intermediate Range - the gun was eight inches to 3.5 feet away; and
Distant Range - the gun was over 3.4 feet away at the time of the shooting.

The “Forensic Investigation Handbook: An Introduction to the Collection, Preservation, Analysis, and Presentation of Evidence” by Michael Fitting Karagiozis and Richard Sqaglio states on p. 139:

Intermediate range (6-8 inches to 1.5-3.5 feet): This is too far for soot to travel so there is no fouling, but hot fragments of burning propellant (gunpowder) follow the bullet to the victim and produce stippling by causing pinpoint burns around the entrance wound. Of the two types of propellant, “ball” and “flake,” the former will produce stippling at a greater distance.

The handbook states close range is between six to eight inches, and that the entrance wound is surrounded by fouling, which is soot that travels for a short distance from the gun barrel to be deposited on the skin. There may also be stippling.

According to the autopsy report, the entrance wound was on Trayvon’s left chest. The wound passed from the front to back entering the heart and lung. There was no exit wound. Three fragments of projectile were recovered. The lead core was recovered behind the right ventricle, and two fragments were recovered behind the right lower lobe of his lung.

Trayvon was shot and killed the night of Feb. 26, and was initially classified an “Unidentified #3,” because police did not find fingerprint information on Trayvon in the fingerprint database. Photographs were taken at the scene, and Trayvon’s body was placed in a blue transport pouch. The coroner received positive identification on Feb. 28 just after noon. The identification was made by Trayvon’s father from crime scene photos.

The Death Certificate Worksheet indicates the cause of death was a gunshot wound to the chest. The manner of death was homicide, and the incident occurred when Trayvon was shot by another person.

I also noticed that you completely disregard that the kid could not have been begging for his life with high velocity shrapnel in his heart and lung. Nor do I think you have seen someone that has been severely beaten.

Get a watermelon take it out to the curb and drop it from about the level of your head. Look at the skin. Now take the same watermelon down on your knees and start pounding it into the pavement a couple of times. Now take a look at it.

Zimmerman's account is a fucking joke. As much as you lie I figure you could spot it easy.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

http://www.mizozo.com/images/item_images/35000/34974_gallery.jpg

That's a picture of a Mexican that has been beaten.

https://encrypted-tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR7Fe7rTflYnX-II-4NbTBprrP20t7ZQQx1i1hgxJAsidLMTaZV

That is not.

[DarrinS]

I also noticed that you completely disregard that the kid could not have been begging for his life with high velocity shrapnel in his heart and lung. Nor do I think you have seen someone that has been severely beaten.

Get a watermelon take it out to the curb and drop it from about the level of your head. Look at the skin. Now take the same watermelon down on your knees and start pounding it into the pavement a couple of times. Now take a look at it.

Zimmerman's account is a fucking joke. As much as you lie I figure you could spot it easy.


Lol @ a watermelon as surrogate for a human head. :lmao

[DarrinS]

Mosquito bite

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-4.jpg

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-head-shot.jpg

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Mosquito bite

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-4.jpg

How many stitches were required? Oh yeah none. Even minor wounds bleed like hell if they are on the head. If it was severe it would have been a cascade of blood

This is a head wound:

http://www.jibberjobber.com/blog/wp-content/william_laceration.png

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Lol @ a watermelon as surrogate for a human head. :lmao

Its just to give a notion of the relative forces involved. Those wounds are not consistent with getting your head beaten into the pavement a dozen times. It didn't require a single stitch.

[Trill Clinton]

Mosquito bite

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-4.jpg

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-head-shot.jpg

FOH with them baby scratches. shit didn't even require stitches. his mommy n daddy probably put some rubbing alcohol and covered it with a bandaid.

[DarrinS]

Its just to give a notion of the relative forces involved. Those wounds are not consistent with getting your head beaten into the pavement a dozen times. It didn't require a single stitch.


I once hit the back of my on pavement (from a standing position) and was knocked unconscious. I had no cuts and required no stitches.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I once hit the back of my on pavement (from a standing position) and was knocked unconscious. I had no cuts and required no stitches.

That's more whiplash than impulse contact.

Have you ever had someone grab your head and slam it into a curb a dozen times like Zimmerman claims was done to him?

[Trill Clinton]

That's more whiplash than impulse contact.

Have you ever had someone grab your head and slam it into a curb a dozen times like Zimmerman claims was done to him?

yea either Tray and Zimmerman were play fighting or Tray was really really really really reaalllllllly weak.

How can you punch someone more than a dozen times, bash their head into concrete multiple times, to the point that it feels like your head is about to burst and only have 2 minor scratches that didn't require medical attention? something isn't right with that picture:wakeup

[clambake]

I once hit the back of my on pavement (from a standing position) and was knocked unconscious. I had no cuts and required no stitches.

bullshit. birther supporting another liar. lol

[Blake]

George should have checked the back of his head before shooting.

[Stringer_Bell]

If zimmerman walks, they need to free OJ. He was just trying to get his shit back.

Fuckin' true that. The whole thing was a set-up on OJ, too much shady shit went down that day...a little too convenient given how he got caught up in that shit in the first place.

As for Zimmerman, that cracker lied his ass off on Hannity. I thought he was telling the truth this whole time, but his lawyer better not put that soft cracker ass on the stand unless he wants to get roasted during cross-x. The defense is better off keeping Zimmerman far away from the stand and not trying to make it look like an emotional decision he made to start watching the neighborhood cuz his wife watched some other bitch get robbed. Ughhhhhh.

I change my vote to manslaughter, fo' sho.

[Trill Clinton]

Fuckin' true that. The whole thing was a set-up on OJ, too much shady shit went down that day...a little too convenient given how he got caught up in that shit in the first place.

As for Zimmerman, that cracker lied his ass off on Hannity. I thought he was telling the truth this whole time, but his lawyer better not put that soft cracker ass on the stand unless he wants to get roasted during cross-x. The defense is better off keeping Zimmerman far away from the stand and not trying to make it look like an emotional decision he made to start watching the neighborhood cuz his wife watched some other bitch get robbed. Ughhhhhh.

I change my vote to manslaughter, fo' sho.

:lol

[Creepn]

Fuckin' true that. The whole thing was a set-up on OJ, too much shady shit went down that day...a little too convenient given how he got caught up in that shit in the first place.

As for Zimmerman, that cracker lied his ass off on Hannity. I thought he was telling the truth this whole time, but his lawyer better not put that soft cracker ass on the stand unless he wants to get roasted during cross-x. The defense is better off keeping Zimmerman far away from the stand and not trying to make it look like an emotional decision he made to start watching the neighborhood cuz his wife watched some other bitch get robbed. Ughhhhhh.

I change my vote to manslaughter, fo' sho.

Lol dont condone the use of the word "cracker" but Stringer is back! Damn you've been making me sad lately. Welcome back :toast

[Creepn]

Mosquito bite

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-4.jpg

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-head-shot.jpg

Look at his collar, it says "free country". Lmao ironic as a muthafucka.

[Capt Bringdown]

Look at his collar, it says "free country". Lmao ironic as a muthafucka.

I think it will come out that GZ's wounds are self-inflicted.

[DarrinS]

I think it will come out that GZ's wounds are self-inflicted.

Sarcasm?

[boutons_deux]

Mosquito bite

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-4.jpg

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/zimmerman-head-shot.jpg

yep, with damage like that, I'd fear for my life too, and blast away.

[clambake]

didn't realize just how minor they were.

thanks for the pictures.

[clambake]

Look at his collar, it says "free country". Lmao ironic as a muthafucka.

can't blame him for that.

mommy buys his clothes.

[bobbyjoe]

He's a poor judge of distances? He didn't have a tape measure available to measure the distance and was just estimating? It's clear to everyone he was at least as far away from his truck as the vicinity where Martin was shot -- unless, of course, he was claiming he didn't shoot him.


I don't recall hearing him say he didn't mean to tell the dispatcher that he was following Trayvon but that he was merely walking in the same direction. I do recall him saying he got out of his truck, while on the phone with police, (apparently his seat belt unbuckling and door opening can be heard on the recording), in order to see if he could maintain sight of Martin so he could tell police where he went. That could be construed as following but, not pursuing as has been suggested. He then said when the dispatcher said he didn't need to do that (when he answered yes to the question of "Are you following him?"), he continued across the complex to his street to get an address off the house on the other side.


