Snowpocolypse: rolling blackouts instituted

[Dirks_Finale]

factoid:

https://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/texas/article/Where-Texans-are-headed-6435629.php


https://www.bondbuyer.com/news/texas-tops-population-growth-as-u-s-demographics-shift#:~:text=Forms%20for%20the%202020%20U.S.,char ts%20from%202019%20to%202020.&text=Since%20the%20last%20census%20in,is%20second% 20to%20Utah's%2017.4%25.

[clambake]

A little less. But in that neighborhood.

Thanks for taking them in. They couldn’t hack it here.

[Winehole23]

https://www.bondbuyer.com/news/texas-tops-population-growth-as-u-s-demographics-shift#:~:text=Forms%20for%20the%202020%20U.S.,char ts%20from%202019%20to%202020.&text=Since%20the%20last%20census%20in,is%20second% 20to%20Utah's%2017.4%25.thanks :tu

[Dirks_Finale]

They will hold up in courts.

Texas will pass some good ol' socialism to stop it though.

Use the rainy day fund to pay for their own eff ups. Call it socialism if you want.

[ChumpDumper]

Use the rainy day fund to pay for their own eff ups. Call it socialism if you want.Whose fuck-ups?

And yeah, I'll call it that.

[Winehole23]

Use the rainy day fund to pay for their own eff ups. Call it socialism if you want.public expenses are only socialism when Republicans don't like them.

[ChumpDumper]

1364322944076423169Honestly these guys didn't really do anything wrong.

RepubliQans set up the system to fail by design decades ago.

[Winehole23]

Honestly these guys didn't really do anything wrong.

RepubliQans set up the system to fail by design decades ago.Will they testify anyway?

[Winehole23]

We are all going to have pay more for the infrastructure investment. This will essentially be a regressive stupidity tax, unless the state steps in.

The Feds may even provide funds, because the current administration isn't populated by dicks.Hope so.

I am willing to pay more to get a grid that eventually *will be* more resilient. Even though the "free market" provided robust financial incentives to suppliers to remain online when we needed them most. Apparently that wasn't sufficient for the kind of reliability we need.

[boutons_deux]

Texas electricity retailer Griddy hit with $1 billion lawsuit for ‘price gouging’ after outages

https://link.dallasnews.com/lt.php?i=14883A15430A15A645257

[Winehole23]

Texas electricity retailer Griddy hit with $1 billion lawsuit for ‘price gouging’ after outages

https://link.dallasnews.com/lt.php?i=14883A15430A15A645257what a surprise

[Winehole23]

Love the diction here, the words "printed" and "delivered" seem to be load-bearing.

1363177034030194691who talks this way?

"Printed"

[Winehole23]

Does ERCOT print money?

[daboom1]

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1364407155839803394.html

[RandomGuy]

Hope so.

I am willing to pay more to get a grid that eventually *will be* more resilient. Even though the "free market" provided robust financial incentives to suppliers to remain online when we needed them most. Apparently that wasn't sufficient for the kind of reliability we need.

Because human being suck at risk assessment. Given that companies are run by those things, that becomes a problem.

[boutons_deux]

Does ERCOT print money?

By granting permission to power plant operator to raise prices, ERCOT is allowing the operators effectively to "print money" like a US Mint, "because they can".

We'll if Tx govt cancels the price gouging, violating their free market, laissez-faire perfect solution of man-made restricted supply raising prices to (desperately high) demand.

(laissez-faire means "let extractive suppliers fuck over demanders")

[Winehole23]

By granting permission to power plant operator to raise prices, ERCOT is allowing the operators effectively to "print money" like a US Mint, "because they can".

We'll if Tx govt cancels the price gouging, violating their free market, laissez-faire perfect solution of man-made restricted supply raising prices to (desperately high) demand.

(laissez-faire means "let extractive suppliers fuck over demanders")Thanks. I guess I meant technically, how does it work, how are the payments structured?

How do they *do it*?

[RandomGuy]

Thanks. I guess I meant technically, how does it work, how are the payments structured?

How do they *do it*?

Bit of a misuse of the term. You aren't creating new money, just saying that an asset was suddenly worth more money than it was before.

[SpursforSix]

Because human being suck at risk assessment. Given that companies are run by those things, that becomes a problem.

I'm not sure that's true. The average person sucks at risk assessment but the ones that do this for a living at the highest level are incredibly intelligent and have the tools to be fairly accurate.
This last event was probably a 1/100 situation (at least). Lots of plants offline, frozen windmills, frozen natural gas facilities, etc.

You can't plan for everything.

[ChumpDumper]

I'm not sure that's true. The average person sucks at risk assessment but the ones that do this for a living at the highest level are incredibly intelligent and have the tools to be fairly accurate.
This last event was probably a 1/100 situation (at least). Lots of plants offline, frozen windmills, frozen natural gas facilities, etc.

You can't plan for everything.You can plan for weather that happens in over half the US.

This happened in Texas ten years ago and the risk assessment people said to prepare for its happening again.

The producers did not.

[SpursforSix]

You can plan for weather that happens in over half the US.

This happened in Texas ten years ago and the risk assessment people said to prepare for its happening again.

The producers did not.

This is over my pay grade.. But I'm sure it's all about money and is it worth it to upgrade facilities to offset for a 1 in 100 event. Every year, I turn down letters from my insurance company to add on accidental death because I assess that it's pretty unlikely. And that's probably more likely than the weather event we just had.

[ChumpDumper]

This is over my pay grade.. But I'm sure it's all about money and is it worth it to upgrade facilities to offset for a 1 in 100 event. Every year, I turn down letters from my insurance company to add on accidental death because I assess that it's pretty unlikely. And that's probably more likely than the weather event we just had.It's a one in ten years event.

[Th'Pusher]

You can plan for weather that happens in over half the US.

This happened in Texas ten years ago and the risk assessment people said to prepare for its happening again.

The producers did not.

Because they weren’t required to as they should have been, imo. Considering the public and private cost of this disaster, not to mention the loss of life, I wonder what the ROI on winterizing the grid would have been had we done it as was recommended as early as 1989.

[ChumpDumper]

Because they weren’t required to as they should have been, imo. Considering the public and private cost of this disaster, not to mention the loss of life, I wonder what the ROI on winterizing the grid would have been had we done it as was recommended as early as 1989.I'm going out on a limb to say the cost of winterizing was less than $50,000,000,000.

[SpursforSix]

It's a one in ten years event.

You'll need to give me your data for that.

Negative degrees across that much of the state at the same time seems < than 1/10.

[ChumpDumper]

You'll need to give me your data for that.No. This happened in 2011.

Low temperatures knocked production offline and caused blackouts.

There were federal reports and recommendations about it.

It's a 1/10 event.

[SpursforSix]

No. This happened in 2011.

Low temperatures knocked production offline and caused blackouts.

There were federal reports and recommendations about it.

It's a 1/10 event.

There's a huge difference in preparing for the 2011 temperatures than what just happened. The amount of power needed had to be significantly higher this time.

[ChumpDumper]

There's a huge difference in preparing for the 2011 temperatures than what just happened. The amount of power needed had to be significantly higher this time.Capacity went offline because of the cold just like 2011.

Cold enough to knock production offline is cold enough to knock production offline.

[SpursforSix]

Capacity went offline because of the cold just like 2011.

Cold enough to knock production offline is cold enough to knock production offline.

That seems like a pretty naive take.

[ChumpDumper]

That seems like a pretty naive take.Tell me how it's wrong.

You can say it's a matter of degree but Texas did not address the causes of the events that actually happened in 1989 and 2011 so there's no way the grid could handle similar events they knew would happen because they did in fact happen.

[SpursforSix]

Tell me how it's wrong.

You can say it's a matter of degree but Texas did not address the causes of the events that actually happened in 1989 and 2011 so there's no way the grid could handle similar events they knew would happen because they did in fact happen.

This wasn't a similar event. This was a historic deep freeze. If you don't think there's a significant difference between negative temperature and 15 degrees, than I don't know what to tell you.

[ChumpDumper]

This wasn't a similar event. This was a historic deep freeze. If you don't think there's a significant difference between negative temperature and 15 degrees, than I don't know what to tell you.Power plants across the country function perfectly well in these conditions. If you don't think they do, then I don't know what to tell you.

[CosmicCowboy]

Chump is correct. This shit has happened before. The PUC is a joke. 2011 blacked out 3.2 million people

[ChumpDumper]

The other side of the coin is that if production goes offline, places like Beaumont, Amarillo and El Paso can get energy from other states to avoid long blackouts. All ERCOT can do is cut people off for days while they wait for its internal production to hopefully ramp back up.

Family up in Canyon had nine inches of snow but a total of 45 minutes of power interruption all week.

This is neither reliable nor is it sustainable. ERCOT needs to end for the sake of the Texas economy if not, you know, its people.

[SpursforSix]

Chump is correct. This shit has happened before. The PUC is a joke. 2011 blacked out 3.2 million people

Sorry...I can't really believe anything you say since your comment about cows not farting.

[CosmicCowboy]

Sorry...I can't really believe anything you say since your comment about cows not farting.

As I have told your ignorant ass multiple times, 95% of bovine methane comes from belches, not farts. Probably the closest your ignorant ass has ever been to a cow was between buns at whataburger.

