Spurs fielding trade calls for Parker

[Pistons < Spurs]

The San Antonio Spurs are engaged in discussions about trading point guard Tony Parker to secure a high pick in Thursday’s draft, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.


The Spurs have talked to teams in the lottery, including the Toronto Raptors and Sacramento Kings, who hold the fifth and seventh picks, respectively. The Kings are determined to get a frontline point guard, and have also talked with the Denver Nuggets about Raymond Felton(notes).

It’s unclear who the Spurs would prefer to take if they acquired a high lottery pick.

If the Spurs were to trade Parker, George Hill(notes) could become their starting point guard. League sources said Hill also has drawn trade interest from teams willing to give the Spurs a pick near the back end of the lottery.

Parker didn’t play well early in the Spurs’ first-round loss to the eighth-seeded Memphis Grizzlies in May then later told French reporters he thought the franchise’s days of contending for a title had all but ended.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-wojnarowski_tony_parker_spurs_nba_draft_062111

[widowmaker]

For a draft pick only??

[TheProfessor]

:depressed

[GB20]

For a draft pick only??
I hope not!

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Good to hear they're at least active in trying to see how they can improve while getting younger. Not sure if making Hill the starting PG is the right direction though.

[GB20]

good to hear they're at least active in trying to see how they can improve while getting younger. Not sure if making hill the starting pg is the right direction though.
1+

[TheProfessor]

Good to hear they're at least active in trying to see how they can improve while getting younger. Not sure if making Hill the starting PG is the right direction though.
I think the answer to that is a resounding "No."

[DPG21920]

The source concerns me. We have all heard rumors and such, but with RC's comments on making trades, the timing of the comments and who reported it, there has to be at least something real to it.

PG's like TP are extremely valuable. I am going to be furious if they trade TP. The only way I would be even remotely "not pissed" (because I won't like any trade where it involves the big 3) is if they unload RJ with him, get into the lottery and get young talent back for him.

[lefty]

http://i1017.photobucket.com/albums/af298/trhonda5/Gif%20Animations/Vdancing.gifhttp://nastynets.com/secretstash/freshprince.gifhttp://www.tvscoop.tv/Elaine_Sequence-frontpage.gifhttp://thesweetfix.com/files/kramer-dance.gif

[Creation88]

this is the worst draft to trade high into.

[DPG21920]

I'm not too overly concerned about Hill at the PG although it's not ideal. When it comes to breaking up the big 3, I am concerned about getting something great back.

If people are offering the Spurs back end of the lottery picks for Hill, I hope that is the route they go. I would hate to lose Hill as I trust him overall and like his talent on a contending/rebuilding team, but if you can address a need by getting into the lotto, Hill can be traded.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

I'm not too overly concerned about Hill at the PG although it's not ideal. When it comes to breaking up the big 3, I am concerned about getting something great back.

If people are offering the Spurs back end of the lottery picks for Hill, I hope that is the route they go. I would hate to lose Hill as I trust him overall and like his talent on a contending/rebuilding team, but if you can address a need by getting into the lotto, Hill can be traded.

:tu

[DPG21920]

Shit, if they are going to offer him up, at least go to LA first and ask for Bynum.

[DesignatedT]

Would prefer to keep him but wouldn't mind trading him for the right pieces and if it somehow allows us to unload RJ as well.

[ohmwrecker]

Yep. I would rather see Hill go.

[ernest787]

yeah I don't like the idea of getting rid of tony for the talent in this draft.

Sacramento could absorb the contract of TP, but obviously we'd probably get Casspi back as well, but still doesn't make it worth it

With the Raptors though, we'd have to follow the cap guide lines, and I just don't see that trade working.

[Jobbs]

This better be fake

Tony is the guy, much like D Rob, that will be the transition piece for the next generation of Spurs. Tony is a Finals MVP and is in no way over the hill yet. He carried us 2 years ago in the playoffs. I rather trade Manu and TP every day of the week.

[Pistons < Spurs]

I do think it's come time to trade TP and rebuild for the future. But a 5-7 lotto pick in this draft doesn't do that for you. This makes very little sense. Are they really willing to trade TP for Tristan Thompson? Biyombo? Vesely? Marcus Morris? I don't get it. I trust @WojYahooNBA more than any other NBA source, but there's got to be a hell of a lot more to the story. We're missing some big details right now.

[DesignatedT]

Spurs receive:
Jason Thompson
Omri Casspi
Francisco Garcia
7th Overall Pick

Kings Receive:
Tony Parker
Richard Jefferson
29th Overall Pick

Now something along these lines I would agree to :lol but not Tony for the 7. That makes no sense.

[GB20]

where is ducks when you need him

[The Btown Spur]

Not this rumor again. Ill believe it when I see it. Although wojo is usually pretty credible I just dont see the spurs FO leaking any type of info like this to a reporter.

[Pistons < Spurs]

Not this rumor again. Ill believe it when I see it. Although wojo is usually pretty credible I just dont see the spurs FO leaking any type of info like this to a reporter.

The source of the info is more likely from the Kings and Raptors.

[DesignatedT]

Wojo is as credible as they come so I definitely believe there is some truth to this but I don't see the Spurs unloading Tony for just a pick .

[bigdog]

Woj is more reliable than almost every NBA guy out there. There has to be some reality to this. I'd expect at least a respectable player to go along with the pick, though.

[timtonymanu]

I agree with DPG, trading RJ with Parker would make this deal at least acceptable for me.

I definitely think trading TP otherwise would be pretty stupid, especially with this draft. I would rather see Hill go.

[SenorSpur]

Shit, if they are going to offer him up, at least go to LA first and ask for Bynum.

According to Jim Buss, new acting decision-maker and the owner's son, Bynum WILL NOT be traded under any circumstances. After all, it was he who found Bynum in the first place and it is he who made Bynum is pet project. Buss is on record for declaring, on every occasion when this speculation starts, that the Fakers ARE NOT INTERESTED IN TRADING BYNUM.

[Sii]

if Adrian Wojnarowski says it then the talks are going on. rather it happens or not who knows but you can take it to the bank its legit

[DesignatedT]

This pretty much confirms that the Spurs will end up doing absolutely nothing come Thursday night :lol

[Tyrone Jenkins]

I wouldn't want Bynum - too injury prone.

I'd take Odom and Shannon Brown for TP.

[Dex]

I do think it's come time to trade TP and rebuild for the future. But a 5-7 lotto pick in this draft doesn't do that for you. This makes very little sense. Are they really willing to trade TP for Tristan Thompson? Biyombo? Vesely? Marcus Morris? I don't get it. I trust @WojYahooNBA more than any other NBA source, but there's got to be a hell of a lot more to the story. We're missing some big details right now.

Exactly.

If it were Hill, I could understand. Hill may be better than the 26th pick that was used for him, but I think he may be showing his ceiling...and that's not by much.

But trading a Finals MVP for a not-so-high draft pick in a weak draft? Just does not compute.

[SenorSpur]

Good to hear they're at least active in trying to see how they can improve while getting younger. Not sure if making Hill the starting PG is the right direction though.

I don't think that trading Parker is the right decision. I'd prefer that they trade Hill instead. Even if it means getting in the back end of the lottery, that's still a good move.

[SenorSpur]

if Adrian Wojnarowski says it then the talks are going on. rather it happens or not who knows but you can take it to the bank its legit

Agreed. Wojo has excellent sources, reports only facts and doesn't publish any bullcrap. If he reports it, you can bet that talks are indeed taking place.

[MI21]

George Hill strikes me as 15MPG type of guy on a contending team, not the 30MPGish he plays with the Spurs.

If you can trade him for a lottery pick, that has to be done, especially if the front office have a particular guy in mind.

Trading Parker in this draft doesn't really make sense to me.

[DAF86]

No, don't give up yet.

[Sisk]

If we trade TP but hold on to RJ it's a terrible trade imho. Have to get rid of that sack of shit.

[jag]

PG's like TP are extremely valuable. I am going to be furious if they trade TP. The only way I would be even remotely "not pissed" (because I won't like any trade where it involves the big 3) is if they unload RJ with him, get into the lottery and get young talent back for him.

[widowmaker]

Smokescreen rumor! Lol.

[MaNu4Tres]

Exactly.


But trading a Finals MVP for a not-so-high draft pick in a weak draft? Just does not compute.

I'm a fan of Tony and his play in 2007.

But since then, where has THAT Tony been come playoff time? It's like Spursfans are still stuck in 2007 and put Tony on this superstar pedal-stool for playing out of his mind for four games against Daniel Gibson.

Don't get me wrong, Tony is a great player. I just don't see him as untouchable as many of posters here do. Nor do I expect the Spurs to get a superstar in return in a trade for Tony.

Spurs would be wise to move Tony, but for the right deal.

[Vinnie_Johnson]

So you guys are going to trade Parker for Kemba Walker? Brilliant.

[Cane]

While George Hill isn't a PG, Tony Parker's not much of one either especially after that stinker of a playoffs run: 31 assists to 21 turnovers. As a Spurs fan it also sucks that he basically nuked the locker room chemistry by getting involved with stupid stuff like sexting Mrs. Barry. But I doubt there's a trade thats worth it.

[MaNu4Tres]

So you guys are going to trade Parker for Kemba Walker? Brilliant.

Probably Kemba Derozan and Ed Davis tbh.

[Ditty]

Probably Kemba Derozan and Ed Davis tbh.

I could live with that I hope its hill and spurs can get a chance by getting Chris Singleton.

[SenorSpur]

For a draft pick only??

I thought the same thing.

If the Spurs ARE fielding offers for Parker, they'd better get back their pick and a player in exchange for him. If Parker is indeed the trade bait and if Sacto is the trading partner, they'd better get back both their pick and a player like Omri Casspi. Imagine it. In such a scenario, the Spurs come away with Casspi and the #7 pick in the draft.

I would give anything to know which player they would be hot after, if they did this deal. I don't necessarily condone getting rid of Parker, I'd rather they trade Hill instead, but Parker obviously would net the best trade value.

Either way, a trade of this type would help stop some of the bleeding and plug some of the lineup cracks that have been exposed.

[blizz]

only way i trade tp is for the #2...otherwise it's a shitty deal.

[Vinnie_Johnson]

We can give you the 8th pick and Rip for Parker.

[rascal]

Agreed. Wojo has excellent sources, reports only facts and doesn't publish any bullcrap. If he reports it, you can bet that talks are indeed taking place.

CBS Sportsline is also reporting it.

[elemento]

You guys are insane if you think the Raptors are going to give us their entire young core + the 5th pick for Tony Parker. They are not that dumb.

I would be happy with something like Jason Thompson + Omri Casspi + 7th pick.

[Spurtacus]

I hope the Spurs aren't after Enes Kanter. No fucking way I'd trade Parker for Kanter.

[DPG21920]

Would prefer to keep him but wouldn't mind trading him for the right pieces and if it somehow allows us to unload RJ as well.

:vomit:

[MaNu4Tres]

I really like Jason Thompson. (Not saying I like the deal.)

He'd start at the PF next year if that deal happened( RJ/TP for Thompson, Casspi, and 7th). Hopefully, Spurs demand a future 1st as well if that deal is proposed and considered.

[ohmwrecker]

They would need to either give up more than Casspi or take RJ's contract from us. Casspi, Thompson, 7th pick. for TP, RJ.

They would have to throw in Garcia or Udrih as well.

[FkLA]

I dont think it'd be just a draft pick, I doubt those teams have the cap space to absorb TP's contract like that. There would have to be other players included...I would take Casspi, Thompson, and their pick tbh. Would prefer Bynum though.


George Hill strikes me as 15MPG type of guy on a contending team, not the 30MPGish he plays with the Spurs.

Thats ridiculous.