It was pretty clear, to me anyway, Zimmerman was struggling to come up with a word, instead of "run," because, while Martin didn't walk away, he wasn't in a flat out run either. "Skip" is what his brain produced. What word would you use to describe a person moving faster than a walk but not sprinting? After thinking a few seconds, I came up with "trot" or "lope." But, it is a condition a person on the phone with police (and you may not be aware I have an extensive background in this area) might 1) struggle with describing on the phone and 2) just use one of the two most common words associated with people moving on their feet...walking or running. He chose run because Martin wasn't walking. In the interview last night, it was clear he was trying to arrive at a descriptor that indicated Martin was doing more than walking but wasn't running. Sue him.


Because he was suspicious (leisurely walking in rain, going between houses, appeared intoxicated, etc...), in a neighborhood experiencing a rash of property crimes which, apparently, weren't being solved by police at the rate Zimmerman thought they should. The "Fucking Punks" always get away is an appropriate response by someone frustrated by the lack of criminal arrests in a neighborhood plagued by crime when he is on the phone with police and the "fucking punk" takes off and he loses sight of them.


I took it to mean Martin wasn't dressed as if he were training for some athletic event. Long distance runners and bicyclers are known to train in the rain.

I'm still wondering how Martin ended up at the scene of the shooting when there is a full two minutes from the time Zimmerman said he ran until the end of Zimmerman's call with police ended. What was Martin doing for those two minutes?

- The location of the shooting is problematic for Zimmerman's defense. It's not an issue because of the distance from his truck, but the 50-60 feet the shooting was from the T intersection where Zimmerman claims it started. How did the shooting end up being that far from where Z alleges it started? Either it started at the T intersection and Zimmerman chased down Trayvon who was trying to get away in which case it certainly looks like a murder. OR it truly didn't start at the T intersection, in which case Zimmerman's claim he was on his way back to the car is an outright lie. If you watch Zimmerman's reenactment, he is uncomfortabe when trying to explain this. He points out a spot to the police officers which isn't even close to where the shot took place. It's as though he was trying to think of a rational explanation as to how the shooting occurred 60 feet away from the T intersection, but simply couldn't.

- Zimmerman was EMPHATIC on the 911 call that Trayvon was running. His exact words were "Shit, he's running. Shit, he ran". So for him to come on Hannity and claim he wasn't truly running is a pretty big deal. My guess is that his legal team has realized that it just doesn't pass the smell test that Trayvon's initial reaction from Zimmerman's pursuit/following of him both at the Clubhouse and at the cut through was to run away from him, but that seconds later he did a complete 180 mentally and decided "You know what, I know my instinct just 10 seconds ago was to run away from this weirdo, but now let me turn right around and find him and kick his ass". It's not credible.

- Zimmerman denied to the Sanford PD that he ever was following Trayvon Martin. He told the Sanford PD he got out of the car at the behest of the police dispatcher, which was an absolute lie. When he gave his initial statement, it probably didn't register to him that the 911 call was recorded and he thought he could get away with never telling the cops he was following TM. When he was asked why he lied about this in the "Serino interview #3" of the prosecution's evidence, he didn't have an explanation.

- Despite me disagreeing with most of you said, you do make an excellent point that when you look at the map of the neighborhood, TM could easily have made it home if he had kept running home. However, it doesn't seem like you realize that Trayvon's GF gave a statement that Trayvon stopped running once he turned onto Twin Trees Lane at the T intersection as he thought he had lost Zimmerman. And this is consistent with Zimmerman noting his reason for believing TM was suspicious was that he was acting too leisurely (likely more engaged in his phone conversation with his girl than the rain) for his liking.

- Also, the exact same logic you apply for Travyon applies to Zimmerman. When you line up Zimmerman's 911 call with his police statements and reenactment, if he truly was walking back to his car after walking from the cut through to Retreat View Circle to allegedly look for a street number, he absolutely would have made it back and there never would have been a fight. I'm sure the prosecution is to prove this clearly in the trial to harm his claims. He's just not being honest about stopping his pursuit of TM because he knows it invalidates his self-defense claim.

- Speaking of Zimmerman's claim that he got out of the car to look for a street number, the hilarious thing about it is that in the reenactment there are clearly 100% visitble street numbers on the townhouses BEFORE the T-intersection! So if Zimmerman's intent when he got out of the car was truly to get a street number for the 911 dispatcher, he simply would have written it down and went back to his car and never even wound up at the T intersection. And as a neighborhood watchman who lived in his neighborhood for 7 years and routinely conducted patrols (enough to result in FIFTY 911 calls over a 4 year stretch) it is just not credible that he didn't know where to look for a street number.


- Anyone who watched that interview saw what a liar Zimmerman was. Hannity asks him 2 very clear questions... "Do you regret getting out of your car that night"... "Do you regret carrying a gun". Zimmerman clearly answers "No regrets, sir" to each question. Later, no doubt after some nudging from his attorney that the whole point of this interview was to win him brownie points with potential jurors and that saying you had "no regrets" about getting out of your car after it resulted in the death of a 17 year old wasn't going to do it, he comes back to Hannity and says "I was confused, I thought you meant did I have regrets about not getting legal representation from the getgo and not agreeing to the voice stress test, giving statements on my own, etc". What an utter lie. Hannity's question in no way could be misconstrued for asking whether the regrets were about anything pertaining to the legal process. They were unequivocally and unmistakeably about his CHOICES that night. The whole interview just showed what an absolute liar Zimmerman is. But then i guess the perjury had already proven that...

[bobbyjoe]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JO5zzZZxnHw

Who thinks Zimmerman's voice samples sound similar to the voices on the 911 call?

[Yonivore]

- The location of the shooting is problematic for Zimmerman's defense. It's not an issue because of the distance from his truck, but the 50-60 feet the shooting was from the T intersection where Zimmerman claims it started. How did the shooting end up being that far from where Z alleges it started? Either it started at the T intersection and Zimmerman chased down Trayvon who was trying to get away in which case it certainly looks like a murder. OR it truly didn't start at the T intersection, in which case Zimmerman's claim he was on his way back to the car is an outright lie. If you watch Zimmerman's reenactment, he is uncomfortabe when trying to explain this. He points out a spot to the police officers which isn't even close to where the shot took place. It's as though he was trying to think of a rational explanation as to how the shooting occurred 60 feet away from the T intersection, but simply couldn't.
You've obviously never watched two people struggle. Also, Martin got up and moved some distance before collapsing and dying -- probably towards home and away from the T-intersection where it started.


- Zimmerman was EMPHATIC on the 911 call that Trayvon was running. His exact words were "Shit, he's running. Shit, he ran". So for him to come on Hannity and claim he wasn't truly running is a pretty big deal. My guess is that his legal team has realized that it just doesn't pass the smell test that Trayvon's initial reaction from Zimmerman's pursuit/following of him both at the Clubhouse and at the cut through was to run away from him, but that seconds later he did a complete 180 mentally and decided "You know what, I know my instinct just 10 seconds ago was to run away from this weirdo, but now let me turn right around and find him and kick his ass". It's not credible.
Not so much but, if Martin ran -- instead of "skipped," he would have been further away from the scene of the shooting that he ended up being -- unless, he came back.


- Zimmerman denied to the Sanford PD that he ever was following Trayvon Martin. He told the Sanford PD he got out of the car at the behest of the police dispatcher, which was an absolute lie. When he gave his initial statement, it probably didn't register to him that the 911 call was recorded and he thought he could get away with never telling the cops he was following TM. When he was asked why he lied about this in the "Serino interview #3" of the prosecution's evidence, he didn't have an explanation.
The way he explained it in the Hannity interview is credible. I think, when Martin took off running or skipping or whatever, Zimmerman unbuckled his seat belt and opened the door with the intent of trying to keep Martin in sight. When asked if he was following, he said "yes," as in he was following the direction Martin went to see if he could spot him. Whey the police said he didn't need to do that, he continued the phone conversation and walked to the other street and was headed back. It all fits.


- Despite me disagreeing with most of you said, you do make an excellent point that when you look at the map of the neighborhood, TM could easily have made it home if he had kept running home. However, it doesn't seem like you realize that Trayvon's GF gave a statement that Trayvon stopped running once he turned onto Twin Trees Lane at the T intersection as he thought he had lost Zimmerman. And this is consistent with Zimmerman noting his reason for believing TM was suspicious was that he was acting too leisurely (likely more engaged in his phone conversation with his girl than the rain) for his liking.
Still doesn't explain why he would hang out visiting with his GF for two minutes while Zimmerman walked around on the phone -- probably within HIS sight at some time.


- Also, the exact same logic you apply for Travyon applies to Zimmerman. When you line up Zimmerman's 911 call with his police statements and reenactment, if he truly was walking back to his car after walking from the cut through to Retreat View Circle to allegedly look for a street number, he absolutely would have made it back and there never would have been a fight. I'm sure the prosecution is to prove this clearly in the trial to harm his claims. He's just not being honest about stopping his pursuit of TM because he knows it invalidates his self-defense claim.
We just disagree. There's nothing to indicate he was back at his vehicle when the call terminated.


