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If Cam had another assist, he'd be dead even, not in the hole. Sochan also had fewer turnovers. His ratio was 1.8 / 1.6. That's about what you're looking for in college PF.
Sochan only shot .063 better than Amen in college from 3 and shot .057 worse in FT%
If you were high on Sochan in believing he can improve than why not Amen who is far more athletic than Sochan.
If Cam had another assist, he'd be dead even, not in the hole. Sochan also had fewer turnovers. His ratio was 1.8 / 1.6. That's about what you're looking for in college PF.
Again, you need to analyze WHY his assist to turnover rate is low. I do believe his court vision has to do with it, but also it's related to the way he's used to play, he tries to finish by himself way too much and that results in getting trapped and racking up TOs. With proper coaching, smart teammates and better spacing, the same situations where he ended up losing the ball he kicks it out and avoids the TO plus gets the assist, and his AS/TO ratio improves significantly. You don't need 5 playmakers, he needs to simply avoid being a huge liability in those situations and whatever he gives up his strengths will compensate for. In context, I don't think this issue is a deal breaker.
Actually, Pop kind of likes that, and the Spurs tend towards drafting secondary creators, not guys who have to be taught a basic kickout pass. His rebounding is light, too. Of the four domestic big forwards, he's the overall worst.
Is Thompson actually that much faster than Sochan?
Regardless, again this is the fallacy of looking at stats like a broken computer. Sochan played very high level college basketball. Amen... didn't. Not even close.
Wesley didn't really get a huge amount of playing time and he was in the Gleague.
Whitmore is a better Prospect, to be sure, but he'll be a total ball stopper unless they do a lot to change him. I'd submit that Wesley got time because he could circulate the ball and play defense. At least Whitmore can play defense, but moving the ball is another issue. I've compared him to Keldon Johnson. If Keldon's on the move with the ball, it's to the rim. He doesn't see the floor.
He's just eye poppingly bad in his asst TO ratio. He doesn't really excel at much else either.
Last edited by Mr. Body; 05-08-2023 at 01:57 PM.
Yes, Amen is much faster that Sochan. I'm not as high on Amen as some (I don't have him top 5), but his his athleticism, speed, etc is legit.
Which is why I'm just slightly higher on Amen than Scoot though I don't like either on the Spurs. Amen is 6'7" and should at least be a boost on defense as a PG where we could use some help. Offensively, neither oexcitement. me.
Sure, but Sochan's extremely fast for his position. Again, though, athleticism might win you a possession here or there, but it's not basketball.
speaking of red flags... brandon miller feels like a safer bet to pan out as a good NBA player than Amen
its just so hard to judge Amen other than his traits, because the level of play at OTE is just atrociously bad. its full of high school guys who werent good enough to play in college or G League Ignite. Amen requires a ton of projection, though his traits are somewhat eye popping. i dont hate him, and id probably start considering him anywhere past #3. but with him, you are looking at a guy who probably is not NBA ready and is legitimately a project. his obvious comp is ben simmons for good and bad reasons.
if Amen had his level of production playing for a college team, his stock would be higher. but we dont have that data point.
his brother feels safer because he at least has a functional jump shot
That all makes sense. I agree with most of that, but I wonder if the Spurs would actually pick Miller at 3, so then who? It will be interesting.
Keep spinning crap when the stats don't support your claims. Both Amen and Sochan are poor 3 point shooters.
You believed Sochan can/will improve then why not Amen?
Spurs have already said they aren't picking Miller.
Amen's shoot is way more broken than sochan's
Sochan already played one full year in the NBA, prior to that he played College basketball at Baylor and international FIBA compe ions with Poland. At all levels he displayed an extremely high compe ive nature and basketball IQ, and all around skill set. Meanwhile, the Thompsons are 4 MONTHS OLDER than Sochan and are still playing mediocre high schoolers, where they don't really stand out like they should statistically, other than for their awful shooting percentages. There's no way to properly assess them, and that's by design. How will they fare in the NBA, it's anybody's guess. If we end up picking 7, then whatever, but at 2, 3, 4, taking one of those guys feels like playing Russian roulette.
That's why I added "maybe" as a caveat.
Link please?
The point isn't moot in my mind. I do think whoever the Spurs draft is going to be in the rotation, both on virtue of how much the Spurs have to like that player to draft them and because of how awful their team is. I don't think not believing the Spurs like Amen is invalid, despite timvp's sources. But I do think you're overplaying what flaws the Spurs would consider unplayable. If a guy needs to learn to pass, but he's still BPA, they will draft him, put him in the rotation and have him learn to pass with the big club. They aren't going to draft someone they think can't play at all. I do think they'll put an even higher emphasis on their ability to work players out and in general have full access to the prospects given their high standing.
I'm honestly pretty against trading back. The Spurs should pick BPA and not worry about getting cute. They are trying to make a statement with this pick, not "get value". That's why it's okay if the pick busts rather than becomes a meh player. The Spurs can get any mediocre pick in this draft that they'd want using their other assets. So unless they hate this draft, they should just take the guy they like the most wherever they pick. If that means reaching, so be it. If that means taking a risk, so be it. Ignoring that there might not be a trade out there that allows them to move exactly where they want to for enough value to make it worth it, I don't think them trading down would ever get to the point where they could justify not playing them right away. Again, Sochan got the nod despite his rawness. That's their actual trend, not what they did with late picks when they were a contender.
They actually haven’t. timvp said that one Eastern Congerence GM’s opinion was that the Spurs wouldn’t. That’s not the same thing at all.
I pretty much agree on all fronts and think there is Zero way they put a top 5 pick in the G-League no matter who here thinks what.
That's Draft capital that needs to be fast-tracked with the big boys at all costs, positive, or negative.
Appreciate the clarification.
I can never trust rascal at face value most of the time.
Sorry rascal.
Why so much Amen talk, we’re drafting Wemby! Manifest it fellas
nommmmm... nommmmm... nommmmm... Necronominommmmmm... nommmmm... nommmmm...
I'm reading here or there "spurs should pick BPA". OK, but isn't it the whole point? WHO is the BPA 2 to 7?
That's the 60 million dollar question. It's very up in the air.
Every pick has such plusses and minuses.
Watch a pick in the late teens be the best pick in the Draft as Wemby is injured most of his career and the top 7 are all goobs.
It's happened before.
Many times.
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