Official 2021 Free Agency Day Thread (Begins at 5PM CT)

[DPG21920]

That's true. Nance still has more value. I don't think Spurs fans know how good he is.

I like Nance and I even said he has solid value; I just think Thad is in a similar spot especially with so many teams needing an upgrade and it being a key position with limited good players available

[Seventyniner]

That pick protection in the McDermott S&T is rather lol. It's hard to imagine either team finishing in the top 5 the season after next. At least 2026 is far enough out that the Pacers or Heat might be terrible that year and the Spurs would get a free pick in the 30s.

[SAGirl]

That's true. Nance still has more value. I don't think Spurs fans know how good he is.
After you mentioned his contract I checked bballref and it’s listed for 10 mill declining to 9 for two years. For a team like Portland with a bloated salary sheet in the books that has value. And he’s young enough to expect no decline in those 2 years if he’s healthy.

Thad OTOH is only signed for one season so he could leave at the end of it. Also he’s already 33. At the end of the season it may be doubtful he’s worth any big contracts at all but if he’s still good, it’s still a risky proposition because he can go LMA washed at any point soon.

I don’t watch either guy other than casually but Nance definitely has more value.

[Chinook]

That pick protection in the McDermott S&T is rather lol. It's hard to imagine either team finishing in the top 5 the season after next. At least 2026 is far enough out that the Pacers or Heat might be terrible that year and the Spurs would get a free pick in the 30s.

Remember, the Heat or Pacers have to BOTH be terrible for the pick to convey. If only one is bad, Memphis gets to keep the pick and send the worse pick to the swap, where it would then be compared with SA's pick. So in order for the Spurs to benefit, they'd have to finish with a better record than both Miami and Indy. It's possible, but it's way less likely to convey a decent amount of value. The most likely result is going to just be SA and Indy exchanging nothing of value. It was a really shitty trade SA should've made.

[Seventyniner]

Remember, the Heat or Pacers have to BOTH be terrible for the pick to convey. If only one is bad, Memphis gets to keep the pick and send the worse pick to the swap, where it would then be compared with SA's pick. So in order for the Spurs to benefit, they'd have to finish with a better record than both Miami and Indy. It's possible, but it's way less likely to convey a decent amount of value. The most likely result is going to just be SA and Indy exchanging nothing of value. It was a really shitty trade SA should've made.

Oh, I was only looking at the post above which didn't mention Memphis at all. I really don't see the point of agreeing to the S&T at all from the Spurs' perspective now. Might as well have asked for $1M or something instead.

[Chinook]

Oh, I was only looking at the post above which didn't mention Memphis at all. I really don't see the point of agreeing to the S&T at all from the Spurs' perspective now. Might as well have asked for $1M or something instead.

SA was probably trying to be nice by agreeing to the deal and giving Indy a TE. Issue is, teams need to trade away something in a deal. So SA had to give up their protected pick. They asked for Indy to do the same to "even things out". I guess I'm glad the Spurs went for something of theoretical value over just cash as the net incentive. But it was a bad deal. Boston gave up two seconds to New York to make Fournier an S&T and did the same thing to Charlotte to make Hayward one last year. It's crazy that the Spurs did a deal for no value and encumbered their second and gave themselves a hard cap as a result.

[Leetonidas]

In other news...

https://uproxx.com/dimemag/report-ben-simmons-trade-request-wont-report-training-camp-rumors/

Not that we didn't know this already but I saw a lot of 76ers fans on other forums pulling the ol "Simmons hasn't come out and said anything himself" ala Spurs fans in 2018 :lol

[Leetonidas]

Given that was reported by their local beat reporter who from what i've gathered based on Sixers fans comments, is pretty plugged into the organization, I would expect to see a Simmons trade within the next 2 weeks. Sixers would be incredibly dumb to drag this out into the season and waste a year of Embiid's prime because Morey overplayed his hand and is trying to save face. :lmao cant believe this guy refused to trade Simmons for Harden, now he's going to be stuck taking pennies on the dollar

[stephen jackson]

Wants to go to a west coast team

[Degoat]

The kings or Timberwolves will cave in and give them a kings ransom, they can come up with the best deals imo

[TD 21]

1. It's not exactly breaking news that he'd prefer California over Minnesota or San Antonio and 2. Neither the 76ers nor those two teams have any reason to care though, given that he's signed for 4 more seasons and his reputation is in tatters. Wherever he goes, he'll be all but forced to grin, bear it and play good soldier.



The kings or Timberwolves will cave in and give them a kings ransom, they can come up with the best deals imo

Spurs lack of a centerpiece is the likely death knell. Russell (despite his being close with Towns, he has to be in it both value and money wise) and Haliburton are not of the caliber the 76ers would prefer, but they're sure as hell more dynamic/malleable offensively than Murray and because of that, they'd also be easier to re-route as part of a package for a Lillard or disgruntled superstar/star TBD.

[RD2191]

In other news...

https://uproxx.com/dimemag/report-ben-simmons-trade-request-wont-report-training-camp-rumors/

Not that we didn't know this already but I saw a lot of 76ers fans on other forums pulling the ol "Simmons hasn't come out and said anything himself" ala Spurs fans in 2018 :lol

Damn...it still hurts.

[tonight...you]

Damn...it still hurts.
Gonna need an RX for some hormones homie.
Get yo ass to an Indian Reserve and I know peeps that can give you boobs in no time.

[RD2191]

Gonna need an RX for some hormones homie.
Get yo ass to an Indian Reserve and I know peeps that can give you boobs in no time.
:downspin:

[spurs10]

Wants to go to a west coast team SA is halfway there....

[dbestpro]

Word is Suns want Thadeus Young and are willing to trade injured Saric, and Jalen Smith. The Spurs want draft capital too and would have to send a couple of players to open roster space. Saric will not play this year but does have a two year contract. Not sure if they could waive him after a trade.

[Mr. Body]

Word is Suns want Thadeus Young and are willing to trade injured Saric, and Jalen Smith. The Spurs want draft capital too and would have to send a couple of players to open roster space. Saric will not play this year but does have a two year contract. Not sure if they could waive him after a trade.

Yes, this has been the news for weeks.

[jjspur]

After you mentioned his contract I checked bballref and it’s listed for 10 mill declining to 9 for two years. For a team like Portland with a bloated salary sheet in the books that has value. And he’s young enough to expect no decline in those 2 years if he’s healthy.

Thad OTOH is only signed for one season so he could leave at the end of it. Also he’s already 33. At the end of the season it may be doubtful he’s worth any big contracts at all but if he’s still good, it’s still a risky proposition because he can go LMA washed at any point soon.

I don’t watch either guy other than casually but Nance definitely has more value.

I agree Nance has more value, but like Aldridge he also has a managed heart condition which is a bit of a red flag. He's a good player just has a few issues to deal with.

[Mr. Body]

Simmons is destined for Minnesota.

[spurspl]

millsap and probably aldridge to nets

[cd021]

Word is Suns want Thadeus Young and are willing to trade injured Saric, and Jalen Smith. The Spurs want draft capital too and would have to send a couple of players to open roster space. Saric will not play this year but does have a two year contract. Not sure if they could waive him after a trade.

If Saric is ruled out for the year, does he count towards the actual roster spots? Isn't there a separate list?

[Chinook]

If Saric is ruled out for the year, does he count towards the actual roster spots? Isn't there a separate list?

There's not. There's a roster exemption to add guys if a team can't field eight. But there's no IR

[dbestpro]

Yes, this has been the news for weeks.

So has Simmons and that dead horse is still getting beat.

[Russ]

Word is Suns want Thadeus Young and are willing to trade injured Saric, and Jalen Smith. The Spurs want draft capital too and would have to send a couple of players to open roster space. Saric will not play this year but does have a two year contract. Not sure if they could waive him after a trade.

If so, that shows you what the Suns think of Jalen Smith -- Saric is out for the year yet they're willing to get rid of Smith?

No thanks.

[bluebellmaniac]

I'd rather go for Saric, tank this year, and maybe be a contender within three years.

[Mr. Body]

If so, that shows you what the Suns think of Jalen Smith -- Saric is out for the year yet they're willing to get rid of Smith?

No thanks.

Jalen Smith is looking like a clear bust.

[TD 21]

Not that he easily couldn't be in the process of becoming that, but you apologists would be making every excuse under the sun if (when?) he were a Spur.

[CGD]

Jalen Smith is looking like a clear bust.

Yup, there is a reason Sun fan is eager to include him in deals.

[Atl Spur]

Yup, there is a reason Sun fan is eager to include him in deals.

After 1 season??? Wow you boys are harsh!

[tonight...you]

After 1 season??? Wow you boys are harsh!
Microwave generations. Instant gratification, or it's shit.

[CGD]

Microwave generations. Instant gratification, or it's shit.

Nah. Last year overall was seen like a weak draft, and it’s pretty much been tracking. That he was “the 10th pick” doesnt mean he merits being the prize of a trade.

[CGD]

After 1 season??? Wow you boys are harsh!

It seems his ceiling is a less good version of Emuka Okafor from a few years back.

[offset formation]

Microwave generations. Instant gratification, or it's shit.

Ppl ready to toss aside Walker and Samanic too. they're like 22 and 21 and Samanic has barely seen the floor and when he did he looked above avg on the defensive end and walker has developed a nice jumpshot. I'll never understand the urge to throw those boys overboard yet

[Uriel]

1433452131437195269

[Mnky]

Ppl ready to toss aside Walker and Samanic too. they're like 22 and 21 and Samanic has barely seen the floor and when he did he looked above avg on the defensive end and walker has developed a nice jumpshot. I'll never understand the urge to throw those boys overboard yet

Yea it's pretty weird how people obsess with projects the spurs drafted because they wouldn't have got them if they had stayed in college or overseas.

They also haven't had the opportunity to really play yet. Everyone knows pop has a record of screwing with young players development. The only players that developed played day 1. Some of them obviously more ready, but the game experience is where they'll grow. They need a consistent role.

[Dejounte]

So wait, we’re supposed to accept that Primo is 1-2 years away from having regular rotation minutes but it’s different for a player like Smith who was on a team that couldn’t afford to switch from their win now philosophy with vets who had a higher standard for their teammates to play mistake-free basketball because they were actually competing for a championship.

spurstalk, yall. Dont come here for player evals.

[ginobilized]

Jalen Smith could be a great fit for the Spurs. His development in PHX is going to be very slow.
Some playing time and coaching would do wonders for him. I was hoping the Spurs would get him at 11 in that draft.

These dog days of the NBA season are hard on the psyches of SpursTalk folks.

I'll be curious if things start to move after Sept. 9 when Primo would be available to be traded. The Spurs have made more moves than usual and have the possibility of making more. This is new terrain for Spurs fans.

Mostly, I am just glad that we have seemingly chosen a youth-oriented path. Should be fun to watch compared to recent seasons.

[rjv]

it all comes down to 1st round picks; that's what i really want.

[Leetonidas]

I wouldn't mind adding Smith at all, as it is waaay to early to label a guy that barely got minutes on a team with titles hopes as a bust at this point. but I think the Spurs can probably get something better in return for Young instead of Smith and Saric's dead money

[CGD]

So wait, we’re supposed to accept that Primo is 1-2 years away from having regular rotation minutes but it’s different for a player like Smith who was on a team that couldn’t afford to switch from their win now philosophy with vets who had a higher standard for their teammates to play mistake-free basketball because they were actually competing for a championship.

spurstalk, yall. Dont come here for player evals.

JUST because someone is 18 or young (Smith is 21) doesn’t necessarily mean they’re always “developable.” So both of your things can be true in this case.

[CGD]

I wouldn't mind adding Smith at all, as it is waaay to early to label a guy that barely got minutes on a team with titles hopes as a bust at this point. but I think the Spurs can probably get something better in return for Young instead of Smith and Saric's dead money

Sort of. Remember that PHX has bad depth issues in the front court, so much so that they were relying mightily on frank the tank there towards the end. You’d think the 10th pick on the draft would at least be able to come in for spot minutes.

[Degoat]

Jalen Smith would be a good add, coaches rarely trust rookies in the playoffs even if their thin at their position. He just needs to focus on getting bigger and continue working on his 3 pointer

[Degoat]

Sekou doumbouya traded to the nets, pretty good add by Sean marks if they plan on keeping him tbh they could develop him into a really solid role player for that team

[Chinook]

So wait, we’re supposed to accept that Primo is 1-2 years away from having regular rotation minutes but it’s different for a player like Smith who was on a team that couldn’t afford to switch from their win now philosophy with vets who had a higher standard for their teammates to play mistake-free basketball because they were actually competing for a championship.

spurstalk, yall. Dont come here for player evals.