- Speaking of Zimmerman's claim that he got out of the car to look for a street number, the hilarious thing about it is that in the reenactment there are clearly 100% visitble street numbers on the townhouses BEFORE the T-intersection! So if Zimmerman's intent when he got out of the car was truly to get a street number for the 911 dispatcher, he simply would have written it down and went back to his car and never even wound up at the T intersection. And as a neighborhood watchman who lived in his neighborhood for 7 years and routinely conducted patrols (enough to result in FIFTY 911 calls over a 4 year stretch) it is just not credible that he didn't know where to look for a street number.
I think he was already out of the vehicle and nearing the t-intersection before the whole "are-you-following-yes-i-am-you-don't-need-to-do-that-ok" exchange had time to evolve. We're not talking about great distances here. And, as Zimmerman indicated, he lived on the opposite street and, when asked for his address, didn't want to give it because it was dark and he didn't know if Martin was around and listening so, he continued on to Retreat View Circle to get the address of the first house on the street where he lived.


- Anyone who watched that interview saw what a liar Zimmerman was. Hannity asks him 2 very clear questions... "Do you regret getting out of your car that night"... "Do you regret carrying a gun". Zimmerman clearly answers "No regrets, sir" to each question. Later, no doubt after some nudging from his attorney that the whole point of this interview was to win him brownie points with potential jurors and that saying you had "no regrets" about getting out of your car after it resulted in the death of a 17 year old wasn't going to do it, he comes back to Hannity and says "I was confused, I thought you meant did I have regrets about not getting legal representation from the getgo and not agreeing to the voice stress test, giving statements on my own, etc". What an utter lie. Hannity's question in no way could be misconstrued for asking whether the regrets were about anything pertaining to the legal process. They were unequivocally and unmistakeably about his CHOICES that night. The whole interview just showed what an absolute liar Zimmerman is. But then i guess the perjury had already proven that...
Yep, I think the attorney told him it sounded bad and he back-pedaled.

But, I also think he stated he had no regrets because, well, people have been threatening to kill him for the better part of three months now and, he's convinced himself that if he even plants the smallest amount of doubt that he would have done something differently -- the hounds will start barking again.

[Yonivore]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JO5zzZZxnHw

Who thinks Zimmerman's voice samples sound similar to the voices on the 911 call?
Who's ever thought they were about to lose their life and screamed like a girl for help?

[Trill Clinton]

Yoni, stop reaching. bobbyjoe posted facts which trump your hypotheticals.

[clambake]

clearly, he doesn't regret lying. lol

[Fabbs]

Can we agree that during the trial there is going to be some facts come out that will shed light on the sitch -either way-?

I don't mean all the biased b.s. that will come from both sides, i mean some facts that we currently do not know will surface.

Ala O.J. criminal and then civil.

[clambake]

the one thing we can all agree on is that george is a liar.

confirmed

undeniable

[Creepn]

the one thing we can all agree on is that george is a liar.

confirmed

undeniable

I don't even think they agree with you on that. None of his suppporters here alluded to that fact.The closest I read was wild cobra saying that it was human nature to lie and that we all lie but it was nothing specific towards him.

[Trill Clinton]

Can we agree that during the trial there is going to be some facts come out that will shed light on the sitch -either way-?

I don't mean all the biased b.s. that will come from both sides, i mean some facts that we currently do not know will surface.

Ala O.J. criminal and then civil.

I agree there will be more facts that dig zimmermans grave even deeper. all the facts so far point to Trayvon forced to fight for his life.

it aint easy being a black in Amerikkka. we're seen as a threat while maniac caucasian mass murderers get to walk around without any batting an eye.

[Fabbs]

I agree there will be more facts that dig zimmermans grave even deeper. all the facts so far point to Trayvon forced to fight for his life.

it aint easy being a black in Amerikkka. we're seen as a threat while maniac caucasian mass murderers get to walk around without any batting an eye.
What was your stance before during and after the OJ criminal trial?
Vs the civil trial.

Or were you alive then?

[Trill Clinton]

What was your stance before during and after the OJ criminal trial?
Vs the civil trial.

Or were you alive then?

I was alive but only a kid so I didn't understand all of the specifics.

looking back on it now as an adult its plain to see OJ did that shit and the only way he got off is because of his celebrity status. the civil trial is the courts way of saying "we know this motherfucker is guilty but we can't prove it, here goes some money for your troubles"

[bobbyjoe]

You've obviously never watched two people struggle. Also, Martin got up and moved some distance before collapsing and dying -- probably towards home and away from the T-intersection where it started.


Not so much but, if Martin ran -- instead of "skipped," he would have been further away from the scene of the shooting that he ended up being -- unless, he came back.


The way he explained it in the Hannity interview is credible. I think, when Martin took off running or skipping or whatever, Zimmerman unbuckled his seat belt and opened the door with the intent of trying to keep Martin in sight. When asked if he was following, he said "yes," as in he was following the direction Martin went to see if he could spot him. Whey the police said he didn't need to do that, he continued the phone conversation and walked to the other street and was headed back. It all fits.


Still doesn't explain why he would hang out visiting with his GF for two minutes while Zimmerman walked around on the phone -- probably within HIS sight at some time.


We just disagree. There's nothing to indicate he was back at his vehicle when the call terminated.


I think he was already out of the vehicle and nearing the t-intersection before the whole "are-you-following-yes-i-am-you-don't-need-to-do-that-ok" exchange had time to evolve. We're not talking about great distances here. And, as Zimmerman indicated, he lived on the opposite street and, when asked for his address, didn't want to give it because it was dark and he didn't know if Martin was around and listening so, he continued on to Retreat View Circle to get the address of the first house on the street where he lived.


Yep, I think the attorney told him it sounded bad and he back-pedaled.

But, I also think he stated he had no regrets because, well, people have been threatening to kill him for the better part of three months now and, he's convinced himself that if he even plants the smallest amount of doubt that he would have done something differently -- the hounds will start barking again.

If you think Zimmerman was still on the phone with the Non-Emergency Dispatcher when he allegedly was walking to the street he lived (Retreat View Circle) to get a street number, can you please explain why he did not give that street number to the dispatcher?!

Better yet...If Zimmerman's true intent was to find a street number on Retreat View Circle to feed the cops, why would he ever need to walk back to his truck?! Why wouldn't he have just stayed there and met the cops there? After all, he and the dispatcher were arranging a location where he could meet the police.

When you look at the map of that neighborhood, it's an outright lie that Zimmerman needed to walk to Retreat View Circle to get an address. His truck was parked near the cut-through and that cut-through abuts the FRONT of the Townhouses on Twin Trees lane. Hell, he could have seen the street number from his truck!!!! Who walks to the back of a townhouse to get an address instead of going to the front of the townhouse?

[Yonivore]

If you think Zimmerman was still on the phone with the Non-Emergency Dispatcher when he allegedly was walking to the street he lived (Retreat View Circle) to get a street number, can you please explain why he did not give that street number to the dispatcher?!

Better yet...If Zimmerman's true intent was to find a street number on Retreat View Circle to feed the cops, why would he ever need to walk back to his truck?! Why wouldn't he have just stayed there and met the cops there? After all, he and the dispatcher were arranging a location where he could meet the police.
Who knows? Have you read the transcript or listened to the call? It was 4:07 minutes. Perhaps Zimmerman was sticking around the area of the T-Intersection hoping to catch a glimpse of Martin so he could direct police to his location.

That still doesn't explain why Martin was anywhere near the T-Intersection at the end of Zimmerman's phone call.


When you look at the map of that neighborhood, it's an outright lie that Zimmerman needed to walk to Retreat View Circle to get an address. His truck was parked near the cut-through and that cut-through abuts the FRONT of the Townhouses on Twin Trees lane. Hell, he could have seen the street number from his truck!!!! Who walks to the back of a townhouse to get an address instead of going to the front of the townhouse?
He couldn't see the Retreat View Circle addresses from Twin Trees Lane. The top of the T went from Twin Trees to Retreat View. The "T's" upright ran between the town homes.

I guess I don't see your point. I think Zimmerman spent the two minutes between Twin Trees and Retreat View, on the top of the "T". The timeline fits... particularly if he was walking slow in hopes of spotting Martin again. What's not explained is why Martin would be anywhere near there after Zimmerman's 4 minute phone call and a full 2 minutes after Zimmerman said he took off.

