Castle ROTY watch

[spurraider21]

1. Jaren Jackson Jr.
2. Jabari Smith Jr.

They can both defend the rim, and shoot the ball, and both will be FAs when we have money in 2026, Smith being restricted, but on a team with many mouths to feed.
unless Nico Harrison gets a job with memphis... it aint happening. he's their best and most impactful player, well on his way to making All-NBA in addition to all-defense this season

the discount version of this would have been john collins before he starting going off. probably could have been had for keldon and some SRPs.... no longer

[spurraider21]

Can't say JJJ is untouchable considering what just happened, but he's definitely the most important player in Memphis and will be offered max extension. I don't see any indications that he'd refuse it.
Idk about Smith, he just might be available, but we need someone next season, not in 2025.

Naz and Aldama are FA and they could be moved to the bench later on if a better player comes along.
PJ Washington is also FA in 2026 and will probably want out of Dallas dumpster fire this summer.
John Collins would be the emergency solution if other options fail.

And we're off-topic, btw.
i think we're going to be priced out of Naz/Aldama. we're basically working with the MLE unless we salary dump some big pieces like vassell/keldon/barnes

[DAF86]

They are going to cost Castle the easiest RoY in league history because they are a bunch of faggots that don't have the balls to sit anyone but the rookie.

[Mr. Body]

They are going to cost Castle the easiest RoY in league history because they are a bunch of faggots that don't have the balls to sit anyone but the rookie.

Christ dude just because psycho incels use that kind of slur doesn't mean you should. Don't be a fucking gape.

[Mikesatx]

I think Aldama is the guy. Would be a great fit on this team. Smart player like Mamu but with better size and athleticism. Have no idea what the cost would be though.

[DAF86]

Christ dude just because psycho incels use that kind of slur doesn't mean you should. Don't be a fucking gape.

Little known fact: non faggot gay people have no problem with the use of the word "faggot".

[exstatic]

Tbh, we have that wing in Barnes.
I'd say I prefer Barnes unless it's a very bad matchup where we get killed physically and can't make it up on the other end.

For example Warriors small ball wasn't about amazing defense in itself, but about running the opposing bigs who could exploit them off the floor.
That should be our end goal, imo. No point in playing any other way now that we have Fox.

I said it many times, I'd be fine with just one high end addition this summer, a starting PF.
Naz Reid, Aldama, PJ Washington and John Collins would be my realistic targets.

JJJ is on a decreasing deal, and his potential extension based on that would be an underpay. He’ll go into UFA.

[baseline bum]

i think we're going to be priced out of Naz/Aldama. we're basically working with the MLE unless we salary dump some big pieces of shit like vassell/keldon

fify

[ismael-robert]

Little known fact: non faggot gay people have no problem with the use of the word "faggot".

I found it funny he made that statement after committing blasphemy

[RC_Drunkford]

Can't say JJJ is untouchable considering what just happened, but he's definitely the most important player in Memphis and will be offered max extension. I don't see any indications that he'd refuse it.
Idk about Smith, he just might be available, but we need someone next season, not in 2025.

Naz and Aldama are FA and they could be moved to the bench later on if a better player comes along.
PJ Washington is also FA in 2026 and will probably want out of Dallas dumpster fire this summer.
John Collins would be the emergency solution if other options fail.

And we're off-topic, btw.

nope, JJJ is on a declining contract so he has to hit free agency. At that point anybody can offer him the max and he might want to go to a better team. We would have to move some salary, but we can definitely try to get him and I think he‘d be worth going after.

[John B]

Unless we get a KAT-like C who can shoot lights out, we'd be sabotaging ourselves with 2 bigs lineup.
Everyone is going to defend Wemby with long forwards as on-ball defenders. Having another big next to him would just make those matchups natural and easier for opposing bigs to not get exploited.

Get a 6'9-6'11 forward who can shoots lights out and put it on the floor against a close-out and we make it near-impossible for the opponents to defend everything.
Now that we have Fox and Castle who will never be elite shooters, we can't afford to have subpar shooters in forward positions.

Danny Wolf?? Guard-like in a 7” body who can shoot and pass, high bball IQ. A little older so he should contribute from day-1. Is his talent going to translate in NBA?

[Uriel]

I know it's way too early, but as it stands, does it look like Castle will be the best player from this draft?

[sfernald]

I know it's way too early, but as it stands, does it look like Castle will be the best player from this draft?

it’s really hard to say yet. I don’t think anyone could give you anything more than a maybe at this point.

[Obstructed_View]

I know it's way too early, but as it stands, does it look like Castle will be the best player from this draft?

My pre-draft pick for best player from this draft was McCain. I was pretty sure Castle had a shot to be the best player from this draft by opening day. Maybe someone develops into a monster later on but Castle looks legit in every way. He's better than any other Spur at this point who wasn't picked first.

[objective]

nope, JJJ is on a declining contract so he has to hit free agency. At that point anybody can offer him the max and he might want to go to a better team. We would have to move some salary, but we can definitely try to get him and I think he‘d be worth going after.

My understanding of the situation is:

While his declining contract can make an extension unlikely because it limits the amount they can offer, there's an alternate route:

If he makes all-nba he is eligible for up to the Supermax. They don't have to give him the full supermax, but it's a loophole they could exploit to keep him from free agency

[John B]

I know it's way too early, but as it stands, does it look like Castle will be the best player from this draft?

I didn’t even know he had the athleticism to enter the AS dunk contest. But now that he did, he’s done windmills at games and most of his dunks are emphatic with much gusto. This kid has it and he’s going to be great. And playing alongside another great player (especially at the same age??) will only push each better. I think he’s going to be number 1 in re-draft when all is said and done.

[Raven]

I know it's way too early, but as it stands, does it look like Castle will be the best player from this draft?

yes

[RC_Drunkford]

I know it's way too early, but as it stands, does it look like Castle will be the best player from this draft?

I mean that was pretty clear pre-draft. He was the most complete player by far. The only questionmark was his jump shot.

[Pauleta14]

I know it's way too early, but as it stands, does it look like Castle will be the best player from this draft?

Not sure yet. It depends on the evolution of his shooting.

Castle is the most "sure thing" from this draft but there are a lot of potentials that need time and development, some will for sure end up AllStar imo in the lot between Risacher Sarr Missi Wells Edey or maybe even Buzelis who started showing some promises too recently

[scott]

JJJ is on a decreasing deal, and his potential extension based on that would be an underpay. He’ll go into UFA.

I believe with the moves MEM made yesterday, it gives them capspace to renegotiate and extend JJJ without him needing to make All NBA (which he may very well do anyway).

We should hope that JJJ doesn't make All NBA, because then to reneg-and-extend JJJ *I think* (could be wrong) they'll have to renounce Aldama's cap hold.

If JJJ does make All NBA, MEM will be granted a lifeline because they they can resign Aldama and give JJJ a max extension (they don't HAVE to pay him the SuperMax)

[scott]

nope, JJJ is on a declining contract so he has to hit free agency. At that point anybody can offer him the max and he might want to go to a better team. We would have to move some salary, but we can definitely try to get him and I think he‘d be worth going after.

See response to exstatic above. MEM has more outs on this than it appears on the surface.

[CGD]

Fox who?

[Manu-of-steel]

Great game by our rook! He's not even the first off the bench. The coaching staff is doin a great disservice to this talented rookie.

[CGD]

Great game by our rook! He's not even the first off the bench. The coaching staff is doin a great disservice to this talented rookie.

CP3 needs muhtouches

[Ice009]

HIS OWN FUCKING TEAM IS TRYING TO TAKE IT AWAY FROM HIM.

If they're going to bench him, not being the first player off the bench is ridiculous.

This kid has already got a Kawhi green light as far as I'm concerned. One of the only guys on the team that shows real toughness out there and he's also one of the youngest. The rest should be freaking ashamed of themselves. Sure, he made a couple of mental errors, but he's playing physical and is actually showing great mental toughness by not giving up and helping claw the Spurs back into games. Spurs get blown out without him tonight. As someone mentioned in the game thread, Spurs probably have more blowout losses without Steph bringing them back into games.

[Manu-of-steel]

If CP3 insists on playing more even if he's not helping the team, Id rather let our rook learn on the fly by letting him play more. I have seen many games wherein CP3 was actually being a negative, yet he played more minutes compared to Castle. I know there is a fine line between letting CP3 play and getting our rook valuable time on the floor to develop. Is it CP3 or the coaching staff? Or a combination of both?

[rascal]

Christ dude just because psycho incels use that kind of slur doesn't mean you should. Don't be a fucking gape.

Don't use the Christ name in this context. Show some respect for the Big Guy.

[Knoxxx]

If CP3 insists on playing more even if he's not helping the team, Id rather let our rook learn on the fly by letting him play more. I have seen many games wherein CP3 was actually being a negative, yet he played more minutes compared to Castle. I know there is a fine line between letting CP3 play and getting our rook valuable time on the floor to develop. Is it CP3 or the coaching staff? Or a combination of both?

CP3 is a net negative on the court for some time now. On the plus side, that helps us achieve closes losses like even to a bad team tonight.

[cd98]

CPS is one of the few reliable off the ball three point shooters on this team. And he gets the ball to Wemby better than anyone.

[100%duncan]

HIS OWN FUCKING TEAM IS TRYING TO TAKE IT AWAY FROM HIM.

If they're going to bench him, not being the first player off the bench is ridiculous.

This kid has already got a Kawhi green light as far as I'm concerned. One of the only guys on the team that shows real toughness out there and he's also one of the youngest. The rest should be freaking ashamed of themselves. Sure, he made a couple of mental errors, but he's playing physical and is actually showing great mental toughness by not giving up and helping claw the Spurs back into games. Spurs get blown out without him tonight. As someone mentioned in the game thread, Spurs probably have more blowout losses without Steph bringing them back into games.


Yup, I was the one who brought this up in the GT. We have had a lot of games where Steph brought us back, again not necessarily that we went on to win.

[Knoxxx]

On a team with not enough of it he oozes BBIQ and grit for that matter.

[Ice009]

Yup, I was the one who brought this up in the GT. We have had a lot of games where Steph brought us back, again not necessarily that we went on to win.

Yeah, I remember now. Good observation IMO. The Spurs didn't win a lot of those games, but we wouldn't have had a chance to win them if it wasn't for Steph's play.

[tim_duncan_fan]

On a team with not enough of it he oozes BBIQ and grit for that matter.

