Reasonable trade ideas [Archive] - SpursTalk.com Forums

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 01:42 AM

This thread is for posting reasonable trade ideas. Not like Barry for LeBron and stuff like that :)

I think there's some teams that are going to be making some moves that the Spurs should get in on.

1. Golden State. After Wednesday's trade, they are jammed at the swing positions.

JRichardson - Hurt and makes $10M plus but ShoogarBear says he might be on the move.

MEllis - I wish, but they like him too much.

SJax - Movable. Would you want him back? I'd go for Barry for SJax.

MBarnes - Might be the odd man out and the Spurs like him. Putting up good numbers. Cheap.

MPietrus - I don't think they'll move him, unless they are going to use Barnes over him.

2. Seattle. I think they are pretty much willing to move anyone.

Rashard Lewis and Ray Allen - Probably available at the right price.

One of Watson or Ridnour - One of them willlikely be traded before the deadline.

Johan Petro - Might be available in a package deal.

Danny Fortson and his expiring contract if anyone wants it. :downspin:

Damien Wilkins - On the block.

Bob Hill - Could be available soon :lmao

3. Charlotte.

Melvin Ely - Available for a expiring contract and a pick.

4. New Jersey.

Rumors of JKidd, VCarter and just about everyone else being shopped.

Marcus Bryant

01-18-2007, 01:43 AM

Condition 1

No contact received shall extend past the 2007-08 season.

tsb2000

01-18-2007, 01:45 AM

I'd trade a pretty fair amount of players for SJax after tonight.

Sacramental

01-18-2007, 01:46 AM

i know u guys want kenny thomas and ron artest :)

Sacramental

01-18-2007, 01:47 AM

Barry for LeBron

brilliant!

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 01:48 AM

rayray2k8

01-18-2007, 01:48 AM

Das Texan

01-18-2007, 01:50 AM

The player that I'd actually want from Seattle is Nick Collison. I always have thought he'd flourish next to Tim Duncan. He was playing pretty crappy this year up until a couple weeks ago. Now he's putting up 20/15 games. His averages on the season are like 7/7. He cares about D, solid offensively and knows his role, works extremely hard and doesn't make crazy money.

I would think maybe Seattle wouldn't trade him, but I don't think they care about winning at all right now. So ...

If you are going after a big then he is a damn good option. Especially if the Sonics want to go really big when Swift gets back next year, and they have Petro and whatever center they drafted again this year.

Marcus Bryant

01-18-2007, 01:54 AM

I like guards under the age of 57.

Leetonidas

01-18-2007, 01:55 AM

Nick Collison would be awesome. I've always liked that guy.

I think maybe Nellie and Pop maybe be talking Barry for Jack because GS could use 3 point shooting in that kind of offense...

Damn, I hope something happens though. I'd rather have Matt Barnes over Jack though.

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 01:55 AM

I like guards under the age of 57.

Come on, help me out here man. You are actually good at making up reasonable scenarios. Forget the 2008 rule (but still be somewhat fiscally responsible) :lol

ChumpDumper

01-18-2007, 01:57 AM

If we were seriously considering Maggette then 2008 is fungible.

Marcus Bryant

01-18-2007, 01:58 AM

The Spurs will take back a contract past 2008 when Peter Holt shows up in the AAC sporting a "I went to Highland Park and all I got was tit job" t-shirt.

TDMVPDPOY

01-18-2007, 01:58 AM

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 02:00 AM

collison is around 27 i believe.....just another role player imo

his stats look good on the sonics, but look at teh trend of all the centers on our team in the duncan era besides drob...they have good stats b4 comin to the spurs then it all goes south the border.

Actually his stats don't look good on the Sonics. He's averaging only 9 and 7. So your theory doesn't work. :lol

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 02:01 AM

If we were seriously considering Maggette then 2008 is fungible.

That's what I was thinking. Obviously that 2008 date isn't in stone, if the player is decent.

Buddy Holly

01-18-2007, 02:01 AM

I'm not a trade rules expert but can we get Jax for Barry (and others) via a three team trade?

Johnny_Blaze_47

01-18-2007, 02:02 AM

I'm not a trade rules expert but can we get Jax for Barry (and others) via a three team trade?

It can be done straight up, but Jax can't come in a package, only by himself.

Texas_Ranger

01-18-2007, 02:09 AM

We will never get Rashard Lewis, Allen, Carter and Kidd.
I would like to se S-Jax in the team one again - so I'll say Barry and Beno for S-JAx.
Then next year we could get Ely.
Pietrus and Ellis would be great for the Spurs. Finley fo Pietrus. I don't know who should we trade for Ellis.
If that doesn't work lets trade Barry and Beno the sucker for Maggette.

Buddy Holly

01-18-2007, 02:15 AM

Three team trade:

Barry to LA Clips
Beno to GS

Maggette to SA
Cuttino to GS

Richardson to LA Clips
Barnes to SA.

SA gets:

Maggette and Barnes

LA Clips get:

Richardson
Barry

GS gets:

Cuttino
Beno

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 02:30 AM

Buckets or Bust. Barry would actually fit in with the run and gun out in Golden State, as they could slide him over to run point some. You could also send out Eric Williams and Mullins would get some cap relief after this year.

Maggette's already been discussed. I also think Khryapa could be pulled away from the Bulls, they've got too many wings up there.

Also look at Antoine Wright or Nachbar over on the Nets if they're going to blow the team up, Thorn would probably welcome some expiring contracts as well. I'm not saying I'd be jumping for joy about Nachbar, but he's probably an attainable player. Wright plays great D and would be a perfect Bowen replacement (great perimeter D, likes to shoot the three from the corners).

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 03:03 AM

Also look at Antoine Wright or Nachbar over on the Nets if they're going to blow the team up, Thorn would probably welcome some expiring contracts as well. I'm not saying I'd be jumping for joy about Nachbar, but he's probably an attainable player. Wright plays great D and would be a perfect Bowen replacement (great perimeter D, likes to shoot the three from the corners).

AWright plays D? All I've heard about him since he got drafted is that he's a cocky ass and a chucker. When did he become a great perimeter defender?

Fillmoe

01-18-2007, 03:04 AM

san antonio spurs for new orleans saints...

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 03:05 AM

Wright does look kind of like a bust.

texbumTHElife

01-18-2007, 04:44 AM

I know the Maggette idea has been versed to death but I personally think he is exactly what this team needs. Here is my trade idea that works with ESPN's trade machine but im sure the Clips wouldnt do:

Spurs send:
Brent Barry
Beno Udrih

Clippers send:
Corey Maggette
Daniel Ewing

Spurs get the swing man they needed and in Ewing a player who can defend the 1 & 2 very well.

Clippers get... Whatever it was they wanted before in Beno and Barry. What it is I have no idea.

NuGGeTs-FaN

01-18-2007, 04:54 AM

what types of players are the Spurs looking for?

An athletic swingman, i know that one

A backup PG (ridding them of Beno)

what else? Or is it anyone in general just to shake the team up?

polandprzem

01-18-2007, 04:56 AM

A new thread with trades

wow - what a fresh breeze

Bruno

01-18-2007, 05:07 AM

A new thread with trades

wow - what a fresh breeze

You seems to be in a bad mood, Poland. :depressed
Calm down and stop being so sensitive. :toast

MannyIsGod

01-18-2007, 05:19 AM

A new thread with trades

wow - what a fresh breezeI know, its kinda like you complaining about women and sex - rehashed and rehased yet I doubt its the last we'll hear about it.

Its the biggest issue right now, of course there will be lots of threads on it.

JPB

01-18-2007, 05:23 AM

I remember saying, few weeks ago, that GS was full of 2-3 and maybe something could be done with them. It's even truer now.

Pietrus would be nice... but possible ? I wish it could be but it seems very very difficult.

You seems to be in a bad mood, Poland. :depressed
Calm down and stop being so sensitive. :toast

Poland is always in a bad mood.

Bruno

01-18-2007, 05:26 AM

I won't throw names (I've done enough in the past) but to me Spurs should to trades for :

- A backup PG : It's not a high priority given that Parker can play 40mpg in playoffs but Beno/Udrih have been bad this year. I don't think Spurs should give a lot (like a first round pick) or trade for a player with a big contract but if a cheap player is available, they should try to get one.

- An athletic SF : there are two possibilities :keeping Barry/Finley and geting a 5th swingman that will only play against dominant strong SF or trading Finley or Barry. Given Spurs troubles, I'm more for the big change and try to get a player like Maggette over a 5th swingman like Khryapa.

- A better PF : Spurs frontcourt was too slow last year. Duncan at C is the best solution in the "new" nba. Elson and Bonner have fasten Spurs' frontcourt but is it enough : Bonner is limited and injured, Has Elson enough BBIQ to play good team defense ?

- A big stiff : With Rasho gone, Spurs haven't anymore a big body to throw against Yao/Shaq. It's not a big need but if Spurs should find a cheap player to do that.

Bruno

01-18-2007, 05:29 AM

Poland is always in a bad mood.

Lately, yes.

Please Poland, bring back old school Poland : he was one of my favourite poster. ;)

JPB

01-18-2007, 05:38 AM

[QUOTE=Bruno]

- A better PF : Spurs frontcourt was too slow last year. Duncan at C is the best solution in the "new" nba. Elson and Bonner have fasten Spurs' frontcourt but is it enough : Bonner is limited and injured, Has Elson enough BBIQ to play good team defense ?

Maybe, but TD has always been more comfortable playing alongside another big. It releases him from some tasks.
Though, he was terrific last year against Dallas alongside Horry, so...

polandprzem

01-18-2007, 05:41 AM

You seems to be in a bad mood, Poland. :depressed
Calm down and stop being so sensitive. :toast

Well yes I am.
It's like I can't even start a thread on this board and everytime I post something I'm being called retard etc. (accually that (being called) do not bother me, cause that suites to the persons who are saying that). So I make the responses.

Point two - The spurs are losing badly, and how can't I be in a bad mood?
And I mean mantal loses. THe loses inmside the team. It is ofcourse covered by a good humor from Pop and "well we are not playing great" by the players. But the feeling is not as same as it was previously.

That about it.

polandprzem

01-18-2007, 05:42 AM

Lately, yes.

Please Poland, bring back old school Poland : he was one of my favourite poster. ;)

You kinnding me right? :p:

mountainballer

01-18-2007, 05:42 AM

the blockbuster between Pacers and GSW left both teams with still some needs to adjust. this is something the Spurs could benefit from.

Pacers: are now definitly without a shooter and have stockpiled bigs (JO, Murphy, Harrison, Diogu, Foster, Baston). considering that also their three SFs (Granger, Dunleavy, Williams) are 6-9 and might also see some time at the PF spot in theses days (especially Granger), they will for sure try to get rid of one or two bigs and to get a shooter.
at PG they are worse than they were before, so there they also have needs.
and the fact, that they will be deep in lux tax land for the next years thanks to the big aquired contracts (and Granger will also ask for a decent contract soon).
so they will be open to get some expiring contracts.

this means, they would be interested in either Beno or Brent or E.Williams (his expiring contract)

they have some players who would definitly be helpful for the Spurs.

M. Daniels: young, versatile, athletic, good defender. didn't work that well in Indy, but is a typ of player we desperatly need. maybe isn't really expandable, now that the Pacers have a thin back-court, but I'm sure they would like to get rid of his contract.

any of their long SFs: problem is, that Dunleavy is to expensive, Granger is untradeable and Williams is to much of a project (like we already have in White)

Baston: not an outstanding talent, but he could be a Elson story with the Spurs. Spurs liked him for some time and had some talks this summer. he is on a cheap contract, so the risk would be low. I'm sure he can be aquired for 2nd round picks. he wouldn't be the savior, but his defense, rebounding and shotblocking would be a great help for our front court. he is quite quick, might be able to defend some of the tall SFs.

