Reasonable trade ideas

[AFBlue]

A question to you all,Can the spurs offer Oberto to Tau in order to lower Scola´s Buy out and finally bring him to SA?like a kind of trade but outside the NBA
would this work?

Impossible to work as a formalized agreement because it's two different leagues with no bargaining agreement between them. That means Oberto would have to opt out of his contract and agree to leave the NBA and go back overseas. It would have to be an "under the table" kind of arrangement...not likely.

[AFBlue]

Listen...I'm not pushing Manu out the door or anything. I love him as a player and he has my respect. I also realize that he's the most expendable of the big 3 and could bring us back players that might turn our fortunes around. It would suck to lose Manu in the process, but I don't think we can get back the type of talent we need without considering it.

Whether it helps this team or not, it's not in the realm of "reasonable" as Pop has already made it known no major trades will occur...only ones involving "peripheral" players, if at all.

[ArgSpursFan]

Impossible to work as a formalized agreement because it's two different leagues with no bargaining agreement between them. That means Oberto would have to opt out of his contract and agree to leave the NBA and go back overseas. It would have to be an "under the table" kind of arrangement...not likely.

Or,the spurs could ¨buy out¨ Oberto´s contract for cheaper and get scola´s buy out for cheaper as well,if both organizations come to a mutual agreement
would that work now?

[AFBlue]

Or,the spurs could ¨buy out¨ Oberto´s contract for cheaper and get scola´s buy out for cheaper as well,if both organizations come to a mutual agreement
would that work now?

Again, it would have to be a "handshake" deal. Once the Spurs "bought out" Oberto's contract or convinced him to opt out of his final year (his prerogative), he would be free to choose retirement or whatever team in the Euroleague he chooses.

Bottom Line: No formal agreement or "trade" could be made, though that doesn't mean the two players couldn't swap places independently.

[ArgSpursFan]

Again, it would have to be a "handshake" deal. Once the Spurs "bought out" Oberto's contract or convinced him to opt out of his final year (his prerogative), he would be free to choose retirement or whatever team in the Euroleague he chooses.

Bottom Line: No formal agreement or "trade" could be made, though that doesn't mean the two players couldn't swap places independently.

but it can be, by closed doors agreement,kind of thing.

[ambchang]

Any mention of getting Salim Stoudamire from the Hawks? He's young, got a great smooth mid-range game, relatively atheletic, long SF/SG type, and is not playing at all. I am not sure how the salaries work, but Beno could be swapped for him, and the Hawks desperately needs a PG.

[Mr. Body]

If by 'long' you mean 6'1".

[ambchang]

I thought the guy is a good 6'6", 6'7", turns out he's listed "only" at 6'5", but that is still a decent sized SG. He may be giving up two inches to most SF though.

[AFBlue]

but it can be, by closed doors agreement,kind of thing.

Sure...I think most of the details would have to be worked out on Oberto, since he is still under contract until after next year and could theoretically choose any team. I think Tau would have to have some assurance that he'd join the team before lowering the buyout on Scola even further. Honestly, I think the buyout of Scola's contract occurs whether or not Fabbs goes back overseas.

[AFBlue]

I thought the guy is a good 6'6", 6'7", turns out he's listed "only" at 6'5", but that is still a decent sized SG. He may be giving up two inches to most SF though.

where are you getting your info?

He's listed at 6'1 and that's generous. He's a shooting guard in a PGs body....and his shot has been streaky, which is never good when that's your ONE dimension.

Dijon Thompson, who used to play for the Hawks is a long and lean SG/SF type.

[Mr. Body]

I thought the guy is a good 6'6", 6'7", turns out he's listed "only" at 6'5", but that is still a decent sized SG. He may be giving up two inches to most SF though.

What 'Salim Stoudamire' are you talking about? The one the league knows is a chucker in a point guard body, who has no point guard skills.

[ambchang]

My mistake, misread his info on the page.

[mountainballer]

Whether it helps this team or not, it's not in the realm of "reasonable" as Pop has already made it known no major trades will occur...only ones involving "peripheral" players, if at all.

but has Pop ever announced an upcomming trade? and it is two weeks back, since he made the "peripheral" statement, it was at the beginning of the rodeo trip. we are 1-4 since then, but even more scary, the team looks worse with every game, just different to the trips of the past.
(maybe Pop was just speculating, that the trip will bring the Spurs back on track, as usual)
so, he might think a bit different today.

[AFBlue]

but has Pop ever announced an upcomming trade? and it is two weeks back, since he made the "peripheral" statement, it was at the beginning of the rodeo trip. we are 1-4 since then, but even more scary, the team looks worse with every game, just different to the trips of the past.
(maybe Pop was just speculating, that the trip will bring the Spurs back on track, as usual)
so, he might think a bit different today.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all about the Spurs making a trade that will bring in an immediate contributor. I would love to see Maggette in a Spurs uni and wouldn't mind a bit if anyone outside TMT (sorry TxAllstar, it's just to good NOT to use) is traded to get him (including Barry). I also understand that situations change and the lack of apparent "trade talk" could just be the calm before the storm.

I'm just saying I haven't seen anything of late to indicate the Spurs FO is in a frenzy to get something done.

[ananthd]

This trade is legal:

Barry, Elson, White for Foyle, Pietrus (http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=254~2173~42~234~3037&teams=24~24~9~9~9)

I think the Spurs biggest problem has been defense; Foyle will give them a legit shotblocker although offensively he's pretty much a stiff. Pietrus has low basketball IQ; but he's very athletic and a very capable defender. He's capable of shutting down Josh Howard or any SF. Plus he can slash from close by and hit the 3. The Spurs can let him walk if they don't like him anyway.

The Warriors might take this, since Foyle isn't in Nellie's rotation and they might let Pietrus walk away anyway since they need to resign Biedrins and Ellis. Nellie would find a way to use White and Elson in his freelancing system. Barry adds a much needed shooter.

The only downside I see is Foyle's contract, but if the Spurs are going to have a defensive philosophy, this may be a better fit for him.

[AFBlue]

This trade is legal:

Barry, Elson, White for Foyle, Pietrus (http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=254~2173~42~234~3037&teams=24~24~9~9~9)

I think the Spurs biggest problem has been defense; Foyle will give them a legit shotblocker although offensively he's pretty much a stiff. Pietrus has low basketball IQ; but he's very athletic and a very capable defender. He's capable of shutting down Josh Howard or any SF. Plus he can slash from close by and hit the 3. The Spurs can let him walk if they don't like him anyway.

The Warriors might take this, since Foyle isn't in Nellie's rotation and they might let Pietrus walk away anyway since they need to resign Biedrins and Ellis. Nellie would find a way to use White and Elson in his freelancing system. Barry adds a much needed shooter.

The only downside I see is Foyle's contract, but if the Spurs are going to have a defensive philosophy, this may be a better fit for him.

About a month ago I would've said you were nuts...Pietrus looks like he's finally turned the corner and is ready to be a legit all-around player for this team. Then the trade happened.

It hasn't effected Pietrus' play or minutes, but they added two more SF types and with all the money they've got tied up, I think there's a legit chance he gets an offer in FA GS will find tough to match.

Still it's a longshot, and Foyle's contract is possibly the worst in the NBA.....wait, I forgot about Darius Miles.

[JPB]

It's probable that GS will be looking at other trades possibilities before the deadline.

I don't know which one of their swingmen they would let go but if SA could get Pietrus (which would be a dream with their current problems) and if it means getting a bad contract/player in the trade to make it work, well no hesitations at all.

but I really don't know if this is really possible. I
f they think they couldn't match an offer next offseason, they might want to make trade to at least get something in return.

[AFBlue]

How about a trade for Melvin Ely.... :lol

[Kori Ellis]

How about a trade for Melvin Ely.... :lol

Read the first post :lmao

[baseline bum]

Condition 1

No contact received shall extend past the 2007-08 season.