He is way up there on my Favorite Current Spurs list, but apparently it was him who left the woman-beater open for the game-winning 3. Clearly a smart guy, but he does some goofy stuff at times.

[Knoxxx]

He is way up there on my Favorite Current Spurs list, but apparently it was him who left the woman-beater open for the game-winning 3. Clearly a smart guy, but he does some goofy stuff at times.

Over helping on D has been an ongoing plague but the silver lining is next year would be the one to fix that. Obviously we only have 6 guys who should even sniff the floor in the playoffs and most of them are not even ready for it.

[dn0774]

He just turned 20, mistakes happen.

[MannyIsGod]

Castle played 31 minutes tonight. Who cares if he was first off the bench?

[Obstructed_View]

Castle played 31 minutes tonight. Who cares if he was first off the bench?
Since they got into a hole that took them the whole game to dig out of, in a game they lost by 1, maybe you should care.

[lefty]

He just turned 20, mistakes happen.

Agreed

He makes mistakes in every game and that’s totally normal for a rookie

Better make them now than later, and he is smart and learm from them

I’m not worried

[MannyIsGod]

Since they got into a hole that took them the whole game to dig out of, in a game they lost by 1, maybe you should care.

Was Castle coming on a minute or two earlier going to mean that the Spurs weren't going to be largely bad for the first 3 quarters? Really? Explain that one to me because I didn't realize that Castle coming on a few minutes early was going to mean that other players magically played better.

Did this loss break all of you? JFC this is the dumbest this forum has acted in years and that's saying something.

[Knoxxx]

Castle is so smart he probably was thinking ahead to the L gets us within a half game of Portland for the #9 lotto seed and keeps us -1 in the win column.

[RC_Drunkford]

Is he the only player on our roster besides Wemby who had a 30-point game this season?

[LeBowen]

Is he the only player on our roster besides Wemby who had a 30-point game this season?

Champ had 30 against the Kings and Keldon had 28 against the Bulls, noone had more than 25 other than those two games.

[Obstructed_View]

Was Castle coming on a minute or two earlier going to mean that the Spurs weren't going to be largely bad for the first 3 quarters? Really? Explain that one to me because I didn't realize that Castle coming on a few minutes early was going to mean that other players magically played better.

Did this loss break all of you? JFC this is the dumbest this forum has acted in years and that's saying something.
Not sure how, yet again, you fail to understand such simple basketball concepts as momentum or shooting confidence. Put a better defender in the starting lineup and a guy who hits his first two shots and has a good night maybe misses that shot and struggles instead. It is literally why coaches pick better players to start.

It is utterly mystifying that someone who cares enough about a sport to post on a message board thinks it's just magic that things happen the way they do with different personnel on the floor.

Don't ever change. You're a hilariously unserious person. It takes commitment to willfully fail to understand things the way you do.

[MannyIsGod]

Not sure how, yet again, you fail to understand such simple basketball concepts as momentum or shooting confidence. Put a better defender in the starting lineup and a guy who hits his first two shots and has a good night maybe misses that shot and struggles instead. It is literally why coaches pick better players to start.

It is utterly mystifying that someone who cares enough about a sport to post on a message board thinks it's just magic that things happen the way they do with different personnel on the floor.

Don't ever change. You're a hilariously unserious person. It takes commitment to willfully fail to understand things the way you do.

Do you not understand what first off the bench means? I means we're not talking about whether or not it would have been better for him to start. Go back and reread what I posted that you replied and then tell me how I'm the unserious one when you're apparently illiterate.

People in this thread are complaining he wasn't first off the bench. I responded to that. I literally made comments that he should start over Paul, but that wasn't the discussion.

SO serious of a person.

[Obstructed_View]

Do you not understand what first off the bench means? I means we're not talking about whether or not it would have been better for him to start. Go back and reread what I posted that you replied and then tell me how I'm the unserious one when you're apparently illiterate.

People in this thread are complaining he wasn't first off the bench. I responded to that. I literally made comments that he should start over Paul, but that wasn't the discussion.

SO serious of a person.
Lol don't ever change. Just move the goalposts. Back to the ignore list you go.

[venitian navigator]

Of Castle can be come our new Manu, im not againt it...
Actually Fox Is supposed tò be our new TP and Wemby out new TD...
Plus we have the privilege for next season tò choose/trade for more good veterans and possibly quality rookies 2 lottery picks

[Raven]

He's a way better fit off the bench in his first season, as i've been saying.

[John B]

I’m okay with Castle playing off the bench if he plays 30+ minutes, especially closing the game. I think the coaching staff has recognized that. The thing that they need to recognize is Champ on a defensive stand instead of CP3

[MannyIsGod]

Lol don't ever change. Just move the goalposts. Back to the ignore list you go.


Yes, me moving the goal posts based off the literal text in the post you quoted but were too stupid to read. I'm heartbroken that the #1 poster in the serious rankings is going to take ignore me. Nothing says LOL like TELLING someone you're going to ignore them. So damn performative dude.

[MannyIsGod]

I’m okay with Castle playing off the bench if he plays 30+ minutes, especially closing the game. I think the coaching staff has recognized that. The thing that they need to recognize is Champ on a defensive stand instead of CP3

I think he fits better with the first unit but only if Devin deffers to him in the offensive pecking order so maybe it is better to have him off the bench and allow him to get more touches.

[spursistan]

https://x.com/Chris_ApTx/status/1889151096905728345

[BatManu20]

He just continues to get better. Love to see it. Should be getting a lot more than 19 min/game though. Mitch needs to cut the bullshit.

[100%duncan]

https://x.com/Chris_ApTx/status/1889151096905728345

Rookie Castle>Rookie Wemby in terms of maturity and BBALL IQ. Let's hope the 2 get meaningful minutes with Fox next season :lol

[cutewizard]

Stud in the making

[cutewizard]

The new big three is here

then we break new ground >> create the big four ????

The Flag is coming? hahahahahahahahaha

[cutewizard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPCfH5TSq2w

[cutewizard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oz5n7OvkaTA

[CGD]

The allstar game also helped optically for many reasons, not least of which was that he was on the same team with the next two challengers (Eddy and Wells) and he looked the part of ROTY compared to them. Those other guys looked like wallflowers.

[mudyez]

Just here to admit again me beeing a Reed Sheppard guy at draft day.

Stupid me.

[Poolboy5623]

Good thing the Rockets passed on him tbh

[NASpurs]

https://x.com/Chris_ApTx/status/1889151096905728345

Nice ten game sample unlike Vassell's 4 game "turning the corner" sample.

[baseline bum]

Just here to admit again me beeing a Reed Sheppard guy at draft day.

Stupid me.

Still way too early to write Sheppard off. Though I was leaning Castle over Sheppard on draft day and am very glad the first three picks played out the way they did. Really didn't want Sarr and would have only picked Risascher if both Castle and Sheppard were already off the board.

[rascal]

Still way too early to write Sheppard off. Though I was leaning Castle over Sheppard on draft day and am very glad the first three picks played out the way they did. Really didn't want Sarr and would have only picked Risascher if both Castle and Sheppard were already off the board.

I would have taken Sarr over Castle then Castle was second. Didn't like anyone else that much and definitely wanted no part of the Kentucky guards.

[rjv]

didn't want sheppard and wasn't upset that we traded away dillingham. i was pumped when castle landed in our lap though i can sort of see the logic in why houston passed on him.

[DAF86]

Just here to admit again me beeing a Reed Sheppard guy at draft day.

Stupid me.

I think if the Rockets took Castle and the Spurs took Sheppard, things would be looking much different right now.

Castle's non-shooting would have probably kept him from having a spot in the Rockets rotation and Sheppard would probably have had much more chances to showcase and develop himself with the Spurs.

[Mr. Body]

Good thing the Rockets passed on him tbh

My biggest fear was the Rockets wising up and taking Castle.

[scott]

4 game win streak coming out of the ASB, you heard it here first.

[Mitch Cumsteen]

Still way too early to write Sheppard off.

It's way too early, but he looks like a giant bust to me. He's physically overmatched every time he's on the floor and his only real skill is outside shooting. And he's shooting 27% from three, which is worse than Castle (28% and rapidly improving) who supposedly can't shoot.

The Rockets way overthought it. Take the BPA, always. Like the famous Bobby Knight line about Portland taking Sam Bowie over Jordan because they needed a center, "They draft Jordan and play him at center!"

[Mugen]

4 game win streak coming out of the ASB, you heard it here first.

2-2 would be a massive W tbh :lol

[dn0774]

It's way too early, but he looks like a giant bust to me. He's physically overmatched every time he's on the floor and his only real skill is outside shooting. And he's shooting 27% from three, which is worse than Castle (28% and rapidly improving) who supposedly can't shoot.

The Rockets way overthought it. Take the BPA, always. Like the famous Bobby Knight line about Portland taking Sam Bowie over Jordan because they needed a center, "They draft Jordan and play him at center!"

I expect Sheppard to get his shot going at some point, tough for a rookie to play with any sort of confidence when you look over and see Ime scowling after any mistake and then pulling you. The problem for Reed even if he finds his shooting is that he is more than a just liability on defense, he is a giant gaping hole on that end. Think how badly Austin Reeves gets tortured on D and then realize that Reeves actually has like 4 inches of height and 6 inches of wingspan over Reed. I don’t see any path for him other than just being short stint microwave scorer as his best outcome.

[baseline bum]

didn't want sheppard and wasn't upset that we traded away dillingham. i was pumped when castle landed in our lap though i can sort of see the logic in why houston passed on him.

Once Dillingham weighed in at 164 I was completely out on him. Still remember that draft lottery special where they had Castle and Clingan standing on one side of the host, Dillingham and Sheppard on the other, and all I could think was Castle and Clingan looked like their dads. :lol

[rjv]

Once Dillingham weighed in at 164 I was completely out on him. Still remember that draft lottery special where they had Castle and Clingan standing on one side of the host, Dillingham and Sheppard on the other, and all I could think was Castle and Clingan looked like their dads. :lol

:rollin

[Gandalf]

This article has an interview with Castle after the dunk contest. Seems like he really likes both Wemby and Fox (and SA), so that’s good.

https://andscape.com/features/san-antonio-spurs-rookie-stephon-castle-puts-in-a-full-nba-all-star-weekend/

[ginobilized]

Steph is so solid in himself. Real confidence and doesn't take shit. So happy that he is showing strong signs of becoming star/superstar. What a find.

