FkLA, DxB, and the other re are all ty versions of what used to be considered a troll around here IMO
KG never got his team to the finals as the first option.
Dirk did.
I think Dirk has had more great years than KG has as well.
But I'm probably the most biased person on the earth for this topic. One is my favorite player and the other is my most hated.
Practically every year, they had 8 consecutive playoff appearances which culminated in the WCF appearance...that was followed by a year filled with injuries to Cassell and the whole "I have to feed my family" thing with Spree. Than the final one in Minnesota without Spree that led to KG demanding out. So 8 out of 10 years they were in the playoffs.They were in the playoffs every year?
You might wanna do a little research first
YOU might wanna do a little research bro.
I'll say KG so far ...
Both have MVP's and both have been to the Finals ...and to be honest I thin dirk probaly played better in the Finals ...but the question really is what are people in this forum about? Winning or stats, hype and potential and the mythical arguments about if you swap him with him crap?
Bottom line is in all 4 major sports my favorite players since 1980 only a few of my all time favorite players have NOT won a le.
Here is my list: (*next to the non le winners)
NBA - Kobe, Magic, Kareem, Hakeem, Shawn Kemp*, Gary Payton, Nique, Worthy Barkley* Bird (after 87 hated him BEFORE that) Reggie miller*, Robert Horry, Duncan and Wade - Only 3 havent won at least ONE le
NFL - Marino*, Manning LT (OG), LT2*, Marshall faulk, the woodsons (Darren & Rod), Ray-ray Lewis, Emmitt,Troy, Mike Irvin, Marcus Allen, Shannon Sharpe, Charles Haley, Mike Singletary, Phil simms Ed reed, Reggie wayne (the U baby!) , Reggie white, Randy moss Charles Woodson* and Demarcus Ware* (again only 3 havent won a le)
NHL - Mario, Jagr, Crosby, Malkin, modano Roy
MLB- Griffey*, Arod, Howard, Rollins, Gooden, straw, Schilling, Manny Papi Vlad
Point is ...I dont care what stats you put up or who you played with but to be the best you have to win ... YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME that's it (shout out 2 Herm).
The very best find a way to get to a le ...even if they need help like KG did. Doesnt matter ...the ring is the thing! ANYtime guys have similar stats I will always pick the guy with the ring over the other ... les matter most ...
and most of these guys won in college (if they went) as well ...
Some of you should seek medical help. I'm serious. KG had Rasho, just like Duncan? I mean, that's some serious illness.
[quote=Findog;3970366]Dirk had more talent around him in Dallas than KG did in Minnesota, but Dirk also never had Ray Allen and Paul Pierce next to him either.
KG > Dirk career, since he has a ring as a Robin and was an all-world defender for so long, although if Dirk ever wins a le as a first or second option, he gets the nod.quote]
What do you mean by having a ring as a Robin?
----------------
This is only a discussion because the casual fan overrates scoring. Because scoring is basically the only aspect in the game where Dirk and Garnett are in the same tier. Other than that, it's not even close.
Oh come on, Garnett isn't even close to Dirk in scoring.
The ring isn't what puts KG on top of Dirk ... It's the rebounding, passing and all NBA defense .. Both have been amazing players, and Dirk has been better since about 2007.. But from 1998 to 2005 KG was a notch above Dirk
Career
PPG
Dirka - 22.8ppg
KG - 20ppg
Please, Dirk could go off for 30-40 pts any given game, KG can't. Dirk had three seasons of scoring at about 26 pts per game. KG had one season of scoring 24 ppg.
Career
PPG
Dirka - 22.8ppg
KG - 20ppg
In 07/08 Garnett was still much better than Nowitzki. Last season he was injured and only this one Nowitzki is playing at a higher level, at least so far.
This.
KG is a but he's had the better career thus far.
KG because he's not hanging out on the perimeter. They both are terrible all stars to build a team around.
KG wouldn't even have a ring if it wasn't for my grampa knees. Well, at least according to lakerfan.
How can ginobili's bald spot be a laker fan? Someone should make a troll of the rest of ginobili's head of lettuce. Back in the day when he had it long, almost mullet worthy.
lol apparently you haven't watched him in a long time. That's exactly what he does.
Just wait til manu grows his hair euro trash again and does the comb over.