[Blake]

the one thing we can all agree on is that george is a liar.

confirmed

undeniable


I don't even think they agree with you on that. None of his suppporters here alluded to that fact.The closest I read was wild cobra saying that it was human nature to lie and that we all lie but it was nothing specific towards him.

he lied about income. It hasn't been confirmed that he has lied about details in this case, has he?

Being caught in a lie like that only matters in the court of public opinion.

[bobbyjoe]

Who knows? Have you read the transcript or listened to the call? It was 4:07 minutes. Perhaps Zimmerman was sticking around the area of the T-Intersection hoping to catch a glimpse of Martin so he could direct police to his location.

That still doesn't explain why Martin was anywhere near the T-Intersection at the end of Zimmerman's phone call.


He couldn't see the Retreat View Circle addresses from Twin Trees Lane. The top of the T went from Twin Trees to Retreat View. The "T's" upright ran between the town homes.

I guess I don't see your point. I think Zimmerman spent the two minutes between Twin Trees and Retreat View, on the top of the "T". The timeline fits... particularly if he was walking slow in hopes of spotting Martin again. What's not explained is why Martin would be anywhere near there after Zimmerman's 4 minute phone call and a full 2 minutes after Zimmerman said he took off.

That's the point. It makes absolutely no sense that Zimmerman would want to give them an address on Retreat View instead of an address for one of the townhouses on Twin Trees lane, which was much closer to his car and also was the street Trayvon he had observed Martin walking along.

I did listen to the call and he never mentioned any street number on Retreat View Circle to the dispatcher. If that was his objective, then it's not credible he walked all the way there and didn't mention the street number to the dispatcher, who all the while was asking GZ where he wanted to meet the cops. The dispatcher clearly asked "What address are you parked in front of?" That address would have been Twin Trees lane, not Retreat View Circle.
On the call, the dispatcher and Zimmerman agree for the cops to meet at the mailboxes. He then immediately says "Actually can you have them call me and I'll them where I'm at".

Both that statement and the inexplicable holes in his story are consistent with a guy who wanted to continue his pursuit of a man he referred to even after shooting him as "The suspect".

[bobbyjoe]

he lied about income. It hasn't been confirmed that he has lied about details in this case, has he?

Being caught in a lie like that only matters in the court of public opinion.

It's a criminal offense. It's called perjury.

This is the way our Court system works. If you lie under oath, it doesn't only matter in the court of public opinion. It matters in the Court of Law.

If one would lie to save a few bucks of bail money, why wouldn't they lie to keep their butt out of jail for 25 to 30 years? Zimmerman also failed to turn in his passport. The Judge thought his plan was to get away with other's people money and flee the Country. Not the prosecutor, not the NAACP, not the Black Panthers... The Judge presiding over the case.

Also, there is lots of physical evidence that is inconsistent with Zimmerman's statements. That's called lying.

Self-defense absolutely hinges on credibility. If jurors see you as a liar, you're probably going to get hung, especially when the guy you killed wasn't in the middle of a crime and was simply walking home.

[Fabbs]

Self-defense absolutely hinges on credibility. If jurors see you as a liar, you're probably going to get hung, especially when the guy you killed wasn't in the middle of a crime and was simply walking home.
Are you serious? :lol
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-T9tpB_Ha6qA/ThTdIA4OM8I/AAAAAAAAAlw/WMMIeqxLgIg/s1600/casey-anthony-party-dress.jpg

[Wild Cobra]

it aint easy being a black in Amerikkka. we're seen as a threat while maniac caucasian mass murderers get to walk around without any batting an eye.
Well, by reading some of the insane posts by people here, I can understand why people are so afraid of blacks now.

Really...

Do you think it's just a black thing? If I were to take every situation I have some heartache over and used the excuse "it's because I'm white," I could come up with as many pathetic excuses as black people do.

It's not the color of a persons skin that make people afraid of another. It's how they carry themselves. Their character. Martin Luther King's dream has become real. Too bad too many people don't understand that it's character that matters.

[Wild Cobra]

looking back on it now as an adult its plain to see OJ did that shit and the only way he got off is because of his celebrity status. the civil trial is the courts way of saying "we know this motherfucker is guilty but we can't prove it, here goes some money for your troubles"
No.

OJ probably was innocent. Too much of the evidence was tampered with to make a case. Someone tried to frame him. If he really was guilty, they fucked up in trying to make the case better.

[boutons_deux]

Murderer Z fits the profile of other stand your ground shooters

Stand Your Ground law used often by those with previous arrests

A Tampa Bay Times analysis of “stand your ground” cases found that it has been people like Moorer — those with records of crime and violence — who have benefited the most from the controversial legislation. A review of arrest records for those involved in more than 100 fatal “stand your ground” cases shows:

•  Nearly 60 percent of those who claimed self-defense had been arrested at least once before the day they killed someone.

 More than 30 of those defendants, about 1 in 3, had been accused of violent crimes, including assault, battery or robbery. Dozens had drug offenses on their records.

•  Killers have invoked “stand your ground” even after repeated run-ins with the law. Forty percent had three arrests or more. Dozens had at least four arrests.

• More than a third of the defendants had previously been in trouble for threatening someone with a gun or illegally carrying a weapon.

•  In dozens of cases, both the defendant and the victim had criminal records, sometimes related to long-running feuds or criminal enterprises. Of the victims that could be identified in state records, 64 percent had at least one arrest. Several had 20 or more arrests.

http://m.miamiherald.com/mh/db_42928/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=Icp01ld7&full=true#display

[boutons_deux]

The NRA is total fraud, just like the entire financcial sector and BigPharma.

It's All About The Benjamins (flowing from guns/ammo mfrs to NRA).

NRA is nothing but guns industry lobbying shop. Has NOTHING to do with 2nd amendment.

And there's no doubt 6000 US gun dealers along the MX border are there because that's where the hunters are. :lol


5 Issues That Divide Gun Owners and the NRA Leadership


Wayne LaPierre, the Executive Vice President of the National Rifle Association (NRA), is a con man. He has spent decades enriching himself, his fellow NRA executives and the organization’s board members by doing what he does best: shamelessly mainstreaming conspiracy theories that lead an increasingly paranoid subset of Americans (the percent of households owing guns has declined dramatically over the past generation) to arm themselves to the teeth, while ensuring any laws that might prevent the horrifying tragedy that occurred in Aurora, Colorado Friday morning are unable to make it through Congress.

LaPierre talks of guns confiscation being just around the corner, when he knows no such thing would ever happen in the United States. The irredeemably violent make good customers too, don't you know? So whether the NRA is working to restore gun rights to violent felons, protect the ability of terrorists, drug kingpins and serial-domestic abusers to purchase high-capacity clips at gun shows or fighting for military style weapons to be available to the Jared Loughners, John Patrick Bedells and James Holmes’ of the world, you can bet that whatever comes out of LaPierre's mouth, his only interest is protecting the real clients of today’s NRA: Arms Dealers.

This is made crystal clear by the fact that the NRA’s own membership, many of whom joined only because of an outdated understanding of what the leadership of this organization actually stands for, agree with most Americans that our gun laws should protect our families, and not the financial interests of a clique of craven and self-interested elites.

Here are 5 key issues that divide the LaPierres at the top of the NRA food chain from their 3 million (or 4 million, depending upon the press release that day) members:

1. The Gun Show Loophole

Currently, in over 30 states, one can walk into a local gun show and purchase a weapon from a “private seller,” who does not have to conduct any kind of background check. For example, a .50 caliber sniper rifle, which can take down a helicopter. The NRA has fought to block any and all efforts to pass a federal law closing this infamous gun show loophole, as well as any efforts in the states (but remember, they are anti-crime!).

Timothy McVeigh was once one of these “private sellers” on the gun-show circuit, and everyone from the Columbine killers to members of Hezbollah have obtained firearms this way. Not surprisingly, just like most other sentient beings (including 85% of gun owners not in the NRA), 69% of NRA members, when polled by conservative Republican Frank Luntz, think this loophole should be closed.

2. Terror Gap

If you are put on the U.S. terror watch list you cannot board an airplane. You can, however, still purchase guns and explosives. According to the Government Accountability Office, “From February 2004 through February 2010, 1,228 individuals on the watch list underwent background checks to purchase firearms or explosives; 1,119, or 91 percent, of these transactions were approved."

NRA members understand this even if their leadership stubbornly tries to protect the gun-ownership rights of terrorists (but they’re patriots I tell you!). 82% of NRA members think this gap should be closed.

3. Tiahrt Amendments

Named in honor of all-around clod, the former Kansas Republican Congressman Todd Tiahrt, this is part of the NRA’s constant effort to hamper, harass and harangue any government effort to get to the bottom of how guns came to be used in a crime (but hey, they really, really care about Fast & Furious!). These amendments, attached to federal spending bills, do their best to severely limit the police’s ability to access, use, and share data that helps them enforce federal, state and local gun laws.