[RandomGuy]

I'm not sure that's true. The average person sucks at risk assessment but the ones that do this for a living at the highest level are incredibly intelligent and have the tools to be fairly accurate.
This last event was probably a 1/100 situation (at least). Lots of plants offline, frozen windmills, frozen natural gas facilities, etc.

You can't plan for everything.

Except this isn't a one in 1/100 situation. Happens about once every ten years.

Last time it happened they did a study about how to prevent outages. It was ignored.

Profit motive, and resiliency were in conflict, and profit motive won.

The people involved are aware of the risks, and care about risks, just not these ones. They are worried about the risks to their bottom line.

[RandomGuy]

This wasn't a similar event. This was a historic deep freeze. If you don't think there's a significant difference between negative temperature and 15 degrees, than I don't know what to tell you.


After a 2011 winter storm knocked out power to about 3 million Texans, a federal report warned Texas the same grid debacle would happen again if it didn't adequately weatherize its power infrastructure and increase fuel reserves — and reminded Texas that "many of those same warnings were issued after similar blackouts 22 years earlier and had gone unheeded," The Associated Press reports.

https://news.yahoo.com/texas-power-grid-failed-mostly-065217364.html

REPORT ON: OUTAGES AND CURTAILMENTS DURING THE SOUTHWEST COLD WEATHER EVENT OF FEBRUARY 1-5, 2011
(PDF)
https://www.ferc.gov/sites/default/files/2020-04/08-16-11-report.pdf

[RandomGuy]

1. Balancing Authorities, Reliability Coordinators, Transmission Operators and Generation Owner/Operators in ERCOT and in the southwest regions of WECC should consider preparation for the winter season as critical as preparation for the summer peak season.

2. Planning authorities should augment their winter assessments with sensitivity studies incorporating the 2011 event to ensure there are sufficient generation and reserves in the operational time horizon.

3. Balancing Authorities and Reserve Sharing Groups should review the distribution of reserves to ensure that they are useable and deliverable during contingencies.

4. ERCOT should reconsider its protocol that requires it to approve outages if requested more than eight days before the outage, consider giving itself the authority to cancel outages previously scheduled, and expand its outage evaluation criteria.

5. ERCOT should consider modifying its procedures to (i) allow it to significantly raise the 2300 MW responsive reserve requirement in extreme low temperatures, (ii) allow it to direct generating units to utilize pre-operational warming prior to anticipated severe cold weather, and (iii) allow it to verify with each generating unit its preparedness for severe cold weather, including operating limits, potential fuel needs and fuel switching abilities.

6. Transmission Operators, Balancing Authorities, and Generation Owner/Operators should consider developing mechanisms to verify that units that have fuel switching capabilities can periodically demonstrate those capabilities.

7. Balancing Authorities, Transmission Operators and Generator Owners/Operators should take the steps necessary to ensure that black start units can be utilized during adverse weather and emergency conditions.

8. Balancing Authorities, Reliability Coordinators and Transmission Operators should require Generator Owner/Operators to provide accurate ambient temperature design specifications. Balancing Authorities, Reliability Coordinators and Transmission Operators should verify that temperature design limit information is kept current and should use this information to determine whether individual generating units will be available during extreme weather events.

9. Transmission Operators and Balancing Authorities should obtain from Generator Owner/Operators their forecasts of real output capability in advance of an anticipated severe weather event; the forecasts should take into account both the temperature beyond which the availability of the generating unit cannot be assumed, and the potential for natural gas curtailments.

10. Balancing Authorities should plan ahead so that emergency enforcement discretion regarding emission limitations can be quickly implemented in the event of severe capacity shortages.

11. States in the Southwest should examine whether Generator/Operators ought to be required to submit winterization plans, and should consider enacting legislation where necessary and appropriate.

12. Consideration should be given to designing all new generating plants and designing modifications to existing plants (unless committed solely for summer peaking purposes) to be able to perform at the lowest recorded ambient temperature for the nearest city for which historical weather data is available, factoring in accelerated heat loss due to wind speed.

13. The temperature design parameters of existing generating units should be assessed.

14. Generator Owner/Operators should ensure that adequate maintenance and inspection of its freeze protection elements be conducted on a timely and repetitive basis.

15. Each Generator Owner/Operator should inspect and maintain its generating units’ heat tracing equipment.

16. Each Generator Owner/Operator should inspect and maintain its units’ thermal insulation.

17. Each Generator Owner/Operator should plan on the erection of adequate wind breaks and enclosures, where needed.

18. Each Generator Owner/Operator should develop and annually conduct winter-specific and plant-specific operator awareness and maintenance training.

19. Each Generator Owner/Operator should take steps to ensure that winterization supplies and equipment are in place before the winter season, that adequate staffing is in place for cold weather events, and that preventative action in anticipation of such events is taken in a timely manner.

20. Transmission Operators should ensure that transmission facilities are capable of performing during cold weather conditions.

21. Balancing Authorities should improve communications during extreme cold weather events with Transmission Owner/Operators, Distribution Providers, and other market participants.

22. ERCOT should review and modify its Protocols as needed to give Transmission Service Providers and Distribution Service Providers in Texas access to information about loads on their systems that could be curtailed by ERCOT as Load Resources or as Emergency Interruptible Load Service.

23. WECC should review its Reliability Coordinator procedures for providing notice to Transmission Operators and Balancing Authorities when another Transmission Operator or Balancing Authority within WECC is experiencing a system emergency (or likely will experience a system emergency), and consider whether modification of those procedures is needed to expedite the notice process.

24. All Transmission Operators and Balancing Authorities should examine their emergency communications protocols or procedures to ensure that not too much responsibility is placed on a single system operator or on other key personnel during an emergency, and should consider developing single points of contact (persons who are not otherwise responsible for emergency operations) for communications during an emergency or likely emergency.


............... It goes on.





They had a road map based on the last disaster.

The Republican administration ignored it.

Sound familiar?

[SpursforSix]

As I have told your ignorant ass multiple times, 95% of bovine methane comes from belches, not farts. Probably the closest your ignorant ass has ever been to a cow was between buns at whataburger.

LOL. That's kind of funny.

But you're the one that said, "cows don't fart, they belch".

[boutons_deux]

Winter freeze damages SA coal plant; limits capacity

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanantonio/news/2021/02/24/winter-freeze-damages-sa-coal-plant.html

[Winehole23]

Winter freeze damages SA coal plant; limits capacity

https://www.bizjournals.com/sanantonio/news/2021/02/24/winter-freeze-damages-sa-coal-plant.htmlOh noes!

SpursTalk energy experts recently scolded us for not having more coal in the mix.

[boutons_deux]

Oh noes!

SpursTalk energy experts recently scolded us for not having more coal in the mix.

One of the big expenses of retiring one of CPS' coal plants is $1.8B it STILL owes on the construction loan/bond LOL

[CosmicCowboy]

One of the big expenses of retiring one of CPS' coal plants is $1.8B it STILL owes on the construction loan/bond LOL

Only cost 40 million to convert to natural gas.

[spurraider21]

Sorry...I can't really believe anything you say since your comment about cows not farting.
:lol

[CosmicCowboy]

The whole thing started with AOCunt blaming cow farts for global warming.

[RandomGuy]

The whole thing started with AOCunt blaming cow farts for global warming.

I guess that is better than admitting how many people had to die in Texas because of Republican fuck ups with the power grid, and how many billions of dollars in economic damages were done because of failed conservative ideology.

But hey, let's talk about cow farts and the junior representative from New York.

[CosmicCowboy]

I guess that is better than admitting how many people had to die in Texas because of Republican fuck ups with the power grid, and how many billions of dollars in economic damages were done because of failed conservative ideology.

But hey, let's talk about cow farts and the junior representative from New York.

I'm not the one that dredged up a 3 year old ankle bite from Spurt4sux

[CosmicCowboy]

I admit the power outages sucked. The flip side is I'm making bank fixing shit.

[RandomGuy]

I'm not the one that dredged up a 3 year old ankle bite from Spurt4sux

(Nods) ah.

[RandomGuy]

Good thing out of all this:

This Republican fuck up was a really good chance to finally give the state government to the Dems. I personally will be advocating for gerrymandering the shit out of Republicans to keep them far out of power in this state for the rest of my life.

[SpursforSix]

I'm not the one that dredged up a 3 year old ankle bite from Spurt4sux

It's not ever 2 years ago.

[RandomGuy]

It's not ever 2 years ago.

You seem to have dropped the "how could the republicans in charge have known what to do to hardened he power grid" schtick awful quick.

What changed?

[SpursforSix]

You seem to have dropped the "how could the republicans in charge have known what to do to hardened he power grid" schtick awful quick.

What changed?

It's more entertaining to me to remind CC about his "cows don't fart" statement.

[RandomGuy]

It's more entertaining to me to remind CC about his "cows don't fart" statement.

(nods) As you wish.

GQP will pay a price for it, thankfully, I'm good.

[baseline bum]

Good thing out of all this:

This Republican fuck up was a really good chance to finally give the state government to the Dems. I personally will be advocating for gerrymandering the shit out of Republicans to keep them far out of power in this state for the rest of my life.

That shit ain't happening. Republican voters will just blame CPS.

[Winehole23]

That shit ain't happening. Republican voters will just blame CPS.decentralization of responsibility

[Adam Lambert]

1364568286353108993

Savings never get passed down to the customer.