His mini-slump a while back was probably his abbreviated version of the rookie wall.
It was cool seeing he and Amen Thompson together in the (stupid) ASG. Steph's offensive upside is miles beyond Thompson. If Houston had them both, their D would be pretty sick. But, they don't and we do.
We are 2 3 & D types and a backup center away from putting something together here.

Castle has already got my vote for ROY.

[RC_Drunkford]

4 game win streak coming out of the ASB, you heard it here first.

they gon lose the first game

[rascal]

2-2 would be a massive W tbh :lol

Agree with a 4 game win streak. Schedule gets easy over the next few games until @ OK City. Spurs can even go into Houston and win that game.

[quentin_compson]

Michael Pina from The Ringer believes in Castle:
"Castle taking home the Rookie of the Year is not a foregone conclusion, but if the San Antonio Spurs don’t completely fade out of the play-in race and remain competitive over the next six weeks, it would be a bit of a surprise to see anyone else win that award."
https://www.theringer.com/2025/02/17/nba/nba-all-star-game-2025-format-dunk-contest-mac-mcclung

[sfernald]

Still way too early to write Sheppard off. Though I was leaning Castle over Sheppard on draft day and am very glad the first three picks played out the way they did. Really didn't want Sarr and would have only picked Risascher if both Castle and Sheppard were already off the board.

Practically everyone on this board had a stiffy for Risascher.

[DAF86]

Practically everyone on this board had a stiffy for Risascher.

And rightly so, he's gonna be exactly as advertised: a versatile 3 and D forward for years to come. Exactly the type of player the Spurs are missing.

[sfernald]

And rightly so, he's gonna be exactly as advertised: a versatile 3 and D forward for years to come. Exactly the type of player the Spurs are missing.

Did you see this BR redraft where he dropped to fifth? Guy can’t create his own shot. That will always make him less than desirable honestly.


https://bleacherreport.com/articles/25142931-re-drafting-2024-nba-rookie-class-ahead-2025-all-star-weekend

[baseline bum]

Practically everyone on this board had a stiffy for Risascher.

I saw him as another Harrison Barnes. Which honestly wouldn't be a bad outcome from a weak draft. If the top 3 had been some permutation of Castle, Sarr, and Sheppard then Risacher would have been the pretty clear pick to make there.

[sfernald]

I saw him as another Harrison Barnes. Which honestly wouldn't be a bad outcome from a weak draft. If the top 3 had been some permutation of Castle, Sarr, and Sheppard then Risacher would have been the pretty clear pick to make there.

Yeah I think so. This was a really tough draft to call overall at the top. But I mean it seemed like so many people here were praying that Risacher would drop somehow. Lol, I guess be careful what you wish for.

[DAF86]

Did you see this BR redraft where he dropped to fifth? Guy can’t create his own shot. That will always make him less than desirable honestly.


https://bleacherreport.com/articles/25142931-re-drafting-2024-nba-rookie-class-ahead-2025-all-star-weekend

Who cares about the BR redraft? :lol

That same redraft has Sheppard staying at #3 and Ware falling. That article is a joke, tbh. :lol

Risacher has been everything he was expected to be. He also has 2 30pts games (that's twice as much as our primary ball handling, RoTY candidate, PG that we all love, tbh). He's been more than fine. I don't know why are you talking about him as he is some kind of bust.

[cutewizard]

The new Manu

[DAF86]

No excuse for Castle not to win RoY now, tbh. Just start him, give him 35 minutes per night and make him the #1 option.

[daslicer]

He's definitely getting the ROY if he stays healthy. He will get as many chances as possible to pad his stats now.

[Ice009]

No excuse for Castle not to win RoY now, tbh. Just start him, give him 35 minutes per night and make him the #1 option.

Yep, I just posted this. Give him and De'Aaron (if he doesn't get the surgery) the keys to the team now for the rest of the season.

The question is, is Chris Paul also want to going to continue to start? Can the Spurs start Steph without benching CP3? Who will be starting in Victor's place? Fucking irresponsible that the Spurs didn't find a decent backup center all season or try to trade for one.

[DAF86]

Yep, I just posted this. Give him and De'Aaron (if he doesn't get the surgery) the keys to the team now for the rest of the season.

The question is, is Chris Paul also want to going to continue to start? Can the Spurs start Steph without benching CP3? Who will be starting in Victor's place? Fucking irresponsible that the Spurs didn't find a decent backup center all season or try to trade for one.

The Spurs just have to tell Fox to get the surgert now. They just have to. Anything else would be management malpractice.

[cutewizard]

Young fella, while are two superstars are recovering

It's YOUR team now

Go and play, make mistakes, lesrn

[LakerHater]

https://images4.imagebam.com/47/97/30/MEZS1KO_o.gif

[Knoxxx]

Castle only 25 minutes last night!?!

[spursparker9]

Castle only 25 minutes last night!?!

And no clutch min in the last 5 min of the game

[exstatic]

Castle only 25 minutes last night!?!

We won.

[onechance87]

Castle only 25 minutes last night!?!

he was playing ok...But fox and cp3 were playing very good to take out.

[exstatic]

he was playing ok...But fox and cp3 were playing very good to take out.

When a lead starts slipping away, and it was, you want your closer getting the bulk of the touches. Fox is a one time winner of the NBA clutch player award. At that point, I want the win, and don’t care about seasoning a rookie. He was in at the end of the Orlando game, and screwed the pooch by ball watching on the final shot, letting a clean, uncontested three go up for the win.

[Splits]

13 minutes :lmao

[DAF86]

We won.

Only 13 minutes and we lost tonight. What now?

[Splits]

Only 13 minutes and we lost tonight. What now?

600 word essay saying nothing of substance coming in 3... 2... 1...

[siraulo23]

Spurs culture is about winning not individual accolades

"cant have 2 ROTY winners in a row, keep Castle on the bench"

:downspin:

[ffadicted]

Don’t care if this is a repeat post, so egregious it needs to be said twice. This is a fucking joke. Play Castle of GTFO. Nothing else to say, this is a fucking embarrassment to the fans and the development of our team.

Paul + Barnes + Vassell + Champagnie = 10 points in 80 minutes
Castle = 12 points in 13 minutes

Like what

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

This article has an interview with Castle after the dunk contest. Seems like he really likes both Wemby and Fox (and SA), so that’s good.

https://andscape.com/features/san-antonio-spurs-rookie-stephon-castle-puts-in-a-full-nba-all-star-weekend/

tha fuk is andscape?

[Gandalf]

tha fuk is andscape?

No idea. Had a few decent quotes though.

[exstatic]

Only 13 minutes and we lost tonight. What now?

They were better than us. We’ve also lost some of Castle’s better high minutes games to the point where I think it maybe unrelated to his PT.

[tonight...you]

Ugly, stupid stuff. We're not playing for Wemby anymore.
We're not developing the Vassell's, or keldon's anymore.
A Play-In does what?
I get developing culture, but you do it with playing the guy your team should be developing.
No matter what now.
You see how Castle plays with others, you see how he plays period.

Defending the coaching right now is...
Mmmmm.

[DAF86]

They were better than us. We’ve also lost some of Castle’s better high minutes games to the point where I think it maybe unrelated to his PT.

That has nothing to do with the fact that Castle needs more playing time. No matter the context, 13 minutes is unacceptable.

[Chomag]

I guess should count ourselves lucky that he isn't getting DNPs

[Ice009]

Will anyone in the SA media ask why Stephon isn't getting many minutes?

[BatManu20]

Castle's scoring this season.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GkZhP5QWUAAeapB?format=jpg&name=large

[RC_Drunkford]

Mitch the bitch is sabotaging his career at this point. He won‘t win it playing 12 minutes per game.

[Obstructed_View]

tha fuk is andscape?
ESPN-funded diversity project.

[ZeusWillJudge]

ROY is more than an honor. It's been a much better indicator of a good career than being the #1 draft pick. In the first 50 years of the award, I think 30 ROY's have made the HOF. (And most of the ones after that aren't eligible for the HOF yet.) Most of the ROY winners who didn't make the HOF still wound up being household names with good, long careers. Winning the ROY all but guarantees that a player will get a larger salary bump when his rookie deal is up. (Or a max extension after year 3.) Barring injury or Josh Primo level stupidity, winning that award is money in the bank. It's even a plus at the end of a player's career when it comes to HOF consideration. And you can't get a second chance to win it. (Yeah, yeah, Holmgren got a chance because his injury came so early in his first "rookie" season.)

Castle was a lock for ROY if he kept starting and performed anything like he had been. He won the Rising Stars MVP award. How could he not feel like he's had the rug pulled out from under him? He has. He earned that spot in the starting lineup, and now with Wemby out, and the chance of even making the play-in being slim to none? Developing young players is a total no-brainer priority. Come up with a rotation that has Castle starting. If he plays so well that the Spurs win some games and don't improve their lottery pick, you live with that because of what it means for next season. People here love to talk about how good the Spurs are to their players. Taking the ROY away from Castle with nothing to possibly gain isn't that. But, hey, maybe not winning ROY will help him get over himself.

Then again, maybe the Spurs are competing with the Mavs for who gets to move to Vegas.

[cutewizard]

We can still play Castle a lot right? and tank

so whats the p[roblem

[RC_Drunkford]

We can still play Castle a lot right? and tank

so whats the p[roblem

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GjzSQJ5XgAAkCqb?format=jpg&name=small

[Ice009]

I didn't want to keep commenting on this as I got so angry last week or the week before, but the Spurs are going to lose all their good players if they keep doing this kind of stuff.

What exactly are they trying to do? Get Vassell going? Get Keldon going? What exactly are they trying to do? They're a lottery team. Mitch is acting like they're a playoff team fighting for seeding, so he yanks the rookie for mistakes like they're playing for seeding and wins.
They're not, so you should be playing your most promising players to get them experience. It could still be to do with Chris Paul. It could be the promise that keeps giving. Maybe he signed because a. he'd start and b. was told we're going to make a playoff push, so maybe Mitch is outright trying to win games.

Then again, maybe Mitch is trying to win games because he wants that for himself and his career. I can't fault the guy for that as he's probably trying/fighting to keep the job.