Check :smokin

[AFBlue]

Read the first post :lmao

Gotta give the girl her props.... :lol

To you Kori... :toast

[AFBlue]

Remaining Needs:

Backup PG
Long 3/Small Ball 4

Remaining assets:

Brent Barry
Jackie Butler
Fabricio Oberto
Matt Bonner
Francisco Elson
Beno Udrih

Who goes where for what? Or are the Spurs done?

[Mr. Body]

If they manage to shore up those 2 needs, I'll be extremely impressed.

[Slinkyman]

right now back up PG is for more important IMO.

[T Park]

Agreed.

Get a back up point, then things can start to get cheery around here again.

[Russ]

right now back up PG is for more important IMO.
I disagree -- backup PG is the least of the Spurs' glaring needs. Come crunch time, the Spurs can go with Manu (or even Barry) at PG. Backup PG will be no more a liability this year than in '05 when they won it all.

The Spurs need more quickness and defensive ability in their swingmen. And especially more rebounding ability. That's what has killed them and will continue to kill them (assuming they have/can upgrade their bigs).

What about this James White guy?

[T-Pain]

trade oberto for Ronald "Flip" Murray

[T-Pain]

better yet, add barry to the equation so i dont have to see his stupid HEB commercial anymore

[AFBlue]

trade oberto for Ronald "Flip" Murray

The Pistons want a PG and are trying to get rid of their excess bigs...I doubt they'd take Oberto.

[AFBlue]

The better Finley plays, I think the better chance Barry has to be dealt. He played well and was aggressive tonight against the Nets. A confident Finley is better than a timid one.

Barry + whatever for Maggette

[Streakyshooter08]

A good thing is that the Ely trade makes another big "tradable". I think some teams might be interested in Oberto or Elson... Golden State might be looking for a big, so is New Jersey...we'll see what happens.

[mountainballer]

A good thing is that the Ely trade makes another big "tradable". I think some teams might be interested in Oberto or Elson... Golden State might be looking for a big, so is New Jersey...we'll see what happens.

good point.
I mentioned in the other thread, that now the FO no longer has to focus on a trade, that gets them under the threshold. this homework has been done.

NJ is desperate for frontcourt help and they still fight for a PO spot, so the will do a trade at deadline.
but there are two questions: do they think, that a trade for one of the Spurs bigs improves them enough to turn around? (very likely not)
second: who do we want? there is a player who would be perfect for the Spurs (maybe still to young, but for the future) and that is Antoine Wright. but I don't think the Nets would give up on him for one of the Spurs crappy bigs. that leaves us with one possibility: Bostjan Nachbar.
he might be to have for maybe Oberto+2nd rounder.
but is this what we think, when talking about help at SF?

and GSW. yes, I can also see them looking for a big. Nelson for sure isn't interested in Oberto. maybe Elson? other than the Nets, the Warriors would have a lot of players the Spurs could use.
(Barnes! Pietrus, Jasikevicious)

[AFBlue]

A good thing is that the Ely trade makes another big "tradable". I think some teams might be interested in Oberto or Elson... Golden State might be looking for a big, so is New Jersey...we'll see what happens.

Pietrus for Elson + pick? I'll keep dreaming....

[Streakyshooter08]

Well, I doubt they would do Pietrus for Elson + pick. I think a Oberto for Barnes trade is not too far fetched. For Pietrus I guess you would have to take a bigger contract in return to make it interesting for GS.

In New Jersey I see Nachbar as a target. He is 6,9, has a good 3pt shoot and his rebounding numbers in january are okay for a wing (3.9 reb/game).

I would welcome trades like:

Oberto or Elson for Barnes

Oberto or Elson for Nachbar

Of course there are better players out there but since this thread is about "reasonable" trade ideas. I think the Spurs would have a chance to land these players...

[tiga]

Can San Antonio use Najera or Childress ? If so, what can the spurs offer ?

[AFBlue]

Well, I doubt they would do Pietrus for Elson + pick. I think a Oberto for Barnes trade is not too far fetched. For Pietrus I guess you would have to take a bigger contract in return to make it interesting for GS.

In New Jersey I see Nachbar as a target. He is 6,9, has a good 3pt shoot and his rebounding numbers in january are okay for a wing (3.9 reb/game).

I would welcome trades like:

Oberto or Elson for Barnes

Oberto or Elson for Nachbar

Of course there are better players out there but since this thread is about "reasonable" trade ideas. I think the Spurs would have a chance to land these players...

I doubt either player makes enough of an impact to the current roster that they garner a spot in the rotation and/or minutes away from guys like Finley, etc. Because I think it's unlikely they get minutes, it would be easier to pick up a guy like Barnes (fill the "long 3/small ball 4" role) in free agency this off-season.

[AFBlue]

Can San Antonio use Najera or Childress ? If so, what can the spurs offer ?

Welcome! :spin

As discussed in another thread, Childress (or any Hawk for that matter) is likely untouchable with an ongoing ownership battle between the current guys and the one guy who got the outser after he disagreed with the Joe Johnson acquisition.

Najera is a more likely scenario because he fits that "long 3/small ball 4" profile, but he makes a good bit of cheese and the Spurs would probably have trouble finding players to match salaries. I'm also not sure how much longer his contract goes on for, but the Spurs FO is hesitant to take on contracts longer than 2 years (ref: 08 plan)

[mountainballer]

Najera is a more likely scenario because he fits that "long 3/small ball 4" profile, but he makes a good bit of cheese and the Spurs would probably have trouble finding players to match salaries. I'm also not sure how much longer his contract goes on for, but the Spurs FO is hesitant to take on contracts longer than 2 years (ref: 08 plan)

i think Najera is also very unlikely, because it still can happen, that the Nuggets meet the Spurs in the first round.
and they know very well what the lacks of the current Spurs are and they won't help them to improve in those areas. (like Najera would regarding rebounding and defense).

edit:
this might also be the case, when thinking about trades with Clippers or GSW.
Spurs might only be able to work out a trade with a WC team, that is out of the PO race. (like Grizzlies, Sonics or Blazers)

the EC teams will be more willing to trade with the Spurs. still hope for a Bulls trade, something like Butler for Khryapa+Barret (for the numbers) for example.

[Big P]

Chris Duhon would definitly be an ideal backup PG(they are shopping him) & if the Bulls would be willing to trade Khrypa too, we could most of our problems with one trade where the players are not making a huge amount. Barry for Duhon, Khrypa & Andriuskevicius works in the trade checker. Spurs would have to throw in picks & cash, but this is a trade I would like to see go down. Butler & Bonner for Duhon & Khrypa also works.

[Que Gee]

Chris Duhon would definitly be an ideal backup PG(they are shopping him) & if the Bulls would be willing to trade Khrypa too, we could most of our problems with one trade where the players are not making a huge amount. Barry for Duhon, Khrypa & Andriuskevicius works in the trade checker. Spurs would have to throw in picks & cash, but this is a trade I would like to see go down. Butler & Bonner for Duhon & Khrypa also works.

You think these are "reasonable trade ideas?"
:drunk

[Gros Membres!]

Chris Duhon would definitly be an ideal backup PG(they are shopping him) & if the Bulls would be willing to trade Khrypa too, we could most of our problems with one trade where the players are not making a huge amount. Barry for Duhon, Khrypa & Andriuskevicius works in the trade checker. Spurs would have to throw in picks & cash, but this is a trade I would like to see go down. Butler & Bonner for Duhon & Khrypa also works.
Bulls wouldn't inculde Dunon in a package with PJ Brown for GASOL.

Keep moving. Nothing to see here...

[Big P]

They dont need to include Duhon in a package for Gasol..it would be Brown, Gordon or Deng, & the NY pick or instead of the pick it would be Thomas...Memphis does not need Duhon. Duhon has not even been mentioned in the Gasol trade, so I am not sure where you are getting this from. Duhon has become the 3rd PG for the Bulls & isn't even playing all that much. Khrypa isn't even playing at all. You make it sound like Duhon & Khrypa are superstars, they are 10th & 11th men off the bench. I'm sure you also thought that EWill for Ely was not a possibility. These two are very likely trade canidates. You might also want to learn how to spell his name.