[pgardn]

LOL. That's kind of funny.

But you're the one that said, "cows don't fart, they belch".

cows do you fart I have heard it.
but nothing like horses. horses do machine gun farting...
well not quite machine gun farting but they fart numerous times in a row when they start moving if they have been still for awhile. The trot off farting it’s quite entertaining

[SpursforSix]

cows do you fart I have heard it.
but nothing like horses. horses do machine gun farting...
well not quite machine gun farting but they fart numerous times in a row when they start moving if they have been still for awhile. The trot off farting it’s quite entertaining

Yep. We've got a few horses. When they start getting playful and bucking, it's a fart symphony. It's hard to take them seriously at that point.

[RandomGuy]

1364568286353108993

Savings never get passed down to the customer.

NO WAY!!!

Big corporations owned by selfish narcissistic assholes focused on quarterly profits instead of their customers? GET OUT!!1

[Winehole23]

12 hours without power here.

Sylvester Turner is right, it wasn’t so much the shortage as a massive power outage. Power plants tripped off last night, so we got prolonged rather than rolling outages.got caught short

[Winehole23]

No water is a drag, but I’m glad y’all are warm. We are all layered up and under blankets here.

Sidebar: my neighbor just went “wakeboarding” in the street towed by a truck.true story

miraculously, no one was hurt.

[Winehole23]

Plenty of gas energy went offline last night, a nuke plant did too. Blaming wind energy is a bit of a stretch.

Siemens sells a cold weather package for its turbines, did Texas buy any?

[Winehole23]

1361684836608532482

[DMC]

Your self promotion post

You knew nothing of cold weather packages for turbines until I told you.

[Winehole23]

aw, you care

[boutons_deux]

Freedom to Freeze

The Electric Reliability Council of Texas, which manages the flow of electric power,

exempted affluent downtowns from outages –

leaving the thriving parts of Austin, Dallas, and Houston brightly lit

while pushing less affluent precincts into the dark and cold.

In Texas, for-profit energy companies have no incentive to prepare for extreme weather or maintain spare capacity.

Even when they’re able to handle surges in demand, prices go through the roof and poorer households are hit hard.

That’s what’s happened in the wake of the deep freeze. If they can’t pay, they’re cut off.

Lower-income Texans, white as well as Black and Latino, are taking it on the chin in many other ways.

Texas is one of the few states that hasn’t expanded Medicaid under the Affordable Care Act,

leaving the share of Texans without health insurance twice the national average, the largest uninsured population of any state.

Texas has double (https://href.li/?https://www.kvue.com/article/news/local/texas/texas-is-one-of-the-worst-states-in-the-us-for-child-welfare-report-says/269-427a62f3-ad3c-4ca1-b444-c298f82b1edb) the national average of children in poverty and

a higher rate of unemployment than the nation’s average.

https://www.laprogressive.com/the-texas-tycoons-are-fine-in-this-weather

[Winehole23]

1365365439392440321

[RandomGuy]

The whole thing started with AOCunt blaming cow farts for global warming.


“This industry has been treating weather events as if they’re high-impact, low-frequency,” she said. “In my view, extreme weather events are no longer high-impact, low-frequency, they are high-impact, medium-frequency.”

FWIW. Man caused climate change doesnt really hinge on any one thing, with several drivers, the primary of which is CO2. She didn't really blame cow farts exclusively, that is a lie.

Why do you people have to lie to make your case?

[RandomGuy]

Is what it is.

So is man made climate change.

Yet brainwashed morons like you have been denying the science for decades.

That keeps anybody who might be considering the effects of that change far from decision making in the radical-rights overall thinking process. The radical right managed to keep any climate change experts out of the planning process for the grid.

So as the radical right excludes all the evidence about man-made climate change, and comes up with policy solutions that fail to account for reality, we are left with entirely predictable results.


“This industry has been treating weather events as if they’re high-impact, low-frequency,” she said. “In my view, extreme weather events are no longer high-impact, low-frequency, they are high-impact, medium-frequency.”

[DarrinS]

So is man made climate change.

Yet brainwashed morons like you have been denying the science for decades.

That keeps anybody who might be considering the effects of that change far from decision making in the radical-rights overall thinking process. The radical right managed to keep any climate change experts out of the planning process for the grid.

So as the radical right excludes all the evidence about man-made climate change, and comes up with policy solutions that fail to account for reality, we are left with entirely predictable results.

https://i.redd.it/hxbcts1iinz31.jpg

[RandomGuy]

"climate changed caused by humans is real, and a problem, the radical-right's denial of the science leads to bad policies that are costly failures"


https://media4.giphy.com/media/hhnpSxCjyXzHy/giphy.gif

Brainwashed. :rolleyes

Your call. Accept personal responsibility for your positions or not.

[RandomGuy]

https://i.redd.it/hxbcts1iinz31.jpg

But hey, if you want to have a conversation about large corporations and the evil they do, I welcome it.

It won't go the way you have been brainwashed into thinkin it will, though. smh, that is some pathetic lying on your part. shame.

[spurraider21]

https://i.redd.it/hxbcts1iinz31.jpg
good reason to enter into multinational trade deals, so labor standards can be put in place

not really a rebuttal to the damages of climate change

[CosmicCowboy]

FWIW. Man caused climate change doesnt really hinge on any one thing, with several drivers, the primary of which is CO2. She didn't really blame cow farts exclusively, that is a lie.

Why do you people have to lie to make your case?

When did I say EXCLUSIVELY?

Why do you people lie to make your case?

the quote was :


“set a goal to get to net-zero, rather than zero emissions, in 10 years because we aren’t sure that we’ll be able to fully get rid of farting cows and airplanes that fast.”

[Winehole23]

the camaras have moved on, but a million Texans remain without water.

1365706491412553736

[Winehole23]

https://i.redd.it/hxbcts1iinz31.jpgthere's usually a woman to blame

[DMC]

good reason to enter into multinational trade deals, so labor standards can be put in place

not really a rebuttal to the damages of climate change

Because 3rd world nations are renowned for adhering to "standards".

[DMC]

there's usually a woman to blame

God thought so.

[DMC]

the camaras have moved on, but a million Texans remain without water.

1365706491412553736

What's your total water delivery number right now? Oh after your tweet storm? Ok.

[Winehole23]

lol water usage smack

[Winehole23]

God thought so.No, that's not what the text says. God blamed Adam.

"Because thou" not "because Eve"

Chauvinist pig. :lol

[boutons_deux]

free market/eletricity wholesaler Griddy kicked out of TX grid and its 10K customers moved to other suppliers

[Winehole23]

free market/eletricity wholesaler Griddy kicked out of TX grid and its 10K customers moved to other suppliersthat's exactly what Griddy asked its own customers to do before the storm.

[Winehole23]

Bloomberg: knocked-out plants led to refining shortages, gasoline prices to rise Monday.

1365591544607162374

[boutons_deux]

Bloomberg: knocked-out plants led to refining shortages, gasoline prices to rise Monday.

1365591544607162374


BigOil will make $10Bs for restricting supply while killing the planet and lying about it

[DMC]

No, that's not what the text says. God blamed Adam.

"Because thou" not "because Eve"

Chauvinist pig. :lol

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak... And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home." 1 Timothy 2:13-15

[DMC]

lol water usage smack

Not usage.. You said you were going to deliver water to the needy. Did the tweet storm overtake you?

[Winehole23]

Not usage.. You said you were going to deliver water to the needy.wouldn't you like to know :lol

[Winehole23]

two days ago

Water crisis Day 10: City of Jackson announces new main breaks, water distribution Friday (https://www.clarionledger.com/story/news/2021/02/26/city-gives-update-water-shortage-distribution-sites/6832584002/)

[RandomGuy]

Not usage.. You said you were going to deliver water to the needy. Did the tweet storm overtake you?

Enforcer of charitable intensions. :lol

[boutons_deux]

Texas Crisis Drives First Public Power Bankruptcy, With More Fallout Expected

Co-op seeks shelter from $2 billion in electricity costs,

state sues a shut-down Griddy, and

San Antonio utility may pull back on clean energy goals.

https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/texas-crisis-drives-first-public-power-bankruptcy-with-more-fallout-expected

[boutons_deux]

the deregulated, free market-perfect Capitalist solution for TX electricity market WORKED as intended, in the fine print.

Why are TX Repugs suing free marketeers that they enabled?

[Winehole23]

Enforcer of charitable intensions. :lolforever moaning about the hypocrisy of others

[boutons_deux]

CPS Energy says the Big Freeze could cost CPS $1B

[DMC]

Enforcer of charitable intensions. :lol

What does "intensions" mean exactly?

[DMC]

forever moaning about the hypocrisy of others

You got all your rewards from your claim, no need to follow through. Just ask RG.

[Winehole23]

I'm ok with what i've done so far, what do you get out of being a scold about it? :lol

[Winehole23]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EvcIBf0WYAIWuW9?format=jpg&name=large

[RandomGuy]

What does "intensions" mean exactly?

It means I am at times a bad spellar, and at times in need of reading glasses.

[RandomGuy]

You got all your rewards from your claim, no need to follow through. Just ask RG.

:rollin still can't fathom that other people do things, when you don't or can't.

Sokay. It simply makes me pity you a bit more. Such a narrow, self-centered life, it seems.

[DMC]

:rollin still can't fathom that other people do things, when you don't or can't.