[tdunk21]

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/30085688


Sacramento Kings forward Jason Thompson suffered a fracture in his right big toe.

[widowmaker]

I thought the same thing.

If the Spurs ARE fielding offers for Parker, they'd better get back their pick and a player in exchange for him. If Parker is indeed the trade bait and if Sacto is the trading partner, they'd better get back both their pick and a player like Omri Casspi. Imagine it. In such a scenario, the Spurs come away with Casspi and the #7 pick in the draft.

I would give anything to know which player they would be hot after, if they did this deal. I don't necessarily condone getting rid of Parker, I'd rather they trade Hill instead, but Parker obviously would net the best trade value.

Either way, a trade of this type would help stop some of the bleeding and plug some of the lineup cracks that have been exposed.


I like DesignatedT's idea getting rid of RJ along with the trade for casspi, tompson, Garcia and the 7th pick.

[Vinnie_Johnson]

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/30085688

Can still be traded though correct? I would think so.

[DPG21920]

This is a lot to take in and again, considering the source, it's likely legit. We have heard some things before, but nothing every really materialized and it's not likely anything was remotely close.

But you can bet if Tree of Woj is reporting it, he checked his facts within the Spurs organization.

I can't really see anything that will work with Raps/Sac. I don't think TP is some superstar on the level of a franchise guy, but elite PG's are still very valuable in this league. Especially ones that are still somewhat young, have experience and good contracts.

I also don't expect something massive for TP in the market, but I'd expect RJ to be gone and to get a pick in the lotto and to get at least 1 young somewhat talented guy that's already shown something.

The fact it's just laid out as a lotto pick for essentially TP at the moment makes me sick.

Also, :lol at the Spurs always doing the exact opposite of the opposite of the opposite of what everyone thinks. Coming off a surprising season, into a shitty draft overall after saying we will build through trade and not the draft say "hey, lets move TP and get higher into the draft!"

[FkLA]

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22748484/30085688

Its not a serious injury. Hes expected to be out a month and theres like 4+ months before next season starts. The size that a TD, Splitter, Thompson rotation would provide would be nice.

[DPG21920]

I really like Jason Thompson. (Not saying I like the deal.)

He'd start at the PF next year if that deal happened( RJ/TP for Thompson, Casspi, and 7th). Hopefully, Spurs demand a future 1st as well if that deal is proposed and considered.

Why do you like Thompson? I think he's ok, but I don't see him as anything special.

[Spurtacus]

Spurs receive:
Jason Thompson
Omri Casspi
Francisco Garcia
7th Overall Pick

Kings Receive:
Tony Parker
Richard Jefferson
29th Overall Pick

Now something along these lines I would agree to :lol but not Tony for the 7. That makes no sense.

Trade certainly works since Kings have the cap room but I'm not so sure if they would give up three young guys. Plus, Thompson leaving would deplete their frontline.

[baseline bum]

The source concerns me. We have all heard rumors and such, but with RC's comments on making trades, the timing of the comments and who reported it, there has to be at least something real to it.

PG's like TP are extremely valuable. I am going to be furious if they trade TP. The only way I would be even remotely "not pissed" (because I won't like any trade where it involves the big 3) is if they unload RJ with him, get into the lottery and get young talent back for him.

Why does anyone give a shit about salary-dumping Jefferson? The Spurs never land young talent in free agency, so the cap space will be worthless.

[baseline bum]

Unless the front office is extremely high on Valaciunas AND they can pry Ed Davis loose, this trade looks to be a complete fucking loser.

[TheProfessor]

Why does anyone give a shit about salary-dumping Jefferson? The Spurs never land young talent in free agency, so the cap space will be worthless.
I will take any talent over RJ at this point.

[baseline bum]

Trade certainly works since Kings have the cap room but I'm not so sure if they would give up three young guys. Plus, Thompson leaving would deplete their frontline.

Oh fuck, Tony Parker for Jason Thompson? That would be 10X worse than giving Jefferson and Bonner the big contracts last summer.

[baseline bum]

I will take any talent over RJ at this point.

Would you throw talent away just to salary dump him? No way I would.

[DPG21920]

Why does anyone give a shit about salary-dumping Jefferson? The Spurs never land young talent in free agency, so the cap space will be worthless.

Really? Because I don't want to see that complete soft mental midget on the court anymore. Because having cap space and the opportunity to make moves is better than not having it.

[MaNu4Tres]

Why do you like Thompson? I think he's ok, but I don't see him as anything special.

Towards the end of the year, I happened to watch the Kings quite often and he really impressed me with his solid play more so than Cousins. He finished around the basket very strong (and efficiently)and his pick and pop game was money as well. He seemed to be really hitting his "break-out" stride, which was obvious with the amount of confidence he was playing with in the month of April.

I'm not saying he's going to be an All-Star or anything like that, but he's a very solid player. A definite improvement over Blair/Bonner without question.

Is he worth trading TP straight up? Hell no obviously.

But it would be decent and somewhat acceptable, if Spurs can get rid of RJ and at the same time acquire the #7, Garcia (who is one of Tim's guys), Thompson and Casspi.

[DPG21920]

Would you throw talent away just to salary dump him? No way I would.

No, but if they are bent on trading TP for something, RJ has to go. Doesn't mean they should do it to get rid of RJ, but they shouldn't do it without dumping him.

[Dex]

I'm a fan of Tony and his play in 2007.

But since then, where has THAT Tony been come playoff time? It's like Spursfans are still stuck in 2007 and put Tony on this superstar pedal-stool for playing out of his mind for four games against Daniel Gibson.

Don't get me wrong, Tony is a great player. I just don't see him as untouchable as many of posters here do. Nor do I expect the Spurs to get a superstar in return in a trade for Tony.

Spurs would be wise to move Tony, but for the right deal.

Agreed, but what are the odds this is the right deal? By it's very nature, it's impossible to tell.

We know what Tony Parker is...maybe not quite a superstar, but certainly all-star capabilities when he's in his right mind. I'll agree that Parker may not be playing at the level he was Finals 2007 (which still cannot be taken away from him), or when Manu was out, but he's still a top-tier point guard....something George Hill is not. I don't entirely believe that he'd be ready to just step into a starting PG role, so that immediately gives you a hole to fill.

Trading that for a draft pick is a shot in the dark. Even if the Spurs really think they've scouted a gem and get the pick, there is nothing that guarantees that player will still be available to them. Or that the player will plan out. Or decide not to walk after his rookie contract.

Is Parker our point guard of the future? Maybe, maybe not. But if you're going to trade him, don't do it just to roll the dice.

[SenorSpur]

I like DesignatedT's idea getting rid of RJ along with the trade for casspi, tompson, Garcia and the 7th pick.

Hell, I like that one myself.

[Sisk]

PG's like TP are extremely valuable. I am going to be furious if they trade TP. The only way I would be even remotely "not pissed" (because I won't like any trade where it involves the big 3) is if they unload RJ with him, get into the lottery and get young talent back for him.



Would prefer to keep him but wouldn't mind trading him for the right pieces and if it somehow allows us to unload RJ as well.



:vomit:


????????

[mfanatic]

I'd pull this:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3skv2lo

Leaves us with:

Calderon/Hill
Manu/Anderson
#5 Pick/Kleza
Duncan/Blair
Andrea/Splitter

[Spurtacus]

If the Spurs were to trade Parker, George Hill(notes) could become their starting point guard. League sources said Hill also has drawn trade interest from teams willing to give the Spurs a pick near the back end of the lottery.

Problem with this is I don't see a team at the back end of the lotto in need of a PG. Houston has Lowry/Dragic, Utah has Devin Harris, Warriors have Curry/Ellis. Possibly Phoenix is interested. I would deal Hill for the Suns #13 if Singleton or Thompson are still on the board.

[ohmwrecker]

I'd pull this:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3skv2lo

Leaves us with:

Calderon/Hill
Manu/Anderson
#5 Pick/Kleza
Duncan/Blair
Andrea/Splitter

I don't think Toronto will move Bargnani and . . . no.

[baseline bum]

Really? Because I don't want to see that complete soft mental midget on the court anymore. Because having cap space and the opportunity to make moves is better than not having it.

So they can sign another Rasho Nesterovic? San Antonio the city sucks in the eyes of NBA players: no big endorsement opportunities, no good clubs, no beach, no ESPN kissing your ass all day. The draft is how the Spurs need to build, but not this one. If they really have a hard on for Valaciunas, think he's a future allstar, he slips to them. and they get Ed Davis then maybe it's a worthy gamble, but not to take Sacramento's C+ level talent and salary dump Jefferson.

[objective]

If the options on the table are Parker for #5 or Hill for say #12-15, then no doubt in my mind TRADE HILL!

Not that Parker played well in the playoffs, he played like trash for half the series. So did Hill. But this is about value/I]. Hill being moved to grab someone like Chris Singleton would be a godsend. I posted weeks ago about how I would love them to move Hill for Singleton and then reach for Mack at the end of the first to be a decent career back-up point guard.

Utah at 12 might like Hill, as well as Indiana at 15 for hometown reasons. Utah especially could want him not just for point, but also at the two as they were stuck playing Raja Bell's corpse last season. AK will be gone, slide Heyward to 3, and play Hill at two. Maybe if Utah goes big at 3 and gets robbed of Jimmer, they'd be open to it.

And another reason I wouldn't be high on a move with say Toronto is they don't have much to give back for Parker. They [I]won't move DeRozan, he's the face of their franchise now. They even featured him at Casey's press conference if I understood the written reports correctly. And I don't imagine them wanting to part with Davis either as they would no longer have a pick to replace him with (Biyombo, Kanter, rando Lithuanian). Spurs would be stuck getting back Bayless or Amir Johnson or other unappealing pieces.

[DPG21920]

????????

:lol I can see how that was confusing. I said that I would only not be extremely pissed if the Spurs traded TP and RJ was involved + pick + young talent.

But I did the throw up because of an RJ lover now saying we need to dump RJ by giving up TP. That thought sickens me (if that is the reason).

[DPG21920]

So they can sign another Rasho Nesterovic? San Antonio the city sucks in the eyes of NBA players: no big endorsement opportunities, no good clubs, no beach, no ESPN kissing your ass all day. The draft is how the Spurs need to build, but not this one. If they really have a hard on for Valaciunas, think he's a future allstar, he slips to them. and they get Ed Davis then maybe it's a worthy gamble, but not to take Sacramento's C+ level talent and salary dump Jefferson.

I agree, I'm just saying that IF the Spurs move TP for whatever reason, they have to included RJ.

[MaNu4Tres]

If the options on the table are Parker for #5 or Hill for say #12-15, then no doubt in my mind TRADE HILL!

Not that Parker played well in the playoffs, he played like trash for half the series. So did Hill. But this is about [I]value/I]. Hill being moved to grab someone like Chris Singleton would be a godsend. I posted weeks ago about how I would love them to move Hill for Singleton and then reach for Mack at the end of the first to be a decent career back-up point guard.

Utah at 12 might like Hill, as well as Indiana at 15 for hometown reasons. Utah especially could want him not just for point, but also at the two as they were stuck playing Raja Bell's corpse last season. AK will be gone, slide Heyward to 3, and play Hill at two. Maybe if Utah goes big at 3 and gets robbed of Jimmer, they'd be open to it.
.

Agreed on all points :tu

Hill to Utah or Indiana for the 12th or 15th pick would be a godsend indeed. (Not a big fan of Chris Singleton though)

[DPG21920]

If the Spurs are truly open (or actively shopping) to moving TP, that opens up a lot of things and I hope they aren't just looking at those two teams.

Hell, something from any other team looking for a PG should be considered if they are going to move him.