I both like Smith well enough and believe the "two years away" line is a bullshit coping mechanism fans use to justify guys who aren't developing normally. Smith wasn't a good player last year. It wasn't merely a minutes thing. He wouldn't've gotten minutes on the Spurs with that production either. He looked good enough in the summer league to have hope, but the idea that guys are supposed to start off as negatives and slowly become positives doesn't track with the way most guys actually develop.

I don't blame anyone who didn't like Smith for not considering him an asset, and at his salary, he can't be unplayable much longer without being a bad contract. The same will be true for Primy if his NBA minutes are horrible for two years. Smith still has another year in my mind before I would be concerned, but there's a huge difference between him and Primo right now.

[Joseph Kony]

Sekou doumbouya traded to the nets, pretty good add by Sean marks if they plan on keeping him tbh they could develop him into a really solid role player for that team

i think Detroit salary dumping him on his rookie deal should tell you all you need to know :lol dude is a scrub and only got drafted so high because GMs thought he could be the next Siakam

[Degoat]

i think Detroit salary dumping him on his rookie deal should tell you all you need to know :lol dude is a scrub and only got drafted so high because GMs thought he could be the next Siakam

Maybe, I think Detroit was a bad place for him to end up, I’d rather have him then our Luka but that’s just me

[The Truth #6]

I think with Jalen it wasn’t simply his NBA minutes, but he underwhelmed in the G league too, which is a much bigger concern. But he seemed to have improved in Summer League. He’s projecting as a role player and will need to shoot well from outside to overcome his slight frame and physical limitations, according to reports.

[objective]

i think Detroit salary dumping him on his rookie deal should tell you all you need to know :lol dude is a scrub and only got drafted so high because GMs thought he could be the next Siakam

Ordinarily I'd agree, but he was drafted by the previous administration and the current guy has cleaned house. They chose Plumlee over Wood for the same reason and just had to salary dump Plumlee. Don't think I'd write off anyone Detroit's new gm got rid of just yet.

[Degoat]

I’ve officially lost all trust in this source now lmao but that NBASupes guy said that in December Ben Simmons will be traded for Norman Powell and Robert Covington. That seems like a pretty shit package for philly to even consider

[dbestpro]

I guess other teams might say the same thing about Vassel we are saying about Smith not developing.
.

[Dejounte]

I guess other teams might say the same thing about Vassel we are saying about Smith not developing.
.

hell, even Keldon received little to no minutes during his first year

people here are claiming they watched the Suns’ garbage time minutes for Jalen and saying he wasnt any good is downright laughable. Almost as laughable as when they claim Murray made no improvements this past season. How can you claim you’re watching Suns games when you weren’t even watching Spurs games? also, performing well in garbage time isn’t a great indicator of success or failure when youre given inconsistent minutes. It just isn’t.

like, it’s okay to admit you don’t fucking know. Stop having your head up your ass.

[Fusternino]

KBD confirmed as a two-way yet?

[DPG21920]

Spurs release Hutch:

https://twitter.com/fredkatz/status/1434263774178025474?s=21

[Mr. Body]

Bombshell!

[tbdog]

So one more cut to go.

[Dverde]

Spurs release Hutch:

https://twitter.com/fredkatz/status/1434263774178025474?s=21

Now he can make a Tic Tok on two NBA teams giving up on him.

[barakz21]

Lmao that TikTok video of him helping his new team to make the playoffs is funnier now than when he posted it

[exstatic]

Yea it's pretty weird how people obsess with projects the spurs drafted because they wouldn't have got them if they had stayed in college or overseas.

They also haven't had the opportunity to really play yet. Everyone knows pop has a record of screwing with young players development. The only players that developed played day 1. Some of them obviously more ready, but the game experience is where they'll grow. They need a consistent role.

Lonnie played 25 minutes per game last year. He has only two skills, jumping high, and shooting the 3 pointer, so he seems to be on the Ben McLemore journeyman track. You don’t pay much for that, and that tends to hurt the players feelings, and they walk when you don’t extend them. If the player still has fans in other front offices, shouldn’t you try to get something for him?

[exstatic]

I guess other teams might say the same thing about Vassel we are saying about Smith not developing.
.
Vassell was playing very well until he got the Rona, shooting 40% from long, and ball hawking on a Dejounte level. He was really never the same after play resumed. I don’t think Jalen Smith ever showed anything.

[CGD]

Vassell was playing very well until he got the Rona, shooting 40% from long, and ball hawking on a Dejounte level. He was really never the same after play resumed. I don’t think Jalen Smith ever showed anything.

I’ll be very happy if Vassel becomes our version of Bridges for the Suns. It’s in play.

[Biggems]

So, I am sure we really don't want Aminu. Orlando obviously doesn't want Mo Bamba. Would it be realistic to trade Aminu for Bamba straight up? It works on the trade machine, but that is just numbers, it isn't realistic.

If straight up doesn't work, what about Aminu and a 2nd or two for Bamba. Of course, if we through in draft picks, he would have to sign at least a 2 year extension.

[Biggems]

Vassell was playing very well until he got the Rona, shooting 40% from long, and ball hawking on a Dejounte level. He was really never the same after play resumed. I don’t think Jalen Smith ever showed anything.

If Vassell can get his mojo back......look out. He can be deadly from 3 and his D is impregnable.

I fact, I like versatility we have on defense, except at the PF position. I really wish we had a big who could play PF/C and be able to guard either position with regularity.

[Dex]

Man, you gotta be really toxic for a team to pay you $4M to just go away and not even get a shot in training camp.

[Biggems]

Man, you gotta be really toxic for a team to pay you $4M to just go away and not even get a shot in training camp.

either that or you must really suck.

[Dex]

either that or you must really suck.

I mean, he was a 22nd overall pick. He made the NBA and is still only 25.

The fact that the Spurs will probably bring some dudes off the street to play in training camp before giving this guy a shot speaks more to his character than his basketball ability, tbh.

But yeah, he does suck too.

[Ocotillo]

So, I am sure we really don't want Aminu. Orlando obviously doesn't want Mo Bamba. Would it be realistic to trade Aminu for Bamba straight up? It works on the trade machine, but that is just numbers, it isn't realistic.

If straight up doesn't work, what about Aminu and a 2nd or two for Bamba. Of course, if we through in draft picks, he would have to sign at least a 2 year extension.
I like Bamba too but all of a sudden we have 4 5s and that is before adding Bamba.

[bluebellmaniac]

Lonnie played 25 minutes per game last year. He has only two skills, jumping high, and shooting the 3 pointer, so he seems to be on the Ben McLemore journeyman track. You don’t pay much for that, and that tends to hurt the players feelings, and they walk when you don’t extend them. If the player still has fans in other front offices, shouldn’t you try to get something for him?

Yup... That's usually the case. Ain't never seen one yet stick around and play without a contract.

[CGD]

Now that the dust has settled, does anyone have an updated list of our recently acquired draft capital?

[BacktoBasics]

Lonnie played 25 minutes per game last year. He has only two skills, jumping high, and shooting the 3 pointer, so he seems to be on the Ben McLemore journeyman track. You don’t pay much for that, and that tends to hurt the players feelings, and they walk when you don’t extend them. If the player still has fans in other front offices, shouldn’t you try to get something for him?
I don’t like that comparison. After his second year Ben turned to shit. Lonnie has been on a nice developmental track. Some here think Lonnie being anything short of 20ppg high value starter is a bust.

12-14ppg bench player is a good value.

[John B]

I mean, he was a 22nd overall pick. He made the NBA and is still only 25.

The fact that the Spurs will probably bring some dudes off the street to play in training camp before giving this guy a shot speaks more to his character than his basketball ability, tbh.

But yeah, he does suck too.

Lyles is KD compared to this guy. He’s happy with the money he’s made. He’s not getting any better.

[DPG21920]

So, I am sure we really don't want Aminu. Orlando obviously doesn't want Mo Bamba. Would it be realistic to trade Aminu for Bamba straight up? It works on the trade machine, but that is just numbers, it isn't realistic.

If straight up doesn't work, what about Aminu and a 2nd or two for Bamba. Of course, if we through in draft picks, he would have to sign at least a 2 year extension.

It is not realistic at all….That would be just dumping him for nothing. Ive seen nothing that suggests they dont want Mo around; at least nothing where they would just salary dump him.

If anything, it would take a first round pick to get him if what you are offering is Aminu.

[TD 21]

I don’t like that comparison. After his second year Ben turned to shit. Lonnie has been on a nice developmental track. Some here think Lonnie being anything short of 20ppg high value starter is a bust.

12-14ppg bench player is a good value.

Given the source, it's shockingly spot on.

:lmao At counting stats without context.

[Mnky]

Lonnie played 25 minutes per game last year. He has only two skills, jumping high, and shooting the 3 pointer, so he seems to be on the Ben McLemore journeyman track. You don’t pay much for that, and that tends to hurt the players feelings, and they walk when you don’t extend them. If the player still has fans in other front offices, shouldn’t you try to get something for him?

What was his role? His stats and rankings are going to be horrid if his role is stand in the corner and wait for the ball hog to dribble for 20 seconds just to chunk it. Roles matter.

If they can get a good deal for Lonnie, of course you listen. Lonnie is potential. If you see more potential elsewhere, you take it. I'm not opposed to that at all. The idea that we just need to get rid of players who haven't had a consistent role because they've met their limit is a bit silly. Most of our young guys are younger then late 1st round picks still coming out.

When we are at the 25-30 area and we still see the same issues, I can see being aggressive with them but these kids have barely had that opportunity. People equating "minutes" with opportunity isn't being honest in evaluation. Lonnie was hardly ever the main ball handler, pushed aside for ddr, Rudy, and mills.

There would be games Lonnie would make 2 or 3 shots in a row and one of those guys would come down the court with the ball and not pass it once. They clearly held Lonnie back. Now whether or not he would have kept going is an unknown. He may have crashed and sinked.

I'm all for always looking to improve. Everyone should be competing for a spot on the team, it's a business.

[Dex]

1435340671703990276

1435341837917585413

[TDMVPDPOY]

spurs should sign jahlil okafor...who is waive by the nets...not bad traditional big...

[Dex]

spurs should sign jahlil okafor...who is waive by the nets...not bad traditional big...

We already have too many people on the roster.

[sananspursfan21]

spurs should sign jahlil okafor...who is waive by the nets...not bad traditional big...

I’ve always liked Okafor and feel like there’s still some untapped potential there. It’s possible that what we see is what we get but he could also be a late bloomer that still has some room to get a little better. But alas, that crowded roster…

[BillMc]

1435340671703990276

1435341837917585413
Appropriate that one of the two photos of Hutch has him in street clothes. Because that's what he's going to be wearing on Suns game nights.

[JeffDuncan]

I’ve always liked Okafor and feel like there’s still some untapped potential there. It’s possible that what we see is what we get but he could also be a late bloomer that still has some room to get a little better. But alas, that crowded roster…


The roster is not crowded, yet. Teams have until the last day of preseason to pare down. That'll be October 18.

[TDMVPDPOY]

okafor a real big vs the undersized scrubs on the team,

hence he could be a bargain compared to the crap FO resign players

[Dex]

okafor a real big vs the undersized scrubs on the team,

hence he could be a bargain compared to the crap FO resign players

Ah yes, Okafor....a "real big".

Okafor the draft bust who got picked 3rd overall and didn't even last three seasons with Philly.

Okafor the guy who has played for 4 teams in his 6-year career and put up a whopping 15 and 7 Per 36 last season. For reference, Eubanks averaged 15 and 11.5 Per 36.

Okafor who couldn't even earn minutes on a tanking Detroit Pistons squad last year.

Yeah, sounds like someone to really roll the dice on for training camp when we already have 17 players with basically guaranteed contracts and need to cut 2 of them.

We already have Poeltl, Landale, and maybe Eubanks. We don't need another big.for

[Spurs9]

Ah yes, Okafor....a "real big".

Okafor the draft bust who got picked 3rd overall and didn't even last three seasons with Philly.

Okafor the guy who has played for 4 teams in his 6-year career and put up a whopping 15 and 7 Per 36 last season. For reference, Eubanks averaged 15 and 11.5 Per 36.

Okafor who couldn't even earn minutes on a tanking Detroit Pistons squad last year.

Yeah, sounds like someone to really roll the dice on for training camp when we already have 17 players with basically guaranteed contracts and need to cut 2 of them.

We already have Poeltl, Landale, and maybe Eubanks. We don't need another big.for
I’d take Okafor over any of those bigs.

[Dex]

I’d take Okafor over any of those bigs.

Good luck with that.

I may take Okafor over Eubanks, but even Eubanks has a better season last year and he is some scrub from the GLeague.

[Chinook]

Oak isn't a good player. He was productive in New Orleans, but his impact stats were still not good. I certainly don't think he'd start on the Spurs.

[Gibbz]

I’d take Okafor over any of those bigs.

Trying not to exaggerate because the stakes are lofty, but this might actually be the worst take I've seen here.