Not surprisingly, while these a big hit at NRA HQ and among those members of Congress so graced with their campaign contributions, 69% of their own members have come to the logical conclusion that this is a pretty bad idea, as have 74% of non-NRA gun owners who think there should be no barriers to information sharing between federal agencies and police when it comes to gun crimes.

4. Reporting Lost & Stolen Guns

Supporting provisions requiring this would seem to be only common sense. But there is not much of that present among the NRA’s leadership. For example, the NRA has not only fought all efforts to make reporting lost or stolen guns to the police a requirement, but in Pennsylvania, where scores of cities and townships have picked up the slack by passing these measures themselves, the fine Americans and conservative-lawsuit-abuse haters at the NRA have actually threatened to sue them to overturn these laws. Yes, you read that correctly, our friends iwho love state and local rights when it comes to allowing a kid to stay on their parent's health care policy until they are 26, don't feel so much the same way about guns.

NRA members would seem to disagree, however. 78% of them think this provision would be a good idea, as do 88% of non-NRA gun owners.

5. Sharing Records With The National Instant Background Check System (NICS)

The Fix Gun Checks Act, modeled on ideas developed by Mayors Against Illegal Guns (for whom I consult), was introduced in the wake of the carnage at Tucson by, among others, Senator Chuck Schumer in March of 2011. Besides closing the gun-show loophole (see #1), it also sought to fix a huge problem in the current federal background check system--a lax attitude by many states and some federal institutions in sharing records of those ineligible to buy firearms due to criminal record or mental health defects. For example, the mass murderer at Virginia Tech, Seung-Hui Cho, had been declared mentally unfit by a judge in Virginia, and Jared Loughner had been rejected by the military for admitted drug use. Both of these men never should have been able to get anywhere near buying a gun legally. But these records were never shared.

The Fix Gun Checks Act would provide both incentives and penalties to states so that all these records are shared in as timely a manner as possible. But the NRA leadership has gone to war with this bill, as they have all other efforts to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and the mentally unfit. Yet, a poll of swing state voters taken around the time the bill was introduced, showed overwhelming support for this concept among gun owners. In Indiana, Ohio, Virginia, Arizona and (most ironically, and sadly) Colorado, more than 82% of gun owners believed states should be fully funded in their efforts to share these records, while 91% supported requiring federal agencies to share information on potentially dangerous persons such as Loughner.


http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/156416

[Trill Clinton]

Well, by reading some of the insane posts by people here, I can understand why people are so afraid of blacks now.

Really...

Do you think it's just a black thing? If I were to take every situation I have some heartache over and used the excuse "it's because I'm white," I could come up with as many pathetic excuses as black people do.

It's not the color of a persons skin that make people afraid of another. It's how they carry themselves. Their character. Martin Luther King's dream has become real. Too bad too many people don't understand that it's character that matters.

Yes this case has racism written all over it. stop quoting MLK, you're a racist and a bigot and your opinion is invalid at this juncture.

[clambake]

he lied about income. It hasn't been confirmed that he has lied about details in this case, has he?

Being caught in a lie like that only matters in the court of public opinion.

smh

[Blake]

smh

we get that you want to convict him for murder because he lied to avoid paying extra bond money.

Luckily the system is better than you.

[clambake]

luckily you're not part of the system that recognizes the difference between justice and public opinion. lol

[Creepn]

Well, by reading some of the insane posts by people here, I can understand why people are so afraid of blacks now.

Really...

Do you think it's just a black thing? If I were to take every situation I have some heartache over and used the excuse "it's because I'm white," I could come up with as many pathetic excuses as black people do.

It's not the color of a persons skin that make people afraid of another. It's how they carry themselves. Their character. Martin Luther King's dream has become real. Too bad too many people don't understand that it's character that matters.

Oh stop that bullshit! Lmao! You obviously made it clear that you don't judge blacks by their character. You pre-judge black people based on the flawed statistics that you eat everyday for breakfast.

[clambake]

i just heard that perjury is under the jurisdiction of public opinion. lol

[Blake]

luckily you're not part of the system that recognizes the difference between justice and public opinion. lol

What system is that?

[clambake]

What system is that?

the system where the judge knows what perjury is. lol

[clambake]

perjury is not a detail in this case. lol

[Blake]

the system where the judge knows what perjury is. lol

The judge knows that perjury during bond hearings is not evidence to murder no matter how much you keep trying to claim that it is. lol.

[clambake]

The judge knows that perjury during bond hearings is not evidence to murder no matter how much you keep trying to claim that it is. lol.

thats nothing. i heard its not even detail worthy. lol

[clambake]

just cuz he lies doesn't mean he's a liar. lol

[Blake]

just cuz he lies doesn't mean he's a liar. lol

Just cuz he lied about income and a second passport doesn't mean he lied about defending himself that night.

Not sure if that's ever going to sink in at this point. smh.

[clambake]

his credibility should be inadmissible. lol

[Creepn]

Just cuz he lied about income and a second passport doesn't mean he lied about defending himself that night.

Not sure if that's ever going to sink in at this point. smh.

I don't see how you cannot connect the two. Shows he's willing to manipulate the judge then he will lie and manipulate the jurors. He already has multiple versions of the story and he backed tracked several times already. Why? He's trying to manipulate.

[clambake]

I don't see how you cannot connect the two. Shows he's willing to manipulate the judge then he will lie and manipulate the jurors. He already has multiple versions of the story and he backed tracked several times already. Why? He's trying to manipulate.

his credibility is not even detail worthy. lol

[Blake]

his credibility should be inadmissible. lol

The results of the revocation hearing probably will be. Smh.

[Blake]

I don't see how you cannot connect the two. Shows he's willing to manipulate the judge then he will lie and manipulate the jurors. He already has multiple versions of the story and he backed tracked several times already. Why? He's trying to manipulate.

if it's a judge trial with the same judge, he'll remember the lying but other than that, it's two totally separate incidents.

Lying about issue A does not mean he was lying about issue B no matter how hard you try to connect them.

[Creepn]

if it's a judge trial with the same judge, he'll remember the lying but other than that, it's two totally separate incidents.

Lying about issue A does not mean he was lying about issue B no matter how hard you try to connect them.

Well aren't you a nice guy lol. Forgive and forget every time someone lies to you huh?

Ok so in the interview he said Martin was "skipping" but in the 911 call he clearly said "he's running". What do you call that?

[Trill Clinton]

guise, zimmerman only raised 2k after his fox interview. he is going broke and needs our help. please find it in your heart to donate what you can.

[Trill Clinton]

Well aren't you a nice guy lol. Forgive and forget every time someone lies to you huh?

Ok so in the interview he said Martin was "skipping" but in the 911 call he clearly said "he's running". What do you call that?

well that's easy. he obviously had a blonde moment and couldn't remember the word "running" and the first thing that came to mind was "skipping".

[Creepn]

guise, zimmerman only raised 2k after his fox interview. he is going broke and needs our help. please find it in your heart to donate what you can.

I will. I would do the same and stalk a teen home and shoot him after starting up shit.

[cantthinkofanything]

well that's easy. he obviously had a blonde moment and couldn't remember the word "running" and the first thing that came to mind was "skipping".

and experiment if you will...

close your eyes. You're in a very large room, at least 1000 yards in length. About 200 yards across. Covered in artificial turf. Two guys enter in through a door on one end. Both are white. One is running and one is skipping. You have a gun with one bullet. You've been told that one of them just shot a black person. You must kill the white person that killed the black person. You take your shot. Which one did you shoot at?

Open your eyes. Your testicles are covered with leeches.

[Trill Clinton]

I will. I would do the same and stalk a teen home and shoot him after starting up shit.

thank you. make sure you pin him face down after you shoot him. and if the police ask, tell them "after I shot him, he looked at me and said...you..you got me. you got it":lol

[Creepn]

and experiment if you will...

close your eyes. You're in a very large room, at least 1000 yards in length. About 200 yards across. Covered in artificial turf. Two guys enter in through a door on one end. Both are white. One is running and one is skipping. You have a gun with one bullet. You've been told that one of them just shot a black person. You must kill the white person that killed the black person. You take your shot. Which one did you shoot at?

Open your eyes. Your testicles are covered with leeches.

I don't think Trill can read with his eyes closed...

[Trill Clinton]

and experiment if you will...

close your eyes. You're in a very large room, at least 1000 yards in length. About 200 yards across. Covered in artificial turf. Two guys enter in through a door on one end. Both are white. One is running and one is skipping. You have a gun with one bullet. You've been told that one of them just shot a black person. You must kill the white person that killed the black person. You take your shot. Which one did you shoot at?