[DPG21920]

Agreed on all points :tu

Hill to Utah or Indiana for the 12th or 15th pick would be a godsend indeed. (Not a big fan of Chris Singleton though)

Makes a lot of sense really.

Yup. I know we are all caught up in the TP part because of the source, but the Hill part is in there as well. I certainly hope (and I really like Hill) that the Spurs go that route.

[TheProfessor]

Would you throw talent away just to salary dump him? No way I would.
Of course not. And hopefully the Spurs wouldn't either.

[ohmwrecker]

Dumping RJ would be a bonus, but under no circumstance should it be a motivating factor for trading TP. Any trade involving Parker should yield superb talent + potential in return. Nothing else is acceptable. If the Spurs can get a team to agree to take on RJ, then great, but TP should not be dealt so frivolously.

[baseline bum]

If the Spurs are truly open (or actively shopping) to moving TP, that opens up a lot of things and I hope they aren't just looking at those two teams.

Hell, something like Varejo/Jamison/4th pick for TP/RJ would be much better than dealing with the Kings IMO.

That deal makes no sense for Cleveland. They're in a total rebuild and couldn't get good before Parker starts massively slowing down.

[baseline bum]

Of course not. And hopefully the Spurs wouldn't either.

That's the only way it happens. 3 more years at the money he makes for what he gives on the floor shapes up to be an enormously toxic contract.

[DPG21920]

That deal makes no sense for Cleveland. They're in a total rebuild and couldn't get good before Parker starts massively slowing down.

Ya, I didn't really think it through from CLE's side :lol. My point was that if SA is really committed to moving TP for whatever reason, I hope they are looking around for better deals than proposed.

[TimmehC]

Unless RC facerapes Toronto with something like this, I fucking hate this.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6kc8drb

[objective]

and the reason some people are clamoring to throw in Jefferson as dump is because he's irredeemable. It's not about dumping Parker in order to dump Jefferson, it's because Jefferson is beyond useless.

Jefferson can not play. Think about it . . . Pop was more invested in RJ than perhaps any player in a long, long time. He put so much of himself and his time into RJ to work on his game. He gave the blessing to give RJ that revolting, idiotic deal. He had no real back-up SF alternatives to RJ on the roster, after fat 2-guard Anderson blew his foot up.

Pop was all in on Jefferson, to a degree that is maddening. But despite that . . . in the biggest game of the season, the brink of elimination . . . RJ sucked so bad that Pop refused to play him in the 2nd half. That is incredible. Pop had so much invested into RJ, both time and lots and lots of money, but RJ was so damn shitty that Pop couldn't bring himself to play him in the 2nd half.

Even more damning was the lack of a back-up SF to play. It didn't matter, Pop couldn't bring himself to play RJ. Pop decided to go with an exhausted broken armed Manu and a 6-4 2-guard like Neal instead of RJ. Against superstars like Sam Young. Pop still couldn't afford one second of RJ in the second half.

Jefferson can not play for the Spurs. EVER again. Any single second of Jefferson on the court is an abomination to the franchise. So if there's a chance to pawn him off on some idiotic team with Parker so that anyone else can play SF for the Spurs, then at least there's something good that can come out of the bad (losing Parker). ANYONE, I don't care if it's Danny Green or Anderson or Butler or training camp invite scrub, ANYONE is better than Richard Jefferson. ANYONE.

I don't want Parker traded. I want Hill gone instead, 10 times out of 10. BUT if Parker has to go, then the best case scenario is that he takes RJ's soft lazy overpaid over-the-hill carcass with him.

[DPG21920]

That is a terrible deal for the Spurs.

[baseline bum]

and the reason some people are clamoring to throw in Jefferson as dump is because he's irredeemable. It's not about dumping Parker in order to dump Jefferson, it's because Jefferson is beyond useless.

Jefferson can not play. Think about it . . . Pop was more invested in RJ than perhaps any player in a long, long time. He put so much of himself and his time into RJ to work on his game. He gave the blessing to give RJ that revolting, idiotic deal. He had no real back-up SF alternatives to RJ on the roster, after fat 2-guard Anderson blew his foot up.

Pop was all in on Jefferson, to a degree that is maddening. But despite that . . . in the biggest game of the season, the brink of elimination . . . RJ sucked so bad that Pop refused to play him in the 2nd half. That is incredible. Pop had so much invested into RJ, both time and lots and lots of money, but RJ was so damn shitty that Pop couldn't bring himself to play him in the 2nd half.

Even more damning was the lack of a back-up SF to play. It didn't matter, Pop couldn't bring himself to play RJ. Pop decided to go with an exhausted broken armed Manu and a 6-4 2-guard like Neal instead of RJ. Against superstars like Sam Young. Pop still couldn't afford one second of RJ in the second half.

Jefferson can not play for the Spurs. EVER again. Any single second of Jefferson on the court is an abomination to the franchise. So if there's a chance to pawn him off on some idiotic team with Parker so that anyone else can play SF for the Spurs, then at least there's something good that can come out of the bad (losing Parker). ANYONE, I don't care if it's Danny Green or Anderson or Butler or training camp invite scrub, ANYONE is better than Richard Jefferson. ANYONE.

I don't want Parker traded. I want Hill gone instead, 10 times out of 10. BUT if Parker has to go, then the best case scenario is that he takes RJ's soft lazy overpaid over-the-hill carcass with him.

So just buy Dick out then.

[stnick2261]

trading Parker for a lottery pick this year will also land us a lottery pick next year (our own)

[SenorSpur]

and the reason some people are clamoring to throw in Jefferson as dump is because he's irredeemable. It's not about dumping Parker in order to dump Jefferson, it's because Jefferson is beyond useless.

Jefferson can not play. Think about it . . . Pop was more invested in RJ than perhaps any player in a long, long time. He put so much of himself and his time into RJ to work on his game. He gave the blessing to give RJ that revolting, idiotic deal. He had no real back-up SF alternatives to RJ on the roster, after fat 2-guard Anderson blew his foot up.

Pop was all in on Jefferson, to a degree that is maddening. But despite that . . . in the biggest game of the season, the brink of elimination . . . RJ sucked so bad that Pop refused to play him in the 2nd half. That is incredible. Pop had so much invested into RJ, both time and lots and lots of money, but RJ was so damn shitty that Pop couldn't bring himself to play him in the 2nd half.

Even more damning was the lack of a back-up SF to play. It didn't matter, Pop couldn't bring himself to play RJ. Pop decided to go with an exhausted broken armed Manu and a 6-4 2-guard like Neal instead of RJ. Against superstars like Sam Young. Pop still couldn't afford one second of RJ in the second half.

Jefferson can not play for the Spurs. EVER again. Any single second of Jefferson on the court is an abomination to the franchise. So if there's a chance to pawn him off on some idiotic team with Parker so that anyone else can play SF for the Spurs, then at least there's something good that can come out of the bad (losing Parker). ANYONE, I don't care if it's Danny Green or Anderson or Butler or training camp invite scrub, ANYONE is better than Richard Jefferson. ANYONE.

I don't want Parker traded. I want Hill gone instead, 10 times out of 10. BUT if Parker has to go, then the best case scenario is that he takes RJ's soft lazy overpaid over-the-hill carcass with him.

I understand your points and agree with most. However, I just think that expecting cash-strapped teams like the Jazz and Kings to take on the heavy contracts of both Parker and RJ would be a stretch.

[objective]

So just buy Dick out then.

I'd be thrilled if the Spurs did that. Maybe they'll luck out and there will be another amnesty situation.

But hey, they were dumb enough to sign him to that deal after all the signals that they shouldn't. They've probably already talked themselves back into thinking that RJ will be a great fit next year.

[Russo21]

Gee we better not get rid of Tony for a draft pick and pieces :( The only way i'd want to see tony go is to get a damn descent big man in return for him. Fucken crazy stuff

[objective]

I understand your points and agree with most. However, I just think that expecting cash-strapped teams like the Jazz and Kings to take on the heavy contracts of both Parker and RJ would be a stretch.

I know, I'm just saying that honey to make the deal go down better for me, as a fan, would be junking RJ.

The only team that could handle RJ would probably be Toronto.

But I'm just dreaming, hoping beyond hope that Spurs fans everywhere will be spared the deception of watching RJ in the regular season.

[ohmwrecker]

You don't trade Tony Parker just to dump Richard Jefferson. That is beyond moronic.

[MaNu4Tres]

You don't trade Tony Parker just to dump Richard Jefferson. That is beyond moronic.

Without question.

[ElNono]

Tony/RJ for Bargnani/DeRozan/Calderon+pick

Although I don't think Toronto would let go of DeRozan that easy.

[Russo21]

Peter Holt is one of the 'poorest' owners in the NBA worth about 80 million 'only'

Maybe the last few years paying such huge salary to Duncan tony and manu, and the piece of shit we know as RJ really affected his pockets more then we know? He went deep into luxury tax territory taking on dipshit RJ.

I hope Peter isn't in any trouble financially.

[ohmwrecker]

Tony/RJ for Bargnani/DeRozan/Calderon+pick

Although I don't think Toronto would let go of DeRozan that easy.

No way Toronto does that deal.

[DPG21920]

Thursday should be interesting around here.

[Agloco]

According to Jim Buss, new acting decision-maker and the owner's son, Bynum WILL NOT be traded under any circumstances. After all, it was he who found Bynum in the first place and it is he who made Bynum is pet project. Buss is on record for declaring, on every occasion when this speculation starts, that the Fakers ARE NOT INTERESTED IN TRADING BYNUM.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=182023

[Spurtacus]

This trade currently fails but it looks like the Raptors have a few expiring contracts. If it can work I wouldn't be opposed to it.

Spurs get:
Jose Calderon
Ed Davis
Linas Kleiza
#5 pick

Raptors get:
Tony Parker
DeJuan Blair
Richard Jefferson
#29 pick & #59 pick

[ElNono]

No way Toronto does that deal.

:depressed

[baseline bum]

Tony/RJ for Bargnani/DeRozan/Calderon+pick

Although I don't think Toronto would let go of DeRozan that easy.

I don't want anything to do with Bargnani. Ed Davis would be far preferable.

[Agloco]

I'd pull this:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3skv2lo

Leaves us with:

Calderon/Hill
Manu/Anderson
#5 Pick/Kleza
Duncan/Blair
Andrea/Splitter

Why would Toronto do that?

Parker/Calderon is a lateral move for them.

[ducks]

I think there is no truth in parker
maybe hill
kings are wanting other teams to give them more for the picks that is why they threw out parkers name

[ducks]

if Adrian Wojnarowski says it then the talks are going on. rather it happens or not who knows but you can take it to the bank its legit

ludden I would believe it

[ohmwrecker]

:depressed

Sorry, dude.

[ohmwrecker]

Parker/Calderon is a lateral move for them.

Say what?!

[shyne]

I'll take that faggot Demarcus Cousins, maybe Pop can whip his fat ass into shape.

[Spurtacus]

Fuck, this draft does suck. Looking at Chad Ford's top 10 in his latest mock there isn't anyone I would want as a Spurs besides Brandon Knight or Derrick Williams.

[ElNono]

Sorry, dude.

:cry :cry :cry

[ElNono]

tbh, what's really gonna suck is when the Spurs don't do shit on Thursday and everybody in here will be :pctoss

[timtonymanu]

tbh, what's really gonna suck is when the Spurs don't do shit on Thursday and everybody in here will be :pctoss

:lol

[Nathan89]

Why would Toronto do that?

Parker/Calderon is a lateral move for them.
:lmao

[Vic Petro]

Although there are a lot of unknowns with the new CBA, it seems a good chance an amnesty clause will be included. Even if RJ isn't included in a trade, there could be an out down the road.

