Report: Spurs wanted to declare Kawhi Leonard out for the season, but he wouldn’t let

[daslicer]

This.
I have serious conserns about Kawhi and so glad we did not come to a deal teh SPurs would accept.
I refuse to buy he was faking injury, is now 100% and that this is all on Pop/the FO.

I know it was just a pressor but listening to Pop yesterdaty tells me there is more to this story.
Spurs will move on and be fine but the ceiling sure got lower with Kawhi's exit.
Not buying this was strictly a culture/lets end this saga move.

Wow a Laker fan defending Kawhi when it comes to his fraudulent injury. You are as credible in my eyes as Fox News when it comes to defending Trump. Real talk I actually respect the Laker fans who have been honest about this situation and just straight up admit Kawhi did the Spurs dirty but are still cool with Kawhi being a Laker.

[SAGirl]

In March 13,2018 Pop said that he had observed Kawhi work out and that he needed more time. At the time he had been riding stationary bike and doing some 3 on 3 drills with coaching and their support staff, nothing with teammates. It was Pop's assessment he didn't look ready or right. He obviously never made it to play.
https://www.slamonline.com/nba/gregg...-ready-return/

I don't think Pop would lie on something like this and they really wanted to rule him out for the season (and Kawhi didn't let them) to focus with the rest of their team on the remaining schedule and avoid the media distractions since the situation was blowing up in the media with no definitive answers.

Shortly thereafter, the team meeting happened, Manu and Tony basically admitted he wasn't coming back to play and Kawhi bolted.

Simmons saying Kawhi shopped for doctors doesn't = made up injury to me. He's shopped around bc Spurs staff back in August diagnosed him and treated him as having one condition but treatments made him worse per reports. He's could have shopped around for someone who told him he didn't have What the Spurs said for any number of reason , including denial of the mortality of his NBA career, money, his contract extension looming, perhaps real distress that he wasn't getting better...

[MoSpur02]

It's my understanding that back in December or some time after that he wasn't injured. The Spurs doctors felt he was ready. This is why the Spurs considered trading him. The Spurs had the okay to trade him to Boston, but R.C and Pop decided not to.

This is where all the problems started happening in the locker room. The guys are the team were frustrated. Pop, Murray, and Kawhi had dinner together and Kawhi really didn't speak. I'm assuming the dinner was to try to figure out what was going on and maybe settle things down before they got outta hand.

It obviously didn't work because things went down hill from there.

[SAGirl]

Leonard was on the trade block what, six weeks? That's a long time in the NBA, enough time for teams to devote the time and resources to do their diligence. Even with the prospect of a 1 year rental, the offers we saw were absolute crap up until Toronto's, which wasn't exciting considering where Leonard's game was at last year. But it was the best and the Spurs took it.

People often don't want to accept the verdict of the market, but it is what it is - there are serious questions about Leonard and I think his health is central to those concerns.

Yes notice Philadelphia didn't want to give up a guy with emotional or mental blocks who barely played last season himself. I didn't even want that guy if I am honest but Philly wouldn't give that guy up or Saric. They wouldn't give up anyone they needed or even someone they had some hope for still.

Toronto made the deal and the still wanted insurance in case both Kawhi insisted on the trade or that he wasn't playable due to the injury. That's why they didn't give up OG, and why they required DG. They wanted players to play both Derozan and Kawhi s spot. They were just encouraged in talking to him and his group that he would play, sufficiently to take the risk. But they wanted all insurance available to survive if the move didn't own out and they got it. SA had to acquiesce to these requests if they wanted Derozan. Those were the terms.that's why it was reported they were inn the drivers seat. making this deal for Kawhi was a risky play. Raptors were ready enough to move on from Derozan to take that risk, and move on with Lowry, DG, OG and the rest of their guys if need be.

[MoSpur02]

I can confirm what Bill Simmons reported is true. Not sure of the number of doctors he sought out, but he did seek different opinions

[SAGirl]

It's my understanding that back in December or some time after that he wasn't injured. The Spurs doctors felt he was ready. This is why the Spurs considered trading him. The Spurs had the okay to trade him to Boston, but R.C and Pop decided not to.

This is where all the problems started happening in the locker room. The guys are the team were frustrated. Pop, Murray, and Kawhi had dinner together and Kawhi really didn't speak. I'm assuming the dinner was to try to figure out what was going on and maybe settle things down before they got outta hand.

It obviously didn't work because things went down hill from there.

Yes, and he played some games in between December and January at the time he was judged ready to play, but then continued to complain from pain at which time Pop held him out again.