Foster: I'm sure they would give him away for just an expiring contract. they won't find many minutes for him in the new front court.
his rebounding and defense would be great and he is a hometown boy. the problem is, that (other than Baston) at 5.5 million per year he is a bit expensive for what he delivers.

all in all there is quite some stuff to talk about and the fact that the Pacers are playing in the East makes a trade more likely, than with teams in the West.

polandprzem

01-18-2007, 05:43 AM

Ohh btw - Tell Pop to call me, I've got some new offensive tactics for him :P)

Bruno

01-18-2007, 05:57 AM

Maybe, but TD has always been more comfortable playing alongside another big. It releases him from some tasks.
Though, he was terrific last year against Dallas alongside Horry, so...

Against teams like Dallas or Lakers, TD defend the opposite C because he can't defend well on players like Odom and Dirk. In these matchups, Spurs need to have a quick big to plug with Duncan.

Streakyshooter08

01-18-2007, 06:06 AM

Bruno

01-18-2007, 06:13 AM

Well yes I am.
It's like I can't even start a thread on this board and everytime I post something I'm being called retard etc. (accually that (being called) do not bother me, cause that suites to the persons who are saying that). So I make the responses.

If I have well understood, you are angry and you hjack each thread today because Kori has said that you shouldn't have started a thread on the same subject. I'm not here to defend here (she doesn't need at all someone to do it) but it's quite understandable that she is fed up to have 10 threads on the same subject after each loss. I guess that it was nothing personal, so forget it and move on. :)

Point two - The spurs are losing badly, and how can't I be in a bad mood?
And I mean mantal loses. THe loses inmside the team. It is ofcourse covered by a good humor from Pop and "well we are not playing great" by the players. But the feeling is not as same as it was previously.

That about it.

Sprus sucking shouldn't be enough to put you in a bad mood, put things in perspective. :)

JPB

01-18-2007, 06:26 AM

How about: Oberto/Udrih/ Williams for Jasikevicius/ Pietrus

GS gets: a big
SA gets: good rebounding wing and a decent backup PG with the ability to hit the 3, both have expiring contracts

I think a package of Barry/ Udrih and Williams might be very interesting for Indiana now...

I'd take Pietrus alone for Oberto/Udrih/ Williams.

Sprus sucking shouldn't be enough to put you in a bad mood, put things in perspective. :)

yeah, my scooter has been stolen, few days ago. There IS something to really pissed about.

Well, if the Spurs could move their resting asses, I wouldn't mind though.

Streakyshooter08

01-18-2007, 06:29 AM

Another trade I would do is: (I know Indiana would not, but it works with the trade checker!)

Barry/ Udrih/ Williams for Granger/ Foster/ McLeod

silk

01-18-2007, 06:52 AM

i heard on espn things were reallly wrong between saunders and R wallace. now i don't know about his contract. And i'm not sure pistons would deal with us bbut it's an intriguing thought

polandprzem

01-18-2007, 06:57 AM

Bruno:

For spurs - no perspective

Kori - I assume you it is a personal, but I espect Kori to say :wtf R U talking about poland?

You cannot pull a reasoable trade right now.
I would love to have Quntin Ross as a spur but will not happen
I would love to have Kidd but it won't happen.

None of this trades will change the spurs mentality.

velik_m

01-18-2007, 07:22 AM

If Magette is unobtainable/too costly, Nachbar should be the next best option.

The Good:
Nachbar is versatile (can play sg, sf and pf), he's tall, athletic and has good shooting range. Has short and cheap contract.

The Bad:
D is suspect, but to be fair he was never really asked to play much defense, as most teams he's been on were run&gun, plus he's tall and mobile - that alone should be worth some defensive points.
His shooting is not all that great (half of his shots are 3pointers).
He's a Slovenian.

If the spurs want small ball, they should get him.

Texas_Ranger

01-18-2007, 08:13 AM

NAchbar for Williams.

dg7md

01-18-2007, 08:51 AM

Jason Richardson here would be like a dream come true, one of the best players to play against the Mavs (they can never stop him), and he's also one of the best clutch players.

They need a big shake-up, and anyone from that list could attribute to that shake-up.

ggoose25

01-18-2007, 09:19 AM

me thinks keep barry and trade finley and udrih for someone who can rebound the goddamn basketball. we need to go back to playing old school smash mouth ball where a big man with some balls puts kobe on his ass when he tries to go into the paint. lets get a big that can grab some boards since horry is worthless and everyone else is too small (other than elson)

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 09:33 AM

AWright plays D? All I've heard about him since he got drafted is that he's a cocky ass and a chucker. When did he become a great perimeter defender?

He was in college. As for the Nets, that's what happens when you've got Vince Carter and Richard Jefferson treating defense like it's the time you get to rest between offensive possessions.

He was a lockdown guy his senior year at A&M, and he would be again in the Spurs system. He's 6'7" with long arms.

He's not a bust, NJ is a bad fit for him playing with a bunch of chuckers.

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 09:41 AM

Another trade I would do is: (I know Indiana would not, but it works with the trade checker!)

Barry/ Udrih/ Williams for Granger/ Foster/ McLeod

Whoopdedoo. Williams + Barry for Rashard Lewis works in the trade checker too, doesn't mean it has a snowball's chance in hell of happening.

Kori asked for reasonable trade ideas. Indy isn't going to take our scrubs and expiring contracts for anything involving Danny Granger. Come on folks, be real.

M. Daniels: young, versatile, athletic, good defender. didn't work that well in Indy, but is a typ of player we desperatly need. maybe isn't really expandable, now that the Pacers have a thin back-court, but I'm sure they would like to get rid of his contract.

Daniels didn't work that well in Dallas either. It's called a trend.

Baston: not an outstanding talent, but he could be a Elson story with the Spurs. Spurs liked him for some time and had some talks this summer. he is on a cheap contract, so the risk would be low. I'm sure he can be aquired for 2nd round picks. he wouldn't be the savior, but his defense, rebounding and shotblocking would be a great help for our front court. he is quite quick, might be able to defend some of the tall SFs.

He's on a cheap contract, which for a team like Indy means he's a bargain and about as likely to be dealt as Lebron is to be traded for Beno.

FirebatMIV

01-18-2007, 10:15 AM

Andrei Kirilenko is apparently on the block.

Just saying.

ShoogarBear

01-18-2007, 10:19 AM

- A backup PG : It's not a high priority given that Parker can play 40mpg in playoffs but Beno/Udrih have been bad this year. OMG, there are two of them?

ShoogarBear

01-18-2007, 10:22 AM

Andrei Kirilenko is apparently on the block.

Just saying.Another guy making too much money, but ability-wise would be a perfect fit for the Spurs.

VaSpursFan

01-18-2007, 10:28 AM

Andrei Kirilenko is apparently on the block.

Just saying.

47's contract is shit, but a front line of AK, Timmy and Elson would be super sweet....

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 10:49 AM

47's contract is shit, but a front line of AK, Timmy and Elson would be super sweet....

Yeah, for the 20 games a year where AK is healthy.

Streakyshooter08

01-18-2007, 10:51 AM

AFBlue

01-18-2007, 10:54 AM

I thought about another possibility. If Indy wants to get rid of Dunleavy because of the bad contract the Spurs could try to make it a 3 team deal:

Indiana: Barry/ Udrih (they need good shooters an a backup PG; get rid of Dunleavys contract)
Clippers: Dunleavy/ McLeod (get rid of Maggette for Dunleavy)
Spurs: Maggette (for obvious reasons)

This is interesting, though I would've thought if the Clippers wanted to get in on the two-team trade reported yesterday they probably could have. Mikey Sr. wants junior, but apparently the Clippers FO isn't sold on him, or his contract.

It's a good idea though....

EDIT: Indy would probably want a pick from someone though.

ShoogarBear

01-18-2007, 10:54 AM

Isn't Dunleavy under the same restrictions as SJax, i.e., he can't be traded for in a package deal?

Streakyshooter08

01-18-2007, 10:57 AM

Isn't Dunleavy under the same restrictions as SJax, i.e., he can't be traded for in a package deal?

That is a thing I was wondering about. I am not sure which restrictions they have. It will be interesting to see what happens...

AFBlue

01-18-2007, 10:58 AM

Isn't Dunleavy under the same restrictions as SJax, i.e., he can't be traded for in a package deal?

No....b/c I said so

Total buzzkill.

AFBlue

01-18-2007, 11:04 AM

Honestly, my thoughts are that the Spurs will get to a point where they don't mind sacraficing a pick (even 1st round) to get Corey. If they get Maggette, I don't think I'd be pissed anymore about giving a pick as well. The Spurs losing has slowly changed my mind, I just hope the Spurs are warming to the idea too.

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 11:08 AM

It sounds like Indiana is very serious about getting Maggette and the Clips just might be happy with Dunleavy. The 8-player trade yesterday makes a lot more sense if this was planned out ahead of time. It gives the Pacers their starting SG; otherwise they'd be starting Dunleavy out of position. Plus it lets Maggs start and isn't as bad salary-wise for them. The more I look at it the more I think this was the plan all along.

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 12:21 PM

Isn't Dunleavy under the same restrictions as SJax, i.e., he can't be traded for in a package deal?

Yes, anyone that's traded can only be traded again alone within the first two months. He can't be traded in a package.

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 12:27 PM

Corey Maggette for Mike Dunleavy works perfectly under the CBA.

AFBlue

01-18-2007, 12:57 PM

Corey Maggette for Mike Dunleavy works perfectly under the CBA.

Isn't Dunleavy a "base-year" compensation player? That would mean his salary still only counts like $2M against the cap and raises next year to $10M or whatever rediculous amount the pacers are now going to pay him. Am I wrong?

If not, then a swap of Maggette for Dunleavy wouldn't work.

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 01:00 PM

Not that I know of. My understanding is the Dunleavy for Maggette swap works perfectly. And it seems very likely; yesterday's trade makes it look more obvious for the Pacers. I still don't know that Sterling wants that contract, but it's really not hideous, just long.

Bruno

01-18-2007, 01:11 PM

I thought about another possibility. If Indy wants to get rid of Dunleavy because of the bad contract the Spurs could try to make it a 3 team deal:

Indiana: Barry/ Udrih (they need good shooters an a backup PG; get rid of Dunleavys contract)
Clippers: Dunleavy/ McLeod (get rid of Maggette for Dunleavy)
Spurs: Maggette (for obvious reasons)

Interesting deal even if you should remove McLeod becuase Dunleavy can't be packaged.
You're right, Pacers really need shooters. If they trade Dunleavy for Maggette, they will become the worst shooting team in the league. I cna see them being more interested in Barry + incentives than Maggette

Streakyshooter08

01-18-2007, 01:32 PM

Interesting deal even if you should remove McLeod becuase Dunleavy can't be packaged.
You're right, Pacers really need shooters. If they trade Dunleavy for Maggette, they will become the worst shooting team in the league. I cna see them being more interested in Barry + incentives than Maggette

Thanks! This deal also works if you remove McLeod. I think the Pacers would want a Pick from either Spurs or Clippers to make it happen. I wonder if the Clippers really want Dunleavys contract. But it would make some sense imo...

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 01:53 PM

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 01:54 PM

That is a thing I was wondering about. I am not sure which restrictions they have. It will be interesting to see what happens...