[spursparker9]

tbh at this stage I don't care anymore on Castle's min :lol

As long as Spurs keep losing and increase the odds to get Flagg

[Pauleta14]

tbh at this stage I don't care anymore on Castle's min :lol

As long as Spurs keep losing and increase the odds to get Flagg

We can do it while building the future. Not by giving Cp3 so much pt

Let Castle make mistakes ffs. He gets the vet treatment when he's the future of the Franchise smh

[Raven]

He needs to focus on defending and play making. His penetration is already good enough, his finishing around the rim very solid, and the shooting form is perfectly acceptable. His D has been uneven to flat out bad, mostly he's been struggling to block anybody he's guarding, we have not seen any charges taken either. Very good at running around the screen, and seems to be able to read offenses well, which is promising. Play making, meaning actually setting the play, moving in the right spots and playing the pick and roll has been practically nonexistent so far, instead he has mostly shown us a kirby bryant style of playing, which is of course very bad.

[exstatic]

tbh at this stage I don't care anymore on Castle's min :lol

As long as Spurs keep losing and increase the odds to get Flagg

If they’re really going to tank, they need to shut down Fox, and do his hand surgery.

[John B]

If they’re really going to tank, they need to shut down Fox, and do his hand surgery.

I think the writing is on the wall. They cannot keep losing and Fox looking he made a mistake coming here. I just don’t know what tanking means to CP3 who obviously came here to play. It’s his best interest really if they embrace the tank, get Castle going, get high draft picks and get Wemby back on his 3rd year. Resign CP3 with 2-years extension. He’ll get his chance on a ring with Spurs if things go well.

[Ice009]

He needs to focus on defending and play making. His penetration is already good enough, his finishing around the rim very solid, and the shooting form is perfectly acceptable. His D has been uneven to flat out bad, mostly he's been struggling to block anybody he's guarding, we have not seen any charges taken either. Very good at running around the screen, and seems to be able to read offenses well, which is promising. Play making, meaning actually setting the play, moving in the right spots and playing the pick and roll has been practically nonexistent so far, instead he has mostly shown us a kirby bryant style of playing, which is of course very bad.

I don't disagree with anything you said, but there's guys on the team that were playing worse than him that have been given longer leashes. Sure, Castle isn't playing well right now, but there are guys that were playing worse than him most of the season still getting minutes.



I think the writing is on the wall. They cannot keep losing and Fox looking he made a mistake coming here. I just don’t know what tanking means to CP3 who obviously came here to play. It’s his best interest really if they embrace the tank, get Castle going, get high draft picks and get Wemby back on his 3rd year. Resign CP3 with 2-years extension. He’ll get his chance on a ring with Spurs if things go well.

I mean, that sounds good, but I think CP3 thinks he's similar to Lebron and should be starting no matter what. I don't have any other way to explain it, but it seems that he feels he should start no matter what age he is. Like another poster mentioned earlier in the season, he'd have to have a huge ego and be ultra competitive to have become the player he is and doesn't seem to want to let go. This is when I coach has to make a hard decision, but it looks like Mitch doesn't have the guts to do it (the other issue is, CP probably thinks he knows better than Mitch anyway).

[Kevin]

Hate to go tinfoil hat but there almost have to be behavioral issues or an injury they're not disclosing. Rookie wall doesn't make sense with his minutes declining the moment his jumper is fixed. There's no way the staff is this dumb either. Something is going on behind the scenes that we don't know about.

[ginobilized]

It's like he flipped off a ref on national tv or something.

Going from the ASG to this is a serious mindfuck for a 20 yr old. Perhaps something went down attitude-wise behind the scenes that is being dealt with by taking his minutes away. If not, there are potentially big mistakes being made here. Developing players is trying to put them in situations that they can succeed. The bigger picture here is that Mitch is not the guy to take this team to the next level. But, that's a whole 'other story.

I hope Castle gets some minutes tonight. Like more than 12 mins.

[tim_duncan_fan]

The biggest reason this sucks is that Castle is THE reason to watch the team, if he shows hints at being an all-star. Granted, his last couple of outings did not look great.

[baseline bum]

It's like he flipped off a ref on national tv or something.

Going from the ASG to this is a serious mindfuck for a 20 yr old. Perhaps something went down attitude-wise behind the scenes that is being dealt with by taking his minutes away. If not, there are potentially big mistakes being made here. Developing players is trying to put them in situations that they can succeed. The bigger picture here is that Mitch is not the guy to take this team to the next level. But, that's a whole 'other story.

I hope Castle gets some minutes tonight. Like more than 12 mins.

Nah occam's razor, the coach is a shithead. Look how he benched Castle that game in Philly last month when he was 7 for 9 and shredding the Sixers. He has pulled this crap multiple times when Castle was having a strong game and it makes no motherfucking sense.

[baseline bum]

The biggest reason this sucks is that Castle is THE reason to watch the team, if he shows hints at being an all-star. Granted, his last couple of outings did not look great.

For me Fox and Castle are the entire reason to keep watching. Spurs haven't had a guard as good as Fox in a decade. But I still want De'Aaron to just get his surgery over with, hell get it done on company time, and then be ready to hit the ground running with Victor and Co (and hopefully some more vets) next season.

[dn0774]

These crazy swings in effectiveness Castle is going through are just classic NBA guard development. Steph has shown enough where you can tell something awesome is there, it’s just going to be some major ups and downs until we get some consistency. Either way, he needs minutes/reps and legit coaching to push through it.

[baseline bum]

Hate to go tinfoil hat but there almost have to be behavioral issues or an injury they're not disclosing. Rookie wall doesn't make sense with his minutes declining the moment his jumper is fixed. There's no way the staff is this dumb either. Something is going on behind the scenes that we don't know about.

I can't imagine someone coming from Hurley's program being anything but a great teammate and we have never seen anything but that from Steph in-game.

[baseline bum]

These crazy swings in effectiveness Castle is going through are just classic NBA guard development. Steph has shown enough where you can tell something awesome is there, it’s just going to be some major ups and downs until we get some consistency. Either way, he needs minutes/reps and legit coaching to push through it.

Yeah even with the ups and downs I'd still take him #1 in a redraft, just like I had him #1 on my board on draft day too. And I'm definitely more excited about Steph now than I was then, as I didn't know he was quite as good an athlete as he's showing himself to be in the NBA. Still the most excited I have been about a non-alien Spurs rookie since Kawhi, or maybe even since Manu. LOL I still remember when we'd be furious at Pop for not playing Manu enough his rookie year either. :lol

[LakerHater]

https://images4.imagebam.com/73/45/e0/MEZXIZJ_o.gif

[cutewizard]

We need insider info

[cutewizard]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBlID-086sE

[cutewizard]

very good moves in this game

developing by leaps and bounds

[cutewizard]

magnificent game by Castle today, incredible

[Chomag]

This kid just flat out plays

[cutewizard]

He is developing those skills

He's gonna be our third star

[spursparker9]

Mitch will reward Castle with 10min for next game :lol

[illusioNtEk]

He is developing those skills

He's gonna be our third star

This will be Castle's team.... not Wemba....

[John B]

This will be Castle's team.... not Wemba....

Our new Big 3. They perfectly complement each other on both ends of the floor. But I really like Castle as a rookie already leading the team in free throw attempts, which eventually will play significantly in FO situations. All 3 relishes the clutch situation and seem to get better. I’m really excited about Castle making those long 3’s, and more mid-range on top of those hesi-moves and Castle will be very hard to defend. Great stuff.

[exstatic]

Our new Big 3. They perfectly complement each other on both ends of the floor. But I really like Castle as a rookie already leading the team in free throw attempts, which eventually will play significantly in FO situations. All 3 relishes the clutch situation and seem to get better. I’m really excited about Castle making those long 3’s, and more mid-range on top of those hesi-moves and Castle will be very hard to defend. Great stuff.

He leads all NBA rookies, but both Victor and Fox have more FTA/game.

[SupremeGuy]

Wemby has more natural gifts but Castle seems like he's got a lot more fire in him.

If we don't play him enough to win ROTY he's going to hold it against us, rightfully so.

[LeBowen]

He leads all NBA rookies, but both Victor and Fox have more FTA/game.

Only because they play more minutes.

If you look at per36, Castle is at 5 FTA, Fox is at 4.9 and Wemby is at 4.


Also, Spurs are 1-9 when Castle plays less than 19 minutes.
14-17 when he plays 19 to 30 minutes.
9-8 when he plays more than 30 minutes.

[John B]

Only because they play more minutes.

If you look at per36, Castle is at 5 FTA, Fox is at 4.9 and Wemby is at 4.


Also, Spurs are 1-9 when Castle plays less than 19 minutes.
14-17 when he plays 19 to 30 minutes.
9-8 when he plays more than 30 minutes.

If Castle’s trajectory continues, he is built for playoffs with his ability to bait free throws at score at will. It’s really a bright future for Spurs fans. I fully expect the FO to be ALL IN from here on, with no stones left unturned.

[Obstructed_View]

Wemby has more natural gifts but Castle seems like he's got a lot more fire in him.

If we don't play him enough to win ROTY he's going to hold it against us, rightfully so.
I like both of them. They are competitors, they both work hard, and they will both get better. Now the Spurs need to be drafting solid role players to put around them.

[dn0774]

Wemby has more natural gifts but Castle seems like he's got a lot more fire in him.

If we don't play him enough to win ROTY he's going to hold it against us, rightfully so.

Maybe its cope but I cant help but give Wemby a mulligan for his play after the new year knowing what we know now about his medical situation. He simply went from playing near MVP level basketball to being fatigued in the first 3 minutes of games. Chalk it up to allergies, flu/illness, blood clot situation or a combination of all 3, it was a perfect storm of awfulness.

Playing with his usual passion and fire is tough when you aren't right.

[tim_duncan_fan]

If that 3 ball comes along, he is gong to be something serious.

On another note, getting him the ROY should be the team's goal, as it is the only thing to play for now.

1. We should not be trying to win games so...

...2. If we win games, it should be because Castle was good that game, and when that is the case, you live with it.

[Knoxxx]

Castle just outscored SGA in same minutes. Now any defense he played on either SGA or J Williams deserves a flogging. I mostly fast forwarded through the other team’s baskets so can’t really say. BTW, Sochan is who I recalled being our best SGA stopper in the past.

[exstatic]

Castle just outscored SGA in same minutes. Now any defense he played on either SGA or J Williams deserves a flogging. I mostly fast forwarded through the other team’s baskets so can’t really say. BTW, Sochan is who I recalled being our best SGA stopper in the past.