[spurraider21]

suns just signed hutchinson. scola 2.0

[ismael-robert]

suns just signed hutchinson. scola 2.0

Scroll to top of page. This was tweeted on 9/7

[John B]

Looks like Zollins, McBuckets and SOB are getting along fine with their new team. Not to mention Primo and Joe. I like this.

https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/blob:https://www.spurstalk.com/4d66da1a-222c-444a-8f0b-df1bdc189514

[Leetonidas]

Looks like Zollins, McBuckets and SOB are getting along fine with their new team. Not to mention Primo and Joe. I like this.

https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/blob:https://www.spurstalk.com/4d66da1a-222c-444a-8f0b-df1bdc189514

Yup, saw those pics too. Cool to see them doing team bonding shit before the season, especially since it was mostly new guys

[Ice009]

Looks like Zollins, McBuckets and SOB are getting along fine with their new team. Not to mention Primo and Joe. I like this.

https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/blob:https://www.spurstalk.com/4d66da1a-222c-444a-8f0b-df1bdc189514

What pictures are these, I'm not seeing any.

[offset formation]

What pictures are these, I'm not seeing any.

They are probably referring to the ones from when they all went to the Hemisfair Park tour together a few days ago.

https://twitter.com/hemisfair/status/1438643390665609217?s=19

[FvckMavs]

They are probably referring to the ones from when they all went to the Hemisfair Park tour together a few days ago.

https://twitter.com/hemisfair/status/1438643390665609217?s=19

I'm curious why Manu was there with them? Was it related to his HOF nomination or is he back to be a coach?

[Ice009]

They are probably referring to the ones from when they all went to the Hemisfair Park tour together a few days ago.

https://twitter.com/hemisfair/status/1438643390665609217?s=19

Thanks. Interesting. I like that group of players (especially seeing Manu there too).

Like the person above me mentioned, I wonder what he's doing there (new star recruit perhaps ;) ). I wonder if they've been able to get him to do some coaching?

[John B]

Thanks. Interesting. I like that group of players (especially seeing Manu there too).

Like the person above me mentioned, I wonder what he's doing there (new star recruit perhaps ;) ). I wonder if they've been able to get him to do some coaching?

I would love Manu to be a coach.

But not seeing some of the new players here (and old) promoting, could be an indication of who else would be moved before the opening season, perhaps? :lol

[SAGirl]

I am not exactly sure which ones is Zollins from that group, however it was good news not to see anyone in a walking boot or a scooter. Bodes well for Zollins if he was walking around town normally already.

[Rocalcio]

I would love Manu to be a coach.

But not seeing some of the new players here (and old) promoting, could be an indication of who else would be moved before the opening season, perhaps? :lol

I’m not sure about that but I remember having read somewhere that he wasn’t interested in coaching.

[Dejounte]

CUB9UDFsm1X

[tonight...you]

CUB9UDFsm1X
Primo's base looks so naturally strong.
Tree trunks.

[itzsoweezee]

CUB9UDFsm1X

Ahh, not a Bryn in sight … warms my heart

[Dejounte]

Primo's base looks so naturally strong.
Tree trunks.

especially compared to Vassell

[pad300]

especially compared to Vassell

Heck, the counter girl has bigger legs than Vassell's twigs...

[XDT76]

Ahh, not a Bryn in sight … warms my heart

Finally see a photo with Lula hanging out with the guys.

[Dverde]

No Dejounte again…hmmm

[John B]

Primo's base looks so naturally strong.
Tree trunks.

I suspect Primo is going to be another big body.

[Indianman]

Looks bigger than Luka's twiggies too.

[pookenstein]

Primo's checking wether or not he should plant his tree trunk in the girls rabbit hole.

[John B]

I’m glad to see Luka hanging out with the guys and hopefully building that camaraderie. Zollins seem enjoying himself with his new team, likewise SOB.

[John B]

All of a sudden Spurs average height seems to be at 6’6” and higher. Even Primo I suspect will be over 6’8” and could be playing some point forward/combo guard. He looks very well acclimated with the guys, and not even a bit shy with the older teammates like normal rookies would be, especially at a very young age, that’s confidence that he belongs.

[XDT76]

No Dejounte again…hmmm

Just lost his sister not too long ago let him has his time to grief.

[RC_Drunkford]

No Dejounte again…hmmm

no Keldon or Lonnie either. That must mean we trade them for Ben Simmons :dizzy:drunk:elephant

[mo7888]

Minnesota dismisses their GM...

[Ocotillo]

Minnesota dismisses their GM...

Beat me to the punch, I was coming here to make a crack about hiring Brian Wright.

[Degoat]

Just a side note if anybody is curious, spurs posted on Instagram that they had a team workout and Tre Jones dunked on Aminu in one of the clips so the spurs may at least consider keeping Aminu even tho we didn’t think they would

[ismael-robert]

Or dude just wants to work out till he hears otherwise

[Dejounte]

Just a side note if anybody is curious, spurs posted on Instagram that they had a team workout and Tre Jones dunked on Aminu in one of the clips so the spurs may at least consider keeping Aminu even tho we didn’t think they would


dude has not bothered to follow anyone else on the roster on social media. He’s probably a training camp body

[John B]

Just a side note if anybody is curious, spurs posted on Instagram that they had a team workout and Tre Jones dunked on Aminu in one of the clips so the spurs may at least consider keeping Aminu even tho we didn’t think they would

Tre is really becoming aggressive to the rim, and it’s a good sign. If DJ or Derek got traded for Simmons, Spurs would need Tre to step up.

[pookenstein]

I read this on realgm from the SF chronicle.

The Golden State Warriors are concerned about the status of Andrew Wiggins this season for home games as he continues to plan to not receive the COVID-19 vaccine.
The city of San Francisco requires full vaccination to be allowed indoors for entertainment.
Sources believe the NBA will grant Wiggins a religious exemption.
The San Francisco Department of Public Health said it would not comment on Wiggins’ specific situation unless he is granted a religious exemption from the NBA.
“We are actively addressing the matter of requests for religious exemption from vaccinations across many industries and will work with our business and entertainment community on next steps,” the San Francisco Department of Public Health said in a statement. “We will provide further clarification on this topic.”
Wiggins would forfeit more than $350,000 for each game he is forced to miss.
The Warriors recently connected Wiggins with an Oakland doctor who understands issues surrounding vaccine hesitancy. Wiggins remains unmoved in his decision against vaccination.

Rusty Simmons/San Francisco Chronicle (https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/warriors/article/Why-Warriors-have-reason-to-worry-about-Andrew-16480613.php?utm_campaign=CMS%20Sharing%20Tools%20 (Premium)&utm_source=t.co&utm_medium=referral)

If the league wouldn't grant Wiggings the religious exemption and he won't get vaxed, should we consider to try and lure the Warriors into a trade? Something like Young, Aminu and Walker for Wiggins and the Warriors 2022 FRP?
Wiggins could eat a lot of minutes at SF this year, be our go to scorer for the season with the our goal beeing to increase his trade value midseason or before the next season. He has two years remaining on his contract. Spurs would clear a couple of roster places in the process, freeing up some minutes for Primo (hopefully).

I know, it's highly unlikely, starting with the assumption, that he'll more likely than not get the religious exemtion, but what if...?

[tbdog]

I read this on realgm from the SF chronicle.


If the league wouldn't grant Wiggings the religious exemption and he won't get vaxed, should we consider to try and lure the Warriors into a trade? Something like Young, Aminu and Walker for Wiggins and the Warriors 2022 FRP?
Wiggins could eat a lot of minutes at SF this year, be our go to scorer for the season with the our goal beeing to increase his trade value midseason or before the next season. He has two years remaining on his contract. Spurs would clear a couple of roster places in the process, freeing up some minutes for Primo (hopefully).

I know, it's highly unlikely, starting with the assumption, that he'll more likely than not get the religious exemtion, but what if...?

I don't think the salaries match. And I am not sure if you want to take touches from from Murray, White, and Johnson. Wiggins doesn't exactly improve the team as the number 1 option.

Also, that's a lot of coin to give up to not get vaccinated. And what does religion got to do with the vaccine. His excuse mashes no sense.

[pookenstein]

I don't think the salaries match. And I am not sure if you want to take touches from from Murray, White, and Johnson. Wiggins doesn't exactly improve the team as the number 1 option.

Also, that's a lot of coin to give up to not get vaccinated. And what does religion got to do with the vaccine. His excuse mashes no sense.

The numbers would work. He makes 31.8M, the three mentioned Spurs make 28.8M. Multiply that by125% and the Spurs could take 36M back. It would even work if they would include KBD type salary instead of LWIV.
Also it wouldn't be about improving the team this season with how Wiggings plays, but getting an additional pick for taking him off their hands and maybe even flip his contract midseason or before the 23 season for more assets.
Also I don't know if San Antonio has the same rules for non vaxed people for inside entertainment as SF has, but I doubt it. So in San Antonio he would't loose nearly as much as he would staying with the Warriors. Max two games in SF instead of 42.

[Chinook]

Nah. That trade is doodoo, and Wiggins not getting the shot is still a problem in SA, even if it's a smaller deal than in SF.

[Seventyniner]

The only reason for the Spurs to have ever taken on Wiggins's salary was to have significant assets attached. Now that the Spurs have blown their cap space I don't see a Wiggins trade that makes sense for both sides.

I wouldn't want the founding member of the Church of Wiggins Doesn't Want the Vax on the team either.

[Spursfanfromafar]

What kind of moron denies the need for a vaccine during a pandemic? Sometimes the stupidity in even the first world countries astound me!

[LCM]

Ask a Jehovah's Witness why they say it's against their religious beliefs to get a simple blood transfusion?

You don't know, but according to our Constitution a person's religious beliefs should be respected, and protected, ESPECIALLY if you don't agree with it. Or does "my body my choice" only get compartmentalized if your talking abortion, for example.

If someone doesn't want the vaccine, they shouldn't be forced by society, the government, nor should they be under threat of loosing their job. There is plenty of data that shows people who have been vaxed getting COVID anyway. So what is the bottom line? You get a gold star and a pat on the head by a government bureaucrat? I'll pass ...

[pookenstein]

Nah. That trade is doodoo, and Wiggins not getting the shot is still a problem in SA, even if it's a smaller deal than in SF.

Why is that? You think the Spurs would get too little for Young+Aminu and LWIV (or another filler like KBD)? What would it take for you to consider a deal like that. Additional first or a couple of seconds?

[buttsR4rebounding]

Ask a Jehovah's Witness why they say it's against their religious beliefs to get a simple blood transfusion?

You don't know, but according to our Constitution a person's religious beliefs should be respected, and protected, ESPECIALLY if you don't agree with it. Or does "my body my choice" only get compartmentalized if your talking abortion, for example.

If someone doesn't want the vaccine, they shouldn't be forced by society, the government, nor should they be under threat of loosing their job. There is plenty of data that shows people who have been vaxed getting COVID anyway. So what is the bottom line? You get a gold star and a pat on the head by a government bureaucrat? I'll pass ...

The Unvaccinated are the new Minority to shit on in this country. Even though I have been vaccinated and believe that there is plenty of evidence that you should, I am astounded by the downright UnAmerican behavior that is accepted in the name of the pandemic.

[Mr. Body]

Ask a Jehovah's Witness why they say it's against their religious beliefs to get a simple blood transfusion?

You don't know, but according to our Constitution a person's religious beliefs should be respected, and protected, ESPECIALLY if you don't agree with it. Or does "my body my choice" only get compartmentalized if your talking abortion, for example.

If someone doesn't want the vaccine, they shouldn't be forced by society, the government, nor should they be under threat of loosing their job. There is plenty of data that shows people who have been vaxed getting COVID anyway. So what is the bottom line? You get a gold star and a pat on the head by a government bureaucrat? I'll pass ...

You cannot put other people's lives wilfully in danger. You can't drink and drive. That's not right. Going unvaxxed when all you have is some dumbass belief in God or whatever the fuck isn't being just or responsible to others around you. It's just selfish and destructive.

[itzsoweezee]

The Unvaccinated are the new Minority to shit on in this country. Even though I have been vaccinated and believe that there is plenty of evidence that you should, I am astounded by the downright UnAmerican behavior that is accepted in the name of the pandemic.

Nothing unamerican about it. Vaccine mandates have been part of the USA for over 100 years. Get over it.

[itzsoweezee]

Ask a Jehovah's Witness why they say it's against their religious beliefs to get a simple blood transfusion?

You don't know, but according to our Constitution a person's religious beliefs should be respected, and protected, ESPECIALLY if you don't agree with it. Or does "my body my choice" only get compartmentalized if your talking abortion, for example.

If someone doesn't want the vaccine, they shouldn't be forced by society, the government, nor should they be under threat of loosing their job. There is plenty of data that shows people who have been vaxed getting COVID anyway. So what is the bottom line? You get a gold star and a pat on the head by a government bureaucrat? I'll pass ...