They've got the same restriction anyone else has. This was covered last night.

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 01:55 PM

FirebatMIV

01-18-2007, 01:58 PM

I thought of reality. The Clips could just do Maggette for Dunleavy, which is what both of them want.

Pretty much. I understand that everyone is riding Maggette's jock cause he's athletic and a good slasher, but I'm still not convinced that he'll be the answer to all our problems.

Don't get me wrong, I have no problems with giving up Brent and Beno, and even the 1st rounder, that said, I think Maggette is fools gold. One of the biggest problems so far this year has been our inability to defend the perimeter. I don't think Maggette solves that. He adds another scorer to a team that already has two good perimeter scorers, and he is a horrible defensive player and has been a horrible shooter this year. The main benefit of Maggette would be that he allows us to be more effective in small ball because he can rebound and play the 4, but I'd rather we never play small ball in the first place, so I can't really see it as a great benefit.

I don't know, I think that this team would be better served by getting a backup point and waiting for everyone to get healthy, and cut the swing man rotation to 3 players rather than constantly shuffling four so that no one gets into any type of rhythm.

VaSpursFan

01-18-2007, 01:59 PM

By the way, can't wait to watch Beno and Barry get lit up and build a house of bricks in the playoffs. Pop is an awesome GM. No one can build a better senior citizen's team in the league. And he's even throwing a bone to the white folk.

:lol :lol :lol :lol pop/rc/FO grossly miscalculated the demand for maggs. they should have been proactive and aggressive like nellie/mullin rather than wait it out to the deadline. nellie said eff it, give him his players now so he can work on the chemistry. pop commented to such and came off looking clueless. the should have sold barry and beno high...now it looks like we're stuck with this crappy team.

Plan B had better be bonkers...

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 02:02 PM

Pretty much. I understand that everyone is riding Maggette's jock cause he's athletic and a good slasher, but I'm still not convinced that he'll be the answer to all our problems.

It's ignorant to look for a magic bullet to solve all of our problems.

But the fact is, Maggette addresses all of them but backup PG:

* Younger, athletic perimeter player who can be groomed as the Bowen replacement and help out on the wing

* Rebounding problems. Maggette's one of the best rebounding guards in the league, and would be #2 in rebounds on our team the moment he joined the roster

* Late in games can get into the lane and get to the FT line. And when he gets there he's a very good shooter

* Has some swagger. Let's face it. Our geriatric perimeter players don't bring any to this squad, Maggette's got some of that fire for the game that we used to see in Buckets.

The failure of this front office to address the perimeter with something other than senior citizen retreads on the down sloap of their careers is the greatest failure of this front office for what is now the third season running.

VaSpursFan

01-18-2007, 02:05 PM

Pretty much. I understand that everyone is riding Maggette's jock cause he's athletic and a good slasher, but I'm still not convinced that he'll be the answer to all our problems.

Don't get me wrong, I have no problems with giving up Brent and Beno, and even the 1st rounder, that said, I think Maggette is fools gold. One of the biggest problems so far this year has been our inability to defend the perimeter. I don't think Maggette solves that. He adds another scorer to a team that already has two good perimeter scorers, and he is a horrible defensive player and has been a horrible shooter this year. The main benefit of Maggette would be that he allows us to be more effective in small ball because he can rebound and play the 4, but I'd rather we never play small ball in the first place, so I can't really see it as a great benefit.

I don't know, I think that this team would be better served by getting a backup point and waiting for everyone to get healthy, and cut the swing man rotation to 3 players rather than constantly shuffling four so that no one gets into any type of rhythm.

sometimes a good defense is a good offense. essentially we're playing 3 on 5 because bruce and the center spot doesn't give us anything. the elite teams have scoring options at 4 positions...we need something similar to combat this. that way one of their scorers can't rest on d.

lock down, drag out d has been made obsolete with the new rules which favors slashers. i think maggs would have been perfect because he has the size to hold his position in the post. bowen's lil wiry ass gets tossed around down there like a rag doll so he's never in a good position to rebound. i really think maggs would help this team. apparently the FO is knows more about this than me so take what i said with a grain of salt :lol :lol

FirebatMIV

01-18-2007, 02:07 PM

It's ignorant to look for a magic bullet to solve all of our problems.

But the fact is, Maggette addresses all of them but backup PG:

* Younger, athletic perimeter player who can be groomed as the Bowen replacement and help out on the wing

* Rebounding problems. Maggette's one of the best rebounding guards in the league, and would be #2 in rebounds on our team the moment he joined the roster

* Late in games can get into the lane and get to the FT line. And when he gets there he's a very good shooter

* Has some swagger. Let's face it. Our geriatric perimeter players don't bring any to this squad, Maggette's got some of that fire for the game that we used to see in Buckets.

The failure of this front office to address the perimeter with something other than senior citizen retreads on the down sloap of their careers is the greatest failure of this front office for what is now the third season running.

I agree on the 2nd one, but I think the other three are all examples of "the grass is greener" syndrome. Maggette is by all accounts a horrible perimeter defender. His footwork, focus and defensive instincts are just flat out terrible, not to mention his questionable work ethic. He is a nice option to have out there in crunch time, but our 4th quarter lineup already consists of Tony, Tim, Manu, Bruce and which ever center we wish to have. I don't think maggette does anything to improve that lineup. The only way we can integrate him into the crunch time lineup would be to play small ball, and I think that is the exact opposite of what this team needs - which is defensive toughness on the perimeter and in the paint.

Mr.Bottomtooth

01-18-2007, 02:09 PM

Oberto+Williams+Barry+Beno+2 2nd rounders for Gerald Wallace and Sean May, then sign Will Conroy.
C DUNCAN/ELSON/BUTLER
PF MAY/BONNER/HORRY
SF WALLACE/BOWEN/WHITE
SG MANU/FINLEY
PG TONY/CONROY/VAUGHN

SoCal Lakeshow

01-18-2007, 02:11 PM

Oberto+Williams+Barry+Beno+2nd rounder for Gerald Wallace and Sean May, then sign Will Conroy.

I'm sure the Bobcats can't wait to jump all over that trade. :lol

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 02:11 PM

Oberto+Williams+Barry+Beno+2nd rounder for Gerald Wallace and Sean May, then sign Will Conroy.
C DUNCAN/ELSON/BUTLER
PF MAY/BONNER/HORRY
SF WALLACE/BOWEN/WHITE
SG MANU/FINLEY
PG TONY/CONROY/VAUGHN

Why would the Bobcats do it?

Mr.Bottomtooth

01-18-2007, 02:11 PM

I'm sure the Bobcats can't wait to jump all over that trade. :lol
I know.

Mr.Bottomtooth

01-18-2007, 02:11 PM

Why would the Bobcats do it?
I have no idea. I'm desperate.

SoCal Lakeshow

01-18-2007, 02:12 PM

I have no idea. I'm desperate.
:lol

Mr.Bottomtooth

01-18-2007, 02:13 PM

:lol
:flipoff j/k

FirebatMIV

01-18-2007, 02:13 PM

I'm usually not one for fantasy trades, but heh, here is one anyways.

http://www2.realgm.com/src_tradechecker/3/
Trade ID: 3604213

SoCal Lakeshow

01-18-2007, 02:14 PM

:flipoff j/k
:madrun :smokin

Mr.Bottomtooth

01-18-2007, 02:17 PM

:madrun :smokin
:music

gameFACE

01-18-2007, 02:21 PM

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 02:25 PM

Maggette is by all accounts a horrible perimeter defender. His footwork, focus and defensive instincts are just flat out terrible, not to mention his questionable work ethic.

People said the same thing about Stephen Jackson and Glenn Robinson. Both left here with rings. 'Nuff said.

He is a nice option to have out there in crunch time, but our 4th quarter lineup already consists of Tony, Tim, Manu, Bruce and which ever center we wish to have. I don't think maggette does anything to improve that lineup. The only way we can integrate him into the crunch time lineup would be to play small ball, and I think that is the exact opposite of what this team needs - which is defensive toughness on the perimeter and in the paint.

Whether or not you feel it's the exact opposite of what this team needs, it's what Pop thinks it needs. So if he's going to play small ball, he needs to have the personnel for it. Maggette goes farther to fitting into that model than what we currently have out there.

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 02:27 PM

I like the idea of SJAX back in a Spurs uniform but i'm not sure if his remaining contract would be considered "reasonable". Three years after this one at approximately $7mil/yr.

Granger is more likely.

Yeah, Indy is just bucking to trade one of their best players who happens to be on a rookie contract for our discards :lol

Granger would cost you Manu or Tony. Come on people, at least apply some reality to your trade scenarios.

FirebatMIV

01-18-2007, 02:32 PM

People said the same thing about Stephen Jackson and Glenn Robinson. Both left here with rings. 'Nuff said.

Whether or not you feel it's the exact opposite of what this team needs, it's what Pop thinks it needs. So if he's going to play small ball, he needs to have the personnel for it. Maggette goes farther to fitting into that model than what we currently have out there.

Posts like this makes me sad, for I know it's pretty much true.

Pop won't abandon small ball until a player calls him out on it. It's times like these that I wish Tim would just get up and say "hey, I need some help in the paint so stop sending out the midgets."

Like I said, I would have done the B+B+1st rd for Maggette trade, but I don't think it would help us all that much. I am angry that it looks like the Spurs got beat to another trade, but I'm not too broken-hearted about losing Maggette, if that makes any sense.

wildbill2u

01-18-2007, 02:37 PM

VaSpursFan

01-18-2007, 02:38 PM

Whether or not you feel it's the exact opposite of what this team needs, it's what Pop thinks it needs. So if he's going to play small ball, he needs to have the personnel for it. Maggette goes farther to fitting into that model than what we currently have out there.

exactly. we know pop isn't going away from small ball. we've seen that crap in every game this year even when there were no health issues. bowen simply can't rebound in the low post, he's too frail. if we have to sacrafice lockdown d and focus on boards off of misses, so be it. but we cannot continue to get play lock down d, get stops and then give up the offensive rebound. the defensive effort was in vain.

dallas is a capapble defensive team, not as good as us, but they rebound the ball well and that's what it takes to be effective in late game situations. i don't know how many games i watched where we gave up key offensive and defensive rebounds...

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 02:38 PM

People said the same thing about Stephen Jackson and Glenn Robinson. Both left here with rings. 'Nuff said.

Because Glenn Robinson was a huuuuuuu-uuuuge part of that championshpi. Give us a break.

FirebatMIV

01-18-2007, 02:46 PM

I notice most of the trades proposed are with West teams, probably cause we see more of them and know them better. So far, none of the trades make me drool at the mouth. But what about the East?

Lots of teams there that will be at the top of the draft heap and picking up talent at high draft picks with high prices. Maybe some of them would be willing to trade someone off in preparation for the money room needed to sign a lottery pick.

Atlanta has a bunch of talented forwards. Could we package something for one of them? They are going to have another lottery pick and will have to pay out some big money for it like they did with Marvin Williams.

Sixers are obviously cleaning house to get into the lottery. Maybe they would like a short expiring or cheap contract or two to go with their lottery prospect dreams. Anyone there.?

Charlotte? Boston? N. Orleans?

One guy I really like is Boston's Delonte West. He's big enough and good enough defensively to guard 1s or 2s, and he's a good shooter, an unselfish player and someone that's generally good under pressure. He's also out of place in Boston, where they already have Rojan Rondo and Sebastian Telfair fighting for PT at PG and guys like Tony Allen (or at least, they will next year), Paul Pierce and Gerald Greene for the 2 guard spot. I think if we give them a conditional 2008 pick and something else, we can probably get West.

gameFACE

01-18-2007, 02:51 PM

Granger would cost you Manu or Tony.
And you're asking people to apply reality.........................?