When Sochan rested the 4th, OKC just repeatedly ran a high drag screen to get Castle in a switch, and off SGA. It was a good move, because Castle would be one of the few guards SGA can’t bully in the paint.

[tim_duncan_fan]

I believe Steph will be the team's general, the culture-setter, the vocal leader.

[scott]

I believe Steph will be the team's general, the culture-setter, the vocal leader.

Was Steph very vocal at UConn? He seems like the quiet "lead by example" type.

[exstatic]

Was Steph very vocal at UConn? He seems like the quiet "lead by example" type.

Not likely, because he was a freshman joining the defending national champs.

At least he’s not a robot like whozits. Seems to interact well with his teammates.

[Knoxxx]

When Sochan rested the 4th, OKC just repeatedly ran a high drag screen to get Castle in a switch, and off SGA. It was a good move, because Castle would be one of the few guards SGA can’t bully in the paint.

If you recall last year Sochan proved highly capable of checking SGA 1 v 1.

[Knoxxx]

Castle is running away with it:

https://www.si.com/nba/draft/newsfeed/san-antonio-spurs-stephon-castle-running-away-as-rookie-of-the-year-favorite

[scott]

Had an opportunity early last season to get Castle at +1800 when I was in Vegas... had a $100 bet queued up but decided against it at the last minute :lol

Reminder: never take any betting advice from me

[Seventyniner]

Had an opportunity early last season to get Castle at +1800 when I was in Vegas... had a $100 bet queued up but decided against it at the last minute :lol

Reminder: never take any betting advice from me

I did the same with Wemby +2500 to lead the league in blocks last season.

[John B]

Castle with game high 25 points in 26 mins, 2-5 from 3 in a losing effort

[Ice009]

Seriously, though, why can't he get more minutes. Under 30 minutes just isn't right. And why can't he start? Your best players should be starting (unless you're overloaded with good players and trying to balance out the team, which the Spurs are not).

[spursparker9]

I am fine with him not starting but his min should be at least 28, 29 mins+

[quentin_compson]

I have to say I don't quite get some of the hand-wringing here regarding Castle supposedly not having a big enough role on this team. He is sixth in minutes per game among all rookies this season - sure, he could and maybe should play a bit more, but his playing time is not egregiously low.
Also, Castle has by far the highest usage in his rookie class. Per statmuse (https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/highest-usage-rate-by-a-nba-rookie), he is at 25%, much much higher than the second-placed Jaylen Wells, who is at 16.1%. As of now, Castle also tops the list of most FGA per game with 11.3, narrowly edging out Sarr (11.2). So even though Castle is still a really inefficient player overall (his TS % has been ticking upwards since February, though), I would say the Spurs are already giving him quite a big role on both sides of the court.

[jjspur]

Ever since Wemby went down, Castle has stepped up his game to the point he's looking better than our other players who have years of experience. I expect Castle to have an even more prominent role next year, possibly being a full time starter. That's how much he has impressed. A ROY award will just be a feather in his cap. Well on his way to being a top 3 spurs player.

[exstatic]

Seriously, though, why can't he get more minutes. Under 30 minutes just isn't right. And why can't he start? Your best players should be starting (unless you're overloaded with good players and trying to balance out the team, which the Spurs are not).

During the championship window,both Bruce Bowen and Danny Green started over Manu.

[dn0774]

Seriously, though, why can't he get more minutes. Under 30 minutes just isn't right. And why can't he start? Your best players should be starting (unless you're overloaded with good players and trying to balance out the team, which the Spurs are not).

He woulda had more minutes last night but he fouled out from playing lazy matador defense. I am expecting Fox to be shut down any day now that he got some legit home games in and his Sacto return, that should open a spot for Castle to start (watch Mitch troll and start Champ or Sochan lol).

[tim_duncan_fan]

Ever since Wemby went down, Castle has stepped up his game to the point he's looking better than our other players who have years of experience. I expect Castle to have an even more prominent role next year, possibly being a full time starter. That's how much he has impressed. A ROY award will just be a feather in his cap. Well on his way to being a top 3 spurs player.

Already my favorite player.

Every time he goes 40% from 3, it feels like a kid just showed me their report card with straight 'A's.

[exstatic]

Ever since Wemby went down, Castle has stepped up his game to the point he's looking better than our other players who have years of experience. I expect Castle to have an even more prominent role next year, possibly being a full time starter. That's how much he has impressed. A ROY award will just be a feather in his cap. Well on his way to being a top 3 spurs player.
It actually started with this cancelled fire game with the Lakers. He went into the gym, and put up hundreds of 3 s each day, and he shot better afterwards, step #1.

[buttsR4rebounding]

It actually started with this cancelled fire game with the Lakers. He went into the gym, and put up hundreds of 3 s each day, and he shot better afterwards, step #1.

That should be a normal occurrence. If you are averaging 5 shots per minute (which is pretty slow) it takes an hour to put up 300 shots. With the importance of the 3 in today’s game why isn’t this the norm for almost everyone on the team?

[exstatic]

That should be a normal occurrence. If you are averaging 5 shots per minute (which is pretty slow) it takes an hour to put up 300 shots. With the importance of the 3 in today’s game why isn’t this the norm for almost everyone on the team?
You rarely get 3-4 unexpected unscheduled days during the season. Most young guys would have used the opportunity in LA to party.

[Ice009]

During the championship window,both Bruce Bowen and Danny Green started over Manu.

You didn't highlight the last bit of my post. I said unless you're overloaded with good players or trying to balance out the team, he should start. I do not think that applies to this current team at all like it did with a lot of the teams Manu played on.

The Spurs had much better rosters when Manu played, and the balance was better with him coming off the bench. It was better for him to come off the bench where he could get more touches and run the offense more. It would have cancelled out the effectiveness of TD, Manu and Tony if they all started together as there wasn't enough touches to go around between 3 high level players like that. Another reason, I'm sure you'll remember is that Manu always played all out, so bringing him off the bench limited his minutes a little bit to try and save some wear and tear on his body. It was actually pretty smart bringing him off the bench as most player's egos wouldn't have allowed that, but fortunately, Manu cared about winning more than anything else. He was also the closer and had the ball in his hands a lot at the end of games, so again, for anyone coming off the bench, I don't think you can ask for more than that.

Big, big difference between this current Spurs team and the ones Manu played on. This current Spurs team without Victor, Castle is either our best or second best player. I stand by what I said. He should not be coming off the bench getting less minutes than inferior players on a team lacking talent and high BBIQ players. It doesn't make sense to me at all. This is nothing like Manu coming in off the bench. This team is nowhere close to a championship team or filled with high BBIQ players. Castle some games hasn't gotten crunch time minutes or had the ball in his hands at the end of the game to learn what to do in those situations. Why not give him those opportunities to learn now that he's shown he's legit (I can understand at the start of the season not giving him those touches and minutes, but what about now with Steph showing what he can do and Victor out? Why isn't it the number one priority?)? Some of the guys on the team that are/were getting those minutes ahead of him may be lost causes due to all the bad teams and possible tanking of previous years (I don't know if they ever outright tanked or just didn't have the talent to win games previous seasons), and also not being coached up hard (I believe the coaching was pretty lax with hardly any emphasis on defense). I don't see why the Spurs are wasting time on those players. They've had long enough to prove themselves, so why not give the minutes to someone that is looking like a stud/someone that can become an all-star level player?

Why not give him those minutes now that the season appears to be lost with Victor being out for the rest of the season and De'Aaron possibly being out soon too if he gets the surgery on his finger.
Maybe the Spurs are still trying to make the play-in, and if so, I guess I can understand them wanting to go with the more veteran players, but if they're not trying to make the play-in, what are they trying to do?

[exstatic]

You didn't highlight the last bit of my post. I said unless you're overloaded with good players or trying to balance out the team, he should start. I do not think that applies to this current team at all like it did with a lot of the teams Manu played on.

The Spurs had much better rosters when Manu played, and the balance was better with him coming off the bench. It was better for him to come off the bench where he could get more touches and run the offense more. It would have cancelled out the effectiveness of TD, Manu and Tony if they all started together as there wasn't enough touches to go around between 3 high level players like that. Another reason, I'm sure you'll remember is that Manu always played all out, so bringing him off the bench limited his minutes a little bit to try and save some wear and tear on his body. It was actually pretty smart bringing him off the bench as most player's egos wouldn't have allowed that, but fortunately, Manu cared about winning more than anything else. He was also the closer and had the ball in his hands a lot at the end of games, so again, for anyone coming off the bench, I don't think you can ask for more than that.

Big, big difference between this current Spurs team and the ones Manu played on. This current Spurs team without Victor, Castle is either our best or second best player. I stand by what I said. He should not be coming off the bench getting less minutes than inferior players on a team lacking talent and high BBIQ players. It doesn't make sense to me at all. This is nothing like Manu coming in off the bench. This team is nowhere close to a championship team or filled with high BBIQ players. Castle some games hasn't gotten crunch time minutes or had the ball in his hands at the end of the game to learn what to do in those situations. Why not give him those opportunities to learn now that he's shown he's legit (I can understand at the start of the season not giving him those touches and minutes, but what about now with Steph showing what he can do and Victor out? Why isn't it the number one priority?)? Some of the guys on the team that are/were getting those minutes ahead of him may be lost causes due to all the bad teams and possible tanking of previous years (I don't know if they ever outright tanked or just didn't have the talent to win games previous seasons), and also not being coached up hard (I believe the coaching was pretty lax with hardly any emphasis on defense). I don't see why the Spurs are wasting time on those players. They've had long enough to prove themselves, so why not give the minutes to someone that is looking like a stud/someone that can become an all-star level player?

Why not give him those minutes now that the season appears to be lost with Victor being out for the rest of the season and De'Aaron possibly being out soon too if he gets the surgery on his finger.
Maybe the Spurs are still trying to make the play-in, and if so, I guess I can understand them wanting to go with the more veteran players, but if they're not trying to make the play-in, what are they trying to do?

I think he’ll absolutely get the minutes when Fox gets shut down. I’m sure one of the reasons he wasn’t starting was spacing. He and Sochan kind of fuck that all up.

[rascal]

You rarely get 3-4 unexpected unscheduled days during the season. Most young guys would have used the opportunity in LA to party.

Castle has a strong work ethic and a strong desire to win. He'll sacrifice his stats for the best of the team. That's what he did at UCONN.

[Ice009]

I think he’ll absolutely get the minutes when Fox gets shut down. I’m sure one of the reasons he wasn’t starting was spacing. He and Sochan kind of fuck that all up.

