E-mail from my 3rd grader's teacher

[mrsmaalox]

i disagree with this statement. the only people i know "using" their degrees graduated with engineering degrees from UT.

That goes for health care/medical degrees as well.

[lebomb]

I'm betting the positions required a degree plus some level of experience.

Some yes, some no.

[peewee's lovechild]

Your school's principal is broken....

although there has been some of that going on in my wife's school.

bottom line is funding. Too many failing kids = less/no aid

Basically all the principals in that district work in that fashion. Many of my family members are teachers and they all have principals that are exactly that way.

As for funding, that district is the biggest district south of San Antonio, and they get funding up the wazoo.

[peewee's lovechild]

Another example of how schools have ed up, many high schools have year book pages dedicated to girls that have gotten pregnant throught the year.

I'm not joking about this.

There is a section on most high school year books called "School Moms" or a variety of that.

This would've been unthinkable 15 years ago.

[peewee's lovechild]

eh....you and I both know the paperwork involved in putting a kid in ISS.You yourself said that asst principal's kicked the kids back and told you to deal with it....

and if you have a better discipline system than ISS or alt school, feel free to share.

In a perfect world, a simple phone call to parents should end whatever discipline problems a kid is having......but we all know it's rare that it does.

I think parents have come to rely on the public schools being the ones to shoulder the discpline problems which to me is problem #1.

Long term ISS requires paperwork, temporary ISS doesn't. I've gone to ISS on any given day and they have kids sitting on the floor because teachers send them there.

They get sent back, but their next teacher sends them to ISS again and the cycle repeats itself.

I agree with the last bit of your statement, but I also believe that corporal punishment would go a looooooong way to help solving this problem.

[The Reckoning]

Another example of how schools have ed up, many high schools have year book pages dedicated to girls that have gotten pregnant throught the year..

i had a pregnant girl in my 8th grade class. she was treated like a queen...


but seriously, i really hope these kids getting babied in elementary school end up ing up beyond belief and drop out of high school.

they then can come work for me for low pay

[BacktoBasics]

Ehhhh, I agree to an extent. College makes you a more well rounded person. All of the basic classes you are required to take besides your major helps with that. At a trade school you are only focusing on one thing usually. I guess it depends.

In my opinion HS should make you a more well rounded person. As well as help develop a clear path for a career. College could be "specifically" designed for higher education as well as expanding certain areas of interest (IE being more well rounded). Instead of 4 years being pissed away trying to figure it out. More emphasis on a clear purpose with college. We've turned a form of higher learning into a glorified HS era of uncertainty and childhood antics.

[desflood]

well if you have research to show that apathy comes from being educated in a public school system, I'd love to see

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Dum...5714489/?itm=1

This guy spells it out much better than I ever could.

[peewee's lovechild]

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Dum...5714489/?itm=1

This guy spells it out much better than I ever could.

That looks like an interesting read.

[desflood]

He's written several. The guy was a NY public school teacher for thirty years, even won state teacher of the year. He spells out in his books exactly how the system runs and the purpose of running it that way - to mass produce workers who don't question anything.

[The Reckoning]

to mass produce workers who don't question anything.

as it should. noone to challenge me for my bid as their boss.

[Jekka]

One of my best friends is in the middle of his 2nd year of teaching math at the middle school level in the public school system (not in a wealthy district) - he spent his first year teaching math to 7th and 8th graders who had failed the standardized math tests the year before, and his classes had a 70% passing rate after his instruction.

That being said, he was mercilessly harassed by the administration, even though (or maybe especially because) the kids liked him, and he prefers to teach with a system of respect rather than fear. He has had really good results with this, in spite of the administration (who this year put him in 6th grade math, which he specifically stated he did NOT want to do ... so they're making him pay, basically for getting good results, and they're taking him away from the kids that need him most).

I agree that the system is pretty broken, and I think that if my friend were not as dedicated to the profession that his teaching would have really suffered. He hasn't been able to get parents involved, because they don't care for the most part - it's just a really hard place to be effective.

[CuckingFunt]

"I wanted to let you know that I had to talk with your child today because of how she has been treating other students. Today, a girl bent over and part of her underwear showed and your daughter proceeded to tell others about it until the girl was in tears. At the beginning of the year she had to go to the counselor because she started a club for girls who disliked a particular classmate. I asked your child why she feels like she is bettee than the other students and she didn't have an answer. I have talked with the girls in my class at length about how thet treat each other, but your daughter still seems to think she should get her way. I think she is losing friends and cannot treat others that way. Please discuss this with her because there are a lot of feelings getting hurt at school."


How would you respond?

I'd tell my kid to stop being a .

And I'd start teaching her grammar and spelling at home.

[I Love Me Some Me]

I'd tell my kid to stop being a .

And I'd start teaching her grammar and spelling at home.

I didn't phrase it as eloquently as you have, but she was told to get her act together.

[CuckingFunt]

You have no idea what it's like to teach in the public sector and you have no idea how public education is failing our children.

Public education is failing our children because our society is failing our children. Parents are ed up, schools are ed up, kids are ed up, and none of this exists in a vacuum.