Sokay. It simply makes me pity you a bit more. Such a narrow, self-centered life, it seems.

You're noted for your charitable contributions.

[SnakeBoy]

:rollin still can't fathom that other people do things, when you don't or can't.

Sokay. It simply makes me pity you a bit more. Such a narrow, self-centered life, it seems.

Are you housing those Syrian refugees yet or still working on paying down your bills?

[RandomGuy]

[smoochies back]

[Winehole23]

ERCOT CEO fired, Congressional probe begins.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2021/03/03/congress-launches-probe-into-texas-power-outages/

[RandomGuy]

ERCOT CEO fired, Congressional probe begins.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2021/03/03/congress-launches-probe-into-texas-power-outages/

Do we have a full tally of how many people were killed?

[Winehole23]

Do we have a full tally of how many people were killed?I haven't seen one.

[baseline bum]

ERCOT CEO fired, Congressional probe begins.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2021/03/03/congress-launches-probe-into-texas-power-outages/

Not gonna find anything wrong with PUC and Abbott letting these fuckers price gouge on the disaster they created.

[Winehole23]

Not gonna find anything wrong with PUC and Abbott letting these fuckers price gouge on the disaster they created.Even if they do find something wrong, that would be only advisory, right?

[boutons_deux]

TX' deregulated electricity market was DESIGNED to make $Bs for billionaire investors when catastrophes hit.

Hilariously hypocritical for Abbott to deflect all blame onto the organizations doing exactly what Repugs designed them to do.

frackin-fool, gas-rich Texas ran outta gas

[boutons_deux]

ERCOT overcharged power companies $16 billion for electricity during winter freeze, firm says

An independent market monitor for the Public Utility Commission of Texas wrote in a letter that

ERCOT kept market prices for power too high for nearly two more days

after widespread outages ended late Feb. 17.

https://www.texastribune.org/2021/03/04/ercot-texas-electricity-16-billion/

PUC/ERCOT lose their jobs, but nothing illegal in predatory Capitalism, so no punishment

[RandomGuy]

TX' deregulated electricity market was DESIGNED to make $Bs for billionaire investors when catastrophes hit.

Hilariously hypocritical for Abbott to deflect all blame onto the organizations doing exactly what Repugs designed them to do.

frackin-fool, gas-rich Texas ran outta gas

But but "drill here, drill now" :lol

[Winehole23]

But but "drill here, drill now" :lolwe froze at the wellhead in that cold snap, tbh.

[Winehole23]

we already figured it out, but it's finally official: the PUC confirms ERCOT screwed us.

1367568691869720588

[pgardn]

^Thanks for keeping this alive.

Abbott and the red team who control Texas have a job to do.
The mask timing is very suspect. Dude needs to roll of a cliff if he does not address the above.

[Winehole23]

^Thanks for keeping this alive.

Abbott and the red team who control Texas have a job to do.
The mask timing is very suspect. Dude needs to roll of a cliff if he does not address the above.yeah, Gov. Abbott is reaching for his support, he sure needs it night now. Sometimes it's when you've been really bad that you need love the most.

[pgardn]

yeah, Gov. Abbott is reaching for his support, he sure needs it night now. Sometimes it's when you've been really bad that you need love the most.

So you are saying I should not roll him off a cliff...

Dammit.

[Winehole23]

So you are saying I should not roll him off a cliff...

Dammit.no recommendation made, none intended.

do as you will.

[CosmicCowboy]

we froze at the wellhead in that cold snap, tbh.

Gas doesn't freeze, but they lost power for the pipeline compressors and didn't have backup generators.

[Winehole23]

Gas doesn't freeze, but they lost power for the pipeline compressors and didn't have backup generators.it's in the literature posted upstream, freezing at the natural gas sources was a problem before/during the blackout. energy Texas needed was unavailable.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol we're a bunch of rubes who can't keep the lights on.

:lol Texas

[RandomGuy]

^Thanks for keeping this alive.

Abbott and the red team who control Texas have a job to do.
The mask timing is very suspect. Dude needs to roll of a cliff if he does not address the above.

Dude is taking a page out of Trumps playbook and creating a smokescreen of stupidity to distract from decisions that in all probability ended up literally killing hundreds of people.

[RandomGuy]

Gas doesn't freeze, but they lost power for the pipeline compressors and didn't have backup generators.

The report that was handed to the Republican led government in 2011 spelled out this vulnerability explicitly.

But hey, keep voting for them, I'm sure they will do better next time they have an opportunity to prevent hundreds of deaths and economic disaster. :tu

[CosmicCowboy]

it's in the literature posted upstream, freezing at the natural gas sources was a problem before/during the blackout. energy Texas needed was unavailable.

Sorry, but that's not what the gas producers said. Natural gas doesn't freeze, but electricity is required to transport the gas and west Texas lost power for days.

for your education:

Transmission pipelines are wide-diameter, long-distance pipelines that transport natural gas from the producing and processing areas to storage facilities and distribution centers. A number of compression, or pumping stations line transmission pipelines. These stations contain one or more compressor units that receive the transmission flow from a previous station, and increase the rate and pressure of flow to sustain the movement of the gas along the multiple pipelines it needs to travel to reach markets and consumers.

[Winehole23]

ok, man.

you can catch up in your own time, i won't hold your hand any further.

[RandomGuy]

Sorry, but that's not what the gas producers said. Natural gas doesn't freeze, but electricity is required to transport the gas and west Texas lost power for days.

for your education:

Transmission pipelines are wide-diameter, long-distance pipelines that transport natural gas from the producing and processing areas to storage facilities and distribution centers. A number of compression, or pumping stations line transmission pipelines. These stations contain one or more compressor units that receive the transmission flow from a previous station, and increase the rate and pressure of flow to sustain the movement of the gas along the multiple pipelines it needs to travel to reach markets and consumers.

https://rbnenergy.com/cold-as-ice-gas-wellhead-freeze-offs


Natural gas wellhead freeze-off happens when outside temperatures drop below freezing in producing fields. . If the wellhead is not protected then water and other liquids in the gas can freeze and block the flow of gas. The consequences range from minor inconvenience to major reductions in natural gas production and power outages affecting millions of customers. Today we put on our hat and gloves to find out how, why and when freeze-offs happen.

What he posted was about wellheads, and what you posted about was about the pipelines after that wellhead gas was aggregated.

It's almost as if you don't really give a shit what is true or not, just want to pwn a lib.

The intellectual rot of modern conservatism in a nutshell. For your education.

Link, because I do care: about the truth, and want to provide you the courtesy:
https://rbnenergy.com/cold-as-ice-gas-wellhead-freeze-offs

[CosmicCowboy]

https://rbnenergy.com/cold-as-ice-gas-wellhead-freeze-offs



What he posted was about wellheads, and what you posted about was about the pipelines after that wellhead gas was aggregated.

It's almost as if you don't really give a shit what is true or not, just want to pwn a lib.

The intellectual rot of modern conservatism in a nutshell. For your education.

Link, because I do care: about the truth, and want to provide you the courtesy:
https://rbnenergy.com/cold-as-ice-gas-wellhead-freeze-offs

Here is a picture of a wellhead heater:

https://www.hcpetroleum.hk/imgs/products/surface_electric_heater_HC_Petroleum_Equipment_2.p ng

Please notice it requires electricity to run.

chicken/egg power outages killed the gas supply.

[ChumpDumper]

Here is a picture of a wellhead heater:

https://www.hcpetroleum.hk/imgs/products/surface_electric_heater_HC_Petroleum_Equipment_2.p ng

Please notice it requires electricity to run.

chicken/egg power outages killed the gas supply.Did they even have heaters?

[pgardn]

Gas doesn't freeze, but they lost power for the pipeline compressors and didn't have backup generators.

It absolutely does freeze at the right pressure and low temp (as methane hydrate)
Freezing point of almost all substances is different at differing pressures.
We have natural gas frozen at the bottom of many deep ocean spots.

What exactly caused the lack of flow of natural gas thru pipes or well heads may be more complex.

[CosmicCowboy]

It absolutely does freeze at the right pressure and low temp
Freezing point of almost all substances is different at differing pressures.
We have natural gas frozen at the bottom of many deep ocean spots.

What exactly caused the lack of flow of natural gas thru pipes or well heads may be more complex.

Kind of academic. Natural gas freezes at -295 degrees F.

[pgardn]

Kind of academic. Natural gas freezes at -295 degrees F.

AT what pressure? Normal atmospheric?
The gas in lines is pressurized.

[spurraider21]

Sorry, but that's not what the gas producers said. Natural gas doesn't freeze, but electricity is required to transport the gas and west Texas lost power for days.

for your education:

Transmission pipelines are wide-diameter, long-distance pipelines that transport natural gas from the producing and processing areas to storage facilities and distribution centers. A number of compression, or pumping stations line transmission pipelines. These stations contain one or more compressor units that receive the transmission flow from a previous station, and increase the rate and pressure of flow to sustain the movement of the gas along the multiple pipelines it needs to travel to reach markets and consumers.
thats like saying you shouldnt blame windmills because the air doesnt freeze

[RandomGuy]

Did they even have heaters?

Doubt it highly.

Would have taken money to do, given the profit motive, and price squeezes, it seems an easy thing to pass on.