It's a very elaborate and difficult to maintain a lie for such a long time, including faking limps and pain like some fans assume that he did. Of course I am no insider and I am going by what has been made public but I give more weight to what Pop said at the time than the media speculation and unnamed sources.

I just really belive he had some type of injury. Maybe it's the kind that's chronic and recurs. That affects the group's bottom line. They might have even felt the urgency to get him traded bc Kawhi s career will not be as lengthy and durable as Lebron. Whatever he wanted to happen it needed to happen now, soon, immediately. This is from the groups and the exterior interest point of view.

[Marcus Bryant]

So a trade demand in 2017?

[ducks]

Pop tried

[ernest787]

I can confirm what Bill Simmons reported is true. Not sure of the number of doctors he sought out, but he did seek different opinions

Maybe now people will believe Bill Simmons?

People can not like Bill Simmons style or think he doesn't know the game like a hardcore basketball guy should, or whatever. But the fact remains. The dude is super plugged into the NBA. He has a current NBA player podcasting for his site. He just did a do entary on the NBA Finals. He is friends with a current NBA GM, etc.

My point with all of this is the guy who is plugged into the NBA and has legit sources is questioning the validity of the injury. He is also saying that he has heard from sources that Kawhi and his team shopped to get the answer they wanted and went to 6-7 different doctors until they got one they told them what they wanted to hear. When asked about the possibility of that being that he shopped until he found a doctor that actually diagnosed him correctly, Bill said that is not how it was framed to him. He has not mentioned this once but on several occasions.

Do I believe Kawhi had an injury to start the year... yes. Do I believe that early on the Spurs doctors cleared him to come back and play... yes. Do I believe that at that point Kawhi was fine... yes.

From that point on, I believe Kawhi sat out. This all goes hand in hand with what guys like Jalen were reporting that Kawhi wanted out of SA.

[Marcus Bryant]

It's my understanding that back in December or some time after that he wasn't injured. The Spurs doctors felt he was ready. This is why the Spurs considered trading him. The Spurs had the okay to trade him to Boston, but R.C and Pop decided not to.

This is where all the problems started happening in the locker room. The guys are the team were frustrated. Pop, Murray, and Kawhi had dinner together and Kawhi really didn't speak. I'm assuming the dinner was to try to figure out what was going on and maybe settle things down before they got outta hand.

It obviously didn't work because things went down hill from there.

Kawhi, blink once if you're ready to order.

[SAGirl]

Maybe now people will believe Bill Simmons?

People can not like Bill Simmons style or think he doesn't know the game like a hardcore basketball guy should, or whatever. But the fact remains. The dude is super plugged into the NBA. He has a current NBA player podcasting for his site. He just did a do entary on the NBA Finals. He is friends with a current NBA GM, etc.

My point with all of this is the guy who is plugged into the NBA and has legit sources is questioning the validity of the injury. He is also saying that he has heard from sources that Kawhi and his team shopped to get the answer they wanted and went to 6-7 different doctors until they got one they told them what they wanted to hear. When asked about the possibility of that being that he shopped until he found a doctor that actually diagnosed him correctly, Bill said that is not how it was framed to him. He has not mentioned this once but on several occasions.

Do I believe Kawhi had an injury to start the year... yes. Do I believe that early on the Spurs doctors cleared him to come back and play... yes. Do I believe that at that point Kawhi was fine... yes.

From that point on, I believe Kawhi sat out. This all goes hand in hand with what guys like Jalen were reporting that Kawhi wanted out of SA.

It's possible, but what do you make of Pop's statements in mid March of this year that he had watched him and he didn't look ready and that he had more work to do. At sine point all this becomes a mystery and its on what and who you choose to believe.

I can believe he shopped around for doctors bc he was looking for something specific. There's many injuries that players can play through. Just on Timmys history alone he played on a bad knee almost his entire career but what if Timmy was looking for a doctor who told him his knee could be fixed. He could have shipped around until he found Someone to tell him maybe, there was a small possibility that he had something other than a bum knee like a bone growing out of his muscle. And prescribed some treatment that takes months to see if it works or not really.

You see where I am going? He could have shopped for doctors simply bc he's in denial this is going to be his career now. He's going to have to play through some pain and manage this condition.

Only time will tell if I am right. Nit that I care to keep score. It's just been little nuggets of information that have come out to make me believe he did have a nag the entire season. Shopping around fir doctors doesn't mean he didn't have a nag necessarily.

[beirmeistr]

Kawhi, blink once if you're ready to order.

Siri probably orders for him.

[YGWHI]

Those last 9 games he play as a Spur in the highlights I didn't really see anything wrong with him, he looked healthy ready to play the season out.