So much nonsense in this post. Antivaxxers continue to demonstrate they have little knowledge about anything, particularly vaccines

[John B]

Ask a Jehovah's Witness why they say it's against their religious beliefs to get a simple blood transfusion?

You don't know, but according to our Constitution a person's religious beliefs should be respected, and protected, ESPECIALLY if you don't agree with it. Or does "my body my choice" only get compartmentalized if your talking abortion, for example.

If someone doesn't want the vaccine, they shouldn't be forced by society, the government, nor should they be under threat of loosing their job. There is plenty of data that shows people who have been vaxed getting COVID anyway. So what is the bottom line? You get a gold star and a pat on the head by a government bureaucrat? I'll pass ...

Your rights stop where other people’s rights begin. If you don’t want to get vaccinated, sure but don’t go socializing without mask and endangering others. Moreover, don’t go running to the ER and ICU’s when you contracted COVID because of your own stubborness, and deny beds from cancer, elderly, and other patients who deserve them more.

[Manu&Duncan fan]

Your rights stop where other people’s rights begin. If you don’t want to get vaccinated, sure but don’t go socializing without mask and endangering others. Moreover, don’t go running to the ER and ICU’s when you contracted COVID because of your own stubborness, and deny beds from cancer, elderly, and other patients who deserve them more.

Very well said!

[buttsR4rebounding]

So much nonsense in this post. Antivaxxers continue to demonstrate they have little knowledge about anything, particularly vaccines

Of course, none of the injections meet the legal definition of a vaccine. When you start changing the actual meaning of words to advance your agenda people become rightfully suspicious.

[offset formation]

Of course, none of the injections meet the legal definition of a vaccine. When you start changing the actual meaning of words to advance your agenda people become rightfully suspicious.

lmao. do tell. I never knew there was a "legal" definition of a vaccine. it's a fucking vaccine.

[buttsR4rebounding]

lmao. do tell. I never knew there was a "legal" definition of a vaccine. it's a fucking vaccine.

Your ignorance is obvious.

[offset formation]

Your ignorance is obvious.

then take a stab at educating me, bruv.

[buttsR4rebounding]

then take a stab at educating me, bruv.

PM me and I will send you some links.

[cd98]

The government shouldn't have the right to force you to get vaccinated. But they should have the right to regulate things like flying on airplanes and require vaccinations to get on a plane. And state and local governments should also have the right to require you to get vaccinated for any job where you pose a risk to others. Public schools require all kinds of vaccinations and so if you don't want your kid to be vaccinated, you have to home school him. There are options, but not believing in vaccinations doesn't give you the right to expose other people to a virus by refusing to get vaccinated. And while people do get COVID even after getting vaccinated, the cases are significantly less dangerous and help avoid hospitalization and death for the most vulnerable to COVID. But if someone wants to take the chance of dying, they should have the right to do that by refusing a vaccine. But there rights don't give them the right to pose a risk to other people. So they have to live with some regulations that will limit what they can do when they are around others.

Should an individual employer be allowed to fire an employee for not getting vaccinated? I would assume so for most people because most people are at-will employees, which means they can pretty much be fired for just about anything. Most people are not avoiding the vaccine for legitimate religious reasons, so I don't think that it violates civil rights. And for the same reason, I don't think the government violates the constitution by requiring vaccinations or constant testing for those that do not want vaccinations.

[Robz4000]

PM me and I will send you some links.

https://scontent-dfw5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/242011926_5121407497880220_6640756277021459787_n.j pg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_rgb565=1&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8024bb&efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&_nc_ohc=AZajYoUPfuYAX9qlODE&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-1.xx&oh=0aaadde4152608ecc2490f60369f69b4&oe=61746659

[Robz4000]

:lol it gets me that five years ago the vast majority of people didn't give a shit about vaccinations to attend school or go over seas but now suddenly they're against them. Hell, these same people made fun of those who did for being crazy liberals.

[itzsoweezee]

Of course, none of the injections meet the legal definition of a vaccine. When you start changing the actual meaning of words to advance your agenda people become rightfully suspicious.

What you wrote is nonsense. You have no clue what you are talking about.

[Fusternino]

:lol it gets me that five years ago the vast majority of people didn't give a shit about vaccinations to attend school or go over seas but now suddenly they're against them. Hell, these same people made fun of those who did for being crazy liberals.

Yeah, anti-vaxxers used to be more evenly split between the left-right camps.

Also, indoor athletics is dangerous for COVID as particles are going much further than 6 feet. This is why at beginning the gyms had to shut down.

Really shameful stuff going on. I think there's still a small group of people who haven't gotten their shots and could be convinced to so I'm fine with a "gentle" approach for now. But to those intentionally spreading misinformation . . . wow. We are a society, and better for it.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

There is plenty of data that shows people who have been vaxed getting COVID anyway. So what is the bottom line?

Bottom line is it's shameful that after a 2 year global pandemic people still don't understand how vaccines work, yet they have strong opinions anyway.

[tbdog]

The issue was that the vaccines were rushed, because they had to be. New research came out that one of the vaccine reduved fertility in females. We are now vaccinate young girls without their permission. Overall, we need to vaccinate. But let's not pretend there's no issues by mandating it.

[UnWantedTheory]

The government shouldn't have the right to force you to get vaccinated. But they should have the right to regulate things like flying on airplanes and require vaccinations to get on a plane. And state and local governments should also have the right to require you to get vaccinated for any job where you pose a risk to others. Public schools require all kinds of vaccinations and so if you don't want your kid to be vaccinated, you have to home school him. There are options, but not believing in vaccinations doesn't give you the right to expose other people to a virus by refusing to get vaccinated. And while people do get COVID even after getting vaccinated, the cases are significantly less dangerous and help avoid hospitalization and death for the most vulnerable to COVID. But if someone wants to take the chance of dying, they should have the right to do that by refusing a vaccine. But there rights don't give them the right to pose a risk to other people. So they have to live with some regulations that will limit what they can do when they are around others.

Should an individual employer be allowed to fire an employee for not getting vaccinated? I would assume so for most people because most people are at-will employees, which means they can pretty much be fired for just about anything. Most people are not avoiding the vaccine for legitimate religious reasons, so I don't think that it violates civil rights. And for the same reason, I don't think the government violates the constitution by requiring vaccinations or constant testing for those that do not want vaccinations.

This.

[Ice009]

I haven't done much research on it, but isn't natural immunity stronger if you get Covid-19 and fight it off naturally? I thought I read/saw someone mentioned natural immunity is up to 13 times stronger.

Also, if a person chooses not to be vaccinated, what is the big issue if everyone else around him/her is vaccinated? Wouldn't the only person at risk be the person who chose not to be vaccinated? Does that person pose a risk to vaccinated people (I don't know enough about it, so that is why I'm asking). If not, and they're only potentially harming themselves, I don't see a problem if everyone else around them are vaccinated.

I also don't think it should be mandatory. What about all the issues with people having blood clots and other issues with it? What if you're perfectly fine and it screws you up? What happens if one of your family members dies from it? Are you going to be happy with that? It's a tough call as it's so new and I don't think anyone knows the long-term effects of it (hopefully there aren't any).

[CGD]

PM me and I will send you some links.

Ah, yes, the “links”

[buttsR4rebounding]

First, I have received the JnJ shot. I operate an assisted living facility and an adult daycare. Out of 127 residents and employees 125 have received one of the approved treatments. So I definitely believe the treatments have great value. My earlier point that it does not meet the legal definition of a vaccine is correct. Blacks Law defines a vaccine as a substance taken to PREVENT someone from getting a disease. You never hear about someone who received the polio vaccine getting a mild case of polio. These injections are designed to elicit a particular response from the body if you do get COVID. That’s why treated individuals can still get it and pass it. Once again IMO this is an exciting new technology that has great possibilities beyond COVID. My point earlier was that by calling it something that it is not you raise legitimate concerns that other representations may be suspect. For everyone concerned that they will catch COVID from an untreated person get a shot. Then your risks are similar for the flu. And people can have legitimate reasons for not wanting the treatment. My wife has MS. This is a disease that has long stretches of dormancy punctuated by what can be terrifying periods of activity that can even cause temporary blindness. 11 years ago her MS was triggered by a flu shot she was required to get for her job at Lackland. She had to use a Walker for a period of time. She since has not been required to have the shot with a letter from her neurologist. They are not accepting that now and she has to make a very difficult decision to risk triggering an episode or lose her job. Herd mentality rarely leads to workable, fair solutions.

[CGD]

I haven't done much research on it, but isn't natural immunity stronger if you get Covid-19 and fight it off naturally? I thought I read/saw someone mentioned natural immunity is up to 13 times stronger.

Also, if a person chooses not to be vaccinated, what is the big issue if everyone else around him/her is vaccinated? Wouldn't the only person at risk be the person who chose not to be vaccinated? Does that person pose a risk to vaccinated people (I don't know enough about it, so that is why I'm asking). If not, and they're only potentially harming themselves, I don't see a problem if everyone else around them are vaccinated.

I also don't think it should be mandatory. What about all the issues with people having blood clots and other issues with it? What if you're perfectly fine and it screws you up? What happens if one of your family members dies from it? Are you going to be happy with that? It's a tough call as it's so new and I don't think anyone knows the long-term effects of it (hopefully there aren't any).

Nah, natural immunity at best gets you 5 months but only if you had a legit bout of COVID (not one of those asymptomatic varieties). This is what my doctor told my when I had a scary bout of covid with double pneumonia in Dec 2020.

On the unvaccinated free riding on the vaccinated, man somethings never change. Those people are the same ones in high school that would join the group project, do no work, copy the groups answers, and coast to the passing grade. Amazing how some people are content never pulling their weight and relying on others to finish the group project.

I do get sensitivities for those with pre-existing conditions or religious concerns, but, let’s be honest, those are the minority of objectors here. This has become tribal.

[Mr. Body]

The issue was that the vaccines were rushed, because they had to be. New research came out that one of the vaccine reduved fertility in females. We are now vaccinate young girls without their permission. Overall, we need to vaccinate. But let's not pretend there's no issues by mandating it.

This is all horseshit. You're seriously misinformed and maybe deliberately lying.

[BacktoBasics]

:lol it gets me that five years ago the vast majority of people didn't give a shit about vaccinations to attend school or go over seas but now suddenly they're against them. Hell, these same people made fun of those who did for being crazy liberals.

Exactly. Fabricated outrage born out of politics. These people are voting machine experts, virologists, vaccine aficionados and know more about reproduction and woman’s vaginas despite rarely being allowed to touch one.

All this education and these fucking losers can’t figure out how to keep their bullshit off a basketball forum.

[XenoThirteen]

Hi. Long term lurker here. Have enjoyed the forum for years, just reading.

I’m a physician and here’s my two cents on the issue.

First of, it’s good to ask questions like these. They are valid and opens everything up for discussion, and hopefully, education.

The problem with natural immunity and COVID-19 is that there are so many variants to consider. Right now, the predominant strain appears to be the Delta variant. So if we get infected now, we will likely get that variant, and as a result, be immune to that variant and, in theory, that variant only.

This is the reason why we have to vaccinate and achieve herd immunity. The longer we don’t vaccinate as a community, the more time we give the virus to mutate, which would pose even more issues and possibly necessitate even more boosters. This is one of the reasons why the Flu is such a problem. It mutates pretty much every year, requiring us to get yearly boosters.

Our current fear right now is if we give the virus enough time to mutate further, it may evade vaccines completely, or even present differently than how it did before. Look at the Wild strain back in 2019 and the early 2020s. It used to almost exclusively affect the elderly and those with co-morbidities. The Delta is different in that it now seems to affect all age groups proportionately. Children still usually present with very mild symptoms but I have been to the pedia wards and I see infants and children intubated all the same.

It’s true that we have no sure idea how the vaccine will affect us in the long run because we simply don’t have 5, 10 years’ worth of papers and studies to show to the public proving its safety, but early studies so far have shown that the overwhelming majority of the side effects are mild and self-limiting. The technology used for the mRNA vaccines are the similar to the ones we were trying to develop back in the SARS CoV-1 days so that can explain a bit why Pfizer and Moderna were able to fast track their vaccination development.

We are pretty hopeful that there will be no long-term risks anyway as far as the vaccine is concerned, and that’s backed up anyway by the history of vaccines in general. And since the advent of the first vaccine, the benefit of protection has far outweighed the potential risk it can carry.

I just hope everyone makes the right choice in time.

Hope this helps.