[Gros Membres!]

They dont need to include Duhon in a package for Gasol..it would be Brown, Gordon or Deng, & the NY pick or instead of the pick it would be Thomas...Memphis does not need Duhon. Duhon has not even been mentioned in the Gasol trade, so I am not sure where you are getting this from. Duhon has become the 3rd PG for the Bulls & isn't even playing all that much. Khrypa isn't even playing at all. You make it sound like Duhon & Khrypa are superstars, they are 10th & 11th men off the bench. I'm sure you also thought that EWill for Ely was not a possibility. These two are very likely trade canidates. You might also want to learn how to spell his name.
Check it - http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/basketball/bulls/cs-070213bullsbits,1,2582658.story?coll=cs-bulls-headlines

Paxson unwilling to part with Duhon and/or Gordon because it "might disrupt team chemistry." Although Deng and Gordon have been the guys in question for the Gasol trade, here's what Paxson had to say yesterday - (here's part of the article in question from yesterday's Chicago Tribune):

"The reason it would be difficult [to trade any of the young core]—and I like all our guys but realize you can't get attached to them—is they've been a part of helping change our culture," Paxson said. "The reason we've been in the playoffs two years in a row is because we were able to change the mind-set of work and accountability.

"I worry about chemistry. I worry about if I'm taking out a player or players that have helped get us to this point, am I messing too much with just the little intangible things that are very important to a team? I'm not saying we're in position [to win a championship] yet. But I have a long-term view in mind as well."

Duhon is a special player, has great athleticism, and shooting skills. If he's the 10th man off the bench why is he averaging around 13, 6 asts, and 3 rebounds in the last 3 games? Check your facts - http://www.nba.com/playerfile/chris_duhon/

Forget it, Duhon not coming to SA to play backup while we given them Oberto and Udrih. Especially if Memphis can't even get to that youthful core in Chicago by dangling Gasol.

Now if we were trading Manu for Nocioni and Deng/Duhon then we might have a chance.

[Big P]

So you resort to altering what the article is saying? And I quote from the article you just linked..."Paxson remains reluctant to include Luol Deng or Ben Gordon in any deal for Gasol."

It does not say anything about Duhon or Khrypa. His playing time has picked up over the last few games, but about 2 weeks ago he was suspended for a game by the team & he is barely working his way out of the dog house. Duhon is far from untradeable, the Cavs are talking about swapping Drew Gooden for Duhon is articles published today. You want me to check my facts, but it might be a good idea for you not to alter stories to make your comments look correct.

[Gros Membres!]

So you resort to altering what the article is saying? And I quote from the article you just linked..."Paxson remains reluctant to include Luol Deng or Ben Gordon in any deal for Gasol."

It does not say anything about Duhon or Khrypa. His playing time has picked up over the last few games, but about 2 weeks ago he was suspended for a game by the team & he is barely working his way out of the dog house. Duhon is far from untradeable, the Cavs are talking about swapping Drew Gooden for Duhon is articles published today. You want me to check my facts, but it might be a good idea for you not to alter stories to make your comments look correct.
Did you not read beyond the first sentence. Jeebus..."The reason it would be difficult [to trade any of the young core]—and I like all our guys but realize you can't get attached to them—is they've been a part of helping change our culture," Paxson said. "The reason we've been in the playoffs two years in a row is because we were able to change the mind-set of work and accountability."

Ultimately, Duhon will not be traded for pennies, Oberto, or Udrih because he's also Chicago's backup PG and part of the "young core" for Chicago that is looking very strong at the moment. If Hinrich goes down then what?? Duhon's would be a perfect fit and the Spurs would be lucky to have him. All I'm saying is, if you want him you'll have to start thinking packages as Chicago will not move him for cheap as a favor to SA. Yes, he is being included in talks for Gasol BUT AS A PACKAGE for GASOL. Chicago has great tradeable assets for any team as they have truly built themselves up from the draft since Jordan retired. Chicago wants something to put them over the top for a package of their young guys. In other words, we'd have to offer Manu for XXX+Duhon.

I'll pass as I think we can pick one up through trade or draft next year. I would rather see us trade Barry+Beno for a SF that could be their heir apparent to Bruce. I think Bruce may have two more good years in him if, and only if, he is not playing full games. We need him fresh for the playoffs. I'd like to see us address the SF weakness first.

[bigdog]

I'm thinking we could probably get rid of beno and fabio, instead of the usual barry+beno trades yall always talk about. remember, barry can play backup point like he did his first year here,and he played starting point for seattle alot too. so we might not have to pick up another backup PG, and oberto and beno could be shipped out for a SF. i would rather have an elson/ely combo at C than oberto/elson.

[AFBlue]

Posted in other thread, but "reasonable" enough....

Udrih + Oberto to MEM for Atkins

New addition:

Udrih + Oberto to POR for Dixon (+ Outlaw?)

[silk]

Posted in other thread, but "reasonable" enough....

Udrih + Oberto to MEM for Atkins

New addition:

Udrih + Oberto to POR for Dixon (+ Outlaw?)
it would take butler instead of oberto i think but i like this trade a lot. Beside, i'd rather get daniel gibson from the cavs he could stay with us a little longer with more upside.

[venitian navigator]

My dream 's trade :

Finley, Bonner and Udrih for Duhon, Kryahpa and Safolosha.
It works, on the trade chacker.

I know we have a promise with Finley, but Chicago is a very good team end his home.
Chicago could be intrigued to have him in their team, expecially come playoff time, and sacrifice some youth, that's what we desperately need, expecially in the guard position.

[Slinkyman]

Posted in other thread, but "reasonable" enough....

Udrih + Oberto to MEM for Atkins

New addition:

Udrih + Oberto to POR for Dixon (+ Outlaw?)

i can see the spurs doing the deal for atkins but they'd probably have to throw in a 2nd round pick for Memphis to bite. Spurs would love that deal though, atkins is in a contract year so he'd be off the books after this season saving the spurs over 4 million next year that they'd have to pay those 2 bums(beno,oberto) not to mention we'd get a decent back up PG in the deal.

[AFBlue]

Beside, i'd rather get daniel gibson from the cavs he could stay with us a little longer with more upside.

Gibson now starts for the Cavs and they're looking to add a point guard, not subtract one. I get the feeling that the Cavs really like what Gibson brings.

What would be the package?

[AFBlue]

My dream 's trade :

Finley, Bonner and Udrih for Duhon, Kryahpa and Safolosha.
It works, on the trade chacker.

I know we have a promise with Finley, but Chicago is a very good team end his home.
Chicago could be intrigued to have him in their team, expecially come playoff time, and sacrifice some youth, that's what we desperately need, expecially in the guard position.

Doubt you'll see the Spurs deal with a "contender" (or any deals between NBAs "contenders" for that matter) before the trade deadline. Lottery-bound teams looking to create cap space or go into full-blown rebuild mode (Bobcats, Blazers, 76ers, Grizzlies, Celtics) will deal with the contenders or amongst themselves.

On your trade....

Duhon makes some sense for a legit backup PG, but he is either starting for them or the first guy off the bench....they obviously value his prescence.

Sefolosha is a versatile guy they see playing at least two positions and being important to their future.

Khryapa is interesting though. He's a kid that obviously has talent, fills a need for the Spurs (can play 3/4), and doesn't get much "burn" in his current situation. I could see the Spurs going after a guy like him, but again, I think it's unlikely you'll see a deal between two "contenders", even if it is just for "peripheral players".

Theoretically though, a Beno for Khryapa deal works straight up...

[Bruno]

Duhon and Sefolosha aren't available.
Duhon was maybe available few weeks ago when he struggles but now it's likely too late to get him.

[Bruno]

http://www.nj.com/columns/ledger/dalessandro/index.ssf?/base/columns-0/117177775397300.xml&coll=1


A market filled with middling madness

Sunday, February 18, 2007
BY DAVE D'ALESSANDRO

Now that we are nearly done celebrating this capitalistic orgy known as All-Star Weekend -- it just gets better every year, doesn't it? -- we can get back to the business of trying to figure out why there are more unwanted mediocre players being shopped than ever before, when it's much easier to fork over $14 million or $36 million just to make guys disappear like the Knicks and Sixers do.