[RandomGuy]

Here is a picture of a wellhead heater:

https://www.hcpetroleum.hk/imgs/products/surface_electric_heater_HC_Petroleum_Equipment_2.p ng

Please notice it requires electricity to run.

chicken/egg power outages killed the gas supply.

yup. As noted in the 2011 report that the Republican government ignored.

[Winehole23]

“Can’t unscramble the egg”

1367891305414721544

[baseline bum]

“Can’t unscramble the egg”

1367891305414721544

Translation: the egg got cooked the way we designed it to be.

[DMC]

Kind of academic. Natural gas freezes at -295 degrees F.

But the pseudo-scientist yapper pgardn wants to "yabut" you with some stupid shit about freezing natural gas. I guess he thinks the freeze was a cryogenic level, absolute zero event. Anything to score some dignity after that shitfest about the supernatural I suppose.

[DMC]

thats like saying you shouldnt blame windmills because the air doesnt freeze

It's not like that at all.

[DMC]

AT what pressure? Normal atmospheric?
The gas in lines is pressurized.

Pressurized gas has a lower freezing point. Dropping the pressure drops the temperature of the gas. Gas will heat as it's compressed. but then you knew this because God told you.

[Winehole23]

nobody said anything about *frozen natural gas* that I recall.

as I recall the issue, as referred to in an article or two upstream and repeated by me a few posts back, was "freezing at the wellhead" preventing delivery. I didn't say natural gas froze; nor did anyone else, I think.

[Winehole23]

lol @ the ongoing attempt to unhorse a phantom rider. you fellas must still be tender from all the whippings.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol Jesus DMC is butthurt

[Ef-man]

Another reason Texas cannot have nice things.

The Big Texas Freeze Doesn't Bode Well For EV Infrastructure

When Winter Storm Uri swept through Texas, the whole state shut down. Electricity was hit-or-miss for several days, with certain areas of the state (read: lower-income areas) hit the hardest. And that doesn’t bode well for introducing electric vehicles on a wider scale.

Austin, the state capitol of Texas, has spent the last two decades budgeting $650 million for electric buses and a charging facility for 187 of those vehicles, Reuters reports. In 2022, if Austin needs to buy a vehicle, it’s going to buy an electric one. But city officials certainly didn’t plan or a winter storm to render those buses essentially inoperable because they couldn’t be charged. If there’s ever a surge in demand for power again in the future, the whole city could suffer.

There are, of course, variables here. Most drivers of battery-powered electric vehicles reported that they didn’t have any charging issues during the rolling blackouts, according to PlugShare. But those drivers also generally also had a non-BEV, road conditions were so bad that fewer people needed to drive anywhere, and EVs still aren’t accessible to everyone. The process of building an electric car is currently more expensive than building an ICE-equipped vehicle, and many EVs are still new, which means they necessarily cost most than, say, the beater you bought because it runs exactly long enough to get you to work. EVs are still currently a rich people thing.

But Austin’s introduction of fully-electric vehicles as being the sole means of city-sponsored transport raises problems. Buses are on the road longer than most cars are, and folks in underprivileged areas rely on public transport as their main means of getting around. If there’s another week where power is consistently failing—but where grocery store and food service workers are still expected to clock in—then Texas could see even bigger problems than the ones it’s already facing. And that's not even taking into consideration the fact that a grid failure this large cost lives; its impact on transportation was one of the smaller concerns.

And this isn’t a problem specific to Texas, although Texas’ decision to remain on a power grid separate from other states certainly exacerbated the problem. Power grids across the country have been overtaxed for years. The switch to EVs will ultimately require grids to be taxed even further as a result of a more robust charging infrastructure. A multi-million dollar investment in EVs will require a multi-billion dollar investment in infrastructure to ensure the country keeps functioning.

It is, unfortunately, a problem that local, state, and federal officials are going to need to tackle before we can even consider going carbon-free.



https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/the-big-texas-freeze-doesn-t-bode-well-for-ev-infrastructure/ar-BB1ejA0c?ocid=msedgntp

[Winehole23]

Jackson, Mississippi is still under a boil notice

https://mississippitoday.org/2021/03/04/as-jackson-residents-suffer-during-historic-water-crisis-state-leaders-keep-their-distance/

[DMC]

Jackson, Mississippi is still under a boil notice

https://mississippitoday.org/2021/03/04/as-jackson-residents-suffer-during-historic-water-crisis-state-leaders-keep-their-distance/

Because Texas is on a separate grid obviously.. duh

[Winehole23]

Because Texas is on a separate grid obviously.. duhSame storm that hit us, menso.

[Winehole23]

lol at the misfired humor

[pgardn]

Pressurized gas has a lower freezing point. Dropping the pressure drops the temperature of the gas. Gas will heat as it's compressed. but then you knew this because God told you.

Gas in lines get hotter that are exposed to COLD AIR have heat removed from them and become cold. The pressure then decreases because the gas is moving slower due to heat transfer. But the gas concentration is still high. You, dumb fuck, don’t understand the full picture.
Gas does freeze at high pressure AND REMOVING HEAT.

How in the fck could gas molecules freeze and become a solid if the molecules where not CLOSE together ie under pressure.

You stepped in shit again old man.

Go on with this. This is about the 10th time I have had to shut your mouth on something dealing with science Dr. DKreuger.

[pgardn]

This is the whole reason they needed heat at the wells.

Hot concentrated high pressure gas can become cold. Yes the pressure drops but it’s still a dense gas. Gas that is cold and dense can freeze.

Kind of like your the hot air that comes out of your mouth as you take another L.

[Winehole23]

Gas in lines get hotter that are exposed to COLD AIR have heat removed from them and become cold. The pressure then decreases because the gas is moving slower due to heat transfer. But the gas concentration is still high. You, dumb fuck, don’t understand the full picture.
Gas does freeze at high pressure AND REMOVING HEAT.

How in the fck could gas molecules freeze and become a solid if the molecules where not CLOSE together ie under pressure.

You stepped in shit again old man.

Go on with this. This is about the 10th time I have had to shut your mouth on something dealing with science Mr.Thanks for explaining this, I didn't quite get it either.

[pgardn]

Thanks for explaining this, I didn't quite get it either.

I’m not an oil and gas expert either. I have a brother in law who is. When I read the articles and they said freezing did occur at well heads etc I reasoned it out already understanding that we have solid methane hydrate on the sea floor. And then further articles made it clear.

And unbelievably you did not attempt to google and quickly read, spout out your gas about gas laws, while not understanding the full picture ala our Science expert DMDunningKreuger.

[pgardn]

:lol Jesus DMC is butthurt

Its about to get more severe.

[pgardn]

The natural gas on seafloors freezes as methane hydrate.

But the idea of frozen gas is not new like dry ice. You pressurize it and cool it. And this costs money as well.
Water is very prevalent almost everywhere so it’s highly possible many things that don’t normally freeze up did so with water present.

Edit: for Winehole

[DMC]

Gas in lines get hotter that are exposed to COLD AIR have heat removed from them and become cold. The pressure then decreases because the gas is moving slower due to heat transfer. But the gas concentration is still high. You, dumb fuck, don’t understand the full picture.
Gas does freeze at high pressure AND REMOVING HEAT.

How in the fck could gas molecules freeze and become a solid if the molecules where not CLOSE together ie under pressure.

You stepped in shit again old man.

Go on with this. This is about the 10th time I have had to shut your mouth on something dealing with science Dr. DKreuger.

:lol you retarded motherfucker

Gas under lower pressure would have even less heat to begin with. You insinuated that gas pressure above atmospheric would experience freezing sooner. You're a tard.

I get the feeling you never actually worked with any of this shit, you just talk about it online and maybe saw it in school.

[DMC]

:lol "Krueger"

[pgardn]

:lol you retarded motherfucker

Gas under lower pressure would have even less heat to begin with. You insinuated that gas pressure above atmospheric would experience freezing sooner. You're a tard.

I get the feeling you never actually worked with any of this shit, you just talk about it online and maybe saw it in school.

You fkn dunce.
YOU PUT the gas under high pressure so the molecules have a chance to interact and bind. This can be done by decreasing the volume the gas is in or adding a lot of gas molecules and lowering the temp or said another way, removing heat energy. The gas molecules will not normally bind because they have too much kinetic energy which is really what temp is a measure of. So remove heat energy which lowers the temp and give molecules that do not normally bind at STP a chance to bind. If the molecules are dense thus right next to each other and not moving as quickly, intermolecular forces have a chance to make the gas a solid. Then you keep the pressure up and remove, for example the cake of CO2, dry ice. When a gas becomes a solid you will lose pressure but there should be more gas around to keep the pressure high. Just keep the temp down to keep the molecules from moving quickly.

YOU CAN HAVE COLD gas that has a high pressure and NOT HAVE a high temp because a lack of heat energy. The packed gas molecules move much more slowly but still have a high pressure because there are a hell of a lot of gas molecules moving slowly and hitting the container they are in ... cabbage for brains.

And your bolded is totally rubbish and again an attempt to misstate what I have said because you stepped in shit again.
YOU have a feeling... no you dont, you dont know shit.

And no I do not work with this very much anymore. But if you do, you do not know your shit.

[pgardn]

:lol "Krueger"

Of course.
Concentrate on a misspelling to make yourself feel better.
You... are a clown.

Just stop posting stuff you dont know.
Stick to guns and the 2nd ammendment.

Your models of gases to solids absolutely sucks.