I guess I did..
I concede that KG might have a better career.
Also he is a better team and one-on-one defender!
He is also a much better offensive rebounder.
But before you go on making other claims please look at some more of the games. Dirk has always been a very good defensive rebounder, right around 8-9, even now that the Mavs have been an elite rebounding team with a lot of good rebounders he still gets his. He'll never get the offensive rebounds necessary to propel him to the top of the rebounders list because he doesn't play close enough to the basket, but given what he contributes with his offense I am fine with it. Plus, Dirk has had multiple games in the playoffs with crazy rebounding numbers, so while KG is better it's not a huge difference by any chance.
Also, it is claimed here that KG is a much better passer. And it's true that in his Minny days KG had some seasons with about 5 assists per game. But he certainly was no Webber or Divac on the post, it came mostly to the fact that he had the ball quite a bit in his hands. Now, neither is Dirk a Webber or a Divac, but if you see him like I do every game, you'll not fail to notice that Dirk has developed into an excellent, I repeat excellent, passer of the ball. Double teams not only fail to trouble him, he often pick some great passes especially to the other big man playing with him. In case you forgot Spurs fans, please look at the 09 playoffs again, and see how well he dealt with the crazy double teaming that the Spurs were doing to him. Dirk's role in the offense has never been to be a distributor, when he catches the ball he has to score, but passing is an area where he has improved massively, much more than defense, from the start of his career. I am not sure at all KG is a better passer at this point to be honest.
Of course KG. It`s not his fault that McHale sucked as GM
And it's not Dirk's fault that he never played with a legit All-Star in his prime, let alone two or three.
my life careeer > the op's
The whole ring argument is a fail if you ask me. So if a player has a ring, then you will go with that player being the better player 100 percent of the time? So Lindsey Hunter is a better player than Karl Malone? Darko Milicic is a better player than Patrick Ewing? Glen Rice better than Reggie Miller? KG's teams had sucked ass in the playoffs before he got his ticket to the Celtics. He only got the Wolves out of the first round one time while he played for them. Dirk has gotten the Mavs out of the first round like 6 times and has gotten to the WCF twice and the Finals once. Dirk's got a better PPG average in the playoffs than KG too.
LOL..you do realize you just used your own hated logic in your own argument, right?..
you said that rings(success) shouldn't measure a player's worth, but then your argument was that Dirk's teams made it deeper into the playoffs than KG's teams(success)..
Garnett's ring doesn't even have to count in this argument IMO..I know most people hate him(not me), but KG was a top-tier player during his prime, along with Shaq-Duncan-Kobe IMO..
While Dirk is a great player in his own regard and the #5 best player of this decade, KG was levels above him as a defender, rebounder and passer..Dirk was the better scorer..none of that is arguable..
THEN you can bring in the ring for the argument..Garnett WAS the best player on that team, he was clearly the leader of the team, and he led one of the best transformations of a franchise that you'll see(obviously with some help)..yes, Pierce-Allen and the rest of the Celtics is better than anything Dirk has ever had..that doesn't change the aspects that KG is better at..
to be fair, Dirk has been better than KG the last 2 years..also, Dirk has never had a championship-level supporting cast, and he does get treated unfairly be many people..saying KG was better doesn't diminish Dirk in any way..
KG is not a better passer, and his difference in rebounding isn't as great as people make it out to be!
I agree with some of what you say but I'm usually a stat guy why? Because MVPs and Rings are given to the best team not necessarily the best player.
If you have a great team then you will win the le, and if the team is really good they will have the best record in the NBA and best player on that team is going to get the MVP.
Kobe before he won his first ring as the first option was still regarded as the best player in the NBA because of his stats.
If a guy for example averaged 40ppg 20rbpg 10apg 10bpg and was on the worst team in the NBA for all his career but continued to put up those numbers, then he would definitely be the best player to ever the play of the game even if he never won a ring or got into the playoffs, is that true in the media's eyes probably not which I find sad.
There are obviously other important things that are not included in stats which includes leadership, fundamentals etc that are not usually discussed. Like I always say, a guy that grabs 20 rebounds per game and block 5bpg may be the defensive player of the year but if he lets his opponent drop 40 on him every night whats the point of DPOY?
Last edited by XFactor; 01-07-2010 at 10:03 AM.
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