The Trayvon Martin Case

[TeyshaBlue]

lol comment #1.

"All broads?? He's doomed."

[Creepn]

What's the strategy using all women?

[TeyshaBlue]

Good fuckin' question from a defense standpoint.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

How much have the taxpayers paid so far in the State of Floridas prosecution of Zimmerman?
What is the anticipated total when finished?
Taxpayer money going towards getting a murderer off the street isn't something to gripe over, tbh.

[Oh, Gee!!]

I guess there won't be a hung jury

[boobie4three]

I believe the jury will find Zimmerman not guilty, saying that he killed Martin in self defense... Then the rioting will begin.

[Creepn]

I'd like to bet people who think there will be a riot if Zimmerman is not guilty.

Dirkonendonkski? Boobie?

Let's do this.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

I'd like to bet people who think there will be a riot if Zimmerman is not guilty.

Dirkonendonkski? Boobie?

Let's do this.
Make sure you go over the specifics of what qualifies as a "riot" :lol

[Creepn]

Riots similar to the LA riot. Flipping cars over and scaring white folk.

[boobie4three]

Make sure you go over the specifics of what qualifies as a "riot" :lol

OK, for starters, at least three patrol cars have to be overturned, (cars on their sides constitutes overturned).

[Creepn]

OK, for starters, at least three patrol cars have to be overturned, (cars on their sides constitutes overturned).

SOLD!

Alright, what's the wager?

[boobie4three]

I'd like to bet people who think there will be a riot if Zimmerman is not guilty.

Dirkonendonkski? Boobie?

Let's do this.

Let's make losing painful. Losers sig will say "I'm an idiot and don't know shit" for one week.

[Creepn]

Let's make losing painful. Losers sig will say "I'm an idiot and don't know shit" for one week.

Meh that's fine. Add a sig pic of winner's choice to that as well.

Any other takers? Doesn't have to be the same wager.

[boobie4three]

Meh that's fine. Add a sig pic of winner's choice to that as well.



OK. I'm down with that. Hey, what if he's found guilty and whites riot?......Yeah, I know. Can't happen.

[CavsSuperFan]

Hey, what if he's found guilty and whites riot?....

No Justice...No Taxes... :lol

[TeyshaBlue]

I guess there won't be a hung jury

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y64/teyshablue/rimshot-o_zps432304c8.gif (http://s3.photobucket.com/user/teyshablue/media/rimshot-o_zps432304c8.gif.html)

[boobie4three]

The jury

Middle aged or older women, employed, 5 married with kids, 5 white 1 Hispanic, I'm not sure I'd be concerned were I Zimmerman. Could be much, much worse.
B-29: A Hispanic nurse on an Alzheimer's ward who has several children and lived in Chicago at the time of shooting. She’s married. She said she doesn't watch the news, preferring reality television: “Right when we got here, I got cable... I love my reality shows.” During jury selection, she said she was arrested once in Chicago.

B-76: A white, middle-aged woman who said Zimmerman had an “altercation with the young man. There was a struggle and the gun went off.” Has been married 30 years, and is unemployed. She formerly worked with her husband in his construction company. Her 28-year-old son is an attorney in Seminole County. She also has a daughter, 26, has been a victim of non-violent crime and rescues “a lot of pets.” The state tried to strike her, but was denied.

B-37: A middle-aged white woman who has worked for a chiropractor for 16 years and has many pets. She described protests in Sanford as “rioting.” Her husband is an attorney. She has two daughters: A 24-year-old dog groomer and a 27-year-old who attends the University of Central Florida. She used to have concealed weapons permit, but let it lapse. Her husband also has one.

B-51: A retired white woman from Oviedo who has a dog and 20-year-old cat. She knew a good deal about the case, but said “I'm not rigid in my thinking.” She has been in Seminole County for nine years, is unmarried and has no kids. She previously lived in Atlanta, and used to work in real estate. She also ran a call center in Brevard County which she said had 1,200 employees.

E-6: A young white woman and mother who used to work in financial services. She used this case as an example to her two adolescent children, warning them to not go out at night. She has lived in Seminole County for eight years, and is married to an engineer. She was arrested in Brevard County, but said she “was treated completely fairly.” Her husband has guns. The state tried to strike her from the jury, but was denied.

E-40: A white woman in her 60s who lived in Iowa at the time of the shooting. She heard national news reports and recalls the shooting was in a gated community and a teenager was killed. She described herself as a safety officer, is married to a chemical engineer and loves football. She has a 28-year-old son who’s out of work. She said she’s very well versed in cell phone technology, and has been a victim of crime.

These are the alternates:

E-54: A middle-aged white man with a teenage stepson who wears hoodies. He recalled seeing photos of Zimmerman's head and face that show injuries. He loves golf and genealogy, and said he’s been married for five years to a technical engineer. He grew up in Seminole County and has a teenage stepson.

B-72: A young, possibly Hispanic man who does maintenance at a school and competes in arm wrestling tournaments. He said he avoids the news because he does not want to be “brainwashed.” He grew up in Chicago, is single and an alumni of Phi Beta Kappa. He is very physically active, having participated in high school football, track and weightlifting. Of arm-wrestling he said, “I could talk about it all day.”

E-13: A young white woman who goes to college and works two jobs, one of them as a surgical assistant. She heard the shooting was a “racial thing.” She said she could be a fair juror “just because I don't really know that much.” She is single, has lived in Seminole County for 17 years and attends church. She also owns and rides horses.

E-28: A middle-aged white woman who has worked as a nurse for 26 years. She knew little about the case and has no opinion about Zimmerman's guilt. She has lived in Seminole County since 1985, and has been married for 28 years; her husband is a teacher. She has two adult children: 27 and 23.

[Trill Clinton]

good thing is there are 5 mothers in the jury.

[Fabbs]

wha?
Sounds like game set and match for the defense.
No blacks on the jury?

[TeyshaBlue]

wha?
Sounds like game set and match for the defense.
No blacks on the jury?

Are you kidding? 5 Mom's on that jury. That's got to hurt the defense.

[Fabbs]

Taxpayer money going towards getting a murderer off the street isn't something to gripe over, tbh.
I was simply asking. You are strawing that i was griping.
Casey Anthony cost FL taxpayers over a million. I guess she is off the street. :lol

[BradLohaus]

lol comment #1.

"All broads?? He's doomed."

That's exactly what I thought. But after reading their descriptions I'm not sure; overall they seem like they would favor the the defense, other than the motherhood aspect. I can totally see why the state tried to strike a couple of them. I think I read that the county is 11% black, so that's a 1 in 9 shot at random. It shouldn't be surprising that there aren't any on the jury, but eveyone is, myself included. Al Sharpton already said somethng like "this will be a test to see if there really is equal justice in America." Get your popcorn ready...

[FuzzyLumpkins]

With opening statements set for Monday, the judge ruled prosecutors can use loaded language, such as 'wanna-be cop,' to describe Zimmerman, but that they must avoid the term 'racial profiling.'

MAS @ http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2013/0621/Zimmerman-trial-Prosecutors-can-call-him-a-vigilante-judge-says?nav=87-frontpage-entryNineItem

[CosmicCowboy]

If the trial lasts long enough their PMS will synchronize.

[Fabbs]

Are you kidding? 5 Mom's on that jury. That's got to hurt the defense.Most moms want their kids to be safe.
When the defense shows reality pics of Travon it's gonna shoot down "Lil Cutesy going to the store for milk and cookies for the church pic nic" prosecution spin.

[Trill Clinton]

lol@ reality pics

[boobie4three]

lol@ reality pics


Yeah, you know man. These:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/george-zimmerman-bloody-photo-20121203_zps1c25f809.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/images10_zps9a226e8a.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/images10_zps9a226e8a.jpg.html)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/zimmermanhandsclean_zpsb20db46a.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/zimmermanhandsclean_zpsb20db46a.jpg.html)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/fgfffggf_zpsfe391971.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/fgfffggf_zpsfe391971.jpg.html)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/fgfgfdgf_zps875fff8c.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/fgfgfdgf_zps875fff8c.jpg.html)

[Creepn]

Yeah, you know man. These:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/george-zimmerman-bloody-photo-20121203_zps1c25f809.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/images10_zps9a226e8a.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/images10_zps9a226e8a.jpg.html)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/zimmermanhandsclean_zpsb20db46a.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/zimmermanhandsclean_zpsb20db46a.jpg.html)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/fgfffggf_zpsfe391971.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/fgfffggf_zpsfe391971.jpg.html)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/krakee/fgfgfdgf_zps875fff8c.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/krakee/media/fgfgfdgf_zps875fff8c.jpg.html)

Non-life threatening injuries and a rebellious teenager going through puberty. How do those pics help your point?

[jack sommerset]

I believe those pics of Zimmerman may be considered self-defense. It appears his nose is broken. God bless.

[boutons_deux]

murderous vigilante GZ went looking for trouble and got beat the fuck up by his stalked, threatened victim who did nothing but Stand His Ground aka in self defense

or does Stand Your Ground in FL mean only with a gun, not with your fists?

[boobie4three]

Non-life threatening injuries and a rebellious teenager going through puberty. How do those pics help your point?
I believe the Defense will portray Martin as a thug wannabe. There were reports that he was asking around about acquiring a gun in the weeks prior to his death. As far as non-life threatening injuries, what's Zimmerman supposed to do? Wait till Martin beats him to within an inch of his life? Also, no marks on Zim's knuckels and I'm betting no marks on Martin's face. Proves to me those cries for help we've been reading about had to be coming from Zim.

[Trill Clinton]

most kids trayvon's age are thug wannabe's. every kid from the hood to the suburb imitates the gangsta rapper, that has nothing to do with him being murdered for walking with skittles and tea. his marijuana use, text messages and pictures of a gun is so irrelevant, the judge told the defense they can't talk about it.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2013/05/28/george_zimmerman_trial_judge_rules_defense_can_t_m ention_martin_s_marijuana.html

those pictures of zimmerman with a busted nose and a scratch on the back of his head don't move me. he went home with no medical attention and fell asleep on his daddy's couch.

[Trill Clinton]

murderous vigilante GZ went looking for trouble and got beat the fuck up by his stalked, threatened victim who did nothing but Stand His Ground aka in self defense

or does Stand Your Ground in FL mean only with a gun, not with your fists?

http://legacy-cdn.smosh.com/smosh-pit/092010/mario_6.gif

[boutons_deux]

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2013/05/28/george_zimmerman_trial_judge_rules_defense_can_t_m ention_martin_s_marijuana.html



"[Circuit Judge Debra S. Nelson] ruled that the two sides cannot bring up evidence of Martin's familiarity with guns, previous marijuana use, and previous fighting incidents. She left the door open on one issue involving marijuana. Defense attorneys say toxicology tests show Martin had enough THC—the key active ingredient in marijuana—to indicate he may have smoked the drug a couple of hours before the shooting. Nelson barred any mention of this from opening statements, but said she will rule later on whether it will be admissible after she hears defense experts' testimony about the marijuana use. ... The attorneys also cannot bring up Martin's text messages.

evidence of the fighting he has been involved with in the past relevant," defense lawyer Mark O'Mara told the Associated Press (http://www.usnews.com/news/us/articles/2013/05/23/defense-releases-photos-texts-of-trayvon-martin) last week after releasing texts from Martin's cellphone that discussed fighting, smoking pot and being forced to move out of his mom's house. (http://www.usnews.com/news/us/articles/2013/05/23/defense-releases-photos-texts-of-trayvon-martin)"

looks Debbie is already down with he poor little GZ's innocence.

[boobie4three]

Not good news for the prosecution on the voice recognition angle.

Judge bars audio experts from George Zimmerman trial who say screams were not Zimmerman

In a major victory for murder suspect George Zimmerman, a judge today ruled that prosecutors may not put on the witness stand two state audio experts who say the voice heard screaming in the background of a 911 call was someone other than Zimmerman.

The judge had heard three days of testimony about the science used by the state's experts and ruled that it failed to meet Florida's legal standard.

One of the experts, Alan R. Reich, had concluded the voice he identified as Trayvon is heard yelling "I'm begging you" and "stop." The other, Tom Owen, says he ruled Zimmerman out as the screamer with biometric software. Both are now banned.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-george-zimmerman-trial-experts-ruling-20130622,0,7655747.story

[Fabbs]

his marijuana use, text messages and pictures of a gun is so irrelevant, the judge told the defense they can't talk about it.
Only for now.
You Travonz may end up having it all in front of the jury.

"Circuit Judge Debra Nelson left open the possibility that the defense could try again later during the trial if it could show relevance."

Also, former prosecution member Wesley White exposed the sneakiness attempted by the prosecution:
"Before the judge decided to postpone the hearing on sanctions, a former prosecutor who used to work in the same office as the attorneys prosecuting Zimmerman testified he had told O'Mara about photos and text messages from Martin's cell phone that hadn't yet been turned over to the defense."

I hope White gets called as a witness. :lol


most kids trayvon's age are thug wannabe's. every kid from the hood to the suburb imitates the gangsta rapper,

an appalling number of sheeple who adulate gangsta wrapper dumbfuck i agree.
Hardly "most kids".

[Wild Cobra]

Not good news for the prosecution on the voice recognition angle.

Judge bars audio experts from George Zimmerman trial who say screams were not Zimmerman

In a major victory for murder suspect George Zimmerman, a judge today ruled that prosecutors may not put on the witness stand two state audio experts who say the voice heard screaming in the background of a 911 call was someone other than Zimmerman.