Open your eyes. Your testicles are covered with leeches.

:lol

i'd shoot the one that's skipping. since a lot of whites hate blacks for some odd reason, i figure the one skipping is doing so because he "earned his stripes" and can't wait to go brag.

[cantthinkofanything]

I don't think Trill can read with his eyes closed...

I don't think you can read with your eyes open.

[cantthinkofanything]

:lol

i'd shoot the one that's skipping. since a lot of whites hate blacks for some odd reason, i figure the one skipping is doing so because he "earned his stripes" and can't wait to go brag.

:lol I thought the same thing.

Open your eyes again. The one skipping is gay.

[Trill Clinton]

creepn, have you read The New Jim Crow by Michelle Alexander? I don't know if I asked you already but its an enlightening book.

[Blake]

Well aren't you a nice guy lol. Forgive and forget every time someone lies to you huh?

nobody is forgiving or forgetting Zimmerman's lies.


Ok so in the interview he said Martin was "skipping" but in the 911 call he clearly said "he's running". What do you call that?

Reaching

[Creepn]

creepn, have you read The New Jim Crow by Michelle Alexander? I don't know if I asked you already but its an enlightening book.

No, I heard about it though. I'll have to give it a try.

[cantthinkofanything]

creepn, have you read The New Jim Crow by Michelle Alexander? I don't know if I asked you already but its an enlightening book.

can you bullet point it?

[cantthinkofanything]

NM. I read the summary.

1. Black man wrongly persecuted
2. Whitey bad
3. The end.

[Creepn]

nobody is forgiving or forgetting Zimmerman's lies.



Reaching


Reaching? I'm reaching or Zimmerman?

[Creepn]

NM. I read the summary.

1. Black man wrongly persecuted
2. Whitey bad
3. The end.

Lmao

[Trill Clinton]

rofl

[Blake]

Reaching? I'm reaching or Zimmerman?

Explain how Zimmerman is lying in regards to running vs skipping.

[clambake]

The results of the revocation hearing probably will be. Smh.

lol mr lubbock already gave george his walking papers.

smh

[Blake]

lol mr lubbock already gave george his walking papers.

smh

right. when he was asked what his name was, he told the truth. That's an undeniable fact.

Therefore, he is honest about the night of the murder. Free George, imo.

Smhlol.

[clambake]

comparing the lies from him and his wife to not lying about his name. lol

[Wild Cobra]

Yes this case has racism written all over it. stop quoting MLK, you're a racist and a bigot and your opinion is invalid at this juncture.
Do you deny that society has come around to his dream? That we judge people by their character, and not their color?

Too many black people do not head his words that come before that in his speech, and that is their undoing.

I will quote MLK any time I want. I think he is a great American hero.

[cantthinkofanything]

Do you deny that society has come around to his dream? That we judge people by their character, and not their color?

Too many black people do not head his words that come before that in his speech, and that is their undoing.

I will quote MLK any time I want. I think he is a great American hero.

seriously? so you think the dream has been realized?

[Wild Cobra]

seriously? so you think the dream has been realized?
Yes, except for all the black people who refuse to heed his warnings, and cause trouble upon themselves and their kind.



But there is something that I must say to my people, who stand on the warm threshold which leads into the palace of justice: In the process of gaining our rightful place, we must not be guilty of wrongful deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred. We must forever conduct our struggle on the high plane of dignity and discipline. We must not allow our creative protest to degenerate into physical violence. Again and again, we must rise to the majestic heights of meeting physical force with soul force.

The marvelous new militancy which has engulfed the Negro community must not lead us to a distrust of all white people, for many of our white brothers, as evidenced by their presence here today, have come to realize that their destiny is tied up with our destiny. And they have come to realize that their freedom is inextricably bound to our freedom.
Look at what happens. They remain bitter and hateful. They do not take the higher ground of dignity and discipline. They degenerate to violence. They teach the "black code" of distrust.

People continue and continue in the black community of making MLK's dream something impossible for them and their children to achieve. Not us whites. It is not racism that's still alive, it's the bitterness of hatred.

[clambake]

talk about bitter

[cantthinkofanything]

Yes, except for all the black people who refuse to heed his warnings, and cause trouble upon themselves and their kind.


Look at what happens. They remain bitter and hateful. They do not take the higher ground of dignity and discipline. They degenerate to violence. They teach the "black code" of distrust.

People continue and continue in the black community of making MLK's dream something impossible for them and their children to achieve. Not us whites. It is not racism that's still alive, it's the bitterness of hatred.

wtf is the "black code"?

and isn't racism just another color of hatred?

[Blake]

comparing the lies from him and his wife to not lying about his name. lol

a bit of hyperbole, but yes.

[Wild Cobra]

wtf is the "black code"?

and isn't racism just another color of hatred?
Racism is a specific type of hatred and it's definition doesn't actually include hate. Hate can come from it, but to be racist means that you believe one race is superior to another.

People who believe in affirmative actions quota systems are racist because they believe black people cannot achieve equal position without help. They think black people are not as good.

[Wild Cobra]

wtf is the "black code"?

Ask those here exposing it. I was seriously shocked when they started talking about it, and don't fully understand the destruction they are doing to their children by teaching it. It is however fostering black children to hate whites.

[Wild Cobra]

seriously? so you think the dream has been realized?
Think about it.

Do you judge black people by their color, or by their character and the way they carry themselves?

Do you judge white people by their color, or by their character and the way they carry themselves?

[clambake]

tell us about how they carry themselves.

[cantthinkofanything]

Racism is a specific type of hatred and it's definition doesn't actually include hate. Hate can come from it, but to be racist means that you believe one race is superior to another.

People who believe in affirmative actions quota systems are racist because they believe black people cannot achieve equal position without help. They think black people are not as good.

I saw this documentary about some black maids that wrote a book about being black maids in white homes. But it was interesting that in most cases, the white person didn't hate the black maid but did believe they weren't good enough to use the white toilet. But meanwhile, they entrusted them to raise their kids. Can't really understand that mentality. One the one hand, they're too inferior to use the same toilet but they are OK to bath and pamper the kids. And with all this going on, the maids were still able to care for the children and even love them in some cases.

[Blake]

Do you deny that society has come around to his dream? That we judge people by their character, and not their color?


you don't

[Wild Cobra]

you don't
Yes I do. You have an example that shows otherwise? If so, I'd like to see it. Not something generalized, but against an individual. Facts make statistics, but statistics don't make facts.

[Creepn]

Explain how Zimmerman is lying in regards to running vs skipping.

First of all, skipping and running are two different things aren't they? If he is so innocent why change the story? Why couldn't he just say he was running like he told dispatcher? He said "skipping" because it's less damaging towards him, especially when giving chase to someone running from you. Martin wasn't running from him (which would imply fear), now he's skipping because he's so calm and poised. Zimmerman already manipulated your ass blake.

[Blake]

Yes I do. You have an example that shows otherwise? If so, I'd like to see it. Not something generalized, but against an individual. Facts make statistics, but statistics don't make facts.

Fuzzy just laid your racist posts out a few pages ago. Even then, everyone knows the black surgeon quote.

You're the only one that thinks you're not a racist hack.

[Wild Cobra]

everyone knows the black surgeon quote.

You're the only one that thinks you're not a racist hack.
That's not a racist quote. It's an example of the harm quota systems do.

[cantthinkofanything]

First of all, skipping and running are two different things aren't they? If he is so innocent why change the story? Why couldn't he just say he was running like he told dispatcher? He said "skipping" because it's less damaging towards him, especially when giving chase to someone running from you. Martin wasn't running from him (which would imply fear), now he's skipping because he's so calm and poised. Zimmerman already manipulated your ass blake.

They are both forms of running. Sprinting, skipping, trotting, etc.
Did you know the Eskimos have over 1000 words for different kinds of snow?

[Creepn]

That's not a racist quote. It's an example of the harm quota systems do.

But if you believe Affirm. Action is racist because it tells that black people can't do the job then why do you deliberately avoid black surgeons?

[Wild Cobra]

Did you know the Eskimos have over 1000 words for different kinds of snow?
Random thought...

I wonder how many of those words are for yellow snow?

[Creepn]

They are both forms of running. Sprinting, skipping, trotting, etc.
Did you know the Eskimos have over 1000 words for different kinds of snow?

Oh so a girl should skip away from a guy trying to rape her as opposed to running?

Skipping is a form of movement.

[Wild Cobra]

But if you believe Affirm. Action is racist because it tells that black people can't do the job then why do you deliberately avoid black surgeons?
No, affirmative action is a good thing as it was originally conceived. The problems started when they added quota systems to the mix.