Obviously no one can have an opinion until a trade is agreed upon and we see official compensation. However in a vacuum, I think the idea of trading a speed-dependent PG entering his 11th NBA season is at least a wise consideration.

That said TP for #5 or #7 straight up would be disgusting.

[Spurtacus]

tbh, what's really gonna suck is when the Spurs don't do shit on Thursday and everybody in here will be :pctoss

Most likely scenario. I'm already expecting we'll draft a Euro to stash him and dump our second round pick. Boring.

[El_Mago]

Not sure if the Spurs pull the trigger, but if they get the 5th pick from Sacramento, I have no doubts that it's Vesely who they will select.

The kid is 6'11 and is not your typical Euro. He's got an aggressive offensive game, and he played with Partizan, which is a really good club out in Belgrade.

[Nathan Explosion]

You don't trade Tony Parker just to dump Richard Jefferson. That is beyond moronic.

Wow, I'm not even involved in the conversation, but I can see that you're either being sarcastic or just not getting it.

I'll take a stab at the latter.

You don't trade Parker just to get rid of Jefferson. No way. But, if you're trading Parker, you better make damn sure Jefferson goes with him. At least, that's what the guy with the idea is saying.

Repeat, don't just trade Parker. If a team wants Tony, then they have to take RJ too or no deal.

And I don't see ANYONE in this draft that I'd want to trade Parker for. Not one. Parker may not be a franchise guy, but he's a former Finals MVP with 3 rings who knows how the win in the playoffs. There's not one single player in this draft that is going to be as good as Parker. Not one. It's THAT bad.

Again, I'm not even sure I'd want Hill traded for just a pick, even a lottery pick at that. As someone else stated, this trade is about getting better now as well as long term, and there's not a difference maker that can be had for Parker or Hill. Hill's trade would need a solid role player that's going to prove to be better than Hill in a few years, and there really aren't that many options available in the late lottery picks that can provide that.

[ducks]

manu should get you a top 15 pick

if you trade tp you trade manu and duncan

[ElNono]

manu should get you a top 15 pick

if you trade tp you trade manu and duncan

:lol

[Agloco]

You don't trade Tony Parker just to dump Richard Jefferson. That is beyond moronic.


Wow, I'm not even involved in the conversation, but I can see that you're either being sarcastic or just not getting it.

I'll take a stab at the latter.You don't trade Parker just to get rid of Jefferson. No way. But, if you're trading Parker, you better make damn sure Jefferson goes with him. At least, that's what the guy with the idea is saying.

[objective]

And I don't see ANYONE in this draft that I'd want to trade Parker for. Not one. Parker may not be a franchise guy, but he's a former Finals MVP with 3 rings who knows how the win in the playoffs. There's not one single player in this draft that is going to be as good as Parker. Not one. It's THAT bad.

I would agree with that. I wouldn't want anyone after the top two instead of Parker, and maybe not even the top two players in this draft.

I would only assume that if a Parker trade happened, it wouldn't be solely because of whoever they were targeting. I would assume there was behind-the-scenes grudge carrying going on and getting a pick for Parker would be an easy out. Maybe Parker's talking to the press got on the Spurs bad side hard enough to get them to look to move him? After all, this is the same franchise that pooped on Bowen, pooh-poohing his defense and benching him for an end-of-the-line scorer starving for points and gave some 10-day scrub his jersey number.

[Agloco]

manu should get you a top 15 pick

if you trade tp you trade manu and duncan

Quack quack.

[ohmwrecker]

Wow, I'm not even involved in the conversation, but I can see that you're either being sarcastic or just not getting it.

I'll take a stab at the latter.

You don't trade Parker just to get rid of Jefferson. No way. But, if you're trading Parker, you better make damn sure Jefferson goes with him. At least, that's what the guy with the idea is saying.


That is exactly what I said. The priority in any trade involving TP is getting back equal value for TP. Getting the trading team to take RJ is secondary.

You should go back and read what was said before because you are the one who is "not getting it". Don't use my quote to springboard your point when you have no fucking clue what I am talking about. Especially when the point you are trying to make has already been discussed . . . thoroughly.

[ducks]

you might trade manu to get rid of jefferson
manu is always hurt in playoffs

[Leetonidas]

If they trade Parker for anything short of the #1 pick to get Irving then I'm going to find R.C. Buford and have him raped.

[Agloco]

Say what?!

Just my opinion. I'm sure most will get a giggle out of that. Isn't Calderon the dude that's throwing up 50-40-90 seasons for them? Or do I have him mistaken for someone else?

[5in10]

First, Can Toronto absorb Tonys contract from the Bosh Trade exception? Second, If they could wouldn't that make sense to get like maybe Amir Johnson or Ed Davis, and the # 5 Pick, for Tony make sense? Maybe draft a SF or PG with the #5. With that available cap space could we make like a run at Greg Oden, Nene, or Chandler? If possible I would do that in a heartbeat.

[SenorSpur]

Not sure if the Spurs pull the trigger, but if they get the 5th pick from Sacramento, I have no doubts that it's Vesely who they will select.

The kid is 6'11 and is not your typical Euro. He's got an aggressive offensive game, and he played with Partizan, which is a really good club out in Belgrade.

I'm with you. If they're going up that high, Vessly would be an outstanding target. Of course, he doesn't have much of a perimeter game, which probably hurts him in Pop's eyes and his open-court skills probably wouldn't match the Spurs. You simply could expect this kid to stand in the corners and shoot 3-balls. He too athletic for that and he shouldn't be converted into a spot-up shooter the way they've tried to do with RJ. It would be a freaking waste.

[ducks]

I jokingly said to a friend that punishment for Tony saying the Spurs are done will be shipped to Minny. That would be funny.

so spurs get the draft pick and their point guard or rubio?
because hill is NO fucking point guard


trading tp is ok if you get more then = value for him

[Spursfanfromafar]

I am stunned. Tony Parker may well be the Spurs' best trade asset, but he was the best player in the last few months of last season, barring the Playoffs against Memphis. He played very very well after his 2009-10 season where he was badly injured most season.

It would have made sense to trade Parker if we were getting a really good upgrade at some positions - PF/C/SF, but that does not seem to be the case with these proposed trades with the Kings/Raptors.

I always thought there was a chance for the Spurs to build around Parker as he was the youngest of the Chief Trio. If what Woj reports is true, the Spurs are doing a complete overhaul of their long term plans. And in my opinion, not for the better if things are as it is according to Adrian Woj.

[Spursfanfromafar]

If Minny were willing to trade Rubio and the second pick for Parker and 29th, I would be fine with that.

Utterly crazy in my opinion. Parker is among Top 6 of PGs in the league (after CP3, DWill, Rondo, DRose, Nash). Trading him for two rookies would be stupid.

[ALVAREZ6]

oh boy.

if they really end up trading him, they better get some real value in return. would hate to see Parker leave for only a pick. and I hope it doesn't become a desperate situation, because now that it's in the public that they are heavily considering trading him it will obviously make him feel less welcomed. weird scenario, but fuck it...the Spurs haven't made any drastic changes in forever, I'm not totally opposed to some exciting and productive change.

[objective]

if the Spurs trade Parker to Sacramento . . .

They can get Beno back!

Behold! The Prodigal Taco returns!

:lol

[DPG21920]

If Minny were willing to trade Rubio and the second pick for Parker and 29th, I would be fine with that.

There is no way they do that. They are all about Rubio and have to at least give him a chance.

I know you were half joking when you said "wait until you see what RC has for you", but is this on your radar?

[Spursfanfromafar]

.the Spurs haven't made any drastic changes in forever, I'm not totally opposed to some exciting and productive change.

Any changes the Spurs have to make are those which make them contenders for the championship. Trading Parker for rookies and chump change certainly does not take them any further in that direction.

[spurs1990]

If Minny were willing to trade Rubio and the second pick for Parker and 29th, I would be fine with that.

That trade would be insane. Derrick Williams and The Spanish Hype Machine would make us pretty interesting in 2012.


So they can sign another Rasho Nesterovic? San Antonio the city sucks in the eyes of NBA players: no big endorsement opportunities, no good clubs, no beach, no ESPN kissing your ass all day. The draft is how the Spurs need to build, but not this one.

Baseline telling it like it is. I remember the only time I was truly ecstatic about a FA signing was Mike Finley in August 2005. We're basically left to over the hill vets or journeymen. Sometimes they work out - SJax, JJax, Neal.

[Nathan Explosion]

That is exactly what I said. The priority in any trade involving TP is getting back equal value for TP. Getting the trading team to take RJ is secondary.

You should go back and read what was said before because you are the one who is "not getting it". Don't use my quote to springboard your point when you have no fucking clue what I am talking about. Especially when the point you are trying to make has already been discussed . . . thoroughly.

It has been discussed, and you keep saying that you don't trade Parker just to get rid of Jefferson. With this draft, if you're trading Parker for a pick (no matter how high it is), you better be damn sure Jefferson goes with him. When a pick is involved, trading Jefferson is not secondary, it's mandatory. Otherwise no trade.

But before you say it, you don't just trade Parker if a team wants Jefferson. You better be getting good value for Parker. Just make sure Jefferson goes with him.

You can claim I'm asking for too much from the other team, but a draft pick in this draft is not going to cut it at all for just Parker, unless the pick is traded for Jefferson straight up. Not saying that that's what should happen, but rather that the value in this draft is that bad imo.

[DPG21920]

Everyone is tradeable for the right price. It's a matter of gauging what that price is. What do people realistically expect?

It will be tough to trade TP for what we as Spurs fans perceive as fair.

[ALVAREZ6]

If Jefferson returns a Spur and Parker doesn't, it will inevitably be the worst offseason in ages.

[Buddy Holly]

Peter Holt is one of the 'poorest' owners in the NBA worth about 80 million 'only'

Maybe the last few years paying such huge salary to Duncan tony and manu, and the piece of shit we know as RJ really affected his pockets more then we know? He went deep into luxury tax territory taking on dipshit RJ.

I hope Peter isn't in any trouble financially.

Peter Holt is one of many people who own the Spurs.

[dbreiden83080]

Tony can take a hike anytime for all i care.. He played well at times but ultimately rode Duncan to 3 rings..

Later Tony..

[jag]

The only reason the Spurs would deal Tony for players with unknown value is if they truly believe what Tony said to the French media. It would be their way of trying to prepare for life without Duncan. Otherwise, it doesn't make any sense.

[Nathan Explosion]

I think I'd take a flyer on Rubio if the Spurs are intent on making Hill the starting PG next season. But I'm not so sure I'd want Rubio as a starting PG. Pairing Rubio with Gino should help Rubio progress, and he is a good passer to put alongside Gino.

But, Minny is not trading Rubio, so that's not really a scenario that needs to be discussed further.

[ALVAREZ6]

Any changes the Spurs have to make are those which make them contenders for the championship. Trading Parker for rookies and chump change certainly does not take them any further in that direction.

I agree...I would only consider it if RJ is also part of the package and it brings the #1 or 2 draft pick AND another solid role player, equivalent or near to RJ in contract/value but a better fit, with some balls.


If they're only getting younger to get younger, they might as well trade Ginobili as well.

[jag]

Tony can take a hike anytime for all i care.. He played well at times but ultimately rode Duncan to 3 rings..

Later Tony..

What a joke you are.

[mabrignani]

there is no way he gets traded, this is bs. after everyone thinking he was gonna leave to ny or whatever and he got rid of that mexican chick and hes still here?

george hill is the one who is possibly getting traded.

[Nathan Explosion]

If Jefferson returns a Spur and Parker doesn't, it will inevitably be the worst offseason in ages.

Hence why I'd tell a team that if they want to offer a lottery pick for Tony, then they'd need to offer up a good to near all star big man in return, or take Jefferson as part of the deal. Picks just aren't going to cut it. The talent isn't there.