[mo7888]

First, I have received the JnJ shot. I operate an assisted living facility and an adult daycare. Out of 127 residents and employees 125 have received one of the approved treatments. So I definitely believe the treatments have great value. My earlier point that it does not meet the legal definition of a vaccine is correct. Blacks Law defines a vaccine as a substance taken to PREVENT someone from getting a disease. You never hear about someone who received the polio vaccine getting a mild case of polio. These injections are designed to elicit a particular response from the body if you do get COVID. That’s why treated individuals can still get it and pass it. Once again IMO this is an exciting new technology that has great possibilities beyond COVID. My point earlier was that by calling it something that it is not you raise legitimate concerns that other representations may be suspect. For everyone concerned that they will catch COVID from an untreated person get a shot. Then your risks are similar for the flu. And people can have legitimate reasons for not wanting the treatment. My wife has MS. This is a disease that has long stretches of dormancy punctuated by what can be terrifying periods of activity that can even cause temporary blindness. 11 years ago her MS was triggered by a flu shot she was required to get for her job at Lackland. She had to use a Walker for a period of time. She since has not been required to have the shot with a letter from her neurologist. They are not accepting that now and she has to make a very difficult decision to risk triggering an episode or lose her job. Herd mentality rarely leads to workable, fair solutions.

Well said..

[Manu&Duncan fan]

XenoThirteen, Thank you so much for your input!

By the way, I'm not against those who refuse to get vaccine. Many people just don't have the correct knowledge and have unnecessary fear. That's why we need to share scientific info with folks.

[scott]

So, we gonna make some trades or what?

[BacktoBasics]

Hi. Long term lurker here. Have enjoyed the forum for years, just reading.

I’m a physician and here’s my two cents on the issue.

First of, it’s good to ask questions like these. They are valid and opens everything up for discussion, and hopefully, education.

The problem with natural immunity and COVID-19 is that there are so many variants to consider. Right now, the predominant strain appears to be the Delta variant. So if we get infected now, we will likely get that variant, and as a result, be immune to that variant and, in theory, that variant only.

This is the reason why we have to vaccinate and achieve herd immunity. The longer we don’t vaccinate as a community, the more time we give the virus to mutate, which would pose even more issues and possibly necessitate even more boosters. This is one of the reasons why the Flu is such a problem. It mutates pretty much every year, requiring us to get yearly boosters.

Our current fear right now is if we give the virus enough time to mutate further, it may evade vaccines completely, or even present differently than how it did before. Look at the Wild strain back in 2019 and the early 2020s. It used to almost exclusively affect the elderly and those with co-morbidities. The Delta is different in that it now seems to affect all age groups proportionately. Children still usually present with very mild symptoms but I have been to the pedia wards and I see infants and children intubated all the same.

It’s true that we have no sure idea how the vaccine will affect us in the long run because we simply don’t have 5, 10 years’ worth of papers and studies to show to the public proving its safety, but early studies so far have shown that the overwhelming majority of the side effects are mild and self-limiting. The technology used for the mRNA vaccines are the similar to the ones we were trying to develop back in the SARS CoV-1 days so that can explain a bit why Pfizer and Moderna were able to fast track their vaccination development.

We are pretty hopeful that there will be no long-term risks anyway as far as the vaccine is concerned, and that’s backed up anyway by the history of vaccines in general. And since the advent of the first vaccine, the benefit of protection has far outweighed the potential risk it can carry.

I just hope everyone makes the right choice in time.

Hope this helps.

This forum is no place for rational level headed common sense people like yourself. We prefer rabid mouth breathing morons who make decisions based on conspiracy sites and banned YouTube channels. Thanks anyway.

Sincerely,

ST’s Antivax Assholes

[tbdog]

This is all horseshit. You're seriously misinformed and maybe deliberately lying.


Of course it's rushed. How did they test the long time side effects of the vaccine? I'll wait.

[John B]

Can we get back to the topic? And move this to another thread?

Counting the days to Oct 1 when Sixers need to ship Simmons or pay 50% of his salary.

Is Poeltl getting shipped if we get Simmons? With the amount of players we have who can play and can open up the lane

Can we get a 1st for Young or wouldn’t the Sixers just take him as a good addition? I think DJ + Young could really help them contend.

I think next week could answe some of these questions, finally :lol

[Mr. Body]

Of course it's rushed. How did they test the long time side effects of the vaccine? I'll wait.

We already know the side effects of the fucking vaccine. It's been given billions of times. Good fucking grief.

[tbdog]

We already know the side effects of the fucking vaccine. It's been given billions of times. Good fucking grief.

We don't know the effects in 5 years or 10. And we are learning more everytime.

[pookenstein]

The NBA announced it reviewed and denied Golden State Warriors wing Andrew Wiggins' exemption request on his vaccination status. Wiggins requested a religious exemption to remain unvaccinated, but eligible to play in Warriors home games in San Francisco. The city of San Francisco requires a COVID-19 vaccination for all participants (ages 12 and older) in large indoor events.

Wiggins will be unable to play in Warriors home games until he's vaccinated. Wiggins is also unable to participate in team workouts, due to being unvaccinated. He's currently restricted to individual workouts.



If he still refuses to get the shot, the Warriors have to do something, right? Young and LWIV or Poeltl could be valuable players for them. They could cut Aminu.
Depending on how the restrictions are in San Antonio (would he be eligible play practice and play?), I would try to do the trade. Wiggings, two FRP for Young, Aminu and Poeltl/LWIV. They get two useful players, we get draft capital and a go-to scorer in Wiggins (who plays the 3) which we could feature and flip before the 22/23 season.

[tbdog]

If he still refuses to get the shot, the Warriors have to do something, right? Young and LWIV or Poeltl could be valuable players for them. They could cut Aminu.
Depending on how the restrictions are in San Antonio (would he be eligible play practice and play?), I would try to do the trade. Wiggings, two FRP for Young, Aminu and Poeltl/LWIV. They get two useful players, we get draft capital and a go-to scorer in Wiggins (who plays the 3) which we could feature and flip before the 22/23 season.

Young is worth a 1st as is. Poeltl is worth one too. Walker might be as well. And Wiggins needs a 1st just to get rid of him.

[John B]

If he still refuses to get the shot, the Warriors have to do something, right? Young and LWIV or Poeltl could be valuable players for them. They could cut Aminu.
Depending on how the restrictions are in San Antonio (would he be eligible play practice and play?), I would try to do the trade. Wiggings, two FRP for Young, Aminu and Poeltl/LWIV. They get two useful players, we get draft capital and a go-to scorer in Wiggins (who plays the 3) which we could feature and flip before the 22/23 season.

And he becomes Spurs problem? Pass

[pookenstein]

Young is worth a 1st as is. Poeltl is worth one too. Walker might be as well. And Wiggins needs a 1st just to get rid of him.

So one more FRP and you'd do that from Spurs perspective?

[pookenstein]

And he becomes Spurs problem? Pass

Just for a season. Maybe only half a season. And I don't think he'd be such a big problem. He's a scorer which we don't have many of next season. Also we don't have that many SF's. And if he's featured heavily on offense the Spurs should be able to flip his expiring contract before the next season.

[lmbebo]

We don't know the effects in 5 years or 10. And we are learning more everytime.

Can apply that logic to sooooo many things in medicine (Antiobiotics, the antiobiotic cocktails they are using for covid, etc). Never going to know 100%. Plus this vaccine that Moderna and Pfizer is built upon was already being tested waaay before covid happened. They just altered it to target the original strain of covid. Its been around, just not wildly used yet. Its how they were able to get one setup.

Medicine is a risk/reward game. The rewards from these vaccine far outweight the risks.

We don't know what will happen in 5-10 years is horrible logic. If you applied that to everything else, we'd still be living in caves and objecting to fires to warm ourselves.

[tbdog]

So one more FRP and you'd do that from Spurs perspective?

Three 1st round picks? Yes.

[Dejounte]

Thaddeus Young and his family have been looking for a place to rent in San Antonio since a couple days ago.

[Mr. Body]

We don't know the effects in 5 years or 10. And we are learning more everytime.

Ain't shit gonna happen from the vaccine, lol. You think we'll turn into monkey people or something? :lol

What will happen to evangelical dumbfucks who aren't taking the vaccine, but do survive Delta, is their bodies are gonna be so fucked up that colds and flues wil finish the job in the next few years for a lot of them.

[tbdog]

Ain't shit gonna happen from the vaccine, lol. You think we'll turn into monkey people or something? :lol

What will happen to evangelical dumbfucks who aren't taking the vaccine, but do survive Delta, is their bodies are gonna be so fucked up that colds and flues wil finish the job in the next few years for a lot of them.

That is not what I am saying at all. Stop making shit up between the lines. I said the vaccine was rushed because it had to be. We don't know the long term effects of the vaccine and learning more about it with time, ie lowering fertility on women. I then recapped and said lets not pretend mandating vaccination doesn't have its issues.

[BackHome]

Ain't shit gonna happen from the vaccine, lol. You think we'll turn into monkey people or something? :lol

What will happen to evangelical dumbfucks who aren't taking the vaccine, but do survive Delta, is their bodies are gonna be so fucked up that colds and flues wil finish the job in the next few years for a lot of them.

Your an idiot if you think it’s just evangelical that are not getting the shots - It’s a whole lot of other groups you leaving out to fit your little shitty narrative.

[BacktoBasics]

That is not what I am saying at all. Stop making shit up between the lines. I said the vaccine was rushed because it had to be. We don't know the long term effects of the vaccine and learning more about it with time, ie lowering fertility on women. I then recapped and said lets not pretend mandating vaccination doesn't have its issues.
What are your credentials? What are you educated in? What sources are you offering? Bitchute? Natural News? Tyler Durden?

This isn’t as “new” of a vaccine as you idiots think. The core of what the vaccine is built on is older than most on this forum. The foundation of this wasn’t just created in a lab a year ago. This science has been around for a long time. You don’t have anything conclusive or data driven to justify your fear mongering. TBH you’re an idiot on the internet who feeds the fire of other morons who would rather go down the rabbit hole of alt or conspiracy news sites than listen to the overwhelming and universal response from highly educated people that the vaccine is safe. Whether it be religion, politics or just plan stupidity.

You people are a threat to society and a world wide public health liability.

[mo7888]

This isn’t as “new” of a vaccine as you idiots think.

How many mRNA vaccines preceded these?

[ginobilized]

Enough with the vaccine conversation. No one come to SpursTalk for this.

[Mr. Body]

That is not what I am saying at all. Stop making shit up between the lines. I said the vaccine was rushed because it had to be. We don't know the long term effects of the vaccine and learning more about it with time, ie lowering fertility on women. I then recapped and said lets not pretend mandating vaccination doesn't have its issues.

You're just passing on bullshit. There is no lowering fertillity in women. What the fuck. You're just spouting right-wing gibberish for no fucking reason.

[Mr. Body]

Your an idiot if you think it’s just evangelical that are not getting the shots - It’s a whole lot of other groups you leaving out to fit your little shitty narrative.

Yeah, at this point the huge driver of unvaxxed are white Republicans, most of them evangelicals, i.e. the stupidest, most misguided morons on the planet. There are unfortunately other groups who are also stupid, but they're starting to pick up and come around.

But the massive problem with this country -- and not just because of the pandemic -- are the stupid Trumper types. Absolutely cretinous, awful, disgusting people who are dragging us down.

[tbdog]

What are your credentials? What are you educated in? What sources are you offering? Bitchute? Natural News? Tyler Durden?

This isn’t as “new” of a vaccine as you idiots think. The core of what the vaccine is built on is older than most on this forum. The foundation of this wasn’t just created in a lab a year ago. This science has been around for a long time. You don’t have anything conclusive or data driven to justify your fear mongering. TBH you’re an idiot on the internet who feeds the fire of other morons who would rather go down the rabbit hole of alt or conspiracy news sites than listen to the overwhelming and universal response from highly educated people that the vaccine is safe. Whether it be religion, politics or just plan stupidity.

You people are a threat to society and a world wide public health liability.

So your stance is an argument from authority. That's a shity position to hold. When I said the vaccine is rushed but it had to be, wtf does that mean to you? When I said we are learning more about the side effects, why do you conclude I'm spreading misinformation? You know that Pfizer for example is it's first of its kind?

[BacktoBasics]

How many mRNA vaccines preceded these?

If you could be bothered to read the next line it clearly states the “the core of what the vaccine is built on”. It’s been around for over 30 years. But don’t let that get in the way of bullshit narratives.


In 1990, scientists discovered that they could inject mice with mRNA and DNA to make the mouse cells create a protein. That protein production lasted for a few weeks. In 1992, mRNA coding for vasopressin (anti-diuretic hormone) was injected into rats, resolving their diabetes insipidus symptoms

[BacktoBasics]

So your stance is an argument from authority. That's a shity position to hold. When I said the vaccine is rushed but it had to be, wtf does that mean to you? When I said we are learning more about the side effects, why do you conclude I'm spreading misinformation? You know that Pfizer for example is it's first of its kind?

My conclusion isn’t that you have questions or are simply vaccine hesitate and would like more information. It’s that you people spout off as if you have intimate knowledge about the safety and development of a vaccine that you wrongly believe was rushed and massed produced with little understanding of how it can affect people long term. You use moderate to mild side effects as a means to spread dangerous fear when most other long term approved meds have far worse side effects.