The judge had heard three days of testimony about the science used by the state's experts and ruled that it failed to meet Florida's legal standard.

One of the experts, Alan R. Reich, had concluded the voice he identified as Trayvon is heard yelling "I'm begging you" and "stop." The other, Tom Owen, says he ruled Zimmerman out as the screamer with biometric software. Both are now banned.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/trayvon-martin/os-george-zimmerman-trial-experts-ruling-20130622,0,7655747.story
I'll bet not a single person who understand digital communications disagree with this decision.

[Trill Clinton]

sounds like a kid's voice screaming help to me...this is so heartbreaking.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6Lr3DOqaSE

in comparison, marissa alexander is serving a 20 year sentence for firing a warning shot in her home at the direction of her huband, she was a victim of domestic violence, smh. a woman who was a victim of an abusive husband fires a warning shot and gets 20 years while zimmerman is about to walk free. i wonder why?

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/31/us-usa-jacksonville-shooting-idUSBRE84U01320120531

there will be hell to pay when zimmerman is found not guilty by this kangaroo court. fuck the jutice system. there is no justice for blacks in ameriKKKa. i hope they burn florida down after the trial.

[Trill Clinton]

oh and her stand your ground defense was denied by the judge. i guess its only stands for creeps who go looking for trouble, not innocent victims of domestic violence or children walking home.

[boobie4three]

oh and her stand your ground defense was denied by the judge. i guess its only stands for creeps who go looking for trouble, not innocent victims of domestic violence or children walking home.
GZ is not utilizing the Stand Your Ground defense in this case.

[Trill Clinton]

GZ is not utilizing the Stand Your Ground defense in this case.

doesn't matter. stand your ground is still relevant in this case. the alexander case is very similar, except zimmerman will get off for murder, while alexander is doing 20 years for a warning shot.

[boobie4three]

After reading this quote from another site, I may have to rethink my prediction that there will be riots if GZ is acquitted. It's not something I considered before:
"Zimmerman will be found innocent, and there will be no Rodney King memorial race riots.

There is a big difference between present-day Florida and South Central LA twenty-one years ago: Florida has had concealed carry for nineteen years.

Everybody in Sanford is going to be armed on the day of the verdict, and all the potential rioters are going to be well aware of that fact."

[Creepn]

After reading this quote from another site, I may have to rethink my prediction that there will be riots if GZ is acquitted. It's not something I considered before:
"Zimmerman will be found innocent, and there will be no Rodney King memorial race riots.

There is a big difference between present-day Florida and South Central LA twenty-one years ago: Florida has had concealed carry for nineteen years.

Everybody in Sanford is going to be armed on the day of the verdict, and all the potential rioters are going to be well aware of that fact."


Lol gun nuts just drooling for the day they find Zimmerman innocent.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I'll bet not a single person who understand digital communications disagree with this decision.

I work with signal processing professionally so tell me your technical opinion.

[Fabbs]

I work with signal processing professionally so tell me your technical opinion.
I've been to a Bose store and listened to an entire AC/DC album.

[Wild Cobra]

Quote Originally Posted by FuzzyLumpkins
I work with signal processing professionally so tell me your technical opinion.
I've been to a Bose store and listened to an entire AC/DC album.
LOL...

I didn't see that, because I have Fizzy on IGNORE.

OK Fuzzy, consider this.

The recording is of an 8 bit datastream, at and i believe an 8k sample rate. The screams are at a distance, and low volume compared to the conversation. There is probably, at best, 5 bits of data for the screams, and I believe all but under 3 seconds of the screaming was occurring the same time as talking. Then of course, a probable 8k sample rate isn't fast enough to sample the harmonics of high pitched screams.

There is no way to properly reconstruct accurate sound from so few bits for amplitude and so little time. The sound we hear is likely not an accurate reconstruction to begin with. If you had read material from various audio experts, you would know that they never trust such results.

This isn't like "CD" quality sound you know.

Sure, they had a 16 bit recording of the 911 call, but the call itself was an 8 bit call through the cell carrier.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

LOL...

I didn't see that, because I have Fizzy on IGNORE.

OK Fuzzy, consider this.

The recording is of an 8 bit datastream, at and i believe an 8k sample rate. The screams are at a distance, and low volume compared to the conversation. There is probably, at best, 5 bits of data for the screams, and I believe all but under 3 seconds of the screaming was occurring the same time as talking. Then of course, a probable 8k sample rate isn't fast enough to sample the harmonics of high pitched screams.

There is no way to properly reconstruct accurate sound from so few bits for amplitude and so little time. The sound we hear is likely not an accurate reconstruction to begin with. If you had read material from various audio experts, you would know that they never trust such results.

This isn't like "CD" quality sound you know.

Sure, they had a 16 bit recording of the 911 call, but the call itself was an 8 bit call through the cell carrier.

:lol only 5-bits

Data loss doesn't make the bus shrink, Dr. Google.

[Wild Cobra]

:lol only 5-bits

Data loss doesn't make the bus shrink, Dr. Google.
LOL...

Once again, you clearly do not understand.

8 bit data gives you 256 levels yo apply to a waveform. A quieter voice will not use all 8 bits. Lets say it uses 7 bits (128 levels) for the peak signal level. More distant voices, will only peak at 6 bits (64 levels) of resolution, etc. 5 bits would only be 32 levels.

Sure, the data package is still 8 bits of resolution, but doesn't mean the intelligence you are analyzing is 8 bits.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

LOL...

Once again, you clearly do not understand.

8 bit data gives you 256 levels yo apply to a waveform. A quieter voice will not use all 8 bits. Lets say it uses 7 bits (128 levels) for the peak signal level. More distant voices, will only peak at 6 bits (64 levels) of resolution, etc. 5 bits would only be 32 levels.

Sure, the data package is still 8 bits of resolution, but doesn't mean the intelligence you are analyzing is 8 bits.

:lol

Thanks, Dr. Google. This is neither here nor there. In truth you can filter out unwanted noise above a certain threshold if you know the approximate volume of what you are trying to isolate. That still has nothing to do with the bus size.

Try again. It's amusing watching you google as you go along.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

A quieter voice will not use all 8 bits. Lets say it uses 7 bits (128 levels) for the peak signal level. More distant voices, will only peak at 6 bits (64 levels) of resolution, etc. 5 bits would only be 32 levels.

This part was especially ignorant on multiple levels but hey you know your powers of 2. You must be an expert.

Dumbfuck

[Fabbs]

:lol

Thanks, Dr. Google. This is neither here nor there. In truth you can filter out unwanted noise above a certain threshold if you know the approximate volume of what you are trying to isolate. That still has nothing to do with the bus size.
Why didn't the judge consult you for your expertise?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Why didn't the judge consult you for your expertise?

What is I work in imaging and don't live in Florida, Alex?

He's making shit up as he goes along and it amuses me. What do low pass mean?

[Fabbs]

Fabbs
Why didn't the judge consult you for your expertise?


What is I work in imaging and don't live in Florida, Alex?


Trill Clinton most kids trayvon's age are thug wannabe's. every kid from the hood to the suburb imitates the gangsta rapper,

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I was simply asking. You are strawing that i was griping.
Casey Anthony cost FL taxpayers over a million. I guess she is off the street. :lol


If the trial lasts long enough their PMS will synchronize.


Most moms want their kids to be safe.
When the defense shows reality pics of Travon it's gonna shoot down "Lil Cutesy going to the store for milk and cookies for the church pic nic" prosecution spin.

[Wild Cobra]

LOL...

Fuzzy is still incapable of telling us how I am wrong. Why should that ever change?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

LOL...

Fuzzy is still incapable of telling us how I am wrong. Why should that ever change?

That's not how it works, you made the claim. You just made the claim that lower amplitudes could not be used to determine voice.

We can hear the screaming on the recording. We can isolate the screaming. You don't even know how much data is required for voice analysis nor do you know the amplitude range before clipping or the amplitude range at all, nor do you even know where the screaming falls in that. But you then make up an assumption that you want to hear anyway based on bullshit that you made up.

What else is new indeed. You don't know shit, make stuff up to fill in the gaps in a way that just so happens get the guy that killed the black kid off.

[Fabbs]

I take it Fuzzy you think the judge made a grave error?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I take it Fuzzy you think the judge made a grave error?

Follow the conversation and try again.

If you need me to walk you through it then let me know.

[Fabbs]

Follow the conversation and try again.

If you need me to walk you through it then let me know.
i don't need you.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

i don't need you.

You are the one that is asking me questions. :rolleyes

[Fabbs]

Cobra,
Is FuzzyTroll a Rumphumper cousin?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Cobra,
Is FuzzyTroll a Rumphumper cousin?

If you say so. Apparently you do need to be walked through it.

WC was making comments about what an audio signal expert would say. I started asking him how he would know that one way or the other. As expected he began googling in order to see like he know what he was talking about. I then started making fun of him because of it.

I at no point made a comment about how good the evidence in question was. I never implied along those lines either.

I get that you don't like having your stupidity demonstrated point by point. Chump does it the Socratic method of asking questions. I don't do that. Read up a bit and perhaps you will catch nuances like that.

But other then that have a nice death in a bus fire.

[CosmicCowboy]

If the same expert and the same technology had it as Zimmerman screaming Fuzzy would be demanding it not be admissible because the technology wasn't universally accepted.

[Trill Clinton]

opening arguments from prosecution: "21 days removed from his 16th year, was face down in his last breaths


Witness 8 heard tray say "what are you following me for"
GZ didn't want to go to the hospital after his "life threatening injuries"


link: http://t.co/DxxJDysYOu

[Creepn]

They will still use the audio and the lawyers will present a likely scenerio to show how it's more likely Trayvon's voice as opposed to the liar Zimmerman.

[Fabbs]

If the same expert and the same technology had it as Zimmerman screaming Fuzzy would be demanding it not be admissible because the technology wasn't universally accepted.
:lol
One of O.J. Simpsons scheme team was being interviewed and the interviewer made the same point.
"How about if you were paid to find Simpson guilty? You would come up with reasons why, correct?"
It made him STFU immediately.

[clambake]

easy to see what george did with his money, lol.

[BradLohaus]

Best comment I've read yet: the jury is a compromise, no blacks vs. no white men = white women.

I've been told that Z's shirt has grass stains on the back and T's only grass stains are on is knees. Z's lawyer hasn't mentioned that. Saving it for the end?

[boobie4three]

You'd have to suspend common sense to believe the screaming came from anyone other than GZ. The photos proved he was the one getting beat on, not TM. It was reported TM had broken skin on his knuckles. I never saw a report about what kind of marks were on TM's face, but from the photos of GZ's hands, it's a safe bet there were no marks on TM's face. GZ was hoping someone would hear his cries which went on for a relatively long period of time(30 seconds maybe), which shows he was reluctant to pull out his weapon before he felt it was necessary.

[Trill Clinton]

12:30 p.m. ET: Judge Nelson has recessed court for lunch. The live blog will resume when court picks back up at 1:30 p.m. ET.
12:29 p.m. ET:
Follow me @vinniepolitan (https://twitter.com/VinniePolitan) to be alerted to all the big moments in the #TrayvonMartin (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TrayvonMartin&src=hash) #GeorgeZimmerman (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23GeorgeZimmerman&src=hash) trial... including the VERDICT...
— Vinnie Politan (@VinniePolitan) June 24, 2013 (https://twitter.com/VinniePolitan/statuses/349194197204606976)

12:27 p.m. ET: West said some photos of Zimmerman's injuries were taken later that night and they look better. because they had been cleaned up.
12:23 p.m. ET: "What you can really see in these pictures that you will have in evidence are the lumps. The big knots on each side of his head. Consistent with having his (Zimmerman's) head slammed into concrete," said West.
12:20 p.m. ET: West said a witness saw Martin on top of Zimmerman during the altercation.
12:17 p.m. ET: West said a paramedic treating Zimmerman at the scene recommended that he be taken to a hospital. West said police said they would take care of transporting him, but it never happened.
12:14 p.m. ET: West is showing a picture of Martin at the convenience store moments before being shot to show the jurors how tall he was. He says Martin was a little over six feet tall.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_137.jpg
12:11 p.m. ET: The witnesses at the scene did not know Martin, and no one could identify him according to West,
12:08 p.m. ET: West is explaining the characteristics of the gun Zimmerman used to shoot Martin, and how he was using it properly.
12:06 p.m. ET:
Did you catch the joke by defense attorney Don West? http://t.co/Se1jHcK9l0 Special coverage of the #ZimmermanTrial (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23ZimmermanTrial&src=hash) continues live at 12pET.
— Kyra Phillips (@KyraHLN) June 24, 2013 (https://twitter.com/KyraHLN/statuses/349191972772270080)