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 02:54 PM

Granger wouldn't cost as much as that, but we don't have what it would take. A guy like Jarrett Jack or Josh Childress would do it.

I'm sure the Pacers would look at Tinsley+Granger for Parker.

VaSpursFan

01-18-2007, 02:58 PM

One guy I really like is Boston's Delonte West. He's big enough and good enough defensively to guard 1s or 2s, and he's a good shooter, an unselfish player and someone that's generally good under pressure. He's also out of place in Boston, where they already have Rojan Rondo and Sebastian Telfair fighting for PT at PG and guys like Tony Allen (or at least, they will next year), Paul Pierce and Gerald Greene for the 2 guard spot. I think if we give them a conditional 2008 pick and something else, we can probably get West.

delonte would be a solid back up to tony. i like that kid. he can pass, rebound and hit the occasional 3. his numbers are down this year but that would be a major coup if we could pull that off.

Viva Las Espuelas

01-18-2007, 03:07 PM

Duncan straight up, for Dwight Howard. My buddy mentioned this and I thought I'd put it out there.

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 03:08 PM

Duncan straight up, for Dwight Howard. My buddy mentioned this and I thought I'd put it out there.

Orlando wouldn't do it.

BeerIsGood!

01-18-2007, 03:30 PM

Forget trades - if we lose every game for the rest of this year we can be in a position to land either Oden or Durant.

Tank it now. Rest Manu, TP, and TD on IR and gear up for a two year Championship run with a young gun coming in.

AFBlue

01-18-2007, 03:32 PM

FirebatMIV

01-18-2007, 03:35 PM

Orlando wouldn't do it.

Nope.

Also, they don't have the contracts.

Here's an idea that I'm throwing out there.

San Antonio trades - Eric Williams/Brent Barry/Robert Horry/ to Utah, Beno Udrih/the rights to a foreign player(Scola)/2008 1st rd pick(conditional) to Boston.

Utah trades - SF Andrei Kirilenko to San Antonio, SG CJ Miles to Boston.

Boston trades - G Delonte West to San Antonio.

San Antonio helps Utah clear its SF rotation and gives guys like Milsap and Brewer some more playing time, Utah also gets its cap space and recieves a legitimate outside shooter and some veteran playoff experience for its very young team. Boston gets another pick with which they can use to build for the future and an inside scorer/bench scorer to compliment their talented wing guys and another athletic/high potential player in CJ Miles. San Antonio gets its defensively-oriented, athletic 3 (albeit, fragile and expensive) and its backup point.

VaSpursFan

01-18-2007, 03:38 PM

Nope.

Also, they don't have the contracts.

Here's an idea that I'm throwing out there.

San Antonio trades - Eric Williams/Brent Barry/Robert Horry/ to Utah, Beno Udrih/the rights to a foreign player(Scola)/2008 1st rd pick(conditional) to Boston.

Utah trades - SF Andrei Kirilenko to San Antonio, SG CJ Miles to Boston.

Boston trades - G Delonte West to San Antonio.

San Antonio helps Utah clear its SF rotation and gives guys like Milsap and Brewer some more playing time, Utah also gets its cap space and recieves a legitimate outside shooter and some veteran playoff experience for its very young team. Boston gets another pick with which they can use to build for the future and an inside scorer/bench scorer to compliment their talented wing guys and another athletic/high potential player in CJ Miles. San Antonio gets its defensively-oriented, athletic 3 (albeit, fragile and expensive) and its backup point.

that's a decent little scenario. i could work with that.

BeerIsGood!

01-18-2007, 03:41 PM

If we lost every game from here on out, we'd still lose out on those two.

We seem to have mojo with the lottery. I think we could land a top 2 or 3, and either way we'd get someone to impact the team right away next year making the next two years at least possible Championship seasons. As it stands right now - we're probably 3 and done.

ajh18

01-18-2007, 04:13 PM

How about Barry/Udrih/and a second round pick to Memphis for Brian Cardinal and Dahntay Jones/Hakeem Warrick?

I don't know which of those two the Grizz would trade, or which we would prefer, but we would be taking one of their bad contracts off their hands, while getting either a younger, athletic defender in jones or a long 3/4 in warrick. They'd get better contracts, and a good veteran shooter in Barry, plus a pick to gamble with.

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 04:53 PM

And you're asking people to apply reality.........................?

Granger is young, he's at the center of Indy's future, and he's on a cheap contract.

Outside of the big three there is no one they would take in return for him.

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 04:54 PM

Because Glenn Robinson was a huuuuuuu-uuuuge part of that championshpi. Give us a break.

Where did I say he was a huge part? I was offering him as a counter to the whole idea that someone who is a chucker and has a rep. for bad to no defensive skills couldn't come in and play defense on this team.

regio

01-18-2007, 04:56 PM

Atlanta has a bunch of talented forwards. Could we package something for one of them? They are going to have another lottery pick and will have to pay out some big money for it like they did with Marvin Williams.

If im not mistaken Atlanta's lottery pick belongs to the suns (from the Joe Johnson trade)

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 05:08 PM

Where did I say he was a huge part? I was offering him as a counter to the whole idea that someone who is a chucker and has a rep. for bad to no defensive skills couldn't come in and play defense on this team.

Glenn Robinson is barely a blip on the radar of Spurs history, yet for a few decent sequences against Carmelo Anthony, supporters bring him up incessantly. For refuting opinion, I refer you to Ron Mercer.

Supergirl

01-18-2007, 05:10 PM

Man, Rashard Lewis would ROCK. That's exactly the kind of player we need.
What would we have to offer to get him?

Other than that - Matt Barnes, SJax, or Richard Jefferson. That's about it from that list.

We need an athletic SF/long 3 who is willing to play D and put up 10-15 points a night pretty reliably, who won't complain about limited minutes.

We'd have to give up Barry, so we better get a good 3 point shooter, and probably Beno as well.

Ed Helicopter Jones

01-18-2007, 05:10 PM

Granger is young, he's at the center of Indy's future, and he's on a cheap contract.

Outside of the big three there is no one they would take in return for him.

I've always thought Granger would be perfect as a Spur. Solid citizen, great defensive player. And he's a hit with the fans.

But Aggie's right. The Pacers organization is in love with Granger. Everything I've read makes me think it would take a lot to get him out of Indy...certainly more than the Spurs would be willing to barter.

Kori Ellis

01-18-2007, 05:13 PM

Man, Rashard Lewis would ROCK. That's exactly the kind of player we need.
What would we have to offer to get him?

Manu or Tony.

And he doesn't rebound or play D (though he was rebounding better this year, prior to his injury).

2centsworth

01-18-2007, 05:15 PM

Spurs need to plan for the near future (2-3 years) and get younger and more athletic.

They need to unload guys like Barry and Fin for picks in the draft. Maybe the spurs can get a late #1 for Barry.

Then with the money they will have next offseason they need to sign a young athletic small forward.

No more old FA signings. this team is starting to look more and more like the -'00-'02 teams.

2centsworth

01-18-2007, 05:17 PM

Manu or Tony.

And he doesn't rebound or play D (though he was rebounding better this year, prior to his injury).
I think he's getting about 7rbs per game. Now I don't know about the D.

The trade doesn't make the spurs better IMO.

AFBlue

01-18-2007, 05:17 PM

If im not mistaken Atlanta's lottery pick belongs to the suns (from the Joe Johnson trade)

It's top 3 protected. So if they have one of the worst 3 records in the league and/or it shakes out that they've got a top 3 pick, they get to keep it.

I think it goes unprotected next year.

remingtonbo2001

01-18-2007, 05:20 PM

i heard on espn things were reallly wrong between saunders and R wallace. now i don't know about his contract. And i'm not sure pistons would deal with us bbut it's an intriguing thought

Oh, how I would LOVE Rasheed playing next to Timmy. Rasheed might be the only player, with the exception of Jackson, that I would bring in, knowing full well of the emotional baggage. I doubt that would fly, but man, Tim and Rasheed in the front court would be about as intimidating as D-Rob and Tim. I wish, but seriously doubt it. Spurs FO, I doubt would take the risk. I believe it would also require giving up one of the big 3.

Mr. Body

01-18-2007, 05:26 PM

Didn't realize until looking Sheed makes $12M/yr plus two more. Also didn't realize what a well-run organization Detroit is. With their talent they aren't even scraping the luxury tax. They can even resign Billups for a decent coin this summer if they want to. They're unlike the Spurs, who have so much sunk into our three good players it's hard to manuever anywhere else.

STEVEYCU

01-18-2007, 05:32 PM

with the way berry and beno are playin we will have a hard time gettin anyone... shoulda pulled the triger on the Magette deal... the only chance the spurs get anyone who will help is by tradin draft picks and some expirin contracts to a bad team that needs to unload a longer contract guy

td4mvp21

01-18-2007, 05:57 PM

I think it's pointless to talk about trades when the fucking management won't make one.

exstatic

01-18-2007, 07:39 PM

Yeah, for the 20 games a year where AK is healthy.
He averaged 70 games for his first 5 years. That's more than Ginobili. AK47 puts us past Dallas, immediately, and that IS a contract they would take on past '08. He and Josh Smith as a FA in '08 are my first two choices. They're both tweener forwards who are long, athletic, and block a shitload of shots. AK is more polished, Josh Smith is younger.

1Parker1

01-18-2007, 08:06 PM

hoopdreams11

01-18-2007, 08:12 PM

Keyon Dooling anyone? gives the spurs the big guard they need on defense.

exstatic

01-18-2007, 08:13 PM

NuGGeTs-FaN

01-18-2007, 08:14 PM

Yeah, Indy is just bucking to trade one of their best players who happens to be on a rookie contract for our discards :lol

Granger would cost you Manu or Tony. Come on people, at least apply some reality to your trade scenarios.

exactly. Look at what Granger is doing during his 1st game back as a starter

FromWayDowntown

01-18-2007, 08:14 PM

I'd give anyone not named Duncan, Manu, or Parker for a chance to land Jermaine Oneal. He has said repeatedly that after this season is over, he thinks that the Pacers and he should part ways.

Problem is, we'd have to wait a year and I want the Spurs to win now! :madrun

Yeah, I think you're more likely to be able to get someone like (perhaps) Jeff Foster out of the Pacers. I can't see the Spurs doing that, given that they just invested in two center-types and have Bonner in the wings, but I could see that Foster might actually be a decent fit in some ways. He certainly would give the Spurs a guy who can be a tenacious rebounder at both ends, which wouldn't suck.

exstatic

01-18-2007, 08:15 PM

Keyon Dooling anyone? gives the spurs the big guard they need on defense.
Keyon Dooling is 6'3". That's PG sized. He also sucks.

hoopdreams11

01-18-2007, 08:17 PM

He's a long 6'3", faster and plays better D than Beno.

1Parker1

01-18-2007, 08:20 PM

Yeah, I think you're more likely to be able to get someone like (perhaps) Jeff Foster out of the Pacers. I can't see the Spurs doing that, given that they just invested in two center-types and have Bonner in the wings, but I could see that Foster might actually be a decent fit in some ways. He certainly would give the Spurs a guy who can be a tenacious rebounder at both ends, which wouldn't suck.

Foster's not bad either...I was under the impression that he's under contract though for some reason.

hoopdreams11

01-18-2007, 08:22 PM

other possibilities Juan Dixon, Delonte West both are tough

FromWayDowntown

01-18-2007, 08:22 PM

Foster's not bad either...I was under the impression that he's under contract though for some reason.