Highlighs dont show all 3s he missed and how his quad affected that shot and jump

Yes, and he played some games in between December and January at the time he was judged ready to play, but then continued to complain from pain at which time Pop held him out again.

It's a very elaborate and difficult to maintain a lie for such a long time, including faking limps and pain like some fans assume that he did. Of course I am no insider and I am going by what has been made public but I give more weight to what Pop said at the time than the media speculation and unnamed sources.

I just really belive he had some type of injury. Maybe it's the kind that's chronic and recurs. That affects the group's bottom line. They might have even felt the urgency to get him traded bc Kawhi s career will not be as lengthy and durable as Lebron. Whatever he wanted to happen it needed to happen now, soon, immediately. This is from the groups and the exterior interest point of view.

Like you say, Pop saw some Kawhi’s practices in March and he said Kawhi wasn’t ready to play yet... Danny Green said Kawhi’s injury got worse in the summer…

There is no reason these guys to lie about…It’s pretty obvious that Kawhi was injured.But it’s more attractive for some media guys like Simmons create conspiracy theories. I'm sure that he wouldn't say that Kawhi shooped doctors if Simmons' loved C's would have gotten him.

It's funny because if you listen to his whole podcast, he also said who knows if Kawhi will be the same player again after this quad injury...

So Bill...Kawhi shopped doctors or was really injured?

It's my understanding that back in December or some time after that he wasn't injured. The Spurs doctors felt he was ready.

The same Spurs doctors that didn’t know that Mills needed a surgery in 2014 and the same doctors that didn’t know what type of hand-injury had Kawhi in 2015…

Just because Spurs doctors thought he was ready, it doesn't mean he was.

This is why the issues between Kawhi and the Spurs started. He didn't trust in team-doctors since 2015 when he had to get a 2nd opinion on his hand-injury.

On Chris Broussard podcast, Danny Green said Kawhi played injured in the playoffs, his camp told Ramona that he felt pain in his quad in 2017 playoffs and during the preseason but Spurs' doctors didn't believe it.

Sadly, he didn't get treatments in 2017 season. His NYC doctors told him that letting pain go on too long in his quad could make it much harder to treat last season.
That's why he had others doctors before but they couldn't make the pain disappear.

[paperboy77]

I remember seeing it yesterday.

This is one of those bits of information that makes me believe that injury was very real (and I believe was at the source of the problem... Like slavery triggering the civil war). Who knows how he is doing from that injury really...

What? Farfetched comparison. Nothing in a game is like slavery anything except actual slavery.

[SAGirl]

What? Farfetched comparison. Nothing in a game is like slavery anything except actual slavery.

Don't want to go on a tangent. Ignore the comment if you please.

[Marcus Bryant]

at the doctor excuse. If the Spurs had any inkling that their medical team was ing up that badly, especially with respect to their franchise player, then guess what? Spurs get a new medical team.

[paperboy77]

No problem here just saying what I think. Moving on....

[YGWHI]

at the doctor excuse. If the Spurs had any inkling that their medical team was ing up that badly, especially with respect to their franchise player, then guess what? Spurs get a new medical team.

RC said the Spurs made mistakes too...Who knows if it was for the way they handle his injury.

Spurs doctors aren't infallible, they misdiagnosed players' injuries in the past -Kawhi's hand included-...But it seemed the Spurs didn't change their medical staff for that.

[Marcus Bryant]

RC just said that when they were in we can reconcile mode.

Next month RC traded him to another country. Figure it out.

[ducks]

at the doctor excuse. If the Spurs had any inkling that their medical team was ing up that badly, especially with respect to their franchise player, then guess what? Spurs get a new medical team.

Yes

[YGWHI]

RC just said that when they were in we can reconcile mode.

Next month RC traded him to another country. Figure it out.

Traded him to another country because only a team of other country made a decent offer...Otherwise they would lose Kawhi for nothing next season.

It doesn't mean that Spurs' doctors are infalible/never misdiagnosed a player before.

[Marcus Bryant]

And Leonard played hide and go seek when Spurs personnel came to check on his rehab because he was scared that the evil docs were with them. Yeah.

[Marcus Bryant]

Traded him to another country because only a team of other country made a decent offer...Otherwise they would lose Kawhi for nothing next season.

It doesn't mean that Spurs' doctors are infalible/never misdiagnosed a player before.

It's an excuse created to justify holding out. Have fun following Toronto.

[lefty20]

Kiwi is a pos, we knew this already.

[YGWHI]

It's an excuse created to justify holding out. Have fun following Toronto.

I doubt Patty's shoulder would agree with you...But it's fine.