12:02 p.m. ET: West showed a picture of a bloody gash on the back of Zimmerman's head taken moments after the shooting.
"George Zimmerman says (to a witness) he was beating me up and I shot him," said West.
11:58 a.m. ET: "You can hear the cries for help up until the moment of the shot," said West.
11:55 a.m. ET: West said it was difficult to make out faces the night of the shooting, but witnesses could identify the color of people's clothing.
11:52 a.m. ET: West said witness Jana Serdaka claims she saw Martin and Zimmerman at the time of the shot, but she was wrong about what happened. She says she saw Zimmerman on top of Martin, but West says if she saw Zimmerman on top of Martin it was after he hired fired the gun.
11:48 a.m ET: West said the 911 call was recorded about 30 or 40 feet away from where the shooting took place, and presents certain "acoustical challenges."
11:46 a.m. ET: Martin's mother Sybrina Fulton left the courtroom as the 911 call was played in court. Zimmerman did not show any emotion as the call was played.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_136.jpg
11:44 a.m. ET: West is playing for the jurors a 911 call a neighbor made, where it is possible to hear the screams and the shot in the background.
11:40 a.m. ET: West is using the map of the neighborhood to explain to the jury where two witnesses live that heard the altercation between Zimmerman and Martin.
11:37 a.m. ET: "At the moment this actually became physical was that Trayvon Martin. I will use my words, that Trayvon Martin decided to confront George Zimmerman. That instead of going home. He had plenty of time. This is what 60 or 70 yards. Plenty of time. He could of gone back and forth four or five times," said West.
11:32 a.m. ET: West is playing the non-emergency call Zimmerman made the night of the shooting for the jury again.
11:30 a.m. ET: West is showing a picture of the scene taken the night of the shooting to demonstrate how it was almost pitch black around the time of the shooting.
11:27 a.m. ET: Periodically, West is displaying quotes from the non-emergency call Zimmerman made the night of the shooting.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_135.jpg
11:23 a.m. ET: West agrees with the prosecution that Zimmerman did say "(expletive) punks" on the non-emergency call.
11:21 a.m. ET: West is walking the jury through the moments leading up to the confrontation between Zimmerman and Martin.
11:17 a.m. ET: "In fact, there was an attempted break in a couple of weeks before (the shooting)," said West.
11:15 a.m. ET: West is showing the jury Martin's phone records to demostrate what phone calls line up with Zimmerman's calls.
11:12 a.m. ET: At the end of the call, Zimmerman asks for the responding officer to call him when they arrive at the scene.
11:11 a.m. ET: The dispatcher asks Zimmerman if he is following him, and the operator tells him that they don't need him to follow him.
11:09 a.m. ET: On the recording, Zimmerman can be heard telling the dispatcher that he sees a suspicious person in his neighborhood, and they have had a lot crime in the area recently. He also says the suspicious person appears to be "black."
11:07 a.m. ET: West is now going to play Zimmerman's non-emergency call for the jury.
11:06 a.m. ET: West is showing the jury a picture of the spot where Martin was shot to illustrate where someone lived when they called 911 after hearing the altercation between Martin and Zimmerman.

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11:03 a.m. ET: The defense has prepared a timeline for the jury that shows the sequential events based on the non-emergency call made by Zimmerman.
11:01 a.m. ET: West is explaining how Martin was on the phone with a girl around the time of the shooting.
11:00 a.m. ET: "Little did George Zimmerman know at the time in less than 10 minutes from him first seeing Travyon Martin that he, George Zimmerman, would be suckered punched in the face, have his head pounded on concrete and wind up shooting and tragically killing Trayvon Martin," said West.
10:57 a.m. ET: West is describing the character of the neighborhood. He says Zimmerman left his house to go to Target just a few min after 7 p.m. that night, he got to the exit of the neighborhood and sees a person later identified as Martin.
10:54 a.m. ET: West is displaying an aerial map of Zimmerman's neighborhood to the jury explaining how the shooting happened that night.
10:52 a.m. ET: West said Zimmerman is not guilty of murder, because he shot Martin in self-defense after being "viciously attacked."
10:51 a.m. ET: West just told the jury a joke.
"Knock, knock, 'whose there?' 'George Zimmerman.' 'George Zimmerman who?' 'Alright, good you are on the jury.'"

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_133.jpg
10:46 a.m. ET: West is explaining to the jury why Zimmerman's parents are not allowed in the courtroom.
10:45 a.m. ET: West begins his opening statement saying, "This is a sad case of course."
"A young man lost his life, another is fighting for his."
10:43 a.m. ET: The jury is being seated, and defense attorney Don West is about to give his opening statement.
10:38 a.m. ET: Judge Nelson is back on the stand, the attorneys have joined her for a sidebar.
10:29 a.m. ET: From HLN's producer in the courtroom:
"During this recess defense attorneys are readying a series of exhibits that are being displayed via power point."
10:11 a.m. ET: Court is now in a 15 minute recess, before the defense will give its opening statement.
10:10 a.m. ET: "We are confident that at the end of this trial you will know in your head, in your heart, in your stomach that George Zimmerman did not shot Trayvon Martin, because he had to. He shot him for the worst of all reasons, because he wanted to. Thank you for your time." said Guy wrapping his opening statement.
10:08 a.m. ET: Guy said Martin's injuries do not indicate that he fought with Zimmerman.
"He didn't have bruised knuckles. He didn't have swollen hands. The only injury to his hand that was capable of being photograph was a small abrasion on his left ring finger. Trayvon Martin was right handed. That was the only injury to his hands." said Guy.
10:05 a.m. ET: "He was told not to be the vigilante police," said Guy.
10:03 a.m. ET: Guy said the jury will hear a heart-wrenching 911 call, where they will hear Martin screaming, and he was silenced when Zimmerman pulled the trigger.
10:00 a.m. ET: Zimmerman was examined by a medical profession the morning after shooting and he had no major injuries and his nose was not broken according to Guy.
9:59 a.m. ET: Guy is explaining that there's no witnesses who saw what happened the night of the shooting from beginning to end. He says the witnesses the jury will hear from saw "slices" of what happened.
9:57 a.m. ET: Guy said ballistics indicate that Zimmerman pressed the gun against Martin's chest and pulled the trigger called a "contact shot."
9:55 a.m. ET: "The defendant claims that while Trayvon Martin was on top of him. He said, 'you are going to die to night,' Well ladies and gentlemen you are going to hear from people out there. Nobody heard that," said Guy.
9:52 a.m. ET: "The defendant told police that at one point while he was sitting in his car following Trayvon Martin. Trayvon Martin ran behind some townhomes, and then came back out circled his car and ran back again. Listen to the non-emergency call that happened in real time and you will see that didn't happen," said Guy.
9:49 a.m. ET: Guy says the jury will see exactly how Zimmerman looked after the confrontation with Martin. They will also see a video police shot at the scene of the killing of Zimmerman explaining what happened.
9:45 a.m. ET: Martin's father is crying as Guy details how officers tried to save his son's life on February 26, 2012.
9:42 a.m. ET: Zimmerman is staring straight ahead without any signs of emotion as Guy details how he allegedly killed Martin.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_132.jpg
9:40 a.m. ET: Guy is walking the jury through Martin's last moments of his life.

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9:37 a.m. ET: Prosecutor John Guy begins his opening statement by quoting Zimmmerman the night Martin was shot.
"[Expelitive] punks" said Guy. "They always get away."
9:30 a.m. ET: Nelson is instructing the jury of the responsibilities of their duty.
9:29 a.m. ET: The jury is seated, and opening statements should begin any minute.
9:22 a.m. ET: Nelson will allow all the statements the defense has requested to be admissible. The attorneys are now at a sidebar with the judge.
9:21 a.m. ET: Nelson rules that two statements are admissible. However, she has a question about a statement Zimmerman made to the police officer who arrived on the scene.
9:17 a.m. ET: The court PIO told HLN that as of this morning the jury is sequestered.
9:16 a.m. ET: Nelson and the prosecutors are reviewing a motion from the defense regarding "res gestae" statements these are the spontaneous statements that Zimmerman made in the moments and minutes after the alleged crime. West wants to use the statements in openings, so the Nelson will have a hearing on it now.
9:14 a.m. ET: Defense attorney Don West is asking Nelson about some statements he wants to use in his opening statements. Nelson said they need to have a hearing on the statements before opening statements can begin.
9:11 a.m. ET: Nelson said Martin family attorney Ben Crump cannot attend the trial until she has a chance to review the case law and to make a ruling on the issue.
9:07 a.m. ET: Zimmerman's family members who are not expected to testify can attend the trial.
9:05 a.m. ET: Nelson ruled that Zimmerman's family must leave the courtroom, because they are potential witnesses. Martin's family can attend the trial due to an exception to the rule of sequestration. The rule requires says all potential witnesses cannot attend the trial.
9:02 a.m. ET: Judge Debra Nelson is on the bench. She has asked the attorneys if there is any issues they need to discuss before bringing in the jury.
8:56 a.m. ET: Opening statements should begin in a few minutes.
8:33 a.m. ET: Martin's mother Sybrina Fulton and his father Tracy Martin gave a brief statement asking for prayers saying that no one should have to go through an ordeal like this.
"I am here today as Trayvon Martin's mother as I have been everyday. I will be attending this court to try to get justice for my son."

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8:29 a.m. ET: "We think this is a simple case." said Martin Family attorney Ben Crump. "We believe the evidence is overwhelming to hold George Zimmerman accountable for killing Trayvon Martin."
8:21 a.m. ET: Martin's parents are expected to make a statement in the courtroom any minute.

[boutons_deux]

Best comment I've read yet: the jury is a compromise, no blacks vs. no white men = white women.

I've been told that Z's shirt has grass stains on the back and T's only grass stains are on is knees. Z's lawyer hasn't mentioned that. Saving it for the end?

fat mexican ought not to have fooled with young black who Standing His Ground

[Trill Clinton]

the defense lawyer opened with a knock-knock joke

trayvon had no scars on his fists from almost beating zimmerman to death

[boobie4three]

fat mexican ought not to have fooled with young black who Standing His Ground

You don't have a right to attack someone for following you.

[BradLohaus]

The defense lawyer started out as a trainwreck, but he's been really good since. The lack of damage on T's hands is bad for Z for sure, but if that MMA witness is legit then that's really bad for T though.

[boutons_deux]

You don't have a right to attack someone for following you.

If you feel threatened, you can Stand Your Ground legally in FL.

[boobie4three]

the defense lawyer opened with a knock-knock joke

trayvon had no scars on his fists from almost beating zimmerman to death
Trayvon Martin Shooting: Autopsy results say slain teen had injuries to his knuckles

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57436083-504083/trayvon-martin-shooting-autopsy-results-say-slain-teen-had-injuries-to-his-knuckles/

[BradLohaus]

One other thing to think about is that somebody on the Martin side completely lied about that girl that was on the phone with Trayvon at the time. They said she was a minor to protect her identity but she was actually 18. Why??

[Trill Clinton]

Trayvon Martin Shooting: Autopsy results say slain teen had injuries to his knuckles

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57436083-504083/trayvon-martin-shooting-autopsy-results-say-slain-teen-had-injuries-to-his-knuckles/


10:08 a.m. ET: Guy said Martin's injuries do not indicate that he fought with Zimmerman.
"He didn't have bruised knuckles. He didn't have swollen hands. The only injury to his hand that was capable of being photograph was a small abrasion on his left ring finger. Trayvon Martin was right handed. That was the only injury to his hands." said Guy.

[CosmicCowboy]

You'd have to suspend common sense to believe the screaming came from anyone other than GZ. The photos proved he was the one getting beat on, not TM. It was reported TM had broken skin on his knuckles. I never saw a report about what kind of marks were on TM's face, but from the photos of GZ's hands, it's a safe bet there were no marks on TM's face. GZ was hoping someone would hear his cries which went on for a relatively long period of time(30 seconds maybe), which shows he was reluctant to pull out his weapon before he felt it was necessary.

Dude!!! Don't let a little thing like facts get in the way of convicting Zimmerman...

[CosmicCowboy]

10:08 a.m. ET: Guy said Martin's injuries do not indicate that he fought with Zimmerman.
"He didn't have bruised knuckles. He didn't have swollen hands. The only injury to his hand that was capable of being photograph was a small abrasion on his left ring finger. Trayvon Martin was right handed. That was the only injury to his hands." said Guy.

Bruises and swelling don't form in your fingers/hands from punching someone when you bleed out 30 seconds later from a gunshot.

Duh.

[Trill Clinton]

Bruises and swelling don't form in your fingers/hands from punching someone when you bleed out 30 seconds later from a gunshot.

Duh.


hey man, i'm just relaying what the experts and professionals have discussed so far. however, i do think if someone is brutally beating someone to the point of near death, there would be significant injuries to the perpetrators hands. there wasn't even any dna on tray's finger nails.

[Trill Clinton]

oh and awwww CC cares

[CosmicCowboy]

LOL no you just crack me up. Logic has no bearing on your position. It's gonna break your fucking heart when those white wimmen find Zimmerman innocent of second degree murder.

[Trill Clinton]

the mom had to leave the courtroom when they were about to play the 911 call with tray screaming for help. a mother knows her baby's voice...she couldn't take hearing her son screaming for his life again.

[CosmicCowboy]

The same baby momma that had just kicked him out of the house for being an unmanageable punk.

[Trill Clinton]

LOL no you just crack me up. Logic has no bearing on your position. It's gonna break your fucking heart when those white wimmen find Zimmerman innocent of second degree murder.

logic like the 2 experts who say its tray screaming? no dna or marks on tray's hands from the vicious beat down? my heart was broken when a kid was killed for walking home and the killer went home to sleep on his daddy's couch. logic has a lot of bearing on my position. i can't debate with you, you already admitted to having no problem with your children talking to strangers and giving them personal information lolsmh.

[Trill Clinton]

The same baby momma that had just kicked him out of the house for being an unmanageable punk.

aight, now you're not even trying to hide your racism. this is why you're team zimmerman hiding under the guise "they're both dummies". having to resort to racist stereotypes is telling that you are biased because the victim is a black male.