He signed a 6 year, $30M extension in 2002. He's a free agent after 2009, which also doesn't comply with the Spurs parameters.

Still, Barry for Foster works as a straight-up deal.

td4mvp21

01-18-2007, 08:27 PM

He signed a 6 year, $30M extension in 2002. He's a free agent after 2009, which also doesn't comply with the Spurs parameters.

Still, Barry for Foster works as a straight-up deal.

That would be a nice trade.

:drunk

FromWayDowntown

01-18-2007, 08:34 PM

That would be a nice trade.

:drunk

With a sweetner, they just might bite -- it would actually seem to address needs going in both directions and might actually make both teams slightly better.

I'm skeptical that it would ever come to pass because: (1) the Spurs just invested a bunch of money in center-types; (2) I'm not sure Indiana wants to give up Foster; (3) Foster's contract is too long for a team with a 2008 plan; and (4) it might actually make some sense.

timvp

01-18-2007, 08:34 PM

Brent Barry for Reggie Evans and DerMarr Johnson :smokin

td4mvp21

01-18-2007, 08:36 PM

Brent Barry for Reggie Evans and DerMarr Johnson :smokin

I would faint if we got Evans. That dude can REBOUND.

timvp

01-18-2007, 08:39 PM

I would faint if we got Evans. That dude can REBOUND.

Evans gets more rebounds than Oberto and Elson combined. Plus he's a better offensive player than either of them. And this year, he's actually started to play good post defense.

I would've said to offer Elson back to Denver, but he probably doesn't make their roster.

:depressed

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 09:01 PM

Glenn Robinson is barely a blip on the radar of Spurs history, yet for a few decent sequences against Carmelo Anthony, supporters bring him up incessantly. For refuting opinion, I refer you to Ron Mercer.

Yeah, Ron Mercer was a bust on the Spurs. Oh wait...

NuGGeTs-FaN

01-18-2007, 09:03 PM

Evans gets more rebounds than Oberto and Elson combined. Plus he's a better offensive player than either of them. And this year, he's actually started to play good post defense.

I would've said to offer Elson back to Denver, but he probably doesn't make their roster.

:depressed

:lol true. Jamal Sampson has played great with the minutes he has got. I didnt realise the guy could board so well

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-18-2007, 09:04 PM

He's a long 6'3", faster and plays better D than Beno.

That's a pretty low bar for him to reach. You are dreamin'. Dooling sucks.

Amuseddaysleeper

01-18-2007, 09:05 PM

I think Morris Peterson is our next most likely trade

Nashfan

01-18-2007, 09:21 PM

I honestly don't think the Spurs have anyone on their team outside of the the big three that any team would be interested in. :lmao

Sacramental

01-18-2007, 09:23 PM

I honestly don't think the Spurs have anyone on their team outside of the the big three that any team would be interested in. :lmao

a-men to that. :P

Bruno

01-19-2007, 03:59 AM

http://www.blazersedge.com/story/2007/1/19/15836/1738

Here's our weekly recap of Oregonlive's Quick Chat hosted by Casey Holdahl. As always this is a paraphrase of the questions and responses. You can listen to the entire chat here (http://www.oregonlive.com/blazers/jason_quick/).

Q: John Canzano and Chad Ford both say the Blazers should trade Zach...

A: It's easy to say but you have to ask what you could get in return. As a 23 and 10 guy his value should be high, but it would have to be the right fit for another team. He's not a great defender or a good passer and he wants a lot of shots. Only a few teams would see that as a fit. That makes it hard to talk about trading a player of his value. I think trade talks are heating up around the Blazers though. There's a rumor that they're talking to San Antonio trying to get Brent Barry for Joel Przybilla or Jamaal Magloire (the latter of which would involved Eric Williams). The Spurs say they're not interested in that but would like Travis Outlaw to help compensate for the Mavericks' athleticism. They've long been interested in Travis and will probably bid for him in the off-season if they can't get him via trade.

Q: Do the Spurs have anything the Blazers want?

A: Brent Barry! He's a shooter who doesn't demand starters' minutes. They need a role-playing shooter.

Q: He's 35 though.

A: Look what you're giving up for him. Maybe you wouldn't do Travis, but one of the centers...maybe. The Golden State trade was interesting. I thought Mike Dunleavy would have been a nice exchange for Magloire. I think the Blazers were disappointed that the trade went down. Coach McMillan also liked Ike Diogu and wouldn't have minded Dunleavy either. He says as far as he knows nothing is being discussed specifically but he expects the Blazers to be in talks around the trading deadline.

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 04:03 AM

There's a rumor that they're talking to San Antonio trying to get Brent Barry for Joel Przybilla or Jamaal Magloire (the latter of which would involved Eric Williams). The Spurs say they're not interested in that but would like Travis Outlaw to help compensate for the Mavericks' athleticism. They've long been interested in Travis and will probably bid for him in the off-season if they can't get him via trade.

Interesting.

I wouldn't have guessed Travis Outlaw but I guess I can see why. He doesn't rebound well. He can't shoot the 3. But he's a tall SF. :lol

timvp

01-19-2007, 04:10 AM

Przybilla with his testicles intact is a pretty good player. He'd be an upgrade as far as rebounding and shot blocking goes. If the Spurs think the missing thing to their defense is shot blocking, Przybilla is one of the best in the league. However, I don't see a trade that works with him. He's BYC and has a trade kicker, so I'm not sure what it'd take.

Magloire doesn't solve anything. He can be decent at times, but he's not a big enough upgrade over what the Spurs have. If the Spurs did it, it'd just be to dump Barry's salary.

Travis Outlaw is a great athlete, especially for a 6-foot-9 player. Problem is he's dumb as a box of rocks and wilts under pressure. I like him in general but not for the Spurs. He's not mentally strong enough to help them anytime soon.

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 04:15 AM

Outlaw barely makes any money. I wonder who else they are thinking of getting with him.

Bruno

01-19-2007, 04:18 AM

Maybe they have the Ndubi Ebi syndrom with Outlaw ?

I think that he can help us a little. i don't see him playing 30mpg ths year but he can be usefull for 15-20mpg with his length and athletism.

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 04:20 AM

Outlaw + Dixon = Barry?

timvp

01-19-2007, 04:22 AM

Outlaw + Dixon = Barry?

I'd do it ... but I'd like it better if there was any chance that Dixon could play point guard. Too bad he's like a 6-foot-1 shooting guard.

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 04:24 AM

I'd do it ... but I'd like it better if there was any chance that Dixon could play point guard. Too bad he's like a 6-foot-1 shooting guard.

Outlaw+Dickau= Barry

Bruno

01-19-2007, 04:26 AM

Dixon, Dickau and Magloire are the three names that makes more sense to be packages with Outlaw.

Trades that should works:
Barry + pick for Dickau + Outlaw
Barry + pick for Dixon + Outlaw
Barry + Williams + pick for Magloire + Outlaw.

timvp

01-19-2007, 04:30 AM

What about Chucky Atkins and Jake Tsakalidis for Eric Williams and Beno Udrih?

The Grizzlies are going nowhere and are just going to let Atkins and Tsakalidis walk after the season. The Spurs could plug in Atkins as their backup point guard and Tsakalidis could come in handy if the Spurs go up against Shaq or Yao in the playoffs.

Oh and Atkins and Tsakalidis both have expiring contracts.

:smokin

ChumpDumper

01-19-2007, 04:36 AM

I do think West is going senile - but do you really think he'd want that? Maybe throw in a second rounder.

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 04:45 AM

Watson + Petro for Barry + Udrih

timvp

01-19-2007, 04:55 AM

I do think West is going senile - but do you really think he'd want that? Maybe throw in a second rounder.

Yeah, throw in a sweetener if need be.

I don't find many decent point guard available that can come in and produce right away, don't cost much, play for a bad team and have an expiring contract.

Atkins isn't great but I don't see many other options out there.

JPB

01-19-2007, 05:51 AM

Watson + Petro for Barry + Udrih

Petro's not a great rebounder.

Dre_7

01-19-2007, 06:33 AM

Petro's not a great rebounder.

Beno's not a good player.

mountainballer

01-19-2007, 08:26 AM

He's on a cheap contract, which for a team like Indy means he's a bargain and about as likely to be dealt as Lebron is to be traded for Beno.

aha.
I guess you want to say with the comparison, that the chance that it will happen is rather low.
didn't know, that players on minimum contracts, who average 10 MPG and who get a DNP every third game, are virtualy untradeable.
especially when thoses players will see their minutes reduced even more, because some more guys have been aquired, who play the same spot.
hm.
in other words: it won't ever happen that team A trades a minimum player, who is a 3rd stringer on their team, to team B, where he would be a 2nd stringer and gets a minimum player in return, who happens to be a 3rd stringer on team B and would be a 2nd stringer on team A.
wait, I guess I can recall, that such trades in fact have happened in the past.
so it might be a proper conclusion, that a trade of Baston is a bit more likely than a trade of Lebron for Beno, as you claim.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 08:39 AM

Watson + Petro for Barry + Udrih

Actually I like this deal. While I'm still a proponent of fiscal responsibility in the 'out years' (aka the '08 plan), I think Watson could be a deciding factor in a championship run. His defense and energy are great and he's not offensively inept.

I see the Spurs trotting out a Parker/Watson backcourt to defensively counter the Harris/Terry and Nash/Barbosa combos.

mountainballer

01-19-2007, 09:21 AM

Actually I like this deal. While I'm still a proponent of fiscal responsibility in the 'out years' (aka the '08 plan), I think Watson could be a deciding factor in a championship run. His defense and energy are great and he's not offensively inept.

I also like the Seattle idea.
Watson is for sure available for the right price, he is unhappy in Seattle and the Sonics want to get rid of his quite big contract for a back-up PG.
but that is the major reason, why Spurs would hesitate to aquire him.
all in all he would have most of the qualities we do lack from Beno and of course he is much better than Vaughn.
I don't think, that the Sonics will throw in a Center prospect in such a deal, but maybe they would add Gelabale, a player I wished the Spurs would have drafted 2005.
(I once argued, that Spurs should have better traded down 2005, the first rounder for 2 second rounders and get Mahinmi + Gelabale for it, because no other team would have drafted Mahinmi higher than bottom half of 2nd round)

VaSpursFan

01-19-2007, 09:28 AM

I also like the Seattle idea.
Watson is for sure available for the right price, he is unhappy in Seattle and the Sonics want to get rid of his quite big contract for a back-up PG.
but that is the major reason, why Spurs would hesitate to aquire him.
all in all he would have most of the qualities we do lack from Beno and of course he is much better than Vaughn.
I don't think, that the Sonics will throw in a Center prospect in such a deal, but maybe they would add Gelabale, a player I wished the Spurs would have drafted 2005.
(I once argued, that Spurs should have better traded down 2005, the first rounder for 2 second rounders and get Mahinmi + Gelabale for it, because no other team would have drafted Mahinmi higher than bottom half of 2nd round)

my only concern with watson is he wants to start. i'm hoping that's only because he thought he was better than luke. if he can accept a back up role to tony, our PG situation is set. he'd be the best back up we've had in a long time and Pop could rest tony more. Right now, when Beno comes into the game, i expect momentum to shift and the lead to evaporate...