Of course, if mercenaries such as Jalen Rose and Chris Webber end up getting cheap rings in Phoenix and Detroit, we might rethink the wisdom of that strategy.

But there are plenty of unwanted guys still hanging around -- some of them as superfluous as Jalen, some of them as competent as C-Web -- and they fill up the annual list of players who are likely to be moved before Thursday's trade deadline.

BREVIN KNIGHT: Health has become an issue for the Jersey guy. The abdominal muscle still hasn't healed as he had expected, and the Bobs actually deactivated him last week, which didn't make him very happy. But there are teams all over the place that can use a steady backup point -- from Golden State to Indiana to Miami -- and the only question is whether they want to absorb a $4.4 million salary if he's still hurting.

JAMES POSEY: His departure was assured as soon as Eddie Jones hit Miami, but this proves that teams have very short memories. He's a good complementary piece with a strong defensive mind-set -- maybe overpriced at $6.4 mil (expiring) -- but the Heat probably don't win Game 6 at Dallas last year without him, and he also had strong fourth quarters against the Spurs and Blazers last week. But he's a good spare part, and somebody with an extra point guard that Miami needs (Spurs? Suns?) could put him to good use.

MIKE BIBBY: Miami was said to have its sights set on him, but at $13.5 this year and $14.5 next, it's not happening for a team that has marching orders to stay under the luxury tax. Cleveland was another possible destination, but it's very hard to put together the salaries and picks (the Cavs don't have one) to make it work.

JAMAAL MAGLOIRE: He's still only 28, still only three years removed from All-Stardom, still has the body beautiful, and you can still lift his $8.4M off your cap when this is all over. So why can't he find a home? For one thing, he's slow. For another, there was a good reason the Bucks jettisoned him a year ago for a backup point guard (Steve Blake) and came out ahead in the deal: He's become very hard to motivate, unless you play a slow game, and he gets to touch it a lot.

JUAN DIXON: He'd be a great, cost-effective solution for Cleveland or Detroit, but the questions linger. Is he the guy who has looked so out of it most of the year, or the guy who buried his old Washington team off the bench (14 points, four steals) last week? Either way, it's doubtful the Blazers would take David Wesley or Flip Murray back for him.

COREY MAGGETTE: The only reason he hasn't been shipped out by now, goes the yarn, is that he's one of Clippers owner Donald Sterling's faves and has final say on any deal. The problem, of course, is that he's not going to bring back much, because the entire league thinks he's one of the worst chemistry guys on the market. So Mike Dunleavy tried something clever -- he let Maggette start at Detroit, just so The Donald could watch his favorite player look inept on TV. Maggette followed the script: He shot 3-for-10, and the Clips got waxed. It would be good to see him land in Utah or San Antonio, just for the entertainment value of watching Jerry Sloan or Gregg Popovich whip him into shape.

MIKE JAMES: Randy Foye has taken James' job away, which would ordinarily make him hit the ceiling, but James will take the T'Wolves' $24 mil and shut up. Every team but Detroit seems reluctant to take a chance on him, because he's not exactly the pass-first point that most coaches want. But there's a deal to be made if GM Kevin McHale doesn't want to keep him hostage and has the guts to admit a mistake for the first time since his last mistake.

NAZR MOHAMMED: He's a starting-quality center and has played 18 minutes in the past month for the Pistons. That's not fair, especially since this is a good kid whose only crime was that he couldn't keep double-teams from swarming Rasheed Wallace. Minnesota has interest.

P.J. BROWN: Another expiring contract ($8M), but unless something happens with the next guy on this list, he looks stuck in Chicago for the duration.

PAU GASOL: The widespread perception is that Chicago is offering one of their top-tier kids (choose: Ben Gordon, Luol Deng, Kirk Hinrich or Andres Nocioni), one of their toddlers (choose: Tyrus Thomas or Thabo Sefolosha) plus the Knicks' draft pick and P.J.'s salary. Tempting, if true. But on second thought, nah. It really makes more sense to wait for the draft lottery, to determine what bigs are going to be available when their turn comes up.

TRAVIS DIENER/KEYON DOOLING: There's a market for backup points, and Orlando has a surplus.

BENO UDRIH: Spurs coach Gregg Popovich has had enough of him, after giving him three tries to secure the backup point job.

[Bruno]

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/sports/16722866.htm


On the NBA | Some Trade Advice

Posted on Sun, Feb. 18, 2007
By David Aldridge
Inquirer Columnist

The Spurs need James Posey on that wall. San Antonio is still smart and tough and willing, but the Spurs need someone who can move if they're going to have any chance at beating Dallas and Phoenix in the playoffs. They need someone who can step out and guard Dirk Nowitzki or Shawn Marion. Posey is precisely that kind of all-around guy.

A Brent Barry-Beno Udrih offer would give Miami both three-point firepower and guard depth to bolster the injured Jason Williams and the fading Gary Payton.

[Mr. Body]

Now that E-Will's expiring is gone I don't see a trade for Posey. Giving up Barry for him is probably too much.

[1Parker1]

Barry for Posey? Does that even match?

[dg7md]

Posey would be a lot more effective than Barry.

[ChumpDumper]

Well, it's another 300k or so off the luxury tax.

[Williewebb]

You all know Pop aint gonna make anymore moves be for the deadline. H wants to beat Avery with the tools we have. The Spurs need one more person who com defend and shot. Who can do that now-a-days???

[ChumpDumper]

I don't know who com defend and shot.

[spurtime]

Posey doesn't seem to have recovered from his injury and is having a hard time finding his shot. If we were getting the Posey from last season (or better yet the Posey from 3 years ago in Memphis) I would probably pull the trigger on a Barry for Posey deal, but I don't think that's the case.

[AFBlue]

Doubt you'll see a deal between two "contenders". My guess is that Posey goes back to Memphis for Chucky Atkins or he goes to Charlotte for Knight.

[ArgSpursFan]

I don´t care who it is,but we need another SF besides Bowen who can give some scoring and D, if we wanna have a chance to get to the WCFs.

[CarmeloNumeroUno]

why dont the spur deal for K-Mart he be back in full effect next season( THINK AMARE)

Nah seriously though yall get NENE and well take FINLEY and UDRIH

want the salaries matched? fine throw in ginobili take away finley

BaDaBaBaBAAAAAAA IM LOVIN IT :smokin

[Darkwaters]

What about Brent Barry/Beno Udrih/Draft Pick for James Posey/Dorell Wright.

The Spurs send a the Heat their needed PG depth and a veteran shooter. The Spurs get a pair of SFs, one who can play this year and contribute and another for the future. Unfortunately, the trade is $10,000 over, but is there anyway to use trade exceptions to balance this? Or is there no way? $10,000 isn't enough to laugh at.

[Darkwaters]

Nah seriously though yall get NENE and well take FINLEY and UDRIH

Nene is making like 10 million dollars. How would that work when Finley and Udrih combined are making less than 4? Magic?

[ArgSpursFan]

why dont the spur deal for K-Mart he be back in full effect next season( THINK AMARE)

Nah seriously though yall get NENE and well take FINLEY and UDRIH

spurs don´t need NENE,we have this guy called Tim Duncan.You know him? :fro

[NuGGeTs-FaN]

dang it. It no longer looks like im the token Nuggets fan on Spurstalk :lol

[AFBlue]

What about Brent Barry/Beno Udrih/Draft Pick for James Posey/Dorell Wright.

The Spurs send a the Heat their needed PG depth and a veteran shooter. The Spurs get a pair of SFs, one who can play this year and contribute and another for the future. Unfortunately, the trade is $10,000 over, but is there anyway to use trade exceptions to balance this? Or is there no way? $10,000 isn't enough to laugh at.