[CosmicCowboy]

logic like the 2 experts who say its tray screaming? no dna or marks on tray's hands from the vicious beat down? my heart was broken when a kid was killed for walking home and the killer went home to sleep on his daddy's couch. logic has a lot of bearing on my position. i can't debate with you, you already admitted to having no problem with your children talking to strangers and giving them personal information lolsmh.

The same two "experts" using inadmissable, untested "technology"?

Boo fucking Hoo Trill. Zimmerman is going to be found not guilty of second degree murder.

[Trill Clinton]

CC, did you or did you not say children, even your own, should acquiesce to a stranger's demands. including but not limited to their address and parent's phone number?

[CosmicCowboy]

:lmao @ Trill playing the race card. Since when is baby mama exclusively a black term?

[boutons_deux]

The same baby momma that had just kicked him out of the house for being an unmanageable punk.

so he deserved to die, got it.

[Trill Clinton]

:lmao @ Trill playing the race card. Since when is baby mama exclusively a black term?

you played the race card, doggie. don't play dumb.

did you say children should tell strangers where they live and give them their parent's phone number?

[CosmicCowboy]

CC, did you or did you not say children, even your own, should acquiesce to a stranger's demands. including but not limited to their address and parent's phone number?

Z: I'm with the neighborhood watch. I don't recognize you. Do you live here?

T option one: "I'm staying with my dad for a few days. He lives on X street."

T option two: Sucker punch Z, sit on his chest and pound his head into the concrete. *bang* T gets shot dead.

Which one seems to be the more successful option?

[clambake]

pound his head, lol.

[clambake]

i've nicked myself shaving that was worse than that.

[CosmicCowboy]

i've nicked myself shaving that was worse than that.

Somehow that doesn't surprise me.

[Trill Clinton]

Z: I'm with the neighborhood watch. I don't recognize you. Do you live here?

T option one: "I'm staying with my dad for a few days. He lives on X street."

T option two: Sucker punch Z, sit on his chest and pound his head into the concrete. *bang* T gets shot dead.

Which one seems to be the more successful option?


sounds like something a pedophile would say.

pedo: hi, i'm with a neighborhood watch and i noticed you walking home. you live around here?

cc jr: yup, my dad has a ranch down the road.

pedo: wanna ride in my van?

ccjr: sure!

don't talk to strangers kids.

[CosmicCowboy]

talking =/= sucker punching and sitting on Z's chest banging his head into the concrete.

[BradLohaus]

Black neighbor (elderly woman) is going to say it's Z's voice.

[Trill Clinton]

to the kids lurking, this is how you handle situations when approached by strangers:

watchmen/pedo/murderer: hi, i'm with the neighborhood watch. i don't recognize you. do you live here?

kid: sorry, sir. i'm not supposed to talk to strangers. *walks away in opposite direction*

watchmen/pedo/murderer: hey kid! i'm serious, i'm a watchmen and i need to verify you live here. what is your address?

kid: may i see a badge or an ID that proves you're a watchmen?

watchmen: errr uhhh...i don't have one.

kid: well i cannot give you that information. you're more than welcome to contact 911. *walks away in opposite direction so they can't follow you home*

[CosmicCowboy]

to the kids lurking, this is how you handle situations when approached by strangers:

watchmen/pedo/murderer: hi, i'm with the neighborhood watch. i don't recognize you. do you live here?

kid: sorry, sir. i'm not supposed to talk to strangers. *walks away in opposite direction*

watchmen/pedo/murderer: hey kid! i'm serious, i'm a watchmen and i need to verify you live here. what is your address?

kid: may i see a bad, or an ID that proves you're a watchmen?

watchmen: errr uhhh...i don't have one.

kid: well i cannot give you that information. you're more than welcome to contact 911. *walks away in opposite direction so they can't follow you home*

That would have been a successful strategy for Trayvon to pursue as well. There are a multitude of ways to keep from getting shot. Attacking the guy and trying to beat his ass wasn't one of them.

[boutons_deux]

talking =/= sucker punching and sitting on Z's chest banging his head into the concrete.

we know you, being a dickless gun fellator with manhood problems, just would have shot GZ.

But Martin didn't have a gun, so couldn't really be sure when he had fully Stood His Own Fucking Ground and reduced the threat he perceived. It was Martin's call, not yours.

Obviously, Martin would be alive if he had knocked GZ the fuck out, or killed him.

[CosmicCowboy]

we know you, being a dickless gun fellator with manhood problems, just would have shot GZ.

But Martin didn't have a gun, so couldn't really be sure when he had fully Stood His Own Fucking Ground and reduced the threat he perceived. It was Martin's call, not yours.

Obviously, Martin would be alive if he had knocked GZ the fuck out, or killed him.

Wow. I never realized Boo was such a macho badass.

[Trill Clinton]

That would have been a successful strategy for Trayvon to pursue as well. There are a multitude of ways to keep from getting shot. Attacking the guy and trying to beat his ass wasn't one of them.

yea he did. tray tried running away from zimmerman and then zimmerman followed him and cornered him.

NOTE TO CHILDREN LURKING: if the scenario doesn't work and the stranger is persistant, you use the "fight or flight" method. meaning if you're in a position to run, you run. if you have nowhere to run, then you fight for your life. better to try to fight off the stranger than let them rape, murder or kidnap you.

[CosmicCowboy]

yea he did. tray tried running away from zimmerman and then zimmerman followed him and cornered him.

NOTE TO CHILDREN LURKING: if the scenario doesn't work and the stranger is persistant, you use the "fight or flight" method. meaning if you're in a position to run, you run. if you have nowhere to run, then you fight for your life. better to try to fight off the stranger than let them rape, murder or kidnap you.

:lmao @ Trill rewriting history.

:lmao @ a fat middle aged mexican "cornering" a fit young black male in an open area with no corners or dead end alleys.

You crack me up, Trill.

[BradLohaus]

Z's lawyer just got objected to about 5 times for the same thing.

[Trill Clinton]

:lmao @ Trill rewriting history.

:lmao @ a fat middle aged mexican "cornering" a fit young black male in an open area with no corners or dead end alleys.

You crack me up, Trill.


he is not mexican, he is white-hispanic. white father and peruvian mother.

remember, trayvon was a pot head and he was not "fit". zimmerman trained in mma and wanted to be a police officer. he was in tip top shape before his league of sympathizers donated damn near a million dollars so he could eat the finest cuisine and get a new leather couch to sleep on.

[BradLohaus]

Z lawyer Omara saying that T's dad cursed at one of Z's family on the way out of the court room last week and wants him banned. Judge doesn't look like she'll do it.

[BradLohaus]

They sent the jury out and the family member is going to the stand... crazy

[Trill Clinton]

2:36 p.m. ET: O'Mara says it seems fair to have Zimmerman's parents in court if Martin's parents can be in court.

Judge Nelson and O'Mara keep cutting each other off because they disagree. #GeorgeZimmerman (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23GeorgeZimmerman&src=hash) #TrayvonMartin (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TrayvonMartin&src=hash)
— Jackie Damico (@InSessionJackie) June 24, 2013 (https://twitter.com/InSessionJackie/statuses/349234129247805440)
2:33 p.m. ET: The judges says Benjamin Crump, the Martin family's attorney, should not be in the courtroom because he's a witness.
2:31 p.m. ET: Defense attorney Mark O'Mara argues that Zimmerman's parents should be permitted to sit in the courtroom during trial testimony, despite the fact that they're on the witness list.
2:29 p.m. ET: The judge has dismissed the jurors so she can take up a matter with attorneys outside of their presence.
2:28 p.m. ET: West disputes that Martin was unarmed.
"Travyon Martin armed himself with the concrete sidewalk and used it to smash George Zimmerman’s head. No different than if he picked up a brick or smashed his head against a wall. That is a deadly weapon," said West. He asked jurors to keep an open mind as he concluded his opening statement.
2:22 p.m. ET: Zimmerman had a gun but many people didn't know about it, according to West.
"He didn’t brag about it, didn’t tell people, didn’t show it," said West.
West says Zimmerman got his permit in 2009 and there's no evidence he was trigger happy.
2:21 p.m. ET: West says Zimmerman has gained a lot of weight since the incident. At the time, Zimmerman was fitter and had been working out, according to West.
2:18 p.m. ET: West says Martin was a former linebacker and "knew how to give a hit and take a hit." He also says Martin "knew how to mount someone so as to incapacitate him."
2:16 p.m. ET: The prosecution objects and the judge sustains, telling West to refrain from commenting on evidence. She tells him opening statements are just for attorneys to tell jurors what they think the evidence will show.
2:14 p.m. ET: Zimmerman's neighbor said it was Zimmerman screaming on the 911 call, according to West.
2:12 p.m. ET: West says Martin's dad then said it was his son screaming on the 911 call and that Martin's mom agreed.
2:10 p.m. ET: Martin's dad lowered his head and said it wasn't his son screaming when detectives first asked him, says West.
"And then, of course, more stuff started to happen in town," said West. He talks about the community reaction starting to build and a lawsuit that was filed to release the 911 call.
"There was great, great public pressure on the city to release these recordings," said West.
2:06 p.m. ET: Zimmerman's uncle knew "immediately, without question in his mind" that it was Zimmerman, says West. Other friends and family agree. But he says that other witnesses will say it was Martin's voice, like his mom. "She certainly wants it to be his voice," said West.
2:04 p.m. ET: Scientifically, you can't figure out someone's age when they're screaming, says West. You're left with people who know the voices to determine who it is.
2:02 p.m. ET: West is discussing the 911 call, saying that common sense tells you that the person crying for "help" is the one on the bottom.
"Can science telling us who is yelling for help? And the short answer is, 'No,'" said West. "It’s either a waste of time or the results are unreliable."
1:58 p.m. ET:

First witness in #ZimmermanTrial (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23ZimmermanTrial&src=hash) should be Chad Joseph, the person #TrayvonMartin (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23TrayvonMartin&src=hash) bought the Skittles for...
— Vinnie Politan (@VinniePolitan) June 24, 2013 (https://twitter.com/VinniePolitan/statuses/349222171710722048)

1:55 p.m. ET: West shows jurors a photo of Martin's pants and tells them to pay close attention to the stains on the knees. He says this shows that Martin was on his knees, straddling Zimmerman.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/martin-pants-knees.jpg1:52 p.m. ET: West says Martin's clothing wasn't packaged properly -- it was wet and put in a plastic bag instead of a paper bag so that it could dry out. He also says the gun shot proves they were less than an arm's length away.
"They were face-to-face, basically on top of each other," said West.
1:48 pm. ET: If Martin grabbed his chest after being shot, then he should have had his own blood on his hands, says West. He again points out that Martin's hands weren't bagged on the scene.
1:46 p.m. ET: West says Martin's hands were never bagged at the scene and the medical examiner never photographed his palms, which could explain why they never found Zimmerman's blood on him.
1:44 p.m. ET: West shows jurors how Zimmerman pulled out the gun and shot Martin.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/west.pointing.gun_.jpg1:40 p.m. ET: Martin was leaning over Zimmerman, punching him, according to West. This, he says, explains the forensic evidence. The soft drink in the pouch of Martin's hoodie was also causing the hoodie to pull away from Martin's body, says West.
1:39 p.m. ET: West says the hole in Martin’s sweatshirt was a contact shot because the fabric was shredded. He says the hole in Martin’s undershirt was also somewhat shredded. He says the wound in Martin's skin was very round and had a 2x2 area of stippling.
"The clothing Travyon Martin was wearing was separate from his skin by at least a certain amount," said West.
1:35 p.m. ET: West starts back up by apologizing to jurors for the knock knock joke he told earlier.
"No more bad jokes, I promise that. I was convinced it was the delivery," he said.
1:31 p.m. ET: The judge is back on the bench and the jury is being seated

[CosmicCowboy]

he is not mexican, he is white-hispanic. white father and peruvian mother.

remember, trayvon was a pot head and he was not "fit". zimmerman trained in mma and wanted to be a police officer. he was in tip top shape before his league of sympathizers donated damn near a million dollars so he could eat the finest cuisine and get a new leather couch to sleep on.

So is Obama white/Kenyan? :lmao

[BradLohaus]

State is shredding this guy.. its a Z friend

[BradLohaus]

Dude just said "I don't want to be up here" that was sad and hilarious.

[Trill Clinton]

So is Obama white/Kenyan? :lmao


kenya isn't a ethnicity. he is mulatto.

[CosmicCowboy]

kenya isn't a ethnicity. he is mulatto.

So Peruvian is an ethnicity?

[Trill Clinton]

So Peruvian is an ethnicity?

no peruvian is not an ethinicity, that would be considered hispanic. i said he is white-hispanic. a white father and peruvian mother.

[CosmicCowboy]

I seriously doubt Trayvon consulted Zimmermans Ancestry.com webpage before attacking him. that is your theory, right? That Trayvon thought he was "cornered" in a wide open space and decided his best defense was to Attack Zimmerman first?

[Wild Cobra]

the defense lawyer opened with a knock-knock joke

trayvon had no scars on his fists from almost beating zimmerman to death

Why would he have scars?

Do you know what you are saying?

[Wild Cobra]

10:08 a.m. ET: Guy said Martin's injuries do not indicate that he fought with Zimmerman.
"He didn't have bruised knuckles. He didn't have swollen hands. The only injury to his hand that was capable of being photograph was a small abrasion on his left ring finger. Trayvon Martin was right handed. That was the only injury to his hands." said Guy.
Yep.