I think that might for sure have been a legitimate reason earlier in the season, but as you said, NBA players don't normally have time to work on their shots, and/or some would have spent those extra days off partying in LA, but thankfully Castle isn't one of those guys. With that work he's put in, I feel like his shot has really improved enough for him to start. I just want to see him have more repetitions with it and get more confident in-game with it.

He definitely has had a few bad games these past few weeks, and as mentioned, his defense was poor in the Sacramento game, and I'd be fine with benching because of that, but it's mostly that I see other players get a pass for bad defense, turnovers, bad play overall, I wonder why he's not treated to the same standards. Maybe they believe in him more and are holding him more accountable to try and get him to become a better player, and the other guys that are getting passes are eventually going to be traded or let go?

Jeremy on the other hand, like I said earlier in the season, I still feel those one handed free throws are retarding his overall progress (it helped a little bit by getting his left hand off the ball - you did mention this earlier this season, but I think it's had diminishing returns anywhere outside of the free throw line), as when he shoots a two handed jump shot, it just does not look good at all. I am glad some have gone in just for his own confidence, but going forward, his shot needs to get much quicker and without that hitch if he ever wants to start and be a valuable player in crunch time. He seems like a good guy and a hard worker and I can't help but feel they've done him a disserve with the shooting coach and program they've put him on. I believe someone like Chip would have helped Sochan get much better results if he were the one teaching him to shoot.

[Manu-of-steel]

Castle getting minutes, with great result! He'a dawg!

[cutewizard]

https://youtu.be/-3MVNR7hiTM?si=fq9ij_lUBB0JHBHU

[cutewizard]

Castle has the spirit of Manu

A fighter's fighter!

The Black Ginobilllllllll

[TrainOfThought5]

That should be a normal occurrence. If you are averaging 5 shots per minute (which is pretty slow) it takes an hour to put up 300 shots. With the importance of the 3 in today’s game why isn’t this the norm for almost everyone on the team?

why are 21 year old millionaires spending their weekends in LA enjoying beautiful whores and cinematic nightlife lifestyles?
when you were 21 what would you have chosen?

[LeBowen]

Considering how much he's been getting to the line, improving his FT% should be the priority.
Just 72% for the season, 67% over the past 6 games, 22/33.
It doesn't really matter this season, but we'll need him to shoot 80%+ when we actually start competing.
Considering his ability to draw fouls, he can't be leaving so many points on the line.

[Raven]

i'm not sure about his long term development anymore..

[LeBowen]

i'm not sure about his long term development anymore..

Good thing that your concerns are completely irrelevant.

[Raven]

Good thing that your concerns are completely irrelevant.

since you asked... i'm not sure anymore he'll develop as a pg, he's now fully playing as a sga like combo guard.

[spurraider21]

since you asked... i'm not sure anymore he'll develop as a pg, he's now fully playing as a sga like combo guard.
who runs point for OKC?

[objective]

Pretty good in March so far

5 games

29mpg
23.6 pts
4.8 rebounds
4.6 assists
5.8 fta but still only shooting 65.5%
32.1% from 3, still his best month so far on 5.6 attempts volume

[scott]

i'm not sure about his long term development anymore..

it's a good thing Vassell is "very good, consistently" - right?

[Raven]

who runs point for OKC?

beats me... why does it matter?

[spursistan]

Another instance of Castle's straight bully-ball.

Like TD 21 (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=17781) mentioned in his thread, one of the most under-discussed topics about this roster is the general lack of physicality and strength at every position. The fact that a 20-year-old rookie has fastly become their most 'imposing' presence/threat off the drive is quite telling.

https://x.com/RealPjHoops/status/1899105496298353141
https://x.com/PaulGarciaNBA/status/1898956630659563605
https://x.com/RealPjHoops/status/1899105496298353141
https://x.com/PaulGarciaNBA/status/1898956630659563605

[exstatic]

Another instance of Castle's straight bully-ball.

Like TD 21 (https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=17781) mentioned in his thread, one of the most under-discussed topics about this roster is the general lack of physicality and strength at every position. The fact that a 20-year-old rookie has fastly become their most 'imposing' presence/threat off the drive is quite telling.

https://x.com/RealPjHoops/status/1899105496298353141
https://x.com/PaulGarciaNBA/status/1898956630659563605
https://x.com/RealPjHoops/status/1899105496298353141
https://x.com/PaulGarciaNBA/status/1898956630659563605

Links aren’t working. Throwing a twitter error.

[KingKev]

Hahah Steph caught some rookie hazing. No popcorn in the whip, his teammates legit jacked all 4 of the rims of his Supra. They ain’t even put the shit on blocks. Had his car sitting on on the rotors lolz

[cutewizard]

Stephon got this

[spursistan]

This is a 23-games sample size by the way. I won't be surprised if Castle is an 18 ppg guy on better efficiency next season.

For what is widely considered the weakest draft class in more than 20 years, the Spurs really hit a home run with the 4th pick (the equivalent of 10-12th pick in a normal/strong draft)

https://x.com/StatMamba/status/1902025564753436956

[RC_Drunkford]

He already looks like he‘ll average 20 in his sleep. If the shooting comes around watch out

[spurraider21]

that 55.5 TS% split up has him shooting 46.5/31.6/71.6 during that stretch

[Uriel]

At this point, what is Castle’s ceiling?

[couchman]

At this point, what is Castle’s ceiling?

It still depends on this shooting.
Even during this recent stretch of good counting stats he is shooting 32% from 3 and 68% on free throws.
If he learns how to shoot his ceiling is all star, maybe even all-NBA.
If he doesn’t he’s a Marcus Smart level role player which is nice but not great.

[LeBowen]

It still depends on this shooting.
Even during this recent stretch of good counting stats he is shooting 32% from 3 and 68% on free throws.
If he learns how to shoot his ceiling is all star, maybe even all-NBA.
If he doesn’t he’s a Marcus Smart level role player which is nice but not great.

Jimmy was all-NBA while shooting less than 25% from 3PT.

Getting his FTs to ~80% should be his priority. He's great at getting to the line, can't leave so many free points there.
Since New Year, Castle is at 31% from 3PT on 150 attempts, I'm not worried about his shot.

His finishing in the paint will develop naturally with experience and strength, as will his passing. I wouldn't be too worried about turnovers because we have no consistency with our lineups and a lot of those are about communication.

If he gets the starting spot next season, he should easily average 18/5/5.

[Em-City]

Jimmy was all-NBA while shooting less than 25% from 3PT.

Getting his FTs to ~80% should be his priority. He's great at getting to the line, can't leave so many free points there.
Since New Year, Castle is at 31% from 3PT on 150 attempts, I'm not worried about his shot.

His finishing in the paint will develop naturally with experience and strength, as will his passing. I wouldn't be too worried about turnovers because we have no consistency with our lineups and a lot of those are about communication.

If he gets the starting spot next season, he should easily average 18/5/5.
I was thinking the same thing - lots of Jimmy butler similarities

[RC_Drunkford]

At this point, what is Castle’s ceiling?

Jimmy Butler, Dwayne Wade, SGA

[ginobilized]

Castle's shooting has improved already, in front of our very eyes.
I have no reason to think that he won't continue to improve. Hitting a few more 3s (compared to earlier in the season) has opened up his driving game even more and he can get into the paint and outmuscle most players in the league. As a rookie. He's tough as nails.
ROY and an absolute home run for the Spurs. We need Mr. Wright to become the Reggie Jackson of bball GMs and get another home run (or two) in June.

[spursparker9]

Jimmy Butler, Dwayne Wade, SGA

SGA is different tier from D-wade and Jimmy tbh

[exstatic]

It still depends on this shooting.
Even during this recent stretch of good counting stats he is shooting 32% from 3 and 68% on free throws.
If he learns how to shoot his ceiling is all star, maybe even all-NBA.
If he doesn’t he’s a Marcus Smart level role player which is nice but not great.

Marcus Smart could never get to the hoop like Steph. His floor is higher than Smart.

[Ice009]

IMO Stephon has already shown more in his rookie year than a lot of other great players did in their rookie years. I think Steph has been better than Butler (maybe even better compared to Butler's first two years), Kawhi (not on defense), SGA were in their rookie years.
Doesn't mean he will continue to progress to their levels, but it's a good sign that I think he has the potential to get somewhere close if he keeps working hard and improving.

LeBowen had at great point that one of the main priorities is to improve his free throw shooting as he gets to the line quite a bit, can't keep leaving points on the table there.

[RC_Drunkford]

SGA is different tier from D-wade and Jimmy tbh

That’s why I mentioned them in that order. Low to high

[Ice009]

While SGA looks like he's a better player than D-Wade overall (I can't remember the highest D-Wade finished in MVP voting in his best years), not sure how you can put him in a higher tier when D-Wade has led a team to a Championship (in a more physical era) and also been a 1b. in multiple other Championships. He's also been a playoff performer which SGA hasn't consistently shown yet.

Until SGA does more in the playoffs and wins at least one Championship, I can't rank him higher than a prime D-Wade.

[LeBowen]

SGA is different tier from D-wade and Jimmy tbh

I really dislike Wade, but he averaged 27/5/7 on 48% FG over his 5 peak seasons. And played even better in the playoffs.
SGA is at 31/5/6 on 52% over his past 3 years, I don't think there's much of a difference between them, you can attribute that 4% FG difference to different eras.

Jimmy isn't in the same tier offensively, but he was a better defender and a big game performer. Same could be said about peak Wade, I wouldn't rate SGA before we see how he does in these playoffs, because he's got only two series behind him as a first option.


Castle will hopefully never be the first option (it would mean either Wemby or him are gone), I don't see that many similarities with Wade, it's more of Jimmy/Jrue for me.
22/6/6 with elite defense at his peak would be amazing. Easily achievable considering his personality and work ethic, imo.

[baseline bum]

This is a 23-games sample size by the way. I won't be surprised if Castle is an 18 ppg guy on better efficiency next season.