It is all a product of how we, as a culture, value education. It's not about learning anymore; it's about succeeding. It's about progressing, about graduating, about ing leveling up. By and large, people will do just as much as they have to in order to move forward -- students put forth the minimum effort to get a passing grade, parents put forth the minimal effort to make sure their kids don't drop out, people do just enough at work to make sure they aren't fired, and teachers (some, not all) will do just enough to make sure that there isn't a riot in the classroom. Even in a college atmosphere, in upper division major specific classes, I find that truly engaging with the material tends to be the exception, and not the rule.

There needs to be a complete paradigm shift in order to remove the biases that this country has against taking a genuine interest in something. Caring too much -- about learning, about intellect, about people, whatever -- is to be ridiculed. At every level, and in every setting. Enthusiasm is silly. Commitment and dedication mean that you've sold out. Instead we reward indifference and dumb luck (and if the months of "real American" rhetoric we were all treated to isn't proof of this, I don't know what is).

Until this changes, wholly, and at every level, there's no hope of really improving our education system. Public or private.

[JoeChalupa]

With so many college educated people why can't the system get fixed? I hear about these school Phd superintendents making the big bucks. Are their hands that tied by government?

[CuckingFunt]

Ask yourself why they had to start there.

Likely financial reasons.

[desflood]

With so many college educated people why can't the system get fixed? I hear about these school Phd superintendents making the big bucks. Are their hands that tied by government?

This is what the system was set up to be - it's how they wanted it, they don't see it as broken and they don't want it "fixed". It's the old tyranny of government wrapped in the s of "What's Best for The Children and The Future of This Country".

[CuckingFunt]

LOL, then you dont know many people. I have a degree and everyone that works for me is required to have a bachelors minimum. We wont even look at your resume without the degree. My sister works at UT and she has her masters from Utsa. My buddy I talked about is a professor at a university right now. I have 3 cousins that work on the east coast.....all of their positions required a degree.

*shrugs*

There's a difference between having a degree and using your degree. Liberal arts degrees can help make you attractive to employers, but that doesn't mean you'll be working anywhere near your field of study.

If I continue my education as planned, I'll have (at least) a BA and MFA in Art History and an MLIS. I can pretty well guarantee that, of the three, the library degree is the one that eventually gets me hired. If it's in an ins ution that's even tangentially related to Art History, I'll consider myself extremely lucky.

[peewee's lovechild]

Public education is failing our children because our society is failing our children. Parents are ed up, schools are ed up, kids are ed up, and none of this exists in a vacuum.

It is all a product of how we, as a culture, value education. It's not about learning anymore; it's about succeeding. It's about progressing, about graduating, about ing leveling up. By and large, people will do just as much as they have to in order to move forward -- students put forth the minimum effort to get a passing grade, parents put forth the minimal effort to make sure their kids don't drop out, people do just enough at work to make sure they aren't fired, and teachers (some, not all) will do just enough to make sure that there isn't a riot in the classroom. Even in a college atmosphere, in upper division major specific classes, I find that truly engaging with the material tends to be the exception, and not the rule.

There needs to be a complete paradigm shift in order to remove the biases that this country has against taking a genuine interest in something. Caring too much -- about learning, about intellect, about people, whatever -- is to be ridiculed. At every level, and in every setting. Enthusiasm is silly. Commitment and dedication mean that you've sold out. Instead we reward indifference and dumb luck (and if the months of "real American" rhetoric we were all treated to isn't proof of this, I don't know what is).

Until this changes, wholly, and at every level, there's no hope of really improving our education system. Public or private.

I completely agree with you.

[CuckingFunt]

In my opinion HS should make you a more well rounded person. As well as help develop a clear path for a career. College could be "specifically" designed for higher education as well as expanding certain areas of interest (IE being more well rounded). Instead of 4 years being pissed away trying to figure it out. More emphasis on a clear purpose with college. We've turned a form of higher learning into a glorified HS era of uncertainty and childhood antics.

I disagree with a lot of this, but I think we've already had that argument before.

[peewee's lovechild]

With so many college educated people why can't the system get fixed? I hear about these school Phd superintendents making the big bucks. Are their hands that tied by government?

The short answer: Yes.

[peewee's lovechild]

Likely financial reasons.

Not at all, though I would agree that for some this may very well be the reason.

But, most of those students can't reach the academic standards most 4 year Us have.

[lebomb]

There's a difference between having a degree and using your degree. Liberal arts degrees can help make you attractive to employers, but that doesn't mean you'll be working anywhere near your field of study.

If I continue my education as planned, I'll have (at least) a BA and MFA in Art History and an MLIS. I can pretty well guarantee that, of the three, the library degree is the one that eventually gets me hired. If it's in an ins ution that's even tangentially related to Art History, I'll consider myself extremely lucky.

True it is career based. My degree, my friends degree and my sisters degree are all directly related to our field. They actually had to be, based on the employment posting.

Whatever..........we all take different paths............those who dont want to attend college, that is cool. Those who do........coooooooooooooooooooooooool.

[JoeChalupa]

Well I've got a 15 yr old and I've been on her about college from day one. With so many degrees out there.....I'm so confused. I would think that a BA and MFA in Art History and an MLIS wouldn't do squat for someone but clearly I'm wrong. There are so many fields where you can make good money without a degree as long as you specialize in that field.