It takes more than a few minutes of blood pumping for bruises to form.

[Wild Cobra]

hey man, i'm just relaying what the experts and professionals have discussed so far. however, i do think if someone is brutally beating someone to the point of near death, there would be significant injuries to the perpetrators hands. there wasn't even any dna on tray's finger nails.
They are being intellectually dishonest to the jury. Seems that means they don't have a case.

[Wild Cobra]

:lmao @ Trill playing the race card. Since when is baby mama exclusively a black term?
Don't you know?

Any word a black finds offensive is a racist remark.

[TeyshaBlue]

They are being intellectually dishonest.....

Vitamin I RDA exceeded.

[TeyshaBlue]

lol @ "a black".

[TeyshaBlue]

and by lol I mean GTFO.

[TeyshaBlue]

Hey! I'm a white!

My dog's a brown!

[TeyshaBlue]

Hey! I'm a white!

My dog's a brown!

My cat..wait, it's like 3 colors. Now what do I do?!!!111

[TeyshaBlue]

Sorry. Carry on.

[CosmicCowboy]

My cat..wait, it's like 3 colors. Now what do I do?!!!111

Start by getting her spayed...:lol

[JudynTX]

Are you all actually watching the trial?

[Trill Clinton]

I seriously doubt Trayvon consulted Zimmermans Ancestry.com webpage before attacking him. that is your theory, right? That Trayvon thought he was "cornered" in a wide open space and decided his best defense was to Attack Zimmerman first?

what are you talking about? you said zimmerman was mexican and i just corrected you that zimmerman has a white father.

its obvious zimmerman wasn't going to just let tray "get away" if that was the case he would have stayed his coward ass in the truck like he was directed to. he was on a mission to catch his suspect by any means necessary. trayvon was forced to stand his ground.

[Trill Clinton]

Why would he have scars?

Do you know what you are saying?


well when you are bashing someone's head into concrete and punching them in the face, usually there is scarring or dna. none of which was found on tray's lifeless body.

[CosmicCowboy]

what are you talking about? you said zimmerman was mexican and i just corrected you that zimmerman has a white father.

its obvious zimmerman wasn't going to just let tray "get away" if that was the case he would have stayed his coward ass in the truck like he was directed to. he was on a mission to catch his suspect by any means necessary. trayvon was forced to stand his ground.

:lmao @ Trill invoking stand your ground. This shit is hilarious. :lmao at no DNA under his fingernails. That is a classic DEFENSIVE struggle sign. You would make a terrible attorney. What a loser...:lmao

[FuzzyLumpkins]

If you say so. Apparently you do need to be walked through it.

WC was making comments about what an audio signal expert would say. I started asking him how he would know that one way or the other. As expected he began googling in order to see like he know what he was talking about. I then started making fun of him because of it.

I at no point made a comment about how good the evidence in question was. I never implied along those lines either.

I get that you don't like having your stupidity demonstrated point by point. Chump does it the Socratic method of asking questions. I don't do that. Read up a bit and perhaps you will catch nuances like that.

But other then that have a nice death in a bus fire.


If the same expert and the same technology had it as Zimmerman screaming Fuzzy would be demanding it not be admissible because the technology wasn't universally accepted.

Man that is the very post before you spouted off.

I know you are lazy but come on. I don't have enough information to say one way or another. Judge made her decision and I am find with that. It's all that really matters and I have no reason to think she is unfair.You certainly not objective.

[Sportcamper]

Cosmic- Isn’t the prosecution claiming that Zimmerman’s blood was not on Trayvon’s hands & clothing? If that were true that would be rather bizarre, yes?

[Creepn]

Don't you know?

Any word a black finds offensive is a racist remark.

Tsk tsk tsk. All you see is skin color by this obvious quote.

[CosmicCowboy]

Cosmic- Isn’t the prosecution claiming that Zimmerman’s blood was not on Trayvon’s hands & clothing? If that were true that would be rather bizarre, yes?

Not really. I got in a similar fight once in high school. He started it I finished it. He swung and I leaned forward/sideways and it glanced off my forehead...followed with a left hook to the nose, when he staggered back I tripped him, got on his chest with my knees on his biceps pinning his arms...had both hands on his forehead with my thumbs in his eyes...I'd pop the back of his head on the concrete three times and ask him if he was ready to give up...only had to do that twice. Didn't get a drop of blood on me.

[Trill Clinton]

:lmao @ Trill invoking stand your ground. This shit is hilarious. :lmao at no DNA under his fingernails. That is a classic DEFENSIVE struggle sign. You would make a terrible attorney. What a loser...:lmao

damn you really are emotionally invested in zimmerman being found not guilty. if tray was kicking zimmerman's ass to the point he thought he would die, there would be some dna on tray's body, mainly his killer hands....none found.

the law says all zimmerman has to prove he thought his life was in danger, yet his attorney is trying to prove that his life was in danger and unfortunately for zimmerman the only way for them to prove that zimmerman's life was actually in danger was for him to have been damaged more than he was. his nose wasn't broken and he had a scratch on the back of his head.

so the jury has to be convinced trayvon intended to kill the gun toting vigilante. i don't see the jury buying that but this is amerikkka and it wouldn't surprise me if zimmerman is found not guilty.

[Trill Clinton]

Not really. I got in a similar fight once in high school. He started it I finished it.


^^^^

story is made up

[CosmicCowboy]

damn you really are emotionally invested in zimmerman being found not guilty. if tray was kicking zimmerman's ass to the point he thought he would die, there would be some dna on tray's body, mainly his killer hands....none found.

the law says all zimmerman has to prove he thought his life was in danger, yet his attorney is trying to prove that his life was in danger and unfortunately for zimmerman the only way for them to prove that zimmerman's life was actually in danger was for him to have been damaged more than he was. his nose wasn't broken and he had a scratch on the back of his head.

so the jury has to be convinced trayvon intended to kill the gun toting vigilante. i don't see the jury buying that but this is amerikkka and it wouldn't surprise me if zimmerman is found not guilty.

Like I said, you would make a fucking terrible attorney. You can't differentiate between what the facts are and what you want them to be.

[CosmicCowboy]

^^^^

story is made up

And you know this how? Again what you WANT the world to be like as opposed to what it IS?

[Trill Clinton]

Like I said, you would make a fucking terrible attorney. You can't differentiate between what the facts are and what you want them to be.

where in that post you quoted did i make up parts of the story of misinterpret the facts? here is what florida state law says about self defense.

It is according to the law:

http://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/Chapter776/All
76.041 Use of force by aggressor.—The justification described in the preceding sections of this chapter is not available to a person who:
(1) Is attempting to commit, committing, or escaping after the commission of, a forcible felony; or
(2) Initially provokes the use of force against himself or herself, unless:
(a) Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or
(b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use of force.



i don't think the jury will believe a busted nose and a scratch is enough to determine a person's life was in danger. especially when law enforcement was en route.





And you know this how? Again what you WANT the world to be like as opposed to what it IS?


because whether "you finished it" or not is irrelevent. plus your history of lying in this thread makes it hard for me to believe anything you say. i wouldn't believe a word out of your mouth if your tounge was notorized.

[CosmicCowboy]

:lol at resorting to "you must be lying because it doesn't validate my prejudices".

fucking pissant loser.

BTW, It's notarize not notorize loser.

[Fabbs]

2:10 p.m. ET: Martin's dad lowered his head and said it wasn't his son screaming when detectives first asked him, says West.
"And then, of course, more stuff started to happen in town," said West. He talks about the community reaction starting to build and a lawsuit that was filed to release the 911 call.
http://fc04.deviantart.net/fs13/f/2007/065/8/2/Lionel_Hutz_by_Kaaziel.jpg
"Mr. and Mrs Martin, I'm going to need you to say it was your sons voice on the recording."

2:12 p.m. ET: West says Martin's dad then said it was his son screaming on the 911 call and that Martin's mom agreed.

2:14 p.m. ET: Zimmerman's neighbor said it was Zimmerman screaming on the 911 call, according to West.
Oops!

[George Gervin's Afro]

CC will go down fighting defending zimmerman

[Fabbs]

Black neighbor (elderly woman) is going to say it's Z's voice.
Today or future day(s)?

[Trill Clinton]

:lol at resorting to "you must be lying because it doesn't validate my prejudices".

fucking pissant loser.

BTW, It's notarize not notorize loser.


http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/umad.gif

look here, all the prosecution has to do is convince the jury that zimmerman wasn't defending himself. he provoked a confrontation while having a loaded weapon on his person and he knew the confrontation would end with him shooting tray, which he did. if the prosecution can do that then they win. if they can't then ya buddy walks away a free man. you resorting to emoticons and calling me a loser is sad at this juncture.

[CosmicCowboy]

CC will go down fighting defending zimmerman

I'm not defending Zimmerman. I have made that clear over and over asshole.

I'm saying that all of you that think Zimmerman is gonna get convicted of second degree murder are kidding yourselves. Ain't gonna happen.

You losers can't even look at the facts of the case logically and see that.

[Trill Clinton]

omara is doing a good job at getting the operator to suggest his statements led to zimmerman following trayvon.

[CosmicCowboy]

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/umad.gif

look here, all the prosecution has to do is convince the jury that zimmerman wasn't defending himself. he provoked a confrontation while having a loaded weapon on his person and he knew the confrontation would end with him shooting tray, which he did. if the prosecution can do that then they win. if they can't then ya buddy walks away a free man. you resorting to emoticons and calling me a loser is sad at this juncture.

Like I said. You would be an awful attorney. You are claiming all sorts of shit that is not backed up by the facts of the case.

And yeah, I'm not mad but I do find you to be a boring, stupid piece of shit.

[George Gervin's Afro]

I'm not defending Zimmerman. I have made that clear over and over asshole.

I'm saying that all of you that think Zimmerman is gonna get convicted of second degree murder are kidding yourselves. Ain't gonna happen.

You losers can't even look at the facts of the case logically and see that.

calm down john wayne... zimmerman was a trigger happy wannabe...

[CosmicCowboy]

calm down john wayne... zimmerman was a trigger happy wannabe...

That won't be convicted of second degree murder because Martin was clearly beating on Zimmerman (you can argue the severity of the wounds all day long but it's irrelevant) when he got shot.

[Trill Clinton]

Like I said. You would be an awful attorney. You are claiming all sorts of shit that is not backed up by the facts of the case.

And yeah, I'm not mad but I do find you to be a boring, stupid piece of shit.

okay, whatever dude. after this i'm not responding to your juvenile tantrums in this thread until you can debate like an adult.

[Trill Clinton]

again, according to state law, zimmerman's attorney must convince the jury that his client used necessary force due to his life being in danger. the injuries he sustained from his ass whoopin' are not life threatening. therefore, the prosecution will paint the picture of an fed up and armed former neighborhood watchmen who followed an unarmed child and killed him. hopefully the jury of mothers will see the pain in trayvon's mother's eyes and empathize with her and make the right decision. only person's who's life was in danger that night died.

[CosmicCowboy]

okay, whatever dude. after this i'm not responding to your juvenile tantrums in this thread until you can debate like an adult.

:lmao @ debating like an adult...the guy that makes up shit that has absolutely no relationship to the facts of the case.

It's clearly all about race with you.

You will defend the stupid black guy as opposed to the stupid anglo/hispanic guy just because you claim to be black yourself.

[Trill Clinton]

4:47 p.m. ET: The judge wants to give attorneys more time to research the matter. The jury is being brought back in.
4:44 p.m. ET: The defense says the call shows previous "bad acts" committed by Zimmerman because he called police about a black male in the past. The prosecutor says it shows the basis for his comment about "these [expletive] always getting away."
4:40 p.m. ET: The attorneys are arguing about the relevance of the call. The prosecutor says this call shows Zimmerman's state of mind.
4:39 p.m. ET: The prosecutor is playing another 911 call made by Zimmerman on August 3, 2011, where he reports a suspicious person. He tells the dispatcher they had some break-ins in the neighborhood and the suspect matches the description of the person who allegedly did it. The defense objects to the relevance of the call. The judge asks the jurors to leave.




the prosecution is winning day 1 so far by painting a more clearer picture of a vigilante watchmen.

[Creepn]

Lol CC is so immature. Pretty pathetic that old men still resort to kindergarten type attacks.

[Fabbs]

:lol If roles and race were reversed.
Travis Martinez a 17 year old Peru-white mixture in the neighborhood
shot by
George Washington Zimmer a black Neighborhood Watch guy.

Now what would the Trills be saying? :lol

[Creepn]

Yeah the overall feeling so far is that the prosecution is winning so far.

[CosmicCowboy]

again, according to state law, zimmerman's attorney must convince the jury that his client used necessary force due to his life being in danger. the injuries he sustained from his ass whoopin' are not life threatening. therefore, the prosecution will paint the picture of an fed up and armed former neighborhood watchmen who followed an unarmed child and killed him. hopefully the jury of mothers will see the pain in trayvon's mother's eyes and empathize with her and make the right decision. only person's who's life was in danger that night died.


:lmao:lmao:lmao at the internet forum attorney that is too stupid to understand the nuance between "his life was in danger" and "had reason to believe his life was in danger".

Now you try to play internet forensic scientist and say "see, his skull isn't bashed in and there wasn't THAT much blood...so his life wasn't in danger".

Zimmerman was pinned to the ground by a 6'1" tall athletic man that was sitting on his chest repeatedly banging his head against the concrete.