Again, I wouldn't expect a deal between the Spurs and Heat. Two contending teams are not likely to help eachother in their race to the title. Expect the Spurs to go after assets from a lottery-bound or fringe playoff team with the assets they have to offer (young projects and rights to players overseas)....

[Darkwaters]

Hows this trade?

San Antonio Sends:
Fabricio Oberto
Beno Udrih
2nd round pick (Milwaukee)

Chicago Sends:
Chris Duhon
Luol Deng
PJ Brown
Viktor Khryapa
Draft pick (maybe a 2008 1st rounder)

Memphis Sends:
Pau Gasol
Alexander Johnson



Chicago Receives:
Pau Gasol
Alexander Johnson
Beno Udrih

Memphis Receives:
Luol Deng
Fabricio Oberto
PJ Brown
Spurs 2nd round pick (from Milwaukee)
Bulls draft pick

San Antonio receives:
Chris Duhon
Viktor Khryapa


Bulls get Gasol and a replacement to Duhon plus filler. Memphis gets Deng, PJ Brown's expiring contract and Oberto (whom they were supposedly high on) and a nice draft pick. The Spurs get their long young SF and Beno's replacement.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2805~2448~99~2429~2377~2435~99 6~3009&teams=29~4~29~29~24~24~4~4

[spurtime]

Hows this trade?

San Antonio Sends:
Fabricio Oberto
Beno Udrih
2nd round pick (Milwaukee)

Chicago Sends:
Chris Duhon
Luol Deng
PJ Brown
Viktor Khryapa
Draft pick (maybe a 2008 1st rounder)

Memphis Sends:
Pau Gasol
Alexander Johnson



Chicago Receives:
Pau Gasol
Alexander Johnson
Beno Udrih

Memphis Receives:
Luol Deng
Fabricio Oberto
PJ Brown
Spurs 2nd round pick (from Milwaukee)
Bulls draft pick

San Antonio receives:
Chris Duhon
Viktor Khryapa


Bulls get Gasol and a replacement to Duhon plus filler. Memphis gets Deng, PJ Brown's expiring contract and Oberto (whom they were supposedly high on) and a nice draft pick. The Spurs get their long young SF and Beno's replacement.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=2805~2448~99~2429~2377~2435~99 6~3009&teams=29~4~29~29~24~24~4~4

That would make my pants very happy. Unfortunately, you overestimate how much Paxson is willing to give up in order to get Gasol.

[freemeat]

anyone up for a Rashard Lewis for Oberto-Barry deal? Mathematically, it works out...Maybe we can throw in a draft pick and/or cash, since we have what, 3 second-rounders this summer?

[AFBlue]

anyone up for a Rashard Lewis for Oberto-Barry deal? Mathematically, it works out...Maybe we can throw in a draft pick and/or cash, since we have what, 3 second-rounders this summer?

Not in the realm of "reasonable"...sorry.

[freemeat]

I don't see why not...the salaries match. Rashard probably won't want to re-sign with Seattle, who's been secretly shopping him around. Barry is a Seattle-favorite, and Oberto can give them an inside presence that'll space the floor for Barry and Allen (who would also benefit from having Barry on the floor). If Seattle doesn't pull the trigger on a Lewis trade, they could potentially lose him this summer for nothing. How is that unreasonable?

[AFBlue]

I don't see why not...the salaries match. Rashard probably won't want to re-sign with Seattle, who's been secretly shopping him around. Barry is a Seattle-favorite, and Oberto can give them an inside presence that'll space the floor for Barry and Allen (who would also benefit from having Barry on the floor). If Seattle doesn't pull the trigger on a Lewis trade, they could potentially lose him this summer for nothing. How is that unreasonable?

Even if they lose some leverage by the possibility of him opting out, it doesn't mean they've lost him...they can still sign him at a higher salary and there will only be a few other teams under the salary cap enough to give him the hike in pay he wants. If seattle were to decide they're going to move him, I'd think his level of talent and youth would fetch more than Barry and Oberto.

[Purple & Gold]

Yeah sorry Rashard for Barry and Oberto is not even close to reasonable. He can pull a lot more than that. But I did enjoy the whole Oberto inside presence deal.

[Darkwaters]

Currently they're saying the Knicks might acquire Lewis in exchange for Channing Frye and Nate Robinson. I'd say that trumps Oberto/Barry.

[CarmeloNumeroUno]

spurs don´t need NENE,we have this guy called Tim Duncan.You know him? :fro

You heard of this thing called position
Duncan PF
Nene C :donkey

[AFBlue]

You heard of this thing called position
Duncan PF
Nene C :donkey

Actually both can play either position, though you're right that it's not really a conflict. What is a conflict, is his $10M per year contract that runs until 2012 or whatever. I'd rather have Reggie Evans for over 50% less $$.

[mountainballer]

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/sports/16737039.htm

Here's a look at point guards who may be on the market and what the Cavs have to offer:

POTENTIAL TARGETS

Mike Bibby, Kings - The Cavs have been in on-and-off talks with the Kings about their point guard for a long time. It is believed the Kings would move Bibby for the right deal but the Cavs don't have the parts needed. A third team needs to get involved and both sides have been looking.

Juan Dixon, Trail Blazers - He's not a pure point guard. He's more of a combo guard and may be too much like Daniel Gibson for the Cavs to consider. But he can handle the ball, he's available and he could help.

Beno Udrih, Spurs - He's lost his playing time again and is constantly in and out of coach Gregg Popovich's doghouse. Ferry was a part of the team that drafted Udrih three years ago and he likes the lefty's game. It is questionable whether the Spurs would let him go, though.

Travis Diener, Magic - The Magic have been shopping their quick guard, according to reports. But potential playoff opponents aren't usually trading partners.

Marko Jaric, Timberwolves - He's been in rumors for months now, ever since he voiced some displeasure earlier in the season. The Cavs looked at him in the summer of 2005, when he was a free agent, but the hefty contract he eventually signed makes him prohibitive. He's very unlikely to be going anywhere.

Jason Hart, Kings - Never plays, isn't happy, wants to be traded. He's the type of player the Cavs could get cheap and he could be a change-of-pace ballhandler for the stretch run.

POTENTIAL ASSETS

Sasha Pavlovic - His talent and recent run of good play make him a desirable prospect, especially considering he's in the final year of a contract.

Anderson Varejao - Everyone who calls the Cavs wants him, but the Cavs won't give him up unless it is for a prime player in return.

Scot Pollard - His $2.2 million deal is expiring, which makes him attractive. He's also a versatile big man, someone always in demand for a team looking to stock for the playoffs.

David Wesley - He also has an expiring deal, worth $1.75 million, with just $250,000 guaranteed for next year.

Trade exception - The Cavs have one worth $2.1 million, which they can swap for a player. But it cannot be used in a combination with players in a deal.

Dan Gilbert's checkbook - Teams can include up to $3 million in a deal, and the Cavs owner hasn't been timid in writing checks before to teams looking to limit losses.



just read on another board an interesting scenario:
the Spurs trade Beno to the Cavs for their trade exception + a future pick.
this would put the Spurs below the lux tax threshold.
it wouldn't make them better though.
(maybe they fill the open spot with a FA signing)

another interesting option would be, if Spurs combined the exception they got with the Scola rights. (for Khryapa?)

[AFBlue]

just read on another board an interesting scenario:
the Spurs trade Beno to the Cavs for their trade exception + a future pick.
this would put the Spurs below the lux tax threshold.
it wouldn't make them better though.
(maybe they fill the open spot with a FA signing)

another interesting option would be, if Spurs combined the exception they got with the Scola rights. (for Khryapa?)

Of those deals, I think Wesley is the most attractive and reasonably available.

I think the Spurs need a Wesley/Dixon-type of combo guard to run with the likes of Nash/Barbosa and Terry/Harris.

Beno for Wesley should work...

Also, Butler + Beno for Dixon + Outlaw (mentioned in another thread)

[AFBlue]

Bring Wesley home...