Every time you fuckwits convince an easily influenced innocent person to pass on the vaccine you put their lives in danger. I’m so fucking tired of the stupidity coming from you people and your bullshit political and financial driven alt sources.

Just stop already. You don’t know what you’re taking about and the places where you get your information is using your stupidity and willingness to spread lies at the expense of everyone else.

[Dejounte]

So your stance is an argument from authority. That's a shity position to hold. When I said the vaccine is rushed but it had to be, wtf does that mean to you? When I said we are learning more about the side effects, why do you conclude I'm spreading misinformation? You know that Pfizer for example is it's first of its kind?

History tells us that severe side effects are extremely rare, and if they do occur, they usually happen within the first two months.
Learn your facts.

[tbdog]

My conclusion isn’t that you have questions or are simply vaccine hesitate and would like more information. It’s that you people spout off as if you have intimate knowledge about the safety and development of a vaccine that you wrongly believe was rushed and massed produced with little understanding of how it can affect people long term. You use moderate to mild side effects as a means to spread dangerous fear when most other long term approved meds have far worse side effects.

Every time you fuckwits convince an easily influenced innocent person to pass on the vaccine you put their lives in danger. I’m so fucking tired of the stupidity coming from you people and your bullshit political and financial driven alt sources.

Just stop already. You don’t know what you’re taking about and the places where you get your information is using your stupidity and willingness to spread lies at the expense of everyone else.

I'm vaccinated. I vaccinated early. I'm pro vaccine. I'm the parent that takes my children to get the needles. I am not in anyway against the vaccine. I am simply saying the vaccine was rushed because it had to be. Gee, what's so damn hard to agree with that?

[mo7888]

If you could be bothered to read the next line it clearly states the “the core of what the vaccine is built on”. It’s been around for over 30 years. But don’t let that get in the way of bullshit narratives.

I know how long the mRNA has been around along time but, it hasn't been injected into people as a vaccine until now. So by definition, it is new and therefore your claim that it's not is...well...bullshit...

For the record, I'm not against any of these vaccines nor am I against or want to discourage anyone who chooses to vaccinate.

[BacktoBasics]

I'm vaccinated. I vaccinated early. I'm pro vaccine. I'm the parent that takes my children to get the needles. I am not in anyway against the vaccine. I am simply saying the vaccine was rushed because it had to be. Gee, what's so damn hard to agree with that?
Good for you. I’ll walk back some of my harshness since I took your recent post for more than face value but the bullshit rhetoric is alive and well on this forum. So you gotta little blowback from that.

Saying it was rushed is at best a half truth. It’s the kinda thing someone says when they don’t really understand fast tracking a proven technology vs. simply creating something out of nothing and rushing it to market.

[BacktoBasics]

I know how long the mRNA has been around along time but, it hasn't been injected into people as a vaccine until now. So by definition, it is new and therefore your claim that it's not is...well...bullshit...

For the record, I'm not against any of these vaccines nor am I against or want to discourage anyone who chooses to vaccinate.

No. By definition that is not new. That’s spin. You’re warping the truth to fit a narrative or side point that isn’t entirely truthful. It’s semantics and not anywhere as clear cut as “by definition”. I’ll agree there’s a small amount of interpretation but you’re presenting this as if it’s 2+2 = new and that’s not being completely honest.

[mo7888]

I'm vaccinated. I vaccinated early. I'm pro vaccine. I'm the parent that takes my children to get the needles. I am not in anyway against the vaccine. I am simply saying the vaccine was rushed because it had to be. Gee, what's so damn hard to agree with that?

I wouldn't worry about it...it's just a form of tribalism we are experiencing in this country right now....everybody swears allegiance to their own tribe and they put everyone who doesn't share the same group think in an opposing tribe... they have no nuance in their thinking.... to them simply 'entertaining' lines of thought that don't agree with their tribe is akin to attacking their own.... it's madness...

We should get back to basketball and drop this because there's no having a discussion like this with those who refuse to entertain critical thoughts...ideas...or data...

[mo7888]

No. By definition that is not new. That’s spin. You’re warping the truth to fit a narrative or side point that isn’t entirely truthful. It’s semantics and not anywhere as clear cut as “by definition”. I’ll agree there’s a small amount of interpretation but you’re presenting this as if it’s 2+2 = new and that’s not being completely honest.

The technology isn't new.... but it has never been used as a vaccine on humans.... that make it 'new' in this form... that's not spin.

[mo7888]

Yeah, at this point the huge driver of unvaxxed are white Republicans, most of them evangelicals, i.e. the stupidest, most misguided morons on the planet. There are unfortunately other groups who are also stupid, but they're starting to pick up and come around.

But the massive problem with this country -- and not just because of the pandemic -- are the stupid Trumper types. Absolutely cretinous, awful, disgusting people who are dragging us down.

Only 28 percent of Black New Yorkers ages 18 to 44 are fully vaccinate

I'll just drop this here for no particular reason...

[Degoat]

For some reason when I got the vaccine, I had this weird urge to vote Democrat and buy a Biden hat lmao can we go back to talking Spurs basketball? Lol

[offset formation]

The technology isn't new.... but it has never been used as a vaccine on humans.... that make it 'new' in this form... that's not spin.

there's a j&j vaccine which uses the older chicken egg technology that practically every shot you've ever had derives. Stop acting like you're being forced to take the mRNA variety. You guys, whether fully anti-vaxxer or not, are having the same effect by simply stirring doubt about safety, effectiveness, govt intent, etc. And it's idiocy during a pandemic.

[mo7888]

there's a j&j vaccine which uses the older chicken egg technology that practically every shot you've ever had derives. Stop acting like you're being forced to take the mRNA variety. You guys, whether fully anti-vaxxer or not, are having the same effect by simply stirring doubt about safety, effectiveness, govt intent, etc. And it's idiocy during a pandemic.

I'm not being forced to take anything (in my situation I sat down with my doctor and asked his advice and followed it)... and all I'm saying is that I can understand individuals who are hesitant to take a vaccine that is new... there are plenty of reason for people to take the vaccine and there are legitimate reason for some people to avoid it. I'm not going to succumb to this either 'everyone has to take this or nobody should take it' BS.... there are more than two camps or schools of thought and more data pours in daily.... it's fluid.

[dbestpro]

Yeah, at this point the huge driver of unvaxxed are white Republicans, most of them evangelicals, i.e. the stupidest, most misguided morons on the planet. There are unfortunately other groups who are also stupid, but they're starting to pick up and come around.

But the massive problem with this country -- and not just because of the pandemic -- are the stupid Trumper types. Absolutely cretinous, awful, disgusting people who are dragging us down.

Your racism is showing.

[BacktoBasics]

Only 28 percent of Black New Yorkers ages 18 to 44 are fully vaccinate

I'll just drop this here for no particular reason...

No, there’s a reason. It’s race baiting and a misrepresentation of reality. That same demographic isn’t funding alt news sites and leading the antivax charge through social media. They’re a byproduct of the real problem and that’s generally fringe conservatives who erroneously cried about stolen elections and disseminate lies and conspiracies.

[BacktoBasics]

Your racism is showing.

Trump danglers are a race now? Typical self aggrandizing take from that crowd. That group loves to muse about genocide but can’t comprehend the irony in what they’re doing to this country and the world around them. After all they’re the center of the universe and cancel culture is a threat to their white supremacy.

[mo7888]

No, there’s a reason. It’s race baiting and a misrepresentation of reality. That same demographic isn’t funding alt news sites and leading the antivax charge through social media. They’re a byproduct of the real problem and that’s generally fringe conservatives who erroneously cried about stolen elections and disseminate lies and conspiracies.

So, fringe conservatives who erroneously cry about stolen elections and disseminate lies contribute to these Black New Yorkers refusing vaccination? You might want to rethink that hypothesis...

[BacktoBasics]

So, fringe conservatives who erroneously cry about stolen elections and disseminate lies contribute to these Black New Yorkers refusing vaccination? You might want to rethink that hypothesis...

Nope. You clearly didn’t understand what I said. They’re not the ones pushing the antivax agenda they’re collateral damage because of it.

Same way they’re not the ones causing bad cops to beat the shit out of minorities. They’re collateral damage because of a larger unaddressed problem.

But look, if you’re gonna race bait then don’t expect us to buy into those bullshit lines like “I’m just gonna say this for no reason” garbage you tried to pull. You’re saying it because you’re a dumb fuck who thinks he’s way smarter than he is or you’re the racist. Either way you’re wrong and can’t see the forest from the trees if you think low vaccination rates amongst blacks is the problem. I’m sure other antivax red hats will gobble that shit up but anyone worth an ounce of intelligence knows how fucking ridiculous that assertion is.

Some of you are so dumb you think other people are actually dumber than you.

[ismael-robert]

Yeah they been testing mrna long time n still couldn't stop it from creating clots n enlarged hearts n whatever those videos are of people with seizures, paralyzed or dead so yeah rushed

[UnWantedTheory]

How many mRNA vaccines preceded these?
If my memory serves, mRNA vaccines have been tested in humans and were in different phases for Rabies, Influenza, Zika, & Cytomegalovirus. As was previously mentioned this has been worked on for decades.

[UnWantedTheory]

Yeah they been testing mrna long time n still couldn't stop it from creating clots n enlarged hearts n whatever those videos are of people with seizures, paralyzed or dead so yeah rushed
Even if what you said is true, there isn't a vaccine created that doesn't carry some risk of side effects. The benefits outweigh the potential risks though. Also, to say this was rushed is simply untrue in the way you mean it. Again, this tech has been worked on for decades.

[ragas]

It's time to start playing basketball again. I've nothing more to say.

[The Truth #6]

I think people should get the vaccine. But after years of a poor education system, government lies, a celebration of charlatans, and an openly corrupt political system, I try to empathize with people who have been misled. The chickens have come home to roost. Like for the black community, I’m going to guess that the distrust is founded on so many other factors (Tuskegee Experiments!) and not just the Trump crowd.

Now, having said that, at what time today do we trade for Ben Simmons?

[mo7888]

Nope. You clearly didn’t understand what I said. They’re not the ones pushing the antivax agenda they’re collateral damage because of it.

Same way they’re not the ones causing bad cops to beat the shit out of minorities. They’re collateral damage because of a larger unaddressed problem.

But look, if you’re gonna race bait then don’t expect us to buy into those bullshit lines like “I’m just gonna say this for no reason” garbage you tried to pull. You’re saying it because you’re a dumb fuck who thinks he’s way smarter than he is or you’re the racist. Either way you’re wrong and can’t see the forest from the trees if you think low vaccination rates amongst blacks is the problem. I’m sure other antivax red hats will gobble that shit up but anyone worth an ounce of intelligence knows how fucking ridiculous that assertion is.

Some of you are so dumb you think other people are actually dumber than you.

What I said wasn't race baiting...what I said was in response to the guy who said only white evangelicals were refusing to vax.... I was pointing out that he was wrong . I know a pathetic moron like yourself probably couldn't discern that. So slink on back to your tribe and pledge allegiance to the authorities that be and avoid the data out there that makes you uncomfortable and snuggle up to the data that makes you feel better. Be a fucking sheep...what do I care dumbass...

[mo7888]

If my memory serves, mRNA vaccines have been tested in humans and were in different phases for Rabies, Influenza, Zika, & Cytomegalovirus. As was previously mentioned this has been worked on for decades.

They've never been used in practice until now. Now, that doesn't make them bad, or flawed or anything like that....again I am not against anyone taking them if they choose.. I'm just saying it is understandable why some people are hesitant and want to see what happens to others before they decide they want to take it.

[BacktoBasics]

What I said wasn't race baiting...what I said was in response to the guy who said only white evangelicals were refusing to vax.... I was pointing out that he was wrong . I know a pathetic moron like yourself probably couldn't discern that. So slink on back to your tribe and pledge allegiance to the authorities that be and avoid the data out there that makes you uncomfortable and snuggle up to the data that makes you feel better. Be a fucking sheep...what do I care dumbass...
You’re not offering any real data for starters. Then you’re not willing to understand what drives the data. That’s not a victory. It’s your ignorance.

But how about this. You shut the fuck up and let this place get back to basketball.

[BacktoBasics]

They've never been used in practice until now. Now, that doesn't make them bad, or flawed or anything like that....again I am not against anyone taking them if they choose.. I'm just saying it is understandable why some people are hesitant and want to see what happens to others before they decide they want to take it.

This is like people saying wegovy has never been used in practice for weight loss. Because it’s a diabetes med that has recently been cross applied for something else. The shit you spew is misleading and ignores the big picture.

You have a profound inability to understand how things are built.

Can you image if we listened to people like you when it came to cross development? Don’t put that steam engine in a car or boat. It’s not safe smh

[mo7888]

You’re not offering any real data for starters. Then you’re not willing to understand what drives the data. That’s not a victory. It’s your ignorance.