[jag]

Tony can take a hike anytime for all i care.. He played well at times but ultimately rode Duncan to 3 rings..

Later Tony..

Are you fucking retarded?

[ALVAREZ6]

:lmao dbreiden

[mabrignani]

Tony can take a hike anytime for all i care.. He played well at times but ultimately rode Duncan to 3 rings..

Later Tony..

hahaha what?!?!

[dbreiden83080]

What a joke you are.

Fuck you.. Because i don't love Tony.. He is Hollywood.. Send him to the Clippers.. You got Spurs fans here that think Manu has been as valuable as Duncan.. :lol

[Agloco]

Damn, this draft is gonna rival 2000. Spurs better get a good commodity on top of any pick for TP.

[dbreiden83080]

hahaha what?!?!

What part of Rode Duncan to 3 rings is confusing??

2003 finals tony was on the bench while Speedy saved the day

2005 finals he watch Tim and Manu carry the team

He beat a terrible Cavs team in 2007

[ALVAREZ6]

Parker, RJ, and Bonner to Memphis for Randolph and a pick...one last shot, do it!


If only that were possible ...

[Nathan Explosion]

Parker, RJ, and Bonner to Memphis for Randolph and a pick...one last shot, do it!


If only that were possible ...

Randolph, no. But Marc Gasol is available as a free agent, although he might be restricted.

And yes, if only because I don't see it happening.

[jag]

Fuck you.. Because i don't love Tony.. He is Hollywood.. Send him to the Clippers.. You got Spurs fans here that think Manu has been as valuable as Duncan.. :lol

No, because your takes are laughable and because you still havent figured out what a complete sentence is.

The fact that you don't realize how valuable Tony has been to the Spurs shows how uninformed and oblivious you are to even the simplest basketball concepts.

[Spursfanfromafar]

And one more thing. Adrian Woj is one of the best but that does not mean he is 100% accurate all the time.

Season and a half ago, he said that the Spurs were looking to trade Manu possibly for Amare. Look where that went. Manu signed for a three year and a very good contract (for both sides).

[jag]

You got Spurs fans here that think Manu has been as valuable as Duncan.. :lol



2005 finals he watch Tim and Manu carry the team

[DPG21920]

Just because something doesn't happen, doesn't mean people are wrong. He said they are having discussions, not that he has been traded.

Sometimes things just don't materialize for whatever reason (likely because trades are difficult in the NBA).

[dbreiden83080]

No, because your takes are laughable and because you still havent figured out what a complete sentence is.

The fact that you don't realize how valuable Tony has been to the Spurs shows how uninformed and oblivious you are to even simplest basketball concepts.

Tony has been a Good Spur but to say he did not ride Duncan to 3 rings is fuckin laughable.. Duncan is the best ever at his position and a top 10 player ever.. Tony was young and often terrible in 2003. He was more consistent in 2005 but nowhere in the 2005 finals.. He was great in the 2007 finals against a lousy team.. Good Spur yes but he rode Duncan..

[tmtcsc]

The playoffs define who you are as a player. Tony Parker, more than any other player on our starting 5 let down his team.

He sucked and then said our Championship years were behind us because of Tim and Manu ? Are you fucking serious ?

Ship his ass out of here. We all know Tim is spent but at least he has 35 excuses or however old he is. Tony is an under-achieving, drama-instigating, boy who can't lead.

Speedy bailed his ass out in '03 and Manu did in '05. 2007 he had a dream match-up with an awful backcourt in Cleveland.

When you need him most he disappears. Trade for a high pick and something of value. Move Jefferson's mental midget ass too.

[dbreiden83080]

The playoffs define who you are as a player. Tony Parker, more than any other player on our starting 5 let down his team.

He sucked and then said our Championship years were behind us because of Tim and Manu ? Are you fucking serious ?

Ship his ass out of here. We all know Tim is spent but at least he has 35 excuses or however old he is. Tony is an under-achieving, drama-instigating, boy who can't lead.

Speedy bailed his ass out in '03 and Manu did in '05. 2007 he had a dream match-up with an awful backcourt in Cleveland.

When you need him most he disappears. Trade for a high pick and something of value. Move Jefferson's mental midget ass too.

Exactly.. Who the fuck would this guy be without Duncan and the Spurs? Putting up 18 a game on a shit ass team..

[Spursfanfromafar]

Well first off, yes, Manu for Amare was talked about. The inclusion of Hill was a deal breaker. Anything coming from Yahoo is coming from Ludden most likely who is good friends with RC. So this is reliable, but not a 100% to happen thing.

Link for Amare/Manu? Hill as deal breaker? I bet it never happened. Why would Suns want Hill if they had Nash and Dragic to go along with Manu?

I have been reading your posts and forgive me for saying so, you mix up a few of your inside scoops with a lot of bogus bullshit.

[jag]

Tony has been a Good Spur but to say he did not ride Duncan to 3 rings is fuckin laughable.. Duncan is the best ever at his position and a top 10 player ever.. Tony was young and often terrible in 2003. He was more consistent in 2005 but nowhere in the 2005 finals.. He was great in the 2007 finals against a lousy team.. Good Spur yes but he rode Duncan..

Your "reasoning" was that Tony is "Hollywood". And why is it that Tim being so great only reflects poorly on Tony? Should David Robinson have been shipped out after '99 because he "rode" Duncan to a ring? How about Bowen, his accomplishments should really mean nothing considering Duncan was the reason for the Spurs' success. And Sean Elliott, AJ, Horry? They were good spurs but they rode Duncan so apparently they should have been shipped at the first available trade. By your reasoning, Manu should be dealt as well because his contributions should be viewed as nothing more than riding Duncan to championships.

Your reasoning is only confirming my original response to your ridiculous post. Youre a joke.

[objective]

The playoffs define who you are as a player. Tony Parker, more than any other player on our starting 5 let down his team.



More than any other player?

Richard Jefferson is still on this team and still the starter.

And as far as replacing McDyess in the starting lineup . . . Pop himself said, "Maybe it's Matt Bonner."

No, Parker has not let the team down more than any other member of the starting 5.

[ohmwrecker]

It has been discussed, and you keep saying that you don't trade Parker just to get rid of Jefferson. With this draft, if you're trading Parker for a pick (no matter how high it is), you better be damn sure Jefferson goes with him. When a pick is involved, trading Jefferson is not secondary, it's mandatory. Otherwise no trade.

You can't just trade Parker for a pick. Mainly because no team can absorb his contract without other players being involved, but more importantly, there is NO player in this draft worth getting rid of Parker for. If the Spurs do that, then it's just a salary dump and they may as well blow up the whole team.
It all depends on what the Spurs motivation for trading Parker is . . . if they are really upset about his comments, that's just sad. Disappointing. Pathetic, really. Fuck Pop in his ass, if that's the case.
If the Spurs are still trying to field a competitive team and they feel the only way they can do that is to trade Parker, then they damn sure better get some value in the trade. If you can move Jefferson in the process, all the better.


But before you say it, you don't just trade Parker if a team wants Jefferson. You better be getting good value for Parker. Just make sure Jefferson goes with him.

Here, you are just basically repeating what I've already said. I don't get what your damage is, honestly.


You can claim I'm asking for too much from the other team, but a draft pick in this draft is not going to cut it at all for just Parker, unless the pick is traded for Jefferson straight up. Not saying that that's what should happen, but rather that the value in this draft is that bad imo.

It's difficult to understand the point you are trying to make here and honestly, I don't care anymore. No Spurs player with a big contract is getting traded straight up for a draft pick. OK?

[Spurminator]

He beat a terrible Cavs team in 2007

That's the best you can do?

Duncan played that same terrible Cavs team. The whole Spurs team did. They beat three other teams to get there. It was the Finals and they won.

That's got to be the dumbest thing I've ever seen any Spurs fan say to try to diminish Parker's contributions to this team, and there's been a lot of dumb shit said.

[objective]

as an aside, here's a recap of the 2001 draft from the Hawks perspective as retold by a former Hawks beat writer. The story of their terrible GM pointed towards passing on Parker due to being 'unsure' as the key to his losing his job is quite amusing.


link (http://www.peachtreehoops.com/2011/6/21/2235474/atlanta-hawks-nba-draft-rewind-2001#storyjump)

[jag]

The playoffs define who you are as a player.


2007 he had a dream match-up with an awful backcourt in Cleveland.




The playoffs define who you are as a player. Unless that player is Tony Parker. Because apparently you decided 2007 doesn't count.

[jag]

And his playoff performances in previous non-title seasons don't count. Because those playoffs just don't count.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

crofl dbreiden
crofl men in spandex

[ohmwrecker]

Sweet Jesus! Between the idiot farm up here and troll town downstairs, I can't get a decent discussion anywhere.

[ALVAREZ6]

I just don't see this Parker for picks, or even Parker + RJ for pick + another decent role player working out very well. I haven't analyzed scenarios with many teams, but I can't see it working out even mediocre-ly well after considering the big picture.

Given the Spurs community loves Duncan and Ginobili, and at least knowing it's essentially a guarantee Duncan will retire a Spur, this franchise is still in win now mode. And I truly think they have one more decent chance to make a deep playoff run as long as they keep the big 3 together and ship out the incompetent role player dickheads like RJ, Bonner, and even Hill is exchangeable.

The problem with trading away Parker while in win now mode is that it leaves a massive scoring whole and shifts more of the burden to Ginobili, who we all know is streaky as hell. Hell, currently in the NBA unless you are Dallas, you can't expect to go far while expecting one main player to do most of the scoring. Duncan obviously can't be relied upon to score very much at this stage of his career, you just can't feed his body the ball 15-17 times a night and expect him to produce very efficiently in the playoffs, game after game. If they traded Parker via this route, they likely wouldn't get another big scorer in return...a Ginobili/Duncan 70-75% Spurs offense won't cut it.

If they trade Parker, picks isn't the route, they need a solid scorer in return and RJ has to go. All things considered, it's best they don't touch the big 3 and instead modify the bench/role players.

[tmtcsc]

More than any other player?

Richard Jefferson is still on this team and still the starter.

And as far as replacing McDyess in the starting lineup . . . Pop himself said, "Maybe it's Matt Bonner."

No, Parker has not let the team down more than any other member of the starting 5.

RJ's poor performance didn't surprise anyone. He's been a bust on our roster and yet he's the best SF we have. What options did we have ? Anderson wasn't on the playoff roster. By the time it was all over, Jefferson was riding the bench.

[Vic Petro]

I wouldn't read too much into the Sacto/Toronto part of the report. The big news is that we have further confirmation that they are willing to trade Tony Parker in the right deal.

It seems like Denver is driving a hard bargain with Sacto over Felton. Nuggs say they want #7 straight up, so Sacto leaks this report to get Denver to soften their stance. "We're not gonna give you #7 straight up for Felton if we can get Tony Parker." No real benefit for the Spurs to leak this info.

[5in10]

I have questions.Can Toronto absorb Tonys contract from the Bosh Trade exception? Second, If they could wouldn't that make sense to get like maybe Amir Johnson or Ed Davis, and the # 5 Pick, for Tony make sense? Maybe draft a SF or PG with the #5. With that available cap space could we make like a run at Greg Oden, Nene, or Chandler? If possible I would do that in a heartbeat.

[Spurtacus]

You know, Parker could be traded for two first rounders. Raptors #5 this year and a likely lottery pick next year.

Parker is past his prime at 29. He's not finished but he's our best trade asset. Getting back Calderon and two potential lottery picks isn't a bad deal.