For what is widely considered the weakest draft class in more than 20 years, the Spurs really hit a home run with the 4th pick (the equivalent of 10-12th pick in a normal/strong draft)

https://x.com/StatMamba/status/1902025564753436956

Kinda weird how much these odds are fluctuating. A couple of days ago Bovada had Steph at -1100 for ROY. Now it's -700, with Sarr and Risacher both tied at +1500 for second place.

https://www.bovada.lv/sports/basketball/nba-awards-league-leaders/futures-odd

[R. DeMurre]

It's funny how people go back and forth between the eye test, raw stats, and impact stats-- I know I'm always trying to find a balance there, but sometimes we look for the best "evidence" to back up our already maybe slightly biased views. I love the way Castle looks on court-- the confidence, the aggression, the driving, passing, and defense-- but his overall impact numbers are relatively bad, with a negative BPM and a big net negative of -16 on his ORtg/Drtg of 104/120. This isn't completely uncommon with 20 yr old rookies, but I can't say it doesn't worry me at least a little bit. I'd bet his impact stats take a significant leap next year along with his raw stats... if they don't, then it'll turn into a much more interesting debate.

[spurraider21]

rookies tend to have efficiency/turnover issues and so they rarely show well with advanced stats. and to be fair, its not like his defense has been anything special for the last few weeks either.

but when you are trying to see if his game translates to the pro level, if his bullyball tendencies would work against bigger/stronger athletes, its pretty clear it does. his handles are better than i expected.

its still an open question of how big a role he will end up being good at. its possible that his game simply doesnt scale up well, and he shouldnt be shooting as much as he is right now. but the early returns are promising. the kid is good enough, but he has to work out a lot of th warts in his game.

[Ice009]

rookies tend to have efficiency/turnover issues and so they rarely show well with advanced stats. and to be fair, its not like his defense has been anything special for the last few weeks either.

but when you are trying to see if his game translates to the pro level, if his bullyball tendencies would work against bigger/stronger athletes, its pretty clear it does. his handles are better than i expected.

its still an open question of how big a role he will end up being good at. its possible that his game simply doesnt scale up well, and he shouldnt be shooting as much as he is right now. but the early returns are promising. the kid is good enough, but he has to work out a lot of th warts in his game.

He is definitely getting a lot of shots. I've been looking at that the past couple of weeks (even though he was in foul trouble last game, he still got up quite a few shots), so I wonder how he'd play if he gets less shots and had to up his efficiency.
One reason would be because he has the ball in his hands quite a bit since he can handle the ball better than most guys on the team. Not sure if you guys think he's been calling his own number a little too much lately and not passing it as much as he could be, or maybe he's just trying to get the Spurs back in the games as a lot of the guys on the team can't create for themselves. I don't know, he's a rookie, so the balance isn't quite there at this early stage of his development. I'm more than OK with it as I'd rather he try and develop as much as possible, but curious what you guys think about his balance between shooting and playmaking.

[spurraider21]

He is definitely getting a lot of shots. I've been looking at that the past couple of weeks (even though he was in foul trouble last game, he still got up quite a few shots), so I wonder how he'd play if he gets less shots and had to up his efficiency.
One reason would be because he has the ball in his hands quite a bit since he can handle the ball better than most guys on the team. Not sure if you guys think he's been calling his own number a little too much lately and not passing it as much as he could be, or maybe he's just trying to get the Spurs back in the games as a lot of the guys on the team can't create for themselves. I don't know, he's a rookie, so the balance isn't quite there at this early stage of his development. I'm more than OK with it as I'd rather he try and develop as much as possible, but curious what you guys think about his balance between shooting and playmaking.
its also easy to say "well theres no wemby or fox so he has to take on more, which would lead to efficiency issues" but his efficiency has been poor all season

[scott]

His biggest weakness is how he causes Vassell to miss so many wide open 3s. Until he cleans that up, he won't pass the eye test.

[Mr. Body]

I don't know how you can watch him play and make shit up about "the eye test." If there's a problem with Castle it's finishing overall. You can say that will improve, or not. Those are legitimate opinions.

It is not, however, a legitimate opinion to say he doesn't pass the eye test, because he absolutely does. It just means you don't know what you're looking at.

[exstatic]

I don't know how you can watch him play and make shit up about "the eye test." If there's a problem with Castle it's finishing overall. You can say that will improve, or not. Those are legitimate opinions.

It is not, however, a legitimate opinion to say he doesn't pass the eye test, because he absolutely does. It just means you don't know what you're looking at.
65% in the restricted area, so, maybe not so much. Finishing is one of his strong points.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Gotta put some RPG level-up points in the Shooting skill. These 40% overall percentage nights will hopefully happen less as he gets more time in the league.

[spurraider21]

being able to bully and score through Bridges + Anunoby... thats not normal

1902532007382352125

[ambchang]

Love castle and he has exceeded all I’ve expected of him in his rookie season. His outside shot is getting better and he has no concerning hesitation launching them, he can be a strong defensive player but advanced stats aren't backing that up yet. He’s playing one of the hardest roles to learn (lead guard, sort of) and seems to be getting a decent handle on it. No doubt castle is the right pick and likely the best player in the draft when viewed in a vacuum. But …

I’ve been excited about keldon, I’ve been excited about Vassell, then sochan (remember his rookie year when he showed so much promise?), and we all thought wemby would challenge for the mvp this year with his second half last year, but then keldon never learned defense, Vassell forgot about defense and forgot how to play offense either, sochan took a huge step back last year and is taking a little step forward this year with his ceiling falling line Tesla stocks did the last few months, and wemby came out of the gates this year struggling and not showing any marked improvements in his game. I’m not sure what PATFO will do to castle next year. Will they try him at PF to see if it can compliment wemby jacking 10 3s a game? Will they continue to stick him on the bench and play him 15 mins a game? Will they have a competent staff working on his shooting with him? Will they insist on playing him with a lineup of sochan, bassey, Wesley and keldon to make sure there is no spacing? I have no idea, but PATFO just plays so much 4D chess that the players are lost in another dimension.

[spurraider21]

Love castle and he has exceeded all I’ve expected of him in his rookie season. His outside shot is getting better and he has no concerning hesitation launching them, he can be a strong defensive player but advanced stats aren't backing that up yet. He’s playing one of the hardest roles to learn (lead guard, sort of) and seems to be getting a decent handle on it. No doubt castle is the right pick and likely the best player in the draft when viewed in a vacuum. But …

I’ve been excited about keldon, I’ve been excited about Vassell, then sochan (remember his rookie year when he showed so much promise?), and we all thought wemby would challenge for the mvp this year with his second half last year, but then keldon never learned defense, Vassell forgot about defense and forgot how to play offense either, sochan took a huge step back last year and is taking a little step forward this year with his ceiling falling line Tesla stocks did the last few months, and wemby came out of the gates this year struggling and not showing any marked improvements in his game. I’m not sure what PATFO will do to castle next year. Will they try him at PF to see if it can compliment wemby jacking 10 3s a game? Will they continue to stick him on the bench and play him 15 mins a game? Will they have a competent staff working on his shooting with him? Will they insist on playing him with a lineup of sochan, bassey, Wesley and keldon to make sure there is no spacing? I have no idea, but PATFO just plays so much 4D chess that the players are lost in another dimension.
our development program has been pretty ass for a while tbh. dejounte is the last guy i can remember who played his best here

[ace3g]

https://x.com/AirlessJordan/status/1902540176141779048

[CGD]

our development program has been pretty ass for a while tbh. dejounte is the last guy i can remember who played his best here

I dont know man, Keldon was the 29th pick for a reason and they developed him to the point that if you re-draft that class he's comfortably in the Top 10. I'd call that a win for the developers. Devin was on a really nice trajectory too before Victor got here, but has really regressed in the last 2 season. Feels mental. I don't understand the hate for Sochan, he's been great this year coming off that dumb PG experiment last season. Then add finds on the margins like Tre Jones (who helped grease the wheels for Fox) and Champ.

The turds in the punchbowl are obviously Blake and Malaki, who have shown flashes but can't ever seem to put the pieces together. Can't bat 100%.

[CGD]

^ Derrick at 29 was also another great development story even excluding all the great stuff he's done in Boston. Lonnie had that one good playoff game for the Lakers, but really also played his best ball here. That dude was always going to be limited though, and his post-Spurs career shows that.

[scott]

Love castle and he has exceeded all I’ve expected of him in his rookie season. His outside shot is getting better and he has no concerning hesitation launching them, he can be a strong defensive player but advanced stats aren't backing that up yet. He’s playing one of the hardest roles to learn (lead guard, sort of) and seems to be getting a decent handle on it. No doubt castle is the right pick and likely the best player in the draft when viewed in a vacuum. But …

I’ve been excited about keldon, I’ve been excited about Vassell, then sochan (remember his rookie year when he showed so much promise?), and we all thought wemby would challenge for the mvp this year with his second half last year, but then keldon never learned defense, Vassell forgot about defense and forgot how to play offense either, sochan took a huge step back last year and is taking a little step forward this year with his ceiling falling line Tesla stocks did the last few months, and wemby came out of the gates this year struggling and not showing any marked improvements in his game. I’m not sure what PATFO will do to castle next year. Will they try him at PF to see if it can compliment wemby jacking 10 3s a game? Will they continue to stick him on the bench and play him 15 mins a game? Will they have a competent staff working on his shooting with him? Will they insist on playing him with a lineup of sochan, bassey, Wesley and keldon to make sure there is no spacing? I have no idea, but PATFO just plays so much 4D chess that the players are lost in another dimension.

I get what you are saying, but neither Keldon, Vassell or Sochan showed anywhere near this kind of promise (Castle, after all, is the favorite to win ROTY, whereas none of those guys even earned All Rookie 2nd Team honors), and Wemby was in the Top 5 of the MVP Ladder this year for a pretty decent stretch before Sneezes and Blot Clots took over.

[scott]

I dont know man, Keldon was the 29th pick for a reason and they developed him to the point that if you re-draft that class he's comfortably in the Top 10. I'd call that a win for the developers. Devin was on a really nice trajectory too before Victor got here, but has really regressed in the last 2 season. Feels mental. I don't understand the hate for Sochan, he's been great this year coming off that dumb PG experiment last season. Then add finds on the margins like Tre Jones (who helped grease the wheels for Fox) and Champ.

The turds in the punchbowl are obviously Blake and Malaki, who have shown flashes but can't ever seem to put the pieces together. Can't bat 100%.

Now sure I'd say Sochan has been great this year. He's been okay. I'd even say "good enough" to continue to invest in with a reasonable contract. But great is a bit of a stretch. He still wouldn't be able to start for a playoff team (heck, he can't even start for this team). Just to put things in the proper context.