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 09:35 AM

I also like the Seattle idea.
Watson is for sure available for the right price, he is unhappy in Seattle and the Sonics want to get rid of his quite big contract for a back-up PG.
but that is the major reason, why Spurs would hesitate to aquire him.
all in all he would have most of the qualities we do lack from Beno and of course he is much better than Vaughn.
I don't think, that the Sonics will throw in a Center prospect in such a deal, but maybe they would add Gelabale, a player I wished the Spurs would have drafted 2005.
(I once argued, that Spurs should have better traded down 2005, the first rounder for 2 second rounders and get Mahinmi + Gelabale for it, because no other team would have drafted Mahinmi higher than bottom half of 2nd round)

Agree with everything you said (especially about the centers b/c they're unsure if any of them will pan out), except for the $$$ Watson makes.

The only downside to him making $5M+ per year is if he thinks he deserves to start or play major minutes based on that salary. I know he feels that way on a crappy Seattle team and did on a so-so Nuggets team, but one would hope he'd come to his senses on a championship-contending Spurs team with an established all-star backcourt.

Pay that kid whatever he wants as long as he helps bring home the bacon.

Bruno

01-19-2007, 09:38 AM

I once argued, that Spurs should have better traded down 2005, the first rounder for 2 second rounders and get Mahinmi + Gelabale for it, because no other team would have drafted Mahinmi higher than bottom half of 2nd round

The problem with your scenario is that Mahinmi has stayed in the draft only because Spurs have guaranteed him to draft him with a first round pick (guaranteed salary). Using a second round pick on Mahinmi wasn't possible.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 09:39 AM

Bruno

01-19-2007, 09:42 AM

Which other frenchman would you rather have? Gelabele or Petro?

Gelabale, easily.
Petro is a lazy ass who doesn't like BB and who is only a BB player because he is 7' and quite athletic. Unless he changes his mind, he is the next Moiso.

mountainballer

01-19-2007, 09:50 AM

The problem with your scenario is that Mahinmi has stayed in the draft only because Spurs have guaranteed him to draft him with a first round pick (guaranteed salary). Using a second round pick on Mahinmi wasn't possible.

probably, has this ever been confirmed?
I mean, isn't such an agreement somehow illegal?

and another (hypothetical) scenario:
what if a player had slipped far more than expected? a player like Jarret Jack (who the Spurs loved, what we know since they tried to trade Beno for him in the summer 2005)
or even someone like Hakim Warrick or Danny Granger.
would the FO have said like "oh, sorry, we know that we would be idiots not to pick thoses guys, but we commited our pick to a 18 years old Frenchman, who is an intriguing athlete, but raw as a newly-laid egg".
if they had in fact made such a commitment, the FO are even more misguided, than I thought.

mountainballer

01-19-2007, 09:55 AM

Pay that kid whatever he wants as long as he helps bring home the bacon.

I would agree, if I thought the back-up PG is the only problem we have to fix, to get a chance for winning the title.
unfortunatly the often mentioned athletic wing is even more important. so if the aquisation of Watsons contract blocks the chance for aquiring the wing, I would hesitate to throw big money at the PG, before having solved the wing issue.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 09:56 AM

probably, has this ever been confirmed?
I mean, isn't such an agreement somehow illegal?

and another (hypothetical) scenario:
what if a player had slipped far more than expected? a player like Jarret Jack (who the Spurs loved, what we know since they tried to trade Beno for him in the summer 2005)
or even someone like Hakim Warrick or Danny Granger.
would the FO have said like "oh, sorry, we know that we would be idiots not to pick thoses guys, but we commited our pick to a 18 years old Frenchman, who is an intriguing athlete, but raw as a newly-laid egg".
if they had in fact made such a commitment, the FO are even more misguided, than I thought.

Depends on the Front Office....the Clippers picked Yaroslav Korolev at #11 when Granger and a bunch of others slipped that were clearly more talented because they had a pre-draft agreement, but I'm sure there are instances where FOs go back on their word....

And to answer your question about whether a deal was in place, Mahinmi was quoted saying somethign to the effect of: "I got a call from the Spurs and was confident about my chances."

Bruno

01-19-2007, 10:20 AM

probably, has this ever been confirmed?

It has been confirmed. Mahinmi's plan was to withdraw from the 05' draft. The 05' draft was just to make some noise around his name but he has stayed because he get the guarantee to get a guaranteed contract from Spurs (a first round pick).

and another (hypothetical) scenario:
what if a player had slipped far more than expected? a player like Jarret Jack (who the Spurs loved, what we know since they tried to trade Beno for him in the summer 2005)
or even someone like Hakim Warrick or Danny Granger.
would the FO have said like "oh, sorry, we know that we would be idiots not to pick thoses guys, but we commited our pick to a 18 years old Frenchman, who is an intriguing athlete, but raw as a newly-laid egg".
if they had in fact made such a commitment, the FO are even more misguided, than I thought.

Yes they would have said that.
You had to take some risks during the draft and Spurs (especially Presti) were really high on Mahinmi. Promising a first round pick was the only way to get Mahinmi because he would easily have been a first round pick in 06'.

Mr. Body

01-19-2007, 10:29 AM

You had to take some risks during the draft and Spurs (especially Presti) were really high on Mahinmi. Promising a first round pick was the only way to get Mahinmi because he would easily have been a first round pick in 06'.

Why do you think he'd "easily" be a first round pick in '06? The big story for that type of player last year was Saer Sene, who is physically and athletically much more gifted than Mahinmi. Late in the round guys like Josh Boone were going, and it's not clear they'd be passed for him. I'm not sure who would have grabbed him before the second round.

Bruno

01-19-2007, 10:44 AM

Why do you think he'd "easily" be a first round pick in '06? The big story for that type of player last year was Saer Sene, who is physically and athletically much more gifted than Mahinmi. Late in the round guys like Josh Boone were going, and it's not clear they'd be passed for him. I'm not sure who would have grabbed him before the second round.

Sene was the 10th pick, I haven't said that Mahinmi would have been a lotery pick.

Mahinmi was a way better project than Joel Freeland who has been drafted with the last pick of the first round and he was very close (even maybe better) than Pecherov who has been drafted with the 18th pick.
Comparing him to Boone is very difficult because Bonne is 2 years older and plays in NCAA. Boone wasn't too considered as a great prospect, a lot of people have questioned his attitude.

BTW, I'm not saying that Mahinmi will be a good nba player.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 10:59 AM

I would agree, if I thought the back-up PG is the only problem we have to fix, to get a chance for winning the title.
unfortunatly the often mentioned athletic wing is even more important. so if the aquisation of Watsons contract blocks the chance for aquiring the wing, I would hesitate to throw big money at the PG, before having solved the wing issue.

Almost wrote that in response to the original Kori post, but then I thought about Williams' expiring contract and the MLE given each year to over-the-cap teams. I mean, if the Spurs make the Earl Watson acquisition, they're almost better off getting over the cap for 08 from a cost/benefit perspective right?

Bottom Line: Even if they get Watson, I think they could still snag a rebounder with Williams this year and/or the MLE next year.

Mr. Body

01-19-2007, 11:01 AM

Sene was the 10th pick, I haven't said that Mahinmi would have been a lotery pick.

Mahinmi was a way better project than Joel Freeland who has been drafted with the last pick of the first round and he was very close (even maybe better) than Pecherov who has been drafted with the 18th pick.
Comparing him to Boone is very difficult because Bonne is 2 years older and plays in NCAA. Boone wasn't too considered as a great prospect, a lot of people have questioned his attitude.

BTW, I'm not saying that Mahinmi will be a good nba player.

So by jumping the gun by a year, the Spurs were able to acquire the same player they could have had at the same spot the next year? I realize they didn't have a first in 2006, but that runs in the face of so much optimism people automatically leaven on Mahinmi around here.

I'm not saying he'll be a good NBA player, either.

mountainballer

01-19-2007, 11:15 AM

I'm not saying he'll be a good NBA player, either.

right now, I'm not saying he'll be a good Euroleague player.

Mr. Body

01-19-2007, 11:19 AM

Ha. Exactly.

*gazes forlornly at David Lee (in an entirely non-gay way)*

Bruno

01-19-2007, 11:21 AM

So by jumping the gun by a year, the Spurs were able to acquire the same player they could have had at the same spot the next year?

Mahinmi was drafted with the 28th pick in 05. He could have been drafted with the 25th pick in 06. They wanted him and they got him for sure with a late first, instead of waiting one year and maybe having him with a late first. Nice move.

With hindsight, it wasn't that stupid to spend a first round pick on a player who wasn't a legit first round pick because one year later he was a legit first round pick.

I realize they didn't have a first in 2006, but that runs in the face of so much optimism people automatically leaven on Mahinmi around here.

:wtf
It's not because two posters who have only seen highlight for him called him the next Robinson that you can say that there are so much optimism about him on this board. Most people on this board think that he is a good prospect, nothing more, nothing less.

I'm not saying he'll be a good NBA player, either.

But, I'm not saying that he will be a bust too.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 11:25 AM

Mahinmi + 2 yrs = Amare...book it!

Mr. Body

01-19-2007, 11:31 AM

Mahinmi was drafted with the 28th pick in 05. He could have been drafted with the 25th pick in 06. They wanted him and they got him for sure with a late first, instead of waiting one year and maybe having him with a late first. Nice move.

Sort of. Once again we pass up talent that could help us immediately for some bright, pinprick prospect for the future.

It's not because two posters who have only seen highlight for him called him the next Robinson that you can say that there are so much optimism about him on this board. Most people on this board think that he is a good prospect, nothing more, nothing less.

I disagree. We collectively have fallen into this flyboy, homer, gee-whiz total faith in the Spurs' draft capabilities, that Sanikidze is the answer, that Mahinmi is certainly the answer (see poster above: apparently he's Amare now). We were all thrilled with him after the pick, talking him up, and it was only within the last month that this board has seemed to turn against the drafting 'prowess' of the Spurs, which is really much more average than we've tended to believe.

But, I'm not saying that he will be a bust too.

Neither am I.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 11:40 AM

Back to topic....

Evans, though a long-term cap hit is a good idea. Turns out even with incentives that he makes less than $5M a year.

So to fix both problems it looks like this:

Barry and Beno for Watson (+ Gelabele?)

Eric Williams + pick for Evans

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 11:41 AM

(see poster above: apparently he's Amare now).

Padding the "two people who saw him dunk and say he's robinson" stat that Bruno threw out there. Being fecitious as you can tell.

Truth be told, I'm more optomistic about Butler's chances to develop into a solid post player for the Spurs than Mahinmi.

mountainballer

01-19-2007, 11:58 AM

Truth be told, I'm more optomistic about Butler's chances to develop into a solid post player for the Spurs than Mahinmi.

Freudian slip regarding Butler? :lol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optometry

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 12:07 PM

Freudian slip regarding Butler? :lol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optometry

nevermind....this thing needs a spell check

Optimistic

Actually I think this is the first time for someone to correct my spelling...not bad for almost 600 posts w/ no "reported" errors.

I'll try to uphold your standards for the future.

I do like what I see though :lol

Mr. Body

01-19-2007, 12:08 PM

Padding the "two people who saw him dunk and say he's robinson" stat that Bruno threw out there. Being fecitious as you can tell.

Sorry, PHAT. I realized it after I posted.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 12:18 PM

Sorry, PHAT. I realized it after I posted.

It's cool. Athleticism is the reason for the Amare comparison...and that's where it stops.

50 cent

01-19-2007, 12:59 PM

How about Beno for a box of tampons?

At least the tampons might hold up and perform a little better.

Nashfan

01-19-2007, 01:14 PM

You guys are crazy if you think anyone wants Brent Barry or Udrich for what you have been proposing in this thread. They are not worth much if anything! :lmao

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 01:19 PM

Petro's not a great rebounder.