Most reasonable people will give the defendant the benefit of the doubt on that one that he might have had REASON to fear for his life.

[Trill Clinton]

:lol If roles and race were reversed.
Travis Martinez a 17 year old Peru-white mixture in the neighborhood
shot by
George Washington Zimmer a black Neighborhood Watch guy.

Now what would the Trills be saying? :lol

bruh, look at my post history. Trill is #teamkids, no matter the color. when i feel a child was a victim of abuse or in this case, death, i am going to have their side. this case is fucked up because a unnarmed innocent kid died for nothing.

ya'll bringing up "if tray was x,y,z" just tells me ya'll are the ones with the race issue, not me.

[Wild Cobra]

Has the defense called any witnesses yet? It's still the prosecutors turn, isn't it. Calling a win for the prosecution... laughable!

[TeyshaBlue]

:lol If roles and race were reversed.
Travis Martinez a 17 year old Peru-white mixture in the neighborhood
shot by
George Washington Zimmer a black Neighborhood Watch guy.

Now what would the Trills be saying? :lol

Thanks for the daily irrelevant comment. See you tomorrow!

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lol at resorting to "you must be lying because it doesn't validate my prejudices".

fucking pissant loser.

BTW, It's notarize not notorize loser.

When someone resorts to grammar smack in an effort to shore up their argument, that is not a good sign.

I deduct a point from CC showing weakness.

[Trill Clinton]

lol the defense is upset at the 911 calls from the past being played. i hope the judge allows the other to be called cuz lawd knows zimmerman had 911 on speed dial.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lmao @ debating like an adult...the guy that makes up shit that has absolutely no relationship to the facts of the case.

It's clearly all about race with you.

You will defend the stupid black guy as opposed to the stupid anglo/hispanic guy just because you claim to be black yourself.

Well something is surely clear but I don't think it's what you think it is. I really never thought you were this bad CC.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

That won't be convicted of second degree murder because Martin was clearly beating on Zimmerman (you can argue the severity of the wounds all day long but it's irrelevant) when he got shot.

Nice bravado. Perhaps you could point us to a specific statute or precedent to validate this claim.

It really seems that you are arguing like WC does. Fill in the gaps on things you clearly have no way of knowing in a way it just so happens to help those who you are partisan for.

Go prune a tree or something.

[CosmicCowboy]

Nice bravado. Perhaps you could point us to a specific statute or precedent to validate this claim.

It really seems that you are arguing like WC does. Fill in the gaps on things you clearly have no way of knowing in a way it just so happens to help those who you are partisan for.

Go prune a tree or something.

It's actually pretty simple. Trill even posted it for you even though he is too stupid to understand what he posted.


a) Such force is so great that the person reasonably believes that he or she is in imminent danger of death or great bodily harm and that he or she has exhausted every reasonable means to escape such danger other than the use of force which is likely to cause death or great bodily harm to the assailant; or
(b) In good faith, the person withdraws from physical contact with the assailant and indicates clearly to the assailant that he or she desires to withdraw and terminate the use of force, but the assailant continues or resumes the use of force.


Martin was sitting on Zimmerman's chest whacking his head against the concrete. Even the prosecution admits this. After you get your head whacked against the concrete a few times it's pretty reasonable that you might think you were in danger of great bodily harm.

Zimmerman was apparently crying like a girl for Martin to stop. Martin apparently didn't stop until the gunshot stopped him.

That is a hell of a hill for the prosecution to overcome.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

That is much better. You stopped behaving like a 12 year old.

Now where is the proof of Martin crying or the prosecutions admission? What basis in Florida is used to determine what is a reasonable act to think one's life is in danger?

[Trill Clinton]

i know what i posted and i stated that the defense has to prove zimmerman's life was in danger. which is wasn't.

[Trill Clinton]

bloody nose, scratch on back of head=/= i'm about to die, let me kill this lil nigga.

[CosmicCowboy]

i know what i posted and i stated that the defense has to prove zimmerman's life was in danger. which is wasn't.

You are still too fucking stupid to understand the nuance.

The defense does NOT have to prove his life was in danger.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Just a random note, Jorge must be using a lot of that tea party money on food. Since tea baggers have been giving him thousands for killing a black kid he's blown up :lol

http://ionenewsone.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/george-zimmerman.png?w=747&h=488

[Trill Clinton]

You are still too fucking stupid to understand the nuance.

The defense does NOT have to prove his life was in danger.

yes they do. they have to prove the act of self defense, the definition of which i posted and you quoted. the prosecution just has to shoot down the notion that trayvon was beating zimmerman to death and paint the picture of zimmerman as an armed, obsesssed, former watchmen. which they've done so far.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

yes they do. they have to prove the act of self defense, the definition of which i posted and you quoted. the prosecution just has to shoot down the notion that trayvon was beating zimmerman to death and paint the picture of zimmerman as an armed, obsesssed, former watchmen. which they've done so far.

Trill, I haven't been keeping up with the details, but in Florida you don't have to prove self defense like most other states. The burden of proof is on the prosecution to prove it WASN'T self defense per Florida law iirc. I think that's totally backwards, but it's how the law is.

[CosmicCowboy]

yes they do. they have to prove the act of self defense, the definition of which i posted and you quoted. the prosecution just has to shoot down the notion that trayvon was beating zimmerman to death and paint the picture of zimmerman as an armed, obsesssed, former watchmen. which they've done so far.

Got DAMN you are stupid.

Getting your head whacked into the concrete over and over is clearly hazardous to your health. The defense has to prove REASONABLE FEAR of serious bodily harm. You don't have to SUSTAIN serious bodily harm before using deadly force to defend yourself.

[Trill Clinton]

Got DAMN you are stupid.

Getting your head whacked into the concrete over and over is clearly hazardous to your health. The defense has to prove FEAR of serious bodily harm. You don't have to SUSTAIN serious bodily harm before using deadly force.

how can they prove fear of serious bodily harm when zimmerman was armed and wasn't afraid to follow tray? how would you convince a jury zimmerman was so scared of tray that he followed him and confronted him?


Trill, I haven't been keeping up with the details, but in Florida you don't have to prove self defense like most other states. The burden of proof is on the prosecution to prove it WASN'T self defense per Florida law iirc. I think that's totally backwards, but it's how the law is.

oh i got that definition from the florida laws and statutes site regarding justifiable use of force. but i think the prosecution is headed in the right direction in proving that it wasn't self defense on zimmerman's part so far. they set a good foundation so far.

[CosmicCowboy]

:lmao

You are blinded by your prejudice. They were both assholes.

Defense just has to prove reasonable fear of bodily harm. That is self evident.

Zimmerman by your own admission could have shot Martin any time he wanted to but he didn't. He apparently (agree we don't know when the gun came out) didn't use the gun until he had been physically attacked and was getting his head pounded into the concrete for at least 30 seconds according to witnesses and the timeline. That's justifiably reasonable fear of serious bodily harm.

[CosmicCowboy]

It is based on what a reasonable person would believe at the time of the shooting. You can muddy the water all you want leading up to the event but the fact is Zimmerman didn't just track down Martin and shoot him.

What we do know about the shooting:

It was a dark, rainy night.

Martin had apparently punched Zimmerman in the nose knocking him down. The police and the EMs said his nose was broken but you claim it wasn't. whatever. We do know from physical evidence that Zimmerman took a good punch in the nose.

We do know from physical evidence and eye witness testimony that Martin was sitting on Zimmerman's chest whacking his head against the concrete.

We know from eye witnesses and audio that someone was screaming and calling for help for at least 30 seconds before the gunshot. It's pretty reasonable that the guy doing the whacking wasn't doing the screaming.

So, under those circumstances...

Dark rainy night, a young athletic guy has already punched you in the nose and he is now sitting on your chest pinning you to the ground and banging your head against the concrete while you scream for help and beg him to stop...

under THOSE circumstances would a REASONABLE person have a fear of serious bodily injury?

I think they would and I think those ladies on the jury will agree.

[tlongII]

CC is absolutely right. I see no way that Zimmerman gets convicted.

[Big Empty]

Did the kid punch Zimmerman and bang his head for 30 seaconds cause he feared his own life?

[CosmicCowboy]

Did the kid punch Zimmerman and bang his head for 30 seaconds cause he feared his own life?

doesn't matter at all.

Whether he did or not, there is no evidence that Zimmerman initiated the final physical confrontation.

[CosmicCowboy]

Did the kid punch Zimmerman and bang his head for 30 seaconds cause he feared his own life?

That is such a weak fucking argument. Martin always had the option to beat feet and run the fuck away. He wasn't cornered in some dead end alley. It was a wide open space. No way Zimmerman could have run him down.

Zimmerman is an asshole but none of the evidence shows that Zimmerman just hunted him down and shot him.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

That is such a weak fucking argument. Martin always had the option to beat feet and run the fuck away. He wasn't cornered in some dead end alley. It was a wide open space. No way Zimmerman could have run him down.

Zimmerman is an asshole but none of the evidence shows that Zimmerman just hunted him down and shot him.

What if he had pulled his gun? You just turn your back on a guy abnd run from a guy hostile towards you and with a pistol right in your face?

[InRareForm]

the defense guy opened with a knock knock joke? wtf

WpQSJVgKn8k

[Big Empty]

the defense guy opened with a knock knock joke? wtf

WpQSJVgKn8ksmh

[DMX7]

Zimmerman may still win.

[boobie4three]

the defense guy opened with a knock knock joke? wtf

WpQSJVgKn8k

I'm afraid Zimmerman would have been better off hiring a REAL clown from PT Barnum and Bailey Circus.

[Big Empty]

CC has no problem if a man driving this van asks his children where they live and if he can offer them a ride

http://universalspectrum.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=253&d=1337242735LMFAO man im just on the 5th page of this thread. so entertaining you racist f**ks are all funny

[Ignignokt]

Trayboon should have not picked a fight with an armed citizen.

[Ignignokt]

lol the defense is upset at the 911 calls from the past being played. i hope the judge allows the other to be called cuz lawd knows zimmerman had 911 on speed dial.

that doesn't prove whether george zimmerman was in danger of his life or not.

[Ignignokt]

Zimmerman may still win. he should.

All joking aside. It's tragic, but lets not make either side saints here.

[Ignignokt]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=bc0_1371690036
Since lie detectors are not sufficient evidence, if the defense can convince the jury that martin did aim for the gun like zman said, case over.

No goalpost moving, "but but.. he didn't have any life threatening injuries!!! herp derp!!".

By the time you get a life threatening injury you may not be able to respond to save your life, dumbass lol

[Ignignokt]

yes they do. they have to prove the act of self defense, the definition of which i posted and you quoted. the prosecution just has to shoot down the notion that trayvon was beating zimmerman to death and paint the picture of zimmerman as an armed, obsesssed, former watchmen. which they've done so far.

Yeah, but then again, you'd easily believe tawana bradley would have been raped by a gang of white betas because you're so immensly buttflustered about white privelege and your social justice crackhouse addiction imho

[Trill Clinton]

Yeah, but then again, you'd easily believe tawana bradley would have been raped by a gang of white betas because you're so immensly buttflustered about white privelege and your social justice crackhouse addiction imho


sorry, can't take you seriously when you call trayvon "trayboon" its obvious you're prejudice and are siding with zimmerman. so far all the racist comments have come from the pro zimmerman side in this thread, sad.

[Th'Pusher]

Z: I'm with the neighborhood watch. I don't recognize you. Do you live here?

T option one: "I'm staying with my dad for a few days. He lives on X street."

T option two: Sucker punch Z, sit on his chest and pound his head into the concrete. *bang* T gets shot dead.

Which one seems to be the more successful option?

Now do that same exercise with which options Z could have have chosen which would have been a more successful option (i.e. not being tried with 2nd degree murder).

[Creepn]

Lol CC, you want a teen, whose parents weren't home atm, to give a complete stranger the street he lives on??? Man get the fuck outta here with that bullshit.

[Wild Cobra]

lol the defense is upset at the 911 calls from the past being played. i hope the judge allows the other to be called cuz lawd knows zimmerman had 911 on speed dial.
Really?

Speed dial for 911...


LOL...

Don't you comprehend anything put out in these threads? He normally, and purhaps always, called the non-emergency number. Not 911.

Are you being intellectually dishonest, or what?

[Sportcamper]

I'm afraid Zimmerman would have been better off hiring a REAL clown from PT Barnum and Bailey Circus. No Joke...

Prosecution is claiming that Trayvon Martin was not "armed" But in fact he was armed with a deadly weapon.... The sidewalk…
Zimmerman’s Azz Clown Defense…

[Wild Cobra]

No Joke...

Prosecution is claiming that Trayvon Martin was not "armed" But in fact he was armed with a deadly weapon.... The sidewalk…
Zimmerman’s Azz Clown Defense…
It's not a joke of a defense. A person can be pushed into a weapon. It's a hoot to see that some people don't realize that.

[CosmicCowboy]

Slamming someones head against a hard surface is about 10X as effective as punching them.

[CosmicCowboy]

Lol CC, you want a teen, whose parents weren't home atm, to give a complete stranger the street he lives on??? Man get the fuck outta here with that bullshit.

And you want him to punch the guy in the nose.

I get that you are fucking stupid.

My point is that there were a myriad of non-confrontational choices for Martin to have taken.

[Sportcamper]

My point is that there were a myriad of non-confrontational choices for Martin to have taken.