^ Derrick at 29 was also another great development story even excluding all the great stuff he's done in Boston. Lonnie had that one good playoff game for the Lakers, but really also played his best ball here. That dude was always going to be limited though, and his post-Spurs career shows that.

Derrick (and Dejounte) were brought up under a different development staff (but so were Lonnie and Luka, so it's not like that staff was batting 1.000)

[dn0774]

I dont know man, Keldon was the 29th pick for a reason and they developed him to the point that if you re-draft that class he's comfortably in the Top 10. I'd call that a win for the developers. Devin was on a really nice trajectory too before Victor got here, but has really regressed in the last 2 season. Feels mental. I don't understand the hate for Sochan, he's been great this year coming off that dumb PG experiment last season. Then add finds on the margins like Tre Jones (who helped grease the wheels for Fox) and Champ.

The turds in the punchbowl are obviously Blake and Malaki, who have shown flashes but can't ever seem to put the pieces together. Can't bat 100%.

I kinda liked Devin last year (Vic's rookie year), his most efficient season so far and he seemed to keep things a little simpler. Early on he kinda looked off Wemby a bit much for my liking but Wemby was an inefficient chucker those first 2 months so I kind of understood. Once it became obvious Wemby was the 1st option and Vassell was the 2nd option he fell in line more.

This year has clearly been a massive disappointment. Devin has 2 jobs in my view, get buckets and play average defense. He has sucked at both and his surgery is getting further and further in the rear view and can't be blamed at this point.

[ambchang]

I get what you are saying, but neither Keldon, Vassell or Sochan showed anywhere near this kind of promise (Castle, after all, is the favorite to win ROTY, whereas none of those guys even earned All Rookie 2nd Team honors), and Wemby was in the Top 5 of the MVP Ladder this year for a pretty decent stretch before Sneezes and Blot Clots took over.

Oh no doubt castle has shown more than keldon Vassell and sochan in their respective rookie years, I’m just worried about the trajectories. If castle has the same trajectory in his first 3 to 5 years like keldon, Vassell (actually regressed) or sochan did/are doing, we are talking about a borderline starter level player on a good team, which would be a disappointment as he seems to have the toolset to be an all star caliber player.

As for wemby, I remembered he started slow in November, then had a good stretch in December like he was going on a tear, then once the calendar flips to 2025 he fell off a cliff. I’d say he played like a top 5 in one month of the season, even before the blood clots he seemed to be struggling (by his standards). Perhaps I was being unrealistic but I was expecting him to play like December wemby throughout, aside from DVT. January and large parts of February seems more like Deep Mitch/Pop thrombosis.

[scott]

Oh no doubt castle has shown more than keldon Vassell and sochan in their respective rookie years, I’m just worried about the trajectories. If castle has the same trajectory in his first 3 to 5 years like keldon, Vassell (actually regressed) or sochan did/are doing, we are talking about a borderline starter level player on a good team, which would be a disappointment as he seems to have the toolset to be an all star caliber player.

As for wemby, I remembered he started slow in November, then had a good stretch in December like he was going on a tear, then once the calendar flips to 2025 he fell off a cliff. I’d say he played like a top 5 in one month of the season, even before the blood clots he seemed to be struggling (by his standards). Perhaps I was being unrealistic but I was expecting him to play like December wemby throughout, aside from DVT. January and large parts of February seems more like Deep Mitch/Pop thrombosis.

I'm with you on the concerns about development. Hopefully the FO recognizes this and makes changes to the development staff this offseason (ideally a whole new staff altogether, tbh). It's definitely a concern.

Re: Wemby, January he was clearly suffering from the allergies/flu/whatever... this is also something that definitely needs to be addressed. Every allergist in San Antonio should be working on this honestly :lol

[spurraider21]

^ Derrick at 29 was also another great development story even excluding all the great stuff he's done in Boston. Lonnie had that one good playoff game for the Lakers, but really also played his best ball here. That dude was always going to be limited though, and his post-Spurs career shows that.
derrick was solid here but blew up once he left

[lefty20]

derrick was solid here but blew up once he left

Different expectations, imo.

We expected him to be option 1 or 2 on a nightly basis. Bro was good, but not that good.

Celtics expect him to be option 3-5 on a nightly basis. It's a perfect situation for him.

[John B]

derrick was solid here but blew up once he left

Better talent around will get him open, better shooter to pass, etc. Nothing different with the Big 3 making Diaw resurrected his career once he got to the Spurs. I’m hoping Wemby, Fox and probably Castle would help improve the skills of everyone

[CGD]

I still miss Derrick, and am happy he was able to level up. He’s about all the right stuff.

[scott]

Different expectations, imo.

We expected him to be option 1 or 2 on a nightly basis. Bro was good, but not that good.

Celtics expect him to be option 3-5 on a nightly basis. It's a perfect situation for him.

Did we?

The year he was traded, DJM and Keldon were the first and second option.

The season before that, Demar was clearly the #1 option and Derrick only played 36 games and DJM was the second option.

Before that it was still Demar and LMA.

I can't think of a time where Derrick was realistically expected to be the 1st or 2nd option on this team.

[lefty20]

Did we?

The year he was traded, DJM and Keldon were the first and second option.

The season before that, Demar was clearly the #1 option and Derrick only played 36 games and DJM was the second option.

Before that it was still Demar and LMA.

I can't think of a time where Derrick was realistically expected to be the 1st or 2nd option on this team.

That's cuz White would often play passive af. Especially if he happened to start the game with a couple of clanks. I distinctly remember posters routinely begging him to be more aggressive in game threads.

It was clear to see that White was better than KJ and had the tools to be better than DJ.

Even if I'm completely wrong and just misremembering everything. It's much much easier to play option 3 on a stacked Celtics team than it was to do same on a mediocre to the core Spurs team. So, yeah he looks better on the Celtics.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Even if I'm completely wrong and just misremembering everything.

You aren't. Everyone from the fandom up through the top of the organization wanted Derrick to be more aggressive, but Derrick refused the reins, even after Pop anointed him onto Team USA. That was the "here are the keys if you want them" moment; D White just didn't take'em.

[ace3g]

He has 14 now.

https://x.com/AirlessJordan/status/1903267848350244948

[LeBowen]

Still hasn't passed the eye test, tbh.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Still hasn't passed the eye test, tbh.

Then smell test after that. How's his coffee-making?

[NASpurs]

Still hasn't passed the eye test, tbh.

A certain poster needs glasses.

[Raven]

i LOVEd how he played today. Some impact plays on D, some passing, some penetrating, no ballhogging and setting plays with purpose. All I want to see tbh.

[cutewizard]

I think we should create a Poll......."Does Castle pass the eye test?"

[cutewizard]

He is the Black Manuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu!

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Still hasn't passed the eye test, tbh.

You should probably get that checked out. Might have pink eye.

[Russ]

Still hasn't passed the eye test, tbh.

The eye test was the easy part for Castle. He had that from hello.

It's the meteoric rise in all statistical categories that's the most eye-popping. That and the winning which he seems to engender (perhaps unfortunately now) once he's in any starting five -- whether here or at UConn.

[LeBowen]

Oh ffs, it's a joke because a certain member has been shitting on Castle all season long with that phrase.

[Joseph Kony]

Should have had 25 points or so last night too, missed a lot of shots he normally makes. but he's got ROTY basically locked up at this point

[Russ]

Oh ffs, it's a joke because a certain member has been shitting on Castle all season long with that phrase.

This is a no joking zone (except in designated areas).

[Dex]

This is a no joking zone (except in designated areas).

Gotta use the blue font.

People here are too smart to understand sarcasm.

[Russ]

Gotta use the blue font.

People here are too smart to understand sarcasm.

My post wasn't good enough for blue font -- I know my limits.

[scott]

Can we pin to the page a running list of dumb shit people have said that are just memes at this point, and when repeated aren’t intended to be taken as actual opinions:

Zach Collins is having an objectively good season
Stephon Castle doesn’t pass the eye test
Devin Vassell is very good, consistently
Devin Vassell has turned a fucking corner

What am I missing?

[LeBowen]

Can we pin to the page a running list of dumb shit people have said that are just memes at this point, and when repeated aren’t intended to be taken as actual opinions:

Zach Collins is having an objectively good season
Stephon Castle doesn’t pass the eye test
Devin Vassell is very good, consistently
Devin Vassell has turned a fucking corner

What am I missing?

Fox is a midget who does nothing except for iso scoring.

[spurraider21]

Would you trade Sochan for Amen Thompson?

[Dex]

Can we pin to the page a running list of dumb shit people have said that are just memes at this point, and when repeated aren’t intended to be taken as actual opinions:

Zach Collins is having an objectively good season
Stephon Castle doesn’t pass the eye test
Devin Vassell is very good, consistently
Devin Vassell has turned a fucking corner

What am I missing?

Wemby's conditioning sucks because he was out of breath after being "sick"

[spurraider21]

His conditioning sucked well before the DVT

[Dex]

His conditioning sucked well before the DVT

He was averaging like 35 minutes before the All-Star Break while being expected to be the #1 option on offense and the #1 defender while averaging 24 and 11 with 4 blocks and 4 assists. Oh, and he's 7.5 freaking feet tall.

Are you mad because he wasn't playing 42 minutes a game? Welcome to the list.

[scott]

He was averaging like 35 minutes before the All-Star Break while being expected to be the #1 option on offense and the #1 defender while averaging 24 and 11 with 4 blocks and 4 assists. Oh, and he's 7.5 freaking feet tall.

Are you mad because he wasn't playing 42 minutes a game? Welcome to the list.

I think it's more about how he was consistently clearly gassed at the 7 minute mark of the first quarter. I think you bring up some good explanations, but his conditioning is a legit criticism. Not a major criticism, but it is a real one, IMO. Hopefully it is significantly mitigated by a better team around him and not requiring him to be superman every game.

[Dex]

Hopefully it is significantly mitigated by a better team around him and not requiring him to be superman every game.

I think this is the big thing. When he is on the court, he wants to do EVERYTHING...which is why he is such an amazing player.

But the human body is only capable of so much, especially at his size.

[Raven]

Can we pin to the page a running list of dumb shit people have said that are just memes at this point, and when repeated aren’t intended to be taken as actual opinions:

Zach Collins is having an objectively good season
Stephon Castle doesn’t pass the eye test
Devin Vassell is very good, consistently
Devin Vassell has turned a fucking corner

What am I missing?

why don't you just admit you were in the wrong and castle was playing losing basketball for no reason?