But how about this. You shut the fuck up and let this place get back to basketball.

Offering data for what you simplistic fuck. .. I'm not pro or anti vax...I'm not in a pathetic tribe like you are.... I'm not trying to convince you of anything....so how about this...stop sniffing on my cock and go back to your cuckold boyfriend....

The only thing we are agreeing on is 'going back to basketball' which I politely suggested before you started in on me..

[mo7888]

This is like people saying wegovy has never been used in practice for weight loss. Because it’s a diabetes med that has recently been cross applied for something else. The shit you spew is misleading and ignores the big picture.

You have a profound inability to understand how things are built.

Can you image if we listened to people like you when it came to cross development? Don’t put that steam engine in a car or boat. It’s not safe smh

You're an idiot...you didn't even comprehend the point I was making.... you can't see it because you have no ability to process any nuance...you project what you suppose my position is based on your bias....so fuck off bitch

[tonight...you]

Lol. I like the slap fighting going on now.

[cd98]

What's funny is that nobody is convincing anyone that disagrees with them. This is just an insult fest with no real purpose other than arguing about vaccines because there hasn't been a Spurs move in months to complain about. Oh well, training camp will start soon and this tired, endless, and unresolvable debate will end soon.

[dbestpro]

Trump danglers are a race now? Typical self aggrandizing take from that crowd. That group loves to muse about genocide but can’t comprehend the irony in what they’re doing to this country and the world around them. After all they’re the center of the universe and cancel culture is a threat to their white supremacy.

Stop feeling sorry for yourself and go make the world a better place. This happens through the good you do, not the bad you perceive others to do.

[Mr. Body]

What's funny is that nobody is convincing anyone that disagrees with them. This is just an insult fest with no real purpose other than arguing about vaccines because there hasn't been a Spurs move in months to complain about. Oh well, training camp will start soon and this tired, endless, and unresolvable debate will end soon.

At this point, the idiots who believe Jesus is sticking his hand up their assholes and controlling everything they do, and who would tongue-bathe Donald Trump's crusty taint at a moment's notice, are beyond help. They are some of the stupidest, most misguided dumbfucks we've ever seen on this planet. Reading accounts of them dying, over and over, and picking up lasting health problems that will likely knock them off in the next few years, is astonishing.

So at this point, no, nobod's getting convinced. Trumper morons have to learn on their own -- they are too braindead to know any different. At this piont it's just the rest of us blowing off steam because of these meat anchors dragging us down.

[BacktoBasics]

You're an idiot...you didn't even comprehend the point I was making.... you can't see it because you have no ability to process any nuance...you project what you suppose my position is based on your bias....so fuck off bitch
Nuance? From a guy who tried to race bait by suggesting that black people are the problem with vaccination rates. You presented that concept as a clear cut black and white statistic with no regard for causation or any nuance surrounding it.

In the last few posts you’ve completely failed to further your stance or support your assertions.

Tribalism huh?

I’ve been a voting conservative for 20 years. That argument holds no weight with me. It’s just another meaningless claim to cover for your lack of a real argument.

So how about you remove me from the equation and attempt again to make your point with supporting evidence. You don’t really seem to have much direction here.

[BacktoBasics]

At this point, the idiots who believe Jesus is sticking his hand up their assholes and controlling everything they do, and who would tongue-bathe Donald Trump's crusty taint at a moment's notice, are beyond help. They are some of the stupidest, most misguided dumbfucks we've ever seen on this planet. Reading accounts of them dying, over and over, and picking up lasting health problems that will likely knock them off in the next few years, is astonishing.

So at this point, no, nobod's getting convinced. Trumper morons have to learn on their own -- they are too braindead to know any different. At this piont it's just the rest of us blowing off steam because of these meat anchors dragging us down.
They learn when they get their wish and meet the imaginary man in the sky after a short battle with Covid. Some after begging for the vaccine long after it can help them.

[BacktoBasics]

Stop feeling sorry for yourself and go make the world a better place. This happens through the good you do, not the bad you perceive others to do.

I put a great deal of money and time into my community. I also employee a few dozen people. It might be helpful if you had anything beyond empty claims.

I noticed you had no actual counter point.

[mo7888]

Nuance? From a guy who tried to race bait by suggesting that black people are the problem with vaccination rates. You presented that concept as a clear cut black and white statistic with no regard for causation or any nuance surrounding it.

In the last few posts you’ve completely failed to further your stance or support your assertions.

Tribalism huh?

I’ve been a voting conservative for 20 years. That argument holds no weight with me. It’s just another meaningless claim to cover for your lack of a real argument.

So how about you remove me from the equation and attempt again to make your point with supporting evidence. You don’t really seem to have much direction here.

You don't even know what stance I'm trying to support. You have no clue...you're not intelligent nor nuanced enough to even get to that point.

I never suggested blacks are a problem with vaccination rates. That's a figment of your imagination based on your tribalustic view.

As for your last paragraph, the ONLY point I've tried to make was that a poster who said 'evangelical whites' were the only ones not getting vaxed was wrong....all the other BS is simply things you want to see...or positions you want me yo hold to make you feel better due to your own lack of reading comprehension skills.

[BacktoBasics]

You don't even know what stance I'm trying to support. You have no clue...you're not intelligent nor nuanced enough to even get to that point.

I never suggested blacks are a problem with vaccination rates. That's a figment of your imagination based on your tribalustic view.

As for your last paragraph, the ONLY point I've tried to make was that a poster who said 'evangelical whites' were the only ones not getting vaxed was wrong....all the other BS is simply things you want to see...or positions you want me yo hold to make you feel better due to your own lack of reading comprehension skills.

So we agree that you’ve yet to make a solid point about anything. Thanks for confirming that.

[mo7888]

So we agree that you’ve yet to make a solid point about anything. Thanks for confirming that.

We apparently agree that reading compression isn't your strong suit.... we should agree that you're an idiot...and apparently I am as well for continuing this discussion with an idiot......but I'm about to wise up...

[BacktoBasics]

We apparently agree that reading compression isn't your strong suit.... we should agree that you're an idiot...and apparently I am as well for continuing this discussion with an idiot..

Still waiting for data? Stats? A point?

You mouthed off, couldn’t support your assertion then back pedaled outta here. Good work.

[tbdog]

https://youtu.be/1oyKVAjISmI

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/ChrisKirschner/status/1442531972765552649?s=20

[CGD]

https://twitter.com/ChrisKirschner/status/1442531972765552649?s=20

Ha, that feels like ages ago.

[dbestpro]

I put a great deal of money and time into my community. I also employee a few dozen people. It might be helpful if you had anything beyond empty claims.

I noticed you had no actual counter point.

The counter point remains the misguided fault you find in others which more often than not is a reflection of your failures. As long as you find fault in others you are nothing more than a dog barking at a mirror.

[pookenstein]

Andrew Wiggins confirmed during media day on Monday that he will not receive the COVID-19 vaccine and will forgo $8.9 million for the 41 regular season home games the Golden State Warriors play this season. The city of San Francisco currently has a vaccine mandate that prohibits players from the Warriors in playing in home games.
"I'm confident in my beliefs and what I think is right and what I think is wrong," said Wiggins.
Wiggins said his "back [is] against the wall" and that he plans to stick with his beliefs.

The Spurs should really (at least try to) get into negotiations with Golden State and assemble some assets by helping them out. We don't need Young and Aminu and we could do without either one of Poeltl or LWIV. Package one of the two with the other two and get some draft picks and Wiggins.
But that's probably not happening under Pop.

[John B]

The Spurs should really (at least try to) get into negotiations with Golden State and assemble some assets by helping them out. We don't need Young and Aminu and we could do without either one of Poeltl or LWIV. Package one of the two with the other two and get some draft picks and Wiggins.
But that's probably not happening under Pop.

Why would you want their problem to be Spurs’? The guy will not get his vaccine, which will limit his playing games. Who knows which other teams also has the same mandates. Besides he’s a big liability to get also infected, God forbid, and spread to other players and/or personnels.

[pookenstein]

Does San Antonio/Texas have the same restrictions as Cali has? If not, the games he'd have to sit out would be drastically reduced. Spurs would gain draft capital, maybe flip Wiggings midseason or before the 22-23 season for even more. If San Antonio/Texas doesn't have strict rules (Vax mandates, masks, etc.) everybody on the team and staff are at a high risk of getting infected just by living their normal lives. Like getting infected while partying in Austin for example. But with Wiggings the odds would be even higher, I give you that.
But seeing just the sports side, I would try to get something like that done.

[UnWantedTheory]

They've never been used in practice until now. Now, that doesn't make them bad, or flawed or anything like that....again I am not against anyone taking them if they choose.. I'm just saying it is understandable why some people are hesitant and want to see what happens to others before they decide they want to take it.
I understand what you are saying, and I am not trying to be a dick, but I simply find those people ridiculous. Then again, I have been told I lack empathy. It's just decades of research and actual human testing should be enough to quell most fears on the matter. Then there is the fact over 6 billion doses have been administered and we are nearing a year. I should be more understanding though, with social media conspiracies and political tribalism, it really isn't all that surprising we are where we are. Anywho, I agree the talk should turn back to ball. Peace.

[spurs1990]

Still waiting for data? Stats? A point?

You mouthed off, couldn’t support your assertion then back pedaled outta here. Good work.

The NYC stats were also mentioned in this 8/12 NY Times article.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/12/nyregion/covid-vaccine-black-young-new-yorkers.html

Evidently the underpinning is a distrust of government based on the articles interviewing of "some" residents, with a myriad of explanations set forth.

Locally, this is from the left leaning Texas Tribune out of Austin.
https://www.texastribune.org/2021/08/20/dan-patrick-black-democrats-vaccine-white-republicans/

Blacks have the lowest shot rate in Texas at 32.9, whites at 42.9, Spanish at 41 and far easterners at 60%.

I think the message mo7888 is presenting is to not frame Corona shot rates as right wing conservatives comprising the vast sum of holdouts. It's across the board in political demographic terms based on this month old TT article. ...The Times article explains a possibility of misgivings among the NYC group, yet truly if the intent is to safeguard health then dismissing (sanctioning?) non-compliance of any sort doesn't jibe (my thinking). RE: June 2020.

Regardless, irrespective, and Irregardless to all of that, Wiggins, Irving, heck even James may not have gotten the shot. Of issues from which you can cut a clear partisan slice, Coronavirus shots has a mold of soggy noodles. Gleaning off of what these periodicals are presenting, tbh.

[CGD]

The Spurs should really (at least try to) get into negotiations with Golden State and assemble some assets by helping them out. We don't need Young and Aminu and we could do without either one of Poeltl or LWIV. Package one of the two with the other two and get some draft picks and Wiggins.
But that's probably not happening under Pop.

Damn, could you imagine having so much money that you’re like “nah, I’m cool, keep your 8M, I don’t want a little booboo on my arm for 3 days.”

[BacktoBasics]

The NYC stats were also mentioned in this 8/12 NY Times article.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/12/nyregion/covid-vaccine-black-young-new-yorkers.html

Evidently the underpinning is a distrust of government based on the articles interviewing of "some" residents, with a myriad of explanations set forth.

Locally, this is from the left leaning Texas Tribune out of Austin.
https://www.texastribune.org/2021/08/20/dan-patrick-black-democrats-vaccine-white-republicans/

Blacks have the lowest shot rate in Texas at 32.9, whites at 42.9, Spanish at 41 and far easterners at 60%.

I think the message mo7888 is presenting is to not frame Corona shot rates as right wing conservatives comprising the vast sum of holdouts. It's across the board in political demographic terms based on this month old TT article. ...The Times article explains a possibility of misgivings among the NYC group, yet truly if the intent is to safeguard health then dismissing (sanctioning?) non-compliance of any sort doesn't jibe (my thinking). RE: June 2020.

Regardless, irrespective, and Irregardless to all of that, Wiggins, Irving, heck even James may not have gotten the shot. Of issues from which you can cut a clear partisan slice, Coronavirus shots has a mold of soggy noodles. Gleaning off of what these periodicals are presenting, tbh.
The large majority of those who aren't vaccinating are doing so as a result of the storm of misinformation, misleading articles and general lies that originate from one general group.

Those same people who are passing on this vaccine are largely vaccinated for all the regular stuff like polio, measles, chicken pox etc. There decisions aren't rooted in a long standing belief of being vaccine hesitant. Those new revelations were born out of the alt news campaign that has been created within just a few small circles. IE bitchute, natural news and the 50-60 alt news sites that are all owned and run by the same company with the same circle of contributors back linking each other. Some of those sites pivoted overnight from election expertise to viral expertise all because that's what's selling to their base.

Until the data addresses causation then its really a moot point. We have yet to see a stat or data set that suggests unvaccinated black people or minorities in general have long held those beliefs. You know, because its not true.