Yeah he's also lazy and doesn't seem to care. My plan was just to upgrade Beno to Watson. The other players don't matter. However, I doubt the Spurs want to pay their backup point $5M+. So, it won't happen anyway. I was just throwing out ideas that matched financially.

Nashfan

01-19-2007, 01:23 PM

Watson is a much better player than Udrich so I don't see why the Sonics would want to do that trade. :dizzy

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 01:40 PM

Watson is a much better player than Udrich so I don't see why the Sonics would want to do that trade. :dizzy

They are trying to trade Watson (and Wilkins) for trash right now. They don't think Ridnour/Watson PG combo works. Plus they think Watson's contract is too long.

VaSpursFan

01-19-2007, 01:51 PM

They are trying to trade Watson (and Wilkins) for trash right now. They don't think Ridnour/Watson PG combo works. Plus they think Watson's contract is too long.

he'd be a hell of a back up to tony...but would he be content with that role?

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 02:03 PM

How about Beno for a box of tampons?

At least the tampons might hold up and perform a little better.

Hey...tampons are real "stoppers"....okay sorry :vomit:

JPB

01-19-2007, 02:13 PM

Petro's not a great rebounder

Yeah he's also lazy and doesn't seem to care. My plan was just to upgrade Beno to Watson. The other players don't matter. However, I doubt the Spurs want to pay their backup point $5M+. So, it won't happen anyway. I was just throwing out ideas that matched financially.

Remember me someone who plays for the spurs :lol He could get along well with Timmy boy.

Aggie Hoopsfan

01-19-2007, 02:15 PM

aha.
I guess you want to say with the comparison, that the chance that it will happen is rather low.
didn't know, that players on minimum contracts, who average 10 MPG and who get a DNP every third game, are virtualy untradeable.
especially when thoses players will see their minutes reduced even more, because some more guys have been aquired, who play the same spot.
hm.
in other words: it won't ever happen that team A trades a minimum player, who is a 3rd stringer on their team, to team B, where he would be a 2nd stringer and gets a minimum player in return, who happens to be a 3rd stringer on team B and would be a 2nd stringer on team A.
wait, I guess I can recall, that such trades in fact have happened in the past.
so it might be a proper conclusion, that a trade of Baston is a bit more likely than a trade of Lebron for Beno, as you claim.

Can you read? Game face was talking about Danny Granger.

Granger is more likely.

He is the one I was referring to as a pipe dream. Granger plays 30+ minutes a night, and with Harrington leaving is now the unquestioned starter at SF for Indy.

He just tallied a career high 28 points the other night for Indy. Dude isn't going anywhere.

If you're going to try to jump in a conversation and try and lay some smack down on someone's post by quoting them and acting like you know something, at least try and get the right players and the right conversation.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 02:15 PM

However, I doubt the Spurs want to pay their backup point $5M+.

Is that based on your knowledge of the Front Office, their history w/ paying back ups, or more speculation than anything? Not calling you out, just curious...

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 02:22 PM

he'd be a hell of a back up to tony...but would he be content with that role?

Tough to say, but he seemed content to back up Jason Williams on a playoff-calibur Grizzlies team.

He wasn't content being THIRD string in Denver, but wouldn't you be pissed if you signed a nice-sized contract and switched teams to play more minutes...then got demoted? He's also had an issue with his minutes in Seattle, but that is a poor team and Ridnour is playing just "okay" this year.

IMO, he'd be okay accepting a back-up role on a championship-calibur team, but there's only one way to find out....

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 02:24 PM

Is that based on your knowledge of the Front Office, their history w/ paying back ups, or more speculation than anything? Not calling you out, just curious...

Just speculation on the fact that they've been trying to keep salary down and avoid a lot of tax.

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 02:31 PM

Just speculation on the fact that they've been trying to keep salary down and avoid a lot of tax.

I know as fans we tend to overreact, but the Front Office obviously knows they have issues. Don't you think they'll eventually get desperate enough to take on some salary for the good of the team....or are they usually just that stubborn?

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 02:32 PM

I know as fans we tend to overreact, but the Front Office obviously knows they have issues. Don't you think they'll eventually get desperate enough to take on some salary for the good of the team....or are they usually just that stubborn?

I think they are willing to take on salary for a significant player. I'm just not sure they think $5M a year for several years is worth taking on for a player that would play about 12mpg.

Slinkyman

01-19-2007, 02:33 PM

They are trying to trade Watson (and Wilkins) for trash right now. They don't think Ridnour/Watson PG combo works. Plus they think Watson's contract is too long.

If i'm the spurs i'd go after both those guys(watson/wilkins). That would give us a solid back up PG and make us younger and more athletic.

I also don't know why they wouldn't pay a back up 5 mil when they're paying eric williams that much to sit the bench.

Kori Ellis

01-19-2007, 02:35 PM

I also don't know why they wouldn't pay a back up 5 mil when they're paying eric williams that much to sit the bench.

EWilliams contract expires after this season.

Watson's expires in 2010.

Darkwaters

01-19-2007, 02:40 PM

For that matter, what about Marcus Banks? Hes apparently on teh block. His contract is lengthy but comes at a more reasonable rate. Obviously though you would not want to give up too much as you're trading it to the Suns (and it would be foolish to add too much more firepower to that team).

JPB

01-19-2007, 02:45 PM

EWilliams contract expires after this season.

Watson's expires in 2010.

Yep,
Watson would be fine but wouldn't represent a dramatic boost.
That'sI dont' see the FO "sacrifying" those $ on that kind of contract considering all they did to save some, the past years.

Nashfan

01-19-2007, 03:39 PM

Darkwater,

What firepower do you think the Spur's have that the Sun's would be interested in?

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 04:29 PM

Darkwater,

What firepower do you think the Spur's have that the Sun's would be interested in?

Guarantee they'd take Barry for Banks in a heartbeat. Same type of money for 3 less years...and he'd actually play. Banks is in the doghouse bigtime...but that might be because he was never really that good, just played over his head for the time he was with the T-Wolves.

ace3g

01-19-2007, 04:49 PM

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 04:58 PM

This trade worked on realgm;

San Antonio Trade Breakdown
Outgoing

Michael Finley
6-7 SG from Wisconsin
7.3 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 1.2 apg in 20.9 minutes

Beno Udrih
6-3 PG from Slovenia (Foreign)
5.4 ppg, 1.3 rpg, 2.0 apg in 15.1 minutes

Incoming

Marcus Banks
6-2 PG from UNLV
4.2 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 1.2 apg in 9.8 minutes

Jumaine Jones
6-8 SF from Georgia
2.7 ppg, 1.4 rpg, 0.0 apg in 8.0 minutes

Trade ID: 3608184

Jumaine Jones was one of the SF I wanted the spurs to sign during the offseason, he is a 6'8 SF who shoots the 3 well, rebounds, and plays defense

Not bad....

One thought against....they signed an aged veteran swingman in Jalen Rose and he rides the pine...I'm not sure they'd want Finley or Barry and I'm not sure they're in salary dump mode before the season ends...maybe off-season.

Yes I know I'm reversing course from my Barry statment...had a second to re-think.

Nashfan

01-19-2007, 05:19 PM

^^Glad you came to your senses! :lmao

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 05:20 PM

^^Glad you came to your senses! :lmao

Glad I could bring joy to your day by saying something so funny...I guess

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 05:23 PM

More Kirilenko talk...owner spoke out publicly against him.

What does it take to get him?

remingtonbo2001

01-19-2007, 06:04 PM

Whatever happened to SPEEDY CLAXTON....Wasn't he a FA this past off-season?

MrChug

01-19-2007, 06:05 PM

I'd kill for a Barry/Bobby Jackson trade. They make about the same this year. Bobby's a dynamic PG...CLUTCH

Nashfan

01-19-2007, 06:08 PM

^^Speedy plays for the Hawks and is constantly injured. You guy's sure are reaching! :lol Someone in another thread mentioned Francis, now Watson and finally Speedy. Oh, also Banks. You don't want Banks, he has no clue on how to run an offense as the Suns have found out. One of the biggest mistakes so far this year for the Suns. :depressed

Nashfan

01-19-2007, 06:10 PM

Mr. Chug, I believe Bobby Jackson has cracked ribs if I remember correctly. Don't think he would help much.

Bruno

01-19-2007, 06:13 PM

For the backup PG spot, Brevin Knight is maybe the best solution among players available for cheap without a bad contract.

stewart

01-19-2007, 06:15 PM

If we can bring gelabale in a deal for a sonic, it could be a steal for the long term

AFBlue

01-19-2007, 08:59 PM

I'd kill for a Barry/Bobby Jackson trade. They make about the same this year. Bobby's a dynamic PG...CLUTCH

BJ got HUGELY overpaid in a long-term deal with the Hornets this off-season, is old, and injury prone. I wouldn't touch him with a ten foot pole.

Whoever mentioned Speedy....he makes like $7M a year and is probably worth $3M

Mr. Body

01-19-2007, 09:15 PM

mountainballer

01-20-2007, 07:44 AM

Can you read? Game face was talking about Danny Granger.

sorry that I have to correct you sir.
just some tips, how you can avoid to be misunderstood:
first: if you refer to someone, don't quote another posters statemant.
(as you did, just go back and check, before discrediting someone else. it is on page 2 of this thread. it wouldn't have taken you much time to do this and for sure less time than you used for abusing me)

If you're going to try to jump in a conversation and try and lay some smack down on someone's post by quoting them and acting like you know something, at least try and get the right players and the right conversation.

well, I would just use the same words for you, since you were the one who obviously mixed up the quotes.
if you had checked, you would have noticed. your behaviour is just laughable and childish.

Baston: not an outstanding talent, but he could be a Elson story with the Spurs. Spurs liked him for some time and had some talks this summer. he is on a cheap contract, so the risk would be low. I'm sure he can be aquired for 2nd round picks. he wouldn't be the savior, but his defense, rebounding and shotblocking would be a great help for our front court. he is quite quick, might be able to defend some of the tall SFs.

He's on a cheap contract, which for a team like Indy means he's a bargain and about as likely to be dealt as Lebron is to be traded for Beno.

Bruno

01-20-2007, 09:19 AM

AFBlue

01-20-2007, 10:33 AM

Another possibility for the backup PG spot is Carlos Arroyo. He is now the 3rd PG in Orlando behind Nelson and Diener. I'm not a big fan of him (too inconsistant) but he has some qualities and his contract isn't bad.

They also have Dooling right? Which one (Dooling, Diener, Arroyo) is best and available?

ArgSpursFan

01-20-2007, 10:48 AM

Another possibility for the backup PG spot is Carlos Arroyo. He is now the 3rd PG in Orlando behind Nelson and Diener. I'm not a big fan of him (too inconsistant) but he has some qualities and his contract isn't bad.

Not bad,I like the guy,I remember him from the Pistons,where he was doing good,I don´t know how he got to the Magics.

Bruno

01-20-2007, 10:50 AM

They also have Dooling right? Which one (Dooling, Diener, Arroyo) is best and available?

Dooling plays SG for them and AFAIK isn't on the block. Diener isn't a good BB player.

From today newspaper :

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/wizardsinsider/2007/01/big_win_first_place_in_east_lo.html

Some of you asked about Carlos Arroyo. I wondered the same thing. One of the Orlando writers told me that Brian Hill has lost all confidence in Arroyo and he's buried in the rotation.