[Creepn]

No, affirmative action is a good thing as it was originally conceived. The problems started when they added quota systems to the mix.

But women benefited more from affirmative actions than blacks as a whole. How come you never include them in your rhetoric?

[cantthinkofanything]

Oh so a girl should skip away from a guy trying to rape her as opposed to running?

Skipping is a form of movement.

It depends on how fast she is skipping. Everyone associates "skipping" with the gay version where someone is just casually flipping their hands in the air while skipping and going, "la la la". But in reality, there are people who can power skip as fast as others can sprint.

[Creepn]

It depends on how fast she is skipping. Everyone associates "skipping" with the gay version where someone is just casually flipping their hands in the air while skipping and going, "la la la". But in reality, there are people who can power skip as fast as others can sprint.

Lmao power skip??? Martin was power skipping from his purser??? LMAO!!!

[cantthinkofanything]

Lmao power skip??? Martin was power skipping from his purser??? LMAO!!!

LOL. I doubt Zimmerman knows what power skipping is. My point being that "skipping" and "running" are virtually synonyms to some people.

[Creepn]

This is power skipping. This is how Martin was tying to get away?

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DjFcm4Z0kJyc&v=jFcm4Z0kJyc&gl=US

[Blake]

First of all, skipping and running are two different things aren't they? If he is so innocent why change the story? Why couldn't he just say he was running like he told dispatcher? He said "skipping" because it's less damaging towards him, especially when giving chase to someone running from you. Martin wasn't running from him (which would imply fear), now he's skipping because he's so calm and poised.

If he were to be put on the stand, the prosecutor might push that.

since he's not getting on the stand, I don't think it makes a difference.


Zimmerman already manipulated your ass blake.

Or there isn't enough evidence to convict him....which is what we're talking about, right?

Or are you suggesting I'm rooting for Team Z?

[Wild Cobra]

But women benefited more from affirmative actions than blacks as a whole. How come you never include them in your rhetoric?
I agree...

Maybe because we seldom talk about that topic... Come on man... Think!

Why should I bring up the "women" aspect of a quota system when we are discussing racism?

[cantthinkofanything]

This is power skipping. This is how Martin was tying to get away?

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DjFcm4Z0kJyc&v=jFcm4Z0kJyc&gl=US

The video didn't play for me. But I doubt Martin was power skipping in the traditional sense. But Zimmerman could have used any of 100 words that all basically mean running. People going down to the track to skip a few laps. Are they power skipping? No. Are they doing the gay skipping? No. They are just running laps. Jogging laps. Skipping laps.

[cantthinkofanything]

I agree...

Maybe because we seldom talk about that topic... Come on man... Think!

Why should I bring up the "women" aspect of a quota system when we are discussing racism?

Because you emulate women but hate blacks?

[Creepn]

I agree...

Maybe because we seldom talk about that topic... Come on man... Think!

Why should I bring up the "women" aspect of a quota system when we are discussing racism?

Because although you know women benefited more from affirmative action as well as other groups, you singled out black surgeons. Everyone else is fine but ooooooh noooo, stay away from black surgeons.

[Wild Cobra]

That's right, have no good ammunition, so go off in a tangent.

I explained myself, you guys refuse to acknowledge my words and make shitty assumptions up.

Your loss. Not mine.

[Creepn]

The video didn't play for me. But I doubt Martin was power skipping in the traditional sense. But Zimmerman could have used any of 100 words that all basically mean running. People going down to the track to skip a few laps. Are they power skipping? No. Are they doing the gay skipping? No. They are just running laps. Jogging laps. Skipping laps.

Sorry here's embedded video of power skipping that you are talking about.

jFcm4Z0kJyc

Is that going to be your defense for Zimmerman's skipping claims?

[Creepn]

That's right, have no good ammunition, so go off in a tangent.

I explained myself, you guys refuse to acknowledge my words and make shitty assumptions up.

Your loss. Not mine.

Like I thought, no ammunition. So why do you single out black surgeons but not women and other minority groups?

[cantthinkofanything]

That's right, have no good ammunition, so go off in a tangent.

I explained myself, you guys refuse to acknowledge my words and make shitty assumptions up.

Your loss. Not mine.

let's try something...

close your eyes. you're standing at the top of a bottomless pit with your arms extended, palms up. one hand is filled with thousands of black people, the other is filled with thousands of women. Someone throws a bomb at you. You have to drop one group of people to knock the bomb away. you make your choice. Open your eyes. You look in your hand. All of the women are black. And some are even transvestites. Who mows your yard know smarty? Also, your penis is caught in a bear trap.

[Creepn]

I wouldn't be surprised if WC could read with his eyes closed. He's a cold blooded creature.

[Wild Cobra]

Like I thought, no ammunition. So why do you single out black surgeons but not women and other minority groups?
I told you why.

I will not continue with adding aspect of quota systems in this thread. If it's that important to you, start a new thread about quota systems.

[Creepn]

I told you why.

I will not continue with adding aspect of quota systems in this thread. It it's that important to you, start a new thread about quota systems.

Again women benefited from the "quota" system more than blacks, as well as other groups. Why do you single out black surgeons but not women and other minority groups Wild Cobra. Just answer that damn question. If you already did then answer it again and I apologize for your stupid inconvenience.

[Wild Cobra]

Again women benefited from the "quota" system more than blacks, as well as other groups. Why do you single out black surgeons but not women and other minority groups Wild Cobra. Just answer that damn question. If you already did then answer it again and I apologize for your stupid inconvenience.
Are you insane? Do you think continuing on the same line of questioning will yeild different results?

If that is important to you, then start a new thread. We have discussed racism in this thread since it's a perceived angle, and quota systems came out too, as I had to explain, once again, peoples asinine assumptions as wrong.

The topic of quota systems deserves it's own thread. Start a new thread or drop the topic. It doesn't belong here.

[cantthinkofanything]

Sorry here's embedded video of power skipping that you are talking about.

jFcm4Z0kJyc

Is that going to be your defense for Zimmerman's skipping claims?

Regardless of what they are calling it, that's gay skipping. Not power skipping.

[Trill Clinton]

WC, you are funny.i give you that much.

[clambake]

maybe zimmerman saw him skipping and thought he was black and gay.

hate crime.

[Trill Clinton]

is power skipping in the olympics?

[clambake]

is power skipping in the olympics?

no, just in sanford.

[cantthinkofanything]

you guys are buttholes

[Trill Clinton]

zimmerman's parents launched their own website asking for donations:rollin:lmao:rollin:lmao

http://www.nbcconnecticut.com/news/national-international/George-Zimmermans-Parents-Launch-Website-164003576.html

[Wild Cobra]

zimmerman's parents launched their own website asking for donations:rollin:lmao:rollin:lmao

http://www.nbcconnecticut.com/news/national-international/George-Zimmermans-Parents-Launch-Website-164003576.html
Try putting yourself in their shoes, and see if you still laugh.

[Trill Clinton]

Try putting yourself in their shoes, and see if you still laugh.

I would be laughing all the way to the bank like the zimmerman family:lmao:rollin:downspin:

[Wild Cobra]

I would be laughing all the way to the bank like the zimmerman family:lmao:rollin:downspin:
Are you one that believe money can buy happiness?

[Trill Clinton]

Are you one that believe money can buy happiness?

no

[clambake]

Are you one that believe money can buy happiness?

what are they trying to buy with their own donation site?

[Creepn]

Are you one that believe money can buy happiness?

Shit i know I'm one lol. Being poor sucks!

[clambake]

"my son murdered a kid and you gave him money, that he spent. now, i want a new house"

[Wild Cobra]

what are they trying to buy with their own donation site?

Please...

Do you really think there isn't a good answer?

Did you read what was written in the article?

Just how expensive do you think is is to try to stay in the shadows so no one can find you. Just how are they suppose to have any peace in life right now?

[clambake]

i read what they wrote.

what they wrote.

they

[clambake]

if he really cared about his parents he'd separate from them.

nope, not george. he gonna milk them till they're dead.

[Trill Clinton]

they need the money!

it aint cheap feeding Georgie and his lying ass wife!

[clambake]

kill a kid and beg for money. new trend.

[clambake]

guy hunts down a kid and people give him money. wow

[Trill Clinton]

and if you're related to the killer, make a website so you can cash in too. i wonder if any of the other zimmerman's in the family tree have created donation sites.

wow...went to robert n gladys's site and what do you know. they have an american flag as the background:lmao smh.

[clambake]

why did daddy leave out all the nasty shit that george has pulled?

[Creepn]

I just left a friendly little message on their site.