[Bruno]

just read on another board an interesting scenario:
the Spurs trade Beno to the Cavs for their trade exception + a future pick.
this would put the Spurs below the lux tax threshold.
it wouldn't make them better though.
(maybe they fill the open spot with a FA signing)

another interesting option would be, if Spurs combined the exception they got with the Scola rights. (for Khryapa?)

Great idea, Spurs get a TE to go under the tax and then trade it for a player that put them over the tax. :spin

And Spurs can likely get more than a player like Khryapa for Scola.

[Bruno]

Bring Wesley home...

Wesley is done.

[AFBlue]

Wesley is done.

I know, just had to show love for the hometown kid, who also went to my alma mater. Someone's gotta pull for him... :lol

[mountainballer]

Great idea, Spurs get a TE to go under the tax and then trade it for a player that put them over the tax. :spin


that's why the word "another" was used.
it tries to point out, that this option is different to the scenario, that just puts them under the threshold.
and the scenarion could also be used on a player, who doesn't put them back over the threshold (like Barnes for example)
and the option doesn't need to be used before deadline, it might be helpfull in an offseason trade, when packed with the Scola rights.
what about an opinion about such a scenario instead of the sarcasmn? you have great knowledge about basketball, would be more interesting to hear your opinion.

btw. don't know if the Spurs indeed can get more than Khryapa, as long as it is not clear, what Scola isn't signed and teams can't estimate his demands.
(he might go for a bigger contract, than he did last summer- who knows). and Khryapa does have some value for the Spurs, since he fills exactly a need for them. (the long SF who can play some PF)

[Bruno]

My opinion : Khryapa can slighty help Spurs. He fill a need but he isn't very good.
BTW, a player like Barnes will put Spurs over the Luxury Tax.

Now, your first scenario : Spurs trade Beno for a TE + future pick and then trade Scola + TE for Khryapa before the deadline.
Is Khryapa worth Scola + $2.5M (cost for being over the luxury tax + remaining salary) ? I don't think so.

Second scenario : they do the Khryapa trade this summer.
Is the upgrade from Khryapa to a player like Jumaine Jones worth Scola ? I don't think so.

And Scola buyout situation was very clear last sumer and it will likely be the case too this summer.

[mountainballer]

My opinion : Khryapa can slighty help Spurs. He fill a need but he isn't very good.


he's not very good, but he could be a decent player on defense. he doesn't get any PT in Chicago, which is esay to understand when Deng, Nocioni and Thomas play his position.
his qualities are clearly on defense and he is a good rebounder. Spurs liked him 2004, there were some rumors, that he was very high on their draft list.
about Scola: we even don't know, if he would ever sign with the Spurs, after what had happened.
overall I would say that Scola is better than Khryapa, but Khryapa is better than nothing.

[Mr. Body]

Khryapa is probably worth a second round pick at this point.

[mountainballer]

Khryapa is probably worth a second round pick at this point.

if Bulls hand him over for a 2nd rounder it will be fine with me.

[Mr. Body]

How about Jackie Butler for Viktor Khryapa? Nevermind, doesn't work salary-wise.

[AFBlue]

Khyrapa is fine, so is Barnes, so is Singleton, so is Outlaw, and so are several other SF/PF types that the Spurs could have for a minimum price. The problem is that none of them have a realistic chance of cracking the rotation this year and helping get a championship this year. Any of them would/should be considered assets for the future.

[Mr. Body]

I'm not sure Outlaw is as readily available as a "minimum price".

[mountainballer]

Khyrapa is fine, so is Barnes, so is Singleton, so is Outlaw, and so are several other SF/PF types that the Spurs could have for a minimum price. The problem is that none of them have a realistic chance of cracking the rotation this year and helping get a championship this year. Any of them would/should be considered assets for the future.

Barnes could IMO. in some games the improvment in the rebounding and energy department will be more important, than what we might lose when playing a player, who doesn't know the sytem well.

and Nazr also wasn't exactly a basketball genious, but got 20 minutes right away ans started in the PO.

[AFBlue]

Barnes could IMO. in some games the improvment in the rebounding and energy department will be more important, than what we might lose when playing a player, who doesn't know the sytem well.

and Nazr also wasn't exactly a basketball genious, but got 20 minutes right away ans started in the PO.

I think we've been a few rounds on this point, so I'll just say....

I respect your opinion, and respectfully disagree....

[mountainballer]

something different. (not based on any rumors)

thanks to the weak East, the Knicks are surprisingly back in the PO race. 3 1/2 ganes behind the Heat and 4 games behind the (struggeling) Magic.
can anybody of you see Isah not do some trades?
and looking at their team, they have clearly one weakness and this is 3 point shooting. (they are no.29 in the league). if they had one competent shooter, they would be a 0.500 team right now.

Knick and Spurs do have a history in doing deadline trades (or trying), so they know the phone numbers.
Jeffries was on the Spurs wish list this summer, maybe not for the price the Knicks finally payed him, but his qualities are wanted even more desperate right now, than they were in the summer.
he lost his spot in the rotation lately, averaging just 8 minutes in February.
the development of Lee also made Jeffries somehow expendable.

can anybody see this happen?
(i know, that the Spurs wouldn't like Jeffries long term contract, but he would also be a long term solution for the often mentioned 3/4 foreward)

do you agree, that Isiah will make a call for Brent?

[GayForManu]

Not sure if this has been mentioned in the thread, but if Ferry is high on Beno, which is a stretch, would it be possible to send Oberto and Udrih to Cleveland for Pavlovic and Varejao? It gives the Cavs some help at point, Oberto for Varejao seems like a wash and Pavlovic gives us some flexibility at the swing position. At least we can have a 3 that can score off the bench. Your thoughts?

[mountainballer]

Oberto for Varejao seems like a wash

you don't care much for basketball, do you?

[AFBlue]

something different. (not based on any rumors)

thanks to the weak East, the Knicks are surprisingly back in the PO race. 3 1/2 ganes behind the Heat and 4 games behind the (struggeling) Magic.
can anybody of you see Isah not do some trades?
and looking at their team, they have clearly one weakness and this is 3 point shooting. (they are no.29 in the league). if they had one competend shooter, they would be a 0.500 team right now.

Knick and Spurs do have a history in doing deadline trades (or trying), so they know the phone numbers.
Jeffries was on the Spurs wish list this summer, maybe not for the price the Knicks finally payed him, but his qualities are wanted even more desperate right now, than they were in the summer.
he lost his spot in the rotation lately, averaging just 8 minutes in February.
the development of Lee also made Jeffries somehow expendable.

can anybody see this happen?
(i know, that the Spurs wouldn't like Jeffries long term contract, but he would also be a long term solution for the often mentioned 3/4 foreward)

do you agree, that Isiah will make a call for Brent?

Will Dolan consent to any trades? I thought his altimatum was for IT to sleep in the bed he made (meaning no trades)...

[mountainballer]

Will Dolan consent to any trades? I thought his altimatum was for IT to sleep in the bed he made (meaning no trades)...

since this trade would benefit the Knick's payroll in the long run, I think this scenario is allowed for Isiah.

[AFBlue]

Not sure if this has been mentioned in the thread, but if Ferry is high on Beno, which is a stretch, would it be possible to send Oberto and Udrih to Cleveland for Pavlovic and Varejao? It gives the Cavs some help at point, Oberto for Varejao seems like a wash and Pavlovic gives us some flexibility at the swing position. At least we can have a 3 that can score off the bench. Your thoughts?

Pavlovic has shown some real ability of late and Cleveland should be able to parlay his success into a deal for Atkins, Knight, or a PG of that calibur. In a recent article it was quoted that Varejao would only be moved for a big fish....that means his future is in Cleveland.

[AFBlue]

since this trade would benefit the Knick's payroll in the long run, I think this scenario is allowed for Isiah.

See your point and think he might make the call, but what would the Spurs incentive be to make the deal? Barry is a productive member of the squad and has a short-term contract. I think the Spurs would ask for another piece in the deal, and I'm not sure who that would be.

[Mr. Body]

On no account will the Spurs take on salary beyond next year. Only in minor dashes, as far as we're understanding.

[Purple & Gold]

Pavlovic has shown some real ability of late and Cleveland should be able to parlay his success into a deal for Atkins, Knight, or a PG of that calibur. In a recent article it was quoted that Varejao would only be moved for a big fish....that means his future is in Cleveland.
Pavlovic will only be moved for a quality player or a desperate need. I don't think they are desperate enough yet to trade him for an Atkins/Knight caliber of PG. Those are extreme PG's (scoring/passing). I think a more complete, well rounded PG would be needed to make that deal.

[mountainballer]

See your point and think he might make the call, but what would the Spurs incentive be to make the deal? Barry is a productive member of the squad and has a short-term contract. I think the Spurs would ask for another piece in the deal, and I'm not sure who that would be.

don't know. it is right that what else would be attractive on their roster (Lee, Frye) even Isiah wouldn't be stupid enough to trade away. Balkman? maybe. Collins might have some upside for the future.

[AFBlue]

don't know. it is right that what else would be attractive on their roster (Lee, Frye) even Isiah wouldn't be stupid enough to trade away. Balkman? maybe. Collins might have some upside for the future.

Balkman fits the defensive mentality, and I know Collins had a decent game against the Spurs a while back, but I don't see either as worthy of a guaranteed three year deal (both were 1st round picks if I'm not mistaken) and/or worth taking on Jeffries' salary. The one wildcard is Nate Robinson, though I think he'd drive Pop to insanity....

Agree with Mr. Body though, any long term deal for significant dollars is highly unlikely.

[JPB]

Mullin Comfortable Making Another Blockbuster
20th February, 2007 - 11:56 am
Contra Costa Times -
On Monday, Chris Mullin said he'd be comfortable making another trade, even one as large as the eight-player deal the Warriors and Pacers completed last month.

"I think right now we've got a group of guys who all want to stay here," Richardson said. "They all want to see this thing turned around."

[pad300]

A couple of proposals from the RealGM boards,

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=628635
Net deal for Spurs
Spurs In - James Singleton, Indiana 2nd (2007)
Spurs Out - Udrih, MIL 2nd (2007)

http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=628791
Spurs In - Singleton, Korolev
Spurs Out - Oberto
Does not consider who Spurs would need to cut for a roster spot...

[Mr. Body]

Pacers don't have a 2nd this year.

[AFBlue]

Pacers don't have a 2nd this year.

And neither addresses back up PG. Granted Vaughn played okay in the last couple games, but not having a third option is just stupid when the #2 guy is Vaughn.

Still a big proponent of

Atkins for Oberto + Udrih

Unless the Spurs get a guy like Maggette (which is looking bleaker by the day...though you never know), I think the Spurs can sign a Korolev-type in the off-season for little to no money....or they could draft a SF/PF type.

[sa_butta]

Here is a cool tool to check if your trade ideas will work...
sorry if already posted but I didnt see it in here.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/trademachine

[Big P]

I really like the Korolev & Singleton trade...helps us in areas of big concern..rebounding & long SF...if anything I would like the Spurs to look at bringing in both of the guys for next year. Korolev is a FA & there is conflicting info on whether Singleton is a FA next year or has 1 year left.

[pad300]

And neither addresses back up PG. Granted Vaughn played okay in the last couple games, but not having a third option is just stupid when the #2 guy is Vaughn.

Still a big proponent of

Atkins for Oberto + Udrih

Unless the Spurs get a guy like Maggette (which is looking bleaker by the day...though you never know), I think the Spurs can sign a Korolev-type in the off-season for little to no money....or they could draft a SF/PF type.

Taking it backwards - signing or drafting a SF/PF type in the offseason does nothing for us this season. Getting a backup PG would be nice, but the proposed options (other than Mardy Collins from the Knicks, which is a pipe dream) are all this season solutions. My judgement says that the wing is a more important problem than the PG spot. I think Vaughn and then Barry at backup PG, is solid enough that I would want to get some rebounding at the 3 and offer another option for small-ball PF (rather than Finley). If I can do both, great. But if I have to chose one, I get an SF.

A solution to both our issues was posted a while back

SA In - Atkins, Singleton
SA out - Udrih, Oberto

Mem in - Oberto
Mem Out - Atkins

LAC In - Udrih
LAC Out - Singleton, Paul Davis

Alternatively

SA In - Atkins, Singleton
SA out - Udrih, Oberto

Mem in - Korolev (or A Williams), Udrih
Mem Out - Atkins

LAC in - OBerto
LAC Out - Singleton, Korolev (or A Williams)

Either would require use of 2nd round picks to balance it (I would not advocate using our 1st).

I might suggest our own pick to LAC, the conditional Bulls pick to Mem (I believe they a) want to cut salary, which Oberto for Atkins does, and b) Jerry West supposedly likes Oberto).

[AFBlue]

Pad,

I'll say it again. If the Spurs trade for Singleton or Korolev they do not see the light of day, let alone time on the court. IMO, no one, outside of Maggette, will unseat Finley as the small ball 4 option this season. Pop will not play a "rookie" type over Finley...he just won't. So why give up anything to get a player now that will absolutely not help this season?

It's better to address a need that can be resolved with immediate impact....like backup PG.

Atkins, Dixon, and Knight would all get PT because they are veterans and there is a need at backup PG. They can all play alongside Tony as well in a small guard lineup....and best of all, they can all be had for a price.

[Big P]

Singleton & Korolev would be a move for the future. Nobody we get is going to unseat Finley(short of Maggette). We could potentially solve 2 problems with very little money(risk) by getting Korolev & Singleton.

[Mr. Body]

If you can make a move for the future with only peripheral players, you have to do it. Overhauling this team will take at least two summers and they might as well start now. Having a young athlete on the bench for the playoffs can't hurt, either.

[AFBlue]

Singleton & Korolev would be a move for the future. Nobody we get is going to unseat Finley(short of Maggette). We could potentially solve 2 problems with very little money(risk) by getting Korolev & Singleton.

Doubt the Clippers give up Singleton and Korolev for Oberto....and then there's the question of who you cut (current full roster).

If you wanted Korolev, you could actually just sign him in the off-season without giving up Oberto.

[AFBlue]

Ok I'll concede...can anyone tell me if the Spurs can trade Oberto for Korolev straight up and get under the lux tax threshold at the same time?

[pad300]

Pad,

I'll say it again. If the Spurs trade for Singleton or Korolev they do not see the light of day, let alone time on the court. IMO, no one, outside of Maggette, will unseat Finley as the small ball 4 option this season. Pop will not play a "rookie" type over Finley...he just won't. So why give up anything to get a player now that will absolutely not help this season?
Yeah, in YOUR opinion.

1) You think Pop is completely stupid. I think Pop is conservative. There is a difference. For example, TP saw play and started over a veteran (Antonio Daniels) in his 1st year. Manu saw some play (1432 minutes) over veterans in his 1st year. They were qualitatively better than the alternatives. Singleton is qualitatively better than Finley at small ball PF.

2) Korolev wouldn't see play time, your right. I'm not in it for Korolev. I want Singleton. Korolev RBR in the NBA 2006 - 5.9 (over 128 min), 2007 - 9.9 (over 17 min) . Singleton RBR in the NBA 2006 - 15.1 (over 758 min), 2007 - 15.5 (over 258 min). Singleton would be the 4th best rebounder on the Spurs (After Tim, Oberto, Elson) from the SF spot. Finley RBR 2007 - 8.2 (1116 min). If Tim is playing C, our critical needs are rebounding and D from our small ball PF. We have got Tim, Tony and Manu to do the scoring...

[AFBlue]

Yeah, in YOUR opinion.

1) You think Pop is completely stupid. I think Pop is conservative. There is a difference. For example, TP saw play and started over a veteran (Antonio Daniels) in his 1st year. Manu saw some play (1432 minutes) over veterans in his 1st year. They were qualitatively better than the alternatives. Singleton is qualitatively better than Finley at small ball PF.