[pgardn]

:lol Jesus DMC is butthurt

And now he wants the flogging.

[DarrinS]

Not sure what you two are arguing about. But, if you drop the pressure on a gas cylinder, the temperature will drop. The simplest example is a can of compressed air you use to clean electronics. Can gets super cold as the pressure drops.

[DMC]

You fkn dunce.
YOU PUT the gas under high pressure so the molecules have a chance to interact and bind. This can be done by decreasing the volume the gas is in or adding a lot of gas molecules and lowering the temp or said another way, removing heat energy. The gas molecules will not normally bind because they have too much kinetic energy which is really what temp is a measure of. So remove heat energy which lowers the temp and give molecules that do not normally bind at STP a chance to bind. If the molecules are dense thus right next to each other and not moving as quickly, intermolecular forces have a chance to make the gas a solid. Then you keep the pressure up and remove, for example the cake of CO2, dry ice. When a gas becomes a solid you will lose pressure but there should be more gas around to keep the pressure high. Just keep the temp down to keep the molecules from moving quickly.

YOU CAN HAVE COLD gas that has a high pressure and NOT HAVE a high temp because a lack of heat energy. The packed gas molecules move much more slowly but still have a high pressure because there are a hell of a lot of gas molecules moving slowly and hitting the container they are in ... cabbage for brains.

And your bolded is totally rubbish and again an attempt to misstate what I have said because you stepped in shit again.
YOU have a feeling... no you dont, you dont know shit.

And no I do not work with this very much anymore. But if you do, you do not know your shit.

You said "gas lines get hotter that are exposed to cold air"

then you proceeded to say they have their heat removed from them (somehow getting hotter in the process it seems) then become cold (while getting hotter).

That's some acid trippy shit.

I think you were exposed to something toxic, maybe got a face full of AsH3 or something. It's evident you spend an inordinate amount of time on physics forums playing scientist.

[DMC]

Of course.
Concentrate on a misspelling to make yourself feel better.
You... are a clown.

Just stop posting stuff you dont know.
Stick to guns and the 2nd ammendment.

Your models of gases to solids absolutely sucks.

:lol Ammendment

:lol "and removing heat"

:lmao no shit

[pgardn]

Not sure what you two are arguing about. But, if you drop the pressure on a gas cylinder, the temperature will drop. The simplest example is a can of compressed air you use to clean electronics. Can gets super cold as the pressure drops.

Yes.

Do you know why the temp drops?

[pgardn]

:lol Ammendment

:lol "and removing heat"

:lmao no shit

Yes the fkn air was cold you stupid clown. Cold air removes heat, especially if it is moving rapidly.
Amendment: It got cold at the gas wells. Did this just totally pass you by? WE HAD COLD WEATHER! Good lord...

YOu are a fkn clown.

[pgardn]

You said "gas lines get hotter that are exposed to cold air"

then you proceeded to say they have their heat removed from them (somehow getting hotter in the process it seems) then become cold (while getting hotter).

That's some acid trippy shit.

I think you were exposed to something toxic, maybe got a face full of AsH3 or something. It's evident you spend an inordinate amount of time on physics forums playing scientist.

Where did I state this?
If I did it was a big mistake.
Point it out.

The rest is just you playing the same games of changing what I wrote.
Point it out.
YOu are such a disingenuous piece of shit old man.
Actually you are a lying piece of shit.

[pgardn]

Went back and looked.
Gas in lines get hotter that are exposed to COLD AIR have heat removed from them and become cold


Gas in lines that get hotter because they are pressurized and then get exposed to cold air have heat removed from them and turn cold.
YOu left a whole part of the sentence out. and in fairness that is THEN... should have been put in instead of jumped over but should be obvious from the last part.
I can see where you might have misunderstood.
But you absolutely knew what I was saying on the whole otherwise the rest does not fit in.

Everything I have stated still stands.
Gas can freeze. ANd if Ercot had heated their lines etc... this problem would not have occurred.

[pgardn]

This is the whole reason they needed heat at the wells.

Hot concentrated high pressure gas can become cold. Yes the pressure drops but it’s still a dense gas. Gas that is cold and dense can freeze.

Kind of like your the hot air that comes out of your mouth as you take another L.

Next post cleared it up.
You are again in the business of trying to confuse arguments you take the L in.
So I take it back. You are a disingenuous piece of shit.

[DarrinS]

Yes.

Do you know why the temp drops?


Just watched a video on it. The physics are not exactly what I thought. The can of compressed air example isn't really relevant here. My bad

[pgardn]

Just watched a video on it. The physics are not exactly what I thought. The can of compressed air example isn't really relevant here. My bad

No its really cool... literally.
You reminded me of this with shaving cream in the shower.
If you shake a can of shaving cream and then expose it to to the hot water from the shower it turns much colder because of a larger temp drop due to heating and shaking and the loss of shaving cream taking heat with it making the can feel very cold. then I remember trying this with something like silly string? and it getting so cold in froze water from the air that "landed" on the can (it was just water from the air condensing to liquid and then freezing. And then it took me back to remembering about compressors and air conditioning and such.

When you physically feel something happen like your hand get cold unexpectedly it makes a huge impression when you are younger and then a big wtf... and off you go. These kind of unexpected events are really important for adults and kids and are really important as teasers to learn more imo.

[DarrinS]

No its really cool... literally.
You reminded me of this with shaving cream in the shower.
If you shake a can of shaving cream and then expose it to to the hot water from the shower it turns much colder because of a larger temp drop due to heating and shaking and the loss of shaving cream taking heat with it making the can feel very cold. then I remember trying this with something like silly string? and it getting so cold in froze water from the air that "landed" on the can (it was just water from the air condensing to liquid and then freezing. And then it took me back to remembering about compressors and air conditioning and such.

When you physically feel something happen like your hand get cold unexpectedly it makes a huge impression when you are younger and then a big wtf... and off you go. These kind of unexpected events are really important for adults and kids and are really important as teasers to learn more imo.


I was thinking about the Joule–Thomson effect that I learned in thermodynamics. Those little cans of compressed air (they're really liquid+gas) have a slightly different physical mechanism.

[DMC]

Yes the fkn air was cold you stupid clown. Cold air removes heat, especially if it is moving rapidly.
Amendment: It got cold at the gas wells. Did this just totally pass you by? WE HAD COLD WEATHER! Good lord...

YOu are a fkn clown.

The water froze, the gas did not. It didn't get -295 :lol

[DarrinS]

Regardless, we need to winterize that shit, even for extremely rare events.

[pgardn]

The water froze, the gas did not. It didn't get -295 :lol

Methane freezes at -295 at STP you wad.
It freezes on the bottom of the ocean as a hyrdrate.
Do you think the ocean reaches -295 you dolt?

[DMC]

Went back and looked.
Gas in lines get hotter that are exposed to COLD AIR have heat removed from them and become cold


Gas in lines that get hotter because they are pressurized and then get exposed to cold air have heat removed from them and turn cold.
YOu left a whole part of the sentence out. and in fairness that is THEN... should have been put in instead of jumped over but should be obvious from the last part.
I can see where you might have misunderstood.
But you absolutely knew what I was saying on the whole otherwise the rest does not fit in.

Everything I have stated still stands.
Gas can freeze. ANd if Ercot had heated their lines etc... this problem would not have occurred.

Jesus you're a special kind of stupid, the proud kind.

[DMC]

Methane freezes at -295 at STP you wad.
It freezes on the bottom of the ocean as a hyrdrate.
Do you think the ocean reaches -295 you dolt?

The gas lines weren't at the bottom of the ocean. Talk about what happens on Mars.

[pgardn]

Jesus you're a special kind of stupid, the proud kind.

Yeah this tends to happen when you get in a bind. You tap out.
And you left the post after out which was a punch to your face again.

[pgardn]

The gas lines weren't at the bottom of the ocean. Talk about what happens on Mars.

Then wtf would you state -295 degrees asshole? You are such a hypocrite.

Where do you find this on the earth ya fckn idiot?
Do you know what STP means? Natural gas can freeze at temperatures much higher than this at the right pressure.
And yes water did freeze at wells as it is present in a lot of procedures.

[DarrinS]

Then wtf would you state -295 degrees asshole?

Where do you find this on the earth ya fckn idiot?
Do you know what STP means?


Stone Temple Pilots?

[pgardn]

Stone Temple Pilots?

Ever so close by DMC standards.

[DMC]

Yeah this tends to happen when you get in a bind. You tap out.
And you left the post after out which was a punch to your face again.

You keep declaring victory after admitting how sloppy you are and how wrong you were.

Of course you were right even though you were wrong, because your internet scientist LARPing ego has to be treated gently.

:lol "hydrates"

Water freezes.. oh noes!

[pgardn]

You keep declaring victory after admitting how sloppy you are and how wrong you were.

Of course you were right even though you were wrong, because your internet scientist LARPing ego has to be treated gently.

:lol "hydrates"


Water freezes.. oh noes!

Methane hydrates.
What chemical do you know of that never has water associated with it?
Water gets into so many things.

I may have been slightly sloppy.
But you... are dead wrong.
And you know it.

[DMC]

Methane hydrates.
What chemical do you know of that never has water associated with it?
Water gets into so many things.

I may have been slightly sloppy.
But you... are dead wrong.
And you know it.

Helium freezes at 32 degrees F! Just add water!