[timtonymanu]

Fuck you.. Because i don't love Tony.. He is Hollywood.. Send him to the Clippers.. You got Spurs fans here that think Manu has been as valuable as Duncan.. :lol

:cry Parker doesnt believe in the team so I want him gone :cry

[TDMVPDPOY]

you pull the trade anything that involves gettin rid of rjs contract

heck then sign some veteran pg to start..maybe iverson hahaha

[Agloco]

Parker is past his prime at 29.

Really?

[Spurtacus]

Really?

No really? Some posts in this thread hinted that Parker still has a ton left in his tank. Fact is he doesn't. We're still better with him for the next two years but now may be the time to start thinking about the future of the Spurs.

[ALVAREZ6]

It all depends on what the Spurs motivation for trading Parker is . . . if they are really upset about his comments, that's just sad. Disappointing. Pathetic, really. Fuck Pop in his ass, if that's the case.

Yeah, I really wish the motivation were clear to us. That would truly be fucking pathetic and hypocritical...if they're inclined to ship Tony because they think he doesn't believe anymore, they might as well order a hitman for Pop's cock sucking retarded ass in deliberately fucking the team.

This whole thing is bound to backfire, the only way it might work is if they end up doing nothing in relation to the draft and instead create interest in Parker from other teams who have an equally valuable player like a solid big man ready to come in and help this team make one more run. And of course, I don't give a shit how advantageous a possible Parker trade is for the Spurs, I will only approve if RJ is also shipped. If the cock sucker wants to keep his boy Bonner another year, so be it, but a dude of RJ's contract level playing so poorly has to be shipped.

[ALVAREZ6]

Really?
Yeah, pretty dumb. Sure, Tony isn't as lightning quick as he was in 05, but he's still about as effective as he's ever been.

[TD 21]

I wouldn't read too much into the Sacto/Toronto part of the report. The big news is that we have further confirmation that they are willing to trade Tony Parker in the right deal.

It seems like Denver is driving a hard bargain with Sacto over Felton. Nuggs say they want #7 straight up, so Sacto leaks this report to get Denver to soften their stance. "We're not gonna give you #7 straight up for Felton if we can get Tony Parker." No real benefit for the Spurs to leak this info.

I agree about not reading too much into the Raptors/Kings part. "Willing to trade Parker in the right deal" isn't saying much. Almost without exception, everyone is available in the right deal. I'm still not convinced that they're shopping him or intend to trade him though. This could be nothing more than them doing their due diligence.

This could also be their way of getting back at Parker for his comments. They may have leaked this, just to scare him into thinking he might be dealt to the Raptors or Kings. I'd be surprised if something actually happens though. The players likely to be available in that range aren't good enough prospects or fits for this to make sense.

[ALVAREZ6]

No really? Some posts in this thread hinted that Parker still has a ton left in his tank. Fact is he doesn't. We're still better with him for the next two years but now may be the time to start thinking about the future of the Spurs.

WTF? :wtf

TP does have a ton left in the tank. Yeah, he doesn't have years left of possible championship success on this aging Spurs team, but individually he still has his legs, Manu and especially Duncan not so much.


WTF are you talking about?

If you're bringing a "thinking about the future" argument approach, it would be the opposite, trade Duncan and Ginobili and keep Parker around for a few more years.

[Spurtacus]

Yeah, pretty dumb. Sure, Tony isn't as lightning quick as he was in 05, but he's still about as effective as he's ever been.

What's dumb is not quoting the entire post. This is what I said.

"Parker is past his prime at 29. He's not finished but he's our best trade asset. Getting back Calderon and two potential lottery picks isn't a bad deal. "

[Trimble87]

I don't really see the upside of trying to trade Tony for picks in this incredibly shallow draft. However I wouldn't hate the trade if we either got good players + a high draft pick (4-10) or we managed to trade with Cleveland or Minnesota in order to grab Derrick Williams. I doubt Minny gwould be willing to deal given that they have Flynn and Rubio already. However a Sessions, Verajo, Filler(Hickson would be great but thats pushing it) + #1 pick for Tony would be a win in my book. I doubt the cavaliers would consider that though.

[ALVAREZ6]

I agree about not reading too much into the Raptors/Kings part. "Willing to trade Parker in the right deal" isn't saying much. Almost without exception, everyone is available in the right deal. I'm still not convinced that they're shopping him or intend to trade him though. This could be nothing more than them doing their due diligence.

This could also be their way of getting back at Parker for his comments. They may have leaked this, just to scare him into thinking he might be dealt to the Raptors or Kings. I'd be surprised if something actually happens though. The players likely to be available in that range aren't good enough prospects or fits for this to make sense.

I believe and seriously hope you are correct. It does make sense that they're simply given the offseason its due diligence as you say. I just hope it doesn't have much at all to due with scaring him into getting his shit together mentally or getting back at him for some sincere, harmless comments to meaningless French reporters that don't know shit about NBA basketball.

[Spurtacus]

WTF? :wtf

TP does have a ton left in the tank. Yeah, he doesn't have years left of possible championship success on this aging Spurs team, but individually he still has his legs, Manu and especially Duncan not so much.


WTF are you talking about?

If you're bringing a "thinking about the future" argument approach, it would be the opposite, trade Duncan and Ginobili and keep Parker around for a few more years.

He didn't show it against the Grizzlies.

Last I checked this is a Tony Parker trade discussion thread based on reported news.

[ALVAREZ6]

What's dumb is not quoting the entire post. This is what I said.

"Parker is past his prime at 29. He's not finished but he's our best trade asset. Getting back Calderon and two potential lottery picks isn't a bad deal. "

But Parker really isn't past his prime at 29...much like Wade, they're still in it. Sure, maybe they're at 95% of their highest athletic ability ever reached in their lives, but as players they are still effective as ever.

[The Truth #6]

Smoke screen. CIA Pop. Not enough guts to pull off a trade. Whatever reason, it's not happening.

[ALVAREZ6]

He didn't show it against the Grizzlies.

Last I checked this is a Tony Parker trade discussion thread based on reported news.

Right before your last realistic shot, would you trade away your proven all-star PG for having one bad series, when the overwhelming majority of the entire team, including the coach, had the same bad series?????

[Spurtacus]

But Parker really isn't past his prime at 29...much like Wade, they're still in it. Sure, maybe they're at 95% of their highest athletic ability ever reached in their lives, but as players they are still effective as ever.

I have to respectfully disagree on the prime part. I'd prefer not to move Parker, but Calderon and two first rounders is a great deal if offered. Calderon is the same age as Parker but the trade is more about the future. If the Spurs are thinking about trading Parker then it has to be because they are looking at unloading salary and rebuilding.

I do not believe a trade will happen. Spurs are still a contender with Parker and it would be a dishonor to Duncan & Manu to start rebuilding in their final years.

[crc21209]

I just don't see this Parker for picks, or even Parker + RJ for pick + another decent role player working out very well. I haven't analyzed scenarios with many teams, but I can't see it working out even mediocre-ly well after considering the big picture.

Given the Spurs community loves Duncan and Ginobili, and at least knowing it's essentially a guarantee Duncan will retire a Spur, this franchise is still in win now mode. And I truly think they have one more decent chance to make a deep playoff run as long as they keep the big 3 together and ship out the incompetent role player dickheads like RJ, Bonner, and even Hill is exchangeable.

The problem with trading away Parker while in win now mode is that it leaves a massive scoring whole and shifts more of the burden to Ginobili, who we all know is streaky as hell. Hell, currently in the NBA unless you are Dallas, you can't expect to go far while expecting one main player to do most of the scoring. Duncan obviously can't be relied upon to score very much at this stage of his career, you just can't feed his body the ball 15-17 times a night and expect him to produce very efficiently in the playoffs, game after game. If they traded Parker via this route, they likely wouldn't get another big scorer in return...a Ginobili/Duncan 70-75% Spurs offense won't cut it.

If they trade Parker, picks isn't the route, they need a solid scorer in return and RJ has to go. All things considered, it's best they don't touch the big 3 and instead modify the bench/role players.

This. People have to realize this. Manu and Tim are the older guys and were the ones who were hurt more throughout the season than anyone else on the team. They're older, and more prone to get injured at their age now. And who keeps the Spurs afloat while Tim or Manu or both are out? Tony. TP is also the reason why the Spurs get so many easy buckets and transition buckets. Without him, you put more pressure on Manu and Tim on the offensive end, and lose basically your entire fast break game. If trading TP is the only way to go, it better be for a pick or TWO even, and some DAMN good players, or otherwise....I as a Spurs fan am going to be pretty pissed off....

[crc21209]

I really, really just don't want to see the Big 3 blown up so quick. The Pistons blew up their core and look what's happened to them since then. The Spurs just have to find creative ways to get some fucking hungry young talent or hungry vets for one last shot. Because guys like Bonner and RJ arent going to fucking get it done. I would trade Hill for a shot at a 8-15 pick in this years draft though. Roll with the Big 3, Neal, Splitter, Hill (if not traded) and replace everyone else on the damn roster and take another shot at a title....

[Spurtacus]

This. People have to realize this. Manu and Tim are the older guys and were the ones who were hurt more throughout the season than anyone else on the team. They're older, and more prone to get injured at their age now. And who keeps the Spurs afloat while Tim or Manu or both are out? Tony. TP is also the reason why the Spurs get so many easy buckets and transition buckets. Without him, you put more pressure on Manu and Tim on the offensive end, and lose basically your entire fast break game. If trading TP is the only way to go, it better be for a pick or TWO even, and some DAMN good players, or otherwise....I as a Spurs fan am going to be pretty pissed off....

Parkers missed games every year due to injury. If you look at last year Manu played 2 more games then him. Duncan played two less than Parker but you can blame that dumb DNP for his ankle injury.

[SenorSpur]

This. People have to realize this. Manu and Tim are the older guys and were the ones who were hurt more throughout the season than anyone else on the team. They're older, and more prone to get injured at their age now. And who keeps the Spurs afloat while Tim or Manu or both are out? Tony. TP is also the reason why the Spurs get so many easy buckets and transition buckets. Without him, you put more pressure on Manu and Tim on the offensive end, and lose basically your entire fast break game. If trading TP is the only way to go, it better be for a pick or TWO even, and some DAMN good players, or otherwise....I as a Spurs fan am going to be pretty pissed off....


That's why I'd rather the Spurs ship Hill's ass out of here instead.

[TDMVPDPOY]

tp + rj for sacrementos lottery pick + beno + fillers

[Vic Petro]

You can say "shallow draft" or whatever but all it takes is one player. High picks are absolutely essential. The bottom line is the Spurs need a new best player. Who is this team built around right now? If it's Tim Duncan, it's not good enough anymore. If it's Ginobili, it's not good enough anymore. If it's Parker, it's not good enough. I don't see a team winning a title with any of those guys as the best player on the team.

I don't think you are going to find a player for player trade involving Parker that is going to make the Spurs a championship contender. The key is the draft picks.

Is there a player in this draft that could become the Spurs best player? If there is I don't see him, but if Pop and RC do that's all that matters.

Sure, if you trade Parker you have to get talent in return that's going to help you sustain a competitive team over time. But the big prize is the lottery tickets. That's why I hope if a trade does materialize, it includes an unprotected 2012 pick from a potential lottery team. The more high picks the better chance to draft a great player, even by accident.

After they make the picks, then we can really judge a potential trade, and then hold Pop and RC accountable for the results.

[DJ Mbenga]

i dont discount wojo's sources, he is the best in the business, but this seems like its coming from sacramento. its been reported today sac would entertain trading their pick for felton and the 22. seems they want a vet pg and have the cap room to absorb the salary. for the spurs it makes sense if a big they like drops. ducan needs lots of help. the spurs are done contending but at least let ducan go with grace, not being destroyed by centers.

[ohmwrecker]

tp + rj for sacrementos lottery pick + beno + fillers

You should just stop now.