George Zimmerman…Wanna B Cop…No Formal Training…No Watch group uniform or ID Badge…Was told by police dispatcher to not follow Trayvon…Zimmerman armed with a 9 mm ignores instructions & follows 17 year old Trayvon…Trayvon asks hey man why are you following me…Smart azz loser Zimmerman does not identify himself as a Neighborhood watch person but instead says I am not following you….Zimmerman is a complete whack who started the confrontation and when 17 year old Trayvon got the upper hand in the conflict he was shot…

[boutons_deux]

Slamming someones head against a hard surface is about 10X as effective as punching them.

shooting them is even more effective. Z murdered M while M was Standing His Ground.

[JudynTX]

I hope Judge Nelson lets the previous 911 calls that GZ made into evidence.

[boutons_deux]

And you want him to punch the guy in the nose.

I get that you are fucking stupid.

My point is that there were a myriad of non-confrontational choices for Martin to have taken.

My point is that there were two actions that Z did that were against Neighborhood Watch rules:

1. be armed

2. confront the suspect

GFY

[clambake]

interesting country of yours.......where a guy like george can determine if anyone is a suspect.

[CosmicCowboy]

I never said Zimmerman was right,. Zimmerman is an asshole.

I guess you guys can't read. I have said that over and over.

That doesn't mean he is guilty of second degree murder.

[CosmicCowboy]

I hope Judge Nelson lets the previous 911 calls that GZ made into evidence.

Maybe I'm just not understanding this, but isn't that why they have neighborhood watches? To have citizens help the police by getting involved and calling in when they see something suspicious? Why would Zimmerman's previous calls be considered a bad thing?

[JudynTX]

He didn't need to be armed.

[JudynTX]

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/03/22/george-zimmerman-s-history-of-911-calls-a-complete-log.html

[Sportcamper]

I guess you guys can't read. I have said that over and over. That doesn't mean he is guilty of second degree murder.

I understand that and Alan Dershowitz agrees with you…I just think that Zimmerman should be released to the populace in Compton so justice can be served…

[resistanze]

Hilarious that if Trayvon was armed and shot the armed man that was following him home dead, he'd be completely justified by Florida Law. Too bad he only had his fists.

[CosmicCowboy]

As I see it, there is no physical evidence or eyewitness testimony I have heard about of how the confrontation started or who physically initiated it. Only two people knew and one of them is dead. Zimmerman says Martin jumped him and sucker punched him.

All this other smoke leading up to the actual shooting is just smoke. They can't prove that Zimmerman initiated the PHYSICAL confrontation. Zimmerman may be a disgusting pig but at the time of the shooting a reasonable person in his situation getting the crap beat out of him would have REASONABLE fear of serious bodily injury and that's all it takes to avoid conviction..

[Trill Clinton]

cross examining the neighborhood watch person:

10:53 a.m. ET: Dorival said all the police needs for the neighborhood watch to do is be its "eyes and ears."
10:49 a.m. ET: West asked Dorival if Zimmerman's behavior every raised any red flags. Dorival said no he seemed concerned and wanted to help.
10:47 a.m. ET: Dorival said acted as a "liaison" between the police and the neighborhood watch.
10:43 a.m. ET: West asked Dorival if a resident told her if there was a home invasion and robbery in the community. The prosecution objected as hearsay, and the judge sustained their objection. West reworded his question, and Dorival said yes one resident said she was traumatized by a home invasion where the perpetrator broke into her home during the day when she was home with her small child.
10:39 a.m. ET: Dorival said residents of Zimmerman's neighborhood they were concerned about robberies, and the fencing around the neighborhood.
10:37 a.m. ET: West asked Dorival if Zimmerman was respectful when he worked with her. Dorival said yes he was always respectful.
10:35 a.m. ET: Dorival said that the neighborhood home owner's association asked Zimmerman to organize its neighborhood watch.
10:32 a.m. ET: Prosecutor Guy has finished his questions for Dorival, and now defense attorney Don West is cross-examining her.
10:29 a.m. ET: Dorival said that she told the the neighborhood watch volunteers in Zimmerman's neighborhood to only call 911 when their property, liberty or when someone was in danger. They were also told to never pursue or engage suspicisous people in the neighborhood.
10:25 a.m. ET: Dorival said gave a presentation on September 22, 2011 about the role of the neighborhood watch, and Zimmerman was attendance. The following slide is from that presentation.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_142.jpg10:22 a.m. ET: Dorival is reviewing the neighborhood watch handbook the police department hands out to volunteers.
10:20 a.m. ET: Dorival said she eventually met Zimmerman at a presentation about starting a neighborhood watch program for his neighorhood.
10:16 a.m. ET: Dorival that people participating in neighborhood watch programs should be the "eyes and ears" for the police.
10:15 a.m. ET: Rumph is finished testifying. The prosecution is calling its next witness, Wendy Dorival was a volunteer program manager for the Sanford, Florida police department in 2012, and coordinated and helped start neighborhood watch programs in the community.
10:09 a.m. ET: The attorneys are at a sidebar with the judge.
10:07 a.m. ET: Rumph maintains the calls received on the 911 and non-emergency lines. She has worked for the sheriff's office for 26 years. She is explaining when 911 calls the night of the shooting connected to with the 911 system and disconnected. Multiple people in the neighborhood called 911 as a result of the shooting.
10:03 a.m. ET: The jury is seated and Ramona Rumph returns to the witness stand.
9:47 a.m. ET: Judge Nelson said she will review the case law and the tapes, and will rule on the admissibility of the evidence later. She has recessed court for 10 minutes. When court resumes the prosecution will pick back up with their case.
9:46 a.m. ET: The prosecution is playing the prior calls Zimmerman made reporting suspicious to the police in rapid succession. On one call, Zimmerman said he doesn't want to approach a suspicious man in his neighborhood.
9:44 a.m. ET: On another call, Zimmerman tells a dispatcher that there are two suspicious "African-American males" loitering in his neighborhood, and he is a member of the neighborhood watch.
9:42 a.m. ET: Zimmerman is closing his eyes as the recordings are played for the judge.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_141.jpg9:39 a.m. ET: On another recording, Zimmerman said he sees suspicious people run or get away most of the time, and he thinks they retreat to the next neighborhood over.
9:36 a.m. ET: The prosecution is playing Zimmerman's "prior calls" reporting suspicious people for the judge. Zimmerman can be heard telling the police about a "black" kid in his neighborhood who matches the description of someone who robbed a house in his neighborhood.
9:31 a.m. ET: "I am allowed and required actually to establish or to address the self-defense in this case. The fact in issue, relevance, pertains no to just the elements of the crime, but the elements of the defense, whether it was justifiable." said Mantei.
9:29 a.m. ET: Mantei is going over how the case law supports the prosecution's argument again.
9:27 a.m. ET: Mantei is said the defense initially agreed to the admissibility of these phone calls, and they aren't a "secret."
9:23 a.m. ET: O'Mara has finished his argument, and now prosecutor Mantei is giving a rebuttal argument.
9:20 a.m. ET: "State of mind does not negate the rules of evidence," said O'Mara.
9:16 a.m. ET: O'Mara said the prosecution can't use "prior good acts" to establish motive, and he can't find a case where that has been allowed.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_140.jpg9:11 a.m. ET: Part of the phone call was played for the juror Monday, before the defense objected to it. O'Mara is asking the judge to tell the jurors to ignore the call and any reference prosecutor John Guy made to it during his opening statement.
9:06 a.m. ET: "They are going to be asking this jury to make a quantum leap from good responsible citizen behavior to seething anger," said O'Mara.
9:03 a.m. ET: Defense attorney Mark O'Mara is now arguing against the admissibility of the Zimmerman's prior phone call. O'Mara said the prosecution is building a circumstantial case against his client, because they have little direct evidence this incident was second-degree murder.
9:00 a.m. ET: Zimmerman is staring straight ahead during the prosecution's argument without showing any emotion.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_139.jpg8:56 a.m. ET:
8:54 a.m. ET: Mantei said Zimmerman's prior phone calls reporting suspicious people shows his "building level of frustration."

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/blhor_138.jpg8:50 a.m. ET: The prior phone call could help establish motive according to Mantei.
8:46 a.m. ET: Mantei said the phone call will help prove Zimmerman's state of mind the night of shooting. He is now supporting his argument with past case law.
8:43 a.m. ET: Prosecutor Rich Mantei is explaining to the judge why he feels the phone call Zimmerman placed in August 2011 about another allegedly suspicisous person in the neighborhood is relevant to the case at hand.
8:40 a.m. ET: The attorneys are reviewing their case law now. The jurors are not in the courtroom for this hearing.
8:36 a.m. ET: The attorneys are still at a sidebar with the judge.
8:30 a.m. ET: Judge Nelson is on the bench, and the attorneys have joined her for a sidebar.
8:00 a.m. ET: Court is expected to start at 8:30 a.m. ET.

[Trill Clinton]

the lank to day2 live blog, if you give a fuck: http://www.hlntv.com/article/2013/06/25/george-zimmerman-trial-live-blog-day-2

[Fabbs]

10:43 a.m. ET: West asked Dorival if a resident told her if there was a home invasion and robbery in the community. The prosecution objected as hearsay, and the judge sustained their objection. West reworded his question, and Dorival said yes one resident said she was traumatized by a home invasion where the perpetrator broke into her home during the day when she was home with her small child.
BAM!
10:49 a.m. ET: West asked Dorival if Zimmerman's behavior every raised any red flags. Dorival said no he seemed concerned and wanted to help.
BAM!

[Trill Clinton]

lol

[boobie4three]

10:43 a.m. ET: West asked Dorival if a resident told her if there was a home invasion and robbery in the community. The prosecution objected as hearsay, and the judge sustained their objection. West reworded his question, and Dorival said yes one resident said she was traumatized by a home invasion where the perpetrator broke into her home during the day when she was home with her small child.
BAM!
10:49 a.m. ET: West asked Dorival if Zimmerman's behavior every raised any red flags. Dorival said no he seemed concerned and wanted to help.
BAM!
TM fans will poo poo that testimony, but it's powerful indeed. Those women jurors probably can't imagine anything more terrorizing than a home invasion. They'll see GZ as wanting to prevent that.

[CosmicCowboy]

I feel sorry for this prosecutor. The only reason they filed on Zimmerman iinitially was because the head lady folded like a cheap lawn chair under the political pressure. He has a shit case and has to try to build something out of unrelated circumstantial bullshit.

[resistanze]

TM fans will poo poo that testimony, but it's powerful indeed. Those women jurors probably can't imagine anything more terrorizing than a home invasion. They'll see GZ as wanting to prevent that.

Yeah GZ did a bang-up job at that.

[Trill Clinton]

president of the HOA is on the stand:

11:54 a.m. ET: Prosecutor Mantei is asking O'Brien to tell jurors about how a man was caught breaking into a house in the neighborhood.
11:52 a.m. ET: O'Brien said the reason why Zimmerman was in charge of the neighborhood watch is, because he went to the police and organized it.
11:50 a.m. ET: "Everybody was supposed to watch out for their neighbors. If they see something suspicious stay away and call the police," said O'Brien.
11:48 a.m. ET: O'Brien said the neighborhood watch had nothing to do with the HOA, and Zimmerman started it on his own.
11:46 a.m. ET: The prosecution has called Donald O'Brien the president of the Homeowners Association at Twin Lakes, Zimmerman's neighborhood.

[Fabbs]

TM fans will poo poo that testimony, but it's powerful indeed. Those women jurors probably can't imagine anything more terrorizing than a home invasion. They'll see GZ as wanting to prevent that.
Yep. So much for the mothers jury being an advantage for the young child Travon.

[Trill Clinton]

questions john guy(prosecution) asked the neighborhood watch person:

John Guy now examining for the state:
Guy: Have you ever told GZ that walking in the rain is suspicious?
Dorival: No

Guy: Did you tell GZ it's okay to follow someone from a distance?
Dorival: No

[CosmicCowboy]

president of the HOA is on the stand:

11:54 a.m. ET: Prosecutor Mantei is asking O'Brien to tell jurors about how a man was caught breaking into a house in the neighborhood.
11:52 a.m. ET: O'Brien said the reason why Zimmerman was in charge of the neighborhood watch is, because he went to the police and organized it.
11:50 a.m. ET: "Everybody was supposed to watch out for their neighbors. If they see something suspicious stay away and call the police," said O'Brien.
11:48 a.m. ET: O'Brien said the neighborhood watch had nothing to do with the HOA, and Zimmerman started it on his own.
11:46 a.m. ET: The prosecution has called Donald O'Brien the president of the Homeowners Association at Twin Lakes, Zimmerman's neighborhood.

HOA trying to distance themselves from civil liability

[Trill Clinton]

i like this o'brien guy, great testimony

12:02 a.m. ET: O'Brien is raising is voice while he is explaining that no one ever told the neighborhood watch volunteers to follow suspicious people. The attorneys have finished their questions for O'Brien, and he as been excused. Judge Nelson has recessed court for lunch. The live blog will resume when court picks back up at 1:00 p.m. ET.

11:57 a.m. ET: O'Brien said some construction workers followed a suspicious person in the neighborhood and caught him breaking into the house. So he sent out an email to the community praising the construction workers.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

I'm curious if there were actual neighborhood watch volunteers who actually went on patrol shifts. It still seems like this "neighborhood watch" was Zimmerman being a 6 year old in an adult's body who wanted to play cops and robbers.