[pgardn]

Helium freezes at 32 degrees F! Just add water!

Yeah thats about the stupidest statement you have made.
What does STP mean? Why would you write -295 ya fckn idiot?

[DMC]

Yeah thats about the stupidest statement you have made.
What does STP mean? Why would you write -295 ya fckn idiot?

STupid Pgardn

[pgardn]

STupid Pgardn

And its over.

[DMC]

And its over.

You done spilling gravy all over yourself or do you want to keep LARPing as Bill Nye?

[DMC]

internet expert
A form of armchair expert who gains all their knowledge from the internet and then enlightens others on social media. The accuracy of their source information may be suspect, their analysis and conclusions are likely flawed, but they will shout down anyone who dares to challenge their expertise in the field.

[Winehole23]

^^^cribbed from the internet

what's the common word for borrowing without attribution? :lol

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=internet%20expert

[pgardn]

You done spilling gravy all over yourself or do you want to keep LARPing as Bill Nye?

Let me help you again. *yes I know this irritates you so I keep it up*
Standard pressure is atmospheric pressure that’s where you got your -295 from.
The pipes are not at standard pressure, do you understand? all the phase change points that are given thus measured at standard pressure for many molecules are different when the pressure changes. Do you not understand this? So you keep at your -295° and remain baffled.

[pgardn]

internet expert
A form of armchair expert who gains all their knowledge from the internet and then enlightens others on social media. The accuracy of their source information may be suspect, their analysis and conclusions are likely flawed, but they will shout down anyone who dares to challenge their expertise in the field.

Good description of yourself.


Until the next dance where you want to butt in with a partner you long to trip...
You will swallow the L that is so distasteful. Stay in your weight class with the guns.
*Irritatant added*

[Winehole23]

The information I've seen confirms that oil and gas wellheads do freeze off. I think pgardn mentioned this already, but it's important to remember that what comes out of the well is sometimes "wet", i.e., contains water and other compounds.




Natural gas production was pretty much halved in Texas and its gas-rich Permian Basin during the recent cold and stormy weather. It fell from 22.5 billion cubic feet of gas produced per day in December to between 10 to 12 billion cubic feet of gas per day this week, according to estimates from BTU Analytics.


That drop-off in production is thanks to freeze-offs at wellheads where oil and gas are pumped out of the ground.
https://asgmt.com/wp-content/uploads/pdf-docs/2011/1/T06.pdf
https://www.theverge.com/2021/2/17/22287130/texas-natural-gas-production-power-outages-frozen
http://pgjonline.com/magazine/2015/january-2015-vol-242-no-1/features/cold-weather-can-play-havoc-on-natural-gas-systems

[Winehole23]

So then, the argument over "natural gas freezing" is more or less academic. It doesn't change the discussion about oil and wellheads freezing. They froze in the winter storm, and energy delivery was disrupted, contributing to power outages.

[DarrinS]

So then, the argument over "natural gas freezing" is more or less academic. It doesn't change the discussion about oil and wellheads freezing. They froze in the winter storm, and energy delivery was disrupted, contributing to power outages.



Regardless, we need to winterize that shit, even for extremely rare events.

[Winehole23]

^^^ agree 100%

[pgardn]

The natural gas on seafloors freezes as methane hydrate.

But the idea of frozen gas is not new like dry ice. You pressurize it and cool it. And this costs money as well.
Water is very prevalent almost everywhere so it’s highly possible many things that don’t normally freeze up did so with water present.

Edit: for Winehole

From way back.
So it seems.
It is highly possible DMC will still want to say that gas and methane cannot freeze. Which is not germane to the fact that the wells needed heating.

He butted in and I responded. It’s merely a dance he wishes for and I will partner with him. I honestly usually don’t read these things when he decides to dance with SR 21 or many others. Since I don’t belong to his circle of trust, these dances often have nothing to do with the bigger question in whic he does not like the answer.

Heating required to stop this stuff from happening again costs money.
End of argument for some. The private company does what it wants. We will pay that cost through CPS. Part of the bigger problem is clearly deregulation. Gregg Abbott wants this discussion to go away via mask debates.

[DMC]

Who are you presenting to? :lol

[pgardn]

Who are you presenting to? :lol

Winehole and Darrin. This was before you fat ass got red.
Keep on letting SR21 spank that ass and then get back to me.

[boutons_deux]

What I is not that the gas froze, but the instrumentation, sensors, valves froze

[pgardn]

What I is not that the gas froze, but the instrumentation, sensors, valves froze

This requires heating to avoid.

On a separate issue gas can freeze.
Dry ice is frozen CO2.

[Trainwreck2100]

Even if the gas didnt freeze which it should have the low temps would have floored the pressure which was another issue

[DMC]

Winehole and Darrin. This was before you fat ass got red.
Keep on letting SR21 spank that ass and then get back to me.

That's retarded. You quoted yourself. Jesus.

[DMC]

This requires heating to avoid.

On a separate issue gas can freeze.
Dry ice is frozen CO2.

Do the lava experiment with baking soda and vinegar. Yeah do that one.

[DMC]

Let me help you again. *yes I know this irritates you so I keep it up*
Standard pressure is atmospheric pressure that’s where you got your -295 from.
The pipes are not at standard pressure, do you understand? all the phase change points that are given thus measured at standard pressure for many molecules are different when the pressure changes. Do you not understand this? So you keep at your -295° and remain baffled.

:lol he says to a high vacuum expert. Did your little lab experiment teach you that?

[Winehole23]

That's retarded. You quoted yourself. Jesus.It was contextually clear to me. There's even a little clue as to exactly whom pgardn was addressing if you read the post carefully.

(shrugs)

[Winehole23]

carry on, then

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/DiligentCheeryAddax-small.gif

[boutons_deux]

That $16B overbilled in error?

State has ruled it must be paid anyway.

[pgardn]

:lol he says to a high vacuum expert. Did your little lab experiment teach you that?

Oh sure. You did not fkn understand that a gas could be made into a solid because you forgot about the opposite, high pressure.
So apparently in your high vacuum expert life you completely ignore high pressure.

So you were a PHD head hunter for a while.
A writer who had articles altered by Time magazine.
And now a high vacuum expert.
Anything else?

[pgardn]

That's retarded. You quoted yourself. Jesus.

Yes.
Because it was meant for winehole from a while back.
did you see the edit to winehole retard?
See post 295 AGAIN fathead.

Not everyone on this site intentionally attempts to confuse issues they are dead wrong about like you do.
Quit trying to read this into other people.

[DMC]

It was contextually clear to me. There's even a little clue as to exactly whom pgardn was addressing if you read the post carefully.

(shrugs)

I wasn't asking you.

[DMC]

Oh sure. You did not fkn understand that a gas could be made into a solid because you forgot about the opposite, high pressure.
So apparently in your high vacuum expert life you completely ignore high pressure.

So you were a PHD head hunter for a while.
A writer who had articles altered by Time magazine.
And now a high vacuum expert.
Anything else?

I am also a high pressure expert. In fact, most of the shit you wax scientific on here with your forum degree I am actually an expert at. I just like to drag you around. Your ego is like a cartoon character, like WC with a Phoenix Online degree.

In fact, just about anything you'd need to create and operate a particle accelerator I am an expert at, among other things you wouldn't understand.

[pgardn]

I wasn't asking you.

Just stfu and stop making a fool of yourself.
And IM TELLING YOU.

[Winehole23]

I wasn't asking you.Your powers of reading failed.

Sorry this is happening to you.

[DMC]

Just stfu and stop making a fool of yourself.
And IM TELLING YOU.

Or what? You going to lecture me? :lol

[pgardn]

I am also a high pressure expert. In fact, most of the shit you wax scientific on here with your forum degree I am actually an expert at. I just like to drag you around. Your ego is like a cartoon character, like WC with a Phoenix Online degree.

So thats what you really are. YOu are also an Art Critic with a minor expertise in cheese.

The company or whoever you work for needs to fire you.
You dont know basic science. Yeah Phoenix online degree... so you accused me of smelling chemicals over the internet.
Cool story asshole. I absolutely do NOT believe you. Stunning, eh?

[Winehole23]

I am also a high pressure expert. In fact, most of the shit you wax scientific on here with your forum degree I am actually an expert at. I just like to drag you around. Your ego is like a cartoon character, like WC with a Phoenix Online degree.

In fact, just about anything you'd need to create and operate a particle accelerator I am an expert at, among other things you wouldn't understand.That's funny, cause you haven't explained shit ITT or shown your expertise in any way, you just clown pgardn all day without showing your cards.

Are your math skills slipping too?

[pgardn]

Or what? You going to lecture me? :lol

No.
Just make fun of you because you are a fake.
Keep going.

[DMC]

So thats what you really are. YOu are also an Art Critic with a minor expertise in cheese.

The company or whoever you work for needs to fire you.
You dont know basic science. Yeah Phoenix online degree... so you accused me of smelling chemicals over the internet.
Cool story asshole. I absolutely do NOT believe you. Stunning, eh?

I know about degas but not the Artist. Keep creating your little Fortnite castle, idiot.

[DarrinS]

You guys STILL arguing this shite?

[pgardn]

Did you help NASA at Plum Brook?
Tell us what you did there?

[DMC]

No.
Just make fun of you because you are a fake.
Keep going.