[Spurtacus]

ESPN is a little late.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2011/news/story?id=6689841

However, they say something different from Yahoo.

"A Parker trade would shift George Hill into the starting roll, but sources also told Yahoo that there are teams at the end of the first round interested in Hill."

Yahoo reported late lottery pick. Spurs would be dumb to trade Hill for a late first rounder.

[intlspurshk]

It is not necessary for improvement. It may just for getting rid of RJ contract.

There is a new CBA coming and the economy is under recession and the SPURS playoff records are declining. As long as SPURS have TD and Manu to sale ticket, why do the owners need to pay lux tax for 1st round exit or even not making playoff?

[crc21209]

Parkers missed games every year due to injury. If you look at last year Manu played 2 more games then him. Duncan played two less than Parker but you can blame that dumb DNP for his ankle injury.

True, but for games when Manu and Tim or even both of them are out, there is NO ONE else on this team that could carry them on offense outside of Tony Parker....

[TD 21]

You can say "shallow draft" or whatever but all it takes is one player. High picks are absolutely essential. The bottom line is the Spurs need a new best player. Who is this team built around right now? If it's Tim Duncan, it's not good enough anymore. If it's Ginobili, it's not good enough anymore. If it's Parker, it's not good enough. I don't see a team winning a title with any of those guys as the best player on the team.

I don't think you are going to find a player for player trade involving Parker that is going to make the Spurs a championship contender. The key is the draft picks.

Is there a player in this draft that could become the Spurs best player? If there is I don't see him, but if Pop and RC do that's all that matters.

Sure, if you trade Parker you have to get talent in return that's going to help you sustain a competitive team over time. But the big prize is the lottery tickets. That's why I hope if a trade does materialize, it includes an unprotected 2012 pick from a potential lottery team. The more high picks the better chance to draft a great player, even by accident.

After they make the picks, then we can really judge a potential trade, and then hold Pop and RC accountable for the results.

In theory, what you're saying isn't a bad idea. But it's the quality of the draft, or lack thereof, that makes this foolish. None of the players projected to be in the 5-7 range are good enough prospects or fits with the current roster for this to make sense. Valanciunas is similar to Biedrins, Vesley is similar to Kirilenko, Walker is similar to Flynn and Leonard is similar to Wallace. If one of them becomes the Spurs next best player, they'll have either overachieved to a historical extent or the Spurs will be the worst team in the league.

The Truth#6, I somewhat agree with "not enough guts". They'd have a hard time selling to Duncan and Ginobili that they're still trying to contend if they trade Parker for a 5th or 7th pick in a weak draft. And I've heard more than a few times over the years that Duncan is more in the loop on the going's on than how it may seem.

Duncan essentially gave them $10 million over 2 years on his last extension and how have they re-paid him? By pairing him with a big older than him and two undersized specialists. They at least tried to vault themselves back into contention with the Jefferson trade. This would be the opposite of that and it would be the ultimate slap in the face.

[ALVAREZ6]

True, but for games when Manu and Tim or even both of them are out, there is NO ONE else on this team that could carry them on offense outside of Tony Parker....

At this stage (2011/2012), the team is shaky whenever any big 3 player is out. It's not a huge deal if it's only one of them at a time for only a few games at a stretch during the regular season. If 2 are out, none of the big 3 can individually carry the team offensively, especially considering the defense is inevitably much weaker with any combination of the 2 being out.

[Ice009]

George Hill strikes me as 15MPG type of guy on a contending team, not the 30MPGish he plays with the Spurs.

If you can trade him for a lottery pick, that has to be done, especially if the front office have a particular guy in mind.

Trading Parker in this draft doesn't really make sense to me.

Also, if you trade Hill for a lotto pick then the Spurs should hold off on the trade and do it draft night. Wait and see if the guy they want is there and then trade Hill, if not there is no point it trading him if the guys that want are already picked.

Can you do that? How late can you make it when trading for a lotto pick?

[Man In Black]

It used to be that when shit like this was printed as news, that shit like this would NEVER happen.

Do I want to see the Big 3 broken up? No, but I do want to see the SPURS win again. I'm for GHill going if they can get a late lotto pick, even in a weak draft like this, all it will take is 1 player that fits perfectly, to make a team that doesn't like it has enough tools, into a team that wins the title. ALA Tyson Chandler and the used to be under-achieving Mavericks. Those pieces around Dallas didn't change all that much. They just got that piece that focused on defense and rebounds and easy putbacks. Those things that we got in a limited fashion from Dice, we need more from in a youthful center.

An Athletic Big who can focus on rebounding and toughness but with range to cover the lane...that's what this team needs. And looking at most mocks...it would seem that the teams with better drafting position are drafting best player available...From my standpoint, I think a player like Bismack Boyombo, think shorter version of his Congo countryman, Serge Ibaka. If Hill can get us to that place...then bye George Hill.

[Ice009]

Peter Holt is one of the 'poorest' owners in the NBA worth about 80 million 'only'

Maybe the last few years paying such huge salary to Duncan tony and manu, and the piece of shit we know as RJ really affected his pockets more then we know? He went deep into luxury tax territory taking on dipshit RJ.

I hope Peter isn't in any trouble financially.

I read Peter Holt was worth about 80 million too. How does that work though? Don't the Spurs have a pretty big ownership group? For example does that even mean Holt is the richest owner just because he is the majority? Is it possible that other people in the ownership group have more money?

[Vic Petro]

In theory, what you're saying isn't a bad idea. But it's the quality of the draft, or lack thereof, that makes this foolish. None of the players projected to be in the 5-7 range are good enough prospects or fits with the current roster for this to make sense. Valanciunas is similar to Biedrins, Vesley is similar to Kirilenko, Walker is similar to Flynn and Leonard is similar to Wallace. If one of them becomes the Spurs next best player, they'll have either overachieved to a historical extent or the Spurs will be the worst team in the league.

We can say one guy is similar to another but we can't write a guy's career before he ever plays a game. Amare Stoudemire was the 9th pick in a weak draft. Brandon Roy was the 6th pick in a weak draft. Maybe Pop/RC see something in Valanciunas, Vesely, Biyambo that we don't. Not saying they would be right, that would remain to be seen of course. But if they feel one of those guys has the chance to be a really great player (and you get other pieces and/or '12 pick) then go ahead and pull the trigger. Exhaust all avenues to acquiring a great player. Tony Parker + filler = X great player does not compute. Any trade must involve high pick(s)

[crc21209]

At this stage (2011/2012), the team is shaky whenever any big 3 player is out. It's not a huge deal if it's only one of them at a time for only a few games at a stretch during the regular season. If 2 are out, none of the big 3 can individually carry the team offensively, especially considering the defense is inevitably much weaker with any combination of the 2 being out.

True, but you have to admit that TP is a big part of the scoring load, and for also creating open shots for his teammates with all the driving he does in the paint. I think without him we would suffer big time....:td

[FkLA]

George Hill turned out to be a Top 10-15 player in the 08' class, a draft that was pretty deep. And if NBA teams knew what we know about him today he would likely be a Top 5-10 pick in this years shallow draft...so why in the world are some of you niggas suggesting he be moved for a late lottery pick? That is just beyond idiotic.

[baseline bum]

It used to be that when shit like this was printed as news, that shit like this would NEVER happen.

Do I want to see the Big 3 broken up? No, but I do want to see the SPURS win again. I'm for GHill going if they can get a late lotto pick, even in a weak draft like this, all it will take is 1 player that fits perfectly, to make a team that doesn't like it has enough tools, into a team that wins the title. ALA Tyson Chandler and the used to be under-achieving Mavericks. Those pieces around Dallas didn't change all that much. They just got that piece that focused on defense and rebounds and easy putbacks. Those things that we got in a limited fashion from Dice, we need more from in a youthful center.

An Athletic Big who can focus on rebounding and toughness but with range to cover the lane...that's what this team needs. And looking at most mocks...it would seem that the teams with better drafting position are drafting best player available...From my standpoint, I think a player like Bismack Boyombo, think shorter version of his Congo countryman, Serge Ibaka. If Hill can get us to that place...then bye George Hill.

I like Biyombo as a high-risk high-reward guy if it doesn't cost the Spurs too much to get him (for example, Hill), but I disagree with the Ibaka comparisons since Serge could hit a jumpshot when he was drafted. I'd be really shocked if Biyombo could make an immediate difference.

[Vic Petro]

If someone slips that they like I wouldn't cry over trading Hill for a pick in the teens.

[baseline bum]

George Hill turned out to be a Top 10-15 player in the 08' class, a draft that was pretty deep. And if NBA teams knew what we know about him today he would likely be a Top 5-10 pick in this years shallow draft...so why in the world are some of you niggas suggesting he be moved for a late lottery pick? That is just beyond idiotic.

Hill is nothing special and supposedly the team loves James Anderson anyways (at least according to Chad Ford). Hill, Anderson, and Neal give this team three backup shooting guards. How many do you really need?

[longhorn]

If we could snag Kemba Walker+ for Tony I would be a happy boy.

[Spurtacus]

If we could snag Kemba Walker+ for Tony I would be a happy boy.

Oh boy...

[Man In Black]

I like Biyombo as a high-risk high-reward guy if it doesn't cost the Spurs too much to get him (for example, Hill), but I disagree with the Ibaka comparisons since Serge could hit a jumpshot when he was drafted. I'd be really shocked if Biyombo could make an immediate difference.

While I agree with you that Biyombo's offense is raw, even moreso than Serge, I also think that his offense isn't what's needed. I get that Dice had a good jumpshot, but throughout his career with the Spurs he averaged a little over 5 shots a game. If the Spurs interior provokes fear with Biyombo as opposed to inspires confidence with B & B, then it's already a difference maker.

[TD 21]

We can say one guy is similar to another but we can't write a guy's career before he ever plays a game. Amare Stoudemire was the 9th pick in a weak draft. Brandon Roy was the 6th pick in a weak draft. Maybe Pop/RC see something in Valanciunas, Vesely, Biyambo that we don't. Not saying they would be right, that would remain to be seen of course. But if they feel one of those guys has the chance to be a really great player (and you get other pieces and/or '12 pick) then go ahead and pull the trigger. Exhaust all avenues to acquiring a great player. Tony Parker + filler = X great player does not compute. Any trade must involve high pick(s)

No, but you can project (which is what the draft is all about). And none of those players projects as a star. It was known at the time that Stoudemire had star potential. Roy was considered a potential All-Star, but had questions about his knees.

There's no chance of them getting an unprotected '12 lottery pick for Parker, especially not in addition to an '11 lottery pick. The '12 draft is shaping up to be significantly better than the '11 draft and look what just happened to the Clippers. Granted, had the Clippers kept their pick, the league wouldn't have given them the #1 pick, but still.

As far as "other pieces", I think one of A. Johnson or Bayless or Casspi or Udrih would be it. I can't see the Raptors offering Davis or the Kings offering Thompson and I can't see the Spurs taking on the salaries of either A. Johnson or Udrih.

[FkLA]

Hill is nothing special and supposedly the team loves James Anderson anyways (at least according to Chad Ford). Hill, Anderson, and Neal give this team three backup shooting guards. How many do you really need?

Hill is getting groomed as a PG by the Spurs, regardless of Spurstalk's consensus that "he's a SG". The sooner yall niggas accept that the sooner yall will realize that trading Parker makes alot more sense than trading Hill, especially for a late lottery pick. If the FO believes the Big 3 can no longer win titles they can either:

1. Rebuild. Duncan & Gino seem to be locks to retire as Spurs, so that leaves Parker as the lone big contract with value (noone wants RJ).

or

2.Make a move. And considering the fact that Parker's value is alot higher than Hill's...that would be the only move that could possibly improve this team significantly. Hill isnt enough to net us someone that might put us over the top.