[Trill Clinton]

so happy they allowed the previous 911 calls to be played. the jury will see that zimmerman's frustrations were becoming more intense with each call. the night he saw tray walking in the rain was his breaking point. "they always get away". instead of staying in the car like he always did, he decided to take matters in his own hands that night.

[CosmicCowboy]

:lol he sent out an email praising the workers for following the suspicious person but he didn't suggest anyone follow suspicious people. You call that great testimony? :lol

It's totally irrelevant testimony. Just the HOA trying to cover their ass.

[DMX7]

http://i1167.photobucket.com/albums/q625/BigJoc73/blk_zps91b85116.jpg

[CosmicCowboy]

I'm curious if there were actual neighborhood watch volunteers who actually went on patrol shifts. It still seems like this "neighborhood watch" was Zimmerman being a 6 year old in an adult's body who wanted to play cops and robbers.

You guys crack me up. No matter what his motive for joining he was an official neighborhood watch guy that went through the program and was registered with the popo.

[CosmicCowboy]

If this is the best the prosecutor can bring to prove motive he is royally fucked.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

:lol he sent out an email praising the workers for following the suspicious person but he didn't suggest anyone follow suspicious people. You call that great testimony? :lol

It's totally irrelevant testimony. Just the HOA trying to cover their ass.
Yeah I agree with you there, idk how the fuck that can be considered good testimony :lol


You guys crack me up. No matter what his motive for joining he was an official neighborhood watch guy that went through the program and was registered with the popo.
What specific authority does that give him he otherwise wouldn't have?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

If this is the best the prosecutor can bring to prove motive he is royally fucked.

The only real shot Zimmerman has at getting convicted imo is if the prosecution can catch him in a few lies or one major lie and completely kill his credibility. Otherwise I agree with you he's getting found not guilty.

[CosmicCowboy]

Yeah I agree with you there, idk how the fuck that can be considered good testimony :lol


What specific authority does that give him he otherwise wouldn't have?

Zimmerman was an asshole and shouldn't have followed Martin. Totally agree. Kick him off the neighborhood watch.

That has nothing to do with whether it was a good self defense shoot under the law.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Zimmerman was an asshole and shouldn't have followed Martin. Totally agree. Kick him off the neighborhood watch.

That has nothing to do with whether it was a good self defense shoot under the law.

Agreed on all points tbh, my original post was more a general inquiry. If it came across as me saying it could be an argument the prosecution uses then my bad not what the intent was.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The only real shot Zimmerman has at getting convicted imo is if the prosecution can catch him in a few lies or one major lie and completely kill his credibility. Otherwise I agree with you he's getting found not guilty.
Just to add to this, the defense saying "Thank god Zimmerman had a gun" was such a royal fuck up that a few more might give the prosecution life it otherwise wouldn't have had. The smug look Zimmerman has on his face while Martin's parents are crying also isn't doing him any favors. That kind of trivial shit might seem pointless but jurors notice it.

[boobie4three]

I'm curious if there were actual neighborhood watch volunteers who actually went on patrol shifts. It still seems like this "neighborhood watch" was Zimmerman being a 6 year old in an adult's body who wanted to play cops and robbers.
If everyone could see this recent story, I'd bet they'd ALL want a neighborhood watch program:

Terrifying New Jersey home invasion and beating caught on homeowner's nanny cam (VIDEO)

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/beating-caught-homeowner-nanny-cam-article-1.1381703#ixzz2XFPRDD29

[Trill Clinton]

court is on recess, and will be back in 10 mins. i'm gonna go get a acai bowl but will be back with more updates.

[CosmicCowboy]

Agreed on all points tbh, my original post was more a general inquiry. If it came across as me saying it could be an argument the prosecution uses then my bad not what the intent was.

Oh, it's definitely an argument the prosecution will use because they have nothing else. People like Trill are just blind to the fact that it was a politically motivated prosecution and the prosecution has nothing.

[Trill Clinton]

2:43 p.m. ET: Prosecutor Guy gives Smith more evidence to examine including Martin's watch and the tools used to take scrapings from underneath Martin's fingers.
2:40 p.m. ET: Smith says she is not responsible for determining who a fingerprint belongs to. She also tested the Skittles bag and flashlight for DNA. She tested the flashlight for fingerprints and was unable to find any. She also didn't find fingerprints on the plastic bags or the small flashlight attached to the keys.
2:35 p.m. ET: Smith describes how she captures latent fingerprints. She was able to lift one fingerprint from Zimmerman's firearm.
2:32 p.m. ET: Smith shows jurors the gun that Zimmerman used to shoot Martin (the red is the gun's lock). She also shows them Zimmerman's holster. The gun's grip, trigger and back part of the slide were processed by Smith for touch DNA.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-gun.jpg2:27 p.m. ET: Smith examines the packaging for the jacket, shirt and pants Zimmerman gave her that night.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/jacket.jpg2:25 p.m. ET: Prosecutor Guy shows the photos Smith took of Zimmerman, including photos of his head, hands and clothes. She also packaged all of his clothing.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-head.jpghttp://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-face.jpg2:21 p.m. ET: Smith took photos of Zimmerman at the police station. Prosecutor Guy walks through those photos with her.
2:19 p.m. ET: The shell casing was found by using a metal detector, according to Smith. She searched along the sidewalk and in between the buildings for blood evidence. She says she used a flashlight to look and didn't locate any blood at the scene (not even where Martin's body was found).
2:17 p.m. ET: Smith shows jurors several exhibits including the soft drink and Skittles Martin bought that night, a flashlight found on the scene, plastic bags given to the patrol sergeant to seal Martin's gunshot wound.
2:10 p.m. ET: Smith says she returned the next day to photograph the scene in the daylight. The ground was still wet, according to Smith.
2:07 p.m. ET: Prosecutor Guy is going over more photos with Smith including images of a cell phone, a flashlight, a button on Martin's sweatshirt, Martin's gunshot wound and the soft drink Martin bought that night. Zimmerman looks away as a close-up of Martin's face is displayed in court.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-soft-drink.jpghttp://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-skittles.jpghttp://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-flash-light.jpghttp://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-plastic-bags.jpg2:02 p.m. ET: Smith is also using the diagram to show jurors where different photos were taken at the crime scene.
1:59 p.m. ET: Smith walks jurors through a diagram of the crime scene and shows them where different pieces of evidence were found.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-diana-smith.jpg1:55 p.m. ET: Smith says she starts by photographing a scene. She does it in stages -- first without evidence markers and then with evidence markers. Some of her photos show how it was raining that night. Her diagram was used to make a computerized rendition of the crime scene.
1:52 p.m. ET: The attorneys are at a sidebar with the judge.
1:50 p.m. ET: Smith responded to the scene where Martin was shot at around 7:55 p.m. ET. The scene had been taped off and they were experiencing rain showers on and off. It had been raining prior to her arrival.
1:47 p.m. ET: The prosecution calls Diana Smith to the witness stand. She is a crime scene technician with the Sanford Police Department.
1:44 p.m. ET: The defense has finished its questioning. The prosecutor asks Raimondo to clarify the conditions that night. Raimondo says it was drizzling. He has been excused.
1:43 p.m. ET: Raimondo says this photo shows the lighting conditions that night. He says the flash makes it a little brighter in the foreground than it really was.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-anthony-raimando2.jpg1:38 p.m. ET: Raimondo is walking through the map of Zimmerman's neighborhood and the photos of Martin's body. Defense attorney O'Mara is asking him about the lighting conditions and the position of Martin's body. Raimondo says Martin was found facing down.
1:35 p.m. ET: Defense attorney O'Mara is asking Raimondo about his background and why he wanted to become a cop. Raimondo says he comes from a family of law enforcement.
"I think we all want to make a difference in our community, sir. You do what you can, when you can, and you just try and influence the audience you have in front of you," said Raimondo. He also says it has been rewarding for him. The prosecution objects to this line of questioning and O'Mara moves on.
1:33 p.m. ET: Prosecutor Guy shows two photos of Martin's body after he was pronounced dead -- one is a close-up image. Guy points out the CPR mask. He also shows photos of Martin's body once the blanket was placed over it. Another photo shows the grocery bag Raimondo was going to use to seal Martin's chest wound. The prosecution has finished its direct examination.
Martin's dad, Tracy, leaves the courtroom as the photos are displayed. His mother, Sybrina Fulton, remained by avoided looking at the photos. She eventually leaves the courtroom as well.
1:30 p.m. ET: Raimondo couldn't find an exit wound so he put Martin down on his back and continued CPR. When rescuers arrived, they hooked up an EKG machine to Martin. He was pronounced dead on the scene. Raimondo put an emergency blanket on Martin's body out of respect for Martin and his family and to preserve evidence.
1:27 p.m. ET: Raimondo heard bubbling sounds from Martin's chest. He asked the crowd for plastic wrap and Vaseline, which he would use to try and seal the chest wound. A bystander gave him a grocery bag. Raimondo raised Martin to a seated position so he could seal the exit wound on Martin's back first.
1:25 p.m. ET: Raimondo took Martin's pulse on his neck and says he didn't find anything. He moved his body onto his back and tried for a pulse again and didn't find anything.
"I breathed for Mr. Martin -- or I tried to, sir," said Raimondo.
Standard Operating Producers require him to use a mask but he says he didn't have one with him. He considered the situation to be an "extraordinary circumstance." He later asked for and received a breathing mask.
1:20 p.m. ET: Prosecutor Guy shows Raimondo a map of Zimmerman's neighborhood. Raimondo shows jurors where he entered into the complex and where he parked. He says he angled his lights on the scene because lighting was poor. It was drizzling, according to Raimondo.

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/static/images/zimmerman-anthony-raimando.jpg1:17 p.m. ET: Raimondo says he heard the call go out for a suspicious person. The call was later upgraded to shots fired. He arrived on scene within five minutes.
1:14 p.m. ET: The prosecution calls Sergeant Anthony Raimondo to the stand. He's the training coordinator for the Sanford Police Department. He's also on the Seminole County SWAT unit. He was a patrol sergeant the night Martin was shot.
1:10 p.m. ET: The jury is now being seated.
1:09 p.m. ET: The attorneys are at the judge's bench and testimony is in a holding pattern.
1:03 p.m. ET: The defense attorneys have left to go into a conference room just outside the courtroom. The judge is on the bench and the jury has not been seated yet.

[Trill Clinton]

they showed tray's lifeless body in the courtroom. it got so emotional his father left and members of the jury's were visibly shaken and crying. warning graphic photo below






















http://i41.tinypic.com/21c7art.jpg

[boobie4three]

they showed tray's lifeless body in the courtroom. it got so emotional his father left and members of the jury's were visibly shaken and crying. warning graphic photo below






















http://i41.tinypic.com/21c7art.jpg


Cops should have probably bagged his hands right away in order to keep any evidence from being washed away by the rain.

[Trill Clinton]

Cops should have probably bagged his hands right away in order to keep any evidence from being washed away by the rain.

1:30 p.m. ET: Raimondo couldn't find an exit wound so he put Martin down on his back and continued CPR. When rescuers arrived, they hooked up an EKG machine to Martin. He was pronounced dead on the scene. Raimondo put an emergency blanket on Martin's body out of respect for Martin and his family and to preserve evidence.

[clambake]

so, george runs him down, starts pulling his gun and little trayvon fights for his life.

[Ignignokt]

http://i41.tinypic.com/21c7art.jpg awww look deh masta. he had his leggs cross'd-howdy be threatening 0le george if he was just eatin candy and dancin ballet http://i2.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/010/669/421566_110052819134743_1827862103_n.jpg

[Big Empty]

so, george runs him down, starts pulling his gun and little trayvon fights for his life.

it seems this way in a nutshell to me.

[Trill Clinton]

3:34 p.m. ET: The firearm, Skittles bag and flashlight were all tested for touch DNA, according to Smith. She performed the latent print examination after taking the swabs.
3:31 p.m. ET: West asks about the swabs Smith used in the case. She says they're sent to the laboratory, not the item itself. Smith also says the swabs don't say where they were taken on an item.
3:29 p.m. ET: Smith takes a look at Martin's pants, which are displayed in court, and says they look like the pants she collected.
3:25 p.m. ET: Defense attorney West asks if chemicals were used on the sidewalk to reveal the presence of blood. Smith says chemicals weren't used.
3:23 p.m. ET: Smith says she may have taken photos of Martin's body when the medical examiner's office arrived, but she's not sure. She says she can't recall if she removed the blanket from Martin's body to take pictures.
3:19 p.m. ET: Smith says she didn't think the evidence had been tampered with before her arrival.
3:14 p.m. ET: West asks Smith to estimate the distance between two evidence markers. She says she's unable to do that.
3:12 p.m. ET: Defense attorney Don West begins his cross-examination by asking Smith if she has ever been on patrol with her husband, who also works for the Sanford Police Department. She says she has been on ride-alongs with him.

[boutons_deux]

it seems this way in a nutshell to me.

we don't know when Z drew the gun, or when M saw it. If M saw the gun before it was drawn, he had every right to Defend His Ground, go on offense as best defense, against the blatant threat he perceived from an armed stalker.

[elbamba]

If the parents keep getting up everyday and leaving the courtroom the defense will have a legitimate objection to have them permanently removed. It is prejudicial to the defense.

[boobie4three]

Defense and the tech just went over a laundry list of damage to GZ's head. Brutal. I'm kind of surprised GZ waited as long as he did before he shot TM.