You're basically a 1st year grad student trying to lecture a seasoned pro about the theory, but know jack shit about practice.

[pgardn]

You guys STILL arguing this shite?

DMC is juggling with his multiple expert status with many posters at this time.
He is doing just fine.

[DMC]

Did you help NASA at Plum Brook?
Tell us what you did there?

Something else you read about and probably asked a thousand questions online and now feel like an expert on? :lol

[DMC]

DMC is juggling with his multiple expert status with many posters at this time.
He is doing just fine.

No it's just you and your Wild Cobra ego.

[pgardn]

You're basically a 1st year grad student trying to lecture a seasoned pro about the theory, but know jack shit about practice.

What did you do to help NASA at Plum Brook?

Nope. I work in the field I was trained in graduate school. At UT.
Sorry fella. And yes I have already mentioned it multiple times but I dont need to brag about it as I got very lucky to make a bunch of really good connections with a bunch of really good people from all over. This happens. It happened to people who are now my friends.

[pgardn]

Something else you read about and probably asked a thousand questions online and now feel like an expert on? :lol

No I read about it, a while back. never been
I bet the enginneering and software that controls all the hard ware that runs it is awesome.
So tell me what you find the most interesting thing about it.
What could we discuss next science related faker?

You dont know your shit. And I know you dont.

[pgardn]

shit i hit n twice...

[DMC]

No I read about it, a while back. never been
I bet the enginneering and software that controls all the hard ware that runs it is awesome.
So tell me what you find the most interesting thing about it.
What could we discuss next science related faker?

You dont know your shit. And I know you dont.

I don't talk work online. I do it professionally and I am my "company".

:lol

[ChumpDumper]

I am also a high pressure expert. In fact, most of the shit you wax scientific on here with your forum degree I am actually an expert at. I just like to drag you around. Your ego is like a cartoon character, like WC with a Phoenix Online degree.

In fact, just about anything you'd need to create and operate a particle accelerator I am an expert at, among other things you wouldn't understand.That makes your getting dragged here even funnier tbh.

[Winehole23]

That makes your getting dragged here even funnier tbh.Claims expertise, refuses to demonstrate. It's convincing, but probably not as intended.

[ChumpDumper]

Claims expertise, refuses to demonstrate. It's convincing, but probably not as intended.
I destroyed his ego when I pointed out he got imply/infer completely wrong.

He's honestly never been the same since.

[pgardn]

I don't talk work online. I do it professionally and I am my "company".

:lol

Wow how professional of you Mr. Vacuum Expert!
I told you the very basics of what I did and you said I invented a technique and won a Noble prize.
We dont have to talk about vacuum or proteins. We can discuss other topics like we have already done a number of times, especially when you butt in with your nonsense about things you dont know.

You even had the gall to use my statement to try and irritate Random Guy at one time... Why?
Dont answer that.
I shall return.

But... you dont know your shit. And I know you dont.
I will let you to your "client/expert" privilege.
Asshat...

[Winehole23]

I destroyed his ego when I pointed out he got imply/infer completely wrong.
Given how much DMC relishes and lords his mastery of the dictionary over others, I can see how confusing two basic logical terms might cause him to decompensate.

[DMC]

Wow how professional of you Mr. Vacuum Expert!
I told you the very basics of what I did and you said I invented a technique and won a Noble prize.
We dont have to talk about vacuum or proteins. We can discuss other topics like we have already done a number of times, especially when you butt in with your nonsense about things you dont know.

You even had the gall to use my statement to try and irritate Random Guy at one time... Why?
Dont answer that.
I shall return.

But... you dont know your shit. And I know you dont.
I will let you to your "client/expert" privilege.
Asshat...

I say "particle accelerator" and you offer a large vacuum chamber.

Try again.

Your M.O. is to puff up your e-chest about your prowess, but when asked to clarify you balk. What exactly did you do with the ELISA assay? You never said.

[DMC]

Given how much DMC relishes and lords his mastery of the dictionary over others, I can see how confusing two basic logical terms might cause him to decompensate.

Look, a tweet is getting away! Quick, to the Batmobile!

[ChumpDumper]

:lol he's losing his shit

[DMC]

^still trying :lol

[ChumpDumper]

^still responding :lol

[pgardn]

I say "particle accelerator" and you offer a large vacuum chamber.

Try again.

Your M.O. is to puff up your e-chest about your prowess, but when asked to clarify you balk. What exactly did you do with the ELISA assay? You never said.

Uhh use it. Use it extensively.
And then hook different types of types of shit to proteins to separate cell types, or count cells, or... better, deliver drugs...
And it can be difficult because when you start hooking different types of things to proteins, the proteins can change shape. So you succeeded in the hook up, but now you dont have the right shape. Its somewhat of a pain. But if the protein stays the right shape in certain regions with stuff hooked to it, you can then do wonderful things. Or what I and others that work together consider wonderful things.

So I offer up one particular assay, and you say Noble prize. Like its some sort of miracle. You have to be careful about shape changes, the reconfiguration of electrons basically. Because thats what its all about. concentration of ions, pH, temp, everything has to be correct or electrons reconfigure and you get shape changes even though the hook up was successful. Layman discussion but basically on point.

Now. Go on about your vacuum maintenance on particle accelerators I guess. Go on then...
Tell the board the use for the vacuum you fix, or most likely sell.

[pgardn]

I don't talk work online. I do it professionally and I am my "company".

:lol

The old contractor job that you yourself have already denigrated.
Such a fckn hypocrite.

[RandomGuy]

I am also a high pressure expert. In fact, most of the shit you wax scientific on here with your forum degree I am actually an expert at. I just like to drag you around. Your ego is like a cartoon character, like WC with a Phoenix Online degree.

In fact, just about anything you'd need to create and operate a particle accelerator I am an expert at, among other things you wouldn't understand.

Except you don't.

More than half of your "drag" attempts are lame, miss the mark, or make sense only in your head.

When you yourself get called to the carpet your fragile ego forces you to run away or deflect, rather than admit you fucked up.

I'm sure this is how you see yourself in your head, but the reality of what you do/say... belies that.

smh

[DMC]

Except you don't.

More than half of your "drag" attempts are lame, miss the mark, or make sense only in your head.

When you yourself get called to the carpet your fragile ego forces you to run away or deflect, rather than admit you fucked up.

I'm sure this is how you see yourself in your head, but the reality of what you do/say... belies that.

smh

You're not an authority though so your take is meaningless. If I needed information on being a house dad, I'd turn to you.

[DMC]

The old contractor job that you yourself have already denigrated.
Such a fckn hypocrite.

The NaCl is palpable.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol DMC didn't sleep well knowing he was dragged yesterday.

He'll definitely respond to this post.

[DMC]

Uhh use it. Use it extensively.
And then hook different types of types of shit to proteins to separate cell types, or count cells, or... better, deliver drugs...
And it can be difficult because when you start hooking different types of things to proteins, the proteins can change shape. So you succeeded in the hook up, but now you dont have the right shape. Its somewhat of a pain. But if the protein stays the right shape in certain regions with stuff hooked to it, you can then do wonderful things. Or what I and others that work together consider wonderful things.

So I offer up one particular assay, and you say Noble prize. Like its some sort of miracle. You have to be careful about shape changes, the reconfiguration of electrons basically. Because thats what its all about. concentration of ions, pH, temp, everything has to be correct or electrons reconfigure and you get shape changes even though the hook up was successful. Layman discussion but basically on point.

Now. Go on about your vacuum maintenance on particle accelerators I guess. Go on then...
Tell the board the use for the vacuum you fix, or most likely sell.

I don't talk about my work online. It's not "ooh and aaah" to me. Obviously the dabbling you did impresses you till this day.

[DMC]

ChumpDumper
Alleged Michigander

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[ChumpDumper]

:lol called it

He can't actually ignore me!

Watch.

[Winehole23]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/DiligentCheeryAddax-small.gif

[pgardn]

I don't talk about my work online. It's not "ooh and aaah" to me. Obviously the dabbling you did impresses you till this day.

Uhhhhh

You fucking asked me?
I have stated many times I do not consider myself and what I do somehow lofty and above others. I worked hard and I got lucky. that’s about it. And I enjoy my work.

seriously DMC

you accuse me of getting a degree online from Phoenix University, then call me out and ask what I’m doing with a particular technique, and then accuse me of showing off when I answer???? this will all be forgotten by the majority of the board so it’s just not that big a deal.

If You can just stops putting your foot in your mouth.

[RandomGuy]

More than half of your "drag" attempts are lame, miss the mark, or make sense only in your head


[I know I don't do that because [lame drag attempt that misses the mark]]

:rollin

You do you, boo. Carry on. :lol

[Winehole23]

Uhhhhh

You fucking asked me?
I have stated many times I do not consider myself and what I do somehow lofty and above others. I worked hard and I got lucky. that’s about it. And I enjoy my work.

seriously DMC

you accuse me of getting a degree online from Phoenix University, then call me out and ask what I’m doing with a particular technique, and then accuse me of showing off when I answer???? this will all be forgotten by the majority of the board so it’s just not that big a deal.

If You can just stops putting your foot in your mouth.CC's attempt to big time me on frozen wellheads and pipelines turned into DMC's days-long jihad to show you up, first about the freezing point of natural gas, then about anything at all, so long as it isn't a fact or the thread topic.

DMC is a solid grudgeposter and a master deflector.