If you deal either of them you deal Parker, its the best move. Otherwise stay pat. Hill shouldnt go anywhere imo.

[baseline bum]

If we could snag Kemba Walker+ for Tony I would be a happy boy.

:vomit:

A guy who shoots 43% against NCAA defenses is going to become more efficient when he's got Dwight Howard or Tyson Chandler switching onto him off the pick and roll? God, I wouldn't even want to draft Walker top 10 in this shit draft, much less give up an allstar for him.

[cdcast]

This is one of the worst drafts in years. There's no trade package in this draft worth giving up TP for. And you don't trade Hill for some late lottery pick. It's that weak of a draft. They should keep Parker for now and trade Hill for a SF like Paul George or a big like Taj Gibson.

[baseline bum]

While I agree with you that Biyombo's offense is raw, even moreso than Serge, I also think that his offense isn't what's needed. I get that Dice had a good jumpshot, but throughout his career with the Spurs he averaged a little over 5 shots a game. If the Spurs interior provokes fear with Biyombo as opposed to inspires confidence with B & B, then it's already a difference maker.

Biyombo will probably be really foul-prone too for a year or two, as are all young athletic defensive bigs. I wouldn't count on much from him early-on, but even considering that I think Hill is redundant enough to make it worth the gamble if they can make the move.

[baseline bum]

Hill is getting groomed as a PG by the Spurs, regardless of Spurstalk's consensus that "he's a SG". The sooner yall niggas accept that the sooner yall will realize that trading Parker makes alot more sense than trading Hill, especially for a late lottery pick. If the FO believes the Big 3 can no longer win titles they can either:

1. Rebuild. Duncan & Gino seem to be locks to retire as Spurs, so that leaves Parker as the lone big contract with value (noone wants RJ).

or

2.Make a move. And considering the fact that Parker's value is alot higher than Hill's...that would be the only move that could possibly improve this team significantly. Hill isnt enough to net us someone that might put us over the top.

If you deal either of them you deal Parker, its the best move. Otherwise stay pat. Hill shouldnt go anywhere imo.

I'm not opposed to trading Parker, but I'd much rather do it next year when there are some really good prospects at the 4 and 3. A top 10 pick would be huge next season, and I'd love for the Spurs to pick one off by offering Tony to a team that wanted to be in the playoffs for 2012-13. Hill is a streak scorer and that's about it. He can't run an offense. He's an enormous defensive liability. His game has already plateaued and the Spurs are in a lot of trouble if he's the point guard of the future. He reminds Antonio Daniels without the hops.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Tony Parker's trade value is never going to be higher than it is right now. He is under 30 and absolutely electric on the court. He is fun to watch and can score against most defenses in this league with ease.

He is also a PG whose game is mostly based on being the quickest athlete on the court. Its more than that I know but when he starts to lose a step, he is going to pull a Elton Brand. Last year he seemed to overrely on his ability to get into the paint and his jumper was spotty at best.

You cannot move Duncan and Manu. No value there as both are damaged goods. Hill is still in his early twenties. Three years from now, he can still be a major contributor. At that same time, Tony would be on the downward track.

If they are rebuilding they absolutely should move on any good offer for Parker.

[baseline bum]

Honestly, the best the Spurs can do is trade Parker and Anderson for Holliday and Iguodala. Two proven to be good players. Iggy being the best defender in the league and Holiday being one of the better low value high potential point guards.

Pipe dream, but I wish it could be Holiday and Thaddeus. I'm not so sure I'd want to trade Iguodala if I'm Philly and can get him running with Tony. Still, Young is way too good to not be starting next season, and you can't give up on Turner yet with all he showed at Ohio State.

[baseline bum]

Tony Parker's trade value is never going to be higher than it is right now. He is under 30 and absolutely electric on the court. He is fun to watch and can score against most defenses in this league with ease.

He is also a PG whose game is mostly based on being the quickest athlete on the court. Its more than that I know but when he starts to lose a step, he is going to pull a Elton Brand. Last year he seemed to overrely on his ability to get into the paint and his jumper was spotty at best.

You cannot move Duncan and Manu. No value there as both are damaged goods. Hill is still in his early twenties. Three years from now, he can still be a major contributor. At that same time, Tony would be on the downward track.

If they are rebuilding they absolutely should move on any good offer for Parker.

What would you consider a good offer for Parker? Sacramento's crap and the #7 makes me want to puke.

[itzsoweezee]

This is one of the worst drafts in years. There's no trade package in this draft worth giving up TP for. And you don't trade Hill for some late lottery pick. It's that weak of a draft. They should keep Parker for now and trade Hill for a SF like Paul George or a big like Taj Gibson.

This is on point. I guess it remains to be seen, however, whether Popovich is willing to be this rational. Will his ego get in the way and force some ridiculous lopsided trade? He seems desperate for a scapegoat for the playoff flameout.

[024]

trading parker better also ship jefferson out. seriously. get jefferson off this team.

[joshdaboss]

I'd pull this:

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3skv2lo

Leaves us with:

Calderon/Hill
Manu/Anderson
#5 Pick/Kleza
Duncan/Blair
Andrea/Splitter

This is the best realistic trade idea I've seen so far, besides Odom and Brown for him, but I don't think the Lakers are going to make that type of move.

[baseline bum]

The problem with Iggy (and Parker for this same matter) is that he is too old. They have a good group of kids in their early 20s. They are a big time player away from being really good. Too bad that both Igoudala and Brand's salaries are holding them back. It would be nice to move either or both of those, but the 6ers aren't trading Iggy away for nothing.

The Sixers are going to be really interesting over the next few years; especially if Turner eventually pans out for them.

[Wu36]

Hill is nothing special and supposedly the team loves James Anderson anyways (at least according to Chad Ford). Hill, Anderson, and Neal give this team three backup shooting guards. How many do you really need?

Agree. But how many role players in general does a team need? Hill, Blair, Anderson, Neal, Bonner, RJ, Splitter, Butler(maybe), plus 5th or 7th pick, along with one or two added players in a TP trade. Thats alot of role players with a lack of time to develope. If TP is traded like this it better be the first of two or three trades. Not enough time on the court for Timmy, Manu and 10/11 maybes

[joshdaboss]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=3ugjtp7

+ their 1st rounder. What say you? I think they reject it, but I take it if I'm the Spurs, without a doubt.

[Fireball]

I really do not know what to make out of it. All the realistic trade options will not change the chances of the Spurs winning another title. On the one hand I like TP, but on the other hand I think its time for something new and only breaking up the Big Three qualifies as something new. I will not speculate and just wait what happens thursday night .... and of course hope there is no lockout!

[TJastal]

Tony Parker's trade value is never going to be higher than it is right now. He is under 30 and absolutely electric on the court. He is fun to watch and can score against most defenses in this league with ease.

He is also a PG whose game is mostly based on being the quickest athlete on the court. Its more than that I know but when he starts to lose a step, he is going to pull a Elton Brand. Last year he seemed to overrely on his ability to get into the paint and his jumper was spotty at best.

You cannot move Duncan and Manu. No value there as both are damaged goods. Hill is still in his early twenties. Three years from now, he can still be a major contributor. At that same time, Tony would be on the downward track.

If they are rebuilding they absolutely should move on any good offer for Parker.

+1

Refreshing to actually find a lucid thought in a thread polluted with literally 100's of whining Parker homers.

Parker needs to be traded now while the spurs can still net a decent player + pick, hell he should have been traded two years ago when he would have yielded an all star level big man or small forward. :stirpot:

[jesterbobman]

Would a three team trade based around parker to someone(Sacramento etc), Later pick and pieces to Minny(e.g., Thompson), Derrick Williams to us, then use trade exception to add a PG to start for us, and MLE for a decent Centre(Or, TE for a centre MLE for a PG.)
E.g, trade for Ramon Sessions to play 20min a game(probably available if Cavs take Irving as he's the 3rd PG), and then a Centre/PF with the MLE, knowing Splitter & Duncan will take most of the Centre Minutes, and Williams as a 4/3 Combo guy. We know the Spurs are efficient offensively with a shooting big, and Derrick Williams is a boost over Bonner in all around play. Not ideal, But probably I'd take Sessions, Williams and saving 2m a year for Parker.

[ace3g]

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
If Spurs deal Tony Parker to Kings for 7th pick, expect Omri Caspi to be part of package, sources say. RC Buford has been long fond of him.

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
The Kings coaching staff, in win-now mode to stay employed, are fully behind trading the 7th pick for an established player, sources say.

[jiggy_55]

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
If Spurs deal Tony Parker to Kings for 7th pick, expect Omri Caspi to be part of package, sources say. RC Buford has been long fond of him.

I just came here to write this. This is shocking to be honest. Parker for 7th pick and Casspi? Could that be the deal? Very bad deal

[Wu36]

If they trade TP for an early pick it better not be Jimmer they draft.

[TJastal]

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
If Spurs deal Tony Parker to Kings for 7th pick, expect Omri Caspi to be part of package, sources say. RC Buford has been long fond of him.

Getting Casspi + 7th pick for unloading Parker would be pure heaven. I think I'd do a frickin dance out on main street if this happened.

:lol

[jiggy_55]

Could this really be happening? Wojnarowski and Yahoo are usually quite reliable when it comes to rumors. He seems to have some true inside information to report such news for the Spurs.

[joshdaboss]

Casspi and Jason Thompson both suck ass. Casspi is WAY worse than Jefferson. Please, God, don't let them be part of any deal.

[lurker23]

One thing that's worth noting is that if the Spurs are even 1% CONSIDERING this, then there's almost certainly someone in the lottery they really like.

With team needs, it's hard to imagine it's not a big man. Personally, my money is on either Jan Vesely or Tristan Thompson. Kanter is likely gone before 5 or 7, and it's hard to imagine Morris or Biyombo as IMMEDIATE impact players.

However, if this is the Spurs version of blowing things up and planning primarily for the future, my money would be on Jonas Valanciunas.

[baseline bum]

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
If Spurs deal Tony Parker to Kings for 7th pick, expect Omri Caspi to be part of package, sources say. RC Buford has been long fond of him.

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
The Kings coaching staff, in win-now mode to stay employed, are fully behind trading the 7th pick for an established player, sources say.

Fuck that shit. If you're gonna trade Parker, do it with Toronto and at least get Ed Davis and the higher pick. With Dalembert a free agent, Sacramento has nothing interesting outside of 'Reke and Cousins to offer, and no way they dump them.

[jesterbobman]

If you got Casspi and 7, you'd have a ~ 12million dollar trade exception, and then could use that to get another player. It'd have to be a salary dump of sorts, but a trade would involve that trade exception aswell.

[TJastal]

Casspi and Jason Thompson both suck ass. Casspi is WAY worse than Jefferson. Please, God, don't let them be part of any deal.

:rolleyes

Casspi just turned 23 today. There's no way he can be worse than 31 year old Jefferson. He's 2 inches taller @ 6'9", younger, more athletic and always hustles and rebounds the basketball. He'd be absolutely perfect starting next to Manu & George Hill in the starting lineup.

[baseline bum]

If you got Casspi and 7, you'd have a ~ 12million dollar trade exception, and then could use that to get another player. It'd have to be a salary dump of sorts, but a trade would involve that trade exception aswell.

Sweet... the Spurs could get a has-been like Baron Davis.

[baseline bum]

:rolleyes

Casspi just turned 23 today. There's no way he can be worse than 31 year old Jefferson. He's 2 inches taller @ 6'9", younger, more athletic and always hustles and rebounds the basketball. He'd be absolutely perfect starting next to Manu & George Hill in the starting lineup.

It would be awesome for tanking, but then you might as well dump Ginobili too.