[clambake]

why does george need defense money when hannity said he'd pay for it?

[Creepn]

why does george need defense money when hannity said he'd pay for it?

Can't fault George for that. Remember Hannity said he would volunteer to get waterboarded to prove a point and he never did? He'snot a man of his word.

[DarrinS]

guy hunts down a kid and people give him money. wow

A white-ish Hispanic with a JEW last name hunting darkies with a sniper rifle. Get your facts straight.

[Creepn]

A white-ish Hispanic with a JEW last name hunting darkies with a sniper rifle. Get your facts straight.

Zimmerman name is German tbh.

[Trill Clinton]

woooooooooooooow.

just read the FBI confiscated zimmermans laptop and found he frequented gay black thug sites. basically sites where gay thugs fucking each other rofl.

im tied up at this juncture, im sure you can google it smh.

[Wild Cobra]

woooooooooooooow.

just read the FBI confiscated zimmermans laptop and found he frequented gay black thug sites. basically sites where gay thugs fucking each other rofl.

im tied up at this juncture, im sure you can google it smh.
Going to the sites Boutons visits again?

Not saying it's not true, but link... credibility...

On a case like this, it is likely just more bullshit in my opinion.

[Creepn]

Wild Cobra, can I ask you something?

[Wild Cobra]

Wild Cobra, can I ask you something?

You just did...

[Creepn]

You just did...

Lol don't count. Anyway, you consider yourself a Christian man no?

[Trill Clinton]

the story about zimmerman looking up gay porn isn't true. smh, should have known better. but you never know.

[Yonivore]

the story about zimmerman looking up gay porn isn't true. smh, should have known better. but you never know.
Some people will fall for anything eh, Trill?

[Trill Clinton]

Some people will fall for anything eh, Trill?

absolutely. that's evident by the number of blind supporters of zimmerman's tale of killing an unarmed teen.

[Wild Cobra]

Lol don't count. Anyway, you consider yourself a Christian man no?
More so than any other religion, but I don't believe that Jehovah is the only God. I believe there are several.

[Creepn]

More so than any other religion, but I don't believe that Jehovah is the only God. I believe there are several.

I see. So when Zimmerman blatantly lied under oath by swearing under God, why did you give him a pass? It's total disrespect and a smack in the face to God. That alone should tell you about his character but despite all that, you dismiss it. Why?

[Wild Cobra]

I see. So when Zimmerman blatantly lied under oath by swearing under God, why did you give him a pass? It's total disrespect and a smack in the face to God. That alone should tell you about his character but despite all that, you dismiss it. Why?

His belief is not mine, and God is not Jehovah's name.

[Creepn]

His belief is not mine, and God is not Jehovah's name.

But he swore on a bible. Obviously the god he's swearing to is the Christian Jehovah or the many other names He is referred by.

[Wild Cobra]

But he swore on a bible. Obviously the god he's swearing to is the Christian Jehovah or the many other names He is referred by.
Why does this matter so much to you? You really think that matters? Unless someone has an unshakable faith in the Christian word, that is nothing but symbolism.

[Blake]

... and God is not Jehovah's name.

What does that have to do with anything

[Yonivore]

What does that have to do with anything
I think it goes to the ignorance, about religion, that passes for sophisticated, and sometimes witty, discourse in this forum.

[Creepn]

Let's cut the shit ok. He is obviously a christian or he is referring to the Christian god. How do you not see that this man is using religion to manipulate? He blatantly lies under oath for his own personal gain but then acts all spiritual in his interview and claims that it was god's plan for him to kill Martin? Does that really make sense? Christian people just ate it up! Look at Sommerset's post. Ate it up! Just dismissed that he slapped God for blood donations but accepts him as some kind of prophet or something.

[Trill Clinton]

Latest news W/ A LINK!

Judge Lester refuses to bow down to Zimmerman's demands and refuses to step down.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/01/13068375-judge-in-george-zimmerman-trial-refuses-to-step-down?lite

[leemajors]

His belief is not mine, and God is not Jehovah's name.

Could be, how would you know?

[clambake]

Latest news W/ A LINK!

Judge Lester refuses to bow down to Zimmerman's demands and refuses to step down.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/01/13068375-judge-in-george-zimmerman-trial-refuses-to-step-down?lite

looks like o'mara is worried about the history of george being a verified and confirmed liar.

looks real bad with george blatantly throwing god all over the room.

[Creepn]

Damn Zimmerman trying to burn through all these judges so his daddy can take the bench.

[CosmicCowboy]

Damn Zimmerman trying to burn through all these judges so his daddy can take the bench.

:rolleyes

Dumbass

Daddy was never even a judge in Florida. He retired to Florida from Virginia.

[clambake]

:rolleyes

Dumbass

Daddy was never even a judge in Florida. He retired to Florida from Virginia.

shut up you pineapple dummy!!!!!!!

you have a good time?

[CosmicCowboy]

shut up you pineapple dummy!!!!!!!

you have a good time?

Oh man. It fucking rocked. I could SO live on the North Shore. Rented a T-top 4 door jeep wrangler to run around in. Did a kickass offshore fishing trip, picked up a couple more hours in sailplanes (I already had 12) flying that wave lift off the mountains and right over the beach...did a ton of snorkeling at sharks cove, chased turtles, rented a kayak for the week to play off the beach with...did some of the usual tourist stuff (Waimea falls, pearl harbor, a kickass luau, etc.) Ate a shitload of poku and sushi. Amazing trip.

[clambake]

sounds like a killer trip! wife keeps bugging me about the north shore.

[CosmicCowboy]

sounds like a killer trip! wife keeps bugging me about the north shore.

It ain't cheap but it's damn nice. I rented a condo right on the beach just outside Haliewa that was perfect. It was like $1700 for 10 days.

[clambake]

It ain't cheap but it's damn nice. I rented a condo right on the beach just outside Haliewa that was perfect. It was like $1700 for 10 days.

actually, that sounds dirt cheap. wife wants to rent a private home, pool, the works.

plenty of those out there?

[CosmicCowboy]

actually, that sounds dirt cheap. wife wants to rent a private home, pool, the works.

plenty of those out there?

Eek! Not many on the North shore. Real estate there is boocoo pricey. These condos were a half mil to buy and what your wife is talking about is 4-5 mil towards Sunset if on the beach. Might be something further west in Waialua that would be reasonable. Ain't nothing cheap there. I haven't added it up yet but figure I dropped 8 grand total for three people.

[CosmicCowboy]

If she wants North Shore but luxury and a fresh water pool you might want to check into Turtle Bay. Hotel rooms, but nice pool, spa, etc. and they have a nice surf break right off the point.

[CosmicCowboy]

It was a really cool place but those mexicans over there sure talk funny. They only have like 6 consonants in their alphabet and every street name looks like a bad "word with friends" hand...:p:

[clambake]

she found one with everything she wants. $3950 a week. thats not too bad.

[clambake]

did you fly first class?

[CosmicCowboy]

did you fly first class?

Naa...I don't do air miles and if you don't upgrade that way first class is stupid expensive. We went at prime time and I paid 8 something each for coach for three plus the bag charges on US Air. Not bad, but this big boy was damn glad to get off the plane after 6 hours. With airfare and condo and car rental I was 5 grand+ into it before we landed.

[clambake]

Naa...I don't do air miles and if you don't upgrade that way first class is stupid expensive. We went at prime time and I paid 8 something each for coach for three plus the bag charges on US Air. Not bad, but this big boy was damn glad to get off the plane after 6 hours.

yeah, can't do that either. 6'3-4" might have shrunk to 6'3" by now! long legs.

6 hours of that would kill me.

[clambake]

had some friends come back last night at midnight. in the matter of a mere 16 hours of her talking to them, she's all over this shit.

[CosmicCowboy]

yeah, can't do that either. 6'3-4" might have shrunk to 6'3" by now! long legs.

6 hours of that would kill me.

Yeah, I'm 6'5" with bad knees. I just get up and stretch and walk every 45 minutes.

[clambake]

i'm tall but also dainty :p:

[CosmicCowboy]

had some friends come back last night at midnight. in the matter of a mere 16 hours of her talking to them, she's all over this shit.

Hey it's nice. Like I said, I could live on the north shore. I wasn't all that crazy about Honolulu, Wakiki, Kaialua, etc...too high rise urban and too expensive. Nice scenery on the beach but not my thing.

[CosmicCowboy]

Nice hijack BTW.

I was sick of talking about that poor fucking black kid....:p:

[clambake]

she's not interested in the high rise stuff, either. she just wants the cool period house and experience. laid back.

[clambake]

Nice hijack BTW.

I was sick of talking about that poor fucking black kid....:p:

:lol