[pookenstein]

Damn, could you imagine having so much money that you’re like “nah, I’m cool, keep your 8M, I don’t want a little booboo on my arm for 3 days.”

Unreal...

[spurs1990]

Everyone's favorite iconoclast, FSU legend, and God willing future San Antonio Spur signee, Jonathan Livingston Isaac, gave remarkable background on his vacine opinion along with general commentary that's worth a full listen.

***Clips of this Q&A are trending on Twitter if you want just the prominent soundbites.


https://youtu.be/gteFcUlxjyY

[BackHome]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? So with the Delta variant it has shown it does not stop you from getting Covid but it does STOP you from dying. So it’s like a Flu shot and like the Flu which is always mutating different shots will have to be created every year.

Also since only a very small percentage of the world has been given the shot we are seeing a variety of Mutations that appear I wonder how long or the likely hood that a more dangerous variant appears? And since this is not a disease created by nature ie. Created in Wuhan Covid lab to be able to make the human to human transfer what variants were created in lab and are more serious ones yet to come?

So unfortunately since no one has created a True Vaccine we still will be wearing masks and dealing with the Flu/COVID shots every year

[Fusternino]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? So with the Delta variant it has shown it does not stop you from getting Covid but it does STOP you from dying. So it’s like a Flu shot and like the Flu which is always mutating different shots will have to be created every year.

Also since only a very small percentage of the world has been given the shot we are seeing a variety of Mutations that appear I wonder how long or the likely hood that a more dangerous variant appears? And since this is not a disease created by nature ie. Created in Wuhan Covid lab to be able to make the human to human transfer what variants were created in lab and are more serious ones yet to come?

So unfortunately since no one has created a True Vaccine we still will be wearing masks and dealing with the Flu/COVID shots every year

I can't answer all of this, but the fraction of the world that been vaccinated is no longer small. Even some parts of the developing world (especially in the Middle East) are well into double digit vaccination rates. And for some of the population, I would anticipate that yes, like with the flu shot, they will likely need an annual COVID shot that deals with new strains. (I would be in this group)

[BacktoBasics]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? So with the Delta variant it has shown it does not stop you from getting Covid but it does STOP you from dying. So it’s like a Flu shot and like the Flu which is always mutating different shots will have to be created every year.

Also since only a very small percentage of the world has been given the shot we are seeing a variety of Mutations that appear I wonder how long or the likely hood that a more dangerous variant appears? And since this is not a disease created by nature ie. Created in Wuhan Covid lab to be able to make the human to human transfer what variants were created in lab and are more serious ones yet to come?

So unfortunately since no one has created a True Vaccine we still will be wearing masks and dealing with the Flu/COVID shots every year
If you have to ask this question then don’t make any assertions about the shot ever again. You don’t understand.

[Mr. Body]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? So with the Delta variant it has shown it does not stop you from getting Covid but it does STOP you from dying.

No vaccine is 100% effective, but in general they 'train' the body how to react should they encounter whatever malady the vaccine is for. You are misinformed about what vaccines are. Yes, the Covid vaccine can prevent people from getting the virus. If a person has what is called a breakthrough case, the case is likely to be much more mild than otherwise.

To be honest, I am completely astonished at the lack of education in the United States on very basic things.

[XenoThirteen]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? So with the Delta variant it has shown it does not stop you from getting Covid but it does STOP you from dying. So it’s like a Flu shot and like the Flu which is always mutating different shots will have to be created every year.

Also since only a very small percentage of the world has been given the shot we are seeing a variety of Mutations that appear I wonder how long or the likely hood that a more dangerous variant appears? And since this is not a disease created by nature ie. Created in Wuhan Covid lab to be able to make the human to human transfer what variants were created in lab and are more serious ones yet to come?

So unfortunately since no one has created a True Vaccine we still will be wearing masks and dealing with the Flu/COVID shots every year



Hi. Yes it is true that vaccines are ideally supposed to eradicate disease. However, there is no such thing as a vaccine that is 100% effective. Current studies have shown that the COVID vaccines are effective in preventing infections 60-90% of the time, depending on the brand in question (Pfizer, Moderna, and Astrazenica seem to be the most consistently highly protective brands). In addition to it preventing the disease a certain % of the time, the vaccine prevents severe illness significantly once the patient finishes their doses. There was actually a study recently that it prevents transmission, infection, and death even further if you get a booster dose in the form of Pfizer. When compared to people who are fully vaccinated (2 doses for all brands except j and j) vs people who got the booster, reduction of rate of infection by about 80% was observed and severe ill ess saw a reduction of 90%. It's significant because those who have 2 doses are already protected to begin with. Those who get the booster are even further protected. I'll link it below if anybody cares to read.

I personally think refusing to call the vaccine a vaccine just because it isn't 100% effective is splitting hairs at this point. No one drug/therapy/management option is ever 100% efficacious. Even the small pox vaccine back in the first few years of its use still would only prevent severe illness.

A good portion of the world population is already vaccinated. We will achieve herd immunity eventually. It's just that if we continue to not educate and help remove vaccine hesitancy, the virus can mutate such that we will eventually have to consider yearly booster doses.

Also as a side note, it's difficult to make claims that the virus was created in a lab when genome studies show it started as several mutations that jumped between different animal species from the Wuhan wet market, where there's basically no quality and sanitary control.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2114255

[Mnky]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? So with the Delta variant it has shown it does not stop you from getting Covid but it does STOP you from dying. So it’s like a Flu shot and like the Flu which is always mutating different shots will have to be created every year.

Also since only a very small percentage of the world has been given the shot we are seeing a variety of Mutations that appear I wonder how long or the likely hood that a more dangerous variant appears? And since this is not a disease created by nature ie. Created in Wuhan Covid lab to be able to make the human to human transfer what variants were created in lab and are more serious ones yet to come?

So unfortunately since no one has created a True Vaccine we still will be wearing masks and dealing with the Flu/COVID shots every year

Vaccines don't stop the virus. They prepare your body to fight it. They give your body instructions for creating anti-viral tools. Those tools are better equipped to reduce the impact of the virus.

The quicker the body overcomes it, the less it spreads, the quicker it fades away, etc.

[hombre]

Only 28 percent of Black New Yorkers ages 18 to 44 are fully vaccinate

I'll just drop this here for no particular reason...

nah, the reason is because you’re a racist,

https://news.yahoo.com/hospitals-nursing-homes-worried-shortages-080009768.html

[mo7888]

nah, the reason is because you’re a racist,

https://news.yahoo.com/hospitals-nursing-homes-worried-shortages-080009768.html

Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference.

Mark Twain

I'm learning....

[John B]

Please have consideration to people who go to this thread for Free Agency forum. I have as much opinion on the subject of vaccine. But please, this thread is not the forum for it. Please take it somewhere else. Create a new thread for if you need to. Thank you.

[spurraider21]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? So with the Delta variant it has shown it does not stop you from getting Covid but it does STOP you from dying. So it’s like a Flu shot and like the Flu which is always mutating different shots will have to be created every year.

Also since only a very small percentage of the world has been given the shot we are seeing a variety of Mutations that appear I wonder how long or the likely hood that a more dangerous variant appears? And since this is not a disease created by nature ie. Created in Wuhan Covid lab to be able to make the human to human transfer what variants were created in lab and are more serious ones yet to come?

So unfortunately since no one has created a True Vaccine we still will be wearing masks and dealing with the Flu/COVID shots every year
a vaccine gives you the antibodies needed to fight off a virus

[spurraider21]

Only 28 percent of Black New Yorkers ages 18 to 44 are fully vaccinate

I'll just drop this here for no particular reason...
just dropping a stat painting people of a particular race in a negative light

"for no particular reason"

[mo7888]

just dropping a stat painting people of a particular race in a negative light

"for no particular reason"

If you go back and read what this was in reference too you'll see it wasn't painting anyone in a negative light. It was simply stating a fact to counter a statement someone else made in regard to who is or is not getting vaccinated. It's not any particular demographic that is avoiding it...that was the point..

[Dverde]

I wanted to give a shout out to Danny Green who will pass 100M career earnings at the end of his current contract with 3 x :lobt:

[itzsoweezee]

I weep for our education system. People willing to get brainwashed by YouTube but unwilling to apply even a little logic or defer to experts that have studied science for decades

[tonight...you]

I weep for our education system. People willing to get brainwashed by YouTube but unwilling to apply even a little logic or defer to experts that have studied science for decades
I just visited with my twin nieces. They're under 10 and their knowledge of social media is frightening.

[hombre]

Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference.

Mark Twain

I'm learning....

Check it out, this racist is quoting another racist.

[hombre]

Please have consideration to people who go to this thread for Free Agency forum. I have as much opinion on the subject of vaccine. But please, this thread is not the forum for it. Please take it somewhere else. Create a new thread for if you need to. Thank you.

:bobo

[TDomination]

Please have consideration to people who go to this thread for Free Agency forum. I have as much opinion on the subject of vaccine. But please, this thread is not the forum for it. Please take it somewhere else. Create a new thread for if you need to. Thank you.

thank you for this

[cd98]

You can close the thread because we are not signing anymore free agents of consequence in 2021.

[JeffDuncan]

One question I have is why are we still referring the shot as a Vaccine? Please correct me if I am wrong but doesn’t a Vaccine STOP you from getting the disease? ...



That is the correct use of the term, yes.

For those who lack the ability to use an online dictionary:

---
vaccine
...
noun
any preparation used as a preventive inoculation to confer immunity against a specific disease, usually employing an innocuous form of the disease agent, as killed or weakened bacteria or viruses, to stimulate antibody production.
---

Vaccines are for the prevention of a disease. They confer immunity.

Those who want to use the term to mean "any shot" are just ignorantly wrong.

And of course those who get most deeply involved in online discussions of this kind are almost always the ones who are the most ignorant of the subject. Those who are the most ignorant have the most room, in their own minds, to be preachy and pig-headed, at endless length.

[Sugus]

That is the correct use of the term, yes.

For those who lack the ability to use an online dictionary:

---
vaccine
...
noun
any preparation used as a preventive inoculation to confer immunity against a specific disease, usually employing an innocuous form of the disease agent, as killed or weakened bacteria or viruses, to stimulate antibody production.
---

Vaccines are for the prevention of a disease. They confer immunity.

Those who want to use the term to mean "any shot" are just ignorantly wrong.

And of course those who get most deeply involved in online discussions of this kind are almost always the ones who are the most ignorant of the subject. Those who are the most ignorant have the most room, in their own minds, to be preachy and pig-headed, at endless length.

I'm of the opinion that the thread should be used as intended, and not as some provax/antivax shit-slinging contest, but I'll correct you on this before going back to the shadows:

The COVID vaccine(s) are referred to as such, and correctly, because they do grant immunization against the virus - just not perfect, absolute immunity, like the anti-vax crowd "demands" in order to take the shot. Matter of fact, most vaccines don't offer absolute immunity, and historically there have been multiple vaccines which outright infected the people who took them. Take smallpox, for example: the original vaccines outright infected people with a different, less severe version of 'pox, called cowpox, and even the most widely available and used vaccine to treat smallpox, called Dryvax, wasn't 100%, and had a non-insignificant percentage of serious, documented side effects: "The vaccine is effective, providing successful immunogenicity in about 95% of vaccinated persons. Dryvax has serious adverse side-effects in about 1% to 2% of cases". Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6532594/

So yeah, that's bullshit, the COVID vaccines, while obviously far away still from a %95 success rate, are still effective and worth taking.

Can we go back to discussing free agents now? That'd be great...

[BacktoBasics]

I'm of the opinion that the thread should be used as intended, and not as some provax/antivax shit-slinging contest, but I'll correct you on this before going back to the shadows:

The COVID vaccine(s) are referred to as such, and correctly, because they do grant immunization against the virus - just not perfect, absolute immunity, like the anti-vax crowd "demands" in order to take the shot. Matter of fact, most vaccines don't offer absolute immunity, and historically there have been multiple vaccines which outright infected the people who took them. Take smallpox, for example: the original vaccines outright infected people with a different, less severe version of 'pox, called cowpox, and even the most widely available and used vaccine to treat smallpox, called Dryvax, wasn't 100%, and had a non-insignificant percentage of serious, documented side effects: "The vaccine is effective, providing successful immunogenicity in about 95% of vaccinated persons. Dryvax has serious adverse side-effects in about 1% to 2% of cases". Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6532594/

So yeah, that's bullshit, the COVID vaccines, while obviously far away still from a %95 success rate, are still effective and worth taking.

Can we go back to discussing free agents now? That'd be great...

Don’t fuck all these guys up with reality. They don’t understand it.

Crazy how these patriots are ready to take up arms and trade gun fire with imaginary enemies until it means getting a tiny boo boo on their shoulder then it’s all “fuck Americans”. Because they never gave a shit about anyone but themselves in the first place.