2) Korolev wouldn't see play time, your right. I'm not in it for Korolev. I want Singleton. Korolev RBR in the NBA 2006 - 5.9 (over 128 min), 2007 - 9.9 (over 17 min) . Singleton RBR in the NBA 2006 - 15.1 (over 758 min), 2007 - 15.5 (over 258 min). Singleton would be the 4th best rebounder on the Spurs (After Tim, Oberto, Elson) from the SF spot. Finley RBR 2007 - 8.2 (1116 min). If Tim is playing C, our critical needs are rebounding and D from our small ball PF. We have got Tim, Tony and Manu to do the scoring...

Let's just call it what it is...difference of opinion. Too bad we won't get to prove eachother right or wrong....this deal won't get done.

[AFBlue]

Barry + Butler for Cassell + Korolev

[ginobili fan]

Beno>Cassell

[dg7md]

If we somehow got Juan Dixon, I have faith in our title-chances again. He can go off any given night for 30.

Ely should be the good gap at the backup PF spot, but I'd still like a young forward.

[leemajors]

If we somehow got Juan Dixon, I have faith in our title-chances again. He can go off any given night for 30.

Ely should be the good gap at the backup PF spot, but I'd still like a young forward.

dixon is a sg, not a pg.

[AFBlue]

dixon is a sg, not a pg.

True, but if Manu continues to come off the bench and/or if Barry is out on the floor with him, he doesn't have to act like a distributor and can still guard the opposing PG. He can also play alongside Tony when Dal/Phx use their small gaurd lineups.

Dixon isn't the perfect fit, but he would address a need, production from the backup "point guard".

[pad300]

Barry + Butler for Cassell + Korolev

I'd do that although I doubt the Clippers would. Cassell is the heart and soul of that team.

Still, assuming Cassell available:

Barry + Butler for Cassell and Singleton

Works even more for me (as I said above, Singleton > Korolev for me). Works for you: Cassell is clutch as hell, a vet, and even if Tony got injured, we would still have a better PG situation than half the league.

Also the 2 PG set would be just impressive - Tony, Cassell, Ginobili, Duncan, Elson...

[pad300]

...

My judgement says that the wing is a more important problem than the PG spot. ... If I can do both, great. But if I have to chose one, I get an SF.
...


Hey Phat Tony, given this
http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/44798/20070221/bowens_back_worries_popovich/

Do you still think that backup PG is more of an issue than the wing spot behind Bowen?

[AFBlue]

Hey Phat Tony, given this
http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/44798/20070221/bowens_back_worries_popovich/

Do you still think that backup PG is more of an issue than the wing spot behind Bowen?

I think both are legitimate needs. My point was that an "immediate contributor" could be found more easily at the backup PG spot than the backup SF spot.

That news does worry me a bit, as it appears to worry Spurs FO, and I think if they don't feel confident that White is ready to step in if need be, then they might go out and get some extra insurance.

If the Spurs do trade for a SF, it'll be interesting to see how much "burn" he gets...

[mountainballer]

My point was that an "immediate contributor" could be found more easily at the backup PG spot than the backup SF spot.


disagree on this and just wanted to mention, that a player named Matt Barnes could....ok, just kidding :lol

but I'm interested, why you think that a contributor at the PG spot can be found more easily?
usually the PG job takes more lead time for a new player, than the wing spots.

[Hoy]

If we somehow got Juan Dixon, I have faith in our title-chances again. He can go off any given night for 30.

Ely should be the good gap at the backup PF spot, but I'd still like a young forward.

:dizzy


Is this an example of a mindboggle?
Juan Dixon give us a title?
What-the-stinky-fart?

[AFBlue]

disagree on this and just wanted to mention, that a player named Matt Barnes could....ok, just kidding :lol

but I'm interested, why you think that a contributor at the PG spot can be found more easily?
usually the PG job takes more lead time for a new player, than the wing spots.

Mainly, Pop's ability to trust inexperienced players. Yes, I know he went with Tony, but he yanked him in favor of veterans during the playoffs. I also know he went with Nazr, who was new to the system, but Nazr was a veteran and was given an opportunity where minutes had already been established...he simply took those minutes and outperformed Rasho.

Point is, Pop trusts Finley and I don't think he would lose confidence in Finley enough to let a guy like Singleton, or yes even Barnes, on the court to begin to prove himself.

Basically, that's my reasoning.

I do see your point on the learning curve for PG though.

[Steve-O-Matic]

To CLE: Beno Udrich and Jackie Butler

To SA: Anderson Varejao and Scot Pollard

[waly.mg]

The Spurs are needing a young SF Backup, who can be starter in a few years
A Starter Center, not Ely, or Elson, a Good Center, that is a 7-8 millions players
We can tarde now, Elson, Buttler, Ely and Oberto

[AFBlue]

To CLE: Beno Udrich and Jackie Butler

To SA: Anderson Varejao and Scot Pollard

The Cavs are said to be rebuking offers that include Varejao for Mike Bibby....

I doubt the Spurs' offer of JB and Beno can trump that. Sorry...

[Darkwaters]

Cavaliers, Two Other Teams Call Phoenix On Banks
21st February, 2007 - 1:25 pm
East Valley Tribune -
According to league sources, the Suns are talking with several teams as the trade deadline nears.

Marcus Banks and Kurt Thomas are the players other teams are bringing up in the discussions.

The Cleveland Cavaliers and at least two other teams have inquired about Banks, and the Suns might be willing to move him as a way to trim their payroll without getting anything in return.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/44811/20070221/cavaliers_two_other_teams_call_phoenix_on_banks/

Any chance the Spurs are involved in this? They'd obviously have to send something in return, but they could definately trim some payroll for the Suns.

[Mr. Body]

Not sure Phoenix and SAS would deal with each other. The big 'payroll trimmer' the Spurs had is gone, in E-Will. The only pieces I see them trading at the moment are Udrih and Butler, and those don't look valuable here.

[ChumpDumper]

That's a long contract for a guy that currently sucks.

[AFBlue]

Concur on the non-trade for Banks...not feasible

[AFBlue]

Dickau + Outlaw for Udrih + Butler?

[Mr. Body]

Jesus, man, Outlaw is not for sale.

[AFBlue]

Jesus, man, Outlaw is not for sale.

I'm like Rain Man dude, once I get an idea it's tough to get it out....

Outlaw from Portland...definitely gotta get Outlaw...definitely Outlaw...

[yavozerb]

What happened to outlaw??They guy was playing 20+ minutes early in the year and all of a sudden DNP start adding up and recently dude only plays 10-12 minutes on a good night, never saw an injury report..

[ace3g]

he had a sprained ankle for a couple of games and DNP

[mountainballer]

I'm like Rain Man dude, once I get an idea it's tough to get it out....

Outlaw from Portland...definitely gotta get Outlaw...definitely Outlaw...

Barnes, Barnes, Barnes.....

btw. does anybody know, why he got a DNP last night ? (despite overtime)
is he injured, or is this a sign, that a trade has already been agreed, but not made public? (remember Barry last year) he for sure didn't injure himself the game before, (Knicks game), b/c he was on the court at the end.

[ace3g]

yeah I noticed the same thing, if the spurs picked up Barnes that would be a great bonus off the bench, he can shoot the 3 and REBOUNDS

[mountainballer]

yeah I noticed the same thing, if the spurs picked up Barnes that would be a great bonus off the bench, he can shoot the 3 and REBOUNDS

his rebounding would be the biggest bonus currently.
and he can defend those SF/PF forewards.

[AFBlue]

Unless you want this thread to morph into a "Reasonable Trades..that didn't happen because the Spurs FO is bunch of arrogant, penny-pinching idiots" thread (which I will happily participate in), I suggest someone remove this thread from "important" status and/or close it altogther...it no longer has relevance.

[Fabbs]

Is Scola coming to SA this season and playoffs an option?
I'm not asking if he will come, he won't.
I'm asking if it's an option allowed by the rules, period.

[ChumpDumper]

Sure, he could join the team if he signed before the eligibility deadline for the playoff roster. I'm too lazy to look up the date, but I'm sure you'll see it in some article about Chucky Atkins soon enough.