If Arroyo continue to be the 3rd string backup PG behing Nelson and Diener, he will be in the trading block.
Magic are in the same case than Spurs : they have a talented backup PG (Beno/Arroyo) who is talented but inconsistent as hell and a solid 3rd stringer who is solid but limited (Vaughn/Diener).
Brian Hill is trying to do the same thing with Arroyo than Pop has done with Beno : puting him in the doghouse for one/few games to try to motivate him.

wildbill2u

01-20-2007, 12:00 PM

Let's try a different direction. Not who we'd like to get--but who we need to shop. Does Bowen have any trade potential?

He's old but still guards everyone's top scorer on the perimeter. Can shoot a little in streaks. Not a rebounder. Perrenially one of the top defenders in the league. Not too expensive a contract. Knows his role and isn't a locker room cancer.

Is there a team out there who would take him, figuring they need defensive help for a couple of years? As the lead player packaged with Beno, he'd certainly be a better trade bait than Barry.

Bruno

01-20-2007, 12:07 PM

Bruce won't be traded because he is way more valuable to Spurs than his market value. forget it.

wildbill2u

01-20-2007, 01:58 PM

Bruce won't be traded because he is way more valuable to Spurs than his market value. forget it.
Ironic that his value to the Spurs is so high if it isn't transferable to another team.

So you're saying we can't begin to get something of equal value for a perrenial all defensive team player.

stewart

01-20-2007, 02:03 PM

i don't think the spurs will trade or even try to trade bowen. I'm sure this as something to do with being "fair" with him for what he brought to the spurs. This kind of think have nothing to do with the way a professionnal team should be driven.

Big P

01-20-2007, 02:41 PM

Ironic that his value to the Spurs is so high if it isn't transferable to another team.

So you're saying we can't begin to get something of equal value for a perrenial all defensive team player.

What he means is...Bowen is making only $3.75 mil this year..since salaries have to match up the players that we would get for him would be low priced players as well..Bowen is one of the biggest bargains in the NBA & the value we would get for him in trade is lower than the value of him staying on the team.

silk

01-20-2007, 03:34 PM

Travis outlaw the more realistic name i've seen out there he blocks 1.5 shots per game yougne tall athletic with some works could get soe rebounds in a small ball line-up could come in handy i like juan dixon and prizbilla too but the first can't pass could pop learn him? pryz contracts not that good i heard and against the mavs or suns i don't know if he woul be very usefuk

Bruno

01-20-2007, 04:09 PM

So you're saying we can't begin to get something of equal value for a perrenial all defensive team player.

For Spurs, he is one of the key (the other is Duncan) of Spurs defense, a player who knows perfectly what he should do on the court and a model citizen.

For the other teams, he is a great defender but he is too very old and very limited on the offenseive end.

If Spurs decided to trade Bowen, they would get in return a player that would be way less usefull for them than Bowen.

Streakyshooter08

01-23-2007, 05:33 AM

It seems like Matt Barnes has fallen out of the rotation of the Warriors. Mabye there is a good chance of getting him cheap...

mountainballer

01-23-2007, 07:10 AM

It seems like Matt Barnes has fallen out of the rotation of the Warriors. Mabye there is a good chance of getting him cheap...

there were some predictions, that this will happen.
Barnes would definitly help right now. his offense is inconsistent, but his rebounding and hustling will be what the Spurs are asking for anyhow.

I would love to see a bigger trade.
Beno + Williams for Barnes + Jasikevicius.

Saras can't be part of a package, but they could do two seperate trades:
Jasikevicius for Williams (+2nd round pick)
Beno for Barnes

is there a rule that forbids this? (like two trades of the same teams within a certain time span or so.)

Barnes would be a huge upgrade over Williams and Saras over Beno.
Warriors might do it to save money (the 3rd year of Saras contract at 4 million, they have to get some cap space to be able to resign Pietrus without paying lux tax) and if they can get some teasers (2nd rounders or rights).
I read that Nelson will have problems with Saras and his stand-still shooting. something that would be a better fit with the Spurs anyhow.

Bruno

01-23-2007, 08:19 AM

Last night :
Duhon : DNP CD
Arroyo : DNP CD

Streakyshooter08

01-23-2007, 08:39 AM

Last night :
Duhon : DNP CD
Arroyo : DNP CD

Mhm...Duhon+Khryapa for...

dbestpro

01-23-2007, 09:12 AM

ace3g

01-23-2007, 09:32 AM

It seems like Matt Barnes has fallen out of the rotation of the Warriors. Mabye there is a good chance of getting him cheap...

yeah I also noticed that he didn't play last night which is strange because he played 30 + minutes in the previous game

I sort of hope he did fall out of the rotation and was the odd man out; hopefully somehow the spurs can pick him up, he is exactly what the spurs need

Dalamar_the_Dark

01-23-2007, 09:40 AM

rascal

01-23-2007, 09:45 AM

How about Carlos Arroyo as the backup pg? He had some good games while with Utah and can be a good backup.

Streakyshooter08

01-23-2007, 10:00 AM

I think it is very unlikely that the Spurs will trade one of the big 3... unless it is a deal they can't reject.

What do you think would the Bulls want for a Khryapa/ Duhon package?

Khryapa is a long SF who is a decent rebounder (his rebounding numbers looked pretty good when he got minutes in the preseason) and he is pretty young.

It think they might be interested in Barry but who else would it take?

Agloco

01-23-2007, 10:03 AM

Bowen is old now. We needed someone this year to groom for his spot. We waited a year too long IMO.

We also need a young athletic center next to Timmy (anyone know what happened to the project from France, Ian Mahinmi (sp)?)

Some better defenders off the bench would be great as well. I was never high on Finley for that reason. He's all offense. You see how his game suffers when he has to play defense........

Beno disappoints to no end. Tons of talent and you can see it, every so often. Thats the problem...... every so often. They need consistency off the bench at the point because Tony is more than capable of throwing up a goose-egg on occasion.

Good fits are there position wise. I just don't know about the economics of the situation.

Jimcs50

01-23-2007, 10:07 AM

ArgSpursFan

01-23-2007, 11:04 AM

I suggested this on another thread. I think it would work as Isiah always has the motto that if he gets the best player in the deal he will do it. Here's who he gets an all star.

David Lee plus Jamal Crawford for Manu.

I like David Lee and while Crawford has a big contract and has questionable shot selection, both are energy guys. Manu also has a pretty big contract and would be difficult to move later. Lee is a grinder and can rebound and score some. Crawford and put up 20 a night and can handle the ball as well. Crawford is also pretty clutch and is 3 years younger than Manu. Lee can also be our long 3.

I personally would like to pull this off.

Ridiculous,They shouln´t trade non of the big three,If you do that wait 15 years to win another championship.I don´t like parker being Iverson´s clone this year,but still shouln´t trade him,or manu or timmy,for nothing.
I ´d defenetly trade a beno,finley pakage for a decent forward,but that´s about it

Bruno

01-23-2007, 11:19 AM

Lee is one of the most overrated player in the league.

ArgSpursFan

01-23-2007, 11:29 AM

Lee is one of the most overrated player in the league.

i see your point,but you can´t just throw away a team´s foundation just like that,There are teams like the Knicks who have been trying to build a team foundation for years,but the can,samething the many teams in the league.
Did you realize that these three guys have been playing together for 5 years now??check the stats and see how many reg seasons games they played together and how maney the won+all the playoffs games and two NBA tittles,thats too much to give away for a couple of guys who are just some good promesses.
get rid of averybody else if you want to,but don´t touch the team foundation.

Bruno

01-23-2007, 11:47 AM

i see your point,but you can´t just throw away a team´s foundation just like that,There are teams like the Knicks who have been trying to build a team foundation for years,but the can,samething the many teams in the league.
Did you realize that these three guys have been playing together for 5 years now??check the stats and see how many reg seasons games they played together and how maney the won+all the playoffs games and two NBA tittles,thats too much to give away for a couple of guys who are just some good promesses.
get rid of averybody else if you want to,but don´t touch the team foundation.

:wtf
RIF

AFBlue

01-23-2007, 01:03 PM

telecomguy

01-23-2007, 01:07 PM

The Spurs have three quality starters, so the issue is really about putting high energy reserves around these guys.

I like Daniels, Najera and Foster. All play hard and would give our bench the muscle needed to keep in the game. I would trade anyone from the bench except Barry to get those three.

Najera would be a VERY GOOD addition as he can play hard-nosed defence against Josh Howard and even Dirk Nowitzki. He can also rebound and is an all-around winner/hustle player. Foster is a great offensive rebounder and is also a perfect fit for Spurs.

We need to address rebounding and small forward deficit so between the two, Najera is probably a better fit as he can play different roles whereas Foster is strictly a garbage pick-up guy with great rebounding skills.

Darkwaters

01-23-2007, 01:09 PM

Vasquez looks like a solid pick despite the fact that he has been unwilling to come over to the NBA. Before the team makes any trades to bring over an international player they need to have some discussions with the guy to ensure that he will be in uniform.

Apparently, Vasquez turned down the spot on the magic because he didn't want to be "Dwight Howard's career backup". Surely he wouldn't want to be behind Duncan either then. Do we think he could be a starting center-type of guy?

AFBlue

01-23-2007, 01:15 PM

Carlos Arroyo had his second DNP in the last three Magic games and appears to be replaced by Travis Diener in the backup PG role. There's also news that the Magic are looking to move Fran Vasquez, their lottery pick from '05 that snubbed them and went to play in the Euroleague, and are looking for more shooting or a big. So here's two deals that could work:

1) Williams straight up for Arroyo

2) Barry for Arroyo + Rights to Fran Vasquez

What do you think?

Read a little more into the Magic trade rumors and apparently they're looking for inside help....so here's one more.

Barry + Butler (+ pick?) for Arroyo + Trevor Ariza + Rights to Fran Vasquez

The Magic get a shooter and another inside presence....

The Spurs get the backup PG, the long three, and a replacement for Butler in the long-term.

wildbill2u

01-23-2007, 01:18 PM

What he means is...Bowen is making only $3.75 mil this year..since salaries have to match up the players that we would get for him would be low priced players as well..Bowen is one of the biggest bargains in the NBA & the value we would get for him in trade is lower than the value of him staying on the team.
If you plan to get value for value in a trade to upgrade the team, then you have to give up something of value. I don't think we trade our core of All-stars--TD, Manu or TP-- so who does that leave that has any real value to another team? Bowen is an all-Pro and not a bad value to a team looking for defense.

I was surprised to see that Bowen was only getting 3.75 million. Damn, that's a cheap contract. The cost, even when projected over the remainder of his career (with raises) should be attractive to someone. Add another player as a sweetener and payroll equalizer and you'd think someone out there would be interested if they have a player they need to move.

sa_butta

01-23-2007, 01:23 PM

mountainballer

01-23-2007, 01:38 PM

I was surprised to see that Bowen was only getting 3.75 million. Damn, that's a cheap contract. The cost, even when projected over the remainder of his career (with raises) should be attractive to someone. Add another player as a sweetener and payroll equalizer and you'd think someone out there would be interested if they have a player they need to move.

Bowen is 35.
he is a typical system player, other teams will ask twice if he could ever make as much of an impact in a different system and they will ask if it makes sense to work an old player into the new system.
if he fails to integrate, he is close to worthless.
considering, that his offense is very limited, the 3.7 million he makes isn't a bargain. it's not exorbitant either, but most teams will think if they can't get his production for less money.
but all in all I would think that Bowen won't ever be as valueable for another team, as he is for the Spurs, even if age has slowed him a bit. so we will always lose more